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Still Trying To Get A Screening Success  
User currently offlineAllie From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2007, 3 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 months 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 1741 times:

Firstly, I apologise in advance as I realise this has been done to death over the years, but I still haven’t cracked the secret of getting an image passed the screeners.

Before ditching the 350D for a 1D and still crashing and burning for further countless times could any of the experienced photogs please provide constructive feedback on the two below. Though not necessarily to be uploaded to A.net both are examples of possible rejections for any number of reasons, but usually blurred or over-sharpened.

Is the problem, the equipment, the photographer or the post processing…or all?!

Any guidance would certainly assist.

Allie

IMG 4315
IMG 4317


10 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineghajdufi From Hungary, joined Jun 2005, 322 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (9 months 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 1731 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

Allie, if you could post an original file (jpeg or raw) somewhere (dropbox or any other file sharing site) I'd be happy to do a step by step guide to show you what is supposed to be done to get the results acceptable. Mind you the original needs to be at least reasonable sharp.
HGabor



Your photos are like your children, you will always find them perfect.
User currently offlineNZ107 From New Zealand, joined Jul 2005, 6417 posts, RR: 38
Reply 2, posted (9 months 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 1717 times:

The only thing which I can deduce from these small images is that they're both low in the frame. The quality is lost, hence HGabor's request for the original to be able to assess it fully.


It's all about the destination AND the journey.
User currently offlineAllie From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2007, 3 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (9 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 1695 times:

Thanks for the input guys. HGabor can I email you on here with the original jpeg and final version and we can go from there?

Thanks again for the offer.

Allie


User currently offlineghajdufi From Hungary, joined Jun 2005, 322 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (9 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 1692 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

Yes Allie, I replied to your personal message with my email address.


Your photos are like your children, you will always find them perfect.
User currently offlineghajdufi From Hungary, joined Jun 2005, 322 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (9 months 1 week 7 hours ago) and read 1511 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

OK, I had the chance to look at some higher res files and here is what I think.
You were using a Canon 350D which is a good camera in good light. Nothing wrong with the gear you have just need to use is properly and it's important to know its limitations.

The Fokker 50 shot is good quality. You were using the right settings and the result is fairly good. I had to apply a little noise reduction, I used the built in NR in Lightroom, the same is available in PS Adobe Camera Raw. You need to look at the photo at 100% magnification and check the noise in the shadows. The contrast is almost correct, just had to darken the black point slightly, I used levels in PS and moved the left slider until a tiny bit of real black appeared. Exposure was good and the colours/white balance was also within limits. You need to be more precise with cropping, always use an aspect ratio between 3:2 and 4:3. The examples you posted are outside of that limit and the aircraft are too low in the frame. You need to resize your photos to 1024px wide, with the 350D I don't recommend anything higher than that just yet. Apply some sharpening using unsharp mask, set the radius to 0.2 and try an amount between 80-120. I can't tell you exactly how much you need, it's a different value for every single photo but you get used to what is required very quickly.


Falcon 7X: here I think you made some mistakes in the camera already. With so much light there is no need to push the ISO higher than 100. In fact with the 350D it's better not to go higher than 100 like ever. Also try to set your aperture to f8, especially when the light is nice like here. Because of the higher iso the shot is fairly noisy but can still be corrected with some noise reduction software. Once again pay attention to the aspect ratio and put the aircraft in the middle of the photo. Since the horizon is visible you also have to make sure the shot is level, in the example showed above a small CCW rotation would be needed. Otherwise the photo is nice and just a small contrast adjustment was needed, same way as I explained above and the usual sharpening after resizing to 1024px wide.

I will post my edits later on today just to show you what I was able to get out of the originals. Please post your version in the feedback forum http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/photography_feedback/ we will be more than happy to help.

I hope you'll find this useful.
Cheers,
HGabor



Your photos are like your children, you will always find them perfect.
User currently offlineAllie From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2007, 3 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 1383 times:

Thanks Gabor, a fair bit of information in there.

Fokker 50: Looking at the dimensions of the cropped image I hadn't realised they had fallen outside of the 3:2, but having re-checked I see that now. The other comments make sense, just needs more attention to detail on my part!

Falcon 7X: Point taken on the ISO, will try to keep to ISO100 & F8 wherever possible in good light conditions. Excuses my ignorance for the moment, is the aircraft not in the middle of the frame in the image at the top of this thread, or should I reference the nose with the centre of vertical as an indication?

Sorry have only just discovered the 'photography feedback' forum, will post them in there as requested.

Cheers
Allie


User currently offlineghajdufi From Hungary, joined Jun 2005, 322 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (9 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1376 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

Tony, it's hard to say, the dimensions influence how the photos look, but both aircraft are low in frame.


Your photos are like your children, you will always find them perfect.
User currently offlineKaphias From United States of America, joined Nov 2010, 301 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (9 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 1363 times:

Quoting Allie (Reply 6):
Excuses my ignorance for the moment, is the aircraft not in the middle of the frame in the image at the top of this thread, or should I reference the nose with the centre of vertical as an indication?

Centering is a tricky thing here, as there is no real technical way of explaining how to do it. The best way I can describe it is that you want the image to be vertically balanced, or "weighted" around the vertical midpoint line. This takes into account color, texture, brightness, and of course the subject… it's something you may already have an eye for, or will be able to develop over time. As suggested, make use of the photography feedback forum for things like this, as there are a number of people there who have developed an eye for the centering requirement here over time.



Flown on: C150, C172, C206, Beaver, Otter, Jetstream 32, Q400, CRJ7/9, E135/40/45, A320, B732/4/7/8/9, B744, B752, B763
User currently offlinePsych From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2004, 3048 posts, RR: 58
Reply 9, posted (9 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 1329 times:
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Quoting Allie (Reply 6):
is the aircraft not in the middle of the frame in the image at the top of this thread,

Hello Allie.

Not for A.net - it's definitely a little low.

For me there are two useful techniques for assessing centring, one a little weirder that the other!

* Try looking at your image when a lot smaller than the full size edit. The thumbnail size A.net uses is a good size. For some reason having the photo a lot smaller enables the brain to get a better sense of how the main subject 'fits' the dimensions of the photo. Doing that with your Falcon clearly shows (to my eye anyhow) that there's a little too much 'dead' sky above the plane, as compared to the darker tarmac below. Those two areas don't look balanced.

* My alternate method, which seems to do the same thing (and works a treat if you combine both methods), is to scrunch your eyes up so that you see a much less clear, darker image. I suggest you do this in private, so no-one is looking at you! Once again, this enables you to get a clearer sense of where the subject is with reference to the overall frame, and how 'above' and 'below' balance. I've just done that again with your photo and it confirms that the plane is too low in the frame. The same is the case with the Fokker.

Cheers.

Paul


User currently offlineNZ107 From New Zealand, joined Jul 2005, 6417 posts, RR: 38
Reply 10, posted (9 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 1321 times:

Try using the AF spots on the viewfinder - this may help to center the image a bit better. If you can put the windows around about in line with the middle horizontal dots, then you'll hopefully find yourself with quite well centered photos (not a fail-proof method though but at least a decent guideline to get started from). Of course if you're not sure, take a wider picture to allow you to crop to size. As time goes on and you get better at it, you might notice that you can reduce the leeway around the subject. Same goes with leveling.


It's all about the destination AND the journey.
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