Sponsor Message:
Aviation Photography Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Model Use My Picture But Without Permission :(  
User currently offlineN178UA From United Arab Emirates, joined Jan 2001, 1696 posts, RR: 65
Posted (11 years 8 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 8530 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Hi all

Recently, I recieved a few tip off emails that BigBird400 company's JAL Disney Sea B747-400 model, used my Airliners.net picture.

Here is one of the picture of their box design



and to my Airliners photo


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Sam Chui



And it seems they also used another photographer's (Avibear) work without consent


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Avibear




The thing it makes me angry is, while your company making thousands of fortunes by making this die cast model, why don't even you bother send me an email to ask for permission? I think this is the worse way to do business and in a long run, such low practices will cost big time on the company

The question is, it seems I cannot find BigBird400 company's website. I heard they do model all without license and therefore no website, just through other model dealer's website to sell them out. Can anyone help or any suggestion? I doubt I can get anything back now.

Don't say I am greedy, if this kind of fraud happened on you, you should get mad too, the model is probably sell like a hot cake, but I get nothing  Sad

Sam

62 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline2912n From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 2013 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (11 years 8 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 8461 times:

Sam--You are certainly NOT greedy. They took your image without permission and used it to make money. I think they would be a bit angry if you walked in and took 500 of their models and walked out the door with them!

Tony


User currently offlineAlaskaairlines From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 2054 posts, RR: 15
Reply 2, posted (11 years 8 months 1 day ago) and read 8455 times:

LOL Tony!

Sam just figure out how to contact them, and send them a healthy invoice! I'd probably charge around a grand for something like this, but that might just be me.

-Dmitry


User currently offlineRsmith6621a From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 194 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (11 years 8 months 1 day ago) and read 8453 times:

Hi,

My heart is sadden for you and the choices you need to make this situation right.

I think the fact you cant find them on the Net is reason enought to find a lawyer who specialize in do buisness searches and would send them a letter requesting a reasonable fee plus a penalty for not asking you first. I think under the situation nothing less than $1000.00 plus a royalty off of each sale after all it is going to be your images that attracts the consumer to the box.


I wish you the very best.

Regards



Did You Ever Think Freedom Could Be this Bad
User currently offlineJeffM From United States of America, joined May 2005, 3266 posts, RR: 51
Reply 4, posted (11 years 8 months 23 hours ago) and read 8383 times:

Sam,
We have a model shop here in Denver that sells tons of models like that. I will check the shop to see if they carry that specific manufacturer and see what I can find out. The store may only know how to contact the distributor, but you never know.

What a rip-off! I'll let you know as soon as I can.

v/r
Jeff


User currently offlineThomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 4001 posts, RR: 26
Reply 5, posted (11 years 8 months 23 hours ago) and read 8374 times:

Sam,

I believe I may know the owner of this company. I need to check my sources first however, give me a couple of hours.

Thomas



"Show me the Braniffs"
User currently offlineContinental From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5519 posts, RR: 18
Reply 6, posted (11 years 8 months 23 hours ago) and read 8358 times:

You can get quite a lot of $$$ is you bust em' which you can! Trust me, that model WILL SELL OUT! I collect some diecast aircraft, and I can tell you, that one WILL SELL OUT.

Continental


User currently offlineVafi88 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 3116 posts, RR: 17
Reply 7, posted (11 years 8 months 17 hours ago) and read 8291 times:

Jeff- Are you talking about Colpar Hobbie???

I love that store, all the aviation needs...



I'd like to elect a president that has a Higher IQ than a retarted ant.
User currently offlineNASA737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (11 years 8 months 15 hours ago) and read 8266 times:

Big Bird models in owned by Andrew Klein, the owner of Aeroclassics models and Collector's Aircraft Models Seattle. His website is http://www.norpac-cam.com. You can email him aklein@w-link.net.

Andrew Klein is a very shady businessman so I not only wish you the best of luck but also encourage you to charge him an arm and a leg. Not only did he use your pictures illegally, but he also makes these models without a license and then charges DOUBLE for them. Big Bird is a fake company name to hide the paper trail to his more reputable Aeroclassics brand.

[Edited 2003-02-28 08:16:42]

User currently offlineVonRichtofen From Canada, joined Nov 2000, 4629 posts, RR: 36
Reply 9, posted (11 years 8 months 15 hours ago) and read 8241 times:

Stick it to him!!

I can't stand scheisty mofos like that!!




Word
User currently offlineSkymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (11 years 8 months 12 hours ago) and read 8212 times:

I'm not suggesting that any of these photos are also used without the photographer's permission, but BigBird400 are making a habbit of using photographs that have also appeared on airliners.net for their box art...

BigBird400's Cathay Pacific model box art:


Jay Selman photo

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jay Selman



Bigbird400's JAL Disney Sea model box art:


Yosuke Kinoshita and Takuji Sohmura photo:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Yosuke Kinoshita
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Takuji Sohmura - the airliner photo collection



Bigbird400's JAL Reso'cha model box art:


Ryan Kawailani Ozawa and Glenn Alderton's photo:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ryan Kawailani Ozawa
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Glenn Alderton



Bigbird400's JAL Marine 767 box art:


Jean and Eddy Cuperus photo:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jean
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Eddy Cuperus


(I'm pretty sure Eddy's pic has been used and has been redone with different sky-scapes)

BigBird400's Australian 767 box art has also used the following photos, although I can't post a link to the art because the acronyms function on the a.net forums now messes up the link.

Dave Faulkner's and Roderick Eime photo:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Dave Faulkner
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Roderick Eime



Please note that the guy who photographs the box art has nothing to do with BigBird400 - he's just a model collector who just photographs models for his website

Andy


User currently offlineCkw From UK - England, joined Aug 2010, 745 posts, RR: 16
Reply 11, posted (11 years 8 months 9 hours ago) and read 8156 times:

Guys, I sympathise with Sam entirely, and agree he should do something. However, could you PLEASE keep specific references to "shady businessmen" off the forum - there is a world of difference between "knowing" and "proving" and posting such allegations may well expose A.net to a lawsuit.

Cheers,

Colin



Colin K. Work, Pixstel
User currently offlineNASA737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (11 years 8 months 6 hours ago) and read 8125 times:

Guys, I sympathise with Sam entirely, and agree he should do something. However, could you PLEASE keep specific references to "shady businessmen" off the forum - there is a world of difference between "knowing" and "proving" and posting such allegations may well expose A.net to a lawsuit.

Cheers,

Colin


I know where you are coming with this. However, it is widely known who the owner of Big Bird models is and it is widely known that some of his business practices are questionable.

http://www.wings900.com/vb/showthread.php?s=f51601d3507c76ad1e8789947e11db0e&threadid=12903

In this post, the owner of EZTOYZ, one of the world's largest retailers of these models clearly states who is the owner of this brand.

[Edited 2003-02-28 17:04:18]

User currently offlineSkymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (11 years 8 months 6 hours ago) and read 8137 times:

Another two photos BigBird are using that have previously been loaded onto airliners.net...

BigBird400 ANA 767 Star Alliance box art:


Andrew Hunt and Sam Chui photos:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Andrew Hunt
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Sam Chui



User currently offlineTommy Mogren From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 912 posts, RR: 21
Reply 14, posted (11 years 8 months 6 hours ago) and read 8131 times:

SAM,

Go get them!

I would never tolerate anybody stealing my work, so...
get what's yours!

Tommy Mogren



Flightdeck Action - Cockpit Videos on Blu-ray and DVD - Flights In The Cockpit- You're Invited!
User currently offlineDC-10 Levo From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2001, 3432 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (11 years 8 months 6 hours ago) and read 8099 times:

You're gonna be making $$$ here!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Go get 'em!

DC-10


User currently offlineClickhappy From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 9644 posts, RR: 68
Reply 16, posted (11 years 8 months 5 hours ago) and read 8079 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

I am going to take a drive by their offices tomorrow.

User currently offlineBenyhone From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 206 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (11 years 8 months 3 hours ago) and read 8022 times:

Sam - you're going to face problems tracking them down. BigBird400 exists for the purpose of producing "unlicensed" models. So you can probably join JAL, Cathay Pacific, ANA, etc. in your hunt for the person who is liable ... since these models are unlicensed, the factory does everything possible to hide their existence & distribution.

And - you can't trust anything written on those message boards. That post listed above doesn't illustrate anything. Even though every clue may point to one well-known modelmaker or owner - I think you're going to have a hard time actually finding concrete evidence of who actually stole your photos. I hope you're successful, for photographers everywhere.

And - if anyone disagrees with them stealing photos, don't buy their models!!

Terry/PHX
Cactus Wings



Cactus Wings Photography, Phoenix
User currently offlineADG From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (11 years 8 months 1 hour ago) and read 7980 times:

Best thing to do I reckon is start a world wide boycott of the product, point out the flaws, point out the places to buy the better and official products and so on. NEVER link to a site on the net that sells the product and when seeing someone advertise it in forums, respond with an eMail of all the reasons why people shouldn't support the company.

Won't get you any money, but will make you feel better  Smile




ADG


User currently offlineBO__einG From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 2771 posts, RR: 18
Reply 19, posted (11 years 8 months 1 hour ago) and read 7974 times:

Very sorry to hear this.
INcluding the star alliance shot you've had 2 photos "stolen" and used without permission. Some businesses these days have no respect for the individuals who goes out to the airport and spend loads of time and money shooting planes at one in a million perfect timing conditions.

I call these businesses a$$holes.

I think the course of action you are taking is proper despite the capacity of this issue. Part of me is assuming that the other photos that this queer company used off a.net were not consulted with the photographers.
A fellow photographer I knew who shoots planes in Edmonton had his picture stolen by Dragonwings a few years back. Dragonwings! Geez that is a big company who makes millions of models and they stole his photo off airliners.net. It's sad really..
I went to the hobby shop at the airport to see hundreds of model plane boxes with his photo on as the cover. And guess what, they were nearly sold out about a week later.

I wish you best of luck, and I hope you get the compensation that you deserve.

B



Chance favors the prepared mind.
User currently offlineSkymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (11 years 8 months ago) and read 7970 times:

AGG,

Just out of interest, was permission given to use that JAL Reso'cha picture?

Andy


User currently offlineQantas744 From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 246 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (11 years 8 months ago) and read 7946 times:

It's funny that EZTOYZ name has come up-I had never heard of them until this evening. I had a quick scan of the early part of this thread this afternoon and coincidentally got an email about an hour ago from Tamsin Zvereva about the following webpages:

http://www.eztoyz.com/cgi-bin/cart/cart.pl?db=collectibles.dat&category=StarJets200

http://www.eztoyz.com/graphics/starjets/dj014.jpg

Check out the BD320 on that page, you ight have seen it before......


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Matthew Willmott-Sharp



I haven't had time to look again at all of this thread as it's late and I have an early start tomorrow. After I get back from work (+Myrtle Ave probably!) I'll look into it in more detail.

So who do I chase? 'Starjets' who I presume are the guys who produce the models, or EZTOYZ since it is their website?

Regards,


Matt




you can't buy time but you can sell your soul and the closest thing to heaven is to rock'n'roll
User currently offlineN178UA From United Arab Emirates, joined Jan 2001, 1696 posts, RR: 65
Reply 22, posted (11 years 8 months ago) and read 7948 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

thanks for all the suggestion and replies.

I have made an attempt to email this "almost certain" BigBird owner who have shop out of Seattle and I knew this person before back to 1999.

His basic replies is bitter and cold tone stating contrary to popular believe , "I have nothing to do with it, my shop sell their model, but I do not run that company"

Terry(Benyhone) is correct, his deny and with currently no other good clue, have left me stranded in this case. All models are unlicensed, and all distribution are hidden, although I know it can possibly get hold of the model in Hong Kong market.

Now, I am not even try to ask a good amount of money, but more of a appology and explanations and hope they can change their way of practice, to give real credit to the photographers. I do not think such case will let me be rich or make anything...

I also face the problem of lawsuit, as I am from Australia, this BigBird company seems is an off shoot company from US, models made in China. It involves Int'l law? I have no time or no effort to devote into this. I doubt I will get anything now.

I am also very interested to see Glenn's JAL Reshocha shot on the model box, have you get any contacts from them? If so, please let me know.

Sam


User currently offlineNASA737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (11 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 7932 times:

Sam,

I'm afraid you are going to be out of luck. Mr. Klein is indeed the owner of this "company" as not only evidenced by the fact that everyone on DAC knows he is but also the fact that the models are made on his molds. However, Big Bird was set up just to make unlicensed models and therefore there is NO paper trail.

This is exactly why I refuse to purchase ANY of his products. I think other members should do the same.


User currently offlineBenyhone From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 206 posts, RR: 3
Reply 24, posted (11 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 7932 times:

Sam,
You want to "confront" Andrew, EZtoyz, and whoever else is involved with these models? All of them were at the LAX collectibles show back on 01Feb. The next show is 21Jun ... I'm sure they will all be there again! Maybe at least you (or someone) can bring this problem to light.

Also - maybe someone should cross-post Sam's complaint over on DAC, Wings900, and Airlinebuzz.com. The unlicensed models were fun for a while, but stealing photos has got to STOP.

Terry/PHX
Cactus Wings



Cactus Wings Photography, Phoenix
25 Post contains images ADG : Andy, No permission has been given for the use of Glenns images for the packaging of these products. :-( yet another victim of a barnacle of the backs
26 Thomasphoto60 : Well seems that one person here has a real 'bug' up his a** concerning Andrew Klein (do I smell a Tucano/Herpa supporter?). So, Nasa737, do you have a
27 Moose : Very well said Thomas. AK is a good person and honest businessman. Manufacturing and selling diecast isn't even his primary business interest. There i
28 ADG : if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck then it's most likely a duck. The fact that you can link him directly to the sale of the planes and th
29 NASA737 : So, Nasa737, do you have actual verifiable, indisputable evidence that A.K. is the founder and owner of Big/BiggerBird models? They are his moulds. Th
30 NASA737 : Here are some quotes taken from other forums. Andrew Klein: It would have been more appropriate for eztoyz/sleazyboyz not to announce Big Bird product
31 Thomasphoto60 : That's your opinion, ADG and your entitled to it. However let me ask you this, what about all of the other shops that sell BB's (and there are quite a
32 N178UA : Speaking of Mr Klein, I remember when I was in his shop in Seattle, I witnessed he have some dispute with customers, and on the old Wings500 chat room
33 NASA737 : Thomas and N178UA... I agree... everything reguarding Big Bird and Andrew is circumstantial, but at one point so many coincidences and circumstances b
34 N178UA : In a few days time, I will try to write emails to JAL, JALways, ANA and others try to notify them BB model violation. I am not going to get anything,
35 NASA737 : In a few days time, I will try to write emails to JAL, JALways, ANA and others try to notify them BB model violation. I am not going to get anything,
36 Thomasphoto60 : Look guys we are getting off track here. This is after all a 'photo forum' and I am certain that many here could care less about the politics of model
37 N178UA : Nasa737 I don't care whether those model made 1, or 500 or unlimited and the law works or not, I am going to report them to the airline. Those model m
38 NASA737 : I am doing this for the good of the model hobby. I agree! And I'll stand right behind you.
39 Qantas744 : Could anyone with a little more insight into the die-cast model scene give me an idea about 'Starjets', are they responsible for the copyright infring
40 NASA737 : I believe the fault here lies with EZTOYZ.. they just used your picture because they didn't have one of the model. Your pic isn't used on Starjets web
41 Post contains links Skymonster : Matt, Your problem is nothing to do with Starjets - its Eztoyz, a model shop in San Diego. Eztoyz have done this before, some time ago. They were told
42 Post contains images Aviatsiya : Thomasphoto You seem to be defending Aeroclassics (correct me if I am wrong) in that they do not produce unlicenced models. This is untrue. One need o
43 Post contains links and images Qantas744 : Thanks for the advice, I've mailed them and included an invoice. In the meantime here are just some of the images I found-and I only looked at a few p
44 Flyby : I checked again & noticed eztoyz already changed the picture of some of those! no more problem with them! in the past also their response was very go
45 Qantas744 : Here is their reply: "Hello Mathew, Greeting The picture was emailed by one of our customers to give us an idea for the actual airliner & was posted t
46 Thomasphoto60 : Actually Matt, Despite that I have little love of EZToyz and their questionable history, they did indeed contact me and paid for use of the Air Canada
47 ADG : That's your opinion, ADG and your entitled to it. However let me ask you this, what about all of the other shops that sell BB's (and there are quite a
48 Thomasphoto60 : ADG, You know, I really like your determination. When you get your teeth into a subject, you rarely let go. I have noticed this on other forums as wel
49 ADG : You know, I really like your determination. When you get your teeth into a subject, you rarely let go. I have noticed this on other forums as well. Re
50 N178UA : Thomas Apparently I emailed Mr Klein last time, within a few hrs he emailed back. Seems he is either in US or contactable right now anyhow. I have not
51 Qantas744 : I have accepted the offer I was made for the photograph, I know that some members on this forum won't agree with it but it's up to me what I want to a
52 Jofa : Matt (Qantas744), thanks for the heads up by posting my image, i really appreciate it! -Johan Kellerman
53 Qantas744 : Thanks! However.... Eztoyz have asked that I remove post 43 in this thread-at least one of the photos in question was used legally and to cast aspersi
54 ADG : Matt, That's pretty funny coming from a company that has comitted copyright infringement themselves. I'd be inclined to tell them to "bring it on" as
55 Qantas744 : That's your opinion and you're entited to it-but I'll have to refer you to the wise words of Colin Work in post 11. I can't win here-either it looks l
56 Post contains images Qantas744 : Except something that would be advisable at the moment: Basically I have no evidence to support claims by myself or any other forum members that any o
57 ADG : "Nikon" ADG
58 Post contains images JeffM : "Nikon" as well. Jeff
59 Post contains links and images Aviatsiya : Thomasphoto I have no sincere answer for this, though I did read a comment somewhere that one does not need permission from a so called 'state operate
60 Post contains images ADG : Scotty, Not only that but with the right court order stock can be seized from retail establishments even if *legally* purchased if that stock breaches
61 Post contains images Thomasphoto60 : Aviatsiya, I see what you are talking about. Again that comment to which I referred was made on the GJ club forum some years back in advance of the th
62 Post contains images ADG : Actually, i'd have to say given the success of a certain photographer that Fuji Rox. Nikon lenses are good though ADG
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Does Use Without Permission=ok To Ask For More $$? posted Fri Jan 13 2006 22:31:55 by MattWS
Help Me Find Borders On My Picture Please... posted Wed Sep 20 2006 20:21:55 by Avro85
Company Wanting To Use My Photo posted Sun Jul 30 2006 19:52:03 by Phxplanes
Great Picture... But Image Size? posted Thu Jan 12 2006 19:53:56 by Vasanthd
Help With Website Using Pics Without Permission posted Thu Dec 15 2005 21:42:20 by US333
Your Opinion Of My Picture? posted Fri Oct 7 2005 02:18:19 by Frontiercpt
TV Usage Without Permission In Denver... posted Thu Aug 4 2005 18:28:09 by JeffM
German Spotters Help Pls, My Picture In Focus posted Sat May 28 2005 09:07:04 by Fly-K
Varig Using A.net Phtos Without Permission posted Fri Apr 8 2005 07:24:10 by Quetzalcoatl
Someone Wants To Use My Photo, Your Advice? posted Fri Apr 1 2005 01:22:37 by Aloha717200