Print from Airliners.net discussion forum
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/4428268/

Topic: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: CCA
Posted 2009-05-30 20:02:40 and read 29650 times.

Well it finally happened the first -400 is going to be scrapped.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/indu...77/First-747-400-heads-for-wrecker


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jonathan Rankin
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jay Piboontum




View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Joseph K.K. Lee
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Frank C. Duarte Jr.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Aaron747
Posted 2009-05-30 20:05:27 and read 29655 times.

This should be considered a criminal activity.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: TDubJFK
Posted 2009-05-30 20:19:06 and read 29590 times.



Quoting CCA (Thread starter):
Well it finally happened the first -400 is going to be scrapped.

Not true .. this one was ...

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Lee Collins

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Stitch
Posted 2009-05-30 20:35:34 and read 29484 times.

According to Boeing, the first 747-400 delivered went to NW. NZ did not get their first 747-400 until almost a year later.

The article itself notes this is NZ's first 747-400 that is bring scrapped, so it's not the first production frame.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: FL787
Posted 2009-05-30 20:52:44 and read 29406 times.



Quoting TDubJFK (Reply 2):
Not true .. this one was ...

What happened to the tail in that one? There is a picture of it in the water with it's tail still intact.

Big version: Width: 1024 Height: 704 File size: 208kb

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: ZANL188
Posted 2009-05-30 20:58:17 and read 29354 times.



Quoting FL787 (Reply 4):
What happened to the tail in that one? There is a picture of it in the water with it's tail still intact.

IIRC the tail obstructed the approach path to the runway and was removed with explosives.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Bohica
Posted 2009-05-30 21:02:15 and read 29329 times.



Quoting FL787 (Reply 4):
What happened to the tail in that one? There is a picture of it in the water with it's tail still intact.

It was quickly removed so other planes had adequate clearance while taking off. Where the plane rested, the tail was an obstruction.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: FL787
Posted 2009-05-30 21:09:48 and read 29282 times.



Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 5):



Quoting Bohica (Reply 6):

Ok thanks, it definitely looks like it was explosives and not carefully taken off.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Jbernie
Posted 2009-05-30 21:31:09 and read 29161 times.



Quoting FL787 (Reply 7):
Ok thanks, it definitely looks like it was explosives and not carefully taken off.

As they are known to say on Mythbusters... "when all else fails... C4"  Smile

Sad to see a 744 go, but like all things, it had to happen sooner or later. Doesn't appear to be any mention of it but would this aircraft have been due up for a D check or anything expensive in the near future? I would have thought a temporary parking might have been better or are Air NZ heading away from 744s and just focusing on 777s for long haul routes?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: 707lvr
Posted 2009-05-30 21:34:50 and read 29145 times.

Could this be the first 747-400 to be scrapped as in retired and not after having been damaged?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: 777ER
Posted 2009-05-30 21:55:13 and read 29077 times.

Quoting Jbernie (Reply 8):

It was coming up for a check that would have cost half its value basically. NZ tried to sell ZK-NBS for $10m. Its worth in parts right now sadly. -NBS had a test flight on Friday before its last long haul flight to the USA. NZ is replacing the B744s with B773ERs from next year.

Quoting 707lvr (Reply 9):

Correct

[Edited 2009-05-30 21:56:28]

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Zkpilot
Posted 2009-05-30 22:26:34 and read 28951 times.



Quoting 777ER (Reply 10):
Quoting Jbernie (Reply 8):

It was coming up for a check that would have cost half its value basically. NZ tried to sell ZK-NBS for $10m. Its worth in parts right now sadly. -NBS had a test flight on Friday before its last long haul flight to the USA. NZ is replacing the B744s with B773ERs from next year.

It is interesting that it is an NZ bird that is being scrapped as they look after their aircraft really well. I'm guessing that this is happening as a bit of a coincidence of factors...
1) GFC...and resulting downturn in aviation including aircraft values
2) D-Check...these are expensive and since the aircraft is not needed by NZ (or others it would seem due to the GFC) its value has slipped significantly...hence why it is not economic to give it a D-Check, instead it is worth more as scrap.
3) Other 744 of similar age/hours/cycles may have already had their last D-check so far as their commercial life goes and so there isn't much sense retiring them after that expenditure.
4) NZ is buying 77W to replace its 744s, it currently really only utilizes 6 out of its 8 744s (to be 7 after -NBS goes). 2 years ago it was using 6.5 with usually 1 spare and 0.5 in mx (772ER filled in etc).

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: KELPkid
Posted 2009-05-30 22:27:36 and read 28957 times.

Unfortunately, my suspicions are confirmed  Sad


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jim Weeden




View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jim Weeden



She was the first 747-400 I ever saw in my life, at the Expermiental Aircraft Association Airventure '98 fly-in at OSH . RIP, fair lady, been nice knowing you  crying 

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: United Airline
Posted 2009-05-30 22:34:32 and read 28903 times.

Did NZ order any B 777-300ERs? When was that?

How many B 747-400s do they have now? 7? I suppose they will stay for a while.

Hope NZ will order the B 747-8

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: United Airline
Posted 2009-05-30 22:45:52 and read 28824 times.

Oh yes I forgot they ordered 5 B 777-300ERs.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: 777ER
Posted 2009-05-30 22:46:15 and read 28801 times.



Quoting United Airline (Reply 13):
Did NZ order any B 777-300ERs? When was that?

Yes last year. NZ also recently confirmed one of their options

Quoting United Airline (Reply 13):
How many B 747-400s do they have now? 7? I suppose they will stay for a while.

7 now. All will be retired within a few years as the B773s arrive

Quoting United Airline (Reply 13):
Hope NZ will order the B 747-8

Highly unlikly as NZ are focusing more on B777/B787 size operations for the future

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Ambanmba
Posted 2009-05-31 00:04:38 and read 27991 times.

This is my memory of ZK-NBS ... stuck in NAN after engine #3 failed. I have the full story on my blog (with pics):

http://blog.ambor.com/2009/05/airnzs...rst-747-400-to-be-scrapped-my.html


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Alastair Bor

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: CCA
Posted 2009-05-31 00:20:18 and read 27808 times.



Quoting Stitch (Reply 3):
According to Boeing, the first 747-400 delivered went to NW. NZ did not get their first 747-400 until almost a year later.

The article itself notes this is NZ's first 747-400 that is bring scrapped, so it's not the first production frame.

NBS is the first 747-400 to be Scrapped every other -400 built is either Active / Stored or has been written off.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Superfly
Posted 2009-05-31 02:45:25 and read 26381 times.

I really hate reading stores like this.  Sad

Shame that no other carrier could have made use of this aircraft that has lots of life still left in it.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: ANstar
Posted 2009-05-31 03:39:56 and read 25784 times.



Quoting TDubJFK (Reply 2):
Not true .. this one was ...

Actually that would be considered a write off.... this is the frist crapping of a 747-400 by choice.

Quoting CCA (Thread starter):
According to Boeing, the first 747-400 delivered went to NW. NZ did not get their first 747-400 until almost a year later

You misunderstood... it is not the first production 744, buit the first 744 to be scrapped.

Quoting Jbernie (Reply 8):
are Air NZ heading away from 744s and just focusing on 777s for long haul routes?

Yes - they have 5 777W's due in the next few years.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: QF744ER
Posted 2009-05-31 04:10:58 and read 25431 times.

777ER,

What else have ANZ removed from -NBS?

I bet it's been sent to the US with high-time engines, APU and under-carriage.

Also do you know which operator is taking -NBT and -NBU as I recall reading these were to undergo freighter conversion?

tom/PER

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Jokestar
Posted 2009-05-31 04:34:09 and read 25260 times.



Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 1):
This should be considered a criminal activity.

i totally agree......in my opinion the Boeing 747-400 will always be the Queen of the Skies. The A380 has the biggest shoes to fill. All due respect to Airbus  Wink The 747 will always rule.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: EK413
Posted 2009-05-31 04:53:20 and read 25077 times.



Quoting FL787 (Reply 4):
What happened to the tail in that one? There is a picture of it in the water with it's tail still intact.



Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 5):
IIRC the tail obstructed the approach path to the runway and was removed with explosives.



Quoting Bohica (Reply 6):
It was quickly removed so other planes had adequate clearance while taking off. Where the plane rested, the tail was an obstruction.



Quoting FL787 (Reply 7):
Ok thanks, it definitely looks like it was explosives and not carefully taken off.

Just to add to the fact the adequate clearance was required for departing aircraft I also believe the tail was promptly removed to protect the carriers identity... Note the titles have been removed..??

EK413

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Kiwiandrew
Posted 2009-05-31 04:56:07 and read 25024 times.

I also have fond memories of this aircraft , I remember lining up with hundreds of other people to get a 'walk through' when it was newly delivered ( shortly before it headed off to spend a year with CX because NZ and their crews could not agree on operating it !!! ) , I also had a very enjoyable sector on it from AKL-HKG in November 2007 - best nights sleep I have ever had on an aircraft , one of the cabin crew had a great deal of difficulty waking me for breakfast ! but let's be realistic , it is nearly 20 years old , it has spent most of it's operational life clocking up high hours on long haul sectors , and as beautiful as it is the 747-400 is very much old technology these days . An aircraft ends it's days in one of three ways - a very small number get preserved , an unfortunate number get written off in crashes , and the vast majority get scrapped - at least unlike the CI aircraft written off at HKG when it was less than 6 months old ,as mentioned above , this aircraft did what it was designed to do day in day out , year in year out , for the best part of 20 years carrying hundreds of thousands of pax and many tonnes of freight . Remember her for that , and also remember her as one of the first steps into the future for aviation , as one of her last tasks for NZ was the testing of biofuels for the future , another job well done by her ....as well as looking to the past we do need to look forward . I am looking forward to trying out the new 777Ws when they start arriving late next year , complete with new interior products , and even more so I am looking forward to when NZ , as launch customer for the 787-9 starts taking ( belated ) delivery in early 2013.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Archer
Posted 2009-05-31 05:07:31 and read 24898 times.

What registration did it carry while flying for Cathy?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Ambanmba
Posted 2009-05-31 05:17:47 and read 24773 times.



Quoting Kiwiandrew (Reply 30):
An aircraft ends it's days in one of three ways - a very small number get preserved , an unfortunate number get written off in crashes , and the vast majority get scrapped

Fortunately, ZK-NBS never met the fate implied by the Jinxed Jumbo Jet moniker given to it by the New Zealand Herald in this article:
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=2897076

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Cchan
Posted 2009-05-31 05:30:35 and read 25704 times.



Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 11):
It is interesting that it is an NZ bird that is being scrapped as they look after their aircraft really well. I'm guessing that this is happening as a bit of a coincidence of factors...
1) GFC...and resulting downturn in aviation including aircraft values
2) D-Check...these are expensive and since the aircraft is not needed by NZ (or others it would seem due to the GFC) its value has slipped significantly...hence why it is not economic to give it a D-Check, instead it is worth more as scrap.
3) Other 744 of similar age/hours/cycles may have already had their last D-check so far as their commercial life goes and so there isn't much sense retiring them after that expenditure.
4) NZ is buying 77W to replace its 744s, it currently really only utilizes 6 out of its 8 744s (to be 7 after -NBS goes). 2 years ago it was using 6.5 with usually 1 spare and 0.5 in mx (772ER filled in etc).

While there is a trend for old near-retirement planes to head to African operators, I am not aware of any old, many-handed 747-400s with African operators in passenger configuration. Maybe it is a bit two big for many smaller carriers?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: AirNZ
Posted 2009-05-31 06:07:52 and read 25163 times.



Quoting Stitch (Reply 3):
According to Boeing, the first 747-400 delivered went to NW. NZ did not get their first 747-400 until almost a year later.

The article itself notes this is NZ's first 747-400 that is bring scrapped, so it's not the first production frame.

Perhaps, but I don't see where the TS meant/stated the first production frame.....I certainly, and immediately, took it to mean the first scrapping of a 747-400

Quoting ANstar (Reply 24):
Quoting CCA (Thread starter):
According to Boeing, the first 747-400 delivered went to NW. NZ did not get their first 747-400 until almost a year later

You misunderstood... it is not the first production 744, buit the first 744 to be scrapped.

Actually no, the TS didn't misunderstand at all.......you've quoted the wrong person.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Bigbird
Posted 2009-05-31 06:39:22 and read 24729 times.

Does anyone know the total airframe hours and cycles on this particular aircraft?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Lotsamiles
Posted 2009-05-31 06:58:58 and read 24484 times.



Quoting 777ER (Reply 10):
NZ tried to sell ZK-NBS for $10m. Its worth in parts right now

That seems quite low for a 744. Does that include the engines, or will they go back to NZ after the aircraft arrives in the USA for dismantling?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: DL752
Posted 2009-05-31 07:10:16 and read 24221 times.

Its so sad seeing these beautiful aircraft go.
They changed the industry and all work so hard!
Thanks to Boeing, all the airline employees, and the aircraft itself for
making the airline industry absolutely amazing!
We will miss you ZK-NBS!
DL752  Sad

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: QF744ER
Posted 2009-05-31 07:19:54 and read 24145 times.

When it was advertised it had just under 90,000hrs on it.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Babybus
Posted 2009-05-31 07:20:42 and read 24074 times.

Couldn't they make it into another hostel?

I presume these aircraft are fully recycleable? It's much better to scrap them them than have them sitting in the desert for a 100 yrs.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Stitch
Posted 2009-05-31 07:39:32 and read 23777 times.



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 27):
Perhaps, but I don't see where the TS meant/stated the first production frame.....I certainly, and immediately, took it to mean the first scrapping of a 747-400

I took it as the scrapping of the first production 747-400, but we're all clear now, so...  Smile

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: WESTERN737800
Posted 2009-05-31 07:42:39 and read 23712 times.

Its just sad to see a 744 still in flyable condition being scrapped.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: LTBEWR
Posted 2009-05-31 07:49:11 and read 23604 times.

I am quite sure the accountants for NZ crunched the numbers and dispassionatly presented them to the executives which justififes these decisions. NZ is in a business, by retiring with scarpping is probably in the airlines best business interest to do with this airliners.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Scipio
Posted 2009-05-31 08:39:17 and read 22957 times.

Boeing has built 448 passenger B744s. The replacement/retirement of those by their original users is fully underway and will intensify in the years ahead, as 77Ws, A380s, and (hopefully) 748i's enter into service.

So, there is a glut building up of used 744s trying to find new homes. Cargo conversion is a logical option, and there are still a lot of old freighters out there that could usefully be replaced by converted 744s. But the current state of the cargo market is not favorable, so we might well see a relatively large number of 744s being scrapped at a relatively young age.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Huaiwei
Posted 2009-05-31 08:49:21 and read 22751 times.



Quoting Bohica (Reply 6):
It was quickly removed so other planes had adequate clearance while taking off. Where the plane rested, the tail was an obstruction.

Not to mention the bad publicity it is generating too...notice the airline's name was promptly removed as well.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: FlyCaledonian
Posted 2009-05-31 10:09:02 and read 21794 times.

Another thing that would count against this aircraft is its RR RB211 engines. Apart from NZ, only BA, CX, SA and QF ordered the 744 with RR powerplants. So the demand for used 744s with RR powerplants is low. All those carriers have also taken 744s with GE powerplants (and in CX's case with PW powerplants too) from other carriers, or new (NZ -419s, QF -438ERs, CX 467ERFs).

BA could have up to 1-in-6 of it's 744's parked this Winter, and it'll be interesting to see how many of those make it back to the air (G-BNLB/G-BNLC have been parked for several months already). With such a large fleet of RR powered 744s it wouldn't be surprising if BA also scrapped one or two for spares.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: FRAspotter
Posted 2009-05-31 13:16:15 and read 19633 times.

I always thought the first 744 to be scrapped would be one of the 744Ds that JAL and ANA fly. Those planes have got to have extremely high cycles flying all those domestic routes multiple times per day...

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Viscount724
Posted 2009-05-31 14:44:38 and read 18893 times.



Quoting Stitch (Reply 33):
Quoting AirNZ (Reply 27):
Perhaps, but I don't see where the TS meant/stated the first production frame.....I certainly, and immediately, took it to mean the first scrapping of a 747-400

I took it as the scrapping of the first production 747-400, but we're all clear now

The first 747-400 built is still hard at work.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Wim Callaert
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ken Chen



View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Daniel Werner

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: PC12Fan
Posted 2009-05-31 15:15:20 and read 18218 times.

I remember when the almost simultaneous roll outs of the 747-400 and 737-400 happened when I was in college. To hear one of the first 744's is being scrapped because of age is depressing for more than one reason for me. I will be a -400 fan til they put me in the ground.

LONG LIVE THE 747-400!!!

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: UnattendedBag
Posted 2009-05-31 15:19:34 and read 18151 times.



Quoting DL752 (Reply 30):
Its so sad seeing these beautiful aircraft go.
They changed the industry and all work so hard!
Thanks to Boeing, all the airline employees, and the aircraft itself for
making the airline industry absolutely amazing!

you make it sound like this is the final -400 frame to be scrapped. It's only the first to be scrapped. there are still hundreds more out there. wipe those tears from your eyes.  Wink

just think about all the beer cans it will make!

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: 777ER
Posted 2009-05-31 15:30:42 and read 17989 times.



Quoting QF744ER (Reply 20):

as far as I know only the seats have been removed. Once the -NBS is at its final resting place, the wrecker will remove its engines and send two of the four engines back to NZ, the cockpit instruments will be sent back to NZ also.

NZ1 is best suited to answer the rest and more of your questions in detail

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: LVZXV
Posted 2009-05-31 16:16:10 and read 17462 times.

Say what you like about the RR-powered 744s, but to me they always sounded more "distinguished" than their PW/GE-powered counterparts.

As for the 744 in general, yes, this is the first to go. It is still a sad loss, given the potential longevity of the aircraft (20 years/90,000 hours is nothing for a 747) and the immaculate safety record of the 744 as a whole in the 21 years they have been in service.

Godspeed NBS. The 77W will never fill the 744's shoes as Queen of the Skies.

ZXV

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Viscount724
Posted 2009-05-31 17:46:30 and read 16620 times.



Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 38):
Apart from NZ, only BA, CX, SA and QF ordered the 744 with RR powerplants.

I know you're referring to passenger 744s, but just for the record 11 of Cargolux's 16 744 freighters are RR-powered. They switched from GE to RR after their first 5 744s were delivered.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Natalie Brüggemann

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Pellegrine
Posted 2009-05-31 18:24:12 and read 16123 times.

Booo

Quoting Jokestar (Reply 21):
.in my opinion the Boeing 747-400 will always be the Queen of the Skies

Yes!  checkmark 

Quoting Cchan (Reply 26):
While there is a trend for old near-retirement planes to head to African operators, I am not aware of any old, many-handed 747-400s with African operators in passenger configuration. Maybe it is a bit two big for many smaller carriers?

I'd think B744s are too big for most African carriers beyond ones like SA, KQ, MS...

Quoting Scipio (Reply 36):
So, there is a glut building up of used 744s trying to find new homes. Cargo conversion is a logical option, and there are still a lot of old freighters out there that could usefully be replaced by converted 744s. But the current state of the cargo market is not favorable, so we might well see a relatively large number of 744s being scrapped at a relatively young age.

I don't think there's room for 400-some 744CFs, so a lot of them are probably going to be scrapped for parts/metal.  Sad

Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 38):
Another thing that would count against this aircraft is its RR RB211 engines. Apart from NZ, only BA, CX, SA and QF ordered the 744 with RR powerplants. So the demand for used 744s with RR powerplants is low. All those carriers have also taken 744s with GE powerplants (and in CX's case with PW powerplants too) from other carriers, or new (NZ -419s, QF -438ERs, CX 467ERFs).

Yes and not many (if any at all, yet???) 744 converted freighters have RR engines.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: EA772LR
Posted 2009-05-31 20:05:25 and read 15201 times.



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 45):
but just for the record 11 of Cargolux's 16 744 freighters are RR-powered. They switched from GE to RR after their first 5 744s were delivered.

Any idea why they would make a switch like that? Were they not happy with their GE powered birds?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: SXDFC
Posted 2009-05-31 20:08:09 and read 15185 times.

Since SUJ is parked next to it does that mean shes leaving the fleet too?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: ZK-NBT
Posted 2009-06-01 01:34:41 and read 14830 times.



Quoting SXDFC (Reply 48):
Since SUJ is parked next to it does that mean shes leaving the fleet too?

NZ most of the week only need 4-5 744s currently meaning that other numourous ones are at AKL parked, for the next southern summer they will need 6 most of the time with the 7th being a spare parked at the Jetbase usually. There has even been an extra 772 parked next to NBS a couple of times recently.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Transpac787
Posted 2009-06-01 09:31:02 and read 14276 times.



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 40):
The first 747-400 built is still hard at work.

This is not correct, actually.

While N661US obviously comes first, numerically, ship 6303 (N663US) was delivered to NW prior to ship 6301 (N661US).

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Viscount724
Posted 2009-06-01 09:58:36 and read 14194 times.



Quoting EA772LR (Reply 47):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 45):
but just for the record 11 of Cargolux's 16 744 freighters are RR-powered. They switched from GE to RR after their first 5 744s were delivered.


Any idea why they would make a switch like that? Were they not happy with their GE powered birds?

I think the R-R engines on the later Cargolux 744Fs had certain parts from the more recent R-R Trent and were found to be more fuel-efficient, quieter, and have lower CO2 emissions than the GE engines.

However they will be switching back to GE on their 13 747-8Fs on order to replace their 744Fs as the new GEnx is the only engine currently available on the 747-8.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: SEPilot
Posted 2009-06-01 10:50:41 and read 14073 times.

It's interesting that a 777 was scrapped before a 744. As an aside, I saw a NW 744 in DTW about a month after they received their first one; I did not note the tail number. I've always loved that plane. As to the economics, it makes sense that with air traffic (and especially air cargo) declining so much that a 20 year old plane due for a D-check would be parted out. If a return to previous levels was anticipated soon, it might have been parked for a while, but obviously they are not anticipating that.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Danielb
Posted 2009-06-01 11:26:43 and read 13943 times.



Quoting Jokestar (Reply 21):
i totally agree......in my opinion the Boeing 747-400 will always be the Queen of the Skies. The A380 has the biggest shoes to fill. All due respect to Airbus The 747 will always rule.

Correct!! Try as they might, Airbus may have made a great aircraft in terms of performance and capacity, but they 747 is the real "Queen of the skies", and always will be.

Long live Boeing!!

Danielb.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: EA772LR
Posted 2009-06-01 11:36:51 and read 13889 times.



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 51):

I think the R-R engines on the later Cargolux 744Fs had certain parts from the more recent R-R Trent and were found to be more fuel-efficient, quieter, and have lower CO2 emissions than the GE engines.

However they will be switching back to GE on their 13 747-8Fs on order to replace their 744Fs as the new GEnx is the only engine currently available on the 747-8.

Yeah I knew that about the 748s being GEnx-only, but not the bit about the RR engines...very interesting. Thanks for the info  checkmark 

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: VirginFlyer
Posted 2009-06-01 18:28:57 and read 13542 times.



Quoting SEPilot (Reply 52):
It's interesting that a 777 was scrapped before a 744.

What 777 is that? The only one I'm aware of which has been cut up is G-YMMM, the BA 777-200ER which had the approach accident at Heathrow last year. But I'd certainly say that is more a write-off than a scrapping, and is analagous to the China Airlines 747-400, B-165, in Hong Kong, shown in replies 2 and 4 above. In addition there was the Korean Airlines 747-400, HL7496, which overan the runway at Seoul (photos) and the ANA 747-400, JA8955, which caught fire during maintenance in Bangkok last year.

So, it would appear ZK-NBS will be the first 747-400 not to have been involved in an accident to be scrapped.

I still have a magazine from 1989 (I think it was) which has an article about Air New Zealand's brand new aircraft. I don't know if it was -NBS or -NBT in the magazine. I also have to chuckle that years ago a made a beeline to Auckland Airport in the early hours of the morning to see ZK-SUH's "last" flight for the airline in January 2002 (okay, I may have been a bit over eager in my younger days). Funny to think that now SUH soldiers on while NBS departs. I should have slept in!

V/F

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Pellegrine
Posted 2009-06-01 20:59:23 and read 13311 times.



Quoting VirginFlyer (Reply 55):
What 777 is that?

Ex-BA G-ZZZE, ex-Varig PP-VRD, (among others): Boeing 777-236
LN:19 SN: 27109

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: NZ1
Posted 2009-06-01 22:23:18 and read 13209 times.



Quoting QF744ER (Reply 20):
777ER,

What else have ANZ removed from -NBS?

I bet it's been sent to the US with high-time engines, APU and under-carriage.

Also do you know which operator is taking -NBT and -NBU as I recall reading these were to undergo freighter conversion?



Quoting 777ER (Reply 43):
as far as I know only the seats have been removed. Once the -NBS is at its final resting place, the wrecker will remove its engines and send two of the four engines back to NZ, the cockpit instruments will be sent back to NZ also.

NBS is being flown direct to Roswell from AKL to be dismantled by a partner company. I won't name them. AFAIK the engines have been sold already, and none are due to come back to NZ, as we already have 3 spares for the remaining two RR aircraft. All seats were removed, plus some of the interior fittings that could be of some use for the rest of the fleet.

NBT and NBU are due to become freighters, though the contract hasn't been signed yet. This may still change.

Quoting SXDFC (Reply 48):
Since SUJ is parked next to it does that mean shes leaving the fleet too?

SUJ is due to leave around December next year. There is a deliberate policy to fly some aircraft less than others, in order to increase the time required to their D Check, thus potentially saving millions of dollars.

NZ1

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: NZ107
Posted 2009-06-01 22:30:05 and read 13132 times.



Quoting NZ1 (Reply 57):
NBT and NBU are due to become freighters, though the contract hasn't been signed yet. This may still change.

If it does go through, will it be completed as the 77Ws arrive? Or do they think that they won't utilise that many planes regardless so it doesn't matter?

And in regards to SUJ going around next December - how many 77Ws will NZ have by then?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Pellegrine
Posted 2009-06-01 22:30:35 and read 13138 times.



Quoting NZ1 (Reply 57):
to be dismantled by a partner company. I won't name them.

LOL is it that bad? Do they require armed guards for their execs? (joke)

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: NZ1
Posted 2009-06-01 22:58:53 and read 13112 times.



Quoting Pellegrine (Reply 59):
LOL is it that bad? Do they require armed guards for their execs? (joke)

Haha, no, it's just contractual that's all. If someone else wants to post the partner company that's fine, just so long as it isn't me.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 58):
If it does go through, will it be completed as the 77Ws arrive? Or do they think that they won't utilise that many planes regardless so it doesn't matter?

And in regards to SUJ going around next December - how many 77Ws will NZ have by then?

We should have 2 77W's by end of next year/Jan 2011. The plan is to retire 744's as the 77W's arrive, 1 for 1. Same with the 787. We will retire 1 772/763 for every 789 that arrives.

NZ1

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Trintocan
Posted 2009-06-01 23:58:20 and read 12964 times.

Well, that sad first has come around for the 747-400. After 20 years of sterling service we are now seeing an example being scrapped as opposed to written off in one form or another. What we are likely to see is that after it is scrapped the residuals of other 747-400s will start to fall as the used parts market is opened and so other airlines may choose to scrap planes of similar vintage. I remember when the first 737-300 went to scrap (an ex-Ansett one in 2001) and the first A320 (a CY example in 2006) they were soon followed by several others of each respective type.

As mentioned, though, it is interesting that the 747-400 has made it to 20 years before a retirement breakdown, rather more than many types (including the 777 after all). As many of us mourn and reminisce here, let us all remember that nowadays planes are generally kept going for many years - just look back to the 50s and 60s and you can read about planes being scrapped after just 5 or 6 years of service due to the greater relative technological advances at that time.

TrinToCan.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: SEPilot
Posted 2009-06-02 03:05:08 and read 12715 times.



Quoting Trintocan (Reply 61):
As many of us mourn and reminisce here, let us all remember that nowadays planes are generally kept going for many years - just look back to the 50s and 60s and you can read about planes being scrapped after just 5 or 6 years of service due to the greater relative technological advances at that time.

I have commented before on the fact that we are in the first era of aviation where planes have the chance to wear out before becoming totally obsolete. We are now seeing planes have the opportunity to wear out while they are still in production (the 744 actually just missed that, but the 777 and A320 did not.)

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: QF744ER
Posted 2009-06-02 05:37:46 and read 12457 times.

Thanks for that NZ1, keep us posted with anything else you hear.

When it was advertised earlier in the year it had 86330hrs and 11276 total cycles.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: NA
Posted 2009-06-02 07:56:07 and read 12269 times.



Quoting UnattendedBag (Reply 42):
just think about all the beer cans it will make!

If it comes to beer can metal Its the only time I prefer the 777 to the 747.  Wink

Quoting QF744ER (Reply 63):
When it was advertised earlier in the year it had 86330hrs and 11276 total cycles.

Thats nothing for a 747. Whats wrong with this paticular airframe?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Viscount724
Posted 2009-06-02 18:37:21 and read 11743 times.



Quoting NA (Reply 64):
Quoting QF744ER (Reply 63):
When it was advertised earlier in the year it had 86330hrs and 11276 total cycles.

Thats nothing for a 747. Whats wrong with this paticular airframe?

But with the economic crisis and oil prices heading up again, I doubt there is much demand for used 744s, meaning sale (or lease) prices would be low. If it needs a major check, it's probably not cost-effective to spend all that money. Likely worth more parted out.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Zkpilot
Posted 2009-06-02 19:32:24 and read 11656 times.



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 65):


Quoting NA (Reply 64):
Quoting QF744ER (Reply 63):
When it was advertised earlier in the year it had 86330hrs and 11276 total cycles.

Thats nothing for a 747. Whats wrong with this paticular airframe?

But with the economic crisis and oil prices heading up again, I doubt there is much demand for used 744s, meaning sale (or lease) prices would be low. If it needs a major check, it's probably not cost-effective to spend all that money. Likely worth more parted out.

It needs a D-check

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Trigged
Posted 2009-06-02 19:52:36 and read 11618 times.

My thoughts on this: It is better to see an aircraft serve a full life and end its days at the boneyard than the alternative, which would be destruction by accidental or nefarious means. I hope someone can get photos of this a/c while going through the process and upload them as a tribute to the years of wonderful service it provided thousands of passengers and crew.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: NA
Posted 2009-06-03 02:00:18 and read 11441 times.



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 65):
But with the economic crisis and oil prices heading up again, I doubt there is much demand for used 744s, meaning sale (or lease) prices would be low. If it needs a major check, it's probably not cost-effective to spend all that money. Likely worth more parted out.

I agree 20 years and D-check soon is a critical age for any airliner, hell, they are beginning to even scrap 777! Look at the non-ER 772s of CX or China Southern, which are not that old, but certainly no youngsters anymore. For sale for a year, no takers. Wonder if one of these belonging to an undesirable subtype might also go to the scrappers. Or look at all those 735s, United had already some scrapped which were just 15 years old.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: AirbusA6
Posted 2009-06-03 02:17:40 and read 11400 times.

As new 77Ws and A380s enter service, and with vast numbers of 787s and A350s due to enter service within the next 10 years, this will be the first of many...

There can't be many significant aircraft types out there that haven't had any aircraft scrapped (over than for accidents etc), the 737NG and the A330 (RIP) come to mind

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: The777Man
Posted 2009-06-05 15:07:50 and read 10779 times.

ZK-NBS left LAX today at about 1245 PDT in white colors with the tail in NZ green/blue but with no titles and markings. I guess it was going to the desert somewhere ?

The777Man

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: KELPkid
Posted 2009-06-05 15:11:52 and read 10754 times.



Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 66):

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 65):


Quoting NA (Reply 64):
Quoting QF744ER (Reply 63):
When it was advertised earlier in the year it had 86330hrs and 11276 total cycles.

Thats nothing for a 747. Whats wrong with this paticular airframe?

But with the economic crisis and oil prices heading up again, I doubt there is much demand for used 744s, meaning sale (or lease) prices would be low. If it needs a major check, it's probably not cost-effective to spend all that money. Likely worth more parted out.

It needs a D-check

Let me add to that, too, that that is one high-time 747-400. I found out, somewhere (can't remember where now) that she has over 90,000 hours on the frame. NZ must have been flying the hell out of her  Wink That's the equivalent of spending about 10.2 years in the air...they can't complain about getting that kind of utilization out of her.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: NA
Posted 2009-06-05 15:19:50 and read 10730 times.



Quoting KELPkid (Reply 71):
Let me add to that, too, that that is one high-time 747-400. I found out, somewhere (can't remember where now) that she has over 90,000 hours on the frame. NZ must have been flying the hell out of her   That's the equivalent of spending about 10.2 years in the air...they can't complain about getting that kind of utilization out of her.

LH has about three 744s of the same year (1989) which have clocked more than 100.000 hours already. And these will fly for at least another two years.

110.000 - 120.000 hours is nothing unusual for a 747. There are even a few which made it beyond 130.000.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: MSPNWA
Posted 2009-06-05 15:46:24 and read 10590 times.

Sad to see the first "whale" get scrapped, but considering it's been over 20 years since the first 744 entered service, it's quite an achievement all the same.

Quoting The777Man (Reply 70):
ZK-NBS left LAX today at about 1245 PDT in white colors with the tail in NZ green/blue but with no titles and markings. I guess it was going to the desert somewhere ?

Correct.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ANZ6390

It's landed for the last time.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: KiwiTEAL
Posted 2009-06-05 18:39:17 and read 10372 times.

Any spotters near Roswell who can get some photos of ZK-NBS's final days ?

I flew this aircraft a number of times during the 1990's - RIP old girl

KiwiTEAL

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Brons2
Posted 2009-06-05 19:04:39 and read 10293 times.



Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 73):
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ANZ6390

I guess it's ok to join Club 410 on positioning flights when you're flying a 744 Big grin

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: QF744ER
Posted 2009-06-06 03:42:51 and read 9934 times.

CX's early B744's are well into the 90,000hrs mark.

There are B744's which have done plenty more hours than -NBS. -NBS hasn't done a lot this year and it sat around when it was delivered before going to CX to operare regional flights.

It would be interested to know what hrs -NBT has on her.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: DavidByrne
Posted 2009-06-06 03:52:30 and read 9909 times.



Quoting QF744ER (Reply 76):
There are B744's which have done plenty more hours than -NBS. -NBS hasn't done a lot this year and it sat around when it was delivered before going to CX to operare regional flights.

Yes, my recollection is that it went to CX back in 1989 pending the resolution of an industrial dispute between NZ and its pilots over the number of flight crew to be used - can someone confirm that?

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: PlaneHunter
Posted 2009-06-06 05:57:44 and read 9711 times.



Quoting NA (Reply 68):
I agree 20 years and D-check soon is a critical age for any airliner, hell, they are beginning to even scrap 777!

One single frame has been scrapped - and allegedly the plane hadn't been in good condition after being used by Varig. So that single case doesn't indicate a trend.

Quoting NA (Reply 68):
For sale for a year, no takers.

And all of them are still in service, while other aircraft have been stored.


PH

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: NA
Posted 2009-06-06 06:43:11 and read 9611 times.



Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 78):
And all of them are still in service, while other aircraft have been stored.

Well, its interesting no one wants to buy them. And which pax aircraft have been stored by CX or China Southern over the last months? I cant remember reading anything in that direction. All of CX 744s and A330s are active for example. The 772"A"s were planned to be retired from earlier on this year. I expect some to be parked soon, latest when scheduled replacements arrive od which I have information at hand.

As for the 744, it would be interesting to know what BA is doing with the two frames parked last winter. Have they been stripped of anything? I doubt they´ll come back soon as the airline wants to park a number of 744s (likely some frames built in 1989) and 767s (built in the early 90s) next winter.

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: PlaneHunter
Posted 2009-06-06 06:57:24 and read 9594 times.



Quoting NA (Reply 79):
And which pax aircraft have been stored by CX or China Southern over the last months? I cant remember reading anything in that direction.

CX hasn't retired any pax aircraft, but transferred four 744F to the desert in the last few months. CZ has retired two 737-500, four MD-80 and four 757 since 2008.

My point is that airlines do store aircraft if it's necessary - and they keep them in service as long as it makes any sense. It seems both carriers still find it useful to operate their 772s.

Quoting NA (Reply 79):
Well, its interesting no one wants to buy them.

Masses of used aircraft are stored (including numerous brand new ones) - demand has just declined in general.


PH

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: SDQ777
Posted 2009-06-06 21:05:23 and read 9219 times.

They should put her in the Smithsonian Institute Not the scrapper for crying out loud!!  cry 

Topic: RE: First 747-400 Heads For Wrecker
Username: Zkpilot
Posted 2009-06-07 00:29:04 and read 9037 times.



Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 73):
Sad to see the first "whale" get scrapped, but considering it's been over 20 years since the first 744 entered service, it's quite an achievement all the same.

I didn't realise Airbus was scrapping an A380? Did we all miss something?? Thats the only whale that I know of. The 744 is the Jumbo or the Queen of the Skies.


The messages in this discussion express the views of the author of the message, not necessarily the views of Airliners.net or any entity associated with Airliners.net.

Copyright © Lundgren Aerospace. All rights reserved.
http://www.airliners.net/