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So...photography In Airports/flights  
User currently offlinesunflower100 From United States of America, joined Feb 2012, 1 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 5921 times:

I hear a bunch of different things about the legalities of this and I get pretty confused. I am a very visual person. Going to Australia once a year is not something that any of my family/friends will ever be able to do...maybe not even once in their lifetime. So I like to capture it in pictures. I like to be able to show them what is past security in the airports...the surroundings, etc. I also like to be able to help someone else out if they are taking a trip that requires them to be in airports I have experienced. As we all know, being in an airport for the first time can be pretty nerve wracking.

I have a couple of rules for myself. First and foremost, I make sure no airport workers, security guards, or other personnel are in the photos. If they are, the photos go to moot. Secondly, I make sure my "camera" is not noticeable so I am not disturbing or offending others. I currently use my iTouch which is very crappy but will probably be getting a compact camera because the iTouch is SO BAD. Thirdly, I limit where the pictures are posted. I post them on my personal Facebook and will post them on various forums but any pictures that have very recognizable faces in them are usually thrown out. I want to ensure privacy of all (not like flying on a plane is private or anything!).

So in flight or past security, is it illegal or wrong to take pictures and/or videos?

Also...a question I am sure a lot of people ask, and fight about. What about when taking off? I see youtube videos of takeoffs all the time taken from cell phones or cameras. I know that the "rules" are to keep ALL electronics off. But what about a regular camera that doesn't emit any waves of any sort (that I am aware of)? I will admit that I used my iTouch (not my phone, however, I did turn that off, and put my iTouch on airplane mode) to take videos of the takeoffs from Boston and Melbourne. I don't like disobeying rules, so I should probably just pack it away, but I am such a visual person...I like it for memories and to show others.

So let the debate begin....
 

18 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSIA6696 From Australia, joined Dec 2009, 90 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 5906 times:

Photos should be allowed in Airports, except photos of Security checkpoints such as customs and immigration.

Staff usually won't bother you if you are using a compact camera, they usually bug those with DSLR's or anything that looks 'pro'.

If you are asked, just be corporative and comply to what they say.

Videos are fine for takeoff and landings, i do it on all my flights. Cameras do not transmit any signals and is completely fine, i have never been asked to pack it away.



The best seat in a plane is the one you are in.
User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 10047 posts, RR: 26
Reply 2, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 5901 times:
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Quoting SIA6696 (Reply 1):
Videos are fine for takeoff and landings, i do it on all my flights. Cameras do not transmit any signals and is completely fine, i have never been asked to pack it away.

While there may not be any electrical interference, you're still supposed to stow all loose objects during takeoff and landing (below 10,000 feet I believe, at least in the US). I've been asked to stow my camera before.

With that said, I've certainly taken photos on approach or during taxi (don't usually do it on the actual takeoff or landing runs). Just be discreet about it.

During the non-critical phases of flight, I take hundreds and hundreds of photos out the window. Nothing wrong with that, as long as I'm not disturbing my neighbors. Again, I try and be discreet about it.

In terms of airport terminals, I'm a bit too self-conscious to take many photos out of the windows. Every now and then, sure, but I don't stand there and snap 100 photos (as much as I might want to!). That said, there's nothing wrong or illegal about it.



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlineshufflemoomin From Denmark, joined Jun 2010, 480 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5840 times:

I would say trying to make your camera inconspicuous is more likely to draw attention. Doing it that way makes it look like you've got something to hide. Just be natural and take pictures normally. I doubt anyone is going to hassle you. That's more of a USA problem.

User currently offlinejwhite9185 From United Kingdom, joined May 2007, 1316 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 5797 times:

Just take a look through a few trip reports to see what you can get away with!


A300,A319,A320,A321,A333,A343,A346,A388,732,733,734,735,738,741,742,744,752,763,772,77W,788,Q400,DC10,E145,E170,E175,E19
User currently offlineCaptainKramer From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2012, 225 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 5766 times:

I have only been asked once to stop taking photo's on a flight. it was on a Jetstar flight from Cairns to Singapore via Darwin flying on a A321. The irony was that I had checked the flight safety card in the backseat, to see what the score was regarding which electronic equipment should be switched off at takeoff and landing, but it clearly stated that cameras were exempt. So as we taxied out I started taking pictures, only to have the flight attendant who was seated at her exit door and who could see me 2 rows down leaning up against the window snapping away, asked me to stop taking pictures. I complied, and only started taking pictures after the seat belt signs had been switched off. On every other airline I have flown, no problem.

On another occassion while taking photo's of aircraft landing at London Heathrow I was approached by 2 police officers. They said they had just driven past along the perimetre road and saw me standing behind some tree's which they thought looked suspicious, as if I was hiding. I explained what I was doing, but stopped short of telling them that where I was standing would not make a very good hiding spot, because in front of me was the A50; I was standing in plain view of a road with 6 lanes of traffic passing by on a regular basis.


User currently offlinehrtsfldhomeboy From Djibouti, joined Oct 2007, 78 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 5646 times:

Last time I looked in a cockpit, it was overflowing with electronic equipment. My camera stays on durin take off.

And a DLSR and a point and shoot can take the same picture. Why airport officials get worried over a big lens and camera... fear! I'll keep shooting with my DSLR until they show me the Code Section, City Ordinance or local law that says "big scary looking cameras" aren't permitted and IPhone an P&S cameras are okey-dokey.

Stop bending over for ignorant people who are put in positions of authority and correct their retarded misconceptions on what really constitutes a threat.

Cheers,
H


User currently offlinemegatop412 From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 313 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 5567 times:

This topic has been discussed many times here. You are not in violation of any laws taking photographs within terminals(in the USA is all I can speak to). I have had to educate airport workers(in the USA) about this in the past. Also, do not agree to delete any of your photos, ever. You might personally choose to stop taking pictures so that you don't get detained(or arrested for 'obstructing justice'), but that don't make it right.

The topic of photography once onboard aircraft has also been discussed. To date, there is no comprehensive answer about whether it's truly risky behavior or not(this debate also rages about cell phone use). As soon as someone says 'it could interfere with the electronics', the next person says 'baloney, a camera could never interefere in any significant way', etc. This debate will never end. Personally, I don't think DSLR's pose any risk to flight safety unless they're being used to beat people about the head.

Just use good judgement- no need to get into arguments while in the plane(because you won't win) if your initial attempt to explain you just want to take a few shots gets you nowhere. Being discreet also helps, like not taking one picture after another throughout the flight to the annoyance of those around you.


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 8, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 5552 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
DATABASE EDITOR

Quoting hrtsfldhomeboy (Reply 6):
Last time I looked in a cockpit, it was overflowing with electronic equipment. My camera stays on durin take off.

Last time I looked, said electronic equipment was certified for use during flight. The rules say to turn your electronic devices off. Follow them.



Intentionally Left Blank
User currently offlineshufflemoomin From Denmark, joined Jun 2010, 480 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 5503 times:

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 8):
Last time I looked, said electronic equipment was certified for use during flight. The rules say to turn your electronic devices off. Follow them.

Then why are shows like Airline allowed to film in the air? How can airlines take official pictures in the air? What about productions such as justPlanes? How come numerous pilots film and photograph from the cockpit without retribution? Do they all send their equipment to the FAA for testing beforehand to make sure it's safe? I doubt it. If cameras posed even the slightest risk, then why do some airlines clearly state that cameras are fine during take off? In fact, one one occasion back in 2004, I filmed take-off with a camcorder on Air Canada with the permission and blessing of the flight attendant who could see me.


User currently offlinehrtsfldhomeboy From Djibouti, joined Oct 2007, 78 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 5493 times:

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 8):
Last time I looked, said electronic equipment was certified for use during flight. The rules say to turn your electronic devices off. Follow them.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © flightdeckimages
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ivandalavia



By accepting Photos like this to the database, this site sends a mixed message. A.net Crew asks photographers to follow government rules about photos inside airplane during "Sterile part of flight" but accepts images anyways.

Just saying...


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 11, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 5482 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
DATABASE EDITOR

Quoting shufflemoomin (Reply 9):
Then why are shows like Airline allowed to film in the air? How can airlines take official pictures in the air? What about productions such as justPlanes? How come numerous pilots film and photograph from the cockpit without retribution?

As you pointed out later in your post, prior permission was granted. Use of such equipment is often at the discretion of the flight crew.

Electronic equipment can and does interfere with avionics. To argue otherwise is to argue that experienced professional pilots are either lying or mistaken when they agree and provide first-hand examples. And thus, to argue otherwise is stupid and shortsighted.

Regardless, the rules are in place. Follow them. You are not authorized to determine when they may be ignored, nor are you able to determine whether or not a given device presents a risk. And your music/photos/Angry Birds/etc are most certainly NOT more important than the safety of flight.

Quoting hrtsfldhomeboy (Reply 10):
By accepting Photos like this to the database, this site sends a mixed message.

No it doesn't. Use of PEDs during takeoff/approach/landing is not necessarily breaking the rules if given permission from the flight crew.



Intentionally Left Blank
User currently offlineshufflemoomin From Denmark, joined Jun 2010, 480 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 5443 times:

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 11):
Electronic equipment can and does interfere with avionics
Quoting 2H4 (Reply 11):
Use of PEDs during takeoff/approach/landing is not necessarily breaking the rules if given permission from the flight crew.

You don't see how those two arguments undermine each other? Something is dangerous on a scientific level, but somehow becomes not so if the crew verbally agree to it? How does a crew member saying something is okay stop electrical interference? I've seen no scientific evidence whatsoever of a camera causing electrical interference nor any data suggesting how it might do so.


User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 10047 posts, RR: 26
Reply 13, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 5443 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting shufflemoomin (Reply 9):
Then why are shows like Airline allowed to film in the air? How can airlines take official pictures in the air? What about productions such as justPlanes? How come numerous pilots film and photograph from the cockpit without retribution?

Nothing wrong with taking photos or filming in the air. Just not when they ask you to stow all loose items and turn off electronic devices (one phrase I've heard is "anything with an ON/OFF switch"), which on US airlines is typically below 10,000 feet.

Quoting hrtsfldhomeboy (Reply 10):
By accepting Photos like this to the database, this site sends a mixed message. A.net Crew asks photographers to follow government rules about photos inside airplane during "Sterile part of flight" but accepts images anyways.

Maybe A.net says that you should follow government and airline rules, but it's not the website's job to police it. How does A.net know whether you were following rules or not? They don't know if you had permission, or whatever.



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 14, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5357 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
DATABASE EDITOR

Quoting shufflemoomin (Reply 12):
How does a crew member saying something is okay stop electrical interference?

It doesn't stop the interference, of course. But crew members can take things into account that passengers generally cannot. Whether the flight is expected to terminate with a CATIII approach to minimums at JFK, for example. Were it my aircraft, I would be a lot less tolerant of distractions during that kind of approach than a visual to a sleepy airport in CAVU conditions.

Also, when a flight attendant gives a passenger permission to use a given device, he/she will know specifically where the device is in use. If the flight deck calls back complaining of interference, the flight attendant can more quickly find and address a likely source.

What is so difficult about following rules? Why do you struggle with it?

Quoting shufflemoomin (Reply 12):
I've seen no scientific evidence whatsoever of a camera causing electrical interference nor any data suggesting how it might do so.

The problem is, you can't guarantee that all cameras do not sometimes cause electrical interference. You can't. Even if the chances are that only 1 in every million DSLRs do so, your photos are NOT more important than the safety of flight, no matter how remote the possibility.

But at the end of the day, it's a rule that the flight crew asks you to follow. Grow up, have some respect. and follow it.



Intentionally Left Blank
User currently offlineshufflemoomin From Denmark, joined Jun 2010, 480 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 5344 times:

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 14):
What is so difficult about following rules? Why do you struggle with it?

I do follow the rule and don't struggle with it. I'm debating your point that electrical devices can interfere with aircraft systems. If there really was any danger, do you truly think the FAA would go with simply asking people to switch them off and just hope they comply?

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 14):
Grow up...

Simply unnecessary comment to make towards me. I would expect a little more respect to be a given by 'staff' of the site.


User currently offlinemegatop412 From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 313 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5300 times:

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 14):
Were it my aircraft, I would be a lot less tolerant of distractions during that kind of approach than a visual to a sleepy airport in CAVU conditions.

Please, enlighten us about the kinds of interference you have experienced as a pilot from DSLR's. If these devices can and do cause interference, why would ANY pilot, yourself included, EVER allow their use in flight, thus jeopardizing passenger safety?

As the 'head database editor' on this site, telling people to 'grow up' and that they are 'stupid' and 'shortsighted' to argue with you when they are trying to participate in a discussion is completely unprofessional, don't you think?


User currently offlinebrianw999 From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 312 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 5149 times:

Quoting shufflemoomin (Reply 3):
While there may not be any electrical interference, you're still supposed to stow all loose objects during takeoff and landing (below 10,000 feet I believe, at least in the US). I've been asked to stow my camera before.

I usually have my camera with me throughout the flight. On the rare occasion where I have been approached about it the flight attendant has been happy with me simply keeping the strap around my neck.

I have a very simple ethos for using a camera in flight. I use it until I am asked or instructed to stop using it or only use it at certain times. Arguing with flight attendants is a waste of time, it makes them more strict with other more reasonable photographers and can possibly get you thrown off the flight ! .....and that will cost you an AWFUL lot of money and possibly your freedom.


User currently offlinePMN From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2005, 563 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 5014 times:

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 11):
You are not authorized to determine when they may be ignored, nor are you able to determine whether or not a given device presents a risk. And your music/photos/Angry Birds/etc are most certainly NOT more important than the safety of flight.

You're right, while in the air those decisions are made and should be followed. Here on the ground however it's perfectly reasonable to want to understand the reasons such rules are made.

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 14):
What is so difficult about following rules? Why do you struggle with it?

What is so difficult about basic politeness? Why do you struggle with it?



Edith in his bed, a plane in the rain is humming, the wires in the walls are humming some song - some mysterious song
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