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Summer 2011 North Atlantic Flights Offer Data  
User currently offlineBrusselsSouth From Belgium, joined Aug 2001, 628 posts, RR: 5
Posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 7463 times:

This thread contains a simple, non professional analysis of (eastbound) North Atlantic flights for an arbitrary day of the Summer 2011 schedule. The day chosen is Tuesday, July 5, 2011.

Disclaimer

In this thread, a North Atlantic flight is arbitrarily defined as a flight originating from one country from the 'West' country list, and arriving in one country from the 'East' country list. For multiple stops flights, only the 'transatlantic' portion is considered. ONLY EASTBOUND FLIGHTS ARE CONSIDERED IN THIS THREAD.

'West' countries : Anguilla, Antigua & Barbuda, Bahamas, Barbados, British Virgin Islands, Canada, Cayman Islands, Costa Rica, Cuba, Dominica, Dominican Republic, El Salvador, Grenada, Guadeloupe, Guatemala, Haiti, Honduras, Jamaica, Martinique, Mexico, Montserrat, Netherlands Antilles, Nicaragua, Panama, St Kitts & Nevis, St Lucia, St Vincent & the Grenadines, Trinidad & Tobago, USA (including Puerto Rico), Turks & Caicos Islands, US Virgin Islands.

'East' countries : Albania, Algeria, Austria, Belarus, Belgium, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Bulgaria, Cape Verde, Chad, Croatia, Czech Republic, Cyprus, Denmark (including Greenlan), Egypt, Estonia, Finland, France, FYR of Macedonia, Gambia, Germany, Greece, Guinea Bissau, Hungary, Iceland, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Kosovo, Jordan, Latvia, Libya, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Mali, Malta, Mauritania, Moldova, Montenegro, Morocco, Netherlands, Niger, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Russia, Senegal, Serbia, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Sudan, Syria, Tunisia, Turkey, UK, Ukraine.

Overseas territories/regions are considered as separate countries (e.g. Guadeloupe, Martinique). Although not correct, 'Netherlands Antilles' include Aruba, Bonaire, Curacao and St Maarten for simplification.

I tried to list all North Atlantic flights operating on July 5, 2011. I don't mean to have them all, especially for charter-like airlines. You are welcome to indicate missing flights. By chosing that particular day, some flights operating on a less than weekly basis are NOT included (e.g. CUN-LGW(BA), KIN-LGW(BA), LAX-MAD(IB),MEX-LHR(BA), MBJ-LGW(BA), YUL-AMM(RJ), PTY-MAD(IB), PUJ-LGW(BA), SJU-LGW(BA), SDQ-MAD(IB), DFW-FRA(LH), EWR-OPO(TP), EWR-WAW(LO), JFK-SNN(EI), MIA-DUS(LH), ORD-AMS(UA), ORD-BRU(UA), YUL-ATH(AC), YUL-BCN(AC), YYZ-ATH(AC), YYZ-IST(TK), YHZ-KEF(FI), ...). Also, some airlines operate radically different schedules depending on the day of the week (e.g. most charter airlines, Air Transat).

The number of seats offered is based on seat plans published by airlines / other websites. This figure is approximate because different cabin configurations can exist for a single aicraft/airline combination, and because airlines do not always indicate the exact version of the aircraft used (e.g. A330-200 or A330-300).

My full list can be downloaded here (PDF file).

> Total North Atlantic eastbound flights : 554
> Total North Atlantic eastbound seats offered : 145.860

The opening post of this thread is divided in :

Opening post :

This introduction / disclaimer

Reply 1 :

A. Top 30 departure METRO AREAS by seats offered
B. Top 30 departure AIRPORTS by seats offered
C. Top 30 destination METRO AREAS by seats offered
D. Top 30 destination AIRPORTS by seats offered
E. Top 30 eastbound city (metro areas) pairs by seats offered
F. Top 20 airlines by seats offered
G. Eastbound seats offered by global alliance
H. Eastbound seats offered by departure country
I. Eastbound seats offered by destination country
J. Top 30 eastbound country pairs by seats offered

Reply 2 :

K. Top 30 departure METRO AREAS by flights offered
L. Top 30 departure AIRPORTS by flights offered
M. Top 30 destination METRO AREAS by flights offered
N. Top 30 destination AIRPORTS by flights offered
O. Top 30 eastbound city (metro areas) pairs by flights offered
P. Top 20 airlines by flights offered
Q. Eastbound flights offered by global alliance
R. Eastbound flights offered by aircraft generic type
S. Eastbound flights offered by departure country
T. Eastbound flights offered by destination country
U. Top 30 eastbound country pairs by flights offered

Reply 3 :

Trivia

I would have liked to add graphs and to analyze the data a bit more, but I don't have time to do that now. I hope you'll find reading those numbers interesting. I'm looking forward for your comments/discussions.

And to finish, a word about presentation : because of the way A.net processes the text in the posts, my data are not correctly aligned (unless I use HTML tables, but I don't have time now). I hope it's still easily readable. Also, there were some problems with the way A.net prepares the HTML code for the airport/airline code tooltips, I am forced to put extra spaces in some airlines / airport codes (e.g. AA, UA, FCO, ...).

Regards
BrusselsSouth

20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineBrusselsSouth From Belgium, joined Aug 2001, 628 posts, RR: 5
Reply 1, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 7463 times:

A. Top 30 departure METRO AREAS by seats offered

1 NYC 37.475
2 YYZ 10.230
3 CHI 8.816
4 WAS 8.026
5 YUL 6.634
6 BOS 6.582
7 ATL 6.214
8 LAX 5.964
9 PHL 4.983
10 SFO 4.390
11 MIA 4.336
12 IAH 3.028
13 MEX 2.919
14 MCO 2.849
15 DTW 2.649
16 CUN 2.054
17 YVR 1.949
18 FDF 1.890
.. PTP 1.890
20 CLT 1.823
21 DFW 1.733
22 SEA 1.521
23 HAV 1.490
24 MSP 1.450
25 YYC 1.325
26 CUR 971
27 BGI 939
28 LAS 866
29 PUJ 856
30 UVF 653

B. Top 30 departure AIRPORTS by seats offered

1 JFK 24.947
2 EWR 12.528
3 YYZ 10.230
4 ORD 8.816
5 IAD 7.834
6 YUL 6.634
7 BOS 6.582
8 ATL 6.214
9 LAX 5.964
10 PHL 4.983
11 SFO 4.390
12 MIA 4.336
13 IAH 3.028
14 MEX 2.919
15 DTW 2.649
16 CUN 2.054
17 YVR 1.949
18 MCO 1.920
19 FDF 1.890
.. PTP 1.890
21 CLT 1.823
22 DFW 1.733
23 SEA 1.521
24 HAV 1.490
25 MSP 1.450
26 YYC 1.325
27 CUR 971
28 BGI 939
29 SFB 929
30 LAS 866

C. Top 30 destination METRO AREAS by seats offered

1 LON 37.034
2 PAR 21.207
3 FRA 15.512
4 AMS 11.305
5 MAD 7.325
6 FCO 5.219
7 MUC 4.195
8 ZRH 3.741
9 TLV 3.573
10 DUB 3.176
11 MAN 2.953
12 BRU 2.890
13 MOW 1.960
14 BCN 1.935
15 IST 1.775
16 DUS 1.567
17 CPH 1.516
18 KEF 1.380
19 GLA 1.339
20 ATH 1.234
21 MXP 1.080
22 LIS 888
23 GVA 865
24 ARN 863
25 SNN 837
26 AMM 762
27 VIE 757
28 CMN 756
29 WAW 735
30 BER 694

D. Top 30 destination AIRPORTS by seats offered

1 LHR 29.794
2 CDG 17.259
3 FRA 15.512
4 AMS 11.305
5 MAD 7.325
6 LGW 7.176
7 FCO 5.219
8 MUC 4.195
9 ORY 3.948
10 ZRH 3.741
11 TLV 3.573
12 DUB 3.176
13 MAN 2.953
14 BRU 2.890
15 BCN 1.935
16 IST 1.775
17 DUS 1.567
18 CPH 1.516
19 KEF 1.380
20 GLA 1.339
21 ATH 1.234
22 SVO 1.193
23 MXP 1.080
24 LIS 888
25 GVA 865
26 ARN 863
27 SNN 837
28 DME 767
29 AMM 762
30 VIE 757

E. Top 30 eastbound city (metro areas) pairs by seats offered

1 NYC-LON 7.375
2 NYC-PAR 3.157
3 YYZ-LON 2.915
4 NYC-TLV 2.591
5 LAX-LON 2.536
6 NYC-FRA 2.266
7 CHI-LON 2.252
8 BOS-LON 2.206
9 YUL-PAR 2.135
10 WAS-LON 2.120
11 PTP-PAR 1.890
12 FDF-PAR 1.890
13 NYC-FCO 1.722
14 NYC-MAD 1.583
15 SFO-LON 1.529
16 NYC-AMS 1.515
17 MIA-LON 1.455
18 CHI-FRA 1.330
19 WAS-FRA 1.260
20 WAS-PAR 1.229
21 MEX-MAD 1.179
22 NYC-DUB 1.164
23 LAX-PAR 1.160
24 DTW-AMS 1.160
25 SFO-FRA 1.152
26 NYC-ZRH 1.152
27 YYZ-PAR 1.120
28 IAH-LON 1.110
29 YYZ-FRA 1.089
30 NYC-BRU 1.070

F. Top 20 airlines by seats offered

1 DL 17.310
2 BA 14.183
3 AF 11.741
4 LH 10.540
5 CO 8.764
6 AA 8.604
7 AC 7.602
8 UA 6.663
9 VS 6.454
10 US 5.694
11 KL 5.387
12 TS 5.238
13 IB 3.878
14 EI 2.179
15 LX 2.153
16 LY 2.149
17 MT 1.938
18 AZ 1.910
19 SK 1.546
20 TK 1.532

G. Eastbound seats offered by global alliance

1 Star Alliance 48.154
2 SkyTeam 39.002
3 (no alliance) 29.794
4 OneWorld 28.910

H. Eastbound seats offered by departure country

1 USA 105.850
2 Canada 21.767
3 Mexico 4.973
4 Cuba 2.119
5 Guadeloupe 1.890
. Martinique 1.890
7 Dominican Republic 1.768
8 Netherlands Antilles 1.554
9 Barbados 939
10 Saint Lucia 653
11 Jamaica 367
12 Panama 294
13 Antigua & Barbuda 286
.. Bermuda 286
15 Aruba 283
16 Costa Rica 260
.. El Salvador 260
18 Grenada 229
19 Bahamas 192

I. Eastbound seats offered by destination country

1 UK 42.559
2 Germany 22.534
3 France 21.698
4 Netherlands 11.305
5 Spain 9.260
6 Italy 6.965
7 Switzerland 4.856
8 Ireland 4.013
9 Israel 3.573
10 Belgium 2.890
11 Russia 1.960
12 Turkey 1.775
13 Denmark 1.516
14 Iceland 1.380
15 Portugal 1.360
16 Greece 1.234
17 Sweden 863
18 Jordan 762
19 Austria 757
20 Morocco 756
21 Poland 735
22 Finland 496
23 Ukraine 462
24 Hungary 441
25 Norway 439
26 Senegal 413
27 Egypt 346
28 Algeria 269
29 Czech Republic 243

J. Top 30 eastbound country pairs by seats offered

1 USA-UK 31.047
2 USA-Germany 17.546
3 USA-France 12.450
4 USA-Netherlands 7.743
5 Canada-UK 6.782
6 USA-Spain 5.728
7 USA-Italy 5.522
8 Canada-France 3.847
9 USA-Ireland 3.802
10 USA-Switzerland 3.562
11 Canada-Germany 3.523
12 USA-Israel 3.128
13 USA-Belgium 1.939
14 Guadeloupe-France 1.890
.. Martinique-France 1.890
16 USA-Turkey 1.775
17 Mexico-Spain 1.688
18 Canada-Netherlands 1.444
19 USA-Russia 1.413
20 USA-Iceland 1.380
21 USA-Denmark 1.305
22 Netherlands Antilles-Netherlands 1.265
23 Canada-Italy 1.167
24 USA-Portugal 1.110
25 Canada-Switzerland 962
26 Barbados-UK 939
27 Mexico-France 903
28 USA-Greece 892
29 Mexico-UK 889
30 USA-Sweden 863


User currently offlineBrusselsSouth From Belgium, joined Aug 2001, 628 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 7465 times:

K. Top 30 departure METRO AREAS by flights offered

1 NYC 156
2 YYZ 38
3 CHI 34
4 WAS 33
5 ATL 26
. BOS 26
7 YUL 25
8 PHL 22
9 LAX 19
10 MIA 15
11 SFO 13
12 IAH 12
13 DTW 10
.. MEX 10
15 MCO 9
16 CLT 7
.. CUN 7
.. DFW 7
19 MSP 6
.. SEA 6
.. YVR 6
22 HAV 5
.. YYC 5
24 FDF 4
.. PTP 4
26 BGI 3
.. CUR 3
.. LAS 3
.. PUJ 3
30 DEN 2
.. SDQ 2
.. UVF 2
.. YEG 2
.. YOW 2

L. Top 30 departure AIRPORTS by flights offered

1 JFK 96
2 EWR 60
3 YYZ 38
4 ORD 34
5 IAD 32
6 ATL 26
. BOS 26
8 YUL 25
9 PHL 22
10 LAX 19
11 MIA 15
12 SFO 13
13 IAH 12
14 DTW 10
.. MEX 10
16 CLT 7
.. CUN 7
.. DFW 7
19 MCO 6
.. MSP 6
.. SEA 6
.. YVR 6
23 HAV 5
.. YYC 5
25 FDF 4
.. PTP 4
27 BGI 3
.. CUR 3
.. LAS 3
.. PUJ 3
.. SFB 3

M. Top 30 destination METRO AREAS by flights offered

1 LON 139
2 PAR 71
3 FRA 53
4 AMS 42
5 MAD 27
6 F C O 21
7 ZRH 17
8 MUC 16
9 BRU 13
.. DUB 13
11 MAN 12
12 TLV 11
13 BCN 8
.. KEF 8
.. MOW 8
16 CPH 7
17 DUS 6
.. IST 6
19 ATH 5
.. GLA 5
.. MXP 5
22 ARN 4
.. GVA 4
.. LIS 4
.. SNN 4
26 AMM 3
.. BER 3
.. CMN 3
.. VCE 3
.. VIE 3
.. WAW 3

N. Top 30 destination AIRPORTS by flights offered

1 LHR 114
2 CDG 61
3 FRA 53
4 AMS 42
5 MAD 27
6 LGW 23
7 F C O 21
8 ZRH 17
9 MUC 16
10 BRU 13
.. DUB 13
12 MAN 12
13 TLV 11
14 ORY 10
15 BCN 8
.. KEF 8
17 CPH 7
18 DUS 6
.. IST 6
20 ATH 5
.. GLA 5
.. MXP 5
.. SVO 5
24 ARN 4
.. GVA 4
.. LIS 4
.. SNN 4
28 AMM 3
.. CMN 3
.. DME 3
.. TXL 3
.. VCE 3
.. VIE 3
.. WAW 3

O. Top 30 eastbound city (metro areas) pairs by flights offered

1 NYC-LON 30
2 NYC-PAR 14
3 YYZ-LON 10
4 BOS-LON 9
. CHI-LON 9
. WAS-LON 9
7 LAX-LON 8
8 NYC-FCO 7
. NYC-FRA 7
. NYC-TLV 7
. YUL-PAR 7
12 NYC-AMS 6
.. NYC-MAD 6
.. NYC-ZRH 6
15 MIA-LON 5
.. NYC-BRU 5
.. NYC-DUB 5
.. SFO-LON 5
.. WAS-FRA 5
20 ATL-PAR 4
.. CHI-FRA 4
.. DFW-LON 4
.. DTW-AMS 4
.. FDF-PAR 4
.. IAH-LON 4
.. LAX-PAR 4
.. MEX-MAD 4
.. NYC-MAN 4
.. NYC-MXP 4
.. PTP-PAR 4
.. WAS-PAR 4
.. YYZ-FRA 4

P. Top 20 airlines by flights offered

1 D L 74
2 BA 53
3 C O 44
4 A A 39
5 LH 35
6 AF 34
7 AC 31
8 U A 28
9 US 24
10 VS 19
11 KL 18
12 TS 18
13 IB 13
14 LX 10
15 AZ 8
16 EI 7
17 FI 7
18 LY 6
19 MT 6
20 SK 6

Q. Eastbound flights offered by global alliance

1 Star Alliance 196
2 SkyTeam 144
3 OneWorld 113
4 (no alliance) 101

R. Eastbound flights offered by aircraft generic type

1 B767 145
2 A330 105
3 B777 92
4 B747 71
5 B757 62
6 A340 53
7 A310 11
8 MD11 5
9 A380 4
10 B737 3
11 A320 3

S. Eastbound flights offered by departure country

1 USA 416
2 Canada 81
3 Mexico 17
4 Cuba 7
5 Dominican Republic 6
6 Netherlands Antilles 5
7 Guadeloupe 4
. Martinique 4
9 Barbados 3
10 Saint Lucia 2
11 Antigua & Barbuda 1
.. Aruba 1
.. Bahamas 1
.. Bermuda 1
.. Costa Rica 1
.. El Salvador 1
.. Grenada 1
.. Jamaica 1
.. Panama 1

T. Eastbound flights offered by destination country

1 UK 162
2 Germany 81
3 France 73
4 Netherlands 42
5 Spain 35
6 Italy 29
7 Switzerland 22
8 Ireland 17
9 Belgium 13
10 Israel 11
11 Iceland 8
.. Russia 8
13 Denmark 7
14 Portugal 6
.. Turkey 6
16 Greece 5
17 Sweden 4
18 Austria 3
.. Jordan 3
.. Morocco 3
.. Poland 3
22 Finland 2
.. Hungary 2
.. Norway 2
.. Senegal 2
.. Ukraine 2
27 Algeria 1
.. Czech Republic 1
.. Egypt 1

U. Top 30 eastbound country pairs by flights offered

1 USA-UK 121
2 USA-Germany 63
3 USA-France 48
4 USA-Netherlands 30
5 Canada-UK 25
6 USA-Italy 23
7 USA-Spain 22
8 USA-Switzerland 17
9 USA-Ireland 16
10 Canada-Germany 13
11 Canada-France 12
12 USA-Belgium 9
.. USA-Israel 9
14 USA-Iceland 8
15 Mexico-Spain 6
.. USA-Denmark 6
.. USA-Russia 6
.. USA-Turkey 6
19 Canada-Italy 5
.. Canada-Netherlands 5
.. USA-Portugal 5
22 Canada-Switzerland 4
.. Guadeloupe-France 4
.. Martinique-France 4
.. Netherlands Antilles-Netherlands 4
.. USA-Greece 4
.. USA-Sweden 4
28 Barbados-UK 3
.. Canada-Belgium 3
.. Dominican Republic-Germany 3
.. Mexico-France 3
.. Mexico-UK 3
.. USA-Jordan 3


User currently offlineBrusselsSouth From Belgium, joined Aug 2001, 628 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 7443 times:

Trivia

Of the 554 flights scheduled to operate on that particular day, 10 are full daylight flights. 9 out of these 10 have LHR as destination. All other flights are redeyes. List of daylight flights sorted by local departure time :

EWR LHR VS 18 08:00
JFK LHR BA 178 08:00
BOS LHR BA 238 08:15
YUL CMN AT 209 08:30
BOS LHR A A 156 08:50
YYZ LHR AC 868 08:50
ORD LHR A A 90 08:55
EWR LHR C O 18 09:00
JFK LHR A A 142 09:30
IAD LHR U A 922 09:38

Note that two other flights depart before noon (local time), but don't arrive before the next day :

YVR FRA TS348 11:15
DTW AMM RJ268 11:20

The following airports have only one North Atlantic departure on that day :

ANU (BA to LGW)
A U A (TOM to LGW)
BDA (BA to LGW)
BON (KL to AMS)
BWI (BA to LHR)
CVG (DL to CDG)
FLL (DE to FRA)
GND (BA to LHR)
HOG (MT to LGW)
MBJ (VS to LGW)
MEM (DL to AMS)
NAS (BA to LHR)
PDX (DL to AMS)
PHX (BA to LHR)
POP (DE to FRA)
RDU (AA to LHR)
RSW (AB to DUS)
SAL (IB to MAD)
SJO (IB to MAD)
SJU (IB to MAD)
SLC (DL to CDG)
SXM (AF to CDG)
TPA (BA to LGW)
VRA (UN to DME)
YHZ (AC to LHR)
YQB (TS to CDG)
YYT (AC to LHR)

All flights are operated by aircraft at least the size of a 757, except the following flights :

JFK LCY BA 2 (A318 - 32 seats)
JFK LCY BA 4 (A318 - 32 seats)
YYT LHR AC 822 (A319 - 120 seats)
EWR ZRH LX 19 (B738 - 56 seats / operated by Privatair)
BOS KEF 5W 426 (B73H - 148 seats)
IAH AMS KL 664 (B73H - 44 seats / operated by Privatair)

All flights are operated by an airline from one of the countries involved in the country pair, except the following flights :

EWR BRU 9W 227
JFK BRU 9W 225
YYZ BRU 9W 229
IAD MAD EI 6963
JFK LHR KU 102
LAX LHR NZ 2
IAD DKR SA 208
IAH DME SQ 61
JFK FRA SQ 25
LAX CDG TN 8


User currently offlineBNAOWB From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 400 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 7276 times:

What a fascinating analysis! Great job!

Quoting BrusselsSouth (Reply 1):
19 FDF 1.890
.. PTP 1.890

It is possible that these 2 airports have more available seats to Europe than to the Americas which would be quite unusual for a North American airport.

Quoting BrusselsSouth (Thread starter):
1 LHR 29.794
2 CDG 17.259
3 FRA 15.512
4 AMS 11.305
5 MAD 7.325
6 LGW 7.176

It is impressive that LGW is still as high as it is (almost 20% of the available seats to LON).


User currently offlineBoeingGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 3258 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 7214 times:

Quoting BrusselsSouth (Reply 3):
The following airports have only one North Atlantic departure on that day :

Great work. Doesn't SAN also have only one North Atlantic departure a day? I'm referring to the reinstatement of SAN-LHR.


User currently offlinegoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1872 posts, RR: 4
Reply 6, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 7081 times:

Very impressive thread !!! Thanks a lot

Quote:
All flights are operated by an airline from one of the countries involved in the country pair, except the following flights :
LAX CDG TN 8

well, TN is a French airline (French Polynesia is a French overseas territory)

Quoting BNAOWB (Reply 4):
It is possible that these 2 airports have more available seats to Europe than to the Americas which would be quite unusual for a North American airport.

Yes. FDF (Martinique) and PTP (Guadeloupe) receive very few American tourists but receive tons of Metropolitan French tourists + an important ethnic traffic between metro France and these 2 French overseas departments.


User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20822 posts, RR: 62
Reply 7, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 6912 times:

Quoting BrusselsSouth (Thread starter):
This thread contains a simple, non professional analysis of (eastbound) North Atlantic flights for an arbitrary day of the Summer 2011 schedule.

An amazingly detailed contribution. Kudos to you!

Quoting BrusselsSouth (Thread starter):
E. Top 30 eastbound city (metro areas) pairs by seats offered

4 NYC-TLV 2.591
5 LAX-LON 2.536

I knew NYC-TLV was a popular/lucrative route, but never realized it topped LAX-LON in number of seats offered, when you consider that there are 8 nonstops per day offered by 5 airlines on the LAX-LON route in the summer months. NYC-TLV certainly has an impressive schedule (though I'm not sure if all are daily flights?).

Quoting BrusselsSouth (Thread starter):
R. Eastbound flights offered by aircraft generic type

1 B767 145

Amazing, the 767 is still used on 40% more flights than the next most-popular TATL aircraft.



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineJAAlbert From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1626 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 6911 times:

Very interesting, but um, is your girlfriend out of town or something?  

Please, PLEASE don't forget SAN's little addition to the mix! We may be at the end of a dirt road (or runway) but we will soon have our very own BA 777! I can hardly stand the excitement of it all.


User currently offlineBoeingGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 3258 posts, RR: 7
Reply 9, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 6788 times:

Let's list the North American cities who have had non-stops to Europe but no longer do.

As mentioned, SAN is soon to come off this list with the reinstatement of SAN-LHR.

Once had it but not currently:

PIT (not sure the status of the DL PIT-CDG flight) - a number of US flights.
BDL - the NW flight to AMS
STL - a number of TW flights, last being AA to LGW after the takeover
BNA - AA to LGW
SJC - AA's short lived flight to CDG
OAK - Corsair or another holiday carrier went into there at one time
CLE - CO to LGW and I think CDG for one season, IIRC
MSY - several destinations on the original National Airlines

Did I miss any?


User currently offlineBrusselsSouth From Belgium, joined Aug 2001, 628 posts, RR: 5
Reply 10, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 6554 times:

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 5):
Doesn't SAN also have only one North Atlantic departure a day? I'm referring to the reinstatement of SAN-LHR.
Quoting JAAlbert (Reply 8):
Please, PLEASE don't forget SAN's little addition to the mix! We may be at the end of a dirt road (or runway) but we will soon have our very own BA 777! I can hardly stand the excitement of it all.
Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 9):
As mentioned, SAN is soon to come off this list with the reinstatement of SAN-LHR.

Thanks for pointing that out. I forgot about that one :

SAN LHR BA272 Dep 20:05 Equip. 772 (let's assume 229 seats).

Note that this does not change anything to the above rankings.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 7):
Amazing, the 767 is still used on 40% more flights than the next most-popular TATL aircraft.

Note that if we consider A330/A340 as a single aircraft family, then that family would be on top of the ranking (A330/340 : 158 - B767 : 145).

Quoting goldorak (Reply 6):
well, TN is a French airline (French Polynesia is a French overseas territory)

You're right. I was basing myself on the same principle as for Guadeloupe and Martinique, considering overseas territories as separate coutries. Of course, technically, you're right.

Quoting goldorak (Reply 6):
Quoting BNAOWB (Reply 4):
It is possible that these 2 airports have more available seats to Europe than to the Americas which would be quite unusual for a North American airport.

Yes. FDF (Martinique) and PTP (Guadeloupe) receive very few American tourists but receive tons of Metropolitan French tourists + an important ethnic traffic between metro France and these 2 French overseas departments.

Absolutely. And to add to what goldorak said, most aircraft on those routes have high density configs. For instance, AF flies so called 'COI' (Caraïbes - Océan Indien / Caribbean - Indian Ocean) with no less than 472 seats (no first class) on those routes. Corsairfly uses high density 744s with 582 seats.

Another trivia : all (4) A380 north atlantic flights on that day :

IAD CDG AF 39 16:40
JFK FRA LH 401 15:40
SFO FRA LH 455 14:40
YUL CDG AF 347 19:55

It's interesting to note that none of those flights (AF : 538 seats / LH 526 seats) have more seats than the Corsairfly 744 mentioned above.

Thank you all for your comments, keep them coming.

Regards
BrusselsSouth


User currently offlineBNAOWB From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 400 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (3 years 8 months 5 days ago) and read 6487 times:

Quoting BrusselsSouth (Reply 10):
Quoting goldorak (Reply 6):
Quoting BNAOWB (Reply 4):
It is possible that these 2 airports have more available seats to Europe than to the Americas which would be quite unusual for a North American airport.

Yes. FDF (Martinique) and PTP (Guadeloupe) receive very few American tourists but receive tons of Metropolitan French tourists + an important ethnic traffic between metro France and these 2 French overseas departments.


Absolutely. And to add to what goldorak said, most aircraft on those routes have high density configs. For instance, AF flies so called 'COI' (Caraïbes - Océan Indien / Caribbean - Indian Ocean) with no less than 472 seats (no first class) on those routes. Corsairfly uses high density 744s with 582 seats.

582 seats! Imagine if Corsairfly gets an A380 in the future!

Could there be any other North American airports (other than FDF and PTP) that have more available seats to Europe than to the Americas?

Some other observations from your analyis:

Related to metro areas, the top 3 destinations (LON, PAR, and FRA) combined have more available seats (about 74000) than the next 27 destinations combined (about 65000)!

However, on the North American side, it requires the top 5 metro areas (NYC, YYZ, CHI, WAS, YUL) combined (about 71000) to top the next 25 departure metro areas combined (about 65000).

There are more available seats to Switzerland (4856) than Turkey, Jordan, Morocco, Senegal, Egypt, and Algeria combined (4321)!


User currently offlineBrusselsSouth From Belgium, joined Aug 2001, 628 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (3 years 8 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 6476 times:

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 9):
Let's list the North American cities who have had non-stops to Europe but no longer do.

[...]

Did I miss any?

YHM (Hamilton, ON, Canada) was served between 2007 and 2009 by Flyglobespan from London (LGW ?), and possibly other UK regional airports.

FlyCentralEurope.com (operated by Air Italy) is supposed to start (less than daily) services from YHM to PRG, KRK and BUD at the end of May (and also from ORD to KRK for that matter). I don't know the status of those, though.

Quoting BNAOWB (Reply 11):
Related to metro areas, the top 3 destinations (LON, PAR, and FRA) combined have more available seats (about 74000) than the next 27 destinations combined (about 65000)!

Indeed, with London being a long shot from the second (Paris), seats or flights wise. The UK in general is a solid first for north atlantic 'east' destinations.

Regards
BrusselsSouth


User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20822 posts, RR: 62
Reply 13, posted (3 years 8 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6428 times:

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 9):
Did I miss any?

Anchorage.



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineBNAOWB From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 400 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (3 years 7 months 4 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 6301 times:

Quoting BrusselsSouth (Reply 2):
K. Top 30 departure METRO AREAS by flights offered

1 NYC 156
2 YYZ 38
3 CHI 34
4 WAS 33
5 ATL 26
. BOS 26
7 YUL 25
8 PHL 22
9 LAX 19
10 MIA 15
11 SFO 13
12 IAH 12

It is interesting that IAH is able to support 3 "Big 3" Gulf flights on that day (2 EK and 1 QR) yet only has 12 "North Atlantic" (as defined in this thread) flights on that day. By comparison, NYC has 4 nonstop "Big 3" Gulf flights (2 EK, 1 EY, 1 QR) that day yet has 156 "North Atlantic" flights.


User currently offlineBrusselsSouth From Belgium, joined Aug 2001, 628 posts, RR: 5
Reply 15, posted (3 years 7 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 6276 times:

Quoting BNAOWB (Reply 14):

It is interesting that IAH is able to support 3 "Big 3" Gulf flights on that day (2 EK and 1 QR) yet only has 12 "North Atlantic" (as defined in this thread) flights on that day. By comparison, NYC has 4 nonstop "Big 3" Gulf flights (2 EK, 1 EY, 1 QR) that day yet has 156 "North Atlantic" flights.

I guess the reasons could be :

1. Larger point-to-point (or point-to-region for that matter) traffic for oil companies between Houston and the Middle East, hence the relatively large presence of Gulf carriers in Houston.

2. NYC has an ideal location for transatlantic flights : relatively short hop across the pond, and good location as a connecting point for virtually every connection within the US. Connecting at IAH makes less sense for destinations East of Texas, which includes many major US cities.

3. The O/D market between NYC and Europe is probably much larger than Houston-Europe.

Regards
BrusselsSouth


User currently offlineBNAOWB From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 400 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (3 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 6158 times:

Is the following a somewhat accurate list of "East" airports that have only one North Atlantic arrival on the following day (July 6th)?:

AGP (DL from JFK)
ALG (AH from YUL)
BFS (CO from EWR)
BHX (CO from EWR)
BOD (TS from YUL)
CAI (MS from JFK)
EXT (TS from YYZ)
HAM (CO from EWR)
NAP (IG from JFK)
NCE (DL from JFK)
PRG (DL from JFK)


User currently offlinegoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1872 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (3 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 6142 times:

Quoting BNAOWB (Reply 11):
Could there be any other North American airports (other than FDF and PTP) that have more available seats to Europe than to the Americas?

If you have the figures, I would be curious to see data for YUL-Europe (and particularly France) versus YUL-USA.
Again, thanks a lot for this thread  


User currently offlineBrusselsSouth From Belgium, joined Aug 2001, 628 posts, RR: 5
Reply 18, posted (3 years 7 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 6086 times:

Quoting goldorak (Reply 17):
If you have the figures, I would be curious to see data for YUL-Europe (and particularly France) versus YUL-USA

Here you go :

On that particular day :

- YUL - Europe : 25 flights / 6634 seats
- YUL - France : 8 flights / 2385 seats
- YUL - USA : 92 flights / 6474 seats

What do we see ?

- More seats to Europe from YUL, than to the US, but it's a close call.
- France accounts for roughly one third of all European flights from YUL (seats and flights).
- Most YUL to US flights are operated by regional jets. We have an average of 70 seats per flight to the US, versus 265 seats per flight to Europe.

Regards
BrusselsSouth


User currently offlineBrusselsSouth From Belgium, joined Aug 2001, 628 posts, RR: 5
Reply 19, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 5902 times:

It appears that, in addition to BA SAN-LHR, the following flight is missing from my list :

PIT CDG DL204 Dep 18:35 Equip. 752 (160 seats).

Regards
BrusselsSouth


User currently offlinegoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1872 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5893 times:

Thanks a lot BrusselsSouth  

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