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Topic: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Emirates773ER
Posted 2007-05-31 05:49:52 and read 9667 times.

Just saw this on another aviation website:

Order No. 2007-A-176
May 29, 2007

IN THE MATTER OF an exemption from section 59 of the Canada Transportation Act, S.C., 1996, c. 10, to permit Emirates to sell, cause to be sold or publicly offer for sale in Canada a scheduled international service between the United Arab Emirates and Canada.
File No. M4212/E217-4
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Emirates (hereinafter the applicant) has applied to the Canadian Transportation Agency (hereinafter the Agency) for the exemption set out in the title. The application was received on May 17, 2007.

Section 59 of the Canada Transportation Act (hereinafter the CTA) prohibits an applicant from selling, causing to be sold or publicly offering for sale in Canada an air service without holding a licence in respect of that service. The applicant has applied for a scheduled international licence to operate a service between the United Arab Emirates and Canada. However, as the application is not yet complete, an exemption from the application of section 59 of the CTA is necessary in order to allow the applicant to sell, cause to be sold or publicly offer for sale in Canada the proposed air service prior to obtaining the applied for licence.

The applicant states that it proposes to start operating its service between the United Arab Emirates and Canada on October 28, 2007 and that it is in the process of obtaining a Canadian Foreign Air Operator Certificate issued by Transport Canada which is required to complete the licence application. Consequently, the applicant submits that in order for the proposed service to be viable, it must be able to offer for sale the service at the earliest possible date.

The Agency has carefully reviewed and considered the application and is of the opinion that in order for the proposed service to be viable, the applicant must be able to offer for sale seats at the earliest possible date. Therefore, the Agency finds that compliance by the applicant with section 59 of the CTA is impractical in the present circumstances.

Accordingly, the Agency, pursuant to paragraph 80(1)(c) of the CTA, hereby exempts the applicant from the application of section 59 of the CTA, thereby permitting the applicant to sell, cause to be sold or publicly offer for sale in Canada a scheduled international service between the United Arab Emirates and Canada, effective from the date of this Order, without holding the required licence, subject to the following conditions:

1. All passengers shall be notified, before reservation, that the international scheduled service is subject to government approval. All future advertising in any media, whether in writing or by telecommunication, shall also include this information.

2. The applicant shall apply its published tariffs, on file with the Agency and in effect, to sales of transportation.

3. The exemption authorized herein does not relieve the applicant from the requirement to hold a licence in respect of the service to be provided and, accordingly, no flights shall be operated until the appropriate licence authority has been granted.

4. The applicant shall arrange to provide alternative air transportation by an appropriately licensed air carrier, at no additional cost for all passengers who have made reservations with the applicant, or, if such arrangements are not possible or acceptable to the passenger, to provide a full refund of all monies paid by the passenger, should the international scheduled licence not issue.

The exemption granted herein does not exempt the applicant from the requirements of other legislative acts or regulations, including those of Transport Canada.

Does this mean we may see EK in Canada this fall?

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Addd
Posted 2007-05-31 06:07:24 and read 9619 times.

Well, not a word about it on EK website, that's for sure...

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: DL777LAX
Posted 2007-05-31 06:12:19 and read 9591 times.

I assume Emirates is going into Toronto. So, will we see daily service, or is there a restrictive bilateral between the two countries?

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Sebring
Posted 2007-05-31 06:37:55 and read 9493 times.

Quoting DL777LAX (Reply 2):
I assume Emirates is going into Toronto. So, will we see daily service, or is there a restrictive bilateral between the two countries?

Presently, there is.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: LouA340
Posted 2007-05-31 07:20:21 and read 9394 times.

With EK serving Toronto its been on and off for quite a while now. Didn't they have their chance a couple of years ago but did not take it because they requested daily service or nothing, and got the later. EY the pounced on it and is serving YYZ presently.
It will be interesting to see what develops out if this.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: LTU932
Posted 2007-05-31 09:07:24 and read 9238 times.

I thought that problems with any UAE carrier serving Canada were related to the bilateral between the two countries.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: WestJetYQQ
Posted 2007-05-31 09:13:20 and read 9223 times.

Quoting Emirates773ER (Thread starter):
a scheduled international service between the United Arab Emirates and Canada.

Damn. They stole my idea!  Wink

What equipment will it be? I'm guessing a 777 of sorts. Great to hear this news. I was waiting for Emirates to start service to Canada!  Smile

Cheers
Carson

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: CXfirst
Posted 2007-05-31 10:59:56 and read 9032 times.

As far as I know, the present bilateral restricts one carrier from each country to fly 6 p/week. Emirates wanted daily and refused to start until they had it. EY came, and took the rights quickly after EK said no.

EK are now hitting themselves for that.

-CXfirst

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Kappel
Posted 2007-05-31 11:07:27 and read 9009 times.

I'm still hoping that EK will come to AMS one day (with pax flights that is). I do find it odd, as AMS was always in the top 10 of biggest airports in the world (they have now dropped to 12 IIRC), but still has no service from EK, while a lot of much smaller airports do receive EK flights. As I understand it, slots are not a problem at AMS.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: BBADXB
Posted 2007-05-31 11:13:05 and read 8989 times.

@ Kappel: Thank KLM for blocking Emirates' flight path into AMS.

I think that Emirates has a Toronto service on the cards. There are a lot of Toronto-based positions with Emirates being advertised in Dubai at the moment.

BBADXB

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Jacobin777
Posted 2007-05-31 16:39:07 and read 8618 times.

Quoting Kappel (Reply 8):
I'm still hoping that EK will come to AMS one day (with pax flights that is). I do find it odd, as AMS was always in the top 10 of biggest airports in the world (they have now dropped to 12 IIRC), but still has no service from EK, while a lot of much smaller airports do receive EK flights. As I understand it, slots are not a problem at AMS.

..however landing rights are, and currently, EK is using it for their cargo-hauling... Smile

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Drgmobile
Posted 2007-05-31 20:55:50 and read 8340 times.

I believe these applications are required even if a carrier wants to operate via codeshare on somebody else's metal. Can anybody confirm? My point is that I wouldn't take this CTA notice as an indication that there is to be an imminent Emirates flight to Canada. The airline has made its interests well known but the bilateral is an impediment.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: CayMan
Posted 2007-05-31 22:55:20 and read 7916 times.

Unless I am confused, under the restricted bi-laterals are not EY already utilizing all of the available frequencies between UAE and Canada?

EY must be doing ok as I gather they are now non stop into YYZ, and I believe using the 346?

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: BHXFAOTIPYYC
Posted 2007-05-31 22:58:21 and read 7864 times.

Who said its YYZ? Could be somewhere decent like YYC !!! DXB to YYC - oil town to oil town.  Wink

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Emirates773ER
Posted 2007-05-31 23:02:31 and read 7797 times.

Quoting BHXFAOTIPYYC (Reply 13):
Who said its YYZ? Could be somewhere decent like YYC !!! DXB to YYC - oil town to oil town.

I am ready to pay a extra $100 on my ticket for that route to happen.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: FLYYUL
Posted 2007-06-01 00:48:50 and read 6936 times.

Remember that EK doesnt have daily rights.. they wont fly to YYZ unless its daily.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: CupraIbiza
Posted 2007-06-01 03:37:22 and read 6083 times.

One more small step towards total world domination. Keep it up EK, the world is yours for the taking

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: YOWza
Posted 2007-06-01 03:46:07 and read 6033 times.

There have been many rumblings at different volumes of EK coming into YYZ over the last 2/3 years. Till the bilateral is revised and EK get daily slots at YYZ this is not going to happen. I will believe it only when I am on board an EK frame on the ground at YYZ ready to head to the gulf.

YOWza

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Marco
Posted 2007-06-01 12:57:11 and read 5338 times.

EK are now hitting themselves for that

I doubt it. Unless you haven't noticed EK is doing well everywhere, EK doesn't really need Canada. It's Canada's communist behaviour that we should be picking on.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: UAEflyer
Posted 2007-06-01 13:08:19 and read 5322 times.

I called EK call center yesterday and i asked about a flight to YYZ direct from DXB, they said nothing on the system yet.
What is the truth on this issue?

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Sebring
Posted 2007-06-01 14:21:13 and read 5256 times.

Quoting Marco (Reply 18):

I doubt it. Unless you haven't noticed EK is doing well everywhere, EK doesn't really need Canada. It's Canada's communist behaviour that we should be picking on.

You don't even know what Communist means.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Naritaflyer
Posted 2007-06-01 14:29:44 and read 5235 times.

Emirates can fly into YYZ tomorrow if they wished but can only do it 3 times a week. I heard Clark somewhere talking about wanting to go to YYZ or YUL daily or not at all.
Sorry but EK wants YYZ or YUL, not YYC or YVR yet.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Paneuropean
Posted 2007-06-01 14:34:36 and read 5221 times.

Quoting BBADXB (Reply 9):
@ Kappel: Thank KLM for blocking Emirates' flight path into AMS.

This is such nonsense ! If so, EK would do the same thing to KLM at Dubai. AMS receives huge EK cargo operations. We will see EK pax at AMS in the future. However, they get higher yields on many European other routes, partly because of the heavy competition of KL at AMS. As many of us know O/D at AMS is low. The airport functions as transfer point, just like DXB.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Airbazar
Posted 2007-06-01 14:44:15 and read 5205 times.

Quoting YOWza (Reply 17):
Till the bilateral is revised and EK get daily slots at YYZ this is not going to happen. I will believe it only when I am on board an EK frame on the ground at YYZ ready to head to the gulf.

Oh don't you worry, it's coming. With AC receiving their brand new 777s and 787s they will likely want to fly them to the Gulf and will have to renegotiate the agreement. EK knows that, they're just getting a head start on the process.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Emirates773ER
Posted 2007-06-01 16:52:25 and read 5054 times.

Quoting Sebring (Reply 20):
You don't even know what Communist means.

Why else not allow a daily service?

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: YOWza
Posted 2007-06-01 16:53:06 and read 5054 times.

Quoting Sebring (Reply 20):
You don't even know what Communist means.

Well protectionism is on the fringe of communism so he's not far off in some respects.

Quoting Naritaflyer (Reply 21):
Emirates can fly into YYZ tomorrow if they wished

No they can't. Bilateral is restricted to one carrier from the UAE into Canada.

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 23):
Oh don't you worry, it's coming. With AC receiving their brand new 777s and 787s they will likely want to fly them to the Gulf and will have to renegotiate the agreement. EK knows that, they're just getting a head start on the process.

There is a sizeable Canuck population in the GCC and this is ready to be plucked but AC already have rights into the UAE and failing that could easily fly into DOH so there is no guarantee that AC are as keen on a revision as EK might be.

YOWza

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Marco
Posted 2007-06-01 22:44:31 and read 4859 times.

If I don't know what communism means, then why is EK blocked from entering Canada? To help a struggling, inefficient airline ...

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: BBADXB
Posted 2007-06-02 02:30:16 and read 4727 times.

Quoting Paneuropean (Reply 22):
Quoting BBADXB (Reply 9):
@ Kappel: Thank KLM for blocking Emirates' flight path into AMS.

This is such nonsense ! If so, EK would do the same thing to KLM at Dubai. AMS receives huge EK cargo operations. We will see EK pax at AMS in the future. However, they get higher yields on many European other routes, partly because of the heavy competition of KL at AMS. As many of us know O/D at AMS is low. The airport functions as transfer point, just like DXB.

Wrong! Dubai doesn't work like that. There's open skies, not tit for tat, and that's just it. Emirates cannot block KL or whoever from coming into DXB, but KL & AMS is another story.

Still Emirates has got AMS within its reach thanks to a very convenient double-daily service into Duesseldorf. Time to change tactics and allegiances at AMS perhaps? Most probably.

Tot sins,

BBADXB

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: CayMan
Posted 2007-06-02 02:53:32 and read 4715 times.

Quoting Marco (Reply 26):
If I don't know what communism means, then why is EK blocked from entering Canada? To help a struggling, inefficient airline ...

If you think you are referring to AC, well that is just a ludicrous statement to make. If AC is "struggling" you can bet there are a helluva lot of legacy carriers out there that would be thrilled to be "struggling" as badly as AC seems to be doing. As to 'inefficient", well there maybe room for improvement still but AC is a much much more efficient airline than before.

But the bigger issue is your suggestion that "communism" is an apt definition wherein international commercial aviaition rights are governed by bilateral air service agreements between two sovereign nations. By your purported definition of "communist" I guess most of the world is commie because bilaterals exists and always have between just about al countries. You might want to read a little bit of political theory. You can criticize and object all you wish as is your right, and if you don't agree with EK not having rights into Canada fine, but it has absolutely nothing to do with "communism."

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: UAEflyer
Posted 2007-06-02 13:30:16 and read 4530 times.

Quoting BBADXB (Reply 27):
Wrong! Dubai doesn't work like that. There's open skies, not tit for tat, and that's just it. Emirates cannot block KL or whoever from coming into DXB, but KL & AMS is another story.

Still Emirates has got AMS within its reach thanks to a very convenient double-daily service into Duesseldorf. Time to change tactics and allegiances at AMS perhaps? Most probably.

Tot sins,

BBADXB

100% right

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Gilesdavies
Posted 2007-06-02 15:00:37 and read 4480 times.

EK need to get their A340-500's into YVR!!! - That would be a goldmine route for them.

With Vancouver region having a very large enthnic Pakistani and Indian population, DXB would be a great destination as the connections to the Asian Sub-Continent are second to none.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Airbazar
Posted 2007-06-02 15:16:20 and read 4461 times.

Quoting YOWza (Reply 25):
There is a sizeable Canuck population in the GCC and this is ready to be plucked but AC already have rights into the UAE and failing that could easily fly into DOH so there is no guarantee that AC are as keen on a revision as EK might be.

True but that agreement will come up for renewal sooner or later.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Dabth747
Posted 2007-06-02 15:30:20 and read 4450 times.

Quoting YOWza (Reply 25):

off topic but why do canadians call themselves canucks?

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: MSYYZ
Posted 2007-06-02 16:32:26 and read 4384 times.

I posted this in October/2005 in the civil aviation forum , and i guess it is coming closer to reality :

"I heard the manager of "Emirates North America" on a Canadian radio channel (680 news) last Saturday saying that Emirates are looking at opening 2 destinations in Canada by Fall 2007 but didn't mention any cities by name . I am aware of the limitations of the Emirati-Canadian bilateral but may be Emirates will take advantage of the new direction the Canadian government is taking towards open skies policy . "

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Behramjee
Posted 2007-06-02 17:20:20 and read 4324 times.

Quoting MSYYZ (Reply 33):
"I heard the manager of "Emirates North America" on a Canadian radio channel (680 news) last Saturday saying that Emirates are looking at opening 2 destinations in Canada by Fall 2007 but didn't mention any cities by name . I am aware of the limitations of the Emirati-Canadian bilateral but may be Emirates will take advantage of the new direction the Canadian government is taking towards open skies policy .

I heard this too on the radio whilst driving on the highway...EK's VP Nigel Page gave an interview concerning the Canadian market and he did say that EK is seriously interested in launching YYZ but the bilateral agreement isnt in their favor right now and until it is EK wont be launching Canadian flights.

Also remember, this is just an application submitted by EK and it doesnt mean that they will be launching flights to Canada. Like someone mentioned earlier, EK can start flights to YYZ tomorrow if they wanted to but only 3 TIMES A WEEK MAXIMUM!!! And unfortunately EK's business philosophy doesnt believe in 3 weekly flights to any destination be it long haul or short haul !

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Paneuropean
Posted 2007-06-02 17:46:11 and read 4296 times.

Quoting BBADXB (Reply 27):
Emirates cannot block KL or whoever from coming into DXB, but KL & AMS is another story.

So, what's the story ?


AMS has an independent slot coƶrdinator who gives away slots through certain rules. EK is using quite some slots momentarily, which it uses for Cargo.

According to European law, KLM cannot interfere in giving away slots, therefor it is very unlikely that the Netherlands home carrier is stopping EK from flying to AMS. BTW, If there is an open skies agreement it should work both ways. My guess is that there is no rush for pax flights for EK, unfortunately.

Look at the map and you will find out that EK has quite some other busy places in Europe not covered.

Tot Ziens !

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Cslusarc
Posted 2007-06-02 17:53:15 and read 4293 times.

I would expect that EK could place its code on a transborder flight from EWR operated by CO (one EK's current codeshare partners).

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: MSYYZ
Posted 2007-06-02 17:56:11 and read 4283 times.

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 34):
I heard this too on the radio whilst driving on the highway...EK's VP Nigel Page gave an interview concerning the Canadian market and he did say that EK is seriously interested in launching YYZ but the bilateral agreement isnt in their favor right now and until it is EK wont be launching Canadian flights.

Also remember, this is just an application submitted by EK and it doesnt mean that they will be launching flights to Canada. Like someone mentioned earlier, EK can start flights to YYZ tomorrow if they wanted to but only 3 TIMES A WEEK MAXIMUM!!! And unfortunately EK's business philosophy doesnt believe in 3 weekly flights to any destination be it long haul or short haul !

The gentleman was talking in an assertive way as if it was a done deal , so i guess he knew back then something we don't know . He didn't mention any cities by name , but i believe YYZ is number one on their list .
I would take even 3 flights a week , the presence of EK in the Canadian market would be a great addition to the relatively small number of international Airlines serving Canada (compared to the US) .
Passengers would definitely benefit from the increased competition which hopefully would translate into lower fares as opposed to the high fares we are currently paying for long haul flights (again compared to the US) .

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: DYK
Posted 2007-06-02 19:11:46 and read 4239 times.

Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 30):
EK need to get their A340-500's into YVR!!! - That would be a goldmine route for them.

With Vancouver region having a very large enthnic Pakistani and Indian population, DXB would be a great destination as the connections to the Asian Sub-Continent are second to none.

Its hard to say what cities Ek will operate into, YYZ is a given but my money will be on YYC is the the other. It would be great to see them in YVR but dont think there is enough traffic.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: MSYYZ
Posted 2007-06-02 22:58:18 and read 4131 times.

Quoting UAEflyer (Reply 19):
I called EK call center yesterday and i asked about a flight to YYZ direct from DXB, they said nothing on the system yet.
What is the truth on this issue?

Hi there UAEflyer , the same thing happened to me with Etihad . I contacted them with a question regarding the rumors that were going on about Etihad going non-stop to Toronto . They said we don't have any info regarding this and surely enough only 2 weeks later , EY announced that it was going to fly non-stop to Toronto eliminating the stop-over in Brussels .

[Edited 2007-06-02 23:14:40]

[Edited 2007-06-02 23:15:42]

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: BBADXB
Posted 2007-06-03 01:08:12 and read 4056 times.

Quoting Paneuropean (Reply 35):
BTW, If there is an open skies agreement it should work both ways. My guess is that there is no rush for pax flights for EK, unfortunately.

Unfortunately you seem to be mistaking 'bilaterals' with 'open skies', which you ought to know that they're sort of the extreme opposites of one another. NO, IT DOES NOT WORK BOTH WAYS  wink  - That's exactly the point of open skies, i.e., that no matter how much the other side restricts and impedes your entry, be it worthless crappy slots or whatever, you're still offering the other side unlimited access, which is the case in DXB for just about everyone, the only exception being Israeli airlines, AFAIK.

You are right in that with a double-daily service into Duesseldorf, it is understood that AMS is not that much of a priority for Emirates. Btw, I don't care much about Emirates getting proper pax access into AMS, although I hope to see Emirates flying into Spain and Scandinavia ASAP.

Ma'a ssalema  biggrin 

BBADXB

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Threepoint
Posted 2007-06-03 05:19:42 and read 3955 times.

Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 30):
EK need to get their A340-500's into YVR!!! - That would be a goldmine route for them.



Quoting DYK (Reply 38):
It would be great to see them in YVR but dont think there is enough traffic.

Oh sure, there's lots of traffic. But low yield. I'd be surprised if YVR is on EK's near horizon.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: UAEflyer
Posted 2007-06-03 05:58:45 and read 3916 times.

Quoting MSYYZ (Reply 39):
Hi there UAEflyer , the same thing happened to me with Etihad . I contacted them with a question regarding the rumors that were going on about Etihad going non-stop to Toronto . They said we don't have any info regarding this and surely enough only 2 weeks later , EY announced that it was going to fly non-stop to Toronto eliminating the stop-over in Brussels .

But, that is to an existing service not a new one, if they will fly on October they should start accepting reservation as their new flight to Houston which will be launched on December

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: MAH4546
Posted 2007-06-03 06:10:09 and read 3906 times.

I can't believe there are people debating if Vancouver will be Emirates' second Canadian city. There is no contest here, it will be.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: DABTH747
Posted 2007-06-03 16:13:26 and read 3769 times.

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 34):

you have summed up this really well, thanks

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Threepoint
Posted 2007-06-04 03:27:05 and read 3557 times.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 43):
I can't believe there are people debating if Vancouver will be Emirates' second Canadian city. There is no contest here, it will be.

Based upon the myriad of reasons stated in above posts, this may take some time. What makes you sure the bureaucratic hurdles will be crossed in time for a meaningfully-timed EK announcement (ie: not a couple years from now)?

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: FlyDreamliner
Posted 2007-06-04 04:22:18 and read 3509 times.

Quoting Emirates773ER (Reply 14):
Quoting BHXFAOTIPYYC (Reply 13):
Who said its YYZ? Could be somewhere decent like YYC !!! DXB to YYC - oil town to oil town.

I am ready to pay a extra $100 on my ticket for that route to happen.

You really think that there is much demand between YYC-DXB and vice versa? I don't know. YYC might be gaining on YUL for #3 airport in Canada, but I think we'll see YYZ, YVR, and maybe even YUL before we see YYC.

Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 30):
EK need to get their A340-500's into YVR!!! - That would be a goldmine route for them.

They aren't flying their A340-500s and haven't announced plans to use their 777-200LR to fly to LAX, which would be by far the largest North American route they have not yet tapped. DXB to the west coast is, by the way, an exceptionally long flight because there are no current airways to provide transpolar service to the west coast, so they'd need to fly reasonably far off of the great circle route... especially when you factor in wind. EK whines about wanting a specialized 747-8 for DXB-LAX, but I have a hard time believing much until EK deploys something smaller to it and makes it work.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: MAH4546
Posted 2007-06-04 09:30:07 and read 3398 times.

Quoting Threepoint (Reply 45):

Based upon the myriad of reasons stated in above posts, this may take some time. What makes you sure the bureaucratic hurdles will be crossed in time for a meaningfully-timed EK announcement (ie: not a couple years from now)?

I'm not taking into consideration those hurdles. All I'm saying is that when Emirates is allowed to fly to Canada, Toronto comes first, and Vancouver comes second.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Pictues
Posted 2007-06-04 09:48:53 and read 3387 times.

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 23):
Oh don't you worry, it's coming. With AC receiving their brand new 777s and 787s they will likely want to fly them to the Gulf and will have to renegotiate the agreement. EK knows that, they're just getting a head start on the process.

No renegots needed as its 1 carrier per country 6 times a week so AC could start service tomorrow as no other canadian carrier is using the rights, however for emiretes to start they need renegots as EY is using the rights for the UAE currently

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Joost
Posted 2007-06-04 17:11:51 and read 3236 times.

Quoting Drgmobile (Reply 11):
I believe these applications are required even if a carrier wants to operate via codeshare on somebody else's metal. Can anybody confirm?

This is correct. A codeshare is, with respect to bilateral air agreements, equal to a flight operated by the own metal of a carrier. Here for example http://www.cta-otc.gc.ca/air-aerien/agreements/html/netherlands_e.html you find the bilateral air agreement for Canada and the Netherlands, clearly indicating the BD/LH codeshares operated by AC.

Another example are the KL/NW European codeshared flights. As the UK-USA air agreement is basically open skies for all airports except LHR/LGW, NW puts it's code on all AMS-UK flights by KLM, except AMS-LHR (but they do put their code on AMS-LCY, for example).

BBADXB hits in on the nail that indeed a country can proclaim a unilateral open-skies situation. Singapore has a similar unlilateral open-skies system; any carrier may operate from and to SIN and sell tickets from and to SIN, no matter how restricted other countries are.

There are many other situations, however, where an open-skies agreement actually is in a bilateral air agreement. There are many countries that say "We will only give your carriers open skies, if you give ours too" - for example the air agreements between the USA and Germany, France, Italy or the Netherlands, to name a few; and the new EU-USA agreement.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Sebring
Posted 2007-06-04 17:52:17 and read 3181 times.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 47):

I'm not taking into consideration those hurdles. All I'm saying is that when Emirates is allowed to fly to Canada, Toronto comes first, and Vancouver comes second.

If this takes long enough, somebody will come with a couple of 787-8s and fly nonstop to a couple of the key markets that would support an EK service to YVR. Absent those markets, the dynamics of a YVR service would change.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: Naritaflyer
Posted 2007-06-05 18:59:38 and read 2933 times.

Quoting YOWza (Reply 25):
Quoting Naritaflyer (Reply 21):
Emirates can fly into YYZ tomorrow if they wished

No they can't. Bilateral is restricted to one carrier from the UAE into Canada.

Well, two things. The Bilateral allows Emirates 3 flights a week and no Emirates would never fly to YVR or YYC. If there is a second city it will be YUL. Despite the oil in YYC there is not business or cultural link with Dubai. Montreal on the other hand has a vast Arab population and more business links with the Middle East.

This just in:

Emirates takes off for Toronto
Emirates, one of the world's most successful and fastest-growing international airlines, has announced its plans to start services to Toronto, a first gateway for the airline in Canada starting 29th October 2007.
United Arab Emirates: 8 hours, 46 minutes ago PRESS RELEASE


Emirates will fly its Boeing 777-300ER offering eight luxurious private suites in First class, 42 of its latest lie-flat seats in Business class, and generous space for 304 passengers in Economy.

The international service is subject to government approval.

The non-stop service between Dubai and Toronto is planned to operate three times a week. Emirates will fly its Boeing 777-300ER on the route, offering 354 seats in a three-class configuration with six tonnes of cargo capacity from Dubai to Toronto and 12 tonnes from Toronto to Dubai.

HH Sheikh Ahmed bin Saeed Al-Maktoum, Chairman and Chief Executive, Emirates Airline and Group said:

'Responding to market demand, the new route will provide a first direct link between Canada's largest city and Dubai, providing also convenient, ongoing access to the Middle East, Africa and the South Asian Subcontinent. We anticipate this route will be very popular, connecting Canada to our global network of soon to be over 90 cities worldwide.'

'This year marks a substantial investment in expanded services in North America, and with enhancements to our 777-300ER, we certainly look forward to launching operations in Toronto in October.'

The planned new route will provide travellers with access to all major Canadian centres with excellent connections available through Toronto's Pearson International Airport. Identified as the country's financial centre as well as for its world-class restaurants, cultural venues, trade exhibitions and hundreds of festivals each year, Toronto offers business and leisure travellers a host of reasons to fly the northern skies.

The Dubai-Toronto non-stop service will take 14 hours and 20 minutes and a return journey of just over 13 hours.

Making comfort a top concern on the long-haul journey, the aircraft will be fitted with eight luxurious private suites in First class, 42 of its latest lie-flat seats in Business class, and a comfortable Economy-class cabin for 304 passengers.

Passengers in all classes will enjoy the award-winning service from Emirates' international cabin crew recruited from over 100 countries around the world; meals prepared by gourmet chefs; as well as the airline's cutting-edge 'ice' (information, communication, entertainment) system, which offers a selection of over 600 channels of entertainment on demand and the ability to send and receive email and text messages from their personal in-seat entertainment systems.

Pending government approval, Toronto will be one of five new Emirates destinations in 2007. Earlier this year, Emirates announced plans to start services to Venice in July, Newcastle in September, Sao Paulo in October and Houston in December. Emirates' global route network currently spans 87 cities in 60 countries across Africa, Europe, the Far East, Indian Subcontinent, and North America.

Topic: RE: EK Coming To Canada
Username: MSYYZ
Posted 2007-06-05 20:08:59 and read 2859 times.

Emirates confirms service to Toronto
Emirates Confirms Toronto Flights (by Behramjee Jun 5 2007 in Civil Aviation)


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