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Is There Any Competition On US Aviation?  
User currently offlineEL-AL From Israel, joined Oct 2001, 1313 posts, RR: 13
Posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4392 times:

I am planning a visit to north America in 4 months. After booking flights from Israel to YYZ and from LAX back to TLV ($968) I am now looking for a flight from Boston to Phoenix in October.

http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/378/bosphz.jpg

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Just take a look on this expedia page: all 3 major carriers have the exact same price, right on the dime! No matter which hour is chosen. Is this a free and deregulated market? Is the only real competition come from Southwest? Or am I missing something?


"In Israel, on order to be a realist, one's must believe in miracles" - David Ben Gurion.
19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21677 posts, RR: 55
Reply 1, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4354 times:

Everyone is trying to match everyone else's price: that's competition.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineTango-Bravo From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3806 posts, RR: 29
Reply 2, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4191 times:

Am surprised to see fares as low as they are in the BOS-PHX market...even for October (a relatively slow travel month in the U.S.) and with 4-months advance purchase. If your plans are firm at this point, grab it while you can!

Even if meaningful pricing competition is largely-to-entirely lacking in many U.S. city pairs, serious competition appears to be alive and well in the BOS-PHX market.


User currently offlinedaedaeg From United States of America, joined Feb 2003, 657 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4142 times:

Prices wouldn't be that low if there was no competition. $128 one way from Boston to Phoenix is a pretty darn good price.


Everyday you're alive is a good day.
User currently offlineDiamondFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1565 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4087 times:

Quoting daedaeg (Reply 3):
Prices wouldn't be that low if there was no competition. $128 one way from Boston to Phoenix is a pretty darn good price.

Exactly. Doesn't matter what car you have, you are going to spend more than that in gasoline. A bus ticket is probably 2X that as well. Don't even bother pricing Amtrak, it's probably 4x as expensive.

-DiamondFlyer


User currently offlineRDH3E From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 1718 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4052 times:

Quoting DiamondFlyer (Reply 4):
Exactly. Doesn't matter what car you have, you are going to spend more than that in gasoline. A bus ticket is probably 2X that as well. Don't even bother pricing Amtrak, it's probably 4x as expensive.

5.5 cents per mile. No airline is making money on that fare, that is for sure.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15780 posts, RR: 27
Reply 6, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 3923 times:

Quoting EL-AL (Thread starter):
all 3 major carriers have the exact same price, right on the dime!

Go find a corner with three gas stations and see what the prices are like.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6723 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 3877 times:

I notice all options take 8 hours or more.

Also, could have something to do with that IP tracking stuff, but I haven't followed it too closely.



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineMIflyer12 From United States of America, joined Feb 2013, 1107 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 3815 times:

Quoting Aesma (Reply 7):
I notice all options take 8 hours or more.

Orbitz (or the OP) isn't showing all options. Both B6 and US operate non-stops BOS-PHX, but it's still a 2300 mile flight and scheduled at 5:25 minimum westbound.


User currently offlineflymia From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 7213 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 3793 times:

Seems like they are competing pretty well with that price!

You will find this plenty. At the same time when I wanted to fly MIA-SDF a few months ago AA wanted $1,000 for the trip DL wanted it for around $450.



"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently offlinedalmd88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2571 posts, RR: 14
Reply 10, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 3791 times:

You could do the train/bus route for $306. That gives you a sixty hour travel time.

User currently offlineDiamondFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1565 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 3509 times:

Quoting RDH3E (Reply 5):
5.5 cents per mile. No airline is making money on that fare, that is for sure.

Exactly my point, but yet people will complain that fares aren't low enough.

-DiamondFlyer


User currently offlineEL-AL From Israel, joined Oct 2001, 1313 posts, RR: 13
Reply 12, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3423 times:

Quoting DiamondFlyer (Reply 11):
Exactly my point, but yet people will complain that fares aren't low enough.

I'm not complaning about the price itself, I mentioned the fact that the price is identical on competing airlines!

In Israel by the way, price comparison is a criminal offence, airlines matching prices in Israel can be finned in millions.



"In Israel, on order to be a realist, one's must believe in miracles" - David Ben Gurion.
User currently offlinejfklganyc From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3535 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3394 times:

Look how low it is. If that isn't competition, what is? Do you think any airline wants to charge that? They have to to be competitive!

User currently offlineMountainFlyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 476 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3378 times:

Quoting EL-AL (Reply 12):
In Israel by the way, price comparison is a criminal offence, airlines matching prices in Israel can be finned in millions.

Collusion is illegal in the US, but that usually involves companies agreeing behind the scenes to set prices at a certain level, which is generally anti-competitive and results in higher prices. There's nothing wrong with matching your competitors price in the open market, however.



SA-227; B1900; Q200; Q400; CRJ-2,7,9; 717; 727-2; 737-3,4,5,7,8,9; 747-2; 757-2,3; 767-3,4; MD-90; A319, 320; DC-9; DC-1
User currently offlinePHLBOS From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 7533 posts, RR: 24
Reply 15, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3370 times:

Quoting MIflyer12 (Reply 8):
Orbitz (or the OP) isn't showing all options. Both B6 and US operate non-stops BOS-PHX, but it's still a 2300 mile flight and scheduled at 5:25 minimum westbound.

It's also worth noting that one can also fly BOS-PHX via WN w/a connection as well (as we all know, WN does not advertise/sell their flight (excluding FL flights) on Orbitz, Expedia, etc.).

Long story short, one has two LFC options for a BOS-PHX intinerary: one nonstop via B6, the other w/WN connections.



"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
User currently offlinerobsaw From Canada, joined Dec 2008, 242 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 3195 times:

Just another example of people continually confusing price-matching (legal) with price-fixing (illegal).

User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20728 posts, RR: 62
Reply 17, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 3012 times:

Quoting EL-AL (Thread starter):
Is this a free and deregulated market? Is the only real competition come from Southwest?

When I first read this thread last night I checked fares, and B6 was offering their nonstop on 10/22 for $195. Today WN announced a 72-hour sale, with prices as low as $153 for BOS-PHX with a stop, but no plane change (I didn't check WN last night).

The fare on B6 this morning for their nonstop on 10/22? $165. US is so far unchanged on their nonstops at $225.

Competition is alive and well.



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlinecatiii From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 3045 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2424 times:

Quoting EL-AL (Thread starter):
Just take a look on this expedia page: all 3 major carriers have the exact same price, right on the dime! No matter which hour is chosen. Is this a free and deregulated market? Is the only real competition come from Southwest? Or am I missing something?

You're missing something. You're implying that the airlines are colluding on price, which is illegal. They are competing on price, which is the basic tenet of a free market. I'm not sure why you think Southwest is the "only real competition." I don't see them listed but I would imagine their price point was similar, if not higher.


User currently offlinegemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5712 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 2201 times:

Quoting robsaw (Reply 16):
Just another example of people continually confusing price-matching (legal) with price-fixing (illegal).

Depends on your jurisdiction. In Australia price matching CAN be illegal depending on circumstances. Just a sidelight, obviously not relevant to the Ops discussion.

Gemuser



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