BA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11150 posts, RR: 60 Posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4127 times:
I am willing to give up my photography hobby for the safety of everyone in this world.
I know many of you are frustrated and angry that future aviation photography will become extremely limited. However, I believe that it is for the best. I may no longer be able to photograph aircraft (unless I'm traveling), but the loss of this hobby is definately worth the safety of everyone.
Just my thoughts. Feel free to share yours.
May all the victims in this tragedy rest in peace.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
Jderden777 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1749 posts, RR: 31 Reply 1, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 3981 times:
i regretfully agree to that...if it means the complete safety of the passengers and others, then i'd give it up...but that doesn't mean i wouldn't have regrets about giving it up...gah i still can't believe this horrible tragedy...it seems unreal...still...i hope everyone is behind me in saying that we have GOT to put an end to terrorism in the world...life is precious and is something that should not be wasted...it should be valued. i broke down last night...i could not contain myself and all the grief i felt...i don't even know how to describe this...please forgive me for being off-topic here...but i think you'll understand...as for air travel and taking pics, i think access for the "spotters" either on the ramp, tower, or whatever, is going to be extremely limited if not impossible. i hope i can still go to LAS for this airshow in october, but God only knows what will be happening then...this is such a tragedy..my deepest, most heartfelt condolences go out to those who lost so much...i pray that this will be the last straw for those terrorists, and we'll see who has the last laugh...i hope punishment is carried out and that the power of all these allied nations is shown brutally so that no others may threaten the world with cowardly deeds such as this...tell me if i am getting out of line but this attack was uncalled for and deserves more than retaliation, but extreme suppression. who's with me???!
Jderden777 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1749 posts, RR: 31 Reply 2, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 3953 times:
Godspeed to those onboard UA 93/175 and AA 11/77...May God bless them and may they forever rest in peace...as for those who took over the planes and commandeered them into the buildings, killing thousands in the process...may they be doomed for eternity in hell...God bless those on United 93 who attempted the takeover from the hijackers, those heroes who sacrificed themselves for this country...this is horrible...i cannot believe this...absolutely disgusting...a dastardly deed to say the least....for all those involved in this attack...they will be punished...
jonathan derden, American
p.s. forgive me...i am very upset and very very angry right now...
Gocaps16 From Japan, joined Jan 2000, 4319 posts, RR: 22 Reply 5, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 3952 times:
Well said Jonathan.
Since sercurity will be extremely tight now here in the DC area (esp. IAD they let 3-6 terrorist thru the sercurity checkpoint) Photography will be VERY limited in the terminal and outside of the airport. Now, the new policy at DCA and possibly IAD is ticketed passengers only. Other outside spots will be off limits to the public.
At DCA, I dunno if Gravelly Point will be permenantly closed since somone can easiliy swim or hop a boat and jump onto the runway or they might permenantly shutdown DCA.
State police will be working as screeners while they'll fire the old screener that are all muslims and make $4/hr. I am not looking for it. And it could be possible that they can kick you out the airport if your taking pictures from the window and doing nothing and looking suspicious.
We will see....
Proud American Citizen/Airlines.
CYKA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 6, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3934 times:
One more thing, it is my belif that the extreme security changes outside spots will likely only take place in the US. I dont think Canadian spotters will see themselves being chased away from their favourite spotting locations simply because Canada has a low risk of terrorism of this kind, in my opinion anyway.
BO__einG From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 2765 posts, RR: 19 Reply 7, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3927 times:
I wont give up as well but I share my condolences.
I saw a video footage of a person who is FALLING from the tower,, That is Just plain Surreal! I coudnt belive my eyes when I saw this.. The person dissapeared off another buildings roof, That is so tragic to die like what happened in the last 48 hours
Spotting will be tougher.. I went to YYC to see some diverts and I almost got a big fine..
Expanding my global domination one spotter at a time..
5280AGL From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 414 posts, RR: 1 Reply 8, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 3921 times:
A fine for what!? Loitering? Increased security is fine, but lets not get carried away. Technically, spotting and photography is completely legal, even after these tragedies. Knee-jerk reactions like this is not what the world needs right now, it will only cause more problems later. Were you inside a restricted or blocked off area or something? Then, I can understand.
Ckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 660 posts, RR: 17 Reply 9, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 3895 times:
CYKA - every (Western) country is a "legitimate" terrorist target, any country not taking security precautions is an easy target. Europe has long been aware of this, and acts accordingly. The restriction are normally not too onerous, and we accept that at times of heightened alerts, additional measures will be required. We live with it ... and continue taking photos!
BA - To give up your hobby because of the action of a few terrorists is, frankly, to concede victory to them. They will have changed your way of life to the worse - do you really want to grant them that?
Yes, what has happened is horrific, and for many of you it is pretty close to home. But, as they say "S*** happens" in the form of man-made or natural disasters all the time. It is important to retain a sense of perspective, and if anything, make a greater effort to exercise those freedoms which we have now paid a very high price for - and I mean "we" in an international sense - there were many, many nationalities in those towers ... this is not just an American loss.
Trintocan From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2000, 3211 posts, RR: 4 Reply 10, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 3887 times:
It will be a very hard time for all of us aviation enthusiasts as this disaster is principally an aviation event of cataclysmic proportions. Let our thoughts go out to all those who lost loved ones in this mayhem and pray for peace in the world. As for our hobby, please let us cooperate with the authorities in our respective countries. We may not like what they are insisting upon but, at this terrible time, the security officers themselves may not like doing what they are compelled to do.
AndyEastMids From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 998 posts, RR: 2 Reply 11, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 3887 times:
I'm sure we're all saddened by what has happened, but I think that the idea that aircraft photography, or "spotting", will from hereon become very difficult or impossible is simply bizarre. As has already been pointed out, in Europe we've had things like a mortar bombing of Heathrow, and whilst such acts led to short term restrictions, in the longer term appropriate measures were put in place that allowed enthusiasts to continue to function without being regarded as undue security risks. Putting it bluntly, the people who are currently expressing concerns about aircraft photography in the future are primarily from the US, and have not been subjected to incidents before.
Maybe only ticketed travellers will be allowed in concorses in the US - well, hey, that's been the case in Europe for years, and we still manage to take photos here. Unless there is a complete and utter over-reaction (which in all likelihood would make air travel, let alone photography, all but impossible) things will calm down and with [maybe] a few more restrictions hobbies like aircraft photography will continue.
Da fwog From United Kingdom, joined Aug 1999, 867 posts, RR: 9 Reply 12, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 3878 times:
I agree with Andy & Colin. After the mortar attack on LHR, I thought we'd never be able to get to the perimeter to take pics again, but this proved not to be the case. However, we have to expect increased security precaustions everywhere when there is any perceived chance of an increased threat.
At the moment, everyone's nerves are on edge, the authorities are going to be paranoid about another attack - and what choice do they have? They don't know what else could happen - Tuesday's events show that they can't predict or rely on anything. It has to be a case of "better safe than sorry", and they have to be seen to be taking all possible precautions to prevent further atrocities.
I will not give up my hobby - while we all may need to curtail our photography, and co-operate with whatever increased security measures are in place, I don't think ANY of us should give up. That is giving in to terrorism. And that's unacceptable to me. For anyone in the UK, I'll say this - my wife and I were in Warrington at the time of the IRA bombing; and the attitude of everyone there was the same - we will NOT allow the terrorists to win.
Ckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 660 posts, RR: 17 Reply 14, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 3877 times:
Taking pics of aircraft is not a threat as such, but we need to have some consideration for those who have to enforce security. If I can stand on the open air terrace at LHR with a camera, I can just as easily do so with a gun or worse. Security are gonna be naturally nervous of anyone pointing ANYTHING at an aircraft just now - photo restrictions may be implemented simply to make the task of securing the airport easier.
Thom@s From Norway, joined Oct 2000, 11951 posts, RR: 50 Reply 15, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 3868 times:
Someone with a gun on the top of a building doesn't sound like something tat will destroy an aircraft, in my mind, but wouldn't these platforms be helpfull for a swat team to stand on during a hijacking of a grounded plane?
Anyway, thanks for informing me.
"If guns don't kill people, people kill people - does that mean toasters don't toast toast, toast toast toast?"
BA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11150 posts, RR: 60 Reply 17, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3826 times:
Airports in the Middle East (perticularily Saudi Arabia) have the TOUGHEST security in the world. Also, airports in the Middle East do NOT allow photography of aircraft on airport grounds. The Middle East is very strict in terms of security, and I see the US adopting some of the rules in the Middle East.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
Jderden777 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1749 posts, RR: 31 Reply 19, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3813 times:
ok, i think i have calmed down a bit since last night....i had no idea what i was typing, all it was was my thoughts at the moment...i don't think that just because of this that we all have to give up our hobby...i feel that life will go on, and that we will be able to take pictures in the future, just maybe not as freely as we once were...i would say ramp tours might be inop for a while...i still can't believe this...i pray we do the right thing...those who attacked in this cowardly, bastardly act better be prepared for our retalitation when we get it together...but anywho i think that for a while it will be harder, but things will calm down eventually, but i feel no remorse for those sorry asses who killed all these innocent people...just a grim sadness that somebody would do such a thing...i know terrorism is worldwide, and it's happened here before, but this is simply unspeakable and this is my first real encounter with terrorism when i actually know what's going on...Somebody is going down hard as a result of this...and I can tell you right now it will not be the United States of America or the rest of the free democratic world...in the words of comedian Roy D. Mercer, "Somebody better get themselves ready for a good ol' country ASS-WHOOPIN'!!!!!" so Bin Laden, or whoever was behind this attack...you may rest well tonight...i hope you suffer for this...your day of judgement will come, and to heaven you will not, you bastards...
i think my anger is quite apparent...excuse me if i'm pointing fingers but it's not like bin Laden has not been involved with terrorism...maybe i haven't calmed down...
Da fwog From United Kingdom, joined Aug 1999, 867 posts, RR: 9 Reply 20, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3817 times:
BA, I disagree with you re: the US response. While you might get chased off of unofficial areas on the airport grounds (as has happened at places like JFK for years already), I don't see security staff coming up to you if you (as a ticketed passenger) are standing by the gate taking pics through the windows. It all comes down to civil liberty. Of course, I could be wrong.
Dan, I agree with you. All I would say in caution is that we have to be careful not to antagonize security staff. As has already been said, although spotters & photographers probably make the area around the airport a SAFER place (it's more difficult for people up to no good to do so if there are other people already around), unfortunately, there's no way for the security staff to know for CERTAIN you are a spotter just because you have a camera. And the "spotter" standing next to you with the camera bag could suddenly pull out a gun as a plane goes over Myrtle Ave. So we need to be sensible about things, and be prepared to comply with the requests/instructions of the police or airport security.
Cfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 22, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 3811 times:
No, no, no!
You should not sacrifice your hobby or anything else because of these bastards - if you do, it means they have won another small victory. Instead, the next time you are at the airport, and you see a security team drive by, wave them down. Tell them who you are and what you do. Tell them you come frequently, and are familiar with the various buildings and traffic around the area (comes from standing around there for hours). Tell them you have a cell phone, and would like to have the number of the emergency call center, in case you see anything. Tell them that you volunteer to be a sentry whenever you are there. I'm pretty sure you'll get a good response.