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The Screening Process - A Question  
User currently offlinedmemory From UK - England, joined Jun 2010, 13 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 9 months 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4397 times:

Hi all

I recently had an initial email saying 5 of my uploads had been passed first screening and if they pass the second they will be added.

No problem with that, but:-

1 1/2 hrs later I get a second email that says 3 have been rejected. One had been rejected for blurry, over sharpened and dark. I'm not questioning the rejection but my question, perhaps for a screener to answer is how can it pass 1st screening and then fail on 3 faults. Seems to be a wide divide between 1st & 2nd screening.

Dean

9 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinedlowwa From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 7328 posts, RR: 30
Reply 1, posted (3 years 9 months 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4387 times:

Quoting dmemory (Thread starter):
Seems to be a wide divide between 1st & 2nd screening.

Not at all. Passing first screening simply means one screener has seen it, not that he has decided that it is ok. It is possible, and even typical for a screener to pass along an image with comments attached about doubts they might have. In fact, I was the one who screened your images first yesterday. I added two right away, and passed the five others on to second screening. On two of the ones I passed along, I included comments to the next screener that they seemed a little over-sharpened, and it would seem he agreed with me - thus the rejections after passing first screening.


User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 10338 posts, RR: 26
Reply 2, posted (3 years 9 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 4377 times:

Quoting dlowwa (Reply 1):
Passing first screening simply means one screener has seen it, not that he has decided that it is ok.

Interesting - I had no idea about that!

Perhaps a wording change may be in order? Because every time I see an email that says "XX photos passed the first screening" I assume that they were approved by the first screener.

It's not helped by the fact that the whole paragraph is:

You have 1 photo still waiting that passed the first screening. If it passes the second one as well, it will be added to the database on Airliners.net. Once processed, you will receive a second, final, confirmation message.

So using the word "pass" for both would indicate it's been approved.

Not a big deal, just a suggestion.



How can I be an admiral without my cap??!
User currently offlinevirgin777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (3 years 9 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 4368 times:

Quoting dlowwa (Reply 1):
not that he has decided that it is ok

Errm .. are you sure ?   

As i understood it an image passes the first process as acceptable even though it may have comments attached to it the image is still passable not close to an outright rejection , i get where he's coming from ... as its been mentioned before does adding a comment just outline a reason for the next screener just to click the reject as he has been prompted ?

Surely if any doubts are there its a reject ?

As the old saying goes ... look to accept not reject  


User currently onlineunattendedbag From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2342 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (3 years 9 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 4358 times:

"PHOTO PASSED FIRST SCREENING
You have 1 photo still waiting that passed the first screening. If it
passes the second one as well, it will be added to the database on
Airliners.net. Once processed, you will receive a second, final,
confirmation message.
"

It's even written in capitol letters "PHOTO PASSED FIRST SCREENING".

Maybe it should say...

"YOUR REMAINING PHOTO(S) ISN'T COMPLETE GARBAGE
You have 1 photo still waiting that isn't complete garbage. If it
passes a second screeners acceptance levels, it will be added to the database on
Airliners.net. Once processed, you will receive a second, final,
confirmation message.
"



Slower traffic, keep right
User currently offlinedlowwa From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 7328 posts, RR: 30
Reply 5, posted (3 years 9 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 4344 times:

Quoting virgin777 (Reply 3):
Errm .. are you sure ?

Yes I am sure. Leaving it as a second opinion will for whatever reason show up as having passed first screening, when in fact no confirmation of its possible acceptance has been given.

Quoting virgin777 (Reply 3):
As i understood it an image passes the first process as acceptable even though it may have comments attached to it the image is still passable not close to an outright rejection , i get where he's coming from ... as its been mentioned before does adding a comment just outline a reason for the next screener just to click the reject as he has been prompted ?

Your question and/or point is unclear.

Quoting virgin777 (Reply 3):
Surely if any doubts are there its a reject ?

If I am sure there is a problem, I will reject it. If I am not sure about something, I will pass it on to another screener to see. For example, if I am not sure about the level, I will simply ask another screener to take a look. That would be the "passing first screening", but in no way implies it will be accepted. If I think there are no problems with an image when I first see it, I will simply add it then and there.

Quoting virgin777 (Reply 3):
As the old saying goes ... look to accept not reject

That is correct.

Quoting unattendedbag (Reply 4):
Maybe it should say...

"YOUR REMAINING PHOTO(S) ISN'T COMPLETE GARBAGE
You have 1 photo still waiting that isn't complete garbage. If it
passes a second screeners acceptance levels, it will be added to the database on
Airliners.net. Once processed, you will receive a second, final,
confirmation message."

Good idea. I'll see about making that the wording in the email.


User currently offlinevirgin777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (3 years 9 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 4329 times:

Quoting dlowwa (Reply 5):
Your question and/or point is unclear.

And vice versa ..

seriously though ... it couldn't be any clearer

As i understood it an image passes the first process as acceptable even though it may have comments attached to it the image is still passable not close to an outright rejection , i get where he's coming from ... as its been mentioned before does adding a comment just outline a reason for the next screener just to click the reject as he has been prompted ?

the more i read it the more it confuses me your not sure of its meaning , Dana this is no attack , just an observation from the back seats based on comments over the months etc , if the image is passable then it gets accepted ... but if a comment is added then it is acted upon from the next screener .. no matter how minimal the fault , this i have seen on many occasion which really begs the question does everyone of the screeners hand on heart look to accept ?
Please don't hit me but i don't think its 100% of the time.

**unless in this case we are talking about a clear "second opinion" and not passed the first screening .. which IS unlcear in this situation.



Enough for now from me ... pub time

[Edited 2011-03-25 12:50:22]

User currently offlinedlowwa From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 7328 posts, RR: 30
Reply 7, posted (3 years 9 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 4280 times:

Quoting virgin777 (Reply 6):
the more i read it the more it confuses me your not sure of its meaning , Dana this is no attack , just an observation from the back seats based on comments over the months etc , if the image is passable then it gets accepted ... but if a comment is added then it is acted upon from the next screener .. no matter how minimal the fault , this i have seen on many occasion which really begs the question does everyone of the screeners hand on heart look to accept ?
Please don't hit me but i don't think its 100% of the time

Don't worry Tony, if this were the worst we saw in terms of 'attacks', we'd be pretty well off   If I pass an image on with a comment, it is only that, an observation. What the next screener does with it is totally up to them. They may or may not agree with my observation. Case in point, with Dean (the o.p.), I screened seven of his images. I added two immediately, and sent five to second screening. Of those five I sent (four with comments) two were accepted on second screening, including one I had added a comment to. The second screener did not act on my comment, and this is routinely the case. If i don't agree with the comment left by the previous screener, it will have no influence on my decision. Again, if I am unsure, I will simply pass it along with another comment. What would be the point of leaving a comment for the next screener if you already knew the outcome? If I left a comment about the level, for example, knowing that the next screener would then act on that and reject for level (according to your logic), why would I simply not reject it myself?

It may seem to people who aren't familiar with the process that there are a lot of discrepancies, but I can tell you that while we do not always agree 100%, we come to the same conclusions (independently) almost all of the time.


User currently offlinealevik From Canada, joined Mar 2009, 1071 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (3 years 9 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 4268 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
HEAD SCREENER

Quoting virgin777 (Reply 3):
Errm .. are you sure ?

Dana's screened a lot of photos - he knows of which he speaks.

The two HQ system does assist in the "look to accept" policy. HQ'ing an image for which there is some subjective doubt (i.e. soft, level, dark, etc) lets the next screener know that (1) The first screener thought the image was fit for the database (2) there was some aspect of the photo that the first screener thought was marginal. Otherwise, we could just reject outright for what could be subjectively minor flaws. (I'm sure you don't want us to do that for your images...) I can tell you I have seen many HQ images that have comments about some minor flaw, but I end up agreeing with the first screener that the flaw is minor enough for the image to be considered "High Quality".

In the end each screener screens the image completely as if it was the first time it was looked at. Comments on the HQ give the second screener an idea of what the other guy was thinking.

It's not unclear to me unless I wish to be a master of pedantics. If an image is clearly without flaws, we use the "Instant Add" button. It says right in the quote you have selected "if it passes the second one as well, it will be added...". Pretty clear that it needs to pass two screenings, and that passing the first one isn't admission to the database.



Improvise, adapt, overcome.
User currently offlinevirgin777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (3 years 9 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 4254 times:

Thanks Alevik , I'm aware of the processes but good for those who haven't screened at any sites , the main thing that needs clarifying in the above posts is the : second opinion & passed first screening.

You have given a clear indication of the terms but a lot of people would still be confused on how it can pass then fail within hours.

Boils down the good old consistency topic ... but that is another topic entirely

Cheers all.


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