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Topic: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: UTA_flyinghigh
Posted 2007-11-01 07:52:10 and read 9093 times.

Anyone else seen this :
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/14477433/detail.html

ATLANTA -- Authorities are investigating why two men tried to sneak knives and other weapons onto a flight from Atlanta to New York.

One of the men even made it through security and onto the Delta Air Lines flight.

Authorities also found 20 small knives wrapped in tin foil. And upon searching Patel's bag three more times, they found razor blades hidden in the battery compartment of a toy car.

Shakarabhai Patel, 64, who was traveling with Chhaganbhai Patel had already made it through security and onto the flight, which was bound for New York and then to India. Officials did not immediately indicate the relationship between the two men.

The plane was brought back to the gate and police said they found a box cutter and $5,000 cash in the second man's bag.


Was something major averted here ?

UTA  checkeredflag 

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: D L X
Posted 2007-11-01 07:58:10 and read 9066 times.

Maybe, but I really think this is the kind of thing that shouldn't be reported.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: PITops
Posted 2007-11-01 07:59:10 and read 9068 times.

How did they find the knives if he was already on the plane?

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Laddb
Posted 2007-11-01 08:00:40 and read 9049 times.

Quoting UTA_flyinghigh (Thread starter):
Was something major averted here ?

Probably not. My guess is they just did not want to throw them away and stupidly thought they could hide them. There are many more just plain idiots in the world than terrorists. The other major probability is the media has it all wrong.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Charlipr
Posted 2007-11-01 08:06:18 and read 9025 times.

But the big question is.....Why did it make through TSA???? Maybe Kip Hawley will come out with a press release saying that the TSO's did not think that those "knives" were a threat, like his other excuses he has made up throughout the years. That is another proof that the so called "security" that we have, is not real security!!!! It is just some make-up to make people think that we are flying on "secure" planes/flights.

TSA = Bunch of incompetent losers!!!!

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Halls120
Posted 2007-11-01 08:11:47 and read 8994 times.

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 4):
But the big question is.....Why did it make through TSA???? Maybe Kip Hawley will come out with a press release saying that the TSO's did not think that those "knives" were a threat, like his other excuses he has made up throughout the years. That is another proof that the so called "security" that we have, is not real security!!!! It is just some make-up to make people think that we are flying on "secure" planes/flights.

TSA = Bunch of incompetent losers!!!!

Couldn't agree more. All we've created with TSA is the illusion of better security, not real security improvements.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: EXAAUADL
Posted 2007-11-01 08:17:07 and read 8937 times.

Quoting UTA_flyinghigh (Thread starter):
Was something major averted here ?

i doubt it..Patel is Indian Hindu name..more liely a couple of nitwits.

Quoting D L X (Reply 1):
Maybe, but I really think this is the kind of thing that shouldn't be reported.

I agree

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: DLPMMM
Posted 2007-11-01 08:17:14 and read 8938 times.

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 4):
But the big question is.....Why did it make through TSA???? Maybe Kip Hawley will come out with a press release saying that the TSO's did not think that those "knives" were a threat, like his other excuses he has made up throughout the years. That is another proof that the so called "security" that we have, is not real security!!!! It is just some make-up to make people think that we are flying on "secure" planes/flights.

TSA = Bunch of incompetent losers!!!!



Quoting PITops (Reply 2):
How did they find the knives if he was already on the plane?

If you would spare the time to read the linked article, It appears that the large cache of knives and razor blades WERE indeed caught at the security check-point. The other passenger apparently was a travelling companion of some sort had $USD 5,000 in cash and a single box cutter that was smuggled through security and on to the plane. The plane was apparently recalled to the gate prior to take-off to re-search and investigate the travelling companion, where the box cutter was found.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: PITops
Posted 2007-11-01 08:19:45 and read 8925 times.

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 7):
If you would spare the time to read the linked article, It appears that the large cache of knives and razor blades WERE indeed caught at the security check-point. The other passenger apparently was a travelling companion of some sort had $USD 5,000 in cash and a single box cutter that was smuggled through security and on to the plane. The plane was apparently recalled to the gate prior to take-off to re-search and investigate the travelling companion, where the box cutter was found.

Thought they found more knives on the other guy while on the plane. Didn't really say they were linked.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: AirTranTUS
Posted 2007-11-01 08:20:15 and read 8910 times.

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 4):
But the big question is.....Why did it make through TSA????

Well, only one guy made it through, the other one was caught. So TSA is only half-incompetent.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Halls120
Posted 2007-11-01 08:25:57 and read 8881 times.

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 7):
The other passenger apparently was a travelling companion of some sort had $USD 5,000 in cash and a single box cutter that was smuggled through security and on to the plane.

What is TSA's excuse for missing a Box cutter during screening?

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Clickhappy
Posted 2007-11-01 08:26:55 and read 8879 times.

Why are they making an issue of having $5k cash.

Big deal. Not against the law. Like somehow this makes the guy more sinister  Yeah sure

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Charlipr
Posted 2007-11-01 08:29:38 and read 8861 times.

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 7):
If you would spare the time to read the linked article, It appears that the large cache of knives and razor blades WERE indeed caught at the security check-point. The other passenger apparently was a travelling companion of some sort had $USD 5,000 in cash and a single box cutter that was smuggled through security and on to the plane. The plane was apparently recalled to the gate prior to take-off to re-search and investigate the travelling companion, where the box cutter was found.

Ok! So why were box cutters later found on the other person??? Again, IT MADE IT THROUGH TSA!!!! Remember what those guys used that infamous day in the history of this country, let me remind you BOX CUTTERS!!!!! Don't you think BOX CUTTERS would be on the priority list for TSA to look after!!!! Actually, I was going thru ATL in Sept, and I caught a TSO, operating the X-Ray machine, falling asleep!!! I wanted to take a picture, but my camera was not within reach and also did not want to spark any controversy (i.e. taking pics of "security") which would have probably landed me in jail. I literally saw him close his eyes and keep his hand on the button allowing bags to go through with him not even checking it!!!! Now that is absurd!!!! So I went up to the supervisor and said, the TSO on lane 11 is falling asleep and they quickly went to talk to him.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: UTA_flyinghigh
Posted 2007-11-01 08:30:29 and read 8840 times.

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 4):
But the big question is.....Why did it make through TSA????

They were busy with the pax that had been SSSSed  Silly

UTA  checkeredflag 

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: GeorgiaAME
Posted 2007-11-01 08:37:26 and read 8798 times.

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 4):
But the big question is.....Why did it make through TSA????



Quoting Halls120 (Reply 10):
What is TSA's excuse for missing a Box cutter during screening?

Sorry, if you so much as ask the question, you don't deserve an answer.

I find the packed razor blades in a toy very disturbing. I can half see an idiot trying to get his prize knife collection onto an aircraft, but box cutter(s) and concealed razor blades? I have been saying for years, we are lucky with these bozos in charge that nothing has happened since 9/11. I don't care that their names are "Hindu". I am sure political correctness demanded that they not be screened as thoroughly as say a grandmother from Sweden, pushing a baby carriage.

"It doth reek to high heaven!" [Hamlet]

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Bla
Username: LHRBlueSkies
Posted 2007-11-01 08:45:07 and read 8748 times.

Quoting D L X (Reply 1):
this is the kind of thing that shouldn't be reported.

Why? To prevent mass hysteria, or cover up the facts?

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 4):
Why did it make through TSA????

Simple - because they were not doing their jobs properly.

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 7):
the large cache of knives and razor blades WERE indeed caught at the security check-point. The other passenger apparently was a travelling companion of some sort had $USD 5,000 in cash and a single box cutter that was smuggled through security

And letting a box cutter through is allowed / excusable / not an issue?! Jeez, give me a break!

The security at LHR gets criticized for being slow and a pain in the butt, and far more intense than anywhere else, but that's because we are still a major target for idiots or all persuasion, that the "it's never going to happen to me" methology is kicked into touch with a few sharp reminders (Lockerbie, GLA, etc) and we get checked on a daily basis by the DfT and a private monitoring company, and any breaches treated extremely seriously, and staff disciplined or sacked - no excuse. Yes, it could certainly be a whole lot better, but I'd rather that then the shoddy approach by some other 'security' agencies.

The only thing this incident will do is give those power-crazy schmucks at the TSA more argument for bringing in ridiculous rules and procedures....super!

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: BR715-A1-30
Posted 2007-11-01 08:51:53 and read 8722 times.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
"It doth reek to high heaven!" [Hamlet]

A-MEN!! BROTHER!!!!

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Ikramerica
Posted 2007-11-01 09:03:01 and read 8649 times.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 5):
Couldn't agree more. All we've created with TSA is the illusion of better security, not real security improvements.

On 9/11, each group of hijackers all got aboard. Not one was stopped.

But what if 2 out of each 5 were caught at security? 3 out of 5? Would they still have been able to take over the planes?

Security doesn't have to be 100% perfect to have an impact. Part of the TSA buildup was to disrupt plans like 9/11 from being executed. Part of being a martyr is not being caught and spending your life in prison. The added likelihood of being caught has led to these crazies looking to other methods of attack.

If this were some kind of plot, it seems like they found the guy with all the knives, and found his traveling partner as well, and they actually did their job. Not sure why people are blaming them for actually finding the guy?

But a 65 year old guy... probably not dangerous even with knives.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Flysherwood
Posted 2007-11-01 09:06:47 and read 8626 times.

People bitch and moan about how long the security lines are and how long it takes, yet when something gets missed, which will happen with the sheer number of bags that are to be looked at, everybody wants to know how the heck something was missed. I would love for you to try being the screener for one day and see how much you love it. What part of the fact that we have not had another major event since 9/11 do you not understand?  Yeah sure

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 4):
TSA = Bunch of incompetent losers!!!!

 no   no 

I am not a particular fan of the TSA as it is a hassle to not be able to travel with anything but 3oz. containers of liquid but I am amazed that nothing big has happened. Give them credit people.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Jpax
Posted 2007-11-01 09:13:42 and read 8594 times.

On the bright side...two old guys with knives versus an airline full of passengers ready to kill anyone who threatens their lives...well, you get the picture.  Wink

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: BigOrange
Posted 2007-11-01 09:34:31 and read 8513 times.

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 6):
Quoting UTA_flyinghigh (Thread starter):
Was something major averted here ?

i doubt it..Patel is Indian Hindu name..more liely a couple of nitwits

AFAIK most Patels are from the Gujarat area of India and are muslim..at least the many Patels I know are.

Quoting D L X (Reply 1):
Maybe, but I really think this is the kind of thing that shouldn't be reported.

Why?? Because it shows the system up for what it really is....Total BS

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: DLPMMM
Posted 2007-11-01 09:39:39 and read 8495 times.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 10):
What is TSA's excuse for missing a Box cutter during screening?

I was merely correcting several posts that stated incorrect information.

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 12):
Ok! So why were box cutters later found on the other person???

And some people continue to make misstatements of fact in exagerrating the weapons that got through. (There were no plural "boxcutters" that were smuggled through, only a single box cutter).

I am in no way excusing TSA for letting a single box cutter get through, but I do not believe in letting people get away with using exagerrations in their hysterical rants.

Quoting LHRBlueSkies (Reply 15):
And letting a box cutter through is allowed / excusable / not an issue?! Jeez, give me a break!

Where did I excuse anything? I only stated the facts as they were reported in the link (that many of the commenters were appaerntly too busy to actually read).

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 17):

 checkmark 

A rational train of thought!

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
I find the packed razor blades in a toy very disturbing. I can half see an idiot trying to get his prize knife collection onto an aircraft, but box cutter(s) and concealed razor blades?

That part bothered me too. At least that was the guy they did stop at security.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Charlipr
Posted 2007-11-01 09:48:30 and read 8458 times.

Quoting Flysherwood (Reply 18):
Give them credit people

I can't give them credit when they come up with stupid rules like the 3-1-1. Take for example this morning CNN had a reporter doing a special on "Airline Frustration." He was explaning that he forgot to put a little bottle of 3oz cream in the plastic bag. Anyways, he took it out and put it in the bin and was told that he would have to through it away because it was not in a plastic bag. WHAT THE F****K DOES THE PLASTIC BAG DO DIFFERENTLY WHEN SCREENING THE 3oz. BOTTLE!!!! He explained to the TSO that it was the same 3oz bottle, he just forgot a bag and there was none at the security checkpoint. Well he threw it away anyways. Ok, now, everyday I see the concession stands putting packs of water and other liquids thru the X-RAY machine so they can sell them past security. What is the difference between the water that the concession stand is putting thru security, from the one that I just bought outside security??? IT'S THE SAME FREAKING BOTTLE. BUT FOR SOME REASON BECAUSE I TOUCHED IT, NOW THE X-RAY MACHINE CANNOT DETECT LIQUID EXPLOSIVE'S!!!! C'mon, give me a freaking break!!!! That is the non-sense that I don't understand. So by allowing those multiple packs of water go through the X-RAY they are "saying" that our machines are good enough for 24/12oz bottles of water all tighlty packed, but not good enough for the 3oz bottle of gel that I forgot to put on a stupid baggy!!!!! So, I ask one question, is the TSA not worried about the Duty Free Liqour/Drinks that are sold thru security? Don't you think that an organized terror group would catch on and probably be able to pay-off somebody to stack bottles of "wine" in the racks with liquid explosive and have some militants buy those specific bottles and use them in the way we would not like!!!! Now the other thing that I don't understand is, what is the freaking reason why the x-ray machine not able to "scan" the 1 quart bag with 3oz bottles inside the hand luggage, but is capable of doing it outside of the hand luggage in a bin.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Haggis79
Posted 2007-11-01 09:50:18 and read 8444 times.

maybe, before getting all havoc on if those mens might have been muslim or not, one should actually mention that the article in question starts with the statement that "Authorities said they have ruled out terrorism" in this incident... or are you trying to  stirthepot ?  Yeah sure

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: D L X
Posted 2007-11-01 10:12:26 and read 8366 times.

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 11):
Why are they making an issue of having $5k cash.

Big deal. Not against the law. Like somehow this makes the guy more sinister

I think that adds to suspicion that wrongdoing is afoot. If you're carrying $5000 in cash... and you're a rap star, then you're not suspicious. (Maybe of smoking dope, but that's about it on a plane.) If you're carrying $5000 in cash, and you're heading to Vegas, then you're not suspicious. But the game changes when you're carrying weapons and $5000 in cash.

And remember, you waive your fourth amendment rights when you enter the secure zone of an airport.


And the two questions about why I think this should not be reported:

Quoting LHRBlueSkies (Reply 15):
Why? To prevent mass hysteria, or cover up the facts?



Quoting BigOrange (Reply 20):
Why?? Because it shows the system up for what it really is....Total BS

No. While preventing hysteria is usually a good idea (especially when you have the crooks in custody), the biggest reason to not tell the world that you've caught people is if you believe them to be members of a conspiracy. Operations security, also known as "a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush." If the other conspirators don't know that one of their colleagues has been caught, they will more likely continue doing what they are doing, giving authorities a better chance at catching them in the act. As Clickhappy noted, there's nothing illegal about carrying $5000 around on a plane. But what if all the conspirators had $5k today? If you noticed that someone had a briefcase of money, it might be a good reason to stop them and give them a more detailed search. BUT, if they know that one of their crime partners has been caught, don't you think they would probably call of the rest of the acts until the coast is clear?

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: MeanGreen
Posted 2007-11-01 10:15:57 and read 8350 times.

Charlipr,

I understand your frustrations but you shouldn't take it out on the front line screeners. They are given a procedure to do and they do it. You should complain to someone higher up if you don't like something because there is nothing that the screener can do. Calling TSA a bunch of incompetent idiots isn't really nice or true. Many people that work there do so part-time and are just trying to make their way through college. Every organization has idiots but it isn't fair to catogize someone as an incompetent idiot just because they work for a certain organization. I hope everyone stays safe flying and I wish there wasn't a need for the TSA, but sadly there is a need for the TSA.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Flysherwood
Posted 2007-11-01 10:22:11 and read 8556 times.

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 22):
I can't give them credit when they come up with stupid rules like the 3-1-1

Again, what part of NO major incident since 9/11 do you NOT UNDERSTAND? Is it the man on the line the ones that makes the rules? NO. Is it his fault that some JACKA** religious fundamentalist from Britain caused a worldwide scare? NO. So if the Department of Homeland Security doesn't do something about the threat right away, like banning liquids and something happened, what is someone like you going to say about TSA then? The rules of travel are what they are. That person not bringing a plastic bag is at fault, not the TSO. Anyone who has traveled at least once in the last year should know the liquid rule by now. So what the F*** is the problem?

Oh and on the water on the other side of th security checkpoints? How the heck is the government supposed to pay for all this security if not by taxing the water inside the airport. They want you to buy it there!!!  Wink

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Evan767
Posted 2007-11-01 11:59:52 and read 8348 times.

Some people in this thread need to go to Anger Management. Cry to them about your problem with TSA, not us.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: LAXspotter
Posted 2007-11-01 12:03:58 and read 8348 times.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 17):
But a 65 year old guy... probably not dangerous even with knives.

probably a very naive Indian  duck 

for all of you who dont know, Patel is a purely Indian name hailing from the State of Gujrat, has nothing to with Terrorism, Arabs, Muslims.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: D L X
Posted 2007-11-01 12:07:08 and read 8327 times.

Quoting LAXspotter (Reply 28):
Patel is a purely Indian name hailing from the State of Gujrat, has nothing to with Terrorism, Arabs, Muslims.

And terrorists have to be arabs or muslims?

I know you don't believe that, so I'm not going to accuse you of it. But think about what you said.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: LAXspotter
Posted 2007-11-01 12:16:42 and read 8274 times.

Quoting D L X (Reply 29):
And terrorists have to be arabs or muslims?

no, no, no. I'm just saying before they accuse the "Patel's" of being alleged "Muslim Terrorists". Anyone can be a terrorist, you dont have to look a certain way to have a certain name, but before they make the Judgement that a Patel was an Arab, that is what I was trying to say.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: LHRBlueSkies
Posted 2007-11-01 12:58:32 and read 8166 times.

Dear All, there are several issues being raised here - here's my 2nd 2 cents worth!

Don't discount anyone because of their age - may I ask how old the uni-bomber was? Saying people of a certain age don't amount to a security risk is a dangerous, and almost foolhardy, path to follow.

Yes, praise the security staff who caught the knives, but reprimand those that let another major item get through. Yes it happens, and security isn't, and never can be 100% secure, but there are some things that shouldn't happen, and this was one example of that.

Don't say 'what's the problem, the a/c got called back to the gate,' because it shouldn't have departed with a security breach passenger on board in the first place.

Yes, security is a tough, demanding and extremely repetitive job, and it's not easy staying 100% alert 24/7, but that's why there should be sufficient numbers of staff on duty to ensure adequate relief periods, and the procedures in place should cater for monotonous jobs and provide variety, and regular refresher training. It should also pay higher wages to attract workers of a certain calibre and work ethic, not simply people who see it as an alternative to working in a fastfood joint.

Don't blame British parts of the terrorist network for the state of aviation security because we are suffering from it on a worldwide basis, and it's mainly aimed at the policies and corporations of the US - I'm not saying it's right, but that's the reality of it.

Aviation is a target for a whole host of people with political, criminal or economical axes to grind - it's just how it is, and letting people know how secure and rigorous security protocols are makes it a less attractive target.

The reporting of this incident only highlights 2 issues. A breach of security occured, and how quick news agencies are to capitilise on such events. If there were indeed other members of the plot, then it would have been up to the relevant security agencies (FBI not TSA) to put a news blackout on the matter and follow it through to it's conclusion, in whatever manner they deemed appropriate. Obviously they felt they had everyone, so the news was aired.

On this occasion, it was more luck than anything that there was no terrorist action or loss of life. Let's be thankful for that, and work hard to make sure no more breaches take place.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: HAMAD
Posted 2007-11-01 13:45:55 and read 8041 times.

i understand the big deal about the knives, but why are they making big deal of the $5000? I my self when i go international i carry large amount of cash with me in an envelope with my other documents. domestic, its not a big deal, but sometimes when i go visit my family back from dubai, grandma gives me cash, my dad gives me cash, my aunts and uncles give me cash, and ofcourse if i can carry it with me on the airplane, i don't deposit it in the bank until i get to the USA, and ofcourse the imigration forms requires you to declare your cash value if its more than X amount of dollars.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Flysherwood
Posted 2007-11-01 13:46:56 and read 8034 times.

Quoting LHRBlueSkies (Reply 31):
Don't blame British parts of the terrorist network for the state of aviation security because we are suffering from it on a worldwide basis, and it's mainly aimed at the policies and corporations of the US - I'm not saying it's right, but that's the reality of it.

I don't mean to blame the British parts of the terrorist network for all of the state of security just the recent ban on liquids being brought on board since that is where the new threat came from.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: LHRBlueSkies
Posted 2007-11-01 14:13:47 and read 7974 times.

Quoting Flysherwood (Reply 33):
just the recent ban on liquids being brought on board since that is where the new threat came from.

And do you know just how close we came to having 10 a/c brought down over the atlantic? If you did, then maybe you'd be more understanding of why liquids rules are as they are.

What needs to happen is a common set of rules that apply throughout the aviation world - period. This would stop 99% of complaints and misunderstandings. Something I believe the Arab league of airlines stated just the last few days.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Flysherwood
Posted 2007-11-01 15:25:40 and read 7829 times.

Quoting LHRBlueSkies (Reply 34):
And do you know just how close we came to having 10 a/c brought down over the atlantic? If you did, then maybe you'd be more understanding of why liquids rules are as they are.

Ummm... If you read my posts closely, I am very supportive of the bans and the rules. You must be talking about the guy that I was arguing with... I do know how close we came to having 10 airliners brought down.

Quoting Flysherwood (Reply 26):
Again, what part of NO major incident since 9/11 do you NOT UNDERSTAND? Is it the man on the line the ones that makes the rules? NO. Is it his fault that some JACKA** religious fundamentalist from Britain caused a worldwide scare? NO. So if the Department of Homeland Security doesn't do something about the threat right away, like banning liquids and something happened, what is someone like you going to say about TSA then?

There is my post once again.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Bla
Username: Analog
Posted 2007-11-01 15:27:08 and read 7828 times.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 17):

On 9/11, each group of hijackers all got aboard. Not one was stopped.

Why should they have been stopped? I don't think they were carrying anything against the rules.

Quoting Flysherwood (Reply 26):
Again, what part of NO major incident since 9/11 do you NOT UNDERSTAND?

See; my magic anti-terrorism rock is working!

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Bla
Username: Indy
Posted 2007-11-01 15:33:12 and read 7809 times.

Quoting UTA_flyinghigh (Reply 13):
They were busy with the pax that had been SSSSed Silly

Fortunately they stopped that bottle of shampoo from getting through  Smile

The whole gel and liquid thing is as stupid as it gets. I'd like to see a powder ban. As long as I can bring powder through I can get the liquid I need in flight to completely my formula. Just like this stupid sports drink ban. Buy the powdered variety and use the water the airline gives you in flight to mix it up an have your banned sports drink.

Just stupid if you ask me. Ban all carry on bags and make people go naked and through and get exams. That should solve the problem.  Smile

Oh and another stupid thing about that liquid restrictions. Just join up with a fellow passenger and combine your fluids. You know have more than the limit. (shakes head)

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Halls120
Posted 2007-11-01 16:04:55 and read 7487 times.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 17):
Quoting Halls120 (Reply 5):Couldn't agree more. All we've created with TSA is the illusion of better security, not real security improvements.
On 9/11, each group of hijackers all got aboard. Not one was stopped.

But what if 2 out of each 5 were caught at security? 3 out of 5? Would they still have been able to take over the planes?

First of all, the reason the 9/11 hijackers were successful was NOT because of lax gate security. The hijackings were successful because airline policy at the time did not permit crew to resist. The hijacked aircraft could have been taken over with ball point pens.

Second of all, the current screening set up is no more effective as pre 9/11.

Quoting Flysherwood (Reply 26):
Again, what part of NO major incident since 9/11 do you NOT UNDERSTAND?

What I understand is that the change of airline policy post 9/11 has more to do with the lack of incidents that the woefully incompetent TSA screening policy.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: QF74
Posted 2007-11-01 16:56:46 and read 6987 times.

LHRBlueSkies: I'm new here but if had made enough posts, you would be on my respected users list. Thanks for giving a fair and balanced account of airport security.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: SCUMBAG
Posted 2007-11-01 17:06:14 and read 6906 times.

Patel !!!! Just look in your phone book!! Patel is the MOST common Indian Hundi name in the world.... Still no assurance they were not up to no good, but if you have five grand, and going to India...... Who needs some crummy knives in your luggage? This story is just totally off the wall...

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: DTWAGENT
Posted 2007-11-01 17:17:15 and read 6794 times.

I can only speak about the money found. If you are carring that much money you are to declare it before leaving the country you got it in. And then declare it again in your home country upon arrival. The amount starts at $5000.00 and goes up from there.

About the other stuff. What do you expect. They had their budget cut and they are working everyone overtime. Some of these people get to work at 4:30am and don't get off work until 5:00 or 6:00pm. That is a long day if you have to do that 5 days a week. They need to hire more TSO's But, the budget is not their for them to do that. It will take another major event before Bush and his group will give them more money.

Chuck

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: SCUMBAG
Posted 2007-11-01 17:35:34 and read 6642 times.

$5000 now Thats a lot of slerpies and beef jerkies! The knives were to remove transplant organs for sale back in the usa?

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Continental180
Posted 2007-11-01 17:49:39 and read 6513 times.

Its just scary of what this has become....its truely sad

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Vald
Posted 2007-11-01 17:54:51 and read 6455 times.

Quoting D L X (Reply 1):
Maybe, but I really think this is the kind of thing that shouldn't be reported

WHY?

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Vald
Posted 2007-11-01 17:58:48 and read 6423 times.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
Sorry, if you so much as ask the question, you don't deserve an answer.

I find the packed razor blades in a toy very disturbing. I can half see an idiot trying to get his prize knife collection onto an aircraft, but box cutter(s) and concealed razor blades? I have been saying for years, we are lucky with these bozos in charge that nothing has happened since 9/11. I don't care that their names are "Hindu". I am sure political correctness demanded that they not be screened as thoroughly as say a grandmother from Sweden, pushing a baby carriage.

DON'T GO NUTS. This is a no story. press gone mad!

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: LAXspotter
Posted 2007-11-01 18:02:13 and read 6413 times.

Quoting SCUMBAG (Reply 40):
Patel is the MOST common Indian Hundi name in the world....

No kidding, but Patel can also be a Muslim name according to my friend. BTW, it really doesnt matter what his name or country of origin is. Anyone carrying knives on board should raise an eye, if that wasnt dont than it would be totally biased. It really should matter whether it be Patel or Smith, and its not up to us to speculate on what their intentions were without interviewing them or knowing about their background.

Quoting SCUMBAG (Reply 42):
Thats a lot of slerpies and beef jerkies!

allright, I dunno know if I should laugh or say "Hey...". BTW, most Patel's in the US own Motels, are not usually associated with 7-11's.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Vald
Posted 2007-11-01 18:09:53 and read 6348 times.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
But a 65 year old guy... probably not dangerous even with knives.



Quoting D L X (Reply 29):
And terrorists have to be arabs or muslims? I know you don't believe that, so I'm not going to accuse you of it. But think about what you said.

And maybe !, this man is an older gentleman just going home to his native land.
it is what YOU WANT IT TO BE......take it eazy,

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Vald
Posted 2007-11-01 18:25:38 and read 6227 times.

Quoting LAXspotter (Reply 46):
No kidding, but Patel can also be a Muslim name according to my friend. BTW, it really doesnt matter what his name or country of origin is.

lads,
in the 1940's certain names got you on trains.
in the 1800's certain names got you burnt at a stake.
my friend this, my friend that!
this is b******t

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Roadrunner165
Posted 2007-11-01 18:31:35 and read 6158 times.

Quoting Flysherwood (Reply 18):
I would love for you to try being the screener for one day and see how much you love it

Whats you point? The problem with the TSA is there are few checks and balances. TSA agents have a lot of authority and often abuse their powers. Quite frankly, the TSA does little to protect America aside from giving us false sense of security.

Adam

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Soon7x7
Posted 2007-11-01 18:42:32 and read 6048 times.

I'm just waiting for the day when TSA catches some character mueling an explosive device up his rectum...imagine what we'll all be subject to then...they'll ask congress to appropriate huge sums of money to conduct studies on locking butt plugs for pax, then the FAA will mandate more money because the butt plugs must be certified and FLAME RETARDENT, then to cover the expenditures, the airlines will be forced to increase fares again...wait a moment...didn't they just make me bend over at the TSA checkpoit...Ouch!

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Jetsa
Posted 2007-11-01 18:53:41 and read 5949 times.

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 4):
TSA = Bunch of incompetent losers!!!!

I agree with you entirely.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Philcresci
Posted 2007-11-01 19:13:08 and read 5813 times.

Wow...I think this is pretty serious and I am GLAD it was reported...I am traveling to ATL tom. and want to know to be more aware of whats going on.....5k and knives? Ya that is serious...with all the warning and every sign out there...no way he made a mistake and anyone who thinks that is naive....65 hindu, muslim american who cares.....what if he was just sneaking them past security in ATL and then was going to slip them to someone more dangerous in the terminal at JFK......wow...good job TSA....hope they dont let anything slip, but i have to be greatful for what they do catch!!!

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: NwAflyer07
Posted 2007-11-01 20:06:20 and read 5471 times.

Quoting UTA_flyinghigh (Thread starter):
it is a hassle to not be able to travel with anything but 3oz. containers of liquid

I love that rule! Now the terrorists will be forced to smuggle on 3 ounces of a chemical or virus in a liquified form and distribute it on an aircraft... It'd be just as bad in my opinion.

Quoting Charlipr (Reply 22):

No need to mention that security is a complete illusion full of loopholes and hypocricy. At MCO the TSAs tried X-raying a dolly that vendors were using to cart around drinks and stuff, but when it didnt fit into the metal detector they just let it pass right through. lol Theres an endless list of things someone can do to get somethin illegal through security... its the sad and scary reality. Short of allowing people to bring only their bodies to an airport, theres no way this can be solved 100%.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: WPIAeroGuy
Posted 2007-11-01 20:46:06 and read 5264 times.

You all are blaming the TSA for this, what about the idiots who brought the knives on the plane in the first place? I can't beleive people are actually defending them. If in this day in age you think you can hide razor blades in a toy car and carry 20 knives wrapped in tin foil on an airplane then you deserve whatever punishment you get. And 5 grand, 20 knives and razor blades, and a toy car are a pretty suspicious combination for a carryon. Yeah the TSA isn't perfect, and they make mistakes and need to change. Until drastically improved screening technology comes out, the only way to make security better is going to cause a ton of lines and will definetly be an invasion of privacy. Still, people will complain about how you can't jog through security because "I know I'm not dangerous". People complain about racial profiling, even though there is a stark correlation between certain descents and this type of incident, yet that same methodolgy is applied when you say "they were in their 60's what harm could they do." Profiling is profiling, if you going to profile someone out of suspicion, then you have to be able to profile people who are suspicious.

Long story short, instead of b****ing about the TSA, just follow the rules and make it go faster for the rest of us. If you have a complaint, or something really useful like an actual suggestion, then write to congress or a higher up in the TSA because all your doing arguing with a screener is holding up everyone else who actually can follow rules.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: PIA777
Posted 2007-11-02 01:17:56 and read 4423 times.

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 6):
i doubt it..Patel is Indian Hindu name..more liely a couple of nitwits.

Not always a Hindu name but the first names sound Hindu to me. I know a couple of Pakistani-Muslims who are
Patel.

PIA777

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Luv2cattlecall
Posted 2007-11-02 03:06:56 and read 4044 times.

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 6):
i doubt it..Patel is Indian Hindu name..more liely a couple of nitwits

I have to give you credit for implying the obvious - but taboo thing to say - that in all likelihood, terrorists tend to be Muslim or something similar  thumbsup 

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 10):
What is TSA's excuse for missing a Box cutter during screening?

Well, to their "credit," 50% is a nice improvement over their 24% catch rate at LAX!

Quoting Flysherwood (Reply 18):
but I am amazed that nothing big has happened. Give them credit people.

And ever since the postal rates increased, there have been no mail bombs, so give the USPS credit for that  sarcastic  . I think it has more to do with the terrorists knowing that pax will kick their ass in a heartbeat and also, terrorists knowing that they've already succeeded with their goal - to terrorize us. I'm sure when Osama found out about 3-1-1, he bought himself a Twinkie Cake or something because even he couldn't have imagined that absurdity. I suggest the following two links for further information:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:FSM_Pirates.png

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation

Quoting WPIAeroGuy (Reply 54):
You all are blaming the TSA for this, what about the idiots who brought the knives on the plane in the first place? I can't believe people are actually defending them

Not defending then and they're certainly idiots but I think the TSA deserves the heat for not doing their job as well. This is a crude example, but if you slept with someone (protected) knowing they had AIDS but contracted it anyways because Trojan had a few bad/leaky batches, aren't they partially at fault as well?

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: PipoA380
Posted 2007-11-02 03:34:57 and read 3923 times.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 5):
All we've created with TSA is the illusion of better security

...and real longer lines at airports...  banghead 

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: Bobnwa
Posted 2007-11-02 04:39:35 and read 3658 times.

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 11):
Why are they making an issue of having $5k cash.

Big deal. Not against the law. Like somehow this makes the guy more sinister

Who is making an issue of it. just mentioning it does not make it an issue.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: DLPMMM
Posted 2007-11-02 05:44:10 and read 3289 times.

Quoting NwAflyer07 (Reply 53):
love that rule! Now the terrorists will be forced to smuggle on 3 ounces of a chemical or virus in a liquified form and distribute it on an aircraft... It'd be just as bad in my opinion.

The reason for the liquids rule was that terrorist plots were uncovered using liquid explosives.

Quoting NwAflyer07 (Reply 53):
Short of allowing people to bring only their bodies to an airport, theres no way this can be solved 100%.

So many here are saying that since security cannot be 100%, we should have no security at all? Pretty lame logic if you ask me.

I hate the idiocy in alot of the security procedures more than most, especially since a fly more tha most people here (I am top tier on 2 of the major alliances' FF programs). I have been SSSSed multiple times, fondled by security personnel in countries around the world, questioned extensively, fingerprinted, photographed..... I got over it, why can't you?

There are a bunch of people posting here that really need to take a sedative.

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: LH526
Posted 2007-11-02 06:19:55 and read 3071 times.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 17):
But a 65 year old guy... probably not dangerous even with knives.

No ... not until he passes them on to a trained 25 seated two rows behind who went through screening without hassle!


Mario
LH526

Topic: RE: 2 Arrested At ATL With Hidden Knives/razor Blades
Username: DLPMMM
Posted 2007-11-02 06:40:14 and read 2915 times.

Quoting Luv2cattlecall (Reply 56):
Not defending then and they're certainly idiots but I think the TSA deserves the heat for not doing their job as well. This is a crude example, but if you slept with someone (protected) knowing they had AIDS but contracted it anyways because Trojan had a few bad/leaky batches, aren't they partially at fault as well?

NO!

It is all your fault because you knowingly slept with somone with AIDS, and everyone knows (or should know) that condoms are not 100% effective.

Your example does not hold water (or anything else apparently).
 Wink


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