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Microsoft Flight, More Information Out!  
User currently offlineFly2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (3 years 9 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 32024 times:

Decided to start a new thread to maximize exposure to those who may have not seen this already.

Well, MS did a minor update of their MSF website (http://www.microsoft.com/games/flight/ ). But damn are they being teasers. Here's a very intriguing FAQ:

Quote:

Q:
What is "Microsoft Flight?"
A:
"Microsoft Flight" is a new PC game from Microsoft Game Studios. The new title will be available on the Games for Windows – LIVE service and will bring a new perspective to the long-standing "Flight Simulator" franchise. From new game play elements and enhanced scenery and terrain to new aircraft and integrated content marketplace, it is an entirely new breed of virtual flight. The Games for Windows - LIVE platform sets the stage for all your virtual flight needs while connecting you to a global base of users, content and endless exploration. Microsoft Flight builds off its heritage of deep, immersive simulation and is redesigned to make the experience easier for virtual fliers of all interests and skills.
Q:
How does “Microsoft Flight” differ from “Flight Simulator?” Why the new name? What’s changed?
A:
With “Microsoft Flight” we’re approaching the virtual flight genre from the ground up, with the focus on the universal appeal of the experience of Flight. We believe the simplicity of “Microsoft Flight” perfectly captures that vision while welcoming the millions of existing Flight Simulator fans. The new “Microsoft Flight” retains the full fidelity simulation longtime fans have come to expect while offering all players a whole new look and feel, a wide range of new game play and challenges, persistent experiences and social connectivity.
Q:
How does Games for Windows – LIVE factor in?
A:
Games for Windows – LIVE introduces a new level of connectivity to virtual flight, enhancing both the social and game play experiences of the title. Content is updated virtually. You can fly solo or join an entire global flight community online. You can easily connect with and facilitate flight experiences with your friends. The addition of Games for Windows - LIVE creates an ubiquitous virtual world of flight that offers easy and engaging access to the magic of flight for all.
Q:
Who is developing “Microsoft Flight” now that ACES is gone?
A:
“Microsoft Flight” is being developed internally at Microsoft by a team that includes many of the same creative minds that helped deliver countless entries in the “Flight Simulator” franchise.
Q:
Why did Microsoft shut down ACES Studio last January?
A:
Microsoft Game Studios is always evaluating its business model to determine what is best for both gamers and the company. Many factors were considered in the difficult decision to close ACES Studio, but we feel the 2009 closure helped us better align with our goals and long-term development plans. "Microsoft Flight" is being developed by many of the same creative minds that shaped "Microsoft Flight Simulator," and we're excited about delivering a new take on this classic franchise.

I get mixed feelings about this. So it looks like it won't be merely just a game after all, however,it's going to be a real challenge to not dumb the sim down so much for the average Joe and still keep it enjoyable for us hardcore veteran MSFSers. This is why I really hope they make two editions: the average Joe edition, and the hardcore edition for the rest of us.

Also, looks like they're pushing for massive online play. This has some great potential if done right. I'm assuming they're planning something similar to the now defunct Microsoft Zone multiplayer system in use for FS98. Again, I hope they segregate the average Joes from the pros, otherwise those of us who like to do long realistic flights will have to put up with 12 year olds trying to ram your airplane and kill you (saw this a lot in the Zone days)  

And the thing that worries me most, is the statement saying that it will "retain the full fidelity simulation long time fans have come to expect". I hope this won't mean, as with EVERY other FS release, that under the hood there will be little changes and the game engine will still be basically the same. It's time FS had a serious physics engine and higher fidelity of systems and what not.

At any rate, I hope they take their time with this, and don't rush it like with FSX, and make a proper simulator, more realistic, better graphics, yet without needing a supercomputer. That's a tough one to pull off.

179 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineUltimateDelta From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 2092 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (3 years 9 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 32010 times:

Definitely going to be interesting to see how they decide to do this.

Quoting Fly2HMO (Thread starter):
This has some great potential if done right

Absolutely. I think it's definitely worth taking it beyond the in-game multiplayer. I've experienced a lot of what you mention with stupid kids. That's why I rarely ever bother with that anymore.

Quoting Fly2HMO (Thread starter):
I hope they segregate the average Joes from the pros

YESSSSS....See above.



Midwest Airlines- 1984-2010
User currently offlinealberchico From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 2911 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 31936 times:

Quoting Fly2HMO (Thread starter):
Microsoft Flight builds off its heritage of deep, immersive simulation and is redesigned to make the experience easier for virtual fliers of all interests and skills.
Quoting Fly2HMO (Thread starter):
with the focus on the universal appeal of the experience of Flight.

Sounds to me like they are going to focus on graphics, scenery, and multi player experiences more than realism. Just hope this doesn't turn into some ace combat arcade style garbage......



short summary of every jewish holiday: they tried to kill us ,we won , lets eat !
User currently offlineDavid L From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 9523 posts, RR: 42
Reply 3, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 31918 times:

Quoting Fly2HMO (Thread starter):
I get mixed feelings about this

Ditto - it's a bit ambiguous. I'm not sure whether it sounds promising or ominous.

Quoting alberchico (Reply 2):
Sounds to me like they are going to focus on graphics, scenery, and multi player experiences

Here's hoping they focus on core features, such as the physics, weather, AI and ATC, etc, and make sure they leave enough doors open for 3rd party developers so they don't have to spend so much time working "outside" the framework to provide decent features. Better graphics would be nice eventually but I think there are higher priorities.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21513 posts, RR: 55
Reply 4, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 31857 times:

Quoting Fly2HMO (Thread starter):
Again, I hope they segregate the average Joes from the pros, otherwise those of us who like to do long realistic flights will have to put up with 12 year olds trying to ram your airplane and kill you (saw this a lot in the Zone days)

Disable aircraft collisions. Problem solved.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineFly2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 31849 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 4):

Disable aircraft collisions. Problem solved.

-Mir

Oh I had it off alright. Still it's annoying as hell to have some other nutjob flying around your plane being stupid taking up your screen and what not as if it was a bunch of flies trying to land on a moving turd. Annoying as hell   


User currently offlineJohnKrist From Sweden, joined Jan 2005, 1399 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 31698 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
HEAD SUPPORT

Still worried that they repeatedly says "game" "games" and "game play". I want a sim not an arcade type of thing, even if my super hard core younger brother says I'm flying arcade mode lol


5D Mark III, 7D, 17-40 F4 L, 70-200 F2.8 L IS, EF 1.4x II, EF 2x III, Metz 58-AF1
User currently offlineGiancavia From Vatican City, joined Feb 2010, 1310 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 31560 times:

Well with FSX we had the custom traffic on the roads .. ships .. cool AI stuff. I hope they take that further because it added more to the game. Its taken me years to become good at Flight Simulation. I sure hope it isnt turned into something really dull. As long as it allows for independent ppl to created add-ons and doesnt stray to far from what it already is It should be cool. Hopefully they throw some foreign voices into the cockpits and towers. Sounds dumb having an american clear you for take off in Beijing lol.

All in all Microsoft wants to make money .. I doubt they are going to want to screw us all over with an arcade game. They could just bring out an arcade style flying game for much cheaper and less effort if they wanted to do that.

Fingers crossed! Looking forward to it. 


User currently offlinecpd From Australia, joined Jun 2008, 4879 posts, RR: 38
Reply 8, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 31543 times:

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 7):
Well with FSX we had the custom traffic on the roads .. ships .. cool AI stuff. I hope they take that further because it added more to the game. Its taken me years to become good at Flight Simulation. I sure hope it isnt turned into something really dull.

I hope for a superior graphics engine that really is very optimised, but otherwise, I hope the rest remains similar to what it is now - so that our addons will readily work in the new simulation.

Well, I hope it is a simulation - but it might well be that it is a game only.

Quoting Fly2HMO (Reply 5):
Still it's annoying as hell to have some other nutjob flying around your plane being stupid taking up your screen and what not as if it was a bunch of flies trying to land on a moving turd. Annoying as hell

That's what Autoland is for (if your plane has it). My landing will look perfect, regardless of someone trying to fly around blocking my view of the runway.

[Edited 2010-10-05 15:43:11]

User currently offlineFly2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 31535 times:

Quoting cpd (Reply 8):

That's what Autoland is for (if your plane has it). My landing will look perfect, regardless of someone trying to fly around blocking my view of the runway.

Or you could just use your instruments   


User currently offlineBurkhard From Germany, joined Nov 2006, 4384 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 31429 times:

What worries me is the " and integrated content marketplace" - which means that add ons will only be possible through MS censorship and control.

User currently offlineGiancavia From Vatican City, joined Feb 2010, 1310 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 31398 times:

Dunno what I'd do without world of ai. They Better not make it hard for add ons.

User currently offlineWNwatcher From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 275 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 31344 times:

Hopefully some of the late model addon A/C for FSX will be compatible with MS Flight, much in the same way most of the current addons from FS-9 are compatible with FSX


meepmeep
User currently offlineFly2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (3 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 31229 times:

Quoting WNwatcher (Reply 12):
Hopefully some of the late model addon A/C for FSX will be compatible with MS Flight, much in the same way most of the current addons from FS-9 are compatible with FSX

Well, if they use the same old sim-engine as in FS9 or FSX, then it would be a definite possibility, but then surely the sim would be disappointing. However, if they're smart they'll finally make a clean sheet sim engine, though that won't bode well for compatibility.


User currently offlineGiancavia From Vatican City, joined Feb 2010, 1310 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 31202 times:

Crazy q .. whens the release date?

User currently offlineFly2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (3 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 31180 times:

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 14):
Crazy q .. whens the release date?

I don't think they'll even release a release date before sometime next year, mid-year. (confused?   ) And my best estimate for a full release is late 2011 early 2012


User currently offlineBurkhard From Germany, joined Nov 2006, 4384 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (3 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 30995 times:

Quoting WNwatcher (Reply 12):
Hopefully some of the late model addon A/C for FSX will be compatible with MS Flight, much in the same way most of the current addons from FS-9 are compatible with FSX

First FS9 addons and FSX addons have almost nothing in common. The basic model format of FS8 and FS9 is similar, a sequential desciption of the models in bgl like language that had been used for scenery already since FS5.
FSX uses a completely different, Direct X native data format.

The backwards compatibility is one of the biggest problems with FSX and its performance, especially when several legacy formats mix in one scene. So please, no real time backward compatibility again.

But, want I want to propse is an offline compatibility. MS, make a converter that transforms old formats into the new ones. Offline, such converters have all time of the universe to do this and make any possible optimization, and than make a slim engine that supports the highly optimzed formats only.


User currently offlineC From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (3 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 30991 times:

Quoting Burkhard (Reply 10):
What worries me is the " and integrated content marketplace" - which means that add ons will only be possible through MS censorship and control.

That worries me too, especially the word "marketplace", which makes it sound like they're going to focus on payware add-ons only. If Microsoft doesn't allow freeware I expect Flight to fail spectacularly.


User currently offlineFly2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (3 years 9 months 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 30678 times:

Well, there is yet another new video out, and IMO it's the same old same old half-assed effort all over again        (truth be told, the final product may be very different).

I did notice however a few minor improvements, like the tree shadows on the plane itself, and even the prop creates it's own shadow on the airframe it seems.

Here's a youtube link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keTDuAz8Hbo&feature=related

Or the official link:

http://www.microsoft.com/games/flight/


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21513 posts, RR: 55
Reply 19, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 30580 times:

Quoting Fly2HMO (Reply 18):
truth be told, the final product may be very different

Doesn't look like a massive leap forward graphics-wise, but that's not a dealbreaker for me. I'd much rather have a big improvement in the way the ATC works and the way the weather is modeled than some extra shadows. And can we finally get some realistic ground handling (i.e proper friction in the tires)?

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlinecpd From Australia, joined Jun 2008, 4879 posts, RR: 38
Reply 20, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 30548 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 19):
Doesn't look like a massive leap forward graphics-wise, but that's not a dealbreaker for me. I'd much rather have a big improvement in the way the ATC works and the way the weather is modeled than some extra shadows. And can we finally get some realistic ground handling (i.e proper friction in the tires)?

The big difference - the taxiways and runways don't flicker anymore!  

I'd hope for some improvement in framerate performance, and ATC performance.


User currently offlineFly2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 30542 times:

How about airports that aren't laser-straight flat. There's no such thing as a straight runway.

User currently offlinecpd From Australia, joined Jun 2008, 4879 posts, RR: 38
Reply 22, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 30535 times:

Quoting Fly2HMO (Reply 21):
There's no such thing as a straight runway.

Good point - Rand Airport in South Africa. Then we can try and fly the B747 into there, like they did in real life!  

But I'll settle for the easier big ticket items. FSX still mostly runs slow on my computer. I think a potent quad-core computer running at 2.93ghz with a powerful graphics card should be able to manage 50fps steady, and not drop to 8fps or less.

FS / Flight needs a big internal restructure to properly take advantage of modern computers.


User currently offlineFly2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days ago) and read 30529 times:

Quoting cpd (Reply 22):
FS / Flight needs a big internal restructure to properly take advantage of modern computers.

I really hope they will do so. But If the final product is going to resemble what we saw in the video, then I'm afraid that ain't happening.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21513 posts, RR: 55
Reply 24, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 30522 times:

Quoting Fly2HMO (Reply 21):
There's no such thing as a straight runway.

Oh yes there is. Go fly in Florida or the Midwest and you'll find them.  

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
25 Post contains images Fly2HMO : May I remind you the world isn't flat
26 Post contains images EA CO AS : Having seen the latest from Microsoft's website, I have to say it - "I've got a bad feeling about this..." Based on the advertising that over-talks an
27 Burkhard : I personally have the impression that Flight will be more a series of games around a slight update to FSX, than a real new Flight Sim. Easy to make, f
28 Mir : Fair enough, but when you can't see that effect most of the time, why bother trying to depict it in FS? Though it would be nice to have the capabilit
29 Fly2HMO : Agreed. It will be bad if they still plan on charging close to $50 or more they usually do. Of course. My thinking is that if X-plane and a myriad of
30 CPH-R : In my opinion it's still a toss up. At least we've seen a bit more of the graphics, and that seems to be on par. Personally, I could settle for FS9/FS
31 Burkhard : You are aware that you can steer this by adding more taxiway nodes? I would prefer to be able to declare taxi ways as one way. Not that my main inter
32 JohnKrist : Think that was possible in FS2002 but for some reason it's not possible in FS9. You can set the option, but nothing happens IIRC.
33 Post contains links and images Fly2HMO : So I just remembered something: after the ACES team was flushed down the toilet, MS kept the FS engine around for industrial/commercial/military appli
34 cpd : ESP is/was FSX. They evolved side-by-side.
35 Post contains links C : The reason for that is because Microsoft sold ESP to Lockheed-Martin late 2009. http://www.prepar3d.com/
36 cpd : There are some interesting details there - especially online content market, does that sound familiar? The old idea was that the two were supposed to
37 Post contains links phatfarmlines : Please review the following Youtube video. It's taking the recent Microsoft Webisode 2 & comparing to FS2004. Upper left corner is Microsoft Fligh
38 Post contains images Fly2HMO : Hmmm. That kinda puts things into perspective. I will say though, that FS2004 clip looks bone stock. The way I have FS2004 set up with mods it looks
39 Post contains images Airbalticfan : Who really know what it is gonna be. It sounds more and more that we are starting to see very simple version of the game( not a Flight Sim), but yes g
40 phatfarmlines : I, for one, would welcome a business decision Microsoft is making here to make Microsoft Flight more appealing to the general public. After all, they
41 Burkhard : MSFS never made any profit. We can estimate the amount of MS stuff on it, the fraction of the overhead like law department, sales department, administ
42 airplaneaddict : I think MS flight could be a great seller if they can produce what there web casts show in game. I was once a Fan of MSFS but have moved onto x-plane
43 Fly2HMO : As a flight instructor I will say X-plane doesn't feel any more realistic to me than MSFS. In theory it should be, and yes it does feel different to
44 Post contains links phatfarmlines : Small update from Microsoft addressing more concerns from the flight sim community dated December 8th, 2010: News from the development team
45 Post contains images Fly2HMO : I'll just go ahead and post it: Overall, I'm a bit less uneasy since their first announcement. Sounds like they got TONS of flak from the hardcore fa
46 Post contains images phatfarmlines : As far as time frame, FSX was "unofficially" announced December 2005, with a formal announcement from Microsoft February 2006. Looking through the for
47 Post contains links phatfarmlines : Six new pictures added. Comparison shots versus FSX can be found on AVSIM: http://forum.avsim.net/topic/322037-ms-flight-new-photos/
48 Post contains images Fly2HMO : Yet more pictures are up: Looks good so far, not sure I'm feeling wowed though. Granted it is a work in progress, but the one major flaw I see is that
49 WNWatcher : Is it just me or do they seem to be only tacking screenshots in Hawaii?
50 cpd : Not sure my brand new computer will stand up to this... I certainly hope the performance is increased massively.
51 ash1111 : Pictures look great! Makes me regret my decision to switch to a Mac. :P I must admit, though, I feel this game will take a step away from a 'simulator
52 Post contains images cpd : I have Mac - and use Bootcamp (Windows 7). Problem solved.
53 Northwest727 : Unfortunately, Microsoft is talking about an "app store" for the next version of Windows, (so I am sure they are going to do this with other products
54 cpd : Not too unfortunate - it's not your only source of Apps. I have the App Store on my Mac as well, you don't have to get stuff through there. At the mo
55 Post contains images QFKangaroo747 : I agree, I think that MSF reached a point around FS2004 where everything to come after it was essentially minor changes with the core game engine rem
56 nighthawk : FS2004 came on 4 CDs, which made installing a bit of a hassle. Back when it was launched, DVD drives were common, but quite a standard feature on all
57 cpd : The scenery above looks even more crisp and detailed than the AUD$170 worth of OrbX scenery I purchased. That's impressive.
58 Burkhard : The graphics of FSX has absolutely nothing to do with FS8/9 type graphics, that part has been completely changed from descriptive graphics to object
59 cpd : Listen to Burkhard above, he knows what he is talking about. He's a respected and very talented FS developer. I desperately hope the new one will mak
60 WNWatcher : Does anyone know why Microsoft is only showing one specific part of Hawaii? Even in the latest webisode, they still only showed maybe a single mile of
61 Fly2HMO : Just a WAG, but If you think about it, Hawaii is perfect for testing scenery development, you have water, very mountainous areas, a large variety of
62 Burkhard : correct. And it would explain why seasons are still so poor in FSX - you cannot add seasonal textures to objects.
63 Post contains links phatfarmlines : Updated for May - six pics added: http://www.microsoft.com/games/flight/ Looks like Waikiki Beach is more detailed this time. I can identify the Royal
64 Fly2HMO : Maybe this is asking for too much too early but I'd be more impressed if they revamped the lighting engine. So far it just looks like a slightly polis
65 AirPacific747 : I hope it's not going to be too much of an Arcade game, but it certainly looks good. Also, I hope it's not going to require a monster of a computer th
66 Burkhard : I read an interview in which one of their team claims they do not intend it for a longer period to cover future computer develpments. I expect it to
67 AirPacific747 : Okay, like an expansion pack? So it won't require additional hardware specs compared to the regular FSX?
68 bueb0g : From what I read they are not allowing 3rd party developers to create add-ons for the game. You'll have to make do with the default stuff. If that's
69 united319 : What a load of crap!!! I'm not buying it either if thats the case. The default planes/scenery are always sub par. They should spend a lot more time o
70 phatfarmlines : Source? This is the first I've heard of this.
71 Post contains images Fly2HMO : Not a chance in hell. They're not THAT stupid, or are they?
72 alberchico : I have never heard of such a decision being made, Microsoft would not be that stupid.... source please.
73 Burkhard : Sorry I cannot give you sources, but I think it is fair to summarize the following: Microsoft has stated that Flight will come with a built in market
74 Post contains links phatfarmlines : September update to pictures http://www.microsoft.com/games/flight/ More Waikiki shots (Hilton Hawaiian Village, Sheraton, Royal Hawaiian), the Mauna
75 Post contains images David L : The eye-candy updates are all very interesting but, until we learn more about what it's going to be like as a flight simulator, I remain ambivalent. I
76 Fly2HMO : I'm still pretty skeptical overall. And honestly I'm not overly impressed with what I've seen so far. The graphics look like little more than slightl
77 WNwatcher : Well Guys... Microsoft has released a new press release/screenshot bundle... and I can say that I have the feeling that Flight will be Hawaii only :/
78 Post contains links CPH-R : RIP the MSFS franchise then. They might get the the odd sale here and there, but the existing MSFS community will balk at this blatant money grab, and
79 Fabo : well XPL10 it is then, isnt it?
80 WNwatcher : Looks like any Airline ops for Flight will be limited to something similar to Aloha. I do like how Fly Away kind of told us how to spur Microsoft into
81 Airbalticfan : Come on guys! With this announcement it is clear that we, the true flight simmers, got a slap in a face from Microsoft, so I will stick with FS9 or FS
82 phatfarmlines : Wow....shocking. I tried to be positive; offered encouragement and full support of Microsoft's efforts to combat piracy, but in their efforts, Microso
83 hnl2bos : I'm still confused, the Microsoft website still mentions in their FAQ that Flight "retains the full fidelity simulation." So is it still a simulator w
84 phatfarmlines : Oh it does alright. So long as you don't mind flying from HNL to OGG or any route within Hawaii for that matter.
85 Gingersnap : FSX it shall remain then for the foreseeable future. Alas there is a lot you can still do with that engine, as shown with some of the latest addons av
86 hnl2bos : I assume that regions of map will be purchasable through their store. I just dont get where this is going with the recent trailer they released. It s
87 817Dreamliiner : hmmm I guess im sticking with FSX as well
88 Northwest727 : That's what you get when you kill your division in charge of games, realize it was stupid, and try to hire less-talented people to re-develop what you
89 Post contains images Mir : Yeah....no.... Well, at least it's free. But they're not getting a penny from me until they put out something resembling FSX. Whole world, both freew
90 Tomskii : Thing is you don't have to purchase the Hawaiian part LOL
91 Air77 : While I bought FSX when it first came out, I only ran it for a short while after it became quickly apparent that my computer at the time was not going
92 hnl2bos : Do yourself a favor and go the homebuild windows machine way. You'll save a ton of cash and have yourself a much better computer for simming.
93 flymia : Why not get a cheaper windows machine which will be more powerful anyway and run both FSX and xplane? PMDG wrote a long statement about what MS did t
94 Mir : You could also get a Windows machine capable of running FSX. The price for such a machine will be much lower now than it was a few years ago. Any lin
95 Post contains links ElpinDAB : Is this the statement, flymia? http://forum.avsim.net/topic/358874-some-thoughts-on-flight/ With the introduction of Flight, the future of MS Flight
96 flymia : That's is, I suggest everyone read this. For us flight simmers I think it will be a few more years until we have something to replace FSX. PMDG is lo
97 Mir : I wouldn't necessarily say that. FSX is still a very capable platform (in fact, now that the average new computer has a realistic chance of running i
98 Burkhard : MSFS is very well alive. MSFS is FSX10 for the majoity, FS9 for a minority and Prepar3D for a tiny group of enthusisast/ semi professionals/ real pro
99 Post contains images wilco737 : FS Flight is different to FS9 and FSX. I am beta tester and have it here at home and used it couple of times. I cannot really say much about it, had
100 Post contains images NAV20 : Hope I don't land you in trouble, wilco737 - but, since I expect that you are an 'FS addict' like the rest of us, only having used FS Flight 'a coupl
101 Post contains images wilco737 : no, you got me wrong here. I only have it 2 or 3 days now and I have trouble signing in with my windows live ID, so I cannot use all the features yet
102 Post contains links alberchico : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KzXaX_ZkWU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rhZkBOGDT0 this should give people an idea of what to expect.
103 WNwatcher : I'm in the beta as well... I'll say this... I'll stick around and see what the future updates bring.
104 Northwest727 : I talked to a buddy of mine that is beta testing Flight! and also works for Microsoft. Right out of the box, MS will only offer a small land area (cur
105 Post contains images EA CO AS : You mean the fact that Microsoft forced the removal of the video?
106 Post contains images alberchico : thank god i downloaded these videos to my hard drive using keepvid before they were deleted... Well in any case its better that the videos are gone,
107 Post contains links johnkrist : Flying around Hawaii for days is not something I feel like doing, and until we see what a "nominal" fee actually is I think I will pass. But if all fr
108 Mir : This won't happen, much as it would be nice. MS won't put in the man-hours required to test software without attaching some price tag to it. -Mir[Edi
109 Burkhard : I think we are not allowed to say if we are beta testers if we take serious what we might have signed. This said, Microsoft Flight! to all we know isn
110 Post contains images Fabo : That will be an interesting PRspeak way to find out if someone is a betatester no/I can not confirm nor deny That reminds me of certain spokesman for
111 WNwatcher : I don't think Microsoft minds us saying if we are, we just can't divulge any information regarding what we see/experience.
112 Airbalticfan : See garbage and experience crap! Job well done Microsoft!
113 WNwatcher : You forget, Flight is not MSFS11, it's not meant to be the replacement for FSX. Granted, I still prefer FSX for more realistic simulation, but I feel
114 Giancavia : No AI? No 3rd party developement (which are basicly what makes all the Flight simulation games what they are). No AIRLINERS??? A stupid windows live a
115 WNwatcher : Microsoft hasn't announced any of that. The game is still in early Beta, which means the main thing that is being tested is the game engine. As far a
116 Burkhard : So the basic expectation that Flight! will serve to boost FSX already works. When I first heared the name Flight! it was clear for me that this is no
117 Post contains images Fly2HMO : There's already hundreds of (unauthorized) videos out there on Flight. So for those of you wondering just google around and see for yourselves. Otherw
118 Fly2HMO : The Flight Beta has closed officially as of today. The full game will be released Feb 29th.
119 CaptainDoony : Haha 1200 Microsoft Points for ONE plane! The Maule M7 costs £12! Emm I think I'll pass Microsoft.
120 Mir : For that price, it had better be significantly better than the default MS standard. -Mir
121 alberchico : so at this point am I to understand that there will absolutely no heavy metal offered with this initial release ???
122 Fly2HMO : Very wishful thinking. Nope. Expect only "cute" planes that will only appeal to 8 year-olds on a sugar high.
123 CPH-R : Reading the AVSIM forums, I was under the impression that they had held talks with the likes of Orbx and other well known developers, and had been un
124 Post contains images Fly2HMO : This I'm afraid could be the final nail in MSFS's coffin. I really think MS is overestimating the appeal of the flight simu... I'm sorry, GAME (becau
125 Burkhard : Millions of dollars in the addon buisiness is the biggest joke I ever heared. Microsoft wnats to do what Apple and Google male in their App Stores. Ap
126 cc2314 : This sounds like a nightmare of a mess.Well at least there is no suspense i can merrily go back to flying my wilco737 in fs9 with a million addons tha
127 Mir : Oh, I'm certainly not expecting it. To be fair, I have been wanting an FS version of an Icon A5 for a while. But that's about the only thing that app
128 joffie : This "game" is markeded for kids, not hard core simmers. I mean, Microsoft points??, flying collecting coins?? Scrap that rubbish, and let me fly my P
129 mmedford : Well guys...look on the bright side. Atleast now you won't have to build a computer for an unknown benchmark... You already own FSX...lol
130 Burkhard : And more and more computers can handle FSX... Of course my computer that can handle FSX best will never be connected to the internet and have any Liv
131 Post contains images JohnKrist : It's available for download now, and I will install it to see what it's all about I have my doubts but need to try to have an oppinion...
132 Post contains images wilco737 : Don't expect too much But happy flying. wilco737
133 Post contains images Harmonium : Am I the only one having troubles launching the game? I downloaded and installed it perfectly fine, but when I start the game, after the splash screen
134 mdavies06 : I am just reading from another website with users citing very positive feedback at least on one thing - the performance is allegedly very good. The gr
135 Fly2HMO : Well now that the beta is officially over I can divulge some more...For what its worth, I uninstalled the beta almost immediately after flying for a f
136 q120 : Hi everyone, I finally played FS Flight last night. It is very different than any FS before it. I am not impressed with anything the game has to offer
137 rfields5421 : I really like the realistically slopped runways in the beta. It is not an FSX follow-on. We knew the MSFS franchise had ended when they let the Aces t
138 Fly2HMO : Huh? They were flatter than pancakes. At least all the paved ones were. I did not see single sloping runway. It was the same old same old typical imp
139 Post contains links san747 : AVSIM review of Flight: http://www.avsim.com/pages/0212/Microsoft/Flight.html
140 Post contains links alberchico : So basically its a modern version of Flight Unlimited 3, an sim that came out back in in 1998 Even that game was better that what Flight is today. Not
141 Giancavia : A Flight sim with no ATC or AI.. put it in the trash where it belongs. Fail.
142 Longhornmaniac : Once upon a time, I was as adamantly against Flight as many of y'all were. And the truth is, as it stands, Flight isn't going to be able to do what we
143 Fabo : The question is, are they doing that? All signs point to a big NO.
144 Mir : Except that Flight is cut from the same mold as Apple's App Store - everything that's going to be an add-on is going to have to be signed off on by M
145 Giancavia : Indeed.. tis all about the money. The only thing Flight offers is nice scenery but since it is limited to a minute place on the planet and you have t
146 Burkhard : How - If I switch off AI traffic in FSX, I have 100 fps++ in that lonely area on my office system. And the scenery in flight contains out of almost n
147 ZKNCL : Oh my. This game is the pure definition of shocking- all it does is wastes space and is a overall tradgety in Flight Simulation History. No ATC, Prope
148 Post contains links Longhornmaniac : Here is a link to an AVSIM interview with one of the developers: http://forum.avsim.net/index.php?app...n=pages&folder=/AVSIM%20Pages&id=8 Bul
149 CPH-R : One of the Orbx developers made a post on AVSIM, shortly after the NDA had been lifted, where he painted quite the different picture from what MS said
150 F9Animal : Well, I guess our hopes in the flight sim world now lie in the hands of X plane. I have played X a little, but does not have the ai like flight simula
151 Post contains links alberchico : Flight sim x is still light years ahead of x plane. Never liked it anyway. I guess it is like a Mac vs PC debate. BTW has anybody tried out aerofly f
152 Gingersnap : Prepar3D is the future of Flight Simming. It is backwards compatible with all FSX addons, and they have just released a consumer version for around $5
153 Fabo : That is not a consumer version, that is an academic version. You should not consider it a general consumer version just because LM "forgot" to ask you
154 Burkhard : True, but the lowered price of $199 for the full version, the 10$/month developer subscription and the very cheap academic version together bundle it
155 N766UA : I could give a crap about flying long haul. How am I supposed to use it as a training tool to practice approaches in New England if Hawaii is the onl
156 Burkhard : You are supposed to purchase the New England scenery from Microsoft once it appears. I hope for Microsoft and the people there involved that this wil
157 Fabo : Or just buy X-Plane (or stay with FSX) and be done with it... Or Prepar3D, in theory.
158 Burkhard : Why, they have lowered the price for the full version significantly and have enough alternatives as licensing so that every simmer who uses the sim m
159 Fabo : Burkhard: the main issue is not price, as many a serious simmer wastes more than 200 dollars for add-ons every couple months, but EULA, that does not
160 Post contains links Burkhard : My understanding of entertainment is that the fun of it more important than the realism, so an entertainment product has in the majority of cases sacr
161 CPH-R : How on earth can they detect if you're using P3d for 'entertainment' purposes or not? Will you be required to hook up a webcam, and the instant a smil
162 Burkhard : See it the other way. Prepar3D has licensed the code - but Microsoft wants to continue to sell FSX and addons for Flight!. That is the reason why LM i
163 Fabo : Its not that - it is, that many FSX add-ons are legally marketed solely as entertainment products, and as such, you may not legally use them in P3D.
164 Mir : What they market them as isn't that important - you can use a lot of products for purposes other than for which they were intended. I would think LM
165 Burkhard : LM only has to proove to Microsoft that Prepar3D is no entertainment product. I think it is the extra work needed to adapt and verify a product for Pr
166 speedbird217 : I really don't get how some people are worse than an office full of lawyers. I am pretty sure LM knows what they are doing, so are the developers for
167 Fabo : the problem is not with end users - that is apparent enough. However I for one have no interest in P3D if I can not get my NGX et al. in it... and tha
168 Burkhard : I predict the producers of addons will go with the market - and the market for P3D addons is growing very steep, is at half the FSX addon market curre
169 cpd : Checking in after a long time - if Prepar3D will support my addons like OrbX, FSLabs Concorde and PMDG B737/B747/MD-11, I'll grab that right away and
170 Post contains images Fabo : cpd: ORBX offers licenses for P3D. PMDG stated that use of their add-ons in P3D is not permitted, but has not yet done anything else (they said they m
171 gingersnap : To be fair, I'm led to believe the majority of FSX addons (especially scenery at least) are very much compatible with P3D as things stand. Let's not
172 Post contains links and images cpd : Burkhard was/is a developer. I'm pretty sure we actually met in Seattle at the Redhook Brewery, while listening to the soft sounds of "Zee" doing kara
173 Burkhard : Hi cpd, no I was invited but didn't go to Seattle - you know my FSX/P3D project is of infinite size and will not end before aviation ends to need upda
174 Fabo : Oh, so it seems you guys are seriously in the development - that is cool. Do you mind me asking who you work for/with/as? I myself know next to nothin
175 Post contains images cpd : No worries then. (must be another developer with the same first name). Yes, I'm all better now. I'm happy to enjoy Flight Sim as the end user, maybe
176 Burkhard : Sorry I cannot withstand - X-Plane is not a clean-sheet - it is like starting with used ... paper. and Fabo, I work for myself, my products are publis
177 Fabo : I was thinking more "contracted" then "employed", but I get the point. I dont delve much into it, I have neither skills nor desire to go commercial h
178 cpd : Fabo: I think people do get contracted in, I'm certainly aware of it - but won't say who or what for obvious reasons. It tends to be for specialised w
179 Burkhard : Most developers I know are not contracted, they work on their own and offer their products to several publishers. No publisher reached a dominant part
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