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Topic: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Phatty3374
Posted 2010-01-23 21:56:01 and read 16594 times.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...le/2010/01/24/AR2010012400307.html

Reports of 20 injured after crash landing...hope the next news we get is good news.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Kaitak
Posted 2010-01-23 22:03:02 and read 16569 times.

Thankfully it doesn't sound as bad as previous accidents (although it is "early hours" of course).

Taban Air has seven 154s, of which six are operated by other carriers, including Tajik Air and Kolavia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taban_Air

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: LEEDS19
Posted 2010-01-24 01:27:56 and read 16212 times.

What are the Implications for Taban Air going to be?

Aria Air were grounded after the IL-62 landing accident,also in Mashhad last year, yet Caspian Airlines were not after all were killed in their TU-154 Accident.

I guess we will have to see what the Investigation uncovers.

Heres praying no-one was killed.

,

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Kaitak
Posted 2010-01-24 02:17:08 and read 16007 times.

More on the accident from PPRUNE:

http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/4...3170-tu-154-crash-mashhad-iran.htm

Aircraft was RA-85787, leased from Kolavia

Landing in fog, due to medical emergency.

Acft (see pictures) is totally W/O, but still no fatalies, thankfully; number of injured now increased to 46.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Shary - Iranian Spotters


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Photo © Kambiz-Iranian Sky

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: PlymSpotter
Posted 2010-01-24 04:16:12 and read 15544 times.



Quoting LEEDS19 (Reply 2):
Aria Air were grounded after the IL-62 landing accident,also in Mashhad last year, yet Caspian Airlines were not after all were killed in their TU-154 Accident.

As far as I recall, the Caspian accident was put down to unknown causes (read: maintainance), whilst the Aria crash was blamed on Pilot error after they landed mid runway and fast.

Glad to hear there were no fatalities. I'd love to know why Iran specifically has such a bad record for the Tu-154 which they can get spares for, whilst it has a pretty good record for western aircraft which they can't legitimately get spares for, and often end up making themselves. It's not the like climate gets to them, the Tu154 operates in similar regions and greater numbers right across Central Asia .

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: OV735
Posted 2010-01-24 05:15:49 and read 15281 times.

OIMM 240330Z 00000KT 0300 FG VV003 02/02 Q1021 A3015=
OIMM 240400Z 00000KT 0200 FG VV002 02/02 Q1021 A3017=
OIMM 240350Z 00000KT 0200 FG VV002 02/02 Q1021 A3017=

Why would they even consider landing in such conditions? The ILS for runway 31 at Mashhad requires a minimum visibility of 800 meters or RVR of 720 meters. RVR is for some reason not provided in the METAR strings (perhaps not measured at the time), but it would be difficult to imagine it being much greater than 500-600 meters in such fog.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 4):
I'd love to know why Iran specifically has such a bad record for the Tu-154 which they can get spares for, whilst it has a pretty good record for western aircraft which they can't legitimately get spares for, and often end up making themselves. It's not the like climate gets to them, the Tu154 operates in similar regions and greater numbers right across Central Asia.

If we look at the three major disaster that have been with Tu-154 in Iran in the past 10 years, we can see that 2 of them weren't very type-specific. One had a midair collision with a fighter. Another one hit a mountain. Iran is the largest foreign Tu-154 operator these days, and the aircraft is a true workhorse on the domestic routes, thus it is more likely to end up in an accident.

The last year's Caspian Airlines crash was probably more related to the type though, both through poor maintenance and the inherent design flaw that subjects the hydraulic lines to damage in case of an uncontained failure.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Readytotaxi
Posted 2010-01-24 05:35:33 and read 15193 times.

This link has video footage.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/8477389.stm

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Teneriffe77
Posted 2010-01-24 06:37:12 and read 14865 times.

Avherald has some good pics
http://avherald.com/h?article=426402c1&opt=0

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: KC135TopBoom
Posted 2010-01-24 07:07:12 and read 14395 times.



Quoting Teneriffe77 (Reply 7):
Avherald has some good pics
http://avherald.com/h?article=426402...opt=0

FoxNews has some pictures too, including the broken off right wing (apparently the left wing broke off too).

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,583753,00.html?test=latestnews

A little speed tape and she'll be as good as new..................

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Acabgd
Posted 2010-01-24 10:50:26 and read 11245 times.



Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 8):
A little speed tape and she'll be as good as new...

From what I've seen this is a write-off, both wings are gone, the tail is completely sheared off, the rest us burned out.

It seems the rescue crews and firefighters are due some kudos as they appear to have brought the fire under control rather quickly and probably saved many lives.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: JBirdAV8r
Posted 2010-01-24 11:30:09 and read 10661 times.



Quoting Acabgd (Reply 9):
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 8):
A little speed tape and she'll be as good as new...

From what I've seen this is a write-off, both wings are gone, the tail is completely sheared off, the rest us burned out.

He was being sarcastic, though we all know the Tu-154 is an amazingly tough old bird. I'd fly in a Tu-154 with a reputable carrier any day.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: A300
Posted 2010-01-24 11:57:09 and read 10273 times.



Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 4):
As far as I recall, the Caspian accident was put down to unknown causes (read: maintenance), whilst the Aria crash was blamed on Pilot error after they landed mid runway and fast.

The latest update from Iranian CAO, posted on their website (in Persian), states that crash was due to un contained failure of engine 3, with resultant destruction of the hydraulic lines and the "number 4" engine (probably APU).

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 4):
The last year's Caspian Airlines crash was probably more related to the type though, both through poor maintenance and the inherent design flaw that subjects the hydraulic lines to damage in case of an uncontained failure.

The aircraft had very recently been overhauled in Russia. The design flaw seems to be similar to that of DC-10, which is another tri-jet, of course. The Sioux City United Airlines crash comes to mind.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Acabgd
Posted 2010-01-24 12:16:09 and read 9977 times.



Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 10):
though we all know the Tu-154 is an amazingly tough old bird.

Can be seen here as well - the fuselage is intact, it didn't break at any point.

Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 10):
I'd fly in a Tu-154 with a reputable carrier any day.

Same here (and did as well).

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Jeffrey1970
Posted 2010-01-24 12:34:10 and read 9705 times.

I pray that everyone will be okay. I flew in one of those planes on Aeroflot back in the late 80's. All I remember is that on the inside and outside it looked like a 727.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Ajd1992
Posted 2010-01-24 12:47:11 and read 9545 times.

What I want to know is.... how the hell did the pilot rip off the tail but nothing else? He did of ripping everything he could have ripped off without doing some major damage  Silly Any other reports on injuries?

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: AndrewUber
Posted 2010-01-24 13:00:05 and read 9363 times.

The "727ski" is a tough bird. Sad to see another one written off, but it's good there were no fatalities. It seems the ground crews in Mashad did a great job. I do however think that the ICAA's decision to suspend Taban Air's AOC is an unecessary knee-jerk reaction.

I too would fly on a Tu-154 with a reputable carrier anytime.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: N1120A
Posted 2010-01-24 13:36:15 and read 8929 times.



Quoting A300 (Reply 11):

The latest update from Iranian CAO, posted on their website (in Persian), states that crash was due to un contained failure of engine 3, with resultant destruction of the hydraulic lines and the "number 4" engine (probably APU).



Quoting A300 (Reply 11):

The aircraft had very recently been overhauled in Russia. The design flaw seems to be similar to that of DC-10, which is another tri-jet, of course. The Sioux City United Airlines crash comes to mind.

I was going to say the same exact thing. I wonder how for how much of the flight this was an issue. If it happened at cruise, these pilots obviously deserve some praise.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: YVRLTN
Posted 2010-01-24 13:50:22 and read 8729 times.



Quoting Ajd1992 (Reply 14):
how the hell did the pilot rip off the tail but nothing else?

According to the linked BBC article in Reply 6, tail strike. Must have been one helluva strike though... of course, the engine & APU explosion could have compromised the stucture.

Quoting OV735 (Reply 5):
Why would they even consider landing in such conditions?

Again from the same article, medical emergency on board.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: OV735
Posted 2010-01-24 14:38:48 and read 8140 times.



Quoting YVRLTN (Reply 17):
Again from the same article, medical emergency on board.

Given that Ashgabat, Turkmenistan was just a quarter of an hour's flight away, and enjoying a much better weather at the time (UTAA 240400Z 26003MPS 240V300 4400 BR BKN230 01/M01 Q1021 NOSIG 99CLRD70), it seems just too awkward to jeopardize everyone on board by going in below the minimums.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: A300
Posted 2010-01-24 14:59:47 and read 7888 times.



Quoting OV735 (Reply 18):
Given that Ashgabat, Turkmenistan was just a quarter of an hour's flight away, and enjoying a much better weather at the time (UTAA 240400Z 26003MPS 240V300 4400 BR BKN230 01/M01 Q1021 NOSIG 99CLRD70), it seems just too awkward to jeopardize everyone on board by going in below the minimums.

Ashgabat (Eshghabad in Persian), is in the Republic of Turkmenistan. Arranging entry would have taken more than the 30 minutes flight time. There are a number of other Iranian airports within 1 hour flight from MHD. The weather was probably poor in many of them and some are not ILS equipped.

Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 15):
I do however think that the ICAA's decision to suspend Taban Air's AOC is an unnecessary knee-jerk reaction.

Given the recent series of crashes in Iran, which have involved small airline companies, the Iranian people are fed up and scared. The suspension, as with that of Aria, was probably meant to show that the Iranian CAO and Ministry of Roads and Transportation are doing something about it. Furthermore, both the Aria and Taban planes were on foreign registries and probably flown by non-Iranian crew; both of these facts limit the effectiveness of the Iranian CAO. On the other hand, the Caspian Tu-154M was Iranian registered and flown by Iranian crew. Caspian has been around for nearly two decades and had a good safety record prior to the Ghazvin crash. Overall, I favor the CAO's decision to suspend Aria and Taban AOCs. If it were up to me, I would pull all AOCs except for those of Iran Air (mainline), Iran Aseman Airlines, Kish Air, Mahan Air and Naft Air. Both Iran Air Tours and SAHA have terrible safety records and I am disappointed that they are still allowed to fly.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Airbuseric
Posted 2010-01-24 15:05:10 and read 7832 times.

Some more very detailed pictures online here:

http://www.aerospacetalk.ir/vb/showthread.php?p=256086

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: OV735
Posted 2010-01-24 16:39:08 and read 6959 times.



Quoting A300 (Reply 19):
Ashgabat (Eshghabad in Persian), is in the Republic of Turkmenistan. Arranging entry would have taken more than the 30 minutes flight time. There are a number of other Iranian airports within 1 hour flight from MHD. The weather was probably poor in many of them and some are not ILS equipped.

I don't see what sort of delays they could have encountered when diverting to Ashgabat. Ashgabat would probably have been one of the planned alternates anyway. Looking at the enroute chart, there is an airway directly linking the two airports (G775), with a total distance of 102 nautical miles.

I believe patients in life-threatening condition are normally transported to the hospital upon arrival, and the usual country entrance procedures are carried out later. The rest of the passengers would wait in the plane until the weather in their planned destination clears and the flight could continue.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: RFields5421
Posted 2010-01-24 16:59:33 and read 6767 times.



Quoting Acabgd (Reply 9):
It seems the rescue crews and firefighters are due some kudos as they appear to have brought the fire under control rather quickly and probably saved many lives.

They certainly did a very good job - but having the wings ripped away really helps since most of the fuel becomes separated from the fuselage.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Teneriffe77
Posted 2010-01-24 17:50:00 and read 6394 times.

Why did the wings separate at the gear attachment points rather than the gear itself collapse?

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Gonzalo
Posted 2010-01-24 18:42:02 and read 6007 times.

Looking those pictures and video it's very fortunate that nobody died. They survive the crash, the fire, the smoke.
Never flew a in any Tupolev, but it seems a very strong airplane, the fuselage is burned but structurally intact.

Saludos
G.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: RFields5421
Posted 2010-01-24 19:48:49 and read 5388 times.



Quoting Teneriffe77 (Reply 23):
Why did the wings separate at the gear attachment points rather than the gear itself collapse?

As stated above, the 154 is built tough. It is intended to operate from rough fields, much like a C-130. Many of the fields the plane used when new were not only unpaved, but subject to some buckling and such due to the harsh winters. They suffer a cargo weight penalty because they are built so strong as compared to a B727.

It does not surprise me that forces that rough break the wings off at the gear mounts rather than breaking off the gear.

Topic: RE: Tu-154 Crash In Iran...Again
Username: Airbuseric
Posted 2010-01-24 23:04:32 and read 4359 times.



Quoting Gonzalo (Reply 24):
Never flew a in any Tupolev, but it seems a very strong airplane, the fuselage is burned but structurally intact.

Same opinion I have. Tupolevs are like a flying tank. The structure is really heavy, but strong!
The tailmounted engines might also helped positively in this incident to keep the fuselage of the aircraft in 'stable' condition. I guess normal wings and engine might have unbalanced the frame at the moment of impact/when it went wrong. And then it's not sure how the situation would be after...


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