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Political Correctness For Spotters/photogs  
User currently offlineFly-K From Germany, joined May 2000, 3153 posts, RR: 51
Posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 2318 times:
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A while ago, I got into an emotional discussion for displaying photos of a certain airline at Justplanes (I have photos of this airline here too).
The airline was Kibris Türk Hava Yollari (KTHY), which to some is offensive because it makes the claim that a Turkish Republic of North Cyprus exists, which isn't recognized by any country except Turkey, and of course fiercly opposed by "the real" Cyprus.
A Greek Cypriot (with whom I had good contact before and is a well-known spotter/photog also) wrote me and asked me how I could do this to him.
Maybe I hadn't reflected on his well enough, but in my opinion, we enthusiasts shouldn't care that much about politics, we love airplanes, of any airline, country and color, plain simple. It's a truly international, global, peaceful, anti-racist hobby!
Maybe some don't like Lufthansa then, because it once carried a swastika, an Israeli doesn't want to see photos of Palestinian Airlines, and maybe Libyan, Iraqi or JAT were supposed to be banned from here while the embargoes were still in place.
Your opinion please!

Konstantin



Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineCkw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 740 posts, RR: 16
Reply 1, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2194 times:

Well, yes, everyone has an axe to grind and I don't think we can cater for this - on the whole we are recording historical fact, the plane exists, we record it. I image it would be possible to compose a shot which set out to cause offense, but in that case the photog is using the aircraft as a prop in making a statement which is a different matter altogether.

The only pics I have trouble with are those depicting crashes involving fatalities - quite frankly, while such shots can be important for news or investigative purposes, in the context of A.net they seem to me to be a bit voyeuristic.

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineGlenn From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2170 times:

Oh dear, I come under that heading > Smile/happy/getting dizzy

I have learnt that you can't please everyone. I once got an email telling me off for refering to the Thai Rowboat as such. The words were " Don't you know the indignity you cause by calling the Thai peoples Royal Barge a rowboat."

Well in all honesty, no offence was meant then nor know but in my mind a barge is like a boat that carries waste to a dumping location. It's all in the language.

For example, us Aussies wear our thongs on our feet, Americans wear them in between their Bums  Smile/happy/getting dizzy English people call them flip flops ????? Which conjurs up an interesting concoction of an englishman visiting America and then coming to Australia after developing a passion for wearing thongs  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

You can't keep everybody happy, so don't try. Do what you do for you and others will follow. It's unfortunate in some cases but the majority of the time it works for the best.

And if it aint offensive to the majority, then it's acceptable. Something about majority rules. That's what gets most democracys elected.

Glenn



User currently offlineChris28_17 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1439 posts, RR: 10
Reply 3, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2151 times:

I wouldnt sweat it; you just cant take things personally in life (usually)

Since when do we cater to stupidity?


CHRIS


User currently offlineJoe pries From United States of America, joined May 2000, 1957 posts, RR: 53
Reply 4, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2143 times:

K,
you can please some of the people some of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time.


User currently offlineFly-K From Germany, joined May 2000, 3153 posts, RR: 51
Reply 5, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2128 times:
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No you can't do it right for everyone, but if possible, I'd try to avoid upsetting others if they have a valid point. You live you learn...

Another example that comes to my mind:
Macedonian the subsidiary of Olympic versus the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia...

Konstantin



Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
User currently offlineIkarus From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 3524 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 2118 times:

So does that mean if Afghanistan had a national airline you would be offending all the suppressed women over there? Or if you take a picture of a Taiwanese 747 (eg EVA air) you are offending the People's Republic of China? Or if you take a picture of an Aeroflot plane, the Chechens feel insulted? A Turkish Airlines plane is symbol of suppression of the Turkish Kurds?

I don't know. There is only so much meaning in a livery. Agreed, maybe that KTHY airline is making a political statement, but taking pictures of their planes does not mean you agree with them or support them.

I once bought "Battlefield Earth" by L.R. Hubbard, the founder of Scientology. My parents were shocked, seeing how I supported his purse with my money - when all I had intended to buy was Sci-Fi entertainment, not his authoritarian philosophy. I still think I did nothing wrong.

There is a fine line between directly supporting an evil cause (eg if you published an advertisement brochure for the airline, or I had bought the book "What is Scientology" instead of a SciFi novel) and simply taking actions that are completely independent of that evil cause.

That is just my view anyway.

Regards

Ikarus


User currently offlineSouthflite From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2094 times:

I've had a few people submitting "corrections" objecting to Joe Pries's comment on this photo:

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Joe Pries


"Bring back our boys from china!!!"

The objections usually go along the lines of "let's not politicise Airliners.net" and such.
Well, it's too late for that - just check out the Non-aviation forum sometime  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

The only objection I personally have to this comment is that it's a comment that will date quickly.
In fact, it's already no longer relevant...

Photographers should bear this sort of thing in mind when writing comments - writing something like "to be retired next month" is going to have a relevancy lifespan of maybe three weeks, and after that it's going to be out of date ... permanently!

BTW, Joe, your aircraft is a VP-3 / the one stuck in China is a EP-3 ... same airframe, very different bird  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

We do have some EP-3 shots, though, courtesy of Frank J. Mirande and Bart Hoekstra, from the earlier days ....

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Frank J. Mirande



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Frank J. Mirande



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Bart Hoekstra



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Bart Hoekstra


... as well as another VP-3, courtesy of our Standardisation Editor, Peter Vercruijsse:

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Peter Vercruijsse



Andrew (Southflite)
Corrections Editor


User currently offlinePhilB From Ireland, joined May 1999, 2915 posts, RR: 13
Reply 8, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2080 times:

Photography (as long as it is not deliberately tampered with) has a habit of recording fact.

If there are people out there who can't deal with the fact that airlines reflect the political realities of geography, then that is their problem.

They ought to either grow up and accept reality or find another hobby.

There are too many people imposing their individual versions of political correctness on the Net. I find them as offensive as those who are truly offensive - as defined by the conventions of normal, civilised behaviour.


User currently offlineThomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3957 posts, RR: 22
Reply 9, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2075 times:

I uploaded a shot of a DL 757, that I took in PHX, with the downtown as a backdrop. Anyways, I added "Delta 757 in its horrible new Deltaflot livery" in the comments field. I receieved no less than 15 e-mails within a 2 day period objecting to my comments...of interest was the fact that all those making the complaints were DL employees. Suffice it to say, I caved and removed the comments. But I still stand by belief that this is one horribly unimaginative livery! Sorry to any DL fans and or employees that may read this, thats how I feel.

Thomas



"Show me the Braniffs"
User currently offlineDee-see-eit From Spain, joined Jan 2000, 435 posts, RR: 24
Reply 10, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2070 times:

Hi Fly-K,

I had so far no discussion/complain about any of my photos at a.net, and there are more than 1000 of them! I really think you should not worry that much about the objections from your greek friend! I've posted a KTHY A310 myself some time ago and did not get any comments on it:


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Marlo Plate



Our hobby has nothing to do at all with politics and so it should stay.

Keep'em coming!
DC8


User currently offlineChrisair From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 2116 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 2067 times:

Colin,

Regarding crashed pictures...Why should we limit ourselves to what we shoot? Crashed pictures have as much importance as a "normal" picture. I don't see anything wrong with shooting these, provided that the comments are respectful, and don't dwell on how many lives were lost etc. I would have a problem however trying to sell my crashed pix...For some reason it just doesn't seem right.

AN is almost like a CNN of sorts (without all the irresponsible journalism). How is posting a picture of a crashed plane, any different than CNN showing the plane crashing? I'll shut up about this now.

If someone doesn't like a comment, then they don't have to view it. Same with radio, TV etc...

Chris


User currently offlineAKE0404AR From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2535 posts, RR: 45
Reply 12, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 2063 times:

Most of us live is a free country and we all enjoy freedom of speech.
Why should we not be able to express our opinion either with words or pics!
The internet has become a big part of the media nowadays and there always will be someone offended, hurt with your comments even though it is not meant to be.
You have your opinion and I have mine and I should be able to raise my voice and speak up for what I believe in.



V.



User currently offlineCkw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 740 posts, RR: 16
Reply 13, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2036 times:

Chris,

I didn't go so far as to say don't post them - I said I, personally, was uncomfortable with those which seem to have no photographic or technical interest and are posted because of the crash not the aircraft. As you suggest, I just don't bother with them. I mentioned this only in the context of what I feel is a much more sensitive issue than what flag an aircraft is flying!

While on the topic of PC, has anyone had any complaints about nose-art depicted on aircraft?

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineFly-K From Germany, joined May 2000, 3153 posts, RR: 51
Reply 14, posted (13 years 5 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2038 times:
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Nose art, hehe, probably few complaints, because, if I remember correctly from the recent poll, some 90% of a.net visitors are male...

Adding to the KTHY topic, when they received their first 738, Boeing had a press release saying it was the airline of the "Turkish Republic of North Cyprus"... I'm sure they got SOME responses on that one. Again, I just showed the photo of the aircraft, not commenting on it in any way, and this I believe is the way to do it in a free world.

Konstantin



Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
User currently offlineTappan From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 1538 posts, RR: 41
Reply 15, posted (13 years 5 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 2023 times:

We can take the PC stuff even further...Joe's statement of "Bring our boys home" is incorrect since there were women also on the plane and detained in China.... Smile
Mark G


User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (13 years 5 months 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 2014 times:

Personally, I cannot stand Castro and his cronies. But would I be at the airport to photograph his arrival on a Cubana Il-62? You bet!

We're just taking pictures, guys. We are not making history, or promoting one philosophy over another. We just like planes and like to show other people what we've captured.

Charles


User currently offlineLewis From Greece, joined Jul 1999, 3636 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (13 years 5 months 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 2009 times:

As a Greek I don't like the situation in Cyprus. But I dont believe that you cant display a pic at A.net just because the specific nation hasn't been recognised. I think that although the nation isn't (of course!) recognised, it has nothing to do with taking pics of KTHY! I have some too and I might upload them!

User currently offlinePsa188 From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 518 posts, RR: 17
Reply 18, posted (13 years 5 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 2001 times:

Konstantin:

I feel about Iran the same way your Greek Cypriot feels about Turkey [I havn't forgiven them for that little incident with our embassy]. Anyway, that didn't stop me from photographing their 727 in SHJ last november.

BH


User currently offlineFly-K From Germany, joined May 2000, 3153 posts, RR: 51
Reply 19, posted (13 years 5 months 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1989 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

And I'm sure we can differentiate between a country and its people.
Even if some totalitarian system seem to have mass support, I wouldn't be prejudiced against each and every inhabitant.

Konstantin



Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
User currently offlineScotty From UK - Scotland, joined Dec 1999, 1875 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (13 years 5 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 1987 times:

Bugger

I'd better go and trash all my JAT, Aviogenex, CAAC, Aeroflot (USSR), Iraqi Airways (Il76 no less), and Iran Air pics

Like hell

Keep clicking folks


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