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Airports With Poor Layouts  
User currently offlineflybynight From Norway, joined Jul 2003, 1005 posts, RR: 2
Posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 5475 times:

It's a small airport, but never do I seem to have to walk further than I do at GEG (from rental car agencies to AS check-in). Not only that, the two concourses are not interconnected.
Who designed this f-ed up airport?


Heia Norge!
44 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently onlineflyiguy From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1092 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 5413 times:

I'd have to give that honor to PHL! An airport with poor terminal construction where flights have to either be pushing out or taxing in but not at the same time and then with 3 runways of which only 2 can be utilized by non commuter aircraft. It's just a terrible airport all together.

Just my 0.02



The opinions I post are of mine and mine alone, not of the airline I work for.
User currently offlineNWADC9 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4896 posts, RR: 10
Reply 2, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 5260 times:

MCI without a doubt. True, O&D pax can walk off the plane and a few feet later you're at the curb, but that's pretty much the only good thing there. As a post-security bandaid in the early 70s, each cluster of gates has their own security checkpoint. And until several years ago, there weren't any restrooms or shops within the secured area; you'd have to reenter security after you buy a paper and do your business. Plus, each cluster isn't connected, so if you had a connecting flight leaving out of another gate, you'd have to leave security and reenter at another cluster. TWA and Brannif parted ways with their hub ops in Kansas City courtesy of these inconveniences. Also, with the many checkpoints at the airport, they all need staffed and equipped, so an extra financial hit goes to managing all those little checkpoints instead of one or two checkpoint like at many airports.


Flying an aeroplane with only a single propeller to keep you in the air. Can you imagine that? -Capt. Picard
User currently offlinePlymSpotter From Spain, joined Jun 2004, 11617 posts, RR: 60
Reply 3, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 5102 times:

In my opinion CDG has, by a country mile, the least inter-connectivity of any major European airport. However it is also one of the most formative and beautiful.


Dan  



...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
User currently offlineplanejamie From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2011, 576 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5057 times:

Quoting flyiguy (Reply 1):

I'd have to give that honor to PHL! An airport with poor terminal construction where flights have to either be pushing out or taxing in but not at the same time and then with 3 runways of which only 2 can be utilized by non commuter aircraft. It's just a terrible airport all together.

I agree with part of that, but from a passenger perspective, the terminals were very easy to get between (unless you were on a commuter aircraft) and transfer from International to Domestic was pain free and quiet too!

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 3):
In my opinion CDG has, by a country mile, the least inter-connectivity of any major European airport. However it is also one of the most formative and beautiful.

It's good if you're going between flights in the same terminal but if you need to connect anywhere else, it's useless!

LHR isn't too bad actually for connections with busses to each terminal airside. I would say AMS but the individual security checkpoints mean that it is a pain if you've bought a bottle of water and want to take it with you!


User currently offlinegoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1832 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4971 times:

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 3):
In my opinion CDG has, by a country mile, the least inter-connectivity of any major European airport. However it is also one of the most formative and beautiful.

It really depends on which terminal. Connecting 2E-2F or vice-versa is very easy. Also 2A and 2C are being linked airside. But connecting 2G to anywhere is a pain...


User currently offlineUSAIRWAYS321 From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 1845 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 4966 times:

Quoting flybynight (Thread starter):

It's a small airport, but never do I seem to have to walk further than I do at GEG (from rental car agencies to AS check-in). Not only that, the two concourses are not interconnected.
Who designed this f-ed up airport?

Have they changed this recently? I flew out of GEG quite often from 2005-2009 and there was a hallway between Concourses B and C.


User currently offlineqf002 From Australia, joined Jul 2011, 2949 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 4940 times:

Ever been to any Australian airports? Try making an International-Domestic transfer in less than a couple of hours  

User currently offlineBD338 From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 703 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 4894 times:

Quoting qf002 (Reply 7):
Ever been to any Australian airports? Try making an International-Domestic transfer in less than a couple of hours

What is the "obsession" with Australian airports about putting International and Domestic airports in completely separate Terminals often the opposite side of a runway?

My vote for worst layout goes to CDG, the runway configuration can lead to very lengthy taxi times, and then sometimes remote parking and then you can find yourself trying to navigate from one Terminal to another depending on the connection. I've had nearly 2 hour connection times that have become a near last minute rush to catch the connection. LAX is bad for inter terminal connections, if you are not on the same Alliance/airline. The sheer size of ATL can be a challenge to catch a tight connection if you have to move concourses, get the train etc.


User currently offlineUltimateDelta From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 2093 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 4842 times:

I'm going to have to go with EWR. I can't complain too much about the actual concourse areas (the moving walkways help a lot), but the international security re-screening (at least for terminal C; not sure about the others) has to be the dumbest arrangement I've seen. You drop off your bags, but then you're directed into the pre-security zone and have to go through again along with all of the regular passengers going through initial screening.


Midwest Airlines- 1984-2010
User currently offlinePacNWjet From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 963 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 4834 times:

Quoting UltimateDelta (Reply 9):
the international security re-screening (at least for terminal C; not sure about the others) has to be the dumbest arrangement I've seen. You drop off your bags, but then you're directed into the pre-security zone and have to go through again along with all of the regular passengers going through initial screening.

Isn't this standard operating procedure at U.S. airports? In recent experiences I have had at DFW, LAX, SFO, and SLC the arrangement was the same way as what the poster describes for EWR, or am I missing something here?


User currently offlineCairnterriAIR From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 401 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4826 times:

JFK....need I say more?

User currently offlinejetblue777 From Canada, joined Jul 2009, 1451 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4822 times:

Quoting CairnterriAIR (Reply 11):

JFK....need I say more?


I disagree but if you're talking about Delta's home in JFK   

I find T1, T4, T5, T7 and T8 all well organized and passenger friendly. However, if you're transferring in JFK, it might be a bit inconvenient considering it has 8 terminals. BUT it's not that bad, the runways are well laid out and I never had any major issues.



It's a cultural thing.
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9511 posts, RR: 52
Reply 13, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4819 times:

Any airport with separate terminals for domestic and international flights and requires a bus transfer in my mind are worst. SVO is miserable. Indian airports can be a nightmare. Struggling to make a 3 hour connection and switching terminals is worst.


If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineUltimateDelta From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 2093 posts, RR: 6
Reply 14, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4814 times:

Quoting PacNWjet (Reply 10):
Isn't this standard operating procedure at U.S. airports?

It's possible, but I only remember experiencing it there (I was much younger the last times I made international connections, so my memory isn't the greatest). At DTW, for example, international arrivals have separate screening directly after passport control/customs, and after it you take an escalator up into the main terminal, inside the secure area. I want to say CVG was like this as well, but again, I don't really remember.



[Edited 2011-12-18 11:22:48]


Midwest Airlines- 1984-2010
User currently onlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17056 posts, RR: 10
Reply 15, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4805 times:

On Tuesday I am flying into BOS from AMS on DL and then connecting onto ATL (and LAX) on DL. Will have to clear immigration/collect my bags/exit/walk to next terminal WITH my bags/enter Terminal A/queue for baggage drop/clear security and then get to the gate. Have only 1.5 hrs, hopefully I will make the connection. The whole process doesnt seem efficient.


Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offline1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6447 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 4747 times:

Here is my list:

Worst: ORD. Too scattered and spread out.

Best: ATL, DEN. The sets of parallel concourses has proven to be ideal for a major hub airport.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlinethegman From United States of America, joined Nov 2008, 654 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 4728 times:

Quoting planejamie (Reply 4):
and transfer from International to Domestic was pain free and quiet too!

Hardly. It was hot and sticky after I just got off a 10 hour flight from Barcelona this summer. Right in the middle of the Euro push the lines at security re-screening were terrible. I think CLT is much better for international pax, but granted, I have never connected there because it is my home.


User currently offlineAlnessW From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 618 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 4682 times:

Quoting B747forever (Reply 15):
Will have to clear immigration/collect my bags/exit/walk to next terminal WITH my bags/enter Terminal A/queue for baggage drop/clear security and then get to the gate.

Not sure that's right. BOS does have a "connecting baggage dropoff" carousel just as you exit the customs area (but BEFORE the international arrivals exit - don't exit there if you are connecting.) in Terminal E. Just follow the signs to Connecting Flights. Are your bags checked all the way through to ATL or LAX? If so, you should just be able to drop them off after clearing customs in Terminal E and not have to bring them to Terminal A and queue with DL.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 15):
Have only 1.5 hrs, hopefully I will make the connection.

Might be close. Terminal A security can be hairy.


User currently offlinejlarsson From Sweden, joined Sep 2007, 97 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 4634 times:

LHR and CDG are by the length that the universe is wide the worst that exists.

Whoever designed those airports have a special place reserved at a very hot place.

ORD & BOS is a breeze.

br, jlarsson



Next trip; ARN-FRA-YYC-YVR-SEA-ORD-BOS-MUC-GOT.
User currently offlinesteex From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 1611 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 4607 times:

Taking the entire way the airport functions into account, I'll go with MNL from my experiences. The airport has three entirely separate terminals (four if you count the tiny Manila Domestic Terminal), and of course T1 is an unmitigated disaster in pretty much every way. Attempting to connect between T1 and T3 could require 40+ minutes of surface transport when traffic on the NAIA Road is at its worst, which can occur at virtually any time.

Having to basically go through security three times to get from cab to plane in T1 is pretty annoying - all items through x-ray/metal detector once to get into the check-in hall, proper security to get into the terminal itself, and once more to get into your specific departure gate. And speaking of cabs, not really a part of the airport layout per se, but the system of having airport taxis that carry all fares departing the airport dramatically increases the taxi traffic since many of the incoming fares are in regular taxis that then leave empty (and try to charge you double for their inconvenience).


User currently offlinejetblue777 From Canada, joined Jul 2009, 1451 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 4571 times:

Quoting steex (Reply 20):
Taking the entire way the airport functions into account, I'll go with MNL from my experiences. The airport has three entirely separate terminals (four if you count the tiny Manila Domestic Terminal), and of course T1 is an unmitigated disaster in pretty much every way. Attempting to connect between T1 and T3 could require 40+ minutes of surface transport when traffic on the NAIA Road is at its worst, which can occur at virtually any time.

   YES. I couldn't agree more. T1 is a complete dump (although like I said before, I had many memories on it, so in a way, I like the terminal) The Domestic Terminal is even worse, I've seen better bus terminals in the Philippines...T2 and T3, however are much nicer. Like you said, transferring is a nightmare. Although we always stay at MNL for a day or two before we transfer to a domestic flight to shop and of course, avoid the nightmare.

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 16):
Best: ATL, DEN. The sets of parallel concourses has proven to be ideal for a major hub airport.

I completely agree. Although the taxi time at DEN could be long, I haven't had any bad experiences with the airport and one of the best in the US IMO. ATL, being the busiest airport in the world, it's such a surprise how organize it is. The concourses are well laid out, transfer is always a breeze although the crowds can be a bit of a frustration but nothing major.

As for ORD, I've only transferred twice and it was from a UA flight to another UA flight so we didn't have any problems at all. But I get what you're saying.

My vote would be DTW. DL's terminal is probably the easiest large terminal to navigate through.



It's a cultural thing.
User currently offlineAkiestar From Philippines, joined May 2009, 784 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 4559 times:

Quoting jetblue777 (Reply 21):
T1 is a complete dump (although like I said before, I had many memories on it, so in a way, I like the terminal)

I presume you don't know about the renovations at NAIA Terminal 1? It's much nicer now than 2-3 years ago.


User currently onlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17056 posts, RR: 10
Reply 23, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 4546 times:

Quoting AlnessW (Reply 18):

Well will see how everything works out, leaving for the airport in about three hours (3:50 am) and have yet to finish packing!



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlinejetblue777 From Canada, joined Jul 2009, 1451 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 4519 times:

Quoting Akiestar (Reply 22):
I presume you don't know about the renovations at NAIA Terminal 1? It's much nicer now than 2-3 years ago.

I have been there in 2010 and yes, it was in a much better state compared in 2007. The departure area, I have nothing to complain about. It's the check-in hall, immigration and security and especially the arrivals hall that's looking a little bit shabby. I can't wait til' international airlines move to T3.



It's a cultural thing.
25 Akiestar : There's a reason for all those checks: -At the door: Davao airport bombing in 2003, and probably incidents before then given that the Philippines is
26 QantasA333 : ADL and MEL have both International and Domestic operations in the same terminal. In the case of ADL the International gates are interchangeable betw
27 steex : I understand that, but it's still an unfortunate reality. At T1 in particular, they had to shoehorn the first x-ray into the front doors, resulting i
28 qf002 : True, and SYD is headed in a similar direction with their new 2 terminal concept. The sterile division between domestic/international is still confus
29 duckbilled : I have always hated the layout of LAS but I usually in and out of D. If I flew out of a different concourse, I may have a different opinion. I have on
30 Babybus : JED having two terminals at different ends of the airport is a candidate for worst airport. It's a taxi ride if you want to get to the other one. Not
31 AlnessW : Oh dear. How did things go?
32 lhr380 : You honestly can not put LHR and CDG in the same bag? LHR has a simple set up, 4 terminals connected by a very frequent airside coach to all terminal
33 DocGATTACA : ORD can be an absolute horror show for international to domestic connections. I agree tho' that it's fine for domestic connections. Same goes for IAD
34 Babybus : I think LHR and CDG are both very good airports and very easy to move between terminals. Going through the Flight Connections Centre at LHR might be
35 BasilFawlty : Almost ALL airports with seperated terminals are poor when it comes to layout. I agree! Also the runway layout and use is terrible as well.
36 1337Delta764 : Typically, such a layout is designed for O&D, not for connecting passengers.
37 blink182 : I disagree about PHL. Is there a method to the madness in the way the concourses are arranged? Yes, but the corridors and concourses are narrow. Even
38 Ben175 : PER without a doubt... until recently it was a 15 minute taxi ride between the international and domestic terminals! When you board flights at Termina
39 DesertFlyer : I'm shocked it took someone so long to mention FRA. It is laid out in a very odd way that usually involves a significant amount of walking and bus ri
40 USAirALB : While I love CLT and usually connecting at CLT is rather simple, although the airport layout was not designed for people with 30 minute connections, w
41 jlarsson : Sorry. I just did. I will gladly spend € 250 more on a ticket just to avoid LHR & CDG. Layout wise and the way those 2 airports are run is a di
42 lhr380 : Why? Plent of transport between the terminals both airside and landside? T5 is superb, T1 T4 T3 have gone thru refurbishment. Security and connection
43 FlyboyOz : I dont like those airports that have a long transit corridor between two terminals. It's not that easy to find one with poor signages. SYD is a WASTE
44 Checo77 : Worst? Without a doubt CDG and FRA! Best? AMS and ATL. Adam
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