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Topic: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: Jlbmedia
Posted 2008-01-30 19:53:35 and read 10849 times.

AA Flight from San Juan to PHL lands at Palm Beach Intl. with Smoke in the cockpit. Co-piolit brakes window to keep cabin from filling with smoke. Six injured. Link below.


http://www.palmbeachpost.com/localne...paper/2008/01/30/0130AMERICAN.html

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: Jasondn
Posted 2008-01-30 20:06:41 and read 10776 times.

What aircraft was this? I was on a few of those MD80's over the last few days! I hope it wasn't one of them!

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: Atrude777
Posted 2008-01-30 20:09:00 and read 10765 times.



Quoting Jasondn (Reply 2):
What aircraft was this? I was on a few of those MD80's over the last few days! I hope it wasn't one of them!

That would be quite the coincedence to get one of the over 300+ MD80's AA has in their fleet  Wink


Glad all is ok!

Alex

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: AlexPorter
Posted 2008-01-30 20:14:38 and read 10715 times.

It was a 757, but I don't have any other info. This is according to Flightaware.

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: ScrubbsYWG
Posted 2008-01-30 20:15:31 and read 10713 times.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/AAL1738

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: AAR90
Posted 2008-01-30 21:08:19 and read 10534 times.

Acft 624, a B752. R1 window (right front windshield IIRC) was broken. Both pilots going to hospital suggests an electrical short (fumes from insulation)... possibly from window heat circuit(s)?

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: Miamiair
Posted 2008-01-31 03:05:55 and read 10253 times.



Quoting Jlbmedia (Thread starter):
Co-piolit brakes window to keep cabin from filling with smoke

He opened it, if anything. Those windows are extremely hard to break. They are panes of laminated glass.

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: HAWK21M
Posted 2008-01-31 03:16:17 and read 10219 times.



Quoting Jlbmedia (Thread starter):
Co-piolit brakes window to keep cabin from filling with smoke

Why not just crank #2 Window open.
regds
MEL

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: Doug_Or
Posted 2008-01-31 03:21:23 and read 10206 times.

Article now says window broke on its own; pilots did not do it.

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: HAWK21M
Posted 2008-01-31 03:23:14 and read 10203 times.

I've heard of Window cracking Never Window breaking on a B757.
Somethings not right.
There are Two layers in the pane.
regds
MEL

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: UAL Bagsmasher
Posted 2008-01-31 04:27:53 and read 10096 times.

Sounds like the windshield heat controller or heating element took a dump causing the window to overheat and shatter.

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: Jlbmedia
Posted 2008-01-31 10:20:17 and read 9629 times.



Quoting Miamiair (Reply 6):
Quoting Jlbmedia (Thread starter):
Co-piolit brakes window to keep cabin from filling with smoke

He opened it, if anything. Those windows are extremely hard to break. They are panes of laminated glass.

The link I posted had the co-pilot breaking the window in it. The article has since been updated with more info and no longer suggests the co-pilot broke the window, just that it is now broken. Sorry if that was incorrect. John.

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: SJUSXM
Posted 2008-01-31 11:53:19 and read 9405 times.

The plane is still inop at PBI and another plane was brought in to ferry the pax to PHL and operated the SJU flight this morning.

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: QQflyboy
Posted 2008-01-31 13:23:32 and read 8911 times.

Here is the initial FAA incident report, although it does not yet add any new info to what we know so far.

http://www.faa.gov/data_statistics/a...reliminary_data/media/D_0131_N.txt

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: Aviateur
Posted 2008-01-31 17:03:21 and read 6691 times.

You could not break the glass of a cockpit window not matter how hard you tried. Even with an axe you'd be lucky to break it. Besides, there'd be no need to -- the side windscreens of a 757 can be opened manually.

Just raw speculation, of course, but it sounds to me like an errant window heat system that 1. cracked the glass, and 2. caused the smoke. Not an unheard of malfunction.


PS

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: Jlbmedia
Posted 2008-01-31 17:22:36 and read 6553 times.

Updated news report below. It reports that a heater in the Widescreen was the cause, breaking an inside layer of glass.

http://www.nbc10.com/news/15187250/detail.html?rss=phi&psp=news

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: MD80fanatic
Posted 2008-01-31 19:08:18 and read 5806 times.

Yes, the axe can easily break the window. It all depends on how fast and at what angle you hit it. Tempered laminated whatever.....it's still glass after all (an extremely viscous liquid).

I can't believe there was speculation that this might have been an MD80......shame on ya'. ;o)

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: Miamiair
Posted 2008-02-01 03:47:23 and read 5330 times.



Quoting MD80fanatic (Reply 16):
Yes, the axe can easily break the window

Not easilly. If you do, you will have been there for a while.

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: MD80fanatic
Posted 2008-02-01 06:12:59 and read 5237 times.

I guarantee you that I could go from being strapped in the pilot seat, to being on the tarmac lighting a cigar in less than one minute (holding the ax). Heck.....it's just an commercial airliner, not an armoured car.

BTW, I have seen a few photos, since being a member here, of large birdstrikes that very nearly penetrated the glass. Dude.....if a bony bag of biomass nearly makes it through......the tempered edge of that crash ax should go right through first attempt.

You cannot give the ax a Barbara Billingsly swing and expect to have it do it's job. You need to be serious about egress to make it work.


From http://www.avbuyer.com/Articles/Article.asp?Id=417

The "Crash" Ax
And finally for this round-up, most business turbine aircraft and all airliners come with a tool with the pessimistic name, "Crash" ax – a hammer-like all-in-one tool designed to cut seat belts, break out windows or shear through metal. This safety tool is arguably the oldest in aviation.

While pilots debate the effectiveness of these tools – great for prying back interior panels, not so great for cutting through metal – for the pilot who has needed one to sever an imprisoning seat belt and shoulder harness, then shatter the cockpit window, there’s seldom any controversy.

The relatively low-tech crash ax usually resides on the flight deck, though some aircraft carry more than one.

As a hedge, carrying a second in the passenger cabin and briefing passengers on its location is never a bad bet.


[Edited 2008-02-01 06:22:36]

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: ARFFdude
Posted 2008-02-01 08:25:30 and read 5086 times.



Quoting Aviateur (Reply 14):
You could not break the glass of a cockpit window not matter how hard you tried.

Not really... I guess you could do it with an axe, but it's going to take a while. Your best bet is a window punch tool designed specifically for that.

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: HAWK21M
Posted 2008-02-01 08:53:42 and read 5035 times.



Quoting UAL Bagsmasher (Reply 10):
Sounds like the windshield heat controller or heating element took a dump causing the window to overheat and shatter

Unlikely to cause more than a crack.Def not shatter the glass.
regds
MEL

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: OPNLguy
Posted 2008-02-01 15:16:12 and read 4867 times.

Here's the window:

http://www.ntsb.gov/Pressrel/2008/images/AA-757-cockpit.jpg

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: L1011buff
Posted 2008-02-02 01:59:54 and read 4707 times.

Maybe we need to call "Mythbusters" up to demonstrate it!

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: UAL Bagsmasher
Posted 2008-02-02 05:34:09 and read 4617 times.

HAWK21M, I've seen shattered windscreens as a result of a controller failure on our aircraft in the past.

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: XT6Wagon
Posted 2008-02-02 05:48:53 and read 4594 times.



Quoting MD80fanatic (Reply 18):
.....it's just an commercial airliner, not an armoured car.

you do know how they make armored glass right?

Its... laminated... glass.

Modern application use more plastics as the protection/cost has increased enough to outweigh the downsides of plastics.

I wouldn't be surprised if the only difference between airplane cockpit windows and lower level armor glass is that the cockpit windows have heaters in them to keep them from breaking at cruise altitude.

Topic: RE: AA Plane Lands With Smoke In The Cockpit
Username: HAWK21M
Posted 2008-02-02 09:25:25 and read 4502 times.



Quoting UAL Bagsmasher (Reply 23):
HAWK21M, I've seen shattered windscreens as a result of a controller failure on our aircraft in the past.

When you mean "Shatter" Do you mean crumble to pieces & fallen glass.......Thats what I mean.
Never happened on a B737 or B757 though.
WHCU malfunctions leads to cracked windshield that still stays in place.
regds
MEL


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