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How Do You Level A Photo Without References?  
User currently offlineQantas077 From Australia, joined Jan 2004, 5870 posts, RR: 39
Posted (9 years 7 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 4179 times:

ok
so i have been up to Alaska and some of the municipal airports, they don't have alot of buildings, poles etc which is making it extremely hard to judge if a photo is level or not, what's the process with this? i have no possible way of telling if any of my shots from Palmer are level. anyone have a method?

thanks


a true friend is someone who sees the pain in your eyes, while everyone else believes the smile on your face.
18 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineFly747 From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1497 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (9 years 7 months 1 day ago) and read 4163 times:

Can you show the photo?

Ivan


User currently offlineQantas077 From Australia, joined Jan 2004, 5870 posts, RR: 39
Reply 2, posted (9 years 7 months 1 day ago) and read 4148 times:

no, because i have a whole bunch of them, they have no visual landmarks or buildings to reference by, so what i want to know is there a method to go by.


a true friend is someone who sees the pain in your eyes, while everyone else believes the smile on your face.
User currently offlineQ330 From Australia, joined Dec 2003, 1460 posts, RR: 21
Reply 3, posted (9 years 7 months 1 day ago) and read 4135 times:

I think the only thing you can do is just look it over and see if it seems level. Even without vertical references, you should be able to intuitively tell if it's level or not. As long as it isn't blatantly unlevel you should be fine.

-Q



Long live the A330!
User currently offlineVzlet From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 839 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 7 months 1 day ago) and read 4136 times:

Quoting Qantas077 (Reply 2):
they have no visual landmarks or buildings to reference by

Sounds like they're level, then!  Wink



"That's so stupid! If they're so secret, why are they out where everyone can see them?" - my kid
User currently offlineFly747 From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1497 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (9 years 7 months 23 hours ago) and read 4131 times:

Vzlet:
"Sounds like they're level, then!"

That's what I would say too  Smile Unless you have a very bad camera angle. I mean if there's no reference for you, there's no reference for anybody. I suppose you can't use the horizon since there are mountains?

Ivan


User currently offlineCallMeCapt From Australia, joined Jan 2005, 496 posts, RR: 7
Reply 6, posted (9 years 7 months 22 hours ago) and read 4110 times:

I have a book that tells you how to level without any references. Email me and i will type out the procedure for you.
Very clever actually.



Without struggle, there is no progress. (Frederick Douglass)
User currently offlineINNflight From Switzerland, joined Apr 2004, 3767 posts, RR: 59
Reply 7, posted (9 years 7 months 21 hours ago) and read 4098 times:

Shoot it level right away.  Wink

Florian



Jet Visuals
User currently offlineCallMeCapt From Australia, joined Jan 2005, 496 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (9 years 7 months 20 hours ago) and read 4094 times:

Quoting INNflight (Reply 7):
Shoot it level right away

Funny you should say that. When I was in my late teens/early 20's, I couldn't figure out why it was so hard to shoot level. My mother was notorious for shooting non level photos. Now when I'm at the airport, I try my damndest to shoot level and when I come home and look at the photos on the PC, NOTHING is level. AND I'M ONLY 33!!!!!
The rate I'm going, I'll be shooting photos vertically by the time I'm 50!



Without struggle, there is no progress. (Frederick Douglass)
User currently offlineWietse From Netherlands, joined Oct 2001, 3809 posts, RR: 55
Reply 9, posted (9 years 7 months 15 hours ago) and read 4036 times:

Quoting CallMeCapt (Reply 8):
The rate I'm going, I'll be shooting photos vertically by the time I'm 50!

Ah well.. Just claim you really like portrait format shots.  Wink



Wietse de Graaf
User currently offlineFergulmcc From Ireland, joined Oct 2004, 1916 posts, RR: 52
Reply 10, posted (9 years 7 months 15 hours ago) and read 4020 times:

Quoting CallMeCapt (Reply 8):
The rate I'm going, I'll be shooting photos vertically by the time I'm 50!

  

Been there, and have the T-shirt to proove it. I know the feeling.

If there are no references then check what looks like a good angle. I got this rejection for bad angle
http://www.airliners.net/addphotos/rejections/big/d-aerf-1-fmc.jpg
Thinking how could they, when there was no reference, but there was, the clouds! And the angle the plane was coming into land was too steep too. So if it looks off just rotate it till you think its ok. This needed 5 deg CW rotation to be corrected.

Hope that helps

Fergul    

[Edited 2005-06-02 12:47:40]


Zambian Airways, Where the Eagles fly free!!
User currently offlineTommy Mogren From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 912 posts, RR: 21
Reply 11, posted (9 years 7 months 14 hours ago) and read 4010 times:

Quoting CallMeCapt (Reply 6):
I have a book that tells you how to level without any references. Email me and i will type out the procedure for you.
Very clever actually.

I would appreciate if you wrote it in the thread. We all could learn from it.

Tommy Mogren



Flightdeck Action - Cockpit Videos on Blu-ray and DVD - Flights In The Cockpit- You're Invited!
User currently offlineCallMeCapt From Australia, joined Jan 2005, 496 posts, RR: 7
Reply 12, posted (9 years 7 months 13 hours ago) and read 3991 times:

Ok, here goes.

Step 1:
Once your photo is open, go under the view menu and make sure Extras is turned on, and then under Show in the View menu (just below extras), choose Grid.

Step 2:
You should have a non printing grid of squares over the entire photo. Grab the bottom right corner of the image window and drag outward to reveal the grey canvas area around your photo.

Step 3:
Press Control-A or go under into the drop down menu to Select the entire photo and then bring up the Free Transform bounding box around the photo. (Keyboard shortcut. Control-T). Move your cursor outside the bounding box and click and drag upward or downward to rotate your image (using the grid as a straight edge to align your image). If one of the horizontal grid lines isn't close enough to a part of your image that's supposed to be straight, just move your cursor inside the bounding box, and then use the Up/Down Arrow keys on your keyboard to temporarily nudge your photo up/down until it reaches a grid line.

Tip: If you want more control of your rotation (and this is particularly helpful when your trying to align to a grid, rather than just "eyeing it"), try this: While you have Free Transform in place, go up to the Options Bar and click once inside the rotation field. Then use the up/down arrow on your keyboard to rotate your photo in 1/10" increments, giving you maximum control

Step 4:
Go back under the View menu, under Show, and choose Grid to remove the grid. After you remove the grid, you'll notice that there are white canvas areas visible in the corners of your image, so you'll have to crop the image to hide these from view.

Step 5:
Select the Crop tool and then drag out a border that will crop your image so that none of the white areas are visible.


This is taken pretty much word for word from my Photoshop book.
I have tried the technique and it works pretty damn good, however, for some reason, the shortcuts don't work for me. But all the functions are in the drop down menus.
Hope it helps. Any questions, please feel free to ask.



Without struggle, there is no progress. (Frederick Douglass)
User currently offlineQantas077 From Australia, joined Jan 2004, 5870 posts, RR: 39
Reply 13, posted (9 years 7 months 11 hours ago) and read 3970 times:

what tool do you use to do part 2 of the above, i am using photoshop CS


a true friend is someone who sees the pain in your eyes, while everyone else believes the smile on your face.
User currently offlineAriis From Poland, joined Sep 2004, 422 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (9 years 7 months 11 hours ago) and read 3955 times:

Quoting CallMeCapt (Reply 12):

I appreciate your explanation, but I think it missed the target a bit. I think most (including me) hoped to learn how to level a photo with neither horizontal nor vertical edges on it, like these:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Sam Chui
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Rhys Dudley - TeamJetspotter


But I agree with others that it does not necessarily make sense to search for a perfect level angle. Look at the right photo above, if you would rotate it say 30 degrees CCW it would make it with no problems. Beyond certain extent it is only a matter of your comfort and perceptional balance as a viewer.

FAO

[Edited 2005-06-02 16:14:36]


FAO - Flight Activities Officer
User currently offlineCallMeCapt From Australia, joined Jan 2005, 496 posts, RR: 7
Reply 15, posted (9 years 7 months 3 hours ago) and read 3916 times:

Quoting Qantas077 (Reply 13):
what tool do you use to do part 2 of the above, i am using photoshop CS

Make sure the photo is in windowed mode. To make sure it is in windowed mode and fits the screen, double click the hand tool. Then you can drag out the box that frames the photo revealing the grey are. I am also using CS.

Quoting Ariis (Reply 14):
I appreciate your explanation, but I think it missed the target a bit. I think most (including me) hoped to learn how to level a photo with neither horizontal nor vertical edges on it, like these:

Photos like those are the ultimate. You can play around with them with no level problem. Just have to go with what looks good. I love that Qantas photo!

[Edited 2005-06-03 00:01:19]


Without struggle, there is no progress. (Frederick Douglass)
User currently offlineJumboJim747 From Australia, joined Oct 2004, 2465 posts, RR: 44
Reply 16, posted (9 years 7 months ago) and read 3888 times:

That's a steep angle of attack on that QF747 never seen one climb that steep before.


On a wing and a prayer
User currently offlineQantas077 From Australia, joined Jan 2004, 5870 posts, RR: 39
Reply 17, posted (9 years 7 months ago) and read 3887 times:

Quoting JumboJim747 (Reply 16):
That's a steep angle of attack on that QF747 never seen one climb that steep before

i think you will find its the way the photo is framed, i have a few shots like that and the angle looks very steep, in fact it's not, just how the photo is framed.



a true friend is someone who sees the pain in your eyes, while everyone else believes the smile on your face.
User currently offlineJumboJim747 From Australia, joined Oct 2004, 2465 posts, RR: 44
Reply 18, posted (9 years 7 months ago) and read 3884 times:

Qantas077
Now that is confusing .With reference to the level issue.



On a wing and a prayer
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