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Topic: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: N14AZ
Posted 2009-03-13 03:57:45 and read 13425 times.

Sorry if this has been posted already before - I didn't find anything in that respect.

Seems as if Emirates tries to postpone the deliveries of some A380s - similiar to what AF did.
Source in German: http://www.airliners.de/news/artikelseite.php?articleid=17598

Rough translation:

Quote:
Emirates is talking to Airbus about postponing the deliveries of A380s.
Emirates could postpone the delivery of several frames” said someone from Airbus.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Directorguy
Posted 2009-03-13 04:29:25 and read 13285 times.

I remember the days when EK couldn't get rhe A380s fast enough.
Perhaps the Airbus delay was a blessing in disguise. Had deliveries been on schedule, EK would have at least a dozen A380s in service now.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Kaitak
Posted 2009-03-13 05:19:20 and read 13062 times.

Perhaps EK could use the possibility of an A380-900 launch as a "trade off" against deferring some orders.

Alternatively, they could bring some A330-300 deliveries forward?

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Singapore_Air
Posted 2009-03-13 05:24:58 and read 13036 times.

An article on LesEchos has been posted.

My French is sketchy however it says that according to sources there are production problems at Airbus.

Airbus and EK are not commenting.

According to their information, the A380 coming in March is coming on 09 April instead. Two which are supposed to be arriving in August have been delayed to November and two will be delivered in December.

Factiva ECHOS00020090313e53d000d6

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Lightsaber
Posted 2009-03-13 06:34:57 and read 12713 times.



Quoting Singapore_Air (Reply 4):
According to their information, the A380 coming in March is coming on 09 April instead. Two which are supposed to be arriving in August have been delayed to November and two will be delivered in December.

Thank you, those are interesting delays.

It wouldn't surprise me if EK slowed A380 delivery rates. But by how much? This economy is very different than 2006. If the A380 had been on time, EK would have been able to fill the planes profitably (assuming that 'magically' the terminal/concourse work hadn't also been delayed as much as it was). Now its a slow economy. No more borrowing against the home for a vacation.

Lightsaber

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: N14AZ
Posted 2009-03-13 07:27:01 and read 12520 times.



Quoting Directorguy (Reply 1):
I remember the days when EK couldn't get rhe A380s fast enough.

Yes, I remember when Airbus announced last year that they want to get in contact with each client in order to clarify how the deliveries could by adjusted Tim Clark said as a reaction in one interview something like "Further delays would be a huge threat for Emirates' expansion plans".

Quoting Singapore_Air (Reply 4):
An article on LesEchos has been posted.
According to their information, the A380 coming in March is coming on 09 April instead. Two which are supposed to be arriving in August have been delayed to November and two will be delivered in December.

There was a similiar article in the German news today. But to be honest, I considered this as old news. Look what our a-net fellow Haan wrote on December 13th 2008 in the "A380 production thread":

Quote:
This seems to be the likely delivery months for Emirates A380's for 2009 to early in 2010.
Also seems like a few swops have been done with some MSN and registrations
from A6-EDI onwords as MSN 07 will join the fleet earlier now.

MSN 17 A6-EDE APRIL 2009
MSN 23 A6-EDF NOVEMBER 2009
MSN 25 A6-EDG NOVEMBER 2009
MSN 28 A6-EDH DECEMBER 2009
MSN 07 A6-EDI DECEMBER 2009
MSN 30 A6-EDJ MARCH 2010
MSN 42 A6-EDK MARCH 2010



It's exactly as described in the article

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Singapore_Air
Posted 2009-03-13 08:20:33 and read 12340 times.



Quoting N14AZ (Reply 6):
But to be honest, I considered this as old news

Hmm - I see. Evidently Les Echos would do well to consult the A.net A380 discussion archives for news scoops.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Ikramerica
Posted 2009-03-13 08:50:37 and read 12196 times.



Quoting N14AZ (Reply 6):
Tim Clark said as a reaction in one interview something like "Further delays would be a huge threat for Emirates' expansion plans"

Tim Clark says a lot of things. I've stopped believing him a long time ago.  Wink

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Ktachiya
Posted 2009-03-13 10:12:56 and read 11736 times.



Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 7):
Tim Clark says a lot of things. I've stopped believing him a long time ago

Sounds like he is becoming an iconic figure like Branson.

But seriously according to an article I read about Dubai property. It has slowed down a lot and that is inevitable given this economic environment. With speculation causing the problems in Dubai, the same sheer of the building boom would most likely never be experienced again.

Well according to a.net, since EK carries a large number of 6th freedom pax, they don't see this as any problem. But is this really so when more point to point routes are opened up? As great as EK's amenities are, there are wide gaps between the a/c type, etc. So are there any announcements forecasting the growth shrinkage in the DXB market and for EK?

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Ikramerica
Posted 2009-03-13 11:30:08 and read 10895 times.



Quoting Ktachiya (Reply 8):
Well according to a.net, since EK carries a large number of 6th freedom pax, they don't see this as any problem.

A.net people say this. But EK themselves have talked about the need for traffic into Dubai to support the growth. If that growth slows, the traffic to Dubai slows.

When various nations see no value in having unlimited traffic rights to Dubai in exchange for EK getting unlimited access rights to their country, open skies becomes harder to negotiate, and bi-laterals get stalled at current levels.

EK needs large O&D growth to support the Dubai argument to other nations that letting EK expand in their market is a good thing.

Without those treaties, EK growth must slow.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: PVG
Posted 2009-03-13 18:47:43 and read 8115 times.



Quoting Kaitak (Reply 2):
Perhaps EK could use the possibility of an A380-900 launch as a "trade off" against deferring some orders.

Perhaps they should cancel 50% of their orders as they never needed so many A380's to begin with and they can finally admit that their plans were a pipe dream from day one. The days of bankers throwing money around like drunken sailors are over. Dubai's huge BS story has been exposed, the party is over.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: MotorHussy
Posted 2009-03-13 19:04:21 and read 8023 times.



Quoting PVG (Reply 10):
Perhaps they should cancel 50% of their orders as they never needed so many A380's to begin with and they can finally admit that their plans were a pipe dream from day one. The days of bankers throwing money around like drunken sailors are over. Dubai's huge BS story has been exposed, the party is over.

Why don't you say what you really think?! Come on don't hold back. LOL, that's great.

Don't think the fat lady's sung yet though so there still may be a curtain call.

Quoting Ktachiya (Reply 8):
iconic figure like Branson

Sorry, but what do you consider Richard Branson to be an icon for? As an analogous extension, what does he symbolise for you? Just interested as I think the use of the term icon is at risk of losing its meaning.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 9):
Without those treaties, EK growth must slow.

Agree with you here.

Regards
MH

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: KL808
Posted 2009-03-13 19:15:48 and read 7957 times.



Quoting N14AZ (Reply 5):

Could this be a delay due to the interior showers?

Wasn't there an article that EK wanted to reduce the size of the water tank that it makes Airbus install into their A380's. They stated that F pax don't use the whole tank.
Maybe that's why the big gap from April to November & December.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: AirbusA370
Posted 2009-03-14 01:33:09 and read 6579 times.

The delay could also be caused by "redesign" of the Emirates specific cabin features like the showers and the awkward position of the crew rest. Also I heard that the operational issues Emirates had with the A380, came mostly from bad crew/maintenance training. Some delay in the deliveries would open space to train new crews and the old ones properly...

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Astuteman
Posted 2009-03-14 02:08:44 and read 6371 times.



Quoting KL808 (Reply 12):
Maybe that's why the big gap from April to November & December.

I have to say in the context of the current economic climate and prospects of wholesale deferrals, 6 months doesn't sound a particularly long time......

Rgds

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: MotorHussy
Posted 2009-03-14 03:07:22 and read 6095 times.



Quoting KL808 (Reply 12):
Could this be a delay due to the interior showers?

Any word on passenger reaction to these? Personally, I couldn't think of anything worse than being wet and naked then hitting turbulence.

MH

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: PVG
Posted 2009-03-14 03:19:01 and read 6037 times.



Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 15):
Any word on passenger reaction to these? Personally, I couldn't think of anything worse than being wet and naked then hitting turbulence.

So, how is that going to work safety wise? Do the showers have straps or a seat in them so that you can shower while buckled in during turbulance?

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: AirbusA370
Posted 2009-03-14 03:43:43 and read 5895 times.

This was discussed a while ago. The shower has a foldable seat inside, with belt. You might even continue your shower while seated  Smile

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: MotorHussy
Posted 2009-03-14 04:13:15 and read 5734 times.



Quoting AirbusA370 (Reply 17):
This was discussed a while ago. The shower has a foldable seat inside, with belt. You might even continue your shower while seated

Still, far prefer to shower on the ground in the comfort of the business class lounge after I get off the plane or at my hotel if I'm going straight there.

Regards
MH

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: APP
Posted 2009-03-14 09:09:45 and read 5193 times.

Wonder if the cabin crew will come round while you're in the shower to check your seatbelt is securely fastened. . . . . . . . could be interesting!


  

[Edited 2009-03-14 09:11:42]

[Edited 2009-03-14 09:12:12]

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Ikramerica
Posted 2009-03-14 11:33:23 and read 4898 times.

Der Spiegel is reporting that EK is delaying these planes due to financing issues. It's in the other thread about EK complaining about the plane not being good enough.

Notice how EK and SRB both complain to the manufacturers about quality/delays and then at the same time defer more aircraft because they don't want them/can't afford them. Seems like the first argument is a smoke screen for the second problem...

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Stitch
Posted 2009-03-14 11:36:27 and read 4887 times.



Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 20):
Notice how EK and SRB both complain to the manufacturers about quality/delays and then at the same time defer more aircraft because they don't want them/can't afford them. Seems like the first argument is a smoke screen for the second problem...

Well it is also a way to prod the aircraft manufacturer to improve their product in the interim, lest that deferment later become a cancellation when the customer is in a position to start taking product again and may have new options.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: NZ107
Posted 2009-03-14 22:23:48 and read 4612 times.

Will EK receive their 5th A380 in time to operate DXB-SYD-AKL daily as scheduled?

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: JoeCanuck
Posted 2009-03-14 23:17:07 and read 4583 times.



Quoting Stitch (Reply 21):
Well it is also a way to prod the aircraft manufacturer to improve their product in the interim, lest that deferment later become a cancellation when the customer is in a position to start taking product again and may have new options.

I suspect that the real prodding is happening in private. This is just advertising through journalism.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Alangirvan
Posted 2009-03-14 23:36:03 and read 4548 times.



Quoting PVG (Reply 10):
Perhaps they should cancel 50% of their orders as they never needed so many A380's to begin with and they can finally admit that their plans were a pipe dream from day one. The days of bankers throwing money around like drunken sailors are over. Dubai's huge BS story has been exposed, the party is over.

How have EK's financial results compared with the recent results of Air China, China Eastern and China Southern? How many EK flights operate with empty seats, or seats filled with people travelling at bargain basement fares? Has the UAE Government pumped emergency money into EK?

Are people in the UK or in the USA cancelling their trip to India/Pakistan this year? If EK's passengers in those countries are in the parts of the economy where jobs are being lost, or where retirement money is going down the drain, then that is what will hurt EK.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Stitch
Posted 2009-03-15 09:03:12 and read 4330 times.



Quoting JoeCanuck (Reply 23):
I suspect that the real prodding is happening in private. This is just advertising through journalism.

Blame SUH for that one. He is widely credited (if falsely so) as the man whose public words convinced Airbus to take what was a mildly-warmed over A330 and turned it into the A350XWB, so airline CEOs - who can't be lacking in the ego department - all must have taken that "lesson" to heart and started publicly castigating Boeing and Airbus on anything and everything they want changed.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Ikramerica
Posted 2009-03-15 16:16:53 and read 4266 times.



Quoting JoeCanuck (Reply 23):
I suspect that the real prodding is happening in private. This is just advertising through journalism.

That's how I see it. If you want to hide that your airline is in financial trouble, just make bigger news blaming the supplier for your problems at the same time. It has little to do with negotiations, it's more a matter of saving face for the ego driven airline executives out there.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: N14AZ
Posted 2009-03-16 05:57:18 and read 3983 times.

I already copied these links into the "EK-hapiness" thread but for the sake of order I would like to post the relevant passages in terms of deliveries here as well: http://www.faz.net/d/invest/meldung.aspx?id=100165729
http://www.intesatrade.it/intesa/New...DettaglioNotizieOggi&idNot=1729258

Quote:
Emirates Airline, the Middle East''s largest carrier, may review the delivery schedule for its A380 aircraft depending on market conditions but remains on track to receive seven of the super jumbos by March 2010, the company''s president said Sunday. "If the market softens on us, we''ll look at the delivery schedule of the aircraft. That''s just good housekeeping but we''ve not gone down that path yet," Tim Clark told Zawya Dow Jones in a phone interview. "I''ve had a routine discussion with Airbus over the delivery schedule of our future aircraft. We''re looking at the whole delivery line but we''re still going to get seven A380s in the financial year ending 2010. One of the A380s has been pushed back from December (2009) to January 2010 but that''s all that has changed," Clark said. Headded that Emirates would take possession of two A380s in April, two in November, one in January and two in March 2010.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: ZK-NBT
Posted 2009-03-17 01:20:17 and read 3728 times.



Quoting NZ107 (Reply 22):
Will EK receive their 5th A380 in time to operate DXB-SYD-AKL daily as scheduled?

Thats the plan I think, it said above the next aircraft will be delivered in April instead of March. It seems to be after that that there are delays.

Topic: RE: EK In Talk With Airbus About A380 Deliveries
Username: Scouseflyer
Posted 2009-03-17 02:04:30 and read 3674 times.



Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 20):
Notice how EK and SRB both complain to the manufacturers about quality/delays and then at the same time defer more aircraft because they don't want them/can't afford them. Seems like the first argument is a smoke screen for the second problem...

It seems to be considered a valid negotiating technique - pick a fight with a supplier to cover for your own inaddequacies......


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