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Canon EOS 5D & 70-300 L  
User currently offlineLGW340 From United Kingdom, joined May 2007, 315 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 8379 times:

Hiya,

I had a Canon EOS 5D (Mark 1) last year and LOVED it. I got something more up to date but I want to get another 5D Mark 1 simply because I liked it so much. Does anybody know how it pairs with the Canon 70-300mm L IS from a vignetting point of view? When I last had a 5D, the vignetting was pretty nasty between 300-400mm on the 100-400mmL what with it being FF so was wondering if it's likely to be as bad with the 70-300L?

Thanks

Chris Goodwin


Live life from the window seat...
14 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineANITIX87 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 3299 posts, RR: 13
Reply 1, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 8383 times:
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The 70-300L will out-resolve the 5D's sensor. There's no benefit to using that over an older, lesser L-lens. You would likely have better results using a modern crop factor camera than you will with the old 5DMk1, and then there's no vignetting to be worried about!

If you insist on the 5DMk1, the vignetting will be the same as with any other full-frame, but I don't have any experience with the 70-300L's vignette characteristics as I've never used it. However, with how low prices are on the 5DMkII, why not pick one of those up? It's about 4.6 trillion times better than the original 5D, especially for spotting.

TIS



www.stellaryear.com: Canon EOS 50D, Canon EOS 5DMkII, Sigma 50mm 1.4, Canon 24-70 2.8L II, Canon 100mm 2.8L, Canon 100-4
User currently offlinealexjames23 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 8 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 8383 times:

Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 1):
However, with how low prices are on the 5DMkII, why not pick one of those up?

Agree with this.

You mind as well just pick up a mark ii. better sensor, will probably last longer, better build quality.

I know someone who uses the 5DMii, and he uses a 300mm f/2.8 with a 2x TC on it, and doesn't see vignetting. Obviously, though, that's f/2.8. With the 70-300, I wouldn't be too worried.

IMHO, I would go with a crop-sensor camera, more specifically a 7D. They are a lot more ideal for spotting. You get that extra zoom already in the sensor, and the 7D has a very fast shutter rate, which is perfect for catching every action of an airplane.


User currently offlineLGW340 From United Kingdom, joined May 2007, 315 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 8383 times:

Thanks for the reply guys!

I used a 7D for a while but just couldn't get along with it because of the grain. Even at ISO 100 it was ridiculous, when you spend that much money on a body, you shouldn't have to spend ages removing grain from every image (even in perfect conditions).

I just liked the colours and sharpness I was getting from the 5D, preferred it over my 50D but maybe ill look at some crop options for a second body


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Photo © C J Goodwin - AirTeamImages



Thanks again

Chris Goodwin



Live life from the window seat...
User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 730 posts, RR: 16
Reply 4, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 8351 times:

I wonder if some people recommending crop have actually used a 5D? Its a completely different experience. One look through that big bright viewfinder and some people are hooked and will never use a crop camera again. Its not always about reach and frame rate!

Personally I think the crop DSLR is reaching the end of the line. I got an OM-D EM-5 to replace my 7D and it out performs it in every way (esp. image quality) EXCEPT for continuous AF. I suspect the next generation of hybrid contrast/phase detect AF systems will address that problem. I think many would be surprised at the sheer quality the current generation of mirrorless cameras are capable of.

Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 1):
The 70-300L will out-resolve the 5D's sensor. There's no benefit to using that over an older, lesser L-lens.

Not sure what that means - pretty much any decent lens will "out resolve" most current sensors (and certainly any crop sensor). Its not JUST about resolution - the contrast, "sharpness", control of aberrations will all impact on the final image regardless of the pixel count of the sensor.

5Dii vs 5D - yes on paper, the 5Dii has advantages BUT if clean images are what you are after, I haven't seen anything to beat a 5D at base ISO. The original 5D creates images with a certain 'look' which no other camera can replicate, even though they may in some ways be 'technically' better.

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineLGW340 From United Kingdom, joined May 2007, 315 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 8349 times:

Quoting ckw (Reply 4):
The original 5D creates images with a certain 'look' which no other camera can replicate, even though they may in some ways be 'technically' better.

Thanks Colin, this is what I mean. I love the 'certain look' it produces and the colour/sharpness/viewfinder is just like nothing else I have ever used!



Live life from the window seat...
User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 730 posts, RR: 16
Reply 6, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 8329 times:

Fact is cameras are mostly just tools (esp. modern cameras) - they work or they don't, they have particular features you need, and if inadequate, you upgrade.

But occasionally a camera come along which seem to have an extra magic ingredient which make the whole much more than the sum of its parts. The 5D was the only digital camera I'd used until very recently which had that magic (and I've owned/used more than a few). Owned it for 5 years, and it was always a pleasure despite its various shortcomings.

Ultimately, for technical reasons (needed higher res. and a much better AF system) I got a 5D3 - but technical marvel though it is, it lacks 'soul'. I would still be using my old 5D alongside it, but an art student friend of my daughter really wanted one, so I let it go to someone who would use and appreciate it for what it is.

Happily I also have an OM-D EM-5 and this may take the old 5D's place as my 'soulful' camera. At first I just found it impressive technically, but then I started using it for some B&W work. Wow! I don't know what fairy dust Olympus are using, but this is the first digital camera I've used that produces B&W images that look like the pics I used to produce with film. Its brought back something that I've been missing for the last 10 years.

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineANITIX87 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 3299 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 8323 times:
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Quoting ckw (Reply 4):
I wonder if some people recommending crop have actually used a 5D?

Yes. I've used Rebels, 50D, 5D (all three models) and 1D (Mk III and IV). I'm not just spouting hot air. Despite all off my experience with both crop bodies and full-frame bodies, I use the 50D for spotting, exclusively.

Quoting ckw (Reply 4):
Not sure what that means - pretty much any decent lens will "out resolve" most current sensors (and certainly any crop sensor).

5D has 12.8 megapixels. 5DMkII has 21. Obviously, the MkII's tighter pixel density will help match (more closely) the resolution of the new L lenses. Again, not just spouting hot air, it's the simple definition of pixel density and resolution.

Quoting ckw (Reply 4):
5Dii vs 5D - yes on paper, the 5Dii has advantages BUT if clean images are what you are after, I haven't seen anything to beat a 5D at base ISO.

I have. The 5DMkII. Or MkIII. The 5D was (still is) a spectacular camera. There's a reason many people keep it as a back-up. For portraiture, you're right, it's tough to find a better body (I prefer the MkII or MkIII because of the ergonomics and the LCD screen on the back, but that's personal preference). 5DMkI + 35L is one of the all-time great combinations for portraits. For spotting, the 5D is archaic and inferior to the newer full-frames. Colors and contrast are as good from the newer 5Ds in good light (or it can be easily fixed in post processing). The autofocus is atrocious (the 5DMkII isn't much better, I'll grant you that) and it doesn't handle high-quality glass nearly as well.

TIS



www.stellaryear.com: Canon EOS 50D, Canon EOS 5DMkII, Sigma 50mm 1.4, Canon 24-70 2.8L II, Canon 100mm 2.8L, Canon 100-4
User currently offlineSilver1SWA From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 4760 posts, RR: 26
Reply 8, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 8322 times:
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Quoting ckw (Reply 4):
I wonder if some people recommending crop have actually used a 5D? Its a completely different experience. One look through that big bright viewfinder and some people are hooked and will never use a crop camera again. Its not always about reach and frame rate!

It's like seeing through a pair of prescription glasses for the first time.

Quoting ckw (Reply 6):
But occasionally a camera come along which seem to have an extra magic ingredient which make the whole much more than the sum of its parts. The 5D was the only digital camera I'd used until very recently which had that magic (and I've owned/used more than a few). Owned it for 5 years, and it was always a pleasure despite its various shortcomings.

For me, that's been the 5D Mark II and it's a certain "magic" I picked up on just by viewing photos taken with one long before I got one. It's like seeing photos taken with a prime lens. You just "know". As impressive as the 5D3 is, I have yet to get a sense for that same "magic" that I can sense from the 5D2. If I had to put my finger on what it is, I think it's with the colors. The 5D2 colors seem so true to real life. I'm seeing a warmer and more saturated trend from 5D3 photos.

Before my friend and I both got 5D2s, he bought a 5D for cheap and we both played with it, having our first go at FF. Coming from the 7D, the 5D was tough to get used to. It actually felt like a step back in image quality. Now we both have 5D2s and I still have my 7D which will get used for appropriate situations but I must say. It's hard to look at and work with 7D images now after getting so used to the superior image quality on the 5D2.

Quoting ckw (Reply 6):
Happily I also have an OM-D EM-5 and this may take the old 5D's place as my 'soulful' camera. At first I just found it impressive technically, but then I started using it for some B&W work. Wow! I don't know what fairy dust Olympus are using, but this is the first digital camera I've used that produces B&W images that look like the pics I used to produce with film. Its brought back something that I've been missing for the last 10 years.

Another friend of mine has been raving about his OM-D EM-5. This guy was such a huge proponent for full frame cameras and has had both the 5D2 and 5D3. Nowadays he won't shut up about his OM-D! It gets used much more than his 5D3.



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 730 posts, RR: 16
Reply 9, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 8310 times:

Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 7):

Yes. I've used Rebels, 50D, 5D (all three models) and 1D (Mk III and IV). I'm not just spouting hot air. Despite all off my experience with both crop bodies and full-frame bodies, I use the 50D for spotting, exclusively.

I would agree that in general the more appropriate tool for spotting is a 50D - but it all depends what you're looking for. I'd take the 5D image over the 50D any day - but I accept it will be harder to get a sharp, frame filling image.

Re relative resolutions - well resolution is loosely used to equate to pixel count, but really it is the ability to resolve line pairs and there is no direct mapping between lens resolution and pixel count. While the 50D has a higher pixel count than the 5D, it also has a much stronger anti-aliasing filter and more noise at base ISO which work against its ability to resolve fine detail.

I'm not for a moment suggesting that the 5d3 (or for that matter the 50D) is not a better camera taking everything into consideration - I'm simply saying (as I think you are with regard to portraits) that 5d images at base ISO are pretty much unique, and unmatched except possibly by the 1Ds series or !Dx (but I haven't used that yet). Pixel for pixel the 5D3 doesn't quite match it - but of course I have twice as many pixels to play with, and can superb quality at 1600 (which the 5D certainly can't).

I'm not even sure the difference is easily measurable - its like comparing Kodachrome and Fujichrome film - both outstanding, but each had its own look - some simply preferred one over the other.

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9700 posts, RR: 27
Reply 10, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 8303 times:
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Quoting ckw (Reply 9):
I'd take the 5D image over the 50D any day - but I accept it will be harder to get a sharp, frame filling image.

This struck me as interesting, since I have no experience with full-frame. The frame-filling part makes sense, but why would it be harder to get sharp images on the 5D over the 50D?

From my own very limited experience, the 10 MP Rebel XS was considerably sharper, pixel-to-pixel, than my current 50D (though the 50D still picks up more detail).



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 730 posts, RR: 16
Reply 11, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 8283 times:

The AF on the original 5D is pretty poor by current standards. Also the 5 AF points cover only the central part of the viewfinder and the outer points are not very good at tracking, so you're pretty much stuck with a comparatively slow center point for moving subjects.

Add to that, FF means a significantly shallower depth of field - which catches a lot of people out who are used to crop! This means accurate focus is more critical. Of course the shallow DOF can be used to great creative effect - one of the reasons people love FF.

The 5Dii is a bit better, but not much - essentially the same AF tweaked a bit. IMHO Canon was in too much of a rush to be first on the market with a video capable DSLR and didn't improve the camera functions as much as they could have.

They more than made up for it on the 5Diii though!

Bottom line - you CAN get great aviation shots with the 5D - but a sluggish AF and slow framerate makes anticipating the shot that bit more important and it requires a little more thought (perhaps no bad thing). BTW I should also say that when you do nail the focus, you'll see sharpness and detail that will shock you compared to what you may be used to with cropped bodies.

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineSilver1SWA From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 4760 posts, RR: 26
Reply 12, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 8279 times:
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Quoting ckw (Reply 11):
Add to that, FF means a significantly shallower depth of field - which catches a lot of people out who are used to crop! This means accurate focus is more critical. Of course the shallow DOF can be used to great creative effect - one of the reasons people love FF.

Absolutely! One thing I wanted most when going FF was that nice, shallow depth of field. But on the other hand, it was quite a shock when I would take a basic wide angle shot. I used to take my general travel photos around f/7.1 and f/8, but on FF that might now be stopped down enough to get everything in focus.



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9700 posts, RR: 27
Reply 13, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 8260 times:
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Quoting ckw (Reply 11):
BTW I should also say that when you do nail the focus, you'll see sharpness and detail that will shock you compared to what you may be used to with cropped bodies.

OK, that's what I figured. That's why I was confused at first - I assumed you were talking about all else equal (nailing focus, DOF, etc.).

The focus point situation wouldn't be much of a hassle for me, since I use only the center focus point 99.7% of the time.

Not that I'm looking at going full-frame anytime soon anyway.... 

Thanks Colin.



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlinechris78cpr From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 2819 posts, RR: 51
Reply 14, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 8196 times:

Chris,

Used the 70-300L on my 5D2 and 5D3 and it perform well, much better than the 100-400 ever did on the 5D2. The 100-400 actually performs a lot better on my 5D3. I would assume based on the fact it works well with the 2 and 3 it would work very well with the 5Dc!

Btw, 5Dc is one of the greatest cameras canon ever made and it's fantastic in a lot of shoting conditions as you know! I wouldn't hesitate buying one as they are a bargain these days!

Chris



5D2/7D/1D2(soon to be a 1Dx) 17-40L/24-105L/70-200F2.8L/100-400L/24F1.4LII/50F1.2L/85F1.2LII
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