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Topic: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-06 06:23:28 and read 5794 times.

By the amount of threads about screening, rejections, rejection help, pre-screening
why is it not called "The Pre, after, rejection screening help forum......"

VG.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Jamesbuk
Posted 2008-01-06 06:26:14 and read 5788 times.



Quoting AKE0404AR (Thread starter):

Why make it so specific like that when it could just be called aviation photography like it is, then everything to do with aviation photography will be suited here.

Rgds --James--

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: DerekF
Posted 2008-01-06 06:39:29 and read 5775 times.



Quoting AKE0404AR (Thread starter):
By the amount of threads about screening, rejections, rejection help, pre-screening
why is it not called "The Pre, after, rejection screening help forum......"

That's what it's for isn't it?

This is from the photo upload page:-

"Ask your fellow photographers for advice and constructive criticism in our photography forum. "

I've found the advice on here very helpful. Is their a problem with helping people out?

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named.
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-06 07:38:15 and read 5733 times.

Here is a quick rundown of the last 2 weeks:

Rougly about 20 posts about pre-screening alone:

For a newbie who has zero pictures on here, I kind of understand this, but for a more or less"established" photographer to ask for pre-screening for standard shots, by now you should have an idea what a.net wants and what goes down the drain......

Quoting DerekF (Reply 2):
"Ask your fellow photographers for advice and constructive criticism in our photography forum. "

I second that and this is part of the forum, but lately it got a little out of hand.
This is just my personal opinion. I have always voiced my opinion over the years. Some people agree with me, some don't........

Vasco G.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: TimdeGroot
Posted 2008-01-06 07:50:17 and read 5722 times.



Quoting AKE0404AR (Reply 3):
I second that and this is part of the forum, but lately it got a little out of hand.
This is just my personal opinion. I have always voiced my opinion over the years. Some people agree with me, some don't........

Vasco,

Recently all photographers got acces to this forum. So the increased number of prescreening threads is a result of that.
I welcome them all, it helps them develop their skills and it helps the queue by making sure they put the best images in there.

Tim

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: JeffM
Posted 2008-01-06 08:29:39 and read 5694 times.



Quoting AKE0404AR (Reply 3):
but lately it got a little out of hand.

that's an understatement...

Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 4):
it helps them develop their skills and it helps the queue by making sure they put the best images in there.

..wouldn't it do the same thing with it's very own forum? Taking a close look, some appear to just be lazy.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Codeshare
Posted 2008-01-06 08:48:37 and read 5681 times.

Why are there so many pre-screening posts? One reason is because the uploaders are afraid of rejections, and are taking things too seriously, especially the acceptance ratio, for instance. The rules are set and well written (hmmmm...) and I guess some people don't read them and proceed directly to the upload page and then the whole thing ('my photo was rejected, help me with the photo' etc.) starts.

KS/codeshare

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: ThierryD
Posted 2008-01-06 09:40:01 and read 5648 times.



Quoting Codeshare (Reply 6):
The rules are set and well written (hmmmm...) and I guess some people don't read them and proceed directly to the upload page and then the whole thing ('my photo was rejected, help me with the photo' etc.) starts.

Of course, there's still the Illustrated guide which however most newer contributors don't know as there's no official link. So here's the unofficial one: http://www.planecatcher.com/IGRR.htm  Wink

Thierry

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named.
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-06 10:12:58 and read 5623 times.



Quoting Codeshare (Reply 6):
uploaders are afraid of rejections, and are taking things too seriously, especially the acceptance ratio,

Bingo!!!

Quoting ThierryD (Reply 7):
So here's the unofficial one: http://www.planecatcher.com/IGRR.htm

I like it a lot, would that be something to be incorporated into the upload page (still needs some work, but it is a very good start)

Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 4):
Recently all photographers got acces to this forum. So the increased number of prescreening threads is a result of that.

ok.

Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 4):
I welcome them all

I do too

Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 4):
it helps them develop their skills and it helps the queue by making sure they put the best images in there.

As far as I see it, most of the questions are basic photography and editing stuff.
Why not take the "MasterClass thing" a step further. Show sample images (unedited - edited with the exact steps call it A.net Tutorial) so newbies and oldies can have a look at them and can learn from there!

I do too struggle a lot of times and a.net has made me a better PS guy over the years, so I am pretty certain, if implemented, I'd check it out too.

I am sure everyone could benefit from it!

Vasco

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: INNflight
Posted 2008-01-06 10:16:31 and read 5619 times.

I guess it's been said often enough, but to bring it up again......Imho the masterclass threads should be STICKIES in the photography forum......so newcomers can be directed to these at the very first point....

Florian

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: IL76
Posted 2008-01-06 10:28:47 and read 5609 times.

Quoting AKE0404AR (Reply 8):
Why not take the "MasterClass thing" a step further. Show sample images (unedited - edited with the exact steps call it A.net Tutorial)

I have/had made a document a while ago and Tim made one on slide scanning, but back in the Johan days, that never made it on-line. Perhaps with the new management we can get that ball rolling again.

Ed

[Edited 2008-01-06 10:36:17]

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: TimdeGroot
Posted 2008-01-06 10:29:32 and read 5610 times.



Quoting INNflight (Reply 9):
I guess it's been said often enough, but to bring it up again......Imho the masterclass threads should be STICKIES in the photography forum......so newcomers can be directed to these at the very first point....

We should have a masterclass section soon. We have something else planned that may greatly help people starting out here!

Tim

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Codeshare
Posted 2008-01-06 11:46:12 and read 5572 times.

...and perhaps Thierry's guide should be more a.net official, it is in a way, what I mean is more 'exposed' to the public. I would add to it by putting in comments from the screeners themselves. For example concerning quality rejections - what are the most common mistakes and how to 'locate' them. Motiv is a totally different book  devil 

KS/codeshare

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Silver1SWA
Posted 2008-01-06 13:15:27 and read 5519 times.



Quoting Codeshare (Reply 6):
Why are there so many pre-screening posts? One reason is because the uploaders are afraid of rejections, and are taking things too seriously, especially the acceptance ratio, for instance. The rules are set and well written (hmmmm...) and I guess some people don't read them and proceed directly to the upload page and then the whole thing ('my photo was rejected, help me with the photo' etc.) starts.

Or some of us are looking for help to a problem that has developed. I have been guilty of posting a prescreening thread or two lately, but that's because seemingly out of nowhere I started developing problems that I never really had before. Even those of us that think we know the rules/standards and cruise along just fine for a while find a bump in the road and need a place to ask for input to help get it straightened out. You do things long enough and often enough, sometimes you start developing bad habits and it takes some outside eyes to pick up on the problem.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: BaldurSveins
Posted 2008-01-06 13:16:22 and read 5518 times.

I am one of the so called "oldies" that have been around for a long time. I have myself been "guilty" of asking for help on prescreening. I am 64 years old and my eyesight was never too good and has not improved and this makes me vary of missing things like spots, borders, softness and others. Therefore it is invaluable for me to be able to ask the good friends on here for a little help.
I have uploaded photos that to my sight have been ok ( and of course a few that never should have been uploaded in the condition they were) and in most cases I should have asked for opinions. I have in many cases looked at some of my rejections and struggled to find the faults, like small dustspots and others.
I would not object to having a special forum for these prescreening posts, but see no pressing reason for splitting up this forum.
Just my little bit.

Baldur Sveinsson

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: TimdeGroot
Posted 2008-01-06 13:20:51 and read 5513 times.



Quoting BaldurSveins (Reply 14):
I have myself been "guilty" of asking for help on prescreening.

No need to feel guilty baldur! Better to ask for help than to get rejection for things you miss yourself.

Don't think it's a good idea to split the forum, there aren't that many posts as it is (compared to the bigger forums).

The main reason why we gave every photog a forum account was so they could come here and be assisted by the vast body of knowledge on this forum. As screeners we'd like to help everyone out personally but there really is not enough time. On the forum there's always someone willing to help.

Tim

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named.
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-06 13:47:26 and read 5500 times.

Quoting BaldurSveins (Reply 14):
I have myself been "guilty" of asking for help

There is no real need to feel "guilty" just because someone has asked the community for help.

I do it too, once in a blue moon, but what kind of annoys me is the following question:

Is this good enough, will it make it, etc....you get the idea.

If you have a guideline, tutorial or whatever you want to call it, to refer to and compare your image, you get a pretty good idea what a.net is looking for. It can save a lot of time, since right now you might answer the same question over and over again.

There are some out here, like Jeff mentioned, who are just lazy.....

It all may sound kind of negative, but I want to turn it into a positive thread, come up with suggestions how we can help and maybe make the site ever better....

I call this constructive critisism


Vasco

[Edited 2008-01-06 13:52:47]

[Edited 2008-01-06 13:54:26]

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: TweetDriver
Posted 2008-01-06 14:07:36 and read 5473 times.

Well this kind of goes in the same direction I was asking about the other day...

I will refrain from uploading in the future, since it seems to be to much of a niusance.

Regards, Henk

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-06 14:13:53 and read 5467 times.



Quoting TweetDriver (Reply 17):
Well this kind of goes in the same direction I was asking about the other day...

No it does not!

Quoting TweetDriver (Reply 17):
I will refrain from uploading in the future, since it seems to be to much of a niusance.

If a simple conversation keeps you away from uploading, I feel sorry for you!

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named.
Username: TweetDriver
Posted 2008-01-06 14:23:39 and read 5459 times.

No this and some other simple conversations where people are telling others tthey have no clue about photography and cause they are new should wait at least about 5 years before beeing taken seriously.
At least that is the feeling I get from some people telling others about things.

So why should I upload, if I have no clue anyways and do not feel wellcome?

[Edited 2008-01-06 14:26:52]

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-06 14:40:05 and read 5445 times.



Quoting TweetDriver (Reply 19):

So why should I upload, if I have no clue anyways and do not feel wellcome?

If I hadn't looked at your profile I would say you are 14 or 15. Why the attitude?
This is not personal, just relax and take it easy.

Quoting TweetDriver (Reply 19):
where people are telling others they have no clue about photography

I got news for you, just browse thru the forum and you will see lot's of threads that will tell you that some actually don't even know what the f-stop means or just lacking basic photography skills. Is it bad no, we all have started somewhere!

One more thing, photography is one thing, editing is another and a whole different ballgame!

Vasco

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: CalgaryBill
Posted 2008-01-06 15:20:23 and read 5420 times.



Quoting AKE0404AR (Reply 20):
One more thing, photography is one thing, editing is another and a whole different ballgame!

I agree with Vasco. This isn't negative at all, it's just that pre-screening for A.net is taking up half or more of the thread these days. Just before posting this response I counted 14 out of the top 25 threads are pre-screening or rejection topics.

Absolutely, people should have a place to ask for pre-screening, to rant about their (most certainly unwarranted) rejections, and ask for critiques. But those of us who want to talk about lenses, good places to shoot, the hottest new camera, the never ending Nikon vs Canon wars, etc, should not have to wade through tons of the other threads. That single subject alone is taking up more than enough space to warrant its own forum.

Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 15):
Don't think it's a good idea to split the forum, there aren't that many posts as it is (compared to the bigger forums).

First off Tim, thank you for spending so much time on the forums trying to help out! There may not be that many posts in total, but critique threads alone are taking over the forum and making it difficult to get to non-critiquing related discussions.

Quoting TweetDriver (Reply 19):
So why should I upload, if I have no clue anyways and do not feel wellcome?

As mentioned in your other thread, it was about people slagging other photographers, not about newbies being unwelcome. Everyone is welcome to post pictures and ask for help, but I thought that was cleared up in your thread.

B

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-07 04:45:07 and read 5322 times.



Quoting CalgaryBill (Reply 21):
I agree with Vasco. This isn't negative at all, it's just that pre-screening for A.net is taking up half or more of the thread these days. Just before posting this response I counted 14 out of the top 25 threads are pre-screening or rejection topics.

Good to know that I am not the only one who has noticed it.....thanks for participating Bill.

Vasco

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Silver1SWA
Posted 2008-01-07 05:30:22 and read 5304 times.

I get this feeling that some of the more seasoned/experienced photographers find such threads to be an annoyance. So, tell me...if we put pre-screening threads in a special place out of the way of those who cannot be bothered by such threads, then where will the requested help and pre-screening come from? I suspect a forum for pre-screening would not only have very little activity, but what little activity it would see would be thread starting without a whole lot of replying/help.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Boeingfreak
Posted 2008-01-07 05:55:41 and read 5288 times.

I have noticed that increase of prescreening-threads as well and while I have nothing against newbies asking for rejection help or prescreening, I'm against more experienced photographers (couple of hundered shots online already) that start a new thread for every side-on shot in sunny conditions and ask "Will it get accepted?". Currently there is at least one "more experienced"photographer that has started plenty of these threads and I'm not sure if you have the same person in mind as the one I have Vasco, but I'm getting annoyed by his threads as well.

But, IMO you should have contacted the posters of the threads that annoy you via personal message instead of starting a thread making those feel bad that have asked for help in the past weeks.

Florian

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: INNflight
Posted 2008-01-07 06:31:50 and read 5271 times.

/long thread on

Quoting Boeingfreak (Reply 24):
But, IMO you should have contacted the posters of the threads that annoy you via personal message instead of starting a thread making those feel bad that have asked for help in the past weeks.

I don't think this thread exists because Vasco is annoyed by postings done by users who seek constructive help here at all. He's never been someone here who'd not get his thoughts out if he feels it's justified and he has always voiced his opinion, which is absolutely fair imo.

I have to agree with him to an extent, because I have to agree lately there's almost nothing but pre-screening threads left in this section.

In no way I say they shouldn't be here, I just feel that to a degree the system has the fault for it. The FAQ page before you get to upload your photos is L O N G....and as many of you probably know from other sides.......reading the fineprint is something hardly anyone cares about anymore...you'd spent half of your life doing it, so I take it most new uploaders simply don't.....go straight to uploading their 1600 pixel unedited files and dang - get their rejections. Now they come here and start threads to get acceptances with the help of more qualified photographers.

We'd need a page with explained reasons (Thierry's one E.G.!) and a page with photos SIDE BY SIDE of what's acceptable and what not. Then put all these links in a seperate thread where nobody can REPLY but read only.

Make that thread a STICKY atop of the photography forum. Make it red, blinking, even with sound if you enter (  Wink ) so people notice it and can get a general idea what it takes from it.

/long thread over......boring afternoon, sry guys.

Florian

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Whisperjet
Posted 2008-01-07 06:59:59 and read 5285 times.

Hi,

on the one hand you say that many people just do not read FAQs and all these things and on the other hand you're suggesting a page with examples of of acceptable and non acceptable pictures... So what's new then?

Quoting INNflight (Reply 25):
The FAQ page before you get to upload your photos is L O N G....and as many of you probably know from other sides.......reading the fineprint is something hardly anyone cares about anymore...you'd spent half of your life doing it, so I take it most new uploaders simply don't.....



Quoting INNflight (Reply 25):
We'd need a page with explained reasons (Thierry's one E.G.!) and a page with photos SIDE BY SIDE of what's acceptable and what not. Then put all these links in a seperate thread where nobody can REPLY but read only.

It's not too difficult to see what's acceptable but the main problem is that many photographers are too proud of their pictures so that they don't see why their picture should be unacceptable for airliners.net.

I got the impression that many people who are asking for prescreening here are not really interested in real help but mainly in a final confirmation that the picture will be accepted.

Stefan

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: JeffM
Posted 2008-01-07 07:05:18 and read 5278 times.



Quoting Whisperjet (Reply 26):
on the one hand you say that many people just do not read FAQs and all these things and on the other hand you're suggesting a page with examples of of acceptable and non acceptable pictures... So what's new then?

Bingo....If you don't read the rules, what makes you think they will go look at the "special page"...

Quoting Whisperjet (Reply 26):
I got the impression that many people who are asking for prescreening here are not really interested in real help but mainly in a final confirmation that the picture will be accepted.

Yup.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: TimdeGroot
Posted 2008-01-07 07:35:14 and read 5255 times.



Quoting Whisperjet (Reply 26):

on the one hand you say that many people just do not read FAQs and all these things and on the other hand you're suggesting a page with examples of of acceptable and non acceptable pictures... So what's new then?

A page with examples would be good, but yes there will always be people who won't bother to read any of the help sections. That's why we have A330s uploaded with category CLASSIC...

Tim

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: INNflight
Posted 2008-01-07 07:51:02 and read 5245 times.



Quoting Whisperjet (Reply 26):
on the one hand you say that many people just do not read FAQs and all these things and on the other hand you're suggesting a page with examples of of acceptable and non acceptable pictures... So what's new then?

A valid point, however I was referring to the endless FAQ before the upload page, which would take you half an hour to read through (probably more) from top to bottom.

A single page placed prominently with Thierry's guide as well as side-by-side pics for every reason would take 5mins to flip through to learn what makes a difference in for example grainy or distance rejections.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Boeingfreak
Posted 2008-01-07 08:51:08 and read 5227 times.



Quoting INNflight (Reply 25):
so I take it most new uploaders simply don't.....go straight to uploading their 1600 pixel unedited files and dang - get their rejections

Exactly, but that could be avoided with an error message: "Sorry, your picture is too large, please resize it." (something like that...) instead of the auto-resizing. As I do not think that there are any top-photographers that upload their shots edited but at a size bigger than 2500pix and let the auto-resizing do the work, I think that there is no need for this "feature" anymore.

Florian

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Psych
Posted 2008-01-07 11:05:24 and read 5200 times.



Quoting INNflight (Reply 25):
The FAQ page before you get to upload your photos is L O N G.

I didn't write it Flo - honest  wink .

Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 11):
We should have a masterclass section soon

I look forward to that, Tim, and other developments.

I would also love to see Thierry's work (fine tuned if necessary) adopted formally by the site.

Paul

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-07 13:37:12 and read 5148 times.



Quoting Boeingfreak (Reply 24):
Currently there is at least one "more experienced"photographer that has started plenty of these threads and I'm not sure if you have the same person in mind as the one I have Vasco

A few things have bothered me in the past few weeks. The issue you are referring to may have been the trigger to finally put it into words. It just got a little out of hand and by the replies received so far, I would say we have found an issue that needs
1.) to be brought up
2.) has to be discussed

Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 28):
there will always be people who won't bother to read any of the help sections

Where ever you go, you'll find these knuckleheads.

Quoting Whisperjet (Reply 26):
I got the impression that many people who are asking for prescreening here are not really interested in real help but mainly in a final confirmation that the picture will be accepted.

there is nothing more to add, after x amount of pictures accepted you should have a pretty good idea and be confident enough to say (yes it will make it / no it will be rejected)

Who gives a s...t about the acceptance ratio, after being at mid 60% again, it dropped down to 48% so what. This is not the end of my life.........

I am still very much in favor of this masterclass thing and I would like to see it online soon. A searchable database of PS actions (a step by step explanation how to work those images)

Vasco

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: DerekF
Posted 2008-01-07 13:48:16 and read 5142 times.



Quoting AKE0404AR (Reply 32):
Who gives a s...t about the acceptance ratio, after being at mid 60% again, it dropped down to 48% so what. This is not the end of my life.........

You might care if you could only upload 2 or 5 photos at a time though.

Quoting AKE0404AR (Reply 32):
there is nothing more to add, after x amount of pictures accepted you should have a pretty good idea and be confident enough to say (yes it will make it / no it will be rejected)

If that was true then those with "x" photos would have 100% acceptance. Does anyone have a consistent 100% acceptance?

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named.
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-07 14:08:02 and read 5132 times.



Quoting DerekF (Reply 33):
Quoting AKE0404AR (Reply 32):
there is nothing more to add, after x amount of pictures accepted you should have a pretty good idea and be confident enough to say (yes it will make it / no it will be rejected)

If that was true then those with "x" photos would have 100% acceptance. Does anyone have a consistent 100% acceptance?

I said: you should have, this is not a guarantee

Quoting DerekF (Reply 33):
You might care if you could only upload 2 or 5 photos at a time though.

No, not really, since I am uploading 2-5 shots at a time anyway

The system is fine as it is, but a lot of people are too concerned about some numbers and figures.
So what happens if you can only upload 5 shot at any given time. Wait for them to be screened and upload another 5 shots.....etc.

Go back a couple of years (not the digital era)...I hardly doubt people would sit down, scan 50 shots of a BA Airbus landing RWY 27R at LHR and upload them.......(off topic sorry)

Vasco

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: DerekF
Posted 2008-01-07 14:23:34 and read 5122 times.



Quoting AKE0404AR (Reply 34):
this is not a guarantee

Exactly , which is why sometimes people ask for advice. I'm still not sure I understand the problem with that.

Personally I don't use the forum for pre-screening (maybe I should!)' I use it occasionally to understand why a picture has been rejected - my uploads not being perfect.
I would love to be able to achieve a 100% acceptance - wouldn't everybody? If not why not?

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Lennymuir
Posted 2008-01-07 18:42:52 and read 5092 times.

Derek, can't you see what Vasco is saying?

Vasco >>

Quote:
One more thing, photography is one thing, editing is another and a whole different ballgame!

Aviation photography (taking pictures of aeroplanes) and digital editing to get pictures accepted
into airliners.net are two different disciplines.

I can see the difference. Hence the request for opinions.

...and I'm an old a.net git, just like you! (comparatively)  

Gerry

[Edited 2008-01-07 18:45:53]

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: JakTrax
Posted 2008-01-07 22:57:29 and read 5060 times.

I see a lot of valid points on both sides here, however this is my take:

I have been uploading to this site since February last year (2007) so I guess I'm kinda a newbie here. A very helpful young man edited my first pic and it got accepted, which I was really chuffed about. I decided to buy Photoshop and give editing a go myself, and after about 6 consecutive rejections I realised just how precise the editing must be. This highlights the argument about actually taking the photo and processing it in photoshop afterwards - definately in my experience two different things. You may be the world's greatest and most consistently accurate photog' but if you can't edit properly then you're screwed, at least here on A.net anyway. In retrospect, you may be a crap photog' but if you're a bit of an editing whizz you can make mediocre photos acceptable to the database.

I gradually learned how to edit from various people in this forum (you know who you are!), by asking for constructive criticism, but I never went over the top - if I was really struggling I'd start a thread. Nowadays I do all my own editing and my acceptance ratio is above 60%, which obviously means I still get rejections from time-to-time. But after my first few shots passed screening I got a good idea of the standards and what's required (most of my rejections these days are for dust-spots which, always being in a hurry, I've failed to pick up on) and therefore I don't feel the need to constantly ask you lot for advice any more. I'm capable now of identifying dust-spots, centering the subject, checking for level and correcting any colour/exposure discrepancies, despite only having 35 shots in the database, which isn't many.

My point? If I am a newbie, with only 35 shots here, and I don't post continual threads asking, "Is this OK?", then why do others with more experience feel the need? You know, IMHO, after your first, say, 5 accepted shots what's required - use common sense and do your own pre-screening. Ask yourself the fundamental questions - is it level? Is it properly centred? Does it have a cast? Is the exposure OK? Are there dust-spots? Once you've answered these questions yourself you shouldn't need to ask everyone else, but I get the feeling people are rushing here to get their shots accepted and aren't asking themselves any of these questions. When the answer's 'yes' to the majority then you're ready to upload, Just remember, everyone is looking at the same pic and will only see what you see - no more, no less.

Having said all this however, exceptions are real newbies, who are just learning about photoshop or indeed photography itself. I have no objections whatsoever to such people asking for pre-screening but in all honesty the ropes are quickly learned.

Hope you see my points here.

Karl

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: JakTrax
Posted 2008-01-07 23:10:24 and read 5053 times.

Something I forgot to mention........

The photography forum is for just that, and although threads asking for advice fall into that category, to be honest they take a lot of enjoyment out of browsing this forum. These "Is this OK?" threads are not entertaining; in fact they are pretty boring and once answered by one - maybe two - people they are rendered null and useless. They don't provide hours of conjecture and certainly don't offer good debate.

I'm not slating those after genuine advice; more so those with enough shots on here to know the score.

To all newbies who feel unwelcome, don't feel like that. I was new here recently and I found much of the advice here impartial and useful. Just don't go over the top - use common sense in tandem with constructive questions and you'll be alright.

Let's make this forum interesting again. It should be about all aspects of photography, not just for nervous and lazy folks to ask questions they are capable of answering themselves.

Karl

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: DerekF
Posted 2008-01-07 23:45:39 and read 5044 times.



Quoting Lennymuir (Reply 36):
Derek, can't you see what Vasco is saying?

Clearly not!

I thought the original thread was started about about ALL rejection, pre-screening posts. Never mind eh?

I admire the new photogs for even bothering to try to upload photos; I'm not sure I would if I was starting out.
I certainly wouldn't dare ask for help on the forums. It appears to be unwelcome.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: IL76
Posted 2008-01-07 23:59:49 and read 5038 times.

Starting out here is like starting at a new job. Slowly work your way in. Don't start out by immediately asking a thousand things, but read all documentation first, collect your questions and start asking bit by bit. Like working in an office, nobody likes it when a new colleague comes in and starts bothering you with questions left and right about things they could have found out for themselves by reading up on the documents supplied. In our case, it's best to browse the forums first and choose your questions well. Posting a picture and asking "does it have a chance?" or "Why was this rejected?" is too vague, and you'll probably get a vague answer.

A bit more care for the questions asked does miracles.

Ed

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: JakTrax
Posted 2008-01-08 00:11:31 and read 5031 times.

Derek, this is certainly not about new photographers being unwelcome - I am still pretty new myself but I always feel welcome here, and always get good advice should I need it. Of course new folks need guidance and that's what the majority of guys (and gals) here offer. But some newbies are asking questions that I myself never asked at their stage, and wouldn't have asked. Also, some people who aren't so new and know the deal are jumping on board now. This forum is about photography, not for everyone to whinge 'cause they had a rejection. Whenever I get a rejection I don't come here and moan - I read the screener's comments (which are as plain as black and white), take the criticism and act upon those comments to get my photo up to scratch.

During my time here I have only queried a rejection in this forum ONCE, and I got a simple and straight answer. Sure, newbies need as much help as they can get but they have to help themselves first, and that starts with reading the FAQs, searching the database for ideas about quality and possibly looking at other peoples' "Is this OK?" threads to check if their problem has already been discussed.

Once again, if any new folks have genuine questions they'd like answered, no problem. But moaning about every rejection here and asking questions they could answer themselves if they took the time isn't what the forum should be about.

What I'm saying here is that I'm a newbie, both here and to photoshop, but I've learned a lot from the folks here by using common sense and being patient. I have a reasonable acceptance ratio, obtained in under a year and without asking hundreds of pre-screening questions, so if I can do it (and I'm far from the world's finest photographer) then so can everyone else.

Karl

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-08 13:10:08 and read 4995 times.



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 37):
use common sense and do your own pre-screening

 praise   praise 

Quoting JakTrax (Reply 37):
Ask yourself the fundamental questions - is it level? Is it properly centred? Does it have a cast? Is the exposure OK? Are there dust-spots?

 bigthumbsup 

Quoting JakTrax (Reply 37):
Once you've answered these questions yourself you shouldn't need to ask everyone else, but I get the feeling people are rushing here to get their shots accepted and aren't asking themselves any of these questions

 checkmark 

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Silver1SWA
Posted 2008-01-08 13:34:13 and read 4978 times.

Well, as someone with 148 photos in the DB (realistically 85 or so since everything else was accepted in 1999), I guess that makes me guilty and I can't help but feel partially responsible for the existence of this thread. I had a very rough time last month that left me scratching my head. I figured a few extra sets of eyes might be able to help find the problem so I asked for help, even for some simple taxi shots in perfect sunlight. But I have already explained that, many times. I spend a lot of time checking and rechecking my shots before I upload, and once or twice a day while they sit in the queue. Every shot is different. I have a hard time because each shot needs a different amount of this and that. Is this enough of this, or too much of that? Sometimes I just like an outside opinion, especially when appealing since the site asks that before you appeal, ask for help/opinions in the photography forum.

And about rejections... What frustrates me about rejections is the wasted time. This was a bigger deal when the queue was 10+ days long. It's frustrating to have a photo sit there for x amount of days to get rejected for something (usually very small and overlooked) costing a new edit and another x amount of days for reupload. I'd rather spend that time on new photos. But, oh well. My bad for not taking the time to properly look at and check my photos asking myself if it meets the criteria...heh.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-08 13:43:32 and read 4976 times.



Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 43):
My bad for not taking the time to properly look at and check my photos asking myself if it meets the criteria...heh.

even after almost 8 years of uploading, I have these problems......

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named.
Username: Jorge1812
Posted 2008-01-08 13:56:57 and read 4960 times.

In my eyes it's no problem to ask some people here for pre-screening, but why upload pics and show them here to get some help while "real screeners" look at them at the same time b/c of the faster screening times.

What me annoys most is that most of the threads are of the same things.....why not post the same question in one or two threads instead of opening a new one on every pics or every version of a pre-screened pic????

Have I Any Chance On These Photos? (by Jumimaco Jan 8 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Are These Pictures Acceptable? (by Johnsiebert Jan 8 2008 in Aviation Photography)
UAL777 In LAS (Prescreen) (by GuamVICE Jan 5 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Just Submitted This - Any Chance? (by Jawed Jan 8 2008 in Aviation Photography)
How About This Gulfstream IV? (by Jawed Jan 7 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Pre-Screening UR-CBN - Nightshot Please (by Carlos Jan 6 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Some Advice Needed. (by Sreenath1239 Jan 6 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Picture Good Enough? (by Points Dec 24 2007 in Aviation Photography)
Is This Acceptable? (by Jawed Jan 7 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Is There Hope? (by Jawed Jan 7 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Airport Overview. A Motive/quality Prescreen. (by Damien846 Jan 6 2008 in Aviation Photography)
RusJet - Motive? (by Carlos Jan 7 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Prescreening With One Photo (by Carloscane Jan 6 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Does This Cockpit Shot Have A Chance? (by AADC10137 Jan 7 2008 in Aviation Photography)
EI-CDG - Nightshot (by Carlos Jan 7 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Pre-screening Please (by Mnazarinia Jan 5 2008 in Aviation Photography)
So Called "Prescreening". What Do You Think? (pic) (by Deradere Jan 6 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Critique My Photos Please (by Zmatt Jan 6 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Ju-52 B/w Prescreening Help? (by Whisperjet Jan 6 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Prescreen Help (by Jobu7282 Jan 5 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Prescreen Help - How To Display Photo? (by CuHead Jan 5 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Motive Allowed? (by Points Jan 5 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Pre-screening And Lens Question (by Cpd Jan 5 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Suggestions? (by LongbowPilot Jan 5 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Pre-Screening D-ATUB Please (by Carlos Jan 4 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Pre-screening These 2 Night Shots (by Dazed767 Jan 4 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Prescreen Of A Night Shot Please... (by TweetDriver Jan 4 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Please Help Pre-Screen (by Rioslu Jan 3 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Prescreening Help (by Whisperjet Jan 3 2008 in Aviation Photography)
A Little More Of Prescreening (by Ketko2 Jan 2 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Pre-screening Of Nightshot (by Ketko2 Dec 31 2007 in Aviation Photography)
Pre-screening Please. (by Jetfreak Jan 1 2008 in Aviation Photography)
Pre-Screen A Rookie (by Rioslu Dec 31 2007 in Aviation Photography)
Prescren For A First-timer, Please. (by HangarRat Dec 30 2007 in Aviation Photography)
Opinion On This Arty Farty Shot (by Deaphen Dec 31 2007 in Aviation Photography)
Could You Give Some Feedback To These Pics? (by Deradere Dec 31 2007 in Aviation Photography)
Another Prescreen, If You Will (by WestJetYQQ Dec 30 2007 in Aviation Photography)
VP-BTH -> Pre Screening Please (by Carlos Dec 30 2007 in Aviation Photography)
Pre Screen Please (by Jobu7282 Dec 29 2007 in Aviation Photography)
Pre-screening: Quality Ok? (by Avro85 Dec 27 2007 in Aviation Photography)
Will These Pass A.net Screening? Feedback Needed. (by Jawed Dec 27 2007 in Aviation Photography)
How's This Look? (by WestJetYQQ Dec 26 2007 in Aviation Photography)
Feedback On Two Photos (by Cpd Dec 21 2007 in Aviation Photography)

Soem nice pics - no question but these are almost all pre-screen threads of the first page in AvPhotogrpahy Forum and if you look on the overview you'll notice that the number of such threads increased a lot after the announcement that every photographer can post here. No offence against asking questions, but switching on brain or searching at least for the answer before aksing again would be no bad idea.

georg


ps: probably a few double postings because I accidentially closed my browser.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Dvincent
Posted 2008-01-08 14:24:30 and read 4954 times.

I have to agree this has gotten out of hand a bit lately. I rarely post in here about rejections or prescreens (I had two all of last month) and I have to admit while I like helping there's a few people going a bit overboard. Posting a new thread to get some kind of affirmation doesn't really do it for me. Have some confidence in your work! I'm more interested in helping people get to the results rather than "are these results OK?"

With the speed of the queue lately, I find it less annoying to get a rejection. I know that I've had only a few rejections lately and I pin this on a lot of hard earned experience being out in the field, getting new software, and meeting some pretty decent people. Over time things will get better.

I also find the utility of prescreening threads to be small anyway because optimally you'd want a screener to chime in, but their time is limited and my opinion or Vasco's opinion or Karl's opinion may be meaningless in the end. It's like playing roulette.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: JakTrax
Posted 2008-01-08 17:38:35 and read 4932 times.



Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 43):
Sometimes I just like an outside opinion, especially when appealing since the site asks that before you appeal, ask for help/opinions in the photography forum.

Indeed. If the only avenue left is to ask fellow photog's then that's absolutely fine, as I and many others have said. This is sensible use of the forum, not misuse like other threads.

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 43):
I'd rather spend that time on new photos.

Bingo! The bit that matters. I have only 35 shots in the database but an acceptance rate of over 60%, because I'd rather spend my time getting new pic's than working on older ones. My shots are, first and foremost, for my pleasure and therefore what matters to me is getting out there and taking the photo's. Part of the problem which this thread addresses is caused by an unhealthy obsession with editing perfection and a desire to get shots accepted. It's more like a game of who can do what when and beating someone else to the finish line than an enthusiasm for aircraft. People don't want to learn to be better photog's but just want to beat thy neighbour. What next for these folks? Stamps collecting? Join the supermarket trolley spotters' website? What's happened to the hobby and the fun of freezing your tits off for a few hours for the rewards you reap when you get home and look at your pictures?

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: RCoulter
Posted 2008-01-08 17:49:07 and read 4930 times.

To be honest the one thing I like about the "other site" is they have a dedicated post for pre-screening. If A.net had something like that it may help. I myself will admit that I may have posted a few too many "pre-screen" threads but I just want to have to the best chance of having a photo accepted and not waste the screener's time.  twocents 

At least I keep my photos to one thread every couple of weeks instead of someone who will remain namless posting 3 + pre-screen threads at once  duck   eyebrow 

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: JakTrax
Posted 2008-01-08 23:45:56 and read 4913 times.



Quoting RCoulter (Reply 48):
I just want to have to the best chance of having a photo accepted and not waste the screener's time.

Same with everyone but I think the point here is that the most capable person of creating that chance is yourself. It's your photo and it's your editing, and although others can give you tips they aren't actually there with you in front of YOUR computer.

P.S. I don't call one pre-screening thread every few weeks excessive. Again, that seems sensible use of this forum. There are many here who think we're all anti-newbie or anti-beginner (or both) but that's simply not the case - we would just rather see sensible and conservative use of the photography forum for pre-screening and/or rejection threads.

Karl

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named.
Username: USAir_757
Posted 2008-01-14 01:33:06 and read 4817 times.

Funny I came over this thread right as I was thinking the exact same thing Vasco.

It seems that since film has for the most part been retired around these parts that most of the discussions are about rejections now. Used to be lots of more interesting discussions about different films, scanners, scanning and processing techniques, etc...I miss those days. Digital has pretty much standardized everything - which is part of why I was very resistant to it at first, it's just not quite as fun anymore. I guess you wouldn't be surprised to know that I still use tapes and vinyl, for the same reason. Big grin

Also, slightly off-topic - I just noticed you can't go past the first page of threads anymore. When did that change? Man, going back page after page after page was the ultimate boredom killer for me back in the day. I'll miss that, too.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: StealthZ
Posted 2008-01-14 02:00:10 and read 4832 times.



Quoting USAir_757 (Reply 50):
Also, slightly off-topic - I just noticed you can't go past the first page of threads anymore. When did that change? Man, going back page after page after page was the ultimate boredom killer for me back in the day. I'll miss that, too.

Unique to the photo forum as well, it neither retains the number of threads that more popular threads such as Civ Av, and not the longevity of Mil/Av and Tech ops forums
I have raised this issue more than once, here and in site related, appears to be an example of the disdain the management(past & present) seem to have for the photographic community.

Cheers

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-16 13:42:24 and read 4716 times.

By the amount of threads about screening, rejections, rejection help, pre-screening
why is it not called "The Pre, after, rejection screening help forum......"

I guess the whole discussion is absolutely useless........

From now on this forum will be re-named...."The Pre-after-fist-second opinion, afraid of rejection, help forum"

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: TimdeGroot
Posted 2008-01-16 13:47:47 and read 4715 times.

Hi vasco

Have to agree some people are not really getting it. We'll try to lay down some more rules.


Tim

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Maiznblu_757
Posted 2008-01-16 15:39:23 and read 4680 times.



Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 53):
Have to agree some people are not really getting it. We'll try to lay down some more rules.


Tim

No more rules, Timmy, I think there are enough.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Lennymuir
Posted 2008-01-16 15:43:51 and read 4675 times.

Yup, no more rules please...

The problem is in the rejection e-mails.

They advise to come here for help.

Perhaps it's time to re-direct the 'helpline' to a dedicated area.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: TimdeGroot
Posted 2008-01-16 16:07:53 and read 4663 times.

I'm not saying people can't come here and ask for help about rejections. But have to agree with vasco that the pre-screening threads are getting out of hand. Some people just mention 'prescreening' in the topic, post an image and that's it. I think they should be a little more specific.

Still if people look for help and get it here that's a good thing and we shouldn't get in their way. Yes maybe prescreening and rejection threads could have their own section someday.

Tim

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: ThierryD
Posted 2008-01-17 02:50:43 and read 4623 times.



Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 53):
Have to agree some people are not really getting it. We'll try to lay down some more rules.

Chad and Gerry are right, we don't need more rules. We only need to apply the existing ones consistently and for the rest help uploading people on and off the forum with the means we've got at hand to get their pictures to the standard requested by A.net.
And there's no denying it, all those pre-, during- and post-screening threads result as a combination of stringent uploading rules, the acceptance ratio and its resulting upload limits.
So we'd need to get people to recognize what a 'good' shot is and what ain't.
The best (because the only one) item freely available for this is the Illustrated guide and we could see again that many people, including you, Tim (

Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 28):
A page with examples would be good,

), would like to have such a guide onboard, so my question I ask again is "Why is there no support from you screeners?!?".
With your help I could already have hugely increased the number of illustrations and explanations and with your background knowledge it could be THE reference for uploading photographers!

To me that belongs into the category "Don't complain about things you're not willing to change!".

An IGRR put up with the help of the screeners and an official link to it on the upload pages would help many, many photographers and hence greatly reduce the number of pre-, during- and post-screening threads.

Thierry

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named.
Username: TimdeGroot
Posted 2008-01-17 03:05:25 and read 4620 times.

Quoting ThierryD (Reply 57):
would like to have such a guide onboard, so my question I ask again is "Why is there no support from you screeners?!?".

Because we're working on our own guide. See, we do listen

So don't accuse me of being anti-change before you know the facts Thierry.

Also I was talking about forum rules, not uploading rules, maybe that was not clear.

edit:spelling

Tim

[Edited 2008-01-17 03:09:52]

[Edited 2008-01-17 03:10:48]

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: StealthZ
Posted 2008-01-17 03:37:45 and read 4603 times.



Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 58):
Because we're working on our own guide. See, we do listen

That's fine but Thierry has put a lot of work into his IGRR , work that I feel was done with the best interests of the site in mind.
What is with this not invented here .. "we're working on our own guide" crap?

Why not work with Thierry?

Cheers

Chris

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: TimdeGroot
Posted 2008-01-17 03:55:12 and read 4598 times.

For the same reason we do not let everyone screen pictures. Not meaning to deny thierry's effort but the screeners are most familiar with the rules and will thus be able to provide the best examples of them.

Tim

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Jorge1812
Posted 2008-01-17 04:15:07 and read 4588 times.



Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 60):
For the same reason we do not let everyone screen pictures.

With the many pre-screen threads everyone is able to "screen" pics at the moment. Long time ago I stopped reading and posting in CivAv forum because of the too many and too young wannabe Airline CEO's and Flightsimmers starting dumb threads and posting even dumber answers. At the moment I tend to stop reading the very interesting AvPhoto forum because of the many pre-screen threads. For us "established" photogs (I count me in with almost 1000 Anet pics) it's hard to get a good answer for a rejection question because most threads are overlooked. I don't want Anet to be a two class page (paying and non-paying members/photogs) but why not open a forum for the non forum-member photogs to discuss their pics/uploads/rejections and make the interesting threads like IGRR or Masterclass the "spirit" of this forum.

georg

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: JakTrax
Posted 2008-01-17 04:28:28 and read 4575 times.

It seems to me to be denying Thierry's work a little - I'm sure you could work with him here. If the whole 'illustrated guide to rejection reasons' is his idea then it's unfair to hijack it and claim the credit - unless of course the screeners have been resting on the idea a good deal before Thierry's work popped up.

I realise that screeners probably know best but wouldn't you also say that people with high acceptance ratios (i.e. equal to that of screeners), as I'm sure Thierry has, are equally capable as they obviously are good enough to consistently get pictures on here? It's gotta work two ways. I wouldn't have thought being a screener makes one any more qualified to pass judgement on whether a photo is good or or not. Remember, many in the community ARE screeners in a way, as they screen their own and limit the amount of work you guys have to do - and this by the request of the screening team.

I don't wanna stir the pot here (this doesn't particularly bother me) but this does seem a little contradictory.....

Karl

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: ThierryD
Posted 2008-01-17 04:56:53 and read 4553 times.



Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 58):
Because we're working on our own guide. See, we do listen

So don't accuse me of being anti-change before you know the facts Thierry.

Not meaning to be disrespectful Tim but HOW could I have known; I've asked for screener's support since the guide went online and apart from some help at the beginning from Mick and Denis I didn't get any feedback from your (the screener's) side and to be honest I find it a little unfair to let me spend hours of effort updating and improving the guide while you're doing your own one which will, as it appears, eventually replace mine and thus make the entire effort worthless.
Also, I don't understand why you want to make the effort twice; the IGRR surely isn't perfect but it's there and it is a good basis from which to work; I would gladly have re-modelled it with the screener's input as I never saw the guide as MY guide but rather as EVERYBODY'S guide; I merely was the one putting all the ideas into a useable form.

Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 60):
Not meaning to deny thierry's effort but the screeners are most familiar with the rules and will thus be able to provide the best examples of them.

Sorry Tim I'm really trying to see this statement objectively but how many times have I asked for screener's input for exactly the reason you state above!!? Yet, I received none. The guide has been online for more than a year now, the discussion to have one is even older and your guide will probably still need weeks before it goes online.
So again, wouldn't it have been cleverer to improve an existing and well working basis instead of trying to re-invent it all with all the effort and time costs this involves?

Quoting JakTrax (Reply 62):
If the whole 'illustrated guide to rejection reasons' is his idea then it's unfair to hijack it and claim the credit - unless of course the screeners have been resting on the idea a good deal before Thierry's work popped up.

Just for clarification: the 'Illustrated guide' is not originally my idea; A.net had one long before but it was hopelessly outdated and calls for a new one 1,5 years ago got louder and louder with new acceptance criteria resulting in ever more rejections. That's why I decided to start a new guide.

Thierry

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Sulman
Posted 2008-01-17 04:57:27 and read 4552 times.



Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 58):
Because we're working on our own guide. See, we do listen

I respect that English is not your first language, so I may have misunderstood, but to me that reads like a slap to the face.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: TimdeGroot
Posted 2008-01-17 04:59:41 and read 4551 times.



Quoting Sulman (Reply 64):
I respect that English is not your first language, so I may have misunderstood, but to me that reads like a slap to the face.

Maybe because you left the  Wink out

Thierry I asked for your input privately, I don't want your effort to be for nothing and I'm happy to accept your suggestions.

Tim

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named.
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-17 09:53:20 and read 4490 times.

Tim,

let me ask you this.....what is the big secret behind "the screeners IGRR"
Wouldn't it make sense to share it at a stage where some changes / feedback are / is still possible?

Sometimes it is good to have a non involved person give you feedback........

Vasco

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: Javibi
Posted 2008-01-19 01:23:25 and read 4429 times.



Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 56):
prescreening and rejection threads could have their own section

Even if I am guilty of asking advice about some of my rejections from time to time, I do vote for a separate forum, as the number of such threads in this one is definitely getting out of hand.

Regards,

j

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: TimdeGroot
Posted 2008-01-19 02:57:25 and read 4415 times.

No Big secret but it's still in an early phase so time for feedback will come later

Tim

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-19 03:14:44 and read 4410 times.



Quoting Javibi (Reply 67):
Even if I am guilty of asking advice about some of my rejections

Everyone is guilty including me, but from

Quoting Javibi (Reply 67):
time to time

are exactly the two or three important words here....!!!

V.

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: JakTrax
Posted 2008-01-19 05:25:29 and read 4371 times.



Quoting AKE0404AR (Reply 69):
Quoting Javibi (Reply 67):
Even if I am guilty of asking advice about some of my rejections

Everyone is guilty including me, but from

Quoting Javibi (Reply 67):
time to time

are exactly the two or three important words here....!!!

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 

Topic: RE: Aviation Photography Forum Should Be Re-named....
Username: AKE0404AR
Posted 2008-01-20 11:11:52 and read 4310 times.



Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 68):
arly phase so time for feedback will come later

any date yet?


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