WestJetYQQ From Canada, joined Jan 2007, 2986 posts, RR: 5 Reply 1, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 7308 times:
I'd have to agree on that one. If you count Mexico as Int'l as opposed to Trans-border, there are probably some pretty profitable routes into Mexico city from LAX or DFW.
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SESGDL From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3385 posts, RR: 11 Reply 2, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 7270 times:
JFK-LHR is not one of the most profitable, just look at the fares. JFK-LHR is so competitive with AA, VG, BA, and to LGW DL and CO that it's no longer the profit maker that it once was.
I'd venture to guess that the most profitable are routes with little competition like JFK-BOM, EWR-TLV, EWR-PEK, EWR-HKG, and others similar to them.
Burnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7411 posts, RR: 9 Reply 3, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 7249 times:
I would say most things to Asia are more profitable, I consistantly find fares from the US to LHR for $200 plus taxes.
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Steeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 8809 posts, RR: 19 Reply 6, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 7134 times:
Quoting SESGDL (Reply 2): JFK-LHR is not one of the most profitable, just look at the fares. JFK-LHR is so competitive with AA, VG, BA, and to LGW DL and CO that it's no longer the profit maker that it once was.
Especially when B6 recently offered round trips for under US $200 including taxes??? I'd say that route be saturated...
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AirlineEcon From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 119 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 7111 times:
This is a no brainer the most profitable intl routes from the US have to be anything to Australia.
FreequentFlier From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 804 posts, RR: 6 Reply 8, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 7094 times:
I'd be curious to see how successful DL's African NSs are since they're not particularly well-served from the US. As for JFK-LHR, its probably profitable but with the intense competition and high tax environment, its not the money maker it once was.
Femialpha From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 66 posts, RR: 0 Reply 9, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 7042 times:
Quoting FreequentFlier (Reply 8): I'd be curious to see how successful DL's African NSs are since they're not particularly well-served from the US.
LOS happens to be one of BA's most profitable routes despite the harsh working operating environment.
DL has an opportunity to make a lot from the underserved African markets. The key is putting people who understand how to run a successful business in these areas. Too often, American companies do not adapt well to local environments. My company (non-aviation) is learning that the hard way in Europe.
Avianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5857 posts, RR: 40 Reply 10, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 6941 times:
Quoting SESGDL (Reply 2): JFK-LHR is not one of the most profitable, just look at the fares. JFK-LHR is so competitive with AA, VG, BA, and to LGW DL and CO that it's no longer the profit maker that it once was.
every checked the first-class prices..... on AA, BA ?? and the flights are mostly also in First full... defenetaly JFK-LHR is a money maker...
Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 6): Especially when B6 recently offered round trips for under US $200 including taxes??? I'd say that route be saturated...
since when B6 offers flights outside the American continent?
Malaysia From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 3183 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 6787 times:
Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 6): Especially when B6 recently offered round trips for under US $200 including taxes??? I'd say that route be saturated...
lol, I think he meant JFK-SOCAL
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Airbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 6875 posts, RR: 7 Reply 14, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 6614 times:
I would not put Asia at the top of the list because any revenue gets highly diluted by the cost of servicing such a long distance destination. You need more aircraft, more fuel, more crew to carry the same number of passengers. LHR, no way, too much competition on that route. LHR is often the cheapest trans-atlantic fare from anywhere in the US. I would have to say, the most profitable has to be a route to a "secondary" market. Something like TLV, MUC, GRU. As AirlineEcon said, I too suspect that of all the major markets, SYD is probably a very profitable route too because of the compelte lack of competition.
777gk From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1641 posts, RR: 20 Reply 16, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 6534 times:
For Continental, IAH-LGW, EWR-TLV, EWR-ZRH, EWR-GVA, EWR-BRU, IAH-GRU, IAH-NRT, IAH-EZE are very strong performers.
Flights to Asia are generally profitable, but do not have the same margins as our most lucrative shorter-haul international markets. As has been mentioned, the operating cost of a 12-14 hour flight is quite a bit greater than your average 6-8 hour transatlantic crossing. Additional crew, fuel, meals, and duty time make these flights a very expensive proposition.
Avianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5857 posts, RR: 40 Reply 17, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 6428 times:
Quoting Airbazar (Reply 14): LHR, no way, too much competition on that route. LHR is often the cheapest trans-atlantic fare from anywhere in the US. I would have to say,
as mentioned before, first class is ofen very full booked on the route... .and you pay over 12.000 USD per ticket just for a 7 hour flight... not bad yield for such a short long-haul flight.... with this prices you can even sell some cheap eco tickets for 250 USD return.
Quoting Airbazar (Reply 14): I too suspect that of all the major markets, SYD is probably a very profitable route too because of the compelte lack of competition.
LAX-SYD is twice as long but costs only 6000 USD more than JFK-LHR, you need more personal to run, more aircrafts and the aircrafts are sitting all the day long in LAX....
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31117 posts, RR: 74 Reply 18, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 6383 times:
Quoting Avianca (Reply 17):
LAX-SYD is twice as long but costs only 6000 USD more than JFK-LHR, you need more personal to run, more aircrafts and the aircrafts are sitting all the day long in LAX....
The biggest costs involved in flying a plane are take off and landing. The longer a flight is, the less those fixed costs are on a per/mile basis.
Also, while nobody can know what the most profitable routes are, they certainly aren't routes like Los Angeles-Tokyo and New York City-London, to markets with plenty of frequency, plenty of compieition, and plenty of flights to other markets.
Think markets with limited airlines (Bolivia), limited entry (Argentina), limited frequencies (Brazil, South Africa), etc., etc. American Airlines' most profitable London route isn't New York City, Chicago, or Los Angeles, it is Miami, which has less frequencies and less compieition than the others. A market like New York City-London, with nine airlines and 30+ daily flights probably doesn't even break into the top twenty five.
WJ From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2006, 339 posts, RR: 0 Reply 19, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 6335 times:
Quoting AirlineEcon (Reply 7): This is a no brainer the most profitable intl routes from the US have to be anything to Australia.
That's just plain wrong.
The most profitable routes, domestic or international, depend on cost and revenue per seat/mile. In effect, yield. If you can charge $300 on an LGA-YMX hop, its is far more profitable than charging $1200 on an LAX-NRT which is 9-10 times longer. Flying from the US to Mexico resort town destinations can cost up to $700 RT in coach for 2-3 hour flights using good sized jets (757, A320 etc) with relatively low operating cost. Those would seem to make sense as the highest yield segments out there internationaly.
Avianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5857 posts, RR: 40 Reply 20, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 6306 times:
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 18): The biggest costs involved in flying a plane are take off and landing. The longer a flight is, the less those fixed costs are on a per/mile basis.
but you have to calculate the complete turnaround, if the aircraft sits 18 hours on ground like QF do in FRA the fixed costs per mile basis will be very high...
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 18): Think markets with limited airlines (Bolivia), limited entry (Argentina), limited frequencies (Brazil, South Africa), etc., etc. American Airlines' most profitable London route isn't New York City, Chicago, or Los Angeles, it is Miami, which has less frequencies and less compieition than the others. A market like New York City-London, with nine airlines and 30+ daily flights probably doesn't even break into the top twenty five.
as mentioned before LHR-JFK is a money maker do all the business travell were the tarifs are very high...
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31117 posts, RR: 74 Reply 21, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 6296 times:
Quoting Avianca (Reply 20): but you have to calculate the complete turnaround, if the aircraft sits 18 hours on ground like QF do in FRA the fixed costs per mile basis will be very high...
Yes, that is true. Though long ground time is the exception, not the rule.
Quoting Avianca (Reply 20):
as mentioned before LHR-JFK is a money maker do all the business travell were the tarifs are very high...
Of course it is a money maker, on an absolute basis. Even with all the business traffic, I doubt it is among the most profitable when you look at profitable on a per/flight basis. There is too much compieition. AA, on a per/flight basis, makes more money on Dallas-, Miami-, and Los Angeles-London than New York City-London.
Avianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5857 posts, RR: 40 Reply 23, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 6258 times:
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21): Yes, that is true. Though long ground time is the exception, not the rule.
I think we have a long ground time on many markets today, as many of the Europe/Brazil - Europe/SouthAfrica. US/Brazil - US/Argentina - US-Down-Under, Europe-Down-Under etc...
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21): Of course it is a money maker, on an absolute basis. Even with all the business traffic, I doubt it is among the most profitable when you look at profitable on a per/flight basis. There is too much compieition. AA, on a per/flight basis, makes more money on Dallas-, Miami-, and Los Angeles-London than New York City-London.
yes would be very intresting to know the exact data... but I still think that AA is earning more money on per flight basis on the JFK, even if the LHR-MIA flights have very high first-class fares... for example.
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31117 posts, RR: 74 Reply 24, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 6246 times:
Quoting Avianca (Reply 23):
yes would be very intresting to know the exact data... but I still think that AA is earning more money on per flight basis on the JFK, even if the LHR-MIA flights have very high first-class fares... for example.
No, they aren't. In 2005, on a per/flight basis, ORD-MAN, MIA-LHR, and DFW-ZRH were the top three performers to Europe. This info was leaked, and has been posted on these boards and others.
a.
25 Kanebear: Just pax or pax and cargo? Big difference there. You can have a 777 go out with 15 people on board that is making a fortune from the cargo below.
26 Bimmerkid19: MSP-NRT on NW ... hmm... 2 flights in the Summer and 1 flight in the winter... and they are the only operators of this route at present, although ther
27 Steeler83: DAMNN!!! I did this in another thread, too, but I caught meself making that mistake then. I only noticed this one just now!!! I was referring to BRIT
28 United319: What about the HNL-Asia routes (unless were only counting the 48 contiguous United States). Considering the extremely high Asian population in Hawaii
29 MCOflyer: I would think IAD- KWI for UA. MCOflyer
30 LAXdude1023: The fact that they are the only operaters of the route makes the route more profitable.
31 UA772IAD: I would also add: SFO/ORD/IAD-FRA SFO-SYD I believe HNL-NRT/KIX are also quite profitable For AA S. American routes for sure For US probably their Ca
32 MAH4546: US' Latin American network does not extend past Guatemala City and resorts in Mexico and Costa Rica.
33 Dimondan: It has to be anything flying to Las Vegas
35 CPT523: SAA's IAD - JNB would my guess. Near monoploy on route. (Delta just started ATL-JNB, so that must show how good their code share with SAA was before S
36 CXfirst: As well as the upcoming IAD-PEK. -CXfirst
37 Airbazar: No one is arguing that it's not profitable, just that it's not one of the most profitable. With something like 20 daily flights on 5? different airli
38 IADLHR: It would seem so but I think that LAS might be very, very low yield. Otherwise, UA, at least would not be flying Ted to LAS.
39 B777A340Fan: I agree, especially untapped markets such as India and China.
40 AirlineEcon: We don't have a consistent definition of "most profitable" Is it total profits? or some measure of profits per (something) profits per take off, profi
41 FLYYUL: How do you determine profitability? By Margin % (Percentage difference between Total Revenue and Total Cost excluding overhead) or By absolutes (Total
42 Gr8Circle: I wouldn't exactly call India an "untapped" market.....growing, yes.... DL, NW, CO and AA already fly drirect to BOM/DEL/BLR and AI flies to JFK/EWR/
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