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Topic: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: Airish
Posted 2005-05-07 17:03:30 and read 4788 times.

AI has added some more flights to its flight schedules for start in July 05 these being:

3 flights a week routing

AI452 New Delhi Kualalumpur 1555 2330 Tue Thu Sun

AI453 Kualalumpur New Delhi 1100 1335 Tue Thu Sun

Flights non stop

AI432 Mumbai Kualalumpur 0235 1000 Tue Thu Sun

AI433 Kualalumpur Mumbai 0030 0240 Mon Wed Fri

Flights non stop

AI310 AI311 will be extended to start, finish in Seoul at around the same time it seems

All flights will be operated with an A310

http://www.airindia.in/

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: Mrniji
Posted 2005-05-07 17:21:36 and read 4749 times.

I read this sometime ago in the tender section of AI (the KUL catering tender) - finally, AI wakes up due to the competition and starts with nonstops from BOM/DEL, as opposed to the flights from MAA via SIN (Texdravid, see, people in MAA had an advantage as opposed to us lousy North Indians - and West Indians  Wink ) -

with 9W and S2 in SE Asia, AI is doing the right thing.. I hope only that these 310 will be substituted by better a/c soon (though I prefer these widebodies to the 738 of 9W and S2) - something I don't understand.. what happened to the shorthauls AI once wanted to order (not those for AIX!)?

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: B747-437B
Posted 2005-05-07 18:09:25 and read 4694 times.

Air India is also adding (yet again) more flights to Bangkok and Hong Kong.

Bangkok which had already been increased by additional services extending to Shanghai and Hong Kong, will now have 2x weekly additional services added extended to Hong Kong.

Hong Kong which had been increased to daily service nonstop from Delhi and 3x weekly via Bangkok from Mumbai will be increased to 12x weekly (daily DEL-HKG nonstop and 5x weekly BOM-BKK-HKG).

Singapore is also going to get 3-4x weekly nonstop BOM-SIN services in addition to the 10-15x weekly nonstops to SIN from HYD, MAA and DEL.

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KU
Username: B747-437B
Posted 2005-05-07 18:34:35 and read 4660 times.

Sorry if my last post is slightly confusing. The summary of Air India services to East Asia for this summer will be as follows.

Bangkok (BKK) : 6x weekly nonstop to DEL, 5x weekly nonstop to BOM, 4x weekly nonstop to PVG, 2x weekly nonstop to NRT, 5x weekly nonstop to HKG

Hong Kong (HKG) : 7x weekly nonstop to DEL, 12x weekly direct to BOM (7 via DEL, 5 via BKK), 3x weekly nonstop to KIX, 4x weekly nonstop to ICN, 5x weekly nonstop to BKK

Singapore (SIN) : 7x weekly nonstop to MAA, 3x weekly nonstop to BOM, 4x weekly nonstop to DEL, 2x weekly nonstop to HYD, 3x weekly nonstop to CGK

Kuala Lumpur (KUL) : 7x weekly nonstop to MAA, 3x weekly nonstop to BOM, 3x weekly nonstop to DEL

Dhaka (DAC) : 3x weekly nonstop to DEL, 3x weekly nonstop to CCU

Tokyo (NRT) : 2x weekly nonstop to DEL, 2x weekly via BKK

Seoul (ICN) : 4x weekly via HKG

Shanghai (PVG) : 4x weekly via BKK

Osaka (KIX) : 3x weekly via HKG

Jakarta (CGK) : 3x weekly via SIN



[Edited 2005-05-07 18:38:04]

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: Mrniji
Posted 2005-05-07 19:02:18 and read 4627 times.

Quoting B747-437B (Reply 2):
Singapore is also going to get 3-4x weekly nonstop BOM-SIN services in addition to the 10-15x weekly nonstops to SIN from HYD, MAA and DEL.

Very good! I was waiting in particular for this.. all this is definitely a reaction towards 9W and S2 (the former being the only Indian nonstop ex-BOM to SIN)... AI is waking up.

Sean, are all flights on A310, or will the 74Ds, having extra capacity, be used on some routes?

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: Shawnnyc
Posted 2005-05-07 19:05:11 and read 4619 times.

How does AI do on their inter-asia flights like BKK to HKG and BKK to PVG? I'm sure they have to discount, but is local traffic on their inter-asia flights profitable?

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: Jasepl
Posted 2005-05-07 19:48:03 and read 4584 times.

Nice. Still, even after including all of these new services, this is still, at best, laughable:


As for the Seoul flights, whilst I'm sure some people will fly the route, I can't imagine why they would want to.

AI have, one again, come up with a wonderful routing of BOM-DEL-HKG-ICN. Why on earth anyone in their right mind would want to endure 13 hours (I think) on one of the ratty 310s as opposed to 7 hours on KE's 330s is beyond me. Maybe AI's customer base for these routings are curiously masochistic or it's something I simply cannot comprehend.

[Edited 2005-05-07 20:22:43]

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: B747-437B
Posted 2005-05-07 22:20:00 and read 4544 times.

Quoting Jasepl (Reply 6):
Maybe AI's customer base for these routings are curiously masochistic

Or maybe the bigger market to Seoul can be found in Delhi, for whom the 4x weekly 1-stop routing is just as good as any of the other options available save the 3x weekly Asiana nonstop.

This routing allows AI to optimise fleet utility on the Hong Kong runs (extending to Seoul and Osaka on alternate days) as well as pick up some good 5th freedom traffic. It ain't perfect, but its ideal for the constraints that AI is currently working under.

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: Jasepl
Posted 2005-05-07 22:44:48 and read 4532 times.

Touchy, touchy!

It is probably the latter then (something I simply cannot comprehend).

Quoting B747-437B (Reply 7):
Or maybe the bigger market to Seoul can be found in Delhi,

Fair enough. I would think this is a more business-oriented market then, because I can't for the life of me imagine Mr Singh take Mrs Singh and the 3.2 Little Singhs to Korea for Diwali vacation!

Quoting B747-437B (Reply 7):
4x weekly 1-stop routing is just as good as any of the other options available save the 3x weekly Asiana nonstop.

If DEL-ICN is a business dominated market, why would this be "just as good" an option? I, for one, would take CX's 4x weekly 1-stops on 330s over AI's tatty 310s in a heartbeat. But maybe that's just me.

[Edited 2005-05-07 22:46:13]

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: Carfield
Posted 2005-05-08 06:11:19 and read 4465 times.

Well HKG-ICN will be a good market to tap into... If HKG-KIX has been working for years, HKG-ICN will add nicely to the mix.

HKG-BKK is a tough market with literally a number of airlines flying this route, and its relatively low yield nature. However, HKG to india is a big enough market... stopping at BKK is just a way to fill up the flights (and possibly restriction on present bilateral air agreement between HKG and Indian government... since CX's Mumbai flight also goes through BKK).

Thanks for the news though! I am happy to see more Air India's planes at HKG... But I also hope to see more variety of a/c other than the boring A310. However I guess it is not happening soon till the new Boeing planes arriving.

Carfield

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: Mrniji
Posted 2005-05-08 08:12:54 and read 4407 times.

Quoting Jasepl (Reply 8):
I, for one, would take CX's 4x weekly 1-stops on 330s over AI's tatty 310s in a heartbeat. But maybe that's just me

JAson: PRICE!! If AI offers cheaper prices, even for their biz, they can do quite well.. and the routes have good 5th freedom potential  Wink

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: HB-IWC
Posted 2005-05-08 08:15:28 and read 4408 times.

Quoting B747-437B (Reply 3):
Jakarta (CGK) : 3x weekly via SIN

Jakarta has the potential to support much more than a thrice weekly service via Singapore. Two of these services make an additional stop at Chennai, so the CGK-originating, BOM-bound passengers is faced with a double stopover, and limited frequencies. The third flight makes a rather ludicrous CGK-SIN-DEL-BOM routing. No wonder SQ and MH are running away with the lion share of the Indonesia-India traffic.

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KU
Username: B747-437B
Posted 2005-05-08 12:35:03 and read 4388 times.

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 11):
Two of these services make an additional stop at Chennai, so the CGK-originating, BOM-bound passengers is faced with a double stopover, and limited frequencies

This will change from July. All the Jakarta flights will operate CGK-SIN-BOM, with an immediate connection also available to MAA at SIN (CGK-SIN arrives at 2030, SIN-MAA departs 2130 and SIN-BOM departs 2140).

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 11):
Jakarta has the potential to support much more than a thrice weekly service via Singapore

As you are probably aware, the India-Indonesia bilateral caps weekly traffic at 1000 seats for each side, so the most Air India could do would be to add a fourth weekly flight but nothing more.

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: Jasepl
Posted 2005-05-08 20:28:12 and read 4275 times.

Quoting Mrniji (Reply 10):
JAson: PRICE!! If AI offers cheaper prices, even for their biz, they can do quite well.. and the routes have good 5th freedom potential

Of course, AI always have the price "advantage".

Wouldn't it make more sense though to offer a better product and charge a similar fare as the competition? Thus turning an actual profit?

I guess it's better to stick to those goals that don't need divine intervention!  Wink

Still, I hope I never end up working at a company that forces their employees to take any of AI's multi-stoppers on the tatty 310s over pretty-much anything else!

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: TKMCE
Posted 2005-05-09 06:41:19 and read 4170 times.

Quoting Mrniji (Reply 1):
finally, AI wakes up due to the competition and starts with nonstops from BOM/DEL, as opposed to the flights from MAA via SIN (Texdravid, see, people in MAA had an advantage as opposed to us lousy North Indians - and West Indians )

Well Mrniji, the traffic flow is mainly between MAA and KUL (the ethnic traffic) rather than BOM. This is the reason why both Jet and Sahara are starting KUL flights from MAA than BOM.

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: Mrniji
Posted 2005-05-09 08:31:27 and read 4126 times.

Quoting Jasepl (Reply 13):
Wouldn't it make more sense though to offer a better product and charge a similar fare as the competition?

In my eyes, not necessarily.. but when AIX is fully launched, maybe

Quoting TKMCE (Reply 14):
Well Mrniji, the traffic flow is mainly between MAA and KUL (the ethnic traffic) rather than BOM.

Yes, but there is more than ethnic traffic (biz) - moreover, it gives the opportunity to commence the journey in MAA and end it in BOM/DEL.. the latter has prevented me often from taking AI, as their network within Asia was/is not the most comprehensive one  Wink

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: HB-IWC
Posted 2005-05-09 08:49:02 and read 4114 times.

Quoting B747-437B (Reply 12):
As you are probably aware, the India-Indonesia bilateral caps weekly traffic at 1000 seats for each side, so the most Air India could do would be to add a fourth weekly flight but nothing more.

Both governments seem to be gearing up for a round of talks to upgrade this number. Garuda is looking into restarting operations to India, and a round of bilateral talks could very well precede such a move. SQ and MH are running away with much more than a 1000 weekly passengers between Jakarta and India. And I'm not even talking about the large Indian community in Medan, where the late afternoon flights to SIN and KUL are often filled by large numbers of India-bound traffic.

Topic: RE: AI Re-starting Seoul Adding More Flights To KUL
Username: JoyA380B747
Posted 2005-05-09 14:04:58 and read 4058 times.

Why cant AI Extend the East Asian flights to US instead of doing that Via Europe, specially for LAX. BOM-FRA-LAX is a much longer direct flight flight than, lets say, BOM-NRT-LAX or BOM-ICN-LAX. I dont think the PAX will be less in these routes.


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