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"Trouble" At ATL...  
User currently offlineJderden777 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1757 posts, RR: 28
Posted (12 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 2093 times:

hey everybody...
i took a day trip down to ATL yesterday, where i spent the day flying in a Delta 737-200 sim and taking pics from the ASA end of concourse C...
after a few hours of taking pics there, the ASA gate agents apparently got worried about me, my friend, and Matthew Lee (he was there too, and he has some NICE photos on here!)

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Matthew Lee



anyway, after a while an ASA gate agent came over to us, while we were taking pictures, and said:
"i'm sorry but you cannot take any more pictures here."
to which we all replied, "why's that?"
agent: "it's a new FAA regulation, it is illegal for any pictures to be taken inside the airport"
us: "yeah, right.."
then matthew lee stood up for us all and said "if you can bring me any paperwork showing me that it's illegal then i'll quit"

hooray for matthew!!!! so the gate agent stomped off and didn't come back with any more excuses to get us to stop taking pictures...

but later a national guard dude came over to us, and it just so happens i was in the midst of taking a picture, and he bumped into me (probably no accident) and said "What the hell are you guys doing?...HUH?"
i just kinda stood there for a sec, not sure of what to say having a national guard dude kinda invading my personal space...then matthew turned and said to him
"we're just amateur aviation photographers taking pictures of AIRPLANES...that's what we do as our hobby"
the nat'l guard dude said "oh, so no pictures of people?"
"uhhh...no..airplanes..."
and then he walked off, but stayed around the area keeping an eye on us...

so just a heads-up to all you photogs heading down to ATL anytime soon...they're pretty anal about the picture taking, but just stand up for yourself, and as long as you are just taking pictures there is nothing they can do to stop you from taking pictures...just some advice: always stand up for yourself and your hobby...there is nothing illegal about it.

jonathan d.





"my soul is in the sky" - shakespeare
41 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSJC-Alien From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 919 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (12 years 11 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 1729 times:

,,,Yes,,know your Rights,,,,

Ask for a supervisor, get your paper and pencil out and start asking names, or write them down from the name plate, ask to see THEIR ID to confirm THEY are real.(see how fast they back off...)...ha ha just a 'turn the tables' on them and put them on the defensive, ask to see if their ID is real...you could stir all sorts of s**t out of it....

Ask them to produce the new security act paperwork and show you where it says 'no photography'...it was total BS,,,good thing Matthew Lee stood up...VERY good...they were just throwing their authority around...we make an easy target......

Wouldn't it be nice to have some major media attention on a story like this, related to our hobby, put on National news channels...? Of course, it may backfire, too.......I think I'm gonna do some checking and find out all I can on airport security issues and see what this new law entails...so I'll keep you posted...


SJC ALien



User currently offlineJderden777 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1757 posts, RR: 28
Reply 2, posted (12 years 11 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 1709 times:

hey SJC-Alien,
Thanks and email me or post here for anything...my email is: jderden777@hotmail.com

i would never let a gate agent boss me around about taking photos, but i gotta admit i was a little disturbed by the national guard guy breathing down my neck..


jonathan d.



"my soul is in the sky" - shakespeare
User currently offlineDazed767 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 5498 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (12 years 11 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1675 times:

Good for you, I'd do the samething too if it happened.(and asking for the name and seeing the badge is a good idea!)

User currently offlineC-GRYK From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 751 posts, RR: 36
Reply 4, posted (12 years 11 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1672 times:

Good for you guys! Finally some people who are strong minded enough to stand up for themselves in the face of adversity. Let's all keep spotting and start standing up for ourselves, we have a right to be taking photos of aircraft, there will be no law in the USA (or my Canada for that matter) against aviation photography in my opinion. People just like to feel important. Good job guys!

Jeremy



Think before you type!
User currently offline2912n From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 2013 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (12 years 11 months 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1641 times:

I am all for people having the right to take photos, (like a photo in a terminal is really some security threat...) if we, as photographers, manage to piss off enough people our rights will be taken away. Some moron will make it illegal to use cameras inside a terminal and we will all be screwed.

By all means stand up for yourself, but try being polite about it.


User currently offlinePlaneboy From India, joined May 2005, 199 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (12 years 11 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1647 times:

Life is all about "Drama"

Enjoy and respect. Be careful of being caught in the "wrong place" at the "wrong time".

Unfortunately, the "NEGATIVITY GOD" has captured the world's attention. So what shall we do ?

As the fellows above have mentioned - DON'T GIVE UP.

Remind the "paranoid bastards" - THE WORLD IS STILL FREE !!!!!!!!

Fore - otherwise - we all lose.....

We need folks to stand up for what they believe in now more than ever....

Does anyone remember the "Boston Tea Party" ?

Does anyone remember when President Reagan was shot?

Does anyone remember Nixon's impeachment?

Does anyone remember seeing the video of president JFK having his head blown to pieces in Texas - and his wife picking up the pieces and trying to put them back into place while they were driving in that little parade ?

That was sad - she actually tried to put the pieces that she could reach - back into her husbands head - as if it would bring him back to life...

Little did she know - but that is another story...

Life is all about drama.

Take your pick.

Do what you wanna do.



User currently offlineCcrlR From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 2241 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (12 years 11 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1620 times:
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I guess you handled the situation carefully and calmly. I had people that do that to me sometimes and I tell them that there isn't anything in the regulations about this. As long as I am not harming anyone in the airport or on the planes it's not illegal. and they say whatever and they leave. Sometimes the police look at me and they don't care. They just walk away.


"He was right, it is a screaming metal deathtrap!"-Cosmo (from the Fairly Oddparents)
User currently offlineH. Simpson From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 949 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (12 years 11 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 1598 times:

Thank you for bringing up the topic, keep our hobby alive!

User currently offlineKcle From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 686 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (12 years 11 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 1595 times:

Call me stupid, but why was the National guard guy so worried about you taking pictures of people, even though you weren't? Is there some sort of law against taking pictures of people in an airport terminal?

User currently offline5280AGL From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 414 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (12 years 11 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1587 times:

I believe the only law is that you cannot take pictures of the security check points (like you would really want to anyway). But I am not even sure it is a real law...They sure as hell will nail ya if you try though.

User currently offlineMirage From Portugal, joined May 1999, 3125 posts, RR: 14
Reply 11, posted (12 years 11 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1583 times:

"...just some advice: always stand up for yourself and your hobby..."

Yes, it's nice to have Matthew Lee around to stand up for you, lol.

Luis


User currently offlineScottysAir From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (12 years 11 months 3 days ago) and read 1567 times:

Jonathan,

What is problems with National Guard at ATL airport and did he was tell you something about with no camera allowing with the airplanes. So it was about due of heightened of security. If you were taking a pictures and they will tell u will had a leave. This is important as for the aviation photography. Well, that it for now.

Regards,

Scott


User currently offlineB757300 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 4114 posts, RR: 22
Reply 13, posted (12 years 11 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 1556 times:

National Guardsmen are the worst. On Wednesday, my friend was flying back to Seattle out of our small airport here in College Station, Texas. I went to see him off and to do some more experimenting with my camera since you can get close to the runways and outside without a problem. Anyway, his dad took a picture of him and within 2 seconds, that M16 carrying fool was in his face. He took the camera out of his hands and removed the film all because the security area was about 30 feet in the background. Well, I went outside to watch the Saab 340 takeoff and who shows up, Mr. Rambo. He tells me that it is illegal to take pictures at airports and to give him the camera. (He couldn't grab it since it was around my neck.) I told him it was not illegal and if by some chance it was for him to show me solid proof, not just his words. I don't think he expected someone to respond this way. After thinking for a second, he told me to come inside and talk to the guy in charge of the airport. I told him fine, since the Saab has already left, and we went inside. The airport manager quickly told him I was NOT breaking the law and unless I was in an area declared off limits then I was not going to be detained. I went back outside and finished my roll of film with a few pictures of a Continental EMB-120 arriving from Houston. I got them developed and tried to scan them. All but one came out "soft and fuzzy". I need a different lens but that's another story.


"There is no victory at bargain basement prices."
User currently offlineAlaskaairlines From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 2054 posts, RR: 15
Reply 14, posted (12 years 11 months 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 1549 times:

I don't see what in the world they want, is our hobby of aviation photography going to hurt them or slow things down?

Good report.

-Dmitry


User currently offlineJderden777 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1757 posts, RR: 28
Reply 15, posted (12 years 11 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1547 times:

Mirage (Luis),
Alright...yes it was good to have him around. He was just the one who spoke up first before I did. i do thank him for being the one to say something, but if he didn't speak to them first then i sure would have. i already had my mouth open to speak when Mr. Lee spoke up...i would've said pretty much the same thing he did, except he beat me to the chase...
so yes i do think we need to stand up for ourselves and for our hobby...in this case it wasn't me doing ALL the talking

jonathan d.



"my soul is in the sky" - shakespeare
User currently offlineSJC-Alien From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 919 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (12 years 11 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 1523 times:

I called my Congressman's office and asked for a report and I'm still waiting,.....as soon as I hear, I'll let you know......and I'm keeping prints of this stuff, btw,,,,nothing I'd like better is to bring a 'class action lawsuit' on this,,,,when I have the right info. I'm taking my time......"just you wait, my pretty"


SJC Alien


User currently offlineTu154m From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 683 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (12 years 11 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1534 times:

Everyone,
I agree with all of the continue taking pictures stuff. One question for Jonathan....Who do you know that got you time in ANY one of DL's sims??? I work for DL in ATL and there is no way in hell they would let a mechanic in there!!!! I had to go to an aircraft taxi procedures class and they let us drive the thing, but just to practice emergency stuff. I would have to go under Leo's desk to even get considered to "pop in" and fly a sim.(And it ain't worth it!). Obviously you are doing something alot of us aren't. I can fly for free and anyone that goes to as many places as you have been(paying I assume) and gets access knows someone! And you are only 16-21!?!?!?! Congrats on getting the hint I never got!
Steve



CEOs should swim with cement flippers!
User currently offlineJan Mogren From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 2043 posts, RR: 50
Reply 18, posted (12 years 11 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1526 times:

>I would have to go under Leo's desk ..<  Wow!

You know, if you REALLY want something..  Laugh out loud

(JUST KIDDING ALRIGHT!!!)

/JM




AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
User currently offlineTu154m From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 683 posts, RR: 5
Reply 19, posted (12 years 11 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1516 times:

OH Yeah!!!! Just kidding! There is nothing that important!!!!!!!


CEOs should swim with cement flippers!
User currently offlineSafetyDude From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3795 posts, RR: 15
Reply 20, posted (12 years 11 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1506 times:

Good job standing up for our hobby  Big thumbs up
If I ever get bothered I'll use this!

Alen, tell us as soon as you know!
-Will



"She Flew For What We Stand For"
User currently offlineRC Pilot From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (12 years 11 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1500 times:

I had a simalar situation at the airport that is kind of close to my house (quad city airport) in moline, IL

I wasn't taking any pictures. I just like going and watching the planes at the airport. I was parked in a grassy area that the firefighters use to test there fire trucks and I guess it's used for other things.

But anyway, Its not a very busy airport so I had to wait a while some times. I wasn't sitting in my car, I was standing a little away from it for a good view.

A police officer came over and told me this was restricted. And I politely responded and left. I went over to where a residential street ended. This street faced the terminal. I had to be about a half mile to 3\4 of a mile away i Think. Probubly less, but it was at least 3 football fields.

A few minutes later that same cop came up and he searched my car, which I didn't mind much because i thought he was going to let me stay after having seen what I was up to.

Then he told me to leave. Now there was a house not to far from us and I told him that I wasn't anymore of a threat than the man living in that house there if not less.

Then he threatened me with this having to see the FBI bull !@#$ and since I really dont want to be in the news since I still go to school I gave in.

I should have keeped going, I love arguing with power hungry morons. Let me remind you I live in the quad cities, there isn't much that happens here and the police jump all over the littlest thing.

Just being polite doesn't really help in an area like mine.

Good luck all.


User currently offlineJderden777 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1757 posts, RR: 28
Reply 22, posted (12 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1505 times:

first of all, about the sim time in ATL...
i know a delta 732 captain and he also is a flight instructor for it...he flies 4 months out of the year and trains others for 8 months. he used one of my photos in a powerpoint presentation (along with gregg stansberry's, and brian stevenson's)...i asked him if i'm ever in ATL and had the time if he would show me around...so i flew down to ATL for the day last friday, and met up with him...he took me and jonathan birdwell (flew down there with me) into the DL 737-200 sim and we flew around for about an hour...i have to say i made one of my best landings in that sim  Smile/happy/getting dizzy i greased her down on 8L at ATL (sim, of course!)...ahh what a great day that was! i took a bunch of pics, and i will get them back on thursday afternoon...i got some shots of N813DE, the DL M11 in new colors....so be on the lookout for some of my shots from this trip

jonathan d.



"my soul is in the sky" - shakespeare
User currently offlineSJC-Alien From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 919 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (12 years 10 months 4 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 1456 times:

Still awaiting an answer.....from the Congressmans office,.,,


I did look up the web under NTSB/FAA and the like and it's a HUGE report....so I am trying to cut corners...there is nothing I can find so far in regards to any paragraph/article/section in regards to airport photography, etc,,,,being banned, so it looks like we're in the clear, just under my 1st examination...more to come

I'll keep you posted...

SJC Alien


User currently offlineEGGD From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2001, 12443 posts, RR: 34
Reply 24, posted (12 years 10 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 1449 times:

This 'matthew lee' person seems to be some sort of super-man..

Tell me more about this person, does he live in Metropolis?


25 Post contains images SJC-Alien : well..if he does,,,there aren't too many 'phone booths' to use anymore... Alien
26 Post contains images FlyDLjets : I had a similar problem at Key West. I really enjoy being able to walk out on the tarmac to board so as I walked out I took out my camera and took pic
27 SJC-Alien : Excellent, good story ,,,from what I've seen on the new FAA order,,,,,,,and I haven't read it all.....is there is nothing about taking photos at airpo
28 United_Fan : I was unfortunate to have my first experience in my 15 years of plane spotting today at my airport,ROC (Rochester,NY) I was sitting in my car in the
29 Post contains images H. Simpson : relax, Scott0. I'm sure they won't bother you since I also had my name down in the FBI sh*t... here's my story: I was at EWR(well, close to it, where
30 United_Fan : Sorry,but I don't like being treated like a crimainal for planespotting becausue some buzzhead a$$hole cop is on a powertrip!
31 H. Simpson : yeah they like(and loved) to use Plane spotter as a target for showing off power.
32 5280AGL : Well, do you really blame the guys? Afterall, they spend hours and hours walking around the airport NEVER FINDING ANYTHING or collecting fingernail cl
33 United_Fan : That's okay,I'll be back tomorrow-they don't intimitade me! It would never hold up in court anyway.
34 Post contains images 5280AGL : The day that photographing aircraft in the U.S. is illegal is the day I move to Canada.
35 Post contains images H. Simpson : I'll go with you, 5280AGL. I'll be in Toronto
36 Tpk : Wow, I guess I missed a hassle there - I changed planes at ATL on the same day (12/28) and luckily did not have the same experience. I feel bad that y
37 Post contains images Jderden777 : I saw the KAL 744 sitting there....DANG i'm kicking myself that i didn't go get it....geeze...also saw the Soaring Spirit 777... jonathan d. :::still
38 Tpk : Jderden777- Yeah, I saw psyched about the Soaring Spirit too. It was my first time seeing it and there was a nice deep blue sky during the hour I was
39 Flpuck6 : Come to think of it, I was ATL that day, 12/28! The 2:30pm arrival from PVD, flt. 1557, 757 N624DL n/c lol. I had 45 mins. for a connection time, so I
40 Post contains links Flpuck6 : Hey guys- Read the following extremely informative thread started by SJC ALien... http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/7081
41 Post contains images Gocaps16 : If some idiot wants your film, you should charge him for it. hmmm, How about $100 per exposure in a roll. LOL, you'd be a rich MF'r. Also, a way to pi
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