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Airline Name Upload Standards II  
User currently offlineInvader From Netherlands, joined Feb 2000, 325 posts, RR: 10
Posted (11 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 6332 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
DATABASE EDITOR

After the discussion a long time ago about the airline name upload standards, here is now finally the definitive version. This is long overdue, and some airline companies and even some of you photographers are regularly asking if we please could combine the different ways of writing or spelling of the name of an airline into one standardized name, for the ease of viewing all the photos with the touch of one button.

Also for the selection of the photos of an airline listed in the airline selection window on the front page, this standardization is an absolute necessity. See e.g. Trans World Express in this window: thanks to a recent standardization effort, all the photos for this "airline" can now be shown touching one button, even with the extra mentioning of the affiliated companies. You will also note that the appropriate photos will come up too under the names of those affiliated companies. This was at first not possible because they had been uploaded by the photographers with a bewildering variety of different versions of the same names.

Several points brought forward in the previous discussions are reflected in these new standards. Although it all looks a bit bureaucratic, there is really no other way to achieve some standardization, and also to diminish the work of the Correction Editor and the Database Standardization Editors. Many more airline names will gradually be added to the upload list to help you selecting the correct one

1. Airline aircraft with titles will be listed with the full airline name, like in this case "Virgin Atlantic Airways”.

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Photo © Michael F. McLaughlin


2. Airline aircraft with titles of two companies will be listed with both companies, whereby the most prominent one comes first, and the minor one will be between brackets, like in this case "Delta Connection (Skywest Airlines)". Although names like "Team Lufthansa" are not really "companies", on Airliners.net we consider them as companies.

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Photo © James Richard Covington, Jr


3. Airline aircraft with titles of one company, but owned by and/or operated by another airline company whose titles are not worn, will be listed with both companies, but with the untitled one between brackets, like in this case "America West Express (Mesa Airlines. Leasing companies, banks, trust companies and such will not be listed, unless they are painted on the aircraft.

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Photo © James Richard Covington, Jr


4. Airline aircraft which are untitled will be listed as "Untitled" with the airline name between brackets, like here "Untitled (TMA - Trans Mediterranean Airlines)", or "Untitled (America West Express (Mesa Airlines))".

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Photo © Frank Schaefer



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Photo © Stephen Dobbins


5. Untitled aircraft not operated by an airline or charter company, but owned by private persons, business companies, flying clubs, aircraft sale companies, broker companies, etc. will be listed as "Untitled". If you want to supply owner or operator details these shall be listed in the Remarks field.

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Photo © John Bixby



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Photo © Alexander Vervoort



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Photo © Europix


6. Aircraft not operated by airlines or charter companies, but nevertheless carrying owner or operator titles, will be listed with that name, like in this case "Waterford Aero Club".

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Photo © Peter Vercruijsse


7. Aircraft which are currently sometimes listed by the photographer as "Ex airline XXX" will be listed as under points 1 to 10 whichever is appropriate, with the ex details in the Remarks field.

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Photo © Frank Schaefer



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Photo © John P. Stewart


8. Military aircraft will be listed as "country name, space, dash, space, service", like here "Argentina - Air Force", and "Denmark - Army". Most of the names are in the upload list. Do not use air force names like "Royal Air Force", and do not add unit details to the name like "USA - Air Force 55TAS", these belong in the Remarks field.

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Photo © Daniel R Carneiro



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Photo © Peter Vercruijsse


9. Government aircraft WITHOUT military roundels AND carrying a civil registration, will be listed as under points 1 to 10, whichever is appropriate and on the second upload page the category "government" has to be selected, as here for the B767 (no roundels and a civil registration).
Government aircraft WITH military roundels AND/OR a non-civil registration, will be listed as under point 8, and not the category "government" has to be selected, but the category "military", as here for the "France - Air Force" DC-8 (military roundels and a non-civil registration), and the "USA - Air Force" B707 (no roundels, but a non-civil registration).

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Photo © Peter Unmuth - Vienna Aviation Photography



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Photo © Mike Bertrand



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Photo © Glenn Alderton


10. When distinctive variations of airline names are used, they will be listed with these distinctive names as like here resp. "KLM Asia", "Lufthansa Express", or "British Airways Manchester".

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Photo © Anton Pettersson



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Photo © Frank Schaefer



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Photo © Frank Schaefer


11. When the airline name has the additional title "Cargo", they will be listed like that, like here "British Airways Cargo".

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Photo © Eduard Marmet


12. Untitled aircraft of fractional ownership companies can (when you know the name) be listed the same way as for airline aircraft under point 4, like here "Untitled (Flight Options)".

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Photo © Darcy Stevens


13. Aircraft in special color schemes like "Wunala Dreaming" here, or promoting an event, like the second pic "Salt Lake 2002" will not have those paint schemes mentioned in the airline name, but they can be mentioned in the Remarks field. These aircraft will thus be listed as just "Qantas" and "Delta Connection (ASA - Atlantic Southeast Airlines)" respectively. On the second upload page, select the Category “Special”.

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Photo © Craig Murray



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Photo © Tommy Simms


14. Airline aircraft with (additional) titles promoting a non-airline business, like the McDonald's photo below, will be listed with the airline name only (like here Crossair), even when the airline name is not painted on the aircraft. The promoted company can be listed in the Remarks. Additionally, the category "Special" has to be selected on the second upload page.

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Photo © Chris Thomson


For non-airline aircraft with promotion titles, these promotion titles will be listed as the "airline" name, like here "Fuji". For non-airline aircraft the category "Special" may NOT be chosen, because that category is only for airliners (as was always noted in the Help item for this category).

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Photo © Michael R. Tomkins


15. The database standardization editors can make exceptions to the above standards when a special situation occurs. An example is e.g.this BEX - Business Express aircraft. Although the titles "BEX - Business Express" are bigger than the titles "Delta Connection", and thus the airline should be listed according to point 2 as "BEX - Business Express (Delta Connection)", the names have been reversed here to "Delta Connection (BEX - Business Express)" to be consistent with all the other Delta Connection titles.

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Photo © Torsten Maiwald


16. Aircraft painted with titles to commemorate an older airline name shall be listed with those titles, with the real company between brackets, like here “Trans Canada Air Lines (Air Canada)”.

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Photo © Kevin Wachter


The Help file on the upload page will be amended in the near future.
Some of the airline names on the upload page have already been overhauled, and more will gradually follow.
The airline names on the 325.000 photos which are currently in the database will be gradually overhauled as well (a small part has been done already).

Peter Vercruijsse
Chief Database Editor



10 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSkymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (11 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 6052 times:

Peter,

I think its great that we have these issues clarified - thank you to you and your team for sorting out what must have been some very complex issues. However, with respect, I think you are placing quite a bit of reliance on the photographer to understand and in some cases research who really owns or operates and airplane. For example:

  • The Air China 747SP in the desert (point 5) is still in basic Air China colours. Lets say for example it is owned by a leasing company, it should be recorded as "Untitled", possibly with the name of the leasing company in the remarks. However, its going to be difficult for some photographers to determine that it is in fact owned by a leasing company rather than still being owned by Air China, and they may just put "Untitled (Air China)" instead


  • Whilst I accept that your standardisation team may hoover up discrepancies that arise from this policy, could you please suggest what screening standards should be applied (e.g. whether to accept or reject), especially in cases similar to that I have outlined above when in fact the screeners may know less about the ownership of the airplane than the (possibly erroneous) photographer does themselves.

    Thanks,

    Andy


    User currently offlineInvader From Netherlands, joined Feb 2000, 325 posts, RR: 10
    Reply 2, posted (11 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 6018 times:
    AIRLINERS.NET CREW
    DATABASE EDITOR

    Hi Andy,

    I think we make it easier for the photographer, because he basically has only to list what he sees on the aircraft. If he knows more about leasing and such, very good, but we are not going to ask that from everybody.

    And if an aircraft is untitled, and you are not sure about the owner, just list it as "Untitled", and that's it! You may optionally list details about leasing companies in the Remarks if you wish, but it is not a must. Most people won't know, so we won't ask.

    These titles should not be a reason for a reject in my opinion, except maybe for air forces, which have a very simple to understand standard name, which in most cases is listed on the upload page. Also, when a photographer uploads a photo with a common airline name like "Virgin Atlantic" while the screener knows that it is listed on the upload list as "Virgin Atlantic Airways", then that could be a reason for a reject. But in general I wouldn't make a problem about it.

    Regards,
    Peter Vercruijsse
    Chief Database Editor


    User currently offlineSonic From Lithuania, joined Jan 2000, 1670 posts, RR: 1
    Reply 3, posted (11 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 5954 times:

    I am saying this for 3rd or 4th time in these forums (for one year or so), but no one cares.

    Lietuva, Air Lithuania, Lietuva Airlines and Aviakompanija Lietuva (not sure if this name is used anywhere in a.net) is the same airline. Please standartise this up under one of the names (best would be Air Lithuania (English name) or Aviakomanija Lietuva (full Lithaunian name).

    The history is so that airline firstly used last word of Lithuanian name ("Lietuva") in their color scheme, later changed this to "Air Lithuania", full English name. Thus various phographers of a.net, who doesn't knows real name, used "Lietuva", "Lietuva Airlines" names in airline category.

    BTW, how are airlines with their names spelled in different languages dealed? For example, JAT used Jugoslovenski Aerotransport name and now uses Yugoslavian Airlines (both names means the same in different langueges). I believe Swiss now also uses it's name spelled differently on different aircraft. Which name would be used in such case?

    Also, what about untitled flying aircraft, which are left untitled for economical purposes? Example - one or more of Air Baltic Avro RJ-70s .


    User currently offlineCicadajet From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
    Reply 4, posted (11 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 5894 times:

    Great effort Peter. Appreciated as always.

    Good call with the Blimps btw.

    Tom


    User currently offlinePUnmuth@VIE From Austria, joined Aug 2000, 4163 posts, RR: 54
    Reply 5, posted (11 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 5840 times:

    Mmmmh... points 4 5 and 12 look confusing to me when you compare them
    ---
    4. Airline aircraft which are untitled will be listed as "Untitled" with the airline name between brackets, like here "Untitled (TMA - Trans Mediterranean Airlines)", or "Untitled (America West Express (Mesa Airlines))".
    5. Untitled aircraft not operated by an airline or charter company, but owned by private persons, business companies, flying clubs, aircraft sale companies, broker companies, etc. will be listed as "Untitled". If you want to supply owner or operator details these shall be listed in the Remarks field
    12. Untitled aircraft of fractional ownership companies can (when you know the name) be listed the same way as for airline aircraft under point 4, like here "Untitled (Flight Options)".
    ---

    wouldnt it be more standard if point 5 would be

    ---
    5. Untitled aircraft not operated by an airline or charter company, but owned by private persons, business companies, flying clubs, aircraft sale companies, broker companies, etc. will be listed (when you know the name) the same way like here "Untitled (Scottish and Newcastle Brewrey)".
    ---

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    Photo © Europix



    Peter



    -
    User currently offlineInvader From Netherlands, joined Feb 2000, 325 posts, RR: 10
    Reply 6, posted (11 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 5701 times:
    AIRLINERS.NET CREW
    DATABASE EDITOR

    Sonic:

    > I am saying this for 3rd or 4th time in these forums (for one year or so), but no one cares.

    Unfortunately I don't have the time to read all the messages in all the forums, doing that there would be no more updates to the database. So, when you have something to remark like in your message, send an email via the "Contact us" button on the lower right of the front page. But don't expect things to be handled immediately, because there is always a large backlog of work.

    > Also, what about untitled flying aircraft, which are left untitled for economical purposes? Example - one or more of Air Baltic Avro RJ-70s

    That is clearly stated above in the Upload Standards!
    For the rest, when an airline name is available on the upload list, ALWAYS use that name without changing any letter or space, otherwise search criteria might not work.

    Peter U:
    > wouldnt it be more standard if point 5 would be
    5. Untitled aircraft not operated by an airline or charter company, but owned by private persons, business companies, flying clubs, aircraft sale companies, broker companies, etc. will be listed (when you know the name) the same way like here "Untitled (Scottish and Newcastle Brewrey)".


    The original idea was to list ALL untitled aircraft as "Untitled", which would have been an easy and consistent method. But after a lot of discussion this wasn't found to be a good solution, because untitled aircraft of airlines wouldn't appear in photo searches. And many companies, viewers, and photographers want that. So the idea was changed to include airline names for untitled aircraft between brackets.

    For non-airline aircraft the situation is different, because most of the photographers don't know where to find the owner names, and for many aircraft they are not available anywhere. And even if you know an owner, for private and corporate planes they change so regularly that it is often impossible to accurately find out who is the owner at the time of your photo. You might have found somewhere that the owner of the Citation above is "Scottish and Newcastle Brewery", but can you expect that info from the average photographer? So, only a very small percentage of owner names would be filled-in, and it doesn't serve much purpose then.

    And who is interested that a Mr.Johnson is the owner of one Cessna 172, or that Banking Trust 435 Inc is the owner of some Learjet? It is of course not forbidden to supply that kind of info, but then please put it in the Remarks.

    Here are a few random pictures for which you may try to list the owners: Big grin

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    Photo © Alan Brown
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    Photo © Paul Chandler



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    Photo © Paulo Carvalho
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    Photo © Felipe Escalona



    Regards,
    Peter Vercruijsse
    Chief Database Editor



    User currently offlineRes From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 417 posts, RR: 1
    Reply 7, posted (11 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5554 times:

    Just so I know for my own good, I'd appreciate feedback on proper naming of some cases, being that I mostly photograph privately owned aircraft.
    In this case,
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    Photo © Tim Lachenmaier

    this cessna (owned by Sawyer Aviation Training Center) would be labled as "Untitle" and if i wish, I could include "Sawyer Aviation Training Center" in the remark, correct?
    If I have anymore questions, I'll ask.

    Thanks,

    Tim



    FLY NAVY
    User currently offlineInvader From Netherlands, joined Feb 2000, 325 posts, RR: 10
    Reply 8, posted (11 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 5527 times:
    AIRLINERS.NET CREW
    DATABASE EDITOR

    Tim:

    Fully correct, only "Untitle" should be "Untitled".

    Peter Vercruijsse
    Chief database Editor


    User currently offlineRes From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 417 posts, RR: 1
    Reply 9, posted (11 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 5501 times:

    oops. no problem. I must have had a candy bar in one hand or something.

    Tim



    FLY NAVY
    User currently offlineJwenting From Netherlands, joined Apr 2001, 10213 posts, RR: 18
    Reply 10, posted (11 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 5374 times:

    I've always taken the field to indicate the operator or owner, and not what's painted on it.
    I do remember in the past some photos being changed because the photographer put in what was printed on the fuselage when in fact it was operated by someone else...

    Let's take
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    Photo © J.T. Wenting

    as an example. Doen't list an airline name, but people in the know recognise it as El Al Cargo (Cargo Airlines).

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    Photo © J.T. Wenting

    also leaves little option for discussion, as there is only one operator of 747s as freighters with aircraft registered in Israel, which is El Al Cargo (Cargo Airlines).

    Similarly (again El Al Cargo)

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    Photo © Brian Stevenson - SPOT THIS!
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    Photo © Yevgeny Pashnin


    but also

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    Photo © Tim de Groot
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    Photo © Europix

    (here there are very small titles visible, but unless you have a very high-res picture or a good pair of binoculars they're impossible to read).
    Atlas is removing titles from ever more aircraft for leasing them out...

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    Photo © Carlos Borda
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    Photo © Tamsin Zvereva



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    Photo © Francisco José Jurado Ariza
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    Photo © Francisco José Jurado Ariza



    For other airlines, titles can be removed temporarilly while an aircraft is awaiting painting after delivery:

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    Photo © Patrick Lutz
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    Photo © Nicolas Kersting


    which became a bit later:

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    Photo © Daniel Werner
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    Photo © Ben Pritchard




    As there is already an option to mark an aircraft as untitled on the upload page, why is the same needed again in the livery description?



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