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Topic: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Singapore_Air
Posted 2004-02-15 09:54:49 and read 15353 times.

Ryanair 'to cut frills further'

Ryanair is taking the "no-frills" concept a stage further - by ordering a fleet of planes without reclining seats or window blinds, it is reported.
The Sunday Times says the budget airline hopes to make savings of more than £1.3m a year by removing all remaining "non-essential" items.

In the long-term, says the paper, the firm hopes to go further by making all passengers carry on their luggage.

This could save the firm 20% of costs, said chief executive Michael O'Leary.

"Think about it. People are happy to carry a bag onto buses so why not onto airlines? It could be revolutionary," the paper quoted him as saying.

"Most of the space in airports is devoted to baggage handling. It's not just a question of staff. It would mean smaller airports, simpler facilities and lower charges."

The Sunday Times has calculated the money Ryanair could save with the stripped-down fleet:

By using non-adjustable seats, it would save about £1.3m a year in repair bills to the reclining type

Removing window blinds would save about £130,000

Removing Velcro headrests and replacing them with ones paid for by advertisers could save £100,000 - and earn the same

Ditching seat pockets would reduce cleaning costs, and shorten the plane's turnaround times.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3489761.stm

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pilottim747
Posted 2004-02-15 09:58:35 and read 15274 times.

Oh my. I can't say I'd like to be on those flights. I'd rather pay the little bit extra and get at least the basics. Beverage service I could do without, but seat pockets and window shades? All carry-on luggage? This sounds like a nightmare.

pilottim747

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Jobalas
Posted 2004-02-15 10:01:58 and read 15253 times.

later it will be an aircraft without cockpit!!!! I don't believe it, I think it 's a shame but it's my opinion. I prefer to pay a little bit more but with a little comfort. What do you think about that?

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.
Username: Ndebele
Posted 2004-02-15 10:13:46 and read 15220 times.

I don't care too much about reclining seats on a flight less than two hours, and I have never lowered the window shades. If it really saves them so much money - why not?

But taking everything as a carry-on? Have you ever been on a full Ryanair flight? Already now, the large 738 overhead bins are not enough to take all the carry-ons, cabin space is limited - especially when you have a Ryanair Y189 configuration. This would never work, and you can say that Ryanair is ignorant and unfriendly, but they are not stupid, they will (hopefully) realize that this carry-on thing won't work.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.
Username: Flyinghighboy
Posted 2004-02-15 10:17:16 and read 15211 times.

i've always wondered why they don't put more ads on the planes. It may annoy people but with cheap airfares they'll still keep coming back. However carrying the luggage onboard, forget about that one.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Johnnybgoode
Posted 2004-02-15 10:28:05 and read 15177 times.

as much as i have enjoyed their "value for money" so far, i always thought FR could just get better. but obviously, they still can get worse.

lots of people that haven't flown before won´t notice and might not care, but i´m sure lots of travelers that used other airlines before won´t come back as easily in the future if there are much better alternatives such as germanwings, easyjet, HLX and others...

the thing is, no-frills or not, FR does really not to seem to care about their customers.

cheers
daniel

Topic: RE: Rainier To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pettersa
Posted 2004-02-15 11:04:26 and read 15120 times.

Removal of the reclining seats is quite good in my opinion - there is not a lot of things that are more irritating when sitting in a crowded plane with not too much space between the seats, and then in addition the person in front of you insists on placing his seat in your lap for the entire flight.
And in addition, the RYR flights normally don't last more than a couple of hours, so then you don't really have to be bugging the person in the seatrow behind you, do you?

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: DC-10 Levo
Posted 2004-02-15 11:11:59 and read 15080 times.

Well I never use the reclining seat anyway. I just leave it in the position it is in when I get onboard so I wouldn't be affected by that. It's really annoying when someone in front reclines their seat on a crowded flight. I don't really touch the window blinds either.

Carrying on luggage onboard just seems silly.

DC-10

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.
Username: Ndebele
Posted 2004-02-15 11:18:04 and read 15044 times.

One thing I forgot:

Ditching seat pockets would reduce cleaning costs, and shorten the plane's turnaround times.
Oh come on, don't tell me that they spend much time in cleaning the aircraft, leave alone the seat pockets. Cleaning seems to be done only during night-stop of the aircraft, the cabins on evening flights are quite dirty, if they ditch the seat pockets, people will throw their waste on the floor, so it doesn't make much of a difference.
But it's not only Ryanair, I had to laugh when I was on a bmiBaby flight, the cabin was quite dirty, I didn't care too much but I had to laugh when the f/a proudly told everybody that she did the cleaning of the cabin on her own.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Udo
Posted 2004-02-15 11:29:48 and read 14997 times.

If Ryanair wants to shoot itself, well I don't care. I would never ever book an airline which forces me to carry my suitcase personally to the aircraft.

It's nice we have so many LCCs out there which offer better service than Ryanair...and it's still possible to offer low fares and good products, just look at jetBlue, Soutwest, germanwings or HLX. I have tried out all of them and all of them were better than Ryanair.

What's next? Removing all seats like in city busses? Maybe O'Leary needs to see a doctor immediately...


Regards
Udo

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 11:41:56 and read 14951 times.

Well done MOL! You're a superb businessman, and can reduce your costs considerably. You're an extremely clever man and one with steel balls.

PEOPLExpress used to make all passengers with check-in luggage pay $7 per bag. The airline provided larger overhead bins onboard the aircraft to store more luggage in. If you did away with the larger bins and made people pay (£5 per hold bag?), it'd be a nice little earner.

Again, congrats to MOL for further increasing his airline's efficiency.

If people here and the general public don't like the changes - they have a choice and can fly a different airline. That's the joy about it.  Smile

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Trent900
Posted 2004-02-15 11:45:20 and read 14926 times.

How can FR get passengers to carry on their own luggage? Once its checked in it would be impossible for the passengers to retreave their case and then carry it to the aircraft. This would be a serious security breach.

And getting rid of the seat pockets? Not sure about that. Where would the safty cards and sick bags be kept? Unless they're removing the carpets as well so its just a wash down floor.  Nuts

Trent.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 11:49:00 and read 14913 times.

"Where would the safty cards and sick bags be kept?"

On the seat back, I should think.

"How can FR get passengers to carry on their own luggage? Once its checked in it would be impossible for the passengers to retreave their case and then carry it to the aircraft."

I suspect it wouldn't be checked-in in the first place; I reckon it'd be checked by security (scanned or whatever) and you then it in onboard. But there isn't room for large suitcases aboard the beasts, so I wonder whether FR will charge passengers for putting them in the hold - just like PEOPLExpress did.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Trent900
Posted 2004-02-15 11:53:00 and read 14897 times.

Sounds like a way of getting more money out of people. I suppose you'll have to pay for sick bags as well then? LOL

Why dont they just put the prices up a bit? I'd rather pay a bit extra for the services.

Trent.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Thaigold
Posted 2004-02-15 11:58:55 and read 14860 times.

G'day

I agree with Pe@rson - great ideas from an absolute LCC genius..... I don't think most people flying Ryanair would mind carrying their own bags onboard on put them near the cargo hold them selves..... I know I wouldn't mind..... As for seats not reclining, no barfbags, window shutters etc. - I couldn't really give a ....

Great thinking and good for us flying even cheaper.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Sonic
Posted 2004-02-15 12:04:45 and read 14829 times.

I believe with all-carry-on luggage they means just that luggage would need to be transported to the plane by each person as carry-on (not checked-in). However, near plane some of luggage would be loaded into baggage compartment of the plane. The same is done currently with some regional props, e.g. ATR-42 where many people carries oversized luggage (for plane's overhead compartments) and there are people who checks the size and, if it's too big, puts under the plane.
I believe, same would be for Ryanair (after all, it was this comparing to bus - exacly the same it works for tourist buses). Not sure just werether they would still run the luggage to baggage claim, or give it away near airplane just after all people disembarqued (assuming it was not done through jetway).

I think this could really revolutionize the system, as it is not that hard for a person to move his/her luggage up to the plane instead of just to the airport. Unless you have really much luggage, of course...

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 12:05:55 and read 14829 times.

"Sounds like a way of getting more money out of people."

Not really - IF FR implements a pay-to-check-luggage-in policy, it would act as an incentive for passengers not not take large or much luggage. Accordingly, FR's fuel bill would be lower - surely a lot lower per day - and it could either pass this cost saving - together with the other cost savings - onto the consumer in the form of lower prices or onto shareholders in the form of higher dividends. If it offered lower prices, more people would travel, because airfares are elastic: if you reduce your prices by 10%, more than 10% more people will travel. If you gave your shareholders a higher return on their investment (i.e. higher dividends), you'd ensure they don't sell-up and go elsewhere. For those passengers who must take a lot of luggage, like families, they'd be penalised for doing so. In reality, it'd save the firm money by not paying out as much in fuel, while bringing in a bit more income - but I really doubt that FR would do it merely to gain more revenue.

"Why dont they just put the prices up a bit?"

They use yield management, so fares are higher at particular times, like weekends, during holidays, on morning and late-afternoon/early evening flights during the week, at the last minute, etc. Its fares can be quite to very high during these periods. For example, I would have had to have paid £149.99 each way if I booked a flight between LPL and DUB the day before travelling. FR generally offers these unbelievably cheap fares to those with complete flexibility, like leisure passengers, the eldery and those unemployed, by offering them on 'sub-otimally timed' flights, like late at night or early morning, or on mid-day flights. Indeed, it's normally always cheaper to fly on a Tuesday or Wednesday, except during those flights aboard which mainly business passengers fly (i.e. morning and late afternoon/evening).

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Trident2e
Posted 2004-02-15 12:09:19 and read 14811 times.

I agree with Sonic - they are not saying all luggage would be carried as hand luggage, just that passengers would be expected to transport it to the aircraft themselves.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 12:11:03 and read 14804 times.

Yep, Sonic! That is a likely way of doing it, especially as he gave the example of a bus. Passengers simply cannot take suitcases onto planes, because of the lack of space. Accordingly, they'd almost certainly have to put them in the aircraft hold. And taking into consideration what happens when you board a bus, you might have to pull or carry it to the aircraft. This happens at bus stations and rail stations, so why not at airports? This form of flying should from the point-of-view of the consumer be made as much like travelling aboard a bus or train as possible - and this is another means of achieving this.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.
Username: ClipperNo1
Posted 2004-02-15 12:18:20 and read 14767 times.

How much cost-reduction would it be, if FR, instead of removing the window shades, removes all windows from the Boeings?!

I hate O'leary's attidute, as if he's re-inventing the all airline biz. He's well over 30 years behind WN, for christ sake.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Capital146
Posted 2004-02-15 12:25:19 and read 14727 times.

I agree with most of the points made here.

Reclining seats can gladly go in my opinion. Nobody in front can sit on your lap anymore.

Window blinds can go as well. Have never used them and almost nobody else uses them either.

Seat pockets can go as long as there is somewhere handy for the sick bag to sit in! Also will require FR to check for litter more frequently or else the aircraft will look like a tip by the end of the day.

The only qualm I have is the idea of passengeres taking all their own luggage on board. This must surely mean cases/large bags, etc as passengers already take their own hand luggage onto an aircraft. I agree with Pe@rson that they could look into charging, say, £5 per person for luggage to be transferred to/from the aircraft for them, but would FR also expect all the elderly/infirm passengers to carry on their own cases as well, unless they pay a surcharge? Maybe Mr O'Leary is looking for someone else to take FR to court for discrimination to get some more free publicity?

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.
Username: Ndebele
Posted 2004-02-15 12:29:29 and read 14709 times.

Ah I see, so they're talking about something like a "delivery at aircraft" - this makes sense, I knew Ryanair wouldn't be so stupid to tell passengers to take everything into the cabin. However, one should keep in mind that you would not be able to take any knifes or scissors ... on your Ryanair trip, because you wouldn't be able to pass security.

...because airfares are elastic: if you reduce your prices by 10%, more than 10% more people will travel.
I doubt that. This may be true for a certain range of ticket fares, but Ryanair is already quite cheap, lowering these cheap fares by 10% would not create much additional demand.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 12:35:05 and read 14671 times.

"...because airfares are elastic: if you reduce your prices by 10%, more than 10% more people will travel."

You can doubt it all you like, but it's true.  Smile

"I hate O'leary's attidute, as if he's re-inventing the all airline biz. He's well over 30 years behind WN, for christ sake."

Then don't fly on FR. You have a choice, so you can take your business elsewhere. WN only went so far in creating low-fare travel. H. K. did not go to such extremes, and WN is arguably less efficient than FR, what with offering drinks (coffee or juice) and snacks (peanuts), a FF programme, allowing the families of staff to travel free, etc. It also operates into arguably extremely expensive airports, like LAX. Hardly conjucive to a low-cost, efficient operation.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FLYtoEGCC
Posted 2004-02-15 12:37:23 and read 14663 times.

I also agree that removing reclining seats is a good idea. In fact, I think this should extend to all charter carriers and even major carriers who give you a miserable seat pitch in economy. It's no fun when you're over 6ft and someone decides to invade the minimal space you already have.

Carrying your own luggage to the aircraft... this sounds a bit silly. Unless the airports are willing to install a hell of a lot more X-ray scanners and security points, people could quite easily smuggle illegal stuff on board. Unless every single bag is scanned, what's to stop someone putting a gun in their hold luggage, then opening their case after passing through security and moving it to their hand luggage?

With regards the seat pockets, I didn't know they cleaned them anyway. I've always found evidence to the contrary  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 12:39:25 and read 14643 times.

Fly2EGCC - I, like Sonic, reckon that passengers might have to take their suitcases and bags to the aircraft (where it'll be loaded into the hold) and not actually take it on board.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FLYtoEGCC
Posted 2004-02-15 12:46:34 and read 14612 times.

Pe@rson
I understand that, I know what Sonic is saying. My point is if there aren't enough security points, if suitcases aren't thoroughly scanned in the same way that hold luggage is, what is to stop someone loading a weapon into their hold luggage, then once through security, still in possession of both their hold luggage and hand luggage, remove their item from their hold luggage and put it into their hand luggage, and carry that on board. Sorry if I was unclear before.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Capital146
Posted 2004-02-15 12:53:26 and read 14579 times.

If passengers did take their own bags to the aircraft, would this not cause more problems than it solves?

Many people would be unable to carry their bags any sort of distance without using a trolley, I can see the mayhem around the aircraft now, trolleys everywhere, being bashed against the side of the aircraft, getting in the way of airside operations. Surely it would take far longer to load/unload luggage in this way than having a dedicated team do this on the passengers behalf. The money FR would save on ground handling would surely be lost on increased turnaround times?

Would it also not be considered dangerous to have people milling around aircraft with their luggage rather than just getting straight onto the aircraft?

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Airsicknessbag
Posted 2004-02-15 12:54:13 and read 14577 times.

>>>PEOPLExpress used to make all passengers with check-in luggage pay $7 per bag. The airline provided larger overhead bins onboard the aircraft to store more luggage in.

Now this is where cost cutting goes to far because it compromises safety: accidents happen because people stow heavy luggage in the overhead bins. The bag shifts, some other guy opens the bin and BANG the bag lands on his head, leaving him with serious head injuries.
And before you bash me for saying this is far-fetched, it happens 2-3 times annually on LH, I presume there are similar numbers for other airlines.
If you make people schlepp more bags on board by charging them for checked ones, these accidents will increase.


>>>However, one should keep in mind that you would not be able to take any knifes or scissors ... on your Ryanair trip, because you wouldn't be able to pass security.

Hats off to Ndebele - that´s a superb point you make.



Now, I guess the usual suspects will begin screaming I´m an FR hater (which I´m not), but I´ll tell you a little story:

I need to go from the FRA area to DUB. Friday afternoon to Sunday evening, on a fixed date, in about three months time.

For HHN-STN-DUB-STN-HHN, FR wanted all in all 220 EUR; the bus to HHN would cost me 32 EUR.

For FRA-DUB-FRA, LH wanted 220 EUR (had been 170 EUR the day before I booked, d´oh); the train to FRA will cost me 6.90 EUR.

No comment.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Daniel Smile

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 12:59:24 and read 14549 times.

Yes, the PEOPLExpress idea might not have been effective, hence the carrier ceasing to exist. Still, the basis is quite good.

No-one in their right mind will ever say that low-cost always means low-fares, because it doesn't. Indeed, the most effective way of securing cheap deals is to do A LOT of research well ahead of travelling, and be as flexible as possible. Look at both low-cost and with-frills carriers. Research is the key.

Obviously they'd be sufficient security measures in place so bags would indeed somehow be scanned.

We are not yet in possession of all the plans, so we cannot effectively argue the proposed idea.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Airsicknessbag
Posted 2004-02-15 13:03:45 and read 14525 times.

>>>No-one in their right mind will ever say that low-cost always means low-fares, because it doesn't.

Yes, I recently noticed at STN that FR don´t call themselves "The Low Fares Airline" anymore, but rather "The On-Time Airline"...  Wink/being sarcastic

Daniel Smile

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 13:13:23 and read 14495 times.

 Wink/being sarcastic lol

People wrongly equate low-cost with low-fares, when the two do not necessarily always go together. Still, if one is willing and able to travel off-peak and on a Tuesday or Wednesday, and book 6 weeks or so in advance, one can normally secure pretty good deals.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Jkw777
Posted 2004-02-15 13:21:22 and read 14449 times.

What is this a joke?!

Reclining seats and window blinds:

Ok I can live with out that, as some of you quite rightly said there is nothing worse than some as*hole who persists to recline their seat all the way back on a crowded flight. I enjoy looking out the window on the majority of my flights so that will not bother me one bit.

Passengers carrying on their own luggage:

You have to be kidding, how the hell is an elderly lady or a single mother with one small infant going to manage to carry on her suitcase to the aircraft. As some one else said above, the mayhem around the aircraft would be complete non-sense!

Removing Velcro headrests:

Another way to make money, ok fair enough. But don't they think they have taken enough away already? Also think of the hygiene side of things!? Wouldn't want some grease infested hair do all over my headrest!

Ditching seat pockets:

Where would the safety cards possibly be for the passengers to access when they are given the pre-departure safety briefing? Would this involve the FA's handing them out to each passenger as they board and then collecting them again? Surely not...

I am just glad that I will probably never have the need to fly FR (He says  Laugh out loud). This just goes to show you how tight one airline could possibly become. Didn't I read that FR made quite good profits anyway?

Just my thoughts on this matter.

Justin  Big thumbs up

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 13:24:56 and read 14438 times.

"Where would the safety cards possibly be for the passengers to access when they are given the pre-departure safety briefing?

On the back of the seat, I should think. Or the cabin crew could hand one out to all passengers, but that might be a bit too inefficient.

"Didn't I read that FR made quite good profits anyway?

Over £100 million last year I think. But there's ALWAYS room for improvement; indeed, airlines, like all businesses, are in business for the money not for fun, so it's natural they'd do whatever they can do secure more profits. It's like someone saying 'I get all Bs for all my Maths A Level work' and not bothering to try a bit harder to get an A. In reality, of course they'd seek to get an A, just like a business will seek to earn as much as it can.

[Edited 2004-02-15 13:27:32]

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.
Username: Delta777jet
Posted 2004-02-15 13:31:36 and read 14401 times.

I had flew with new FR B 737-800 three weeks ago and was on board of such 738 with no recline possibilities. The seats are colored blue and in the top a sunshine yellow, in fact there is also no seat pocket anymore and the safety instruction card sticker has been placed in the seat headrest in front of the next seat.

All in all a very interesting colour sheme what they used, its remembering me a little bit on any fast food restaurant with all plastic seats etc. a few years ago.

The aircrafts are now very un comfortable and from my last 30 trips with Ryanair I just can say, that, if there would be any other carrier flying the routes, I would suggest to go on them even if it is 15 EUR worse. Ryanair is demonstrating you, that you are nothing for them and they don`t care about passengers.

But anyway the Ryanair boom comes to an end fast and soon. May be the load factor is not decreasing, but their passenger yield is descending like hell and even on such routes like LBC-BGY (Hamburg-Milan), where I used to fly several times a month you can see that they are not able to get the aircraft full with fares like 2,99 or Free just Tax etc.

They started the low cost boom in europe and due to irish tax system and of course the strong management behind FR they gone to the Pole Position within short time. But now FR get really bored and other companies such Easyjet analizing what people wants. And if there is an alternate to Ryanair, they will loose the business no matter what.

So I estimate that Ryanair will loose over a longer period of time, I personally give them 1 to 2 years until they file for Chapter 11 and then we can also see how much the company Boeing will loose, because I`m sure that there is something not correct with the deal about the big order.

Something like we pay no maintenance reserve or we pay no lease rental in the first two years.

But anywhen they have to pay lease rentals, have to pay back the illegal subventions from the airports, maintenance reserve etc.

Wait and see...........


Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Greaser
Posted 2004-02-15 13:43:25 and read 14353 times.

Guys, chill about the carry-on luggage thing. Its not for sure, if Ryanair conducts a poll and 60 or 70% say they would rather pay more, then they will!
O' Leary isn't THAT dumb and drive FR down the toilet, after all, All this skeptism just creates PUBLICITY (good or bad) for FR and him!
Get rid of those recliners!!!

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Airsicknessbag
Posted 2004-02-15 13:53:57 and read 14310 times.


>>>Ditching seat pockets: Where would the safety cards possibly be for the passengers to access when they are given the pre-departure safety briefing? Would this involve the FA's handing them out to each passenger as they board and then collecting them again? Surely not...

In a way yes: the "inflight magazine" (well...) includes safety instructions.


>>>Where would the safty cards and sick bags be kept?
>>>On the seat back, I should think.

Oh, I´d love to see that in the case of the sick bags  Laugh out loud


How come you´re all so intolerant towards people who recline their seats? Calling them assholes, inconsiderate and stuff. I pay for my seat, I use it fully within its intended function, and that includes recline, from twenty seconds after take-off until shortly before landing. (Not during meals of course.)
Has it ever occurred to you that, especially in cramped configurations, tall people will HAVE to do that to avoid a sore back for a week?

Daniel Smile

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Mikec
Posted 2004-02-15 14:10:22 and read 14243 times.

Anyone who has had to join the large queue at STN to get through security at peak times, or the rugby scrums that ensue to get onboard an FR flight (not unique to FR I know) will be dumbfounded to think about every one of those FR pax still having their suitcases with them. It would beggar belief!!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

I personally think that FR is a successful company and my experiences with them have been ok. However I don't think they are particularly special. I've flown U2 4 times this year and have been just as happy - provided booked well in advance, the fares were every bit as cheap as FR and we flew into the main city airports.

Still nothing compares to jetBlue who I used 4 times during my trip to the US last year. I know a lot of people don't think they will last the course, but I was very impressed. Modern fleet of A320s, 34" seat pitch (more than VS gave on the transatlantic journey across to the US!), leather seats, PTV for every passenger showing DirecTV, free headphones, free drinks and snacks. Prices (when I booked) were a bit less than WN, and the service was great.

I'm all for cutting costs safely so that the passenger pays less, but I think some of the ideas are a little OTT! - would be nice to not have some idiot in front reclining their seat into your lap for the duration of a short haul flight though  Big grin

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Airblue
Posted 2004-02-15 14:11:48 and read 14235 times.

they're talking about something like a "delivery at aircraft" - this makes sense

Delivery your luggage to the cargo hold of the aircraft will affect the turnaround time, cause they should wait the last passenger with the last bag to close the cargo door, when usually now when the last pax board the plane they are almost ready for the push back.



Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FoxBravo
Posted 2004-02-15 14:24:34 and read 14188 times.

While I don't care that much about the reclining seats, which usually don't provide that much additional comfort anyway, I disagree strongly with those who say window shades don't matter. It's true that most of the time I can live without them, but have you ever been on a flight where the morning or late afternoon sun is shining right into your eyes? It's bad enough when this happens in a car, but when you're flying at 30,000 feet and there is (a) much less atmosphere in the way, and (b) no trees, buildings or anything else to block the glare, it can be quite unpleasant and even painful. It's like skiing on a sunny day with no sunglasses or goggles. Furthermore, while I have routinely seen broken seat recline mechanisms requiring maintenance, I have never seen a damaged window shade, nor have I ever heard of them as a frequent maintenance item. If they really need to take cost-cutting that far, I would start to wonder where else they might be cutting corners. Maintenance? Training? Where does it stop?

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FunFlyer
Posted 2004-02-15 14:26:31 and read 14179 times.

Well I have just 1 word, okay add them all together you would get more.




GOODBYE

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.
Username: Codeshare
Posted 2004-02-15 14:31:54 and read 14149 times.

How about reorganising the a/c interiors so they can look like a Tube car or a city bus? They'll be able to fly more passengers, or perhaps all seats can be removed and everybody will be standing up??

Ryanair can also introduce cattle transport - cows, sheep, geese, hens + humans, that could cut costs. Also passengers can have fun chasing the animals around the a/c.

And how about... forget it

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: JAL777
Posted 2004-02-15 14:35:35 and read 14120 times.

Why anyone would choose to fly Lyin'Air is beyond me.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Patroni
Posted 2004-02-15 14:36:46 and read 14111 times.

Well, I can only hope that this is empty publicity bla bla than the real strategy of Ryanair....

Reclining seats gone? Fine for flights of up to 90 minutes. Window blinds? Well, never use them myself.

But... seeing what there seems to be "on approach" for FR's customers makes me more and more avoiding them. Their new interior is simply tacky, I am pretty sure that there are other ways of saving cost without literally writing on everything "hey, I am cheap".

The delivery at aircraft is nonsense in my view, this works well with regional aircraft such as the ATR or a CRJ, but how long shall this take for a full 189 seater 737-800? Plus the long queues at security control. No thanks, I think that this measure will definitely shy away those few business pax that they have (and who so far were willing to pay 129EUR or more for a oneway HHN-STN if booked at short notice, which FR needs to get their average fare of 40EUR oneway). I maybe could take this treatment with an airfare of 2.99EUR, but definitly not for a cent more than that. In this case I rather pay 10, 20 or even 50EUR more and fly on a decent carrier like Germanwings, Hapag Lloyd Express or a traditional airline.

Low air fares may be price elastic, but Ryanair has seen - at least in Germany - that they can't even fill their flights if they give seats away for free. At some point, the market is simply saturated or people notice the additional cost for a weekend in Malmo (= Hotel, transport, etc) so that even the cheapest fare can't make them fly.

I flew about a dozen times on Ryanair in the past two years. Flights were OK but not spectacular. They alway manage it very well to take any "style" or "fascination" out of flying  Big grin
With these changes mentioned above they would certainly move to my personal no-fly list.

Cheers,

Tom

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Crosswind
Posted 2004-02-15 14:37:58 and read 14101 times.

Eliminating seatpockets has little to do with minimising loss/damage to safety cards and sickbags!

The main reason for removing seatpockets is reducing the time the lengthy pre-boarding security checks take. Before every flight, the cabin crew are required to security check the eintre cabin, including a visual check of all overhead stowages/equipment stowages and phsically checking every seatback pocket for prohibited items, plus randomly checking 10% of lifejacket stowages. The crew must also security check the toilets and galleys.

This can only be completed once all passengers/caterers/cleaners have left the aircraft, and must be complete before boarding for the next sector commences.

Checking every seatpocket takes some time, even with all the crew doing it. I believe currently the crew remove litter at the same time as checking the seatpockets. With the new seats removing litter from the cabin will also be a faster process.

By removing seatpockets, you substantially reduce the length of time these tasks take, and may shave 5 mins off the required turnaround time.

Ryanair won't reduce the scheduled turaround times, especially since they have a mix of aircraft interior configs in service, but it will allow more time on the turnaround to make up any delays, or give extra time for boarding to ensure an ontime departure.

Also, by in installing non-reclining seats, they not only minimise the cost to purchase the seat, they minimise maintenance costs and also lost revenue - a seat with a faulty recline mechanism is unserviceable, it cannot be occupied until repaired.

Also, don't underestimate the huge fuel savings over the course of the year from having lighter seats due to the lack of a recline mechanism - it may make the aircraft up to a few hundred kg lighter. That will save a fair amount over the course of a year for each aircraft, multiplied by the number of aircraft in Ryanair's fleet that's a lot of money!

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Photo © Johan Kellerman


Regards
CROSSWIND

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Johnnybgoode
Posted 2004-02-15 14:42:30 and read 14081 times.

without wanting to paint it black, to me it seems that FR is trying to cut costs so drastically (which is, of course, a very good thing) because they need to "finance" their growth. with the huge order of aircraft and so many new routes they introduce every couple of months, combined with the presence of so many LCCs in europe, one needs to question if their growth strategy is sustainable...

i cannot make a judgement because i´m not fully aware of FR's financial picture but i'm aware they recently warned on earnings for the first time, i believe.

rgds
daniel

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 14:51:52 and read 14032 times.

">>>Where would the safty cards and sick bags be kept?
>>>On the seat back, I should think.

Oh, I´d love to see that in the case of the sick bags"

Airsicknessbag - if you're going to quote me, do so precisely. I said the back of the seats for the safety cards - sick bags were not even mentioned.  Smile

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.
Username: Ndebele
Posted 2004-02-15 14:57:00 and read 14009 times.

Maybe a little off-topic, but I just found this link and I thought I'd share it with you:

http://www.ryanair.com/about/pax_compliments_03.html

Unfortunately I didn't find the link to the negative feedback...

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Jwenting
Posted 2004-02-15 15:06:19 and read 13976 times.

How can FR get passengers to carry on their own luggage? Once its checked in it would be impossible for the passengers to retreave their case and then carry it to the aircraft. This would be a serious security breach.

No, there would be no checkin desk.
Ryanair is talking about servicing very small locations that don't have full facilities.
In the current system those facilities would have to be built first, increasing the cost of development.

Aeroflot experimented with this system in the 1980s (albeit for different reasons) and it worked reasonably well.
Just place a bank of X-ray machines (which are now placed in the luggage sorting area) near the exit doors to the ramp (these are small airports, so no jetways or busses) and pull the bags through them when the pax leave the building to board.
One person next to each luggage hatch throws in the bags, and the passengers board through the airstairs (built into the aircraft possibly so the airport doesn't have to invest in even that).

And getting rid of the seat pockets? Not sure about that. Where would the safty cards and sick bags be kept? Unless they're removing the carpets as well so its just a wash down floor.

Printed onto the seatback. At least one LCC already does that.
Saves on replacing stolen or damaged ones, and stickers are cheaper than laminated paper charts.

I think Ryanair is on to something here. They remove the things most pax don't use anyway, thus saving money (on both maintenance and fuel) which they can either pass on to the passengers (lower fees) or the shareholders (lower losses).

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Luv2fly
Posted 2004-02-15 15:12:26 and read 13945 times.

This just begs me to ask, what is next? Fares priced on what you weigh, weigh less pay less, weigh more and pay more. At what point do you say, "Enough is enough!"

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 15:19:29 and read 13910 times.

"At what point do you say, "Enough is enough!""

Never - there are always means by which to reduce costs and wastage and to thereby operate more efficiently and effectively. Businesses should not become complacent, but rather always seek ways of improving.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Luv2fly
Posted 2004-02-15 15:23:41 and read 13884 times.

I am not sure that some of these suggestions FR is considering would be viewed as improving the product.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Crosswind
Posted 2004-02-15 15:36:24 and read 13812 times.

"At what point do you say, "Enough is enough!""

Never.


So in your opinion customer service doesn't matter, because like Michael O'Leary you believe no matter how badly you treat someone, not only will they come back for more, but they got what they deserved because they didn't pay much?

Any company that ignores customer service for will eventually get back what it gives! People do want cheap fares, but they also want to given at least a reasonable level of treatment. So there is of course a point where enough is enough.

Ryanair will continue to push the boundaries until there is a backlash from the travelling public. The next couple of years will be very interesting...

Businesses shouldn't become complacent

They shouldn't be complacent about costs. But also they shouldn't be complacent that passengers will put up with anything because it's cheap!

And of course, safety and maintenance is a line the airline will not be permitted to cross.

Regards
CROSSWIND

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Luv2fly
Posted 2004-02-15 15:46:13 and read 13770 times.

Crosswind you said it best. I understand wanting to pay a fair fare, tho I also do not want to be viewed as a walking ATM machine and nickled and dimed for every little thing....

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: AAJAXFlyer
Posted 2004-02-15 15:50:18 and read 13750 times.

Why do they even bother painting their airplanes then? Why pay to put up logos at the airport when cardboard signs will do? Do away with uniforms... make the staff wear their own clothes, saving the cost of keeping suppliers (even if the staff already pay for their uniforms).

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FLYtoEGCC
Posted 2004-02-15 15:53:42 and read 13737 times.

"Why even bother painting their airplanes then?"
AAJAXFlyer - that's a very good point! Is it true that AA leaves its aircraft in a "metal" finish to save on weight penalties? I thought I'd read that somewhere. Another airline was going to try it as well, I THINK - and i'm not sure - that it was JAL. Do correct me if I'm wrong though.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Graham697
Posted 2004-02-15 15:54:00 and read 13737 times.

Wow, I am usually pro-Euro, even though I dislike Airbus, but this makes me happy to live in the states. No reclining, window shades, checked luggage? If anyone who has flown song, jetBlue, Frontier, AirTran, and even Southwest would never fly FR again. They are taking it way to far.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 17:34:45 and read 13564 times.

"So in your opinion customer service doesn't matter."

Where did I say that customer service doesn't matter? If you re-read what I wrote, you'll quickly discover that I didn't say that at all. Indeed, I believe that good customer service is essential, and I believe that FR does, in comparison to WN, have quite poor customer service (good relationships with ALL stakeholders is essential) and poor relationships with its staff. It does not cost much at all to develop excellent relationships, yet the results from have them are excellent (increased morale and motivation and therefore productivity). Accordingly, I believe that while FR should be commended for operating as efficiently as possible, it could easily offer good, simple customer service by concentrating on the 'old' things, like being friendly, courteous and offering an 'individual' service. Good customer service does not imply spending a lot of money on what can be achieved very cost effectively.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Blackbird615
Posted 2004-02-15 17:52:33 and read 13481 times.

Southwest, AirTran and JetBlue prosper offering a core product complimented by basic and standardized services which do not include on-going service cuts and continued efforts to minimize passenger services. The key to Southwest's success lies in establishing a level of service and expectations and offering the same service day in and day out over an extended period of time. The central issue from my perspective is not the loss of reclining seats or window shades which represent passenger amenities but rather at what level will a company descend to in an effort to profit. For example, maintenance, crew training and employee retention are key components to a long term successful entity. My inititial thought as I read this thread was if Ryan is cutting visible costs of service in the name of efficiency and profit what additional cuts are being made in areas not visible including maintenance, training and aircrew scheduling? In the end, successful LCC's have carved a market niche not on saving a penny per passenger by eliminating window shades but by efficient use of aircraft and assets while standardizing costs and projecting an image of consistency and behaving as a responsible entity to passengers and shareholders. Only time will validate Ryan's continued survival and prosperity.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: N312RC
Posted 2004-02-15 17:59:52 and read 13446 times.

Removing window shades.... and most of you agree with it??



I hope none of yall fly on a sunny day or sunrise/sunset flight. Good luck trying to sleep with the sun in your face.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: CoTXDFW777AA
Posted 2004-02-15 18:00:45 and read 13439 times.

I hope this trend does not spread over the pond. Could you imagine a jetblue read eye transcon without window blinds and a reclining seat. The legacys would have a field day.

-CoTXDFW777AA

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Richierich
Posted 2004-02-15 18:07:04 and read 13416 times.

I find it funny that most US low-cost carriers are trying to increase creature comforts (adding IFE, more legroom, etc.), while Ryanair seems determined to go the other way and strip the aircraft of any comfort.
Then again, their chief competitor does stuff 150 people in an A319!

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Capital146
Posted 2004-02-15 18:52:00 and read 13306 times.

I hope none of yall fly on a sunny day

Everyday is a sunny day once you get above the clouds.

You hardly ever see people using the window shades anyway so I can't see this a huge loss of comfort. Most flights operated by FR are under 2 hours in length, therefore the majority of passengers do not need to sleep on the flight or have a real justification for needing the seat-recline either.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: N276AASTT
Posted 2004-02-15 18:56:24 and read 13286 times.

I CAN SEE THE HEADLINE NOW:

RYANAIR NEW FEATURE: NO SEATS AT ALL!

Today Ryanair annouced that they will be taking out all seats from all aircraft in an effort to save money. They will install new handloops and bars along the ceiling. Passengers will file in and stand holding the loops and bars.


This is, of course, a joke for all who don't have a sense of humor.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: IHadAPheo
Posted 2004-02-15 19:28:57 and read 13181 times.

My rambling opinions are as follows.

Reclining seats: I agree that on most flights I never recline my seat, so for me it ould be no great loss.

Window shades: If the sun is right (or wrong depending upon how you look at it) I would miss a window shade on a long flight.

Seatback pockets: Why not go with just a short a shallow mesh pocket, just big enough for the saftey card and airsickness bag. It would be easy to see through being mesh and would not hold more that the safety card and airsickness bag.

Some other ideas:

Have the passengers be held responsiible for cleaning the lav, or better yet pay toilets on the plane 1 euro to get in the lav and 2 to get out.

Hand out 1 hand vac to each passenger and have them clean their seat and floor area while on approach to reduce turn-around times, have the vacs have adverts on them .

Use the passengers instead of a tug for push back from the gate, this would be a great labour saver.



[Edited 2004-02-15 19:34:43]

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Luv2fly
Posted 2004-02-15 19:32:53 and read 13150 times.

IHadAPheo

To funny, I was thinking the same thoughts.....

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FLYtoEGCC
Posted 2004-02-15 19:39:16 and read 13118 times.

N276AASTT,  Big thumbs up - but you might have a point! I have to stand up on buses quite often, and they are so bumpy that I'm frequently chucked around the aisle. It can't be any worse than standing up in an airliner and having to put up with a bit of turbulence - and imagine how many people FR could pack into a 738 if they took all the seats out! Low-cost travel of the future?!

(Before you all start, this is also a joke - I can't really see it happening, can you?)

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Cytz_pilot
Posted 2004-02-15 20:04:57 and read 13037 times.

Does anyone understand how removing the window shades would save 130,000/year? I always assumed that shades were installed when the aircraft was constructed...so if they're already there, why are they costing so much money?

I guess my thoughts are that removing reclining seats would be a blessing (I'm 6 foot 1), and the carry-on luggage policy would be a nightmare (can you see the delays caused by people trying to stuff a massive and heavy suitcase through the little metal detector at a security checkpoint, AND THEN, if one has to be opened and examined??)

I have to say I quite enjoyed the LCC carriers when I was travelling throughout the British Isles and Europe last summer...dirt cheap and quicker than anything. Flew Edinburgh to Gatwick for less than half of what a train would have cost. Flew Gatwick to Dublin for less than a nice dinner in central London. For me, lack of frills is better than lack of funds.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 20:05:35 and read 13031 times.

"I would miss a window shade on a long flight."

You just identified the key issue: U2's longest flight is LTN-ATH, about 3.5 hours, with the majority being 2 hours or less. Clearly, it has no "long" flights.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Aa757first
Posted 2004-02-15 20:12:38 and read 12984 times.

Why aren't they cutting out personal air vents and reading lamps? They probably cost more.

AAndrew

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: David b.
Posted 2004-02-15 20:18:07 and read 12944 times.

Maybe they should get rid of air vents, reading lamps, seat cushions, O2 masks, life jackets and emergency slides  Nuts Also, food and drink services Wow!

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: N766UA
Posted 2004-02-15 20:19:15 and read 12928 times.

Sounds like bus service to me.... I won't be flying Ryanair ever if that's the case.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-15 20:20:45 and read 12913 times.

"food and drink services"

Nah, that would be silly: food and drink sales amount to 7% of FR's total annual revenue. Clearly, it's a big, big earner.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FLYtoEGCC
Posted 2004-02-15 20:23:24 and read 12897 times.

How about flying on one engine during descent and landing to save fuel?!  Yeah sure

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Aloges
Posted 2004-02-15 20:25:20 and read 12878 times.

Thanks for giving me one more reason why not to fly Ryanair!

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: David b.
Posted 2004-02-15 20:26:30 and read 12871 times.

They make you pay for drinks your saying?

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Shankly
Posted 2004-02-15 20:38:24 and read 12814 times.

I have to say, none of these things are a big deal, but why announce them so publicly? Clearly O'Leary's gone bonkers (well more bonkers than he was).

Why not get the pax to clean out the plane and re-fuel it and carry out a bit of maintenance - you can imagine the call "if there are any mechanics traveling on Ryanair flight 462 to Bonkersville, can they please go to the gate now"

I have to say if he wants to go even further, then i've got a PPL and would be happy to have a go!

I'll give 'em 12 months, before the payments on those 738's rolling off the Boeing production line begin to really hurt.

Next he'll be landing in the fields adjacent to cities to save landing fees (oh no, he does that already)

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Blackbird615
Posted 2004-02-15 21:02:21 and read 12735 times.

A few additional sources of revenue:

Install coin receptacles on bathroom doors, $1.00 urine, $2.00 fecal material with 4 tissues, each additional sheet 25 cents. Credit card scanners for use of fresh air and reading lights and a $50 deposit in the event oxygen masks are deployed. Heck lets include the pilots, postcard of 737-800 personally autographed by the pilot $25 payable in cash only.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Mandala499
Posted 2004-02-15 21:03:52 and read 12728 times.

Hmmm, didn't FR recently loose a large amount of the market value after the profit warning came out?

Something about problems in keeping yields and filling up all the extra capacity?

Damn, I knew I forgot to watch the biz news one day....

Mandala499

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FLYtoEGCC
Posted 2004-02-15 21:09:50 and read 12702 times.

How about:
- doing away with the F/As completely and employing one security guard who makes you sit down when the seat-belt light comes on;
- dispose of the snack/drink trolleys and install vending machines at the front and back;
- do away with the duty-free trolleys completely and instead, set up little shops just inside the gates that you HAVE to walk through, like when you get off a rollercoaster and have to walk past the photograph monitors.

Sorry this is getting daft now  Big thumbs up

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Aa757first
Posted 2004-02-16 02:09:48 and read 12499 times.

I was serious in my question that no one has answered yet. Why aren't they cutting out personal air vents and reading lamps?

AAndrew

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Stormin
Posted 2004-02-16 02:59:02 and read 12446 times.

Be careful about what you ask for...

Delta has some second-hand 757s (from National, I think) that have no individual overhead vents, just the lights. I was surprised when I ended up on one of these for a short trip one weekend. Not good for those people who like a little breeze to not feel so packed in.

Hopefully Boeing doesn't offer this option on 738s...

Later

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: IHadAPheo
Posted 2004-02-16 03:18:10 and read 12361 times.

Along with with ideas above I have few more..

Remember in Airplane!! wherethe passengers deplaned via the Baggage Carousel, heck youcould even be bar coded to arrive at the carousel with your bags.

Get rid of the APU's and seats have each passenger sit on a stationary exercise bike and have them pedal under the whip of a chief purser with an attitude.

Allow passengers to pay for their flights with the deposit on returnable bottles and cans, just have a bunch of those handy dandy self serve machines near check in, take your receipt to check-in and away you go.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: M404
Posted 2004-02-16 09:32:04 and read 12192 times.

Where are we supposed to put the bags? Not the overheads, that would exceed the weight limits Not under the seats, a normal T! exceeds the height limit. Not in the closet, all the coats wont fit in it now. You can bet Ryanair will not devote more of the main cabin to storage.

Some major information is missing on this.

Aeroflot had an acft that the pax carried bags up the first step and walked through the storage area, set the bags down for agent to store, and proceeded up another stair to the seating area.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Tokolosh
Posted 2004-02-16 09:40:45 and read 12168 times.

Why doesn't Ryanair go all the way and simply remove all seats and have standing room only. Much nicer!

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Diesel1
Posted 2004-02-16 10:57:22 and read 12045 times.

Check out http://myaviation.net/?pid=00022606 for a pic of the latest FR interior with the non reclining seats and the safety cards on the seat backs...

Regardless of everyone's thoughts on the seats / blinds / safety instructions, that interior is so yellow!

Still, as has been said, we have the choice to fly FR ior not...



[Edited 2004-02-16 10:58:54]

[Edited 2004-02-16 11:01:46]

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: TriStar500
Posted 2004-02-16 12:35:49 and read 11980 times.

Like Gordon Bethune once said: "You can make a pizza so cheap by removing all toppings that no one wants to buy it even if you are trying to sell it way below your competitor's prices."

Ryanair is clearly approaching this point now.

I am glad that we now have plenty of LCC competition in Europe, which offer vastly superior service for only marginally higher fares (if you break it down to fare price per mile).



[Edited 2004-02-16 12:39:38]

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-16 12:41:19 and read 11965 times.

What a load of old Tosh, Tristar! People WILL continue to fly FR - and it LARGE QUANTITIES. If FR reduces its prices further, which it certainly will, MORE PEOPLE will fly the carrier. You'll see.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: TriStar500
Posted 2004-02-16 12:54:08 and read 11922 times.

It won't change anything if you get all emotional, my dear Pearson, when the wonders of our market economy permit the competition to overtake the former market leader with a better product and value for money ratio.  Smile

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-16 13:04:24 and read 11884 times.

I'm not getting emotional at all. I am not attached to FR. I am not a stakeholder.

Yes, the competition probably already has a better product, but most people are 'bought' by price, price and price. If FR offers a flight for 0.01p and U2 offers it for £15, most people will go for FR, especially as flying is - like or not - nowadays about getting from A to B rather than the joy of flying. Price is the key factor. If FR can continue to lower its prices, it will attract more passengers, irrespective of whether U2 charges lower prices or not.

Let's not forget an all-important thing - very few no-frills airlines compete with one another. GO tried to compete with FR on flights from DUB to EDI, but FR rightly defended its position and essentially forced GO to withdraw from the market. FR will do the same with any airline which moves onto its 'patch' and rightly so.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: TriStar500
Posted 2004-02-16 13:18:17 and read 11847 times.

Agreed. Although with the ever-increasing density of the LCC network, it will be harder for FR to sell flights from remote airports and at increasingly restrictive conditions of carriage if there are competitors flying from more centralized airports under less restrcitive conditions.

It would be interesting to see, at what point the other factors like increased convenience, lower restricitons actually outweigh the price argument in the decision making process. I am just having my doubts that if you cut more "toppings" from the "pizza", people will go for your product even if they have to pay only a little more and then get the full "Marinara".  Smile

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-16 13:22:08 and read 11836 times.

Yes, I agree that it will be interesting to see which is deemed by the general public - not us overanalytical people - as being more important. I myself normally just go for the cheapest deal, so long as it gets me to where I need to be.

[Edited 2004-02-16 13:23:53]

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: GodBless
Posted 2004-02-16 13:44:44 and read 11800 times.

I was "lucky" enough to get the feeling of the new seats already and I can say I was glad when I got out of that plane.
Well but on the other hand now the emergency exit row doen't have any disatvantage over the other rows anymore since they can also not recline either...
But anyways I'm glad I always have the choice between Air Berlin, Germanwings, Hapag-Lloyd Express to to an extent also V-Bird so I do not depend on Ryanair. And adding up all the costs it is usually only cheaper to fly them when they offer specials for 0,01€/flight since they add "NRT-taxes" to every flight making them not so cheap at all... Too bad Germanwings seems to want to play that game too now.

Max

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Shenzhen
Posted 2004-02-16 13:45:11 and read 11791 times.

I have but a small question... How will Ryan Air determine the weight of all the baggage thrown into the cargo compartment at the gate.

If I had my choice, I'm afraid that I would rather fly another airline if I am to be treated in this manner. I mean, "private" busses have reclining seats (wonder how much they could save).

I suppose it wouldn't be too much to ask the customer, if they could simply UPS their baggage to their destination 3 days in advance.

regards,
Confused

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Boo25
Posted 2004-02-16 15:52:30 and read 11714 times.

From now on the hold will be the lower lobe cabin, for the seats that sold for 99p...

It will be £40 to hire a seat belt for take-off , and a meter on the wall will accept £2 coins for lighting and heating.

A ramp will be provided to embark/disembark this area, but it will only be available for 180 seconds to speed up the turnaround.
Anybody who misses this will lose their money,and have to pay to travel on the next flight - and be fined.alot.

Coming back to baggage, a smaller suitcase will have to sit on your lap for the flight , or you may hire a halfords (uk autostore) roofbox which have been specially modified for the 737 at a cost of £50/hour.

If you would like a smile on boarding, please pay the £5 surcharge when booking your ticket, likewise if you wish to have a smooth landing, a whipround will be offered during the flight, the takings of which will calculate the g-force/bump on landing.

As there are no seatpockets, you will have to request a sickbag (£5) , but if you're too late and puke on the carpet, it will cost you £75 to call out a cleaner.

On arrival , if you do wish to take the 2km walk to the terminal , a minibus will be available (£10/seat)...

Apart from that , have a nice flight Big grin Big grin Big grin

Have a nice flight

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Gte439u
Posted 2004-02-16 17:23:39 and read 11628 times.

I very much admire O'Leary for trying something different. Many consumers travel infrequently or do not care about the niceties (unlike a.net members), and thus are willing to accept these cost cuts. Most importantly however, there are a huge number of travel options in Europe, and the consumer can choose to pay more for greater comfort if that is a priority.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: VCE
Posted 2004-02-16 17:50:02 and read 11574 times.

This is another reason to avoid to fly with this that should be defined as an airline..

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FLYtoEGCC
Posted 2004-02-16 17:54:32 and read 11556 times.

Shenzhen raises a good point about the determining of the weight of all the hold luggage. Of course, low-cost carriers in particular fly with the minimum safe amount of fuel, and adding more weight means more fuel is required. My guess is that Ryanair would weigh passengers' bags at a check-in desk as usual, record the weights and then the passengers would carry their bags through the terminal and out to the aircraft. However, what is to stop the crafty ones from checking in a light bag to avoid Ryanair's (too low IMHO) £15kg max.baggage penalty, then loading more stuff into the case once it has been checked in? I can see why people would do it, but in the end, it would compromise safety in the event that the aircraft had to go-around and/or divert. Once this idea spread around, I bet more than just one or two would do it.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Planemaker
Posted 2004-02-16 18:01:10 and read 11509 times.

My, my, what a rarefied bunch we have on A.net. All this scorn and derision on FR. As has been posted ad nauseum - if you don't like FR, then simply don't fly them.

O'Leary should be congratulated for experimenting and adding choice to the market - after all, this all about choice of transportation and fare options - from bus, through train to airplane. And there is choice in level of service as well - if you want the frills you can happily fly business or first class. And if you can't afford to fly F or J, you can still fly Economy on BA if you want some overpriced "free" coke and a lousy TV dinner (yes, just because they don't break out the charges, you are still paying way too much for that coke and "meal service.")

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: CPDC10-30
Posted 2004-02-16 18:05:33 and read 11475 times.

My goodness, this is going way, way too far and will alienate potential customers. I can understand the luggage handling ideas, but window shades? Give me a break! How much extra does it cost to maintain those pieces of plastic? Removing reclining seats is OK as long as it isn't on flights over 2 hrs, then it is a big problem. How is it that every other LCC in the world can somehow manage to afford these "luxuries"?

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Donder10
Posted 2004-02-16 18:10:22 and read 11438 times.

How is it that every other LCC in the world can somehow manage to afford these "luxuries"?

And how come Ryanair is the most profitable?

Anyway,more free publicity for MOL.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FLYtoEGCC
Posted 2004-02-16 18:10:51 and read 11434 times.

"All this scorn and derision on FR."
I'd call hardly any of this thread scorn and derision. The ideas Mr O'Leary is suggesting are pretty radical, and, as such, are obviously going to generate a discussion as to whether they are feasible or not. We are so used to being able to check in bags, have a window blind, be able to sit down on the plane  Smile/happy/getting dizzy that a lot of people are going to react with surprise, as we've seen here. Some may agree, others may not.

IMHO the humourous posts that were put on here were intended to be just that - humourous. I don't believe any scorn was intended.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-16 18:10:57 and read 11434 times.

It's not a question of affording the items, it's a question of reducing costs to operate more efficiently and therefore to pass the cost-saving onto either the consumers in the form of lower prices (which will attract more flyers), or the shareholders in the form of higher dividends (which will retain them), or keeping the prices and increasing the profit margin. It's not a question of affording them at all. Indeed, it could be totally fairly argued that FR is without doubt the most efficient airline of its size in the world, as a direct result of all these cost-cutting measures. Like MOL or hate him, he's a bloody good businessman who drives his costs down considerably. His lack of care for his staff and customers is another matter.

[Edited 2004-02-16 18:12:47]

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Cloudboy
Posted 2004-02-16 18:17:28 and read 11384 times.

Maybe I am missing something here, but...

If you are going to remove the window shades, doesn't that mean a lot of labor? Do planes normally come without them and the airlines put them in themselves? I don't see where this is saving money.

Likewise, maybe a non-reclining seat costs less than a reclining one. You still have to buy the non-reclining seats and install those, so I would think that is going to be a hefty cost. Not to mention, I can't imagine it is that easy to find non-reclining aircraft cabin seats and that the seats really save that much money for the reclining mechanism.

As far as luggage goes, I don't know how the situation is in Europe, but there is a size limit to what you can carry through the security checkpoint. I can't imagine that passengers would be willing to give up being able to carry a decent suitcase. And I can't imagine that the airports would be at all tolerable about that many people carting around that much luggage.

Isn't one of the big cost-savings for a LCC is quick turnaround times? Dealing with all that luggage is going to stretch out their turnaround time something fierce. Not to mention as stated above figuring out weight and balance.

Somehow it seems rather sketchy to me - I wonder if it is more a marketing ploy than anything to do with savings.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FLYtoEGCC
Posted 2004-02-16 18:21:32 and read 11364 times.

Pe@rson has hit the nail on the head. I remember reading a quote from Michael O'Leary a few weeks ago (don't ask me where) where he said that Ryanair has massive cash reserves. Obviously, they could afford these "luxuries" if the wanted to, but at the end of the day it's costs and efficiency that are important to Ryanair, and if they can find new ways of reducing their costs and becoming more efficient, then good for them. Whether the suggestions mentioned at the beginning of this post will actually work is a different argument to whether they can afford them or not.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: LJ
Posted 2004-02-16 21:16:24 and read 11230 times.

The only problem with FR's strategy is that in the end you simply can not cut costs anymore. If that point has been reached and FR is still not performing well, FR will get serious trouble. In marketing one basic "law" is that cost leadership is no sustainable strategy. Only time will tell if FR will be the first to proof otherwise..........

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Prebennorholm
Posted 2004-02-16 21:51:42 and read 11162 times.

There is nothing more annoying and less comfortable than when some passenger in front of you suddenly slams his seat down on your lap. (Maybe except on first class with 50+ inches seat pitch, don't know, never tried, will never try).

Many years ago I confessed here at a.net that I will be the most loyal customer of the first airline to invent the non-inclining seat. I will stick to that promise. Wonderful, wonderful, you are a genius Mike O'Leary! Only a pity that it should last 101 years to invent such a rather simple comfort feature.

(Okay, okay, the Wright brothers inclined the other way, never have we pax had to lie on our stomach (yet)).

And dear LJ, just remember that Ryanair is already Europe's most profitable airline company.

Happy landing, Preben Norholm

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Greenjet
Posted 2004-02-16 23:23:22 and read 11081 times.

Another good reason for the removal of seat pockets is that it will boost online sales of food and drink as people will have nowhere to store their own food and drink except in a bag under the seat in front of them or in the overhead bin.

Fair play to Ryanair. People have always been far too snobbish when it comes to flying. When it comes to short haul flying all most people want is to get from A to B at a relatively cheap price. To hell with free food and drink, reclining seats, etc. If people want frills (even basic ones) then they should just look elsewhere. Simple.

I don't think the baggage thing will happen any time soon. Not only does it raise security concerns but also airports would object to it as they would lose out on revenue due to passengers with large bags finding it too awkward to avail of the shops and restaurants. I can't imagine BAA and their Stansted shopping centre, for one, being too happy with this.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: SailorOrion
Posted 2004-02-16 23:36:35 and read 11018 times.

As an aerospace engineer, I shall not board a plane where the luggage is being loaded by passengers and the pilot has no idea where his CG is.

SailorOrion

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Coronado990
Posted 2004-02-16 23:56:06 and read 10966 times.

Staring at that emergency exit safety placard for 90 minutes would make me feel a little uneasy. I always study it prior to departure, but it is a bit too "in your face" for me. I hope FR sells adhesive tape on board. Then I can stick a napkin over it. Plus I can tape my napkin over the window if I want to.


Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FlyCaledonian
Posted 2004-02-17 07:17:45 and read 10834 times.

Well, as has been said you can choose to fly FR or not. As the non-reclining seats without seat pockets are a reality no more to be said there. Hope window blinds don't go as actually I see them used a lot.


Personally I won't choose to fly FR. I can fortunately book ahead and will choose BA for S/H if at all possible. Better pitch, reclining seat, free bar (No $5 per alcoholic drink as I've discovered on CO this week), free headsets (Again, no charge). Yes, this is shorthaul I'm on about. And I know it's included in the fare but frankly booking ahead makes it worthwhile.

At the end of the day if FR still fills the planes so be it. I just won't be on them.
P.S. CO has no individual airvents on their 767-200s - I know as I hunted for them last week LGW-EWR. Hopefully my 777-200 tomorrow will have them,

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: JGPH1A
Posted 2004-02-17 10:02:49 and read 10775 times.

As has been said earlier in the thread, many FR passengers are infrequent travellers - on FR, that is. As Mr O'Leary diminishes the flying experience and cranks out his patent disgust and contempt for his customers, he might start to find that his first time travellers are also his last time travellers - everyone has their limits.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-17 11:01:31 and read 10724 times.

"The only problem with FR's strategy is that in the end you simply can not cut costs anymore."

In some respects, yes - diseconomies of scale would occur, i.e. where the cost per unit cannot be reduced any more. For example, say FR purchased 100 738s at a 40% discount, and Boeing would not go any lower, even if the airline purchased 150 instead. That would be diseconomies of scale, because the cost per item could not be reduced any more.

There will surely always be means by which to reduce costs and to thereby operate more efficiently. They might not be big ways, but rather small, subtle ways - ways we, the consumer, might not know, as we're not senior management.

Oh, and FR is performing well, for its profits make it the most profitable airline in Europe. Such a bad, bad thing, and indicative of it performing so awfully.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Tokolosh
Posted 2004-02-17 11:23:05 and read 10683 times.

This is a ridiculous plan by Ryanair! The "headrests" are there for a reason, i.e. to keep grease from hair off the seats. Cutting them, in combination with seat pockets, is supposed to save £100,000 a year. Divide that by the number of passengers per year, and you will comfortably (excuse the pun) save less than one Pence per passenger. In fact, I think these "savings" will actually cost more. Without seat pockets people will just throw all their junk everywhere, needing a more intensive clean-up of the plane and thus a longer turnaround time. As for passengers putting their own baggage on board, think of the logistics of that. It's the same old thing through the ages: if you cut corners too much, you actually end up being less efficient and certainly less fun.

Happy flying ...

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Stefandotde
Posted 2004-02-17 15:55:55 and read 10576 times.

Ryanair can do what Ryanair want, if they get passengers who accept how they get treated. No problem. Everybody can choose the airline he wants (and he deserves).
If the EU tax payer doesn't have to pay for the airports only Ryanair uses.
So Ryanair should pay the money they generate  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
And I think the new EU law about refund for delay and no support for smaller airports will make Ryanair very very sad.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: JGPH1A
Posted 2004-02-17 16:21:55 and read 10513 times.

Stefandotde - I don't think FR will worry too much about the EU Compensation rules - flights cancelled due to events beyond the airlines control are exempt. All of a sudden I think you'll find that all FR's cancellations are due to weather  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Richardw
Posted 2004-02-17 16:53:36 and read 10467 times.

FR need to introduce more shuttle services with capped fares at say £169, that would get customers returning, and with fewer Saturday and Sunday variations.


Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: BestWestern
Posted 2004-02-17 17:26:42 and read 10419 times.

If Ryanair can continue cutting costs by more than passenger yields fall - they will survive and prosper. Me thinks that they are running out of ideas if they are now resorting to damaging the passenger experience further by removing window blinds, seat pockets, and reclining seats.

The recent profit warning was because yield is falling dramatically due to overcapacity. Next summer they will add 25% more capacity over todays overcapacity. Can they continue to cut costs to lower fares enough to fill these extra seats? To fill this Januarys capacity they had free offer after free offer, and load factors still fell by 5%+. They also cut their poor performing routes.

Using Continental's Pizza example - ryanair have long ago removed the toppings, the base is wearing thin, and all thats left is the box...

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: JGPH1A
Posted 2004-02-17 17:31:05 and read 10411 times.

Using Continental's pizza example, the FR experience is more like licking the anchovies out of the delivery bikes tire tread after the guy ran someone else's pizza over.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: LTBEWR
Posted 2004-02-17 18:55:44 and read 10330 times.

I hope some of these ideas of Ryanair don't come to US/International Majors or US LCC's!. Part of the problem for even LCC's is the quickly growing and in some cases exorbant taxes and fees at many airports and flights. For example some major offer $199 round trip airfares from JFK to LHR, but you have to add another $110 + in taxes and fees (mostly from the LHR side!) This puts pressure on the airlines to cut costs to the bone marrow to keep the true price competitive and profitable. If the flights are relativly short and where pitch is very tight you don't need reclining seats. No shades? People will probably place their jacket to cover the window. No seat pocket? Do as on trains and busses, use net pockets of a stretchy material. You still have the place for airsick bags, etc, but can safety check them quickly. The baggage handling idea would mean that all passangers and luggage would have to go through the full x-ray treatment, and unless hire a lot more security officers, then your security check costs will go up and may take longer than the flight! The PeoplExpress idea of paying a charge for check-in bags may be a good alternative, but then you have the costs of handling money/cc's payments, it may not save much in the long run. What's next for Ryanair, volunteer f/a's, gate workers & ramp rats?

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Startvalve
Posted 2004-02-17 19:07:08 and read 10296 times.

OK here is an idea. Rather than eliminating the window shades why not just eliminate the windows? Order the airplanes with a cargo door and at night when the airplane is otherwise not making money have it move freight? Out of courtesy I never recline the seat but is the savings really worth removing the recline option? Removing the seat pockets is good too I guess since I doubt there is an airline magazine to stuff in there and I think the safety cards on Ryan are on the tray table. As for the all carry on luggage.. What are they doing with all that empty belly space?

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Marcopolo747
Posted 2004-02-17 20:52:46 and read 10230 times.


Adding to Startvalve suggestions, as there will be no windows, why don't they do away with seats too ? Passengers could strap themselves directly in the floor carpet.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: SafetyDude
Posted 2004-02-19 03:27:20 and read 9929 times.

I think that Ryanair should consider to do what some Asian carriers already have of putting advertisements on the Safety Cards.

Think about it, move things around to create room, and voila: Not only will people know what to do in an emergency, they'll know what to buy after the emergency. And as an added plus, collectors can take the Safety Card with them and they will also forever have the ad!

Now there's a money-making plan...  Big grin  Laugh out loud

-Will

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Lj
Posted 2004-02-19 12:10:45 and read 9846 times.

And dear LJ, just remember that Ryanair is already Europe's most profitable airline company.

You mean that Ryanair is currently Europe's most profitable airline. Only time will tell if Ryanair will be amongst us in 25 years time (and if I reread my post I don't see anything where I said that they currently aren't making money or does the word "sustainable" get a different meaning?). They wouldn't be the first "star" to disappear.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-19 12:14:35 and read 9840 times.

But the thing is, LJ, FR have been around for a LONG time already - 10+ years. It's hardly an ignorant newcomer.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: FLYtoEGCC
Posted 2004-02-19 14:20:34 and read 9778 times.

If Ryanair suffers from major overcapacity during the summer, wouldn't it be sensible to withdraw a few of its 737-800s from unprofitable routes and lease them out over the summer? I bet there's a few holiday charter carriers in Europe alone who would be happy to lease extra capacity in the summer. Excel and Futura, to name two, are both 738 operators and sometimes have to lease extra capacity. FR's aircraft are probably suitable as they are in all-economy configuration. The only problem would be lack of IFE, but for short hauls within Europe, would this matter?

FR probably have no plans to do this, but it seems like it would make logical sense - they're not losing money on unprofitable routes, and they're making money from airlines paying to lease the aircraft.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: RyanairA320
Posted 2004-02-19 15:07:08 and read 9720 times.

Ryanair are Europe's largest and best low fares airline.

They have a brilliant on-time record, the cheapest airfares, brand new aircraft and friendly efficient staff. For the hundreds I save a year I can do without a window blind(like anyone uses them) ,reclining seat, a seat pocket filled with rubbish in exchange for a full LEATHER SEAT INTERIOR (scarce on national carriers).

Ryanair have not said they are enforcing hand luggage only. It's a proposal and a pretty good one. They will probaby charge for all hold baggage. Not a bad idea. Why should I pay for baggage handling fee's when Im only carrying hand luggage. It makes sense.

Ryanair are just taking another step in trying to convince the public that hopping on a plane is just like hopping on a bus. I wouldn't expect blinds on a bus and reclining seats. Infact on a bus your lucky to get a seat. That would have been Ryanair's next move but I've hard the JAA won't allow Hand rails and standing room only.

If you don't like Ryanair, don't fly them.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Stephen Boreham


With 16 countries, 88 airports and 155 Routes
Millions flying with them each year
They are hardly stuck for passengers.

RyanairA320

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2004-02-19 15:20:01 and read 9700 times.

Couldn't have put it better, FR320! For your take-no-crap attitude, I'll add you to my respected users list.

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: RyanairA320
Posted 2004-02-19 15:25:11 and read 9683 times.



Thank you Pe@rson. Much appreciated. Enjoy your upcoming flight. Sounds exciting

Topic: RE: Ryanair To Cut Reclining Seats, Window Blinds.....
Username: Jaspike
Posted 2004-02-19 15:38:44 and read 9671 times.

I was on Ryanair recently.. well, yesterday.
http://www.airliners.net/discussions/trip_reports/read.main/40289/

I've read the last few replies, haven't got time to read them all, so here are my views..

Window blinds... they ask you to have them up for takeoff and landing, no point in them. If they can get rid of them, they should do it.

Reclining seats. Getting rid of them would solve the problem of people taking up your space. I never recline my seat, there's no need unless you're on a long haul flight. Do Ryanair do long hall? No.

If Ryanair got rid of stuff like this, I'd still fly with them. If some people can't cope without a window blind or a reclining seat for just a couple of hours, they need help.

If the flights were long haul it would be a different story, but I don't see Ryanair starting a service to SYD anytime soon  Laugh out loud

This is a ridiculous plan by Ryanair! The "headrests" are there for a reason, i.e. to keep grease from hair off the seats.
I read in the paper in Dublin that they were going to get sponsors to buy the headrests, with their logos all over it. Don't know if that's been mentioned above, as I said, haven't got time to read all the replies.

I noticed something on yesterdays flight that I hadn't heard about before - advertising on the bottom of the tables. It looked like Mars had paid for loads of advertising on it, with food etc. to buy with prices in the middle  Big thumbs up

About the seat pockets now.. on the aircraft yesterday, the seat pockets were two horizontal pieces of material, and three vertical pieces. There is no need for seat pockets - they collect and hand out the inflight magazines, and you have to ask for sickbags. So the pockets can go..  Smile

Josh


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