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Request For Help From A Newbie  
User currently offlineEMA747 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 1171 posts, RR: 1
Posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 4211 times:

Hi,
I got a Canon 400D a few weeks back and have been up to EMA my local airport to take a few shots but because of gloomy weather and me being new to this all of the photos I got were aweful!

Could anyone who has got a shot into the database post a link to the shot and also state their setting for the shot so I can see if I can see where I am going wrong? Im talking about things like ISO setting, shutter speed and apature. I did a photography A-level 4 years ago (and got an A Big grin ) so I have some knowledge of these things but I just want to know how they relate to aviation photography which is very different from any photography I have done before.

Thanks for any advice.

Andy S


Failing doesn’t make you a failure. Giving up and refusing to try again does!
9 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineDC10Tim From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 1406 posts, RR: 14
Reply 1, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4206 times:

Andy, there is no substitute for good light. I really don't envy you being at EMA in the gloom, crikey I've done it enough myself, but I wont venture out now unless the light is good. I like to be able to keep the ISO on 100 and alter aperture and shutter speed accordingly. With my 300D the quality is acceptable at ISO 200 but not outstanding and 400 is a definite "no".

Just have to wait for a crisp cloudless day. They can't be that far away now  Smile

Tim.



Obviously missing something....
User currently offlineNorfolkjohn From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 251 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4190 times:

Andy,

I have to agree with Tim's comments. I only ever shoot at ISO 100 with my 20D or 10D. While it is true there is no substitute for good lighting, and that generally means sunshine, it also has to be accepted that at times you have to deal with the conditions you are presented with. If there is an interesting subject to be had I'll take a crack at it in anything other than pitch darkness -but I won't expect to get the results accepted on A.Net. This said it can be done as the following examples will show. (N.B. PLEASE do not click on these shots unless you are genuinely interested - this is NOT a hit generation exercise)


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © John Allan
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © John Allan



The F-50 shot was taken around 3pm in April in the middle of a violent hail storm. The basic settings were ISO 100 1/200 F3.5. The P51 was taken in the summer but the sky was totally grey and it was heavy rain. The settings were ISO 100 1/200 F5.0.

Having demonstrated that shots taken in pretty poor weather CAN be acceptable I must add several notes of caution. First of all in poor light the performance of your lens is much more critical IMO. Both the above shots were taken with a Canon 70-200 F2.8 L IS which is about as good as it gets in terms of mid size tele-zooms. The next thing I would say is that bad weather shots usually need very careful editing particularly with respect to adjustment of levels (and / or curves). Finally, and perhaps most importantly, in terms of A.Net acceptance the subject matter needs to be something out of the ordinary. Either a fairly rare subject or something that adds drama to the shot such as clouds of spray or vapour over the wings.

In summary I would say it WAS worth going out and practicing shooting in poor weather BUT in doing so it has to be realised that very few shots in these conditions will be A.Net material. However by practicing in poor weather you will be better placed to get shots of anything unusual that turns up accepted - and you just might be the only person around at the time !

Good luck with your photography in the future. (If you want to discuss technique in further detail feel free to contact me via any of my pictures in the DB)

John



One thorn of experience is worth a whole wilderness of warning.
User currently offlineEMA747 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 1171 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4179 times:

Tim and John thanks for the replies.
I think I now know why my shots looked very grany and generally bad. I was at ISO 800 and still not getting that high shutter speeds!  Yeah sure
Well I still think it was worth going out because I wont make the mistake again and I did have a fun afternoon.

Quoting DC10Tim (Reply 1):
Just have to wait for a crisp cloudless day. They can't be that far away now

Cant wait. Will be nice when it gets round to summer and I can go up in the evenig and take shots of some of the freight traffic and feel the sun onmy back not a biting wind!

Andy S



Failing doesn’t make you a failure. Giving up and refusing to try again does!
User currently offlineJakTrax From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 4936 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 4142 times:

Quoting EMA747 (Reply 3):
Cant wait.

Might have to mate - forecast doesn't look too good for the next week but things can change.

I live in Stoke and am right in the middle of EMA, BHX and MAN; not one being more than an hour's drive. I get down to EMA a lot more these days because the light (should there be any) is good for much of the day, and you never know what's gonna turn up. I've been there so often on my own and caught something special landing.

The 400D is a great camera, I bought one to go with my 350D a few weeks ago. I never shoot in bad weather (unless the subject is extremely rare) but I can give you tips for good weather shooting.

Best settings to use on bright, sunny days are (in my opinion):

Av (aperture priority) - set usually to F8/F9
ISO100 (200 if using long focal lengths)
1/3 of a stop down exposure compensation
AI Servo focus mode
Evaluative metering (unless the background is dark, in which case I use centre-weighted)
Parameter 1 colour/contrast/sharpness setting

I've included a pic I took last week (at EMA) using the above settings, just to illustrate the results.

Big version: Width: 3456 Height: 2304 File size: 1962kb


Hope this helps.

Karl


User currently offlineJeffM From United States of America, joined May 2005, 3266 posts, RR: 51
Reply 5, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 4125 times:

Quoting JakTrax (Reply 4):
I've included a pic I took last week (at EMA) using the above settings, just to illustrate the results.

I guess you didn't actually understand Andy's request?

Quoting EMA747 (Thread starter):
Could anyone who has got a shot into the database post a link to the shot and also state their setting for the shot so I can see if I can see where I am going wrong?

That little part about actually having a photo IN the database???  rotfl 


Andy,
-set the iso to 100,
-use a mid-range aperture in Aperture priority mode, let the camera choose your shutter speed.
-use center-weighted or spot metering to prevent the camera being fooled by either a too bright or too dark background. If you must use the camera's meter, at least have it meter the subject (aircraft).
-don't set exposure compensation until you know whether or not the conditions warrant it.
-AI Servo and keep your finger halfway down on your focus button.

Here are my photos.. http://www1.airliners.net/search/pho...=Jeff%20Miller&distinct_entry=true

My first 500 or 600 I used similar settings, my last 100-200 I've been using manual exposures.


User currently offlineLinco22 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 1380 posts, RR: 16
Reply 6, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 4124 times:

Quoting JeffM (Reply 5):
Here are my photos..

Jeff! You should be ashamed of yourself, a self plug....

Andy, all sound advice my friend. Read your manual cover to cover!

Regards
Colin


User currently offlineANITIX87 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 3308 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 4115 times:
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Quoting EMA747 (Reply 3):
Well I still think it was worth going out because I wont make the mistake again and I did have a fun afternoon.

In the end, that's what matters. I used to take shots with the intention of putting them on A.Net and I just kept dissapointing myself because none were good enough, but I was so bent on getting some in that I kept uploading. I had a zero acceptance until my 30th upload. Then I got three in thanks to someone else's editing, and after that got another 6 rejected. Once I got my new camera I want shutter-crazy. I've taken probably 300 aviation pictures with it, and only four have been good enough to upload, and only three got accepted. So don't get too down on yourself, make sure you're shooting for fun. If you had a good afternoon, then mission is half accomplished. Your other goal should be mastering photography, not uploading here. It seems to me you are determined to learn your camera. Good on you.

As for settings. I've thumbed my three pics with my new camera and put the settings below. Apparently my captions are wrong, with the settings, I should change them.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Antonis Panayotatos


Shutter 1/320
Aperture f6.3
Focal 150mm
ISO 100


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Antonis Panayotatos


Shutter 1/160
Aperture f13.0
Focal 150mm
ISO 100


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Antonis Panayotatos


Shutter 1/320
Aperture f6.3
Focal 40mm
ISO 100

Hope that helps!

TIS



www.stellaryear.com: Canon EOS 50D, Canon EOS 5DMkII, Sigma 50mm 1.4, Canon 24-70 2.8L II, Canon 100mm 2.8L, Canon 100-4
User currently offlineEMA747 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 1171 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4102 times:

Thanks again for all the advise guys, its exactly what I wanted to hear. I will try and get up to EMA this week if the weather is OK and I'm not at uni, or I might skip a lecture or two  Wink and try again with the advice you have given me.

Karl, where is that pic taken from and what size lense are you using? I have a 70-300mm. Do you know if it is possible to walk from the main terminal to the spot on the access road off the A453 on the right hand side of rwy 27? I know its a long way but is it possbile? I have no car at the moment.  Sad

Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 7):
Your other goal should be mastering photography, not uploading here. It seems to me you are determined to learn your camera. Good on you.

Thats exactly what I'm trying to do. If I have a fun time and get a couple of pics that I am happy with then I will be satisfied not matter if they are A.net material. I will work to getting a pic in the database but I realise that it will not come without some hard work and learning.

Many thanks

Andy S



Failing doesn’t make you a failure. Giving up and refusing to try again does!
User currently offlineJakTrax From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 4936 posts, RR: 7
Reply 9, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 4075 times:

The pic was taken from the mound to the east of the old viewing park - it can be accessed from the lay-by/truck stop on the main approach road from the M1/A50. If on foot, it's probably a 20 minute walk from the terminal. Head east to the 27 approach, walk towards the approach lights (on the above mentioned main road) and hop over the fence into the field just after the truck stop (there is a gap). Keep walking west through the field until you come to the mound. Step-ladders are useful but not essential. I have a 70-200mm lens, and this shot was taken at about 140mm, so your kit will be fine.

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