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Canon 70D  
User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 713 posts, RR: 16
Posted (9 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 5454 times:

This is the spec for the Canon 70D according to Canon rumours. Expect an announcment next week. Note that this one will have both a new sensor and new AF system

20.2mp CMOS Sensor
DIGIC 5+
19pt AF System (All Cross Type)
7fps
Built-in WiFi
3″ Vari-Angle Touch Screen LCD
ISO 12,800 Maximum
Dual Pixel CMOS Autofocus
Full HD Video
HDR
Multiexposure Mode
LP-E6 Battery
Announcement on July 2, 2013

Cheers,

Colin


Colin K. Work, Pixstel
58 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineangad84 From India, joined Nov 2012, 638 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (9 months 3 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 5442 times:

If that AF system is solid, I will stop waiting for the 7D Mk2. I hate being a guinea pig for new tech, though :p

Any word on AF microadjustment?

Cheers


User currently offlineJakTrax From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 4936 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (9 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5402 times:

Hopefully they'll re-introduce magnesium alloy bodies in the XXD range with this latest model. The plastic body of the 60D was the first thing that put me right off!

Karl


User currently onlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9397 posts, RR: 27
Reply 3, posted (9 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 5394 times:
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Quoting ckw (Thread starter):
ISO 12,800 Maximum

Surprised they haven't increased that at all. The 50D has 12800 max too.

Quoting angad84 (Reply 1):
Any word on AF microadjustment?

Yup, wouldn't even consider it without that.



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlinesouthwest9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2012, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 5357 times:

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 3):
Surprised they haven't increased that at all. The 50D has 12800 max too.

True, but would you really ever want to shoot with your iso at 12800? I hope that they work on the noise control so that 12800 becomes more usable and not just some sort of last resort.


User currently onlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9397 posts, RR: 27
Reply 5, posted (9 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5331 times:
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Quoting southwest9 (Reply 4):
True, but would you really ever want to shoot with your iso at 12800?

Yes. Orion Nebula shot at ISO 12800:



With a new sensor with presumably better noise control, it seems logical that they'd extend the ISO range.



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlineNewark727 From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 1312 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 5310 times:

What would the WiFi be for? Is that something cameras have been doing a lot recently? I'm kind of out of the loop, as I haven't needed a new body since getting a 50D at the end of 2009.

User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 713 posts, RR: 16
Reply 7, posted (9 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 5295 times:

Quoting Newark727 (Reply 6):

What would the WiFi be for? Is that something cameras have been doing a lot recently?

Not something I would want as I don't like the idea of sending/posting unedited files anywhere, but for some this is a real big deal - upload files to Flickr or Facebook as you shoot. For photojournalists (though they probably won't be buying 70Ds) this is a very valuable feature. Expect it to be standard in all new models.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 3):
Surprised they haven't increased that at all. The 50D has 12800 max too.

I wonder if this a deliberate "crippling" of the camera - ie. the sensor may be capable of better, but they're not going to allow you to exceed 12800 in order to allow some differentiation with more expensive models

Quoting angad84 (Reply 1):
Any word on AF microadjustment?

No, and again this may be a deliberate omission to help ensure sales of the 7D mk II.

I would guess that the 70D will be as per the Canon Rumours spec, and the 7D mk II will possible use a similar sensor but with an AF more like the 5D3, dual processors (dedicated AF processor) magnesium body and microadjustment.

The big mystery for me is the new AF system - supposedly much faster in live view, but unclear whether it will support continuous focus ... if it does, that would be a big deal for anyone shooting video.


Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineNewark727 From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 1312 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (9 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 5269 times:

Quoting ckw (Reply 7):
Not something I would want as I don't like the idea of sending/posting unedited files anywhere, but for some this is a real big deal - upload files to Flickr or Facebook as you shoot. For photojournalists (though they probably won't be buying 70Ds) this is a very valuable feature. Expect it to be standard in all new models.

That makes sense, though I was thinking something along the lines of a replacement for having a memory card reader attached to my laptop.


User currently offlineangad84 From India, joined Nov 2012, 638 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 5259 times:

Quoting JakTrax (Reply 2):
Hopefully they'll re-introduce magnesium alloy bodies in the XXD range with this latest model. The plastic body of the 60D was the first thing that put me right off!

Yep, that and the lousy weathersealing. Unfortunately, regardless of the material, it appears that the weathersealing will not improve where it matters most, thanks to the articulating screen. Again, Canon seems to focusing too much on the video-shooting crowd.

btw, happy A.net birthday!

Quoting ckw (Reply 7):
I wonder if this a deliberate "crippling" of the camera - ie. the sensor may be capable of better, but they're not going to allow you to exceed 12800 in order to allow some differentiation with more expensive models

I wouldn't be surprised.


User currently offlinedazbo5 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2005, 2820 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (9 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 5249 times:

Quoting Newark727 (Reply 6):
What would the WiFi be for?

For wireless transfer to a storage device, for example a laptop. Rather than thinking WiFi for internat connection, it can be used simply to transfer photos from the camera to a laptop, iPad etc as they're taken or once returned from a shoot. It just negates the need for wires or memory card readers. A feature many won't use or find useful, but some will. I'm in the process of toying ith the idea of replacing one of the memory cards in my video system with an eye-fi card for the same reason.

Darren



Equipment: 2x Canon EOS 50D; Sigma 10-20 EX DC HSM, 50-500 EX APO DG, Canon 24-105 f/4 L, Speedlite 430EX
User currently offlinePMN From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2005, 563 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (9 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 5184 times:

I'm disappointed to see they've piled even more megapixels onto an APS-C sensor. No doubt the processing will be better than the 7D and noise performance will be improved (not that I ever found the 7D terribly noisy in normal use anyway) but such a densely packed sensor really puts serious demands on lenses in terms of sharpness. With such a sensible pixel count on the 1DX and the 5D3 remaining similar to the 5D2 I hoped Canon had started seeing sense and stopped joining in the nonsense pixel race but perhaps not. Or perhaps they've kept the top end sensible because pro/sensible amateur shooters generally know exactly what they need, and as the 70D is part of a lower range perhaps they're thinking people might just be taken in by more pixels?


Edith in his bed, a plane in the rain is humming, the wires in the walls are humming some song - some mysterious song
User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 713 posts, RR: 16
Reply 12, posted (9 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 5128 times:

Quoting PMN (Reply 11):
I'm disappointed to see they've piled even more megapixels onto an APS-C sensor.

Agreed - even if Canon have sprinkled magic fairey dust on the sensor, an equivalent 12-15 mp sensor would be of higher quality. And the situation is aggravated by the fact that people buying a x0 series are probably less likely to buy a high quality lens than someone who an x series.

Sad fact is that at the consumer/pro-sumer level, pixel count still carries a lot of weight. And of course the various photomags are also at fault by the way they do comparisons, and not making clear the pros and cons of pixel count.

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineDazed767 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 5486 posts, RR: 51
Reply 13, posted (9 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 5101 times:

For me 20MP is overkill, still love my 10MP 40D and can shoot all day and then some in RAW with an 8GB card  

User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 713 posts, RR: 16
Reply 14, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 5019 times:

Well it's officially announced.

The headline news is of course all live view/video related, with the new AF system which allows for continuous focus when shooting video. That will be a huge feature for many, possibly as significant as putting video in the 5D2.

Personally I don't shoot video by choice, however, professionally I'm being asked to do so more and more often - this camera promises to make that a LOT easier, so I'll be looking at this one very closely.

On the still camera side not so much to offer that's new - though it uses the same AF and metering as the 7D and is nearly as fast. It does have micro-adjust as well. What it does have over the 7D is an articulated rear screen. I think this is quite important - something I use a lot with my OM-D. One of those things you don't fully appreciate until you use it.

Image quality - we'll have to wait and see. But if it is as good as the 7D (and yes, the 7D should be better!)I think I' could live with that and buy it as a 2nd body and video camera as it appears to add some useful capability lacking in my 5D3.

Price is pretty good - just over under $1200/ £1100. Anyone still interested in the 7D should probably wait a bit as this is sure to cause the price of that model to drop.

Cheers.



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineangad84 From India, joined Nov 2012, 638 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 5000 times:

I think apart from weather-sealing (thanks to the articulated screen) this camera is the true 50D replacement that many had hoped for back when the disappointing 60D was foisted on us.

I will miss the quick-control joystick from the 50D, but I think it's upgrade time for me.

Cheers


User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 713 posts, RR: 16
Reply 16, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 4986 times:

I think people get overly concerned about weather sealing ...

1 - weather sealed cameras are not RELIABLY weather sealed - sure, they offer some protection, but I would never assume that the camera is certain to survive a rain storm etc. I have personally seen many pro Canon cameras die in situation where you might have thought the wetaher sealing should have protected them.

2 - non weather sealed cameras don't generally melt at the first drop of rain - my orginal 5D (which is certainly not weather sealed) survived 5 years of sailing photography ... salt spray, rain, being knocked about in the bottom of boats - and, quite remarkably - sitting in an inch of salt water for over an hour. Of course ...

3 - ... if you really want to shoot in harsh conditions, then you really should invest in additional protection. I use Stormforce covers - simple, quick to put on, and can be stuffed in a pocket if not needed. Yes they are probably over priced for what they are (£30 - £50), but they work on any spec camera and are a lot cheaper than the premium you'd pay for a weather sealed body.

BTW - the articulated screen does not preclude weather sealing - Olympus had weather sealed articulated screens from day one.

Another thought ... you could think of the inclusion of WiFi as a form of weather sealing ... no need to open up the camera or remove the cover to change cards!

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineTonyholt777 From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2010, 177 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 4986 times:

Quoting ckw (Reply 14):
Anyone still interested in the 7D should probably wait a bit as this is sure to cause the price of that model to drop

Agree and its still a good option - I do wonder where Canon are going to pitch (any) upgrade/replacement of it tho given the specs below.

http://cpn.canon-europe.com/content/...es_with_brand_new_af_technology.do

Quoting PMN (Reply 11):
I'm disappointed to see they've piled even more megapixels onto an APS-C sensor

Me too - Gonna have to see some real world examples of this sensor myself before taking a dip.

T


User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 713 posts, RR: 16
Reply 18, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 4975 times:

Now this is cool - sort of a hidden bonus of the new AF system:

When shooting in live view, whether still or video, the AF system is unaffected by the lens aperture ... ie it works regardless of the aperture. So stick a 2x convertor on your 100-400 and you will still have AF ... and that AF can be on any pixel within the central 80% of the screen - no fixed focus points as every pixel is a focus point - you can just touch the screen to tell the camera where to focus.

The more I read about it the more I want this camera - for my work it could be a game changer, letting me do things which were impossible or very difficult before. I'm hoping the sensor is reasonably noise free, but frankly, if I can get the shot I'm happy to put up with a bit more work in post processing.

And the entry fee for this new technology is not prohibitive. Of course it does make me wonder what the 7D mk 2 will be like!

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineangad84 From India, joined Nov 2012, 638 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4962 times:

Point taken Colin. I was indeed going off assumptions re: weather sealing.

DPReview has a spec sheet up that states the 70D is "water and dust resistant" and I've read elsewhere that it has the same polycarbonate-on-aluminum construction as the 60D. So that's nice.

Regardless of comparisons to the 7D/7Dmk2, the 70D certainly feels like a solid step up from my 50D.

And image/video samples are available here - http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd/samples/eos70d/

Those are JPEGs straight from the camera, so I imagine with proper processing, one could get even better results. The 3200 ISO jazz saxophonist was particularly impressive but the 1600 ISO butterflies were not. The samples also really highlight the importance of good glass. The waterfall shot with the EF-S 10-22mm is pretty soft considering the EXIF provided, but the bird shot with the 300mm 2.8L is ridiculously sharp. In fact most of the L-glass shots are good (135L, 24-70 mk2)

I really hope this can be made available before MAKS.

Cheers

[Edited 2013-07-02 04:56:49]

User currently offlinetrvyyz From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 1369 posts, RR: 10
Reply 20, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4955 times:

The jpgs on the canon website look impressive, wonder how the raw would look like. IQ seems to be not worse than 7D, the high ISO is pretty good at 3200, but too early to tell with these few samples.

User currently offlineckw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 713 posts, RR: 16
Reply 21, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 4941 times:

I'm always cautious with Canon samples - doesn't always reflect real world ... though interesting point about lens differences. I think it is generally accepted that increasing the pixel density makes more demands on the glass (there's probably a relationship between lens resolution and pixel density)

Availability - just phoned LCE here in the UK (to put my name down!) and was told they were expecting them before end on month. They didn't have a firm price yet, but when I mentioned around £1000, they said they hoped to be below that.

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlinechris78cpr From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 2819 posts, RR: 51
Reply 22, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4913 times:

Seems like a very good camera with some fantastic features. A nice improvement over the 60D.


5D2/7D/1D2(soon to be a 1Dx) 17-40L/24-105L/70-200F2.8L/100-400L/24F1.4LII/50F1.2L/85F1.2LII
User currently offlinedazbo5 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2005, 2820 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4903 times:

Quoting trvyyz (Reply 20):
The jpgs on the canon website look impressive, wonder how the raw would look like

I've just looked at a couple of them and my first impression is there's quite noticable noise in the sky on the waterfall photo, even at ISO 100. Noise control doesn't look too bad on the others given their respective ISO's, but from what I can see, it's not great either.

Darren



Equipment: 2x Canon EOS 50D; Sigma 10-20 EX DC HSM, 50-500 EX APO DG, Canon 24-105 f/4 L, Speedlite 430EX
User currently offlinetrvyyz From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 1369 posts, RR: 10
Reply 24, posted (9 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4888 times:

Quoting dazbo5 (Reply 23):

Reply 23, posted Tue Jul 2 2013 11:50:13 your local time (58 minutes 18 secs ago) and read 13 times:

Even the 18MP sensor had noise in the sky at iso 100, based on the 60d I used, the high iso's look better on this one imo. A silky smooth sky is a thing of the past it seems.


25 angad84 : A lot of that has to do with in-camera processing of the JPEGs. You're likely to get much better results working from RAW. Wow! I hope it hits India
26 vikkyvik : Eh....I don't think there's anything here that would make me upgrade from my 50D. Then again, I'd probably upgrade to full-frame if I were going to up
27 dazbo5 : I'm aware of that but even so, it seems an excessive amount of noise at ISO 100. It certainly wouldn't inspire me to upgrade from the 50D on noise pe
28 Post contains images JakTrax : I think the 30/40D hit the perfect balance between image clarity and noise performance. The 50D is very reasonable too, although dark cloud can lead
29 Post contains images ckw : Yeah, but you tend to find people object to this at a concert I'm not sure the camera offers that much more to the dedicated aviation stills photogra
30 vikkyvik : Maybe, but I have to agree with Darren: My 50D has quite low-noise photos at ISO160 and less. The skies are particularly quite nice, since I hate hav
31 ckw : I'm not sure these test shots tell us much - image 3 is noisier than I would like, but image 5 looks pretty good - both at ISO 100. I think image 3 i
32 GuitrThree : It goes beyond that. My 6D has the wifi and with the iPhone or Android App you can do remote shooting. You can change all the settings, Ap, Shutter S
33 vikkyvik : That's a fair point. And I've almost exclusively shot full manual for the last 2 years, so can't comment too knowledgeably on that! That's actually p
34 ckw : Didn't realise that - if the 70D adds video, that would be a real bonus for me - I use a GoPro that way at the moment on location shoots ,,, the 70D
35 GuitrThree : And I should expand just a little more. The camera can act two different ways in wifi. You can connect it to your home or any wifi network, and set y
36 dazbo5 : But isn't that partly the point? Not everyone who uses one of these will be a seasoned professional and have a light meter and be shooting manual all
37 Post contains images ckw : Well yes, but from a purely selfish point of view I'm only interested in whether the camera will work for me! There is no doubt that Canon sensors ar
38 Bestof79 : Hi, may this helps to some of the upcoming questions... Canon EOS 70D key features 20.2MP APS-C 'Dual Pixel CMOS AF' sensor DIGIC 5+ image processor I
39 megatop412 : Really? Nobody's 'foisting' anything on you. If you lived in East Germany in the 60's and needed a car, and the only game in town was the crappy Trab
40 angad84 : Haha, easy there tiger. I just meant that the xxD line (as well as the 7D) was due for an update and I know many users were itching for something awe
41 dazbo5 : I think that remains to be seen on the samples provided by Canon. From what I've see so far, there's nothing that really inspires me to swap the 50D'
42 angad84 : Darren, one of my favourite times to shoot is late evening/twilight and I have a very hard time getting good results in that light with the 50D. I lov
43 ckw : I find it interesting that full frame is often discussed as an upgrade path (and I'm sure Canon are delighted to hear that!) - but I see it different
44 dazbo5 : I quite agree Colin, which is why I say there's not really any benefit in an upgrade from the 50D to 70D based on the specs quoted, unless you want t
45 chris78cpr : I have to say it does make me laugh when i see people say "When i upgrade to full frame" and the like. Like Colin mentioned, there are 3 distinct 'cro
46 Post contains images Silver1SWA : True, but I'm confident that real-world results will show that the 70D will be excellent with regard to image quality and ISO performance. This is a
47 Post contains images vikkyvik : Well, I'm not sure one can make that condition. Otherwise, there's never a reason to upgrade based on image quality, which I doubt is true. My client
48 Silver1SWA : First of all, then don't upgrade. If what you have is good enough for you, then don't worry about upgrading. Speaking generally here, but people like
49 Post contains images Silver1SWA : Also, what's interesting is when the 50D was released, initial thoughts on IQ compared to 40D were similar to comments we are seeing here.
50 Post contains links NZ107 : A nice article showing the speed of the AF through live view.. http://www.canonrumors.com/2013/07/c...eos-70d-dual-pixel-af-performance/ Damn! 5D4, I
51 ckw : I don't know - is there a reason? Who's making the case? The manufacturers (for obvious reasons), the photo press (well they need something to write
52 Post contains images vikkyvik : I know. I'm not saying one has to upgrade. But I would expect image quality to be better, given the new sensor and such. The features on the 70D cert
53 Post contains images angad84 : High-ISO when resized down to 1200px or so is far from a good measure of a sensor's ISO performance. I always expose to the right with Canon cameras
54 Post contains links trvyyz : to some kind of photographers the new cameras make a difference, who shoots indoors and concerts etc. The new cameras shine in high iso's compared to
55 vikkyvik : I do too. That's really all I was saying. The 50D just happens to not be too bad to me for high ISO. I know. Hey, I was just going by what you said e
56 angad84 : Oh, I meant that the 50D is flawless up to 200, requires progressively more work up to 1600 (I frequently shoot at 1600, just rarely stuff I'm going
57 Post contains links ckw : For those (like me) who are waiting for the 70D with some anticipation, the manual is now online at http://gdlp01.c-wss.com/gds/5/0300011965/01/eos70d
58 Post contains links ckw : More on the new AF system from Canon http://www.learn.usa.canon.com/app/p...terview_nonfacing_pressquality.pdf What is interesting is the section on s
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