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KLM World "Business"  
User currently offlinegasman From New Zealand, joined Mar 2004, 862 posts, RR: 0
Posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2459 times:

I've never flown this product before, but may have to for convenience reasons in the near future. I'm used to the J class offings of SIA, NZ and QF.

From what I can see, KLMs product looks well below par. Seats that don't go to 180 degrees, smallish IFE, a 2-3-2 config in a 777..... well below what one has come to expect from a Business Class product. Are my impressions correct? - or do they somehow manage to provide a good experience in other ways?

If not, I think I'll forgoe the convenience factor, and fly SIA.

Cheers

[Edited 2010-08-10 19:37:22]

8 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25652 posts, RR: 22
Reply 1, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2455 times:

While KLM's inflight J product may not quite come up to the standards of certain other carriers, you may also find that their fares are lower. I've often found KL's business class fares very attractive. It's also hard to beat the convenience of their AMS hub among other major connecting hubs in Europe. Only MUC and ZRH are better in my opinion. There are more factors at play when choosing an airline than just the seat.

[Edited 2010-08-10 19:29:36]

User currently offlineairbuseric From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 4273 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2444 times:

Crew is very attentive and friendly, open minded also. Many passenger like that style.
While IFE might be a smaller screen, the offering is AVOD and up to date movies and audio.

Meals are a hit or miss. KLM is known for frozen meals (for stock) and therefore cannot be 100% said to be 'fresh'. Meals are not prepared on the same day of the flight. Some people might taste this.

I don't like the seats. When you put some magazines/newspapers and a small bottle of water in the seatpocket in front of you, and that person is reclining the seat, everything falls out.



"The whole world steps aside for the man who knows where he is going"
User currently offlineairbuseric From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 4273 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2440 times:

btw, in case you need a feeder KLM flight within Europe to connect on your longhaul flight, beware that on the Europe Select (Business Class), all seats are for sale. That means, same seats as Y-class, and also the middle seat might be occupied by a passenger (e.g. on the B737's). This is a very weak point on KLM's shorthaul premium product.


"The whole world steps aside for the man who knows where he is going"
User currently offlinegasman From New Zealand, joined Mar 2004, 862 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2440 times:

Thanks. Is there a product upgrade even in the pipeline? Seems to me they'll have to do something, and soon, if they are to remain competitive.

User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15781 posts, RR: 27
Reply 5, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 2427 times:

Quoting gasman (Thread starter):
From what I can see, KLMs product looks well below par. Seats that don't go to 180 degrees, smallish IFE

The seat is somewhat subpar, but from what I've read the soft product is as good as any. Plus, AMS is supposedly a nice airport to use.

If you want a better seat, you can always use Air France, but that will most likely entail fighting your way through CDG. Or you could catch KLM's BBJ service to IAH and connect from there if you are headed to North America.

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 1):
Only MUC and ZRH are better in my opinion.

I definitely agree with ZRH but I've not been to MUC or AMS. I would add T5 at LHR to that list too.

Quoting airbuseric (Reply 2):
I don't like the seats. When you put some magazines/newspapers and a small bottle of water in the seatpocket in front of you, and that person is reclining the seat, everything falls out.

I can deal with a seat that is at an angle, but I really don't like a business class seat where reclining takes up another passenger's space. The hard shell really makes it nicer.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25652 posts, RR: 22
Reply 6, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2275 times:

Quoting airbuseric (Reply 3):
btw, in case you need a feeder KLM flight within Europe to connect on your longhaul flight, beware that on the Europe Select (Business Class), all seats are for sale. That means, same seats as Y-class, and also the middle seat might be occupied by a passenger (e.g. on the B737's). This is a very weak point on KLM's shorthaul premium product.

I agree, except the first half dozen or more rows on KL 737s used for their Europe Select product have at least 2 more inches of seat pitsh (34 inches I believe) than the rest of the Y cabin. When I travel Y on KL 737s I always select a seat as close to the front as possible. More often than not the Europe Select cabin won't be using all the rows with the increased pitch and you'll get one of the extra legroom rows.


User currently offlineJRadier From Netherlands, joined Sep 2004, 4703 posts, RR: 50
Reply 7, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2229 times:

Quoting gasman (Reply 4):
Thanks. Is there a product upgrade even in the pipeline? Seems to me they'll have to do something, and soon, if they are to remain competitive.

KLM does not make money from being a high quality airline, but rather from using the resources very efficiently. This shown in aircraft utilization, no really high quality (SQ) product offerings etc. This means that they are not able to attract very high fares, but given their market this is the best situation for them. The current seats are quite new (only the 77W Business seats are newer) so I do not expect a new product any time soon.



For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
User currently offlineweb500sjc From United States of America, joined Sep 2009, 749 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 2196 times:
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you also get the special houses/ bottles of alcohol- i don't think you can open it- but the houses look really nice


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