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Three Questions  
User currently offlineStulli From Germany, joined Mar 2009, 48 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 3082 times:

Hi

At first, I would like to ask, how many pics have to be accepted to find my name in the 'welcome to the community' column on the 'photo search' page. Oviously, one is not enough?

My second question is adressed specially to the screeners: In case of a rejection, would you please be so kind to name ALL reasons for rejection, if there is more than one? I recently got one rejected for the second time, now with a different reason, which had also been the case, when I first uploaded it. This makes me kind of angry, it remembers me of the usual trouble with the German civil service...

Third question is also concerning the rejection: Is there a possibility to re-upload a once rejected pic after I have worked on it, just to save all the work with filling out the data sheet? If so, this would make things much easier.

Regards

Ulrich

10 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineClickhappy From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 9668 posts, RR: 68
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 3050 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER



Quoting Stulli (Thread starter):
In case of a rejection, would you please be so kind to name ALL reasons for rejection, if there is more than one? I recently got one rejected for the second time, now with a different reason, which had also been the case, when I first uploaded it.

It practical purposes this is near-impossible. If you are reworking a rejection, that means you are starting over. If you forget to clone a dust spot, leave a border, the picture is unlevel, etc etc, we of course would have to reject for those reasons.

Quoting Stulli (Thread starter):
Third question is also concerning the rejection: Is there a possibility to re-upload a once rejected pic after I have worked on it, just to save all the work with filling out the data sheet? If so, this would make things much easier.

There is not, sorry.


User currently offlineJalap From Belgium, joined Oct 2007, 355 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 3013 times:



Quoting Stulli (Thread starter):
My second question is adressed specially to the screeners: In case of a rejection, would you please be so kind to name ALL reasons for rejection, if there is more than one? I recently got one rejected for the second time, now with a different reason, which had also been the case, when I first uploaded it. This makes me kind of angry, it remembers me of the usual trouble with the German civil service...

Hello Ulrich,

I have experienced something similar recently. Had a rejection for dust spots, it were just one or two and only a few pixels in size so I could clone them out without redoing the entire processing. When I uploaded that very same but now clean shot it got rejected for level. I was a bit annoyed that level was not mentionned in the 1st rejection. But then again, I think this was the first time this happened to me so I guess that's a very rare event.

A point of advice to avoid this from happening often could be to always describe to the screeners in the comment line why a previous version was rejected and explain briefly what you did to correct those issues. It's my impression that this is usefull and can avoid extra rejections.

Another point of advice: save your picture several times during the editing process. I always save a first time after editing out the dust spots. However hard I try to clean the slide before scanning, I'm always ending up with on average 20 or so dust spots. Sometimes many more! Cloning those out I find a tedious job and I would hate to have to do that again after a level rejection! So I keep a cleaned hi-res version, a version right after cropping/resizing and an uploadable version after the final edits (like reducing noise). This way, after a rejection, I can minimise the work that needs to be redone.

I hope this helps a bit  Smile

cheers


User currently offlineF4wso From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 974 posts, RR: 11
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2951 times:

I believe it is 50 images in the database to get listed on the photographers list.

There is no guarantee that the same screeners will look at your corrected image so there is the possibility that something "new" will get noticed. Likewise, if there are obvious flaws, the screener may opt to reject for that reason without looking further. I have submitted an image seven times, with improvements each submission, before getting it accepted. There are others that after I have done all I could, just ends up in my own collection.

I would not see much effort in streamlining the reupload process as that would be counter productive to putting the best effort forward on the first submission.

Good luck and don't get discouraged,

Gary
Cottage Grove, MN, USA



Seeking an honest week's pay for an honest day's work
User currently offlineStulli From Germany, joined Mar 2009, 48 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2765 times:



Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 1):
It practical purposes this is near-impossible. If you are reworking a rejection, that means you are starting over. If you forget to clone a dust spot, leave a border, the picture is unlevel, etc etc, we of course would have to reject for those reasons.

Yes, that might be true, but you seem to underestimate the psychological aspects: In fact, it is really frustrating to find no difference in the comments, concerning the overall quality and interest of the respective picture. No matter if the pic is complete bullshit order there is just a small detail like a single dust spot the result, and the resulting work is the same. I'm sure, a simple comment on if a picture is wanted but not yet perfect would help a lot concerning the motivation of those who - don' t forget about this fact - send their pics for free.

The way it is held by now, many photographers feel like beggars: please, please would you take my picture... And I'm concerned that the amount of frustration one can accept without losing all of his motivation is related to the overall quality of his pictures!

I spoke to many, many really good photographers who got so much frustrated by getting their pictures rejected, that they refuse to try editing any further pic on A.net.

Sorry, but this is just my personal opinion

regards

Ulrich


User currently offlineAcontador From Chile, joined Jul 2005, 1421 posts, RR: 30
Reply 5, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 2699 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

Hi Ulrich,

Quoting Stulli (Reply 4):
The way it is held by now, many photographers feel like beggars: please, please would you take my picture... And I'm concerned that the amount of frustration one can accept without losing all of his motivation is related to the overall quality of his pictures!
I spoke to many, many really good photographers who got so much frustrated by getting their pictures rejected, that they refuse to try editing any further pic on A.net.

You know, we screeners don't edit the pictures, thus we are not to be blamed for any issues the pictures might have - that is your responsibility as the uploader.
I can understand that sharpening or contrast problems might be a real cause for frustration as you may actually see things differently than we do due to different monitors/calibration/ambient light/etc...here, only the experience from many uploads/acceptances/rejections will show you the path to go.
But how about OUR frustration as screeners, when we see one photographer uploading the same rejected picture for the third time without any changes; see multiple cell-phone shots; have a 1000+ pictures-in-database photographer uploading a business jet as an airliner and not including the construction number although it is already available in the database?
Having said that, I agree that the screening process is not exactly perfect or even near by, and we are definitely trying to improve things.
Instead of looking at it as the we (photographers) and they (screeners), why not change the perspective and see us all belonging to the same community as a team? We screeners are all uploaders, and we want your pictures in the database the same way you want them there, too, so we share at least something  Wink !

Let's go back to have fun shooting, uploading and see our pictures online.

Cheers, Andres



Just sit back, relax and have a glass of Merlot...enjoy your life!
User currently offlineUnattendedBag From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2342 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 2672 times:



Quoting Stulli (Reply 4):
The way it is held by now, many photographers feel like beggars: please, please would you take my picture...

that changes once you figure out the system and get a few pictures accepted.



Slower traffic, keep right
User currently offlineUnattendedBag From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2342 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 2669 times:



Quoting Stulli (Reply 4):
but you seem to underestimate the psychological aspects:

if you are having a hard time dealing with your rejections, I might suggest posting a few examples in this forum. the feedback is critical yet fair and could help lead you to your second acceptance.



Slower traffic, keep right
User currently offlineClickhappy From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 9668 posts, RR: 68
Reply 8, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 2661 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER



Quoting Stulli (Reply 4):
I spoke to many, many really good photographers who got so much frustrated by getting their pictures rejected, that they refuse to try editing any further pic on A.net.

Lots of photographers I know would prefer to spend their time taking pictures, not learning the latest noise reduction technique or how to selective sharpen.

There is nothing wrong with that. But to blame the screeners, or even the standards of this website, does not make any sense.

A website cannot be all things to all people. If we were to lower our standards we would loose some photographers. Personally I feel there is more enjoyment in viewing high quality photos.

Uploading here is like winning a beauty pageant. Would you rather be Miss Universe or Miss Fresno Strip Mall?

Either way it's your choice.


User currently offlineJalap From Belgium, joined Oct 2007, 355 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 2647 times:



Quoting UnattendedBag (Reply 6):

that changes once you figure out the system and get a few pictures accepted.

I mostly agree. Yet not fully.

This discussion started with getting slide scans accepted and that changes things. A slidescan can as good as never have the quality of a digital shot. There is Mick Bajcar's Vulcan that proves the opposite but this is very very rare.

Therefore, slide scanners always have to hope for leeway granted by the screeners which, in a way, makes us beggars since we have no "laws" to protect us. Our shots never are sharp the way a digital shot can be, they are never free of grain, centering is often an issue since we shoot our slides full frame, leaving little to no room for cropping. Colour/contrast often is hard work and much doubt.

Nevertheless, I have a fairly clear idea - from experience - what is acceptable and what isn't. About 50% of my slidescans (all from the 90's - yes - I'm taking the easy way) have the potential to be accepted here. In the other 50% about 40% is not up to "standards" because of centering. This centering has caused me some serious frustration and even paranoia, therefore I can fully understand Ulrich's sentiments. I have - in a dark moment - been thinking about moving my shots elsewhere but realised that the grass won't be greener on the other side and after all, one wants his shots to be seen and then this is the place to be!

So, I'm keeping my nice but too badly centered shots in my to-do folder, someday I'll upload them to myaviation and that's it. Even if that means I can't upload any shot of a living Concorde here (without 'begging')  Sad

Also a note on this:

Quoting Stulli (Reply 4):
I'm sure, a simple comment on if a picture is wanted but not yet perfect would help a lot concerning the motivation

In the past I often got such a message but not any recently. These comments were very very much appreciated by me !

To conclude: I must add that I got great advice from Mick Bajcar when I started uploading. Without him, I don't think I would have made it this far.


User currently offlineStulli From Germany, joined Mar 2009, 48 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2562 times:



Quoting Jalap (Reply 9):
Our shots never are sharp the way a digital shot can be

I agree with most of what you said in the above, Jalap (if this is your name...), but not with that: Of course, a perfect color slide is indeed much better by appeal than any digital shot - but of course only as a slide itself, projected to the wall in all it's brillance and size, and no monitor or beamer can reach this impression in any way. Well, that's my opinion, and so I've come to the conclusion to take things as they are: My slide collection of unique shots on the one, and viewing digital shots on my computer on the other hand. That's not at least because I found it frustrating just for myself, to see, what the scanner made out of my slides.
Anyway, the one and only pic, I have in the base is a scanned slide...

And I have to say that I never wanted to blame anybody! My intention was just to give you an idea of what I've heard from many people who, sadly will never try again to upload their pictures anymore - and that's indeed sad for us altogethter, including even those frustrated.

And by the way: I just tried to upload some pics for pre screening, but found out, this is ony possible by having a first class membership... or am I wrong?


regards


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