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Level D 767 Sim Is Great.....  
User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1464 posts, RR: 3
Posted (6 years 11 months 4 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 21385 times:

I've been toying with the Level D Simulator and I'm quite pleased. For a Payware jet this is pretty realistic and fun. I have learned how to do some basic programming with the specific flight plans depending on which trip you plan to take. Someone gave me a link to preloaded flightplans on a website that I can download to my computer http://www.simroutes.com/ then cut & paste to a folder in Level D and all I do is type certain codes to upload to my FMC then the legs on my FMC are loaded.

The performance initial/specification programming of the FMC is probably the hardest for me to learn so far. I have to program the fuel load and passenger weights all together hoping I dont get an error (This can be tricky sometimes) especially if you want to be precise about using the right amount of fuel, and getting the most out of you're performance at the same time. Obviously you do need to do a quick pax/fuel configuration (In the 767-300ER configuration manager before you load the flight simulator cause if you're wrong the aircraft could be overweight, or not enough fuel etc. I know to put flaps 05 degrees etc...and a few other minor calculations like wind speed and other stuff. Then after all this the FMC figures out you're V1,V2 speeds etc... based on what you input if it jives.

Someone from the Flight1 forum gave me a link to a thread which contained 3 different tutorials with downloadable .pdf files that you can download off the post in the Flight D 767 forum (the tutorial after printing averages 30-50 pages each one) includes with it flight plans with the printable AIRAC, STARS, SIDS charts/files at
http://www.navdata.at/

The tutorial booklet has a couple pages dedicated to help you familiarize with the switchology of the 767-300ER cockpit from overhead panel by its illustration, FMC, Pedestal etc...

It's true there is so much to learn once you attempt to play it, I still haven't figured out how calculate the fuel loads yet manually on my own by a arbitrary spontaneous trip. in the AP mode you usually program for airspeed, VNAV, LNAV, C Command and as you're airborne you watch the EICAS which can zoom up to 320 NM. It shows the legs on the EICAS like dot to dot just like the pilots as you get in to you're trip about halfway I start programming the FMC for arrival you can add the waypoint closer to you're arrival airport and select speed/alttiude next to the particular leg one of the last entries in the LSK is usually you're arrival runway so the plane can pretty much fly itself on to centerline with the ILS.

The only glitch i get on occasion is sometimes the aircraft wont stay on course for a short time i have to manually disconnect AP and keep the plane in the heading on the EICAS and attempt AP from time to time until it works and sometimes I just have to manually fly and land it as the FMC is one of the only ways to navigate the jet or you cant figure out where you are unless you know every bit of terrain.

The CFM engines are great if you span to the outside of jet view in FS9 you hear the low realistic roar of them, and inside the cockpit as real as it gets you its reasonably quiet but you can hear the airflow sound from you air systems and noise
from the cockpit instruments. You can communicate with the ground crew to hook up Ext Air, pushback inter-phone etc.. The only annoying thing is the F/A's can communicate with you and tell you its too hot or cold in the cabin.

You can watch the engines spin in high quality mode. Also there is a repaint manager for the various liveries you can download http://www.leveldsim.com/files/repaints/ I have the UA, DL current, Varig, BA liveries all free.

Here is some pics of it http://www.flight1.com/products.asp?product=FL1-767-001 and http://www.leveldsim.com/sevensix_screenshots.asp One word of warning The game is time consuming especially if you play you're first 2-3 times it may take you hours until you can fly if you start from the very first checklist step-by-step will familiarize you with the pre-flight which is the most time consuming and most challenging aspect of the game but the pre-flights will get shorter and shorter if you're persistent to learn Of course after a month of having this game I still have a lot to learn.

Also If you want to learn how to start the engines from scratch there are checklists out there on the net etc...Sometimes you have to go back to tthe beginning of the checklist to double check you did every thing right that is if you they don;t light up after a few minutes sometimes it can take a few to get them started so be patient.

Some of this is common or obvious info for those savvy to the game.

So thats my review of the game. Any questions or comments are welcome.

One last tidbit since I don't have FSX I cant answer those questions I can only assume that they are similar to my FS2004.

Regards Mike

[Edited 2007-08-30 07:39:58]

20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineKhelmDTW From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 269 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 21328 times:

You think thats good, try the PMDG 747 series

UNBELIEVABLE!!!

 hyper 



In Thrust We Trust
User currently offlineWestJetForLife From Canada, joined Jun 2005, 814 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 21317 times:

Quoting KhelmDTW (Reply 1):
You think thats good, try the PMDG 747 series

I agree. The PMDG 747-400 is almost as authentic as the actual plane. I had the "honor" of flying the level-D 747 Sim in Vancouver (courtesy of Air Cadets), and with PMDG, it is almost as if I was back in the level-D 747 simulator.

I tried the LDS 767, but I didn't really like it as much as I do the PMDG 747 or 737 (I prefer the 747 though).

Nik



I need a drink.
User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1464 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 21305 times:

Quoting KhelmDTW (Reply 1):
You think thats good, try the PMDG 747 series

UNBELIEVABLE!!!



Quoting WestJetForLife (Reply 2):
I agree. The PMDG 747-400 is almost as authentic as the actual plane. I had the "honor" of flying the level-D 747 Sim in Vancouver (courtesy of Air Cadets), and with PMDG, it is almost as if I was back in the level-D 747 simulator.

I tried the LDS 767, but I didn't really like it as much as I do the PMDG 747 or 737 (I prefer the 747 though).

Nik

A lot of people have been raving about PMDG simulations and I don't doubt they are great. I do like the 767 or 777 paywares better than 747 but thats just my preference. I'm biased to the newer generation widebodies on payware I even like the 737 as well even though its not a widebody. I even like the default 747 & 777 cockpits in FS9 however I do realize they dont have all the features of PMDG however the default FS cockpit views looks really close to me for the 747 & 777 if you want simple. But thats just my opinion.

I have to admit though Level D 767 can be quite complex I wouldn't recommend it for a novice. But the screen-shots of PMDG 747 are quite nice. From my understanding the 777 payware is simpler to operate. http://www.wilcopub.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=prod_777

[Edited 2007-08-31 08:06:18]

User currently offlineQantas744ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1288 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 21302 times:

The PMDG 744 is the best out there! The wilco put model SUCKS!!!!! just check it out.

I reallly rnjoy the LDS 763 aswell but sadly they decided against EPR engine indications for the RR and PW models and only have N1 for all 3


LEo



Happiness is V1 in Lagos
User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1464 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 21301 times:

Quoting Qantas744ER (Reply 4):
The wilco put model SUCKS!!!!! just check it out.

I reallly rnjoy the LDS 763 aswell but sadly they decided against EPR engine indications for the RR and PW models and only have N1 for all 3

Yeah I dont know much about Wilco but I did base my decision to get LDS763 on many reviews and forum members opinions of LDS 763. I wasn't aware they had restrictions on the RR and PW engines I havent got to the point where I've even tried to change the engines yet.

Cheers Mike


User currently offlineWestJetForLife From Canada, joined Jun 2005, 814 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 21243 times:

Quoting Qantas744ER (Reply 4):
The wilco put model SUCKS!!!!!

Wilco wasn't bad. MelJet wasn't very good, in my honest opinion. It didn't have the same flight characteristics (then again, it was freeware, and what do you expect with freeware?) as the PMDG 747, but then again, that's a bad comparison.

Mike, just a recommendation: if you like LDS 767, you will also like the Iron Knuckles DC-9 or Flight1 727. Both are realistic interpretations of the classic narrow-bodies of yesteryear.

Nik



I need a drink.
User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1464 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 21238 times:

Quoting WestJetForLife (Reply 6):
you will also like the Iron Knuckles DC-9 or Flight1 727. Both are realistic interpretations of the classic narrow-bodies of yesteryear.

Thanks for the tip. I was wondering what 777 program is worth getting free or payware.


User currently offlineQantas744ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1288 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 21228 times:

Quoting Mike89406 (Reply 7):
Thanks for the tip. I was wondering what 777 program is worth getting free or payware.

Out of all i would get the PSS 777 take its panel and merge it with a Meljet 777 cause till date the PSS has the best panel and Meljet the best model.

Leo



Happiness is V1 in Lagos
User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1464 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 21155 times:

BTW does anyone know how to open the flight deck door so you can see the F class cabin on Level D 767 I did it once by accident was scrolling around in virtual cockpit looking straight back I saw the F class seats but now I can't seem to figure it out. I also posted in the level D forum before this with the same question but know one seems to know.

Mike


User currently offlineJamesbuk From United Kingdom, joined May 2005, 3968 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 21143 times:

Quoting Mike89406 (Reply 9):

Theres a button on the lower panel that says "Flight deck door lock" or "Door lock" - something like that, press that and it should open  Smile

Nice review, but for some reason I get bored of the 767 after a while, I just don't find it very exciting to fly on flight simulator.

Rgds --James--



You cant have your cake and eat it... What the hells the point in having it then!!!
User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1464 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 21118 times:

Quoting Jamesbuk (Reply 10):
Nice review, but for some reason I get bored of the 767 after a while, I just don't find it very exciting to fly on flight simulator.

I think its very realistic at least for a 767 there arent too many choices out there except POSKY 767 flights and other repaints. I would actually like to find a 767-400 flight since it is close to the 777 cockpit in real life. The 747's Meh it seemed at least on the default FS 744 that the cocpit window is smaller.

There are some really cool things about level D it depends how intense you set up the graphics and other stuff. I find if I do everything by the checklist for a flight it is time consuming and there are so many other things to watch during flight like the FMC, EICAS, flight controls, I do really like the ability to communicate with the ground crew and FA's and cabin announcements.

However If i just fly with the jet started and dont really do any complex flight planner then yes I do get bored, ANother thing is I have Ultimate Traffic so that adds exictment to the game.


User currently offlineOB1504 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 3327 posts, RR: 9
Reply 12, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 20012 times:



Quoting WestJetForLife (Reply 2):
The PMDG 747-400 is almost as authentic as the actual plane.

 checkmark  If only they didn't insist on gouging their American customers...

Quoting Qantas744ER (Reply 4):
I reallly rnjoy the LDS 763 aswell but sadly they decided against EPR engine indications for the RR and PW models and only have N1 for all 3

It's a shame that they decided not to model engine indications for RR- and PW-engined aircraft. It's really the only major shortcoming in their product, especially when all of their competitors include them. I was hoping they would add it as one of the new features of the FSX version.

Quoting Qantas744ER (Reply 8):
Out of all i would get the PSS 777 take its panel and merge it with a Meljet 777 cause till date the PSS has the best panel and Meljet the best model.

Or use the upcoming Project Open Sky model, which should blow the MelJet one away (but, sadly, not when FDEs are concerned)


User currently offlineJwenting From Netherlands, joined Apr 2001, 10213 posts, RR: 18
Reply 13, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 19993 times:



Quoting Mike89406 (Reply 3):
I have to admit though Level D 767 can be quite complex I wouldn't recommend it for a novice. But the screen-shots of PMDG 747 are quite nice. From my understanding the 777 payware is simpler to operate. http://www.wilcopub.com/index.cfm?fu...d_777



Quoting WestJetForLife (Reply 6):
Wilco wasn't bad. MelJet wasn't very good, in my honest opinion. It didn't have the same flight characteristics (then again, it was freeware, and what do you expect with freeware?) as the PMDG 747, but then again, that's a bad comparison.

The Wilco 777 is complete rubbish. The flightmodel is terrible, the autopilot doesn't work properly, the FMC/CDU don't work properly.
And their support is non-existent. Wilco published the thing and will tell you to contact the creators for support, who will in turn tell you to contact Wilco for support as they did it on a fixed price basis with Wilco supposed to handle support for it.
The model looks nice, but that's about it.


PMDG are indeed quite good, but their suppose sucks (and they're quite expensive).



I wish I were flying
User currently offlineQantas744ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1288 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 19934 times:



Quoting OB1504 (Reply 12):
It's a shame that they decided not to model engine indications for RR- and PW-engined aircraft. It's really the only major shortcoming in their product, especially when all of their competitors include them. I was hoping they would add it as one of the new features of the FSX version.

I really did not understand that decision from the LDS team...just two additional config lines had to be put into the panel design to allow EPR indication. Spoils a 99.9% perfect plane in my opinion!

Quoting Jwenting (Reply 13):
PMDG are indeed quite good, but their suppose sucks (and they're quite expensive).

PMDG's support does not suck...its just idiots sending them emails over and over again regarding the same issues and all they would have to do to solve it is checking out the PMDG wiki page. Were every known problem to their add-ons has an answer to resolve it...maybe you should check it out  Wink

http://ops.precisionmanuals.com/wiki/Main_Page

And if you say their support sucks cause you sent them a email in the past week and they still havent replied, well thats because Rob and the majority of his team were in Seattle at the Avsim FANCON convention and now have to reply to the traffic of emails.

Leo



Happiness is V1 in Lagos
User currently offlineJwenting From Netherlands, joined Apr 2001, 10213 posts, RR: 18
Reply 15, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 5 hours ago) and read 19894 times:

no, I say their support sucks because their attitude towards their customers sucks.
There are still open issues with the 737 that have been known about for years, have been acknowledged as problems by PMDG, but despite repeated requests to solve them have never been handled. Think the age old problem with the autospoilers of the -800.
There are repeated occurrances of PMDG staff stating blatant falsehoods in order to not have to support or supply something, like stating that real 737s are delivered without any navigational data and thus PMDG is acting realistically when they don't supply that data either. In fact Boeing supplies an initial load, after which it's up to the customer to keep that data current.

They're in general arrogant, not customer friendly, and assume that anything is not their responsibility.
Good customer support is quite the reverse of that.



I wish I were flying
User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Reply 16, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 5 hours ago) and read 19893 times:



Quoting Qantas744ER (Reply 14):
And if you say their support sucks cause you sent them a email in the past week and they still havent replied, well thats because Rob and the majority of his team were in Seattle at the Avsim FANCON convention and now have to reply to the traffic of emails.

What about the time when they started charging for their products in Euros, and just converted the prices 1 to 1, effectively jacking up the price in US Dollars? Yes, they claim they did that for economical reasons, but they surely put off many potential customers with their "We don't give a shit about our customers" attitude, which they displayed, but not being up front with us about the change and being reasonable with the price.

Pmdg Jacks Up Product Prices By Going Euro (by LTU932 May 22 2007 in Aviation Hobby) (the post is from a few months ago, so the actual Euro to Dollar conversion I made was with a much different exchange rate)

Quoting Jwenting (Reply 15):
no, I say their support sucks because their attitude towards their customers sucks.

Not just their support sucks, their customer service department suck as well, and I speak from a very bad experience I had with them.

It's sad. PMDG has fine products, but their horribly arrogant and even disrespectful at times.


User currently offlineZTagged From Niger, joined Oct 2007, 516 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 19863 times:



Quoting LTU932 (Reply 16):
Not just their support sucks, their customer service department suck as well, and I speak from a very bad experience I had with them.

I can agree with that. They had my order up and everything was good, yet they still claimed I was trying to use a pirated version and CD key. Downloaded from their site, no less.  crazy 
Screw 'em. I'll deal with PSS and Overland before I deal with PMDG again.



Something awful.
User currently offlineCptSpeaking From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 639 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (6 years 9 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 19748 times:



Quoting WestJetForLife (Reply 6):
MelJet wasn't very good

Yeah, but I LOVED the soundset on that package! It really captured the low rumble of the T7 at idle as well as the powerful spool on takeoff...

Your CptSpeaking



...and don't call me Shirley!!
User currently offlineLonghornmaniac From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 3284 posts, RR: 44
Reply 19, posted (6 years 9 months 1 day ago) and read 19576 times:

Ok A.net Flight Simmers, time to diagnose some problems for me.  Smile Both of these questions are about the Level-D 767.

I cannot for the life of me get the SIDs/ STARs to load. I downloaded them (.xml files), from Terry Yingling's website, PlanePath.com, and ran the install. So now they're all in the FS9 main folderLevel-D SimulationsNavdata folder, but none of them are showing up in the FMS. Some airports (namely DFW) only have 1 SID and 1 STAR in the FMS, but I went into DFW's .xml file and it had all of them. Do I have to do something else to activate them?

Also, what are the criteria that need to be met for the Interphone connection to work? I was sitting at EGKK, and I said Connect Interphone from the dropdown menu (not the overhead panel menu), and it grayed everything out, and said Connecing Interphone, but no options ever came back (i.e. they stayed grayed out). Sometimes (like when I load a new flight), every ground communication works, but any other time than that, it doesn't.

Thanks!

Cheers,
Cameron


User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1464 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (6 years 9 months 22 hours ago) and read 19561 times:

Quoting Longhornmaniac (Reply 19):
Ok A.net Flight Simmers, time to diagnose some problems for me. Both of these questions are about the Level-D 767.

I cannot for the life of me get the SIDs/ STARs to load. I downloaded them (.xml files), from Terry Yingling's website, PlanePath.com, and ran the install. So now they're all in the FS9 main folderLevel-D SimulationsNavdata folder, but none of them are showing up in the FMS. Some airports (namely DFW) only have 1 SID and 1 STAR in the FMS, but I went into DFW's .xml file and it had all of them. Do I have to do something else to activate them?

Also, what are the criteria that need to be met for the Interphone connection to work? I was sitting at EGKK, and I said Connect Interphone from the dropdown menu (not the overhead panel menu), and it grayed everything out, and said Connecing Interphone, but no options ever came back (i.e. they stayed grayed out). Sometimes (like when I load a new flight), every ground communication works, but any other time than that, it doesn't.

Thanks!

Cheers,
Cameron

I use Sim Routes http://www.simroutes.com/ (simroutes is free to download) Anyways download the file as as usual to the NAV data a folder. When you're in the FMC start with clicking RTE function key you should see the RTE1 top center of page one easy way if you downloaded the route is to look on the right side buttons (known as LSK key) you'll see DEST which is (R1 LSK) below that is is FLT NO (2R LSK) next down CO ROUTE (3R LSK) the CO ROUTE is the one to program you type in for example say you downloaded CVYR (Vancouver BC) to KSFO (San Francisco) you type at the bottom CYVRKSFO together then click CO ROUTE and activate.

Of course there are more entries you need to type in the FMC I strongly suggest you register at LDS 767 forums http://www.leveldsim.com/forums/ and they will give you a link to some tutorials you can download from a cold dark cockpit to programming the FMC and landing at destination etc...its pretty in depth more than I can explain but you learn a lot. BTW I downloaded 3 tutorials and printed them out and put them in a binder CYVR-KSFO, EKCH-EGLL, KJFK-LIRR.

I also printed up the part of the LDS 767 operating manual from my program it's in Adobe format on only the section concerning the FMC as well now I have a decent guide how to do the basics of flying the 767. But there is a whole manual if you want to print the whole thing.

About the Interphone I didn't have a problem however I dont know what to tell you except search or post on the LDS forums.

Last thing if your not registered on the LDS 767 forum but you or someone bought the product you should have a product key or something because you need to be a licensed member to register on the forums (meaning it was bought and paid for) and the forums are free. The support on the forums are good as I've heard the PMDG forums aren;t that friendly.

I had a performance problem on my framerates and posted about it one mod who was in New Zealand asked me to PM him a cut and pasted FS9.config file so I did and he sent it back optimized anyways I digress LDS 767 is realistic from the reviews I've read graded by actual pilots and although PMDG is better to some people 767 does me just fine.

Hope this helps let me know if it works.

Mike

[Edited 2007-11-25 18:40:48]

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