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Topic: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TN486
Posted 2010-10-09 22:19:24 and read 21887 times.

Here is a quick summary of Thread 40: (commenced with professionalism by QF175)

Korean and Thai movements to OZ.
ACCC rulings (interim) re NZ/DJ "tie-up".
Seat selection pre check-in QF/VA.
MH PER-BKI.
Kendalls fleet of CRJ200's.
US DOT decision (interim) on proposed alliance DJ/Delta.
Jetconnect Long Haul crew rostering etc.
A300 in QF service.
JAL service cessation NRT-BNE.
BNE airport and transfer options.
QF 767(GE) planned upgrades and proposed disposal of 767(RR).
MEL facilities and future expansion.
DJ computer problems.
IASC Indonesian capacity decisions.
V Australia to AUH.
Facts and rumours re "DJ Group of airlines".
V Australian Y cabin service.
Check in procedures at DJ and QF.

Let discussions in our next thread begin.

[Edited 2010-10-09 22:34:45]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2010-10-10 00:06:56 and read 21827 times.

Interesting article in yesterday's SMH about suspended QF cabin crew who helped themselves to some rather expensive Klug (it walked off the aircraft) when their LAX-SYD A380 was weather diverted to NOU last August.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ZuluAlpha
Posted 2010-10-10 01:46:11 and read 21746 times.

With both the recent AA/BA/IB and the UA/CO 'agreements' do we think we will see any major changes here in the South West Pacific to/from Asia/Europe and to/from USA?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: anstar
Posted 2010-10-10 01:53:12 and read 21740 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 1):
With both the recent AA/BA/IB and the UA/CO 'agreements' do we think we will see any major changes here in the South West Pacific to/from Asia/Europe and to/from USA?

Not much from BA/IB/AA as it really only effects TATL flying.

UA probably has the most potential to see some impact. Given CO's ambitious plans with 787 routes ie AKL-HOU I reckon we could also see a ORD-SYD flight with a 787 (presuming it has the range).

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2010-10-10 02:22:42 and read 21699 times.

Quoting anstar (Reply 3):
I reckon we could also see a ORD-SYD flight with a 787

That's a possibility I hadn't though of, but I'm not sure it would be of much benefit in the great scheme of things.

However, I think SYD-IAH is a case of when, not if.

The problem with ORD is that it won't make access easier to any city (other than Chicago) than transiting in Houston: going to BOSNYWASH the elapsed time will be just about identical. For example SYD-IAH-EWR is 9996mi while SYD-ORD-EWR is 9951mi.

I also live in the hope that UA will use the 787 to be a little less conservative than they have been previously and de-link MEL and launch BNE and (maybe) PER. Especially with the latter they could be rest assured that neither QF or VA (or DL) have anything to come back at them with. The only potential threat would be an AA 787, but the QF/AA relationship is decidedly one sided and there's no guarantee that AA would come running to the rescue of QF if they think more profitable routes exist.

Quoting ZuluAlpha (Reply 2):
AA/BA/IB

I'm not sure that will have much impact down here. I think I'm more likely to grown wings than QF are to ever serve MAD, and IB to SYD is almost as unlikely so for OneWorld I think QF/BA to LHR (and FRA) is all we'll get for a long time yet.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-10 18:02:56 and read 21377 times.

A possibility might be that AA would think about making DFW a gateway to the South Pacific, as competition to the United gateway at IAH. This is how 787s will be game changers. AA will have 787s, just like Qantas. AA might decide that they would like to be the OneWorld carrier who links ORD and DFW to SYD, rather than leaving it to Qantas. And note that AA is looking at building LAX into a hub - they are just about to start LAX to PVG. AA could get together with QF and operate the world's longest shuttle - SYD-LAX. Look at NYC to LHR with 11 flight operated by the Joint Venture AA/BA. Bit hard for large airlines like DL, VS and UA (old and new version) to compete against that. If QF and AA between them operated 5 times daily between SYD and LAX, even combined UA/AC/NZ and VA/DL would struggle against that.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2010-10-10 18:18:27 and read 21359 times.

Quoting TN486 (Thread starter):
I also live in the hope that UA will use the 787 to be a little less conservative than they have been previously and de-link MEL and launch BNE

Just as a technical point: UA used to serve BNE as a 744 SYD tag-on... it was a sector that was very short-lived and often cancelled. One question is just how viable (with DRW/CNS/TSV transit traffic) a BNE-LAX service is... it's about 3x/week with VA and less than daily (and a frequent flyer redemption dumping ground) with QF in off-peak periods.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: cwalt
Posted 2010-10-10 19:50:59 and read 21250 times.

Jetstar has announced it plans to operate multiple weekly services between Darwin and Manila from early 2011.

It's also increasing domestic capacity to Darwin and boosting frequencies to Bali (Denpasar)


Source: Travel Daily Australia

Jetstar to expand northern Australia hub

Qantas offshoot Jetstar has just announced an increase in international and domestic flight operations from Darwin, including new multiple weekly direct services between Darwin and Manila, to launch early 2011.

JQ will boost its Darwin-Adelaide service from 4 weekly to daily (effective 10 Dec), Darwin-Bali from daily to 11/week (effective 16 Dec), while the Darwin-Sydney and Darwin-Melbourne routes will increase from 10 per week to 11, from 27 Mar 2011.

CEO Bruce Buchanan said the move was in line with Jetstar's pan Asia strategy and "the continued sustainable expansion of Jetstar with a stronger and even better connected route network between Australia and South East Asia."

"The proposed future linking of Darwin and Manila will see Jetstar's fledging Australian operations further connect in with Jetstar brand services from Singapore that operate multi-daily to the Philippines capital via our primary Asian hub at Singapore Changi Airport," Buchanan said.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-10 19:57:56 and read 21243 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 6):
Just as a technical point: UA used to serve BNE as a 744 SYD tag-on... it was a sector that was very short-lived and often cancelled. One question is just how viable (with DRW/CNS/TSV transit traffic) a BNE-LAX service is... it's about 3x/week with VA and less than daily (and a frequent flyer redemption dumping ground) with QF in off-peak periods.

That makes it look as though BNE-LAX, and perhaps BNE to other US cities would be better with 787s - half the size of 744s, and still a lot smaller than the VA 77Ws.

If there is any Business traffic, three times weekly will lose passengers to Qantas. 77Ls might be overkill for this route, but 77Es would help improve the frequency.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: pugsley
Posted 2010-10-10 21:25:23 and read 21181 times.

Qantas expands CityFlyer routes

http://www.travelweekly.com.au/getat...32-437f-99a5-06e922671171/pdf.aspx

"Qantas will also expand its
flying to Darwin with the launch
next May of direct CityFlyer
services from Melbourne."

This is great news, hopefully this is the first of many JQ routes that QF are returning to. Funny thing about DRW, is no one was mentioning this as a potential destination QF would return to. I wonder what else it may be then...

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-10-10 22:00:50 and read 21143 times.

Quoting pugsley (Reply 9):
Qantas expands CityFlyer routes

http://www.travelweekly.com.au/getat...32-437f-99a5-06e922671171/pdf.aspx

"Qantas will also expand its
flying to Darwin with the launch
next May of direct CityFlyer
services from Melbourne."

This is great news, hopefully this is the first of many JQ routes that QF are returning to. Funny thing about DRW, is no one was mentioning this as a potential destination QF would return to. I wonder what else it may be then...

Looks like a strange move, but they must feel the demand is there for it.. How can 3 weekly flight be classed as Citiflyer though? I thought that was their high frequency, business orientated service.

With this additon, along with an additional 1 weekly JQ flight (up from 10 to 11) on MEL-DRW, there will e 2 daily service by the QF group on the route.

The MEL-DRW route really seems to have rebounded again, with the re-introduction of DJ, TT and now QF onto the route.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TN486
Posted 2010-10-10 23:42:11 and read 21064 times.

Another part of that source referred to in above posts suggests Virgin group had $15 million to $20 million wiped off the bottom line due to their recent computer hassles........Sheesh, a lot of money for 11 days!!. No wonder they intend to pursue "aggressively" recovery of costs.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2010-10-10 23:55:38 and read 21046 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 6):
One question is just how viable (with DRW/CNS/TSV transit traffic) a BNE-LAX service is... it's about 3x/week with VA and less than daily (and a frequent flyer redemption dumping ground) with QF in off-peak periods

True, BNE-LAX is definitely a seasonal route. But what's interesting is that I'm flying across the Pacific for the first time next July, and booked last week on a frequent flyer award ticket. Outbound I'm having to go BNE-SYD-HNL-LAX and inbound LAX-MEL-BNE because the direct flight had no (reward) availability left. And the MEL flight is on an A380 (another first)

But I agree with alangirvan, the 787 is the aircraft with which to operate this route: by downsizing (which is obviously isn't going to happen) VA could probably increase frequencies to 6 weekly which suddenly looks a lot more threatening to QF. And QF 10 787 weekly would probably be a better allocation of capacity than trying to fill a 747

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-11 00:11:49 and read 21033 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 10):
The MEL-DRW route really seems to have rebounded again, with the re-introduction of DJ, TT and now QF onto the route.

There was a time when it was said that the only freight that domestic carriers picked up in Darwin was pet food. Is that still how it is?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-11 00:27:54 and read 20997 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 12):
And QF 10 787 weekly would probably be a better allocation of capacity than trying to fill a 747

Or you could do 3x weekly 744 + 4x weekly 787. I suspect something similar to that is what they will do eventually, but it depends a lot on the availability of the 787.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: smi0006
Posted 2010-10-11 00:50:42 and read 20967 times.

Quoting cwalt (Reply 7):
new multiple weekly direct services between Darwin and Manila, to launch early 2011.

Now this is interesting I must say I didn't see this one coming! DRW seems to be turning into quiet the nice little hub up there. I assume JQ and the airport authorities came to some form of understanding regarding the expansion of DRW to accomodate these flights?

I wonder when we will see JQ announcement regarding their indonesia plans now that the IASC has allocated capacity or are the airlines contesting the decision?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-10-11 01:00:21 and read 20954 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 10):
Looks like a strange move, but they must feel the demand is there for it.. How can 3 weekly flight be classed as Citiflyer though? I thought that was their high frequency, business orientated service.

With this additon, along with an additional 1 weekly JQ flight (up from 10 to 11) on MEL-DRW, there will e 2 daily service by the QF group on the route.

The MEL-DRW route really seems to have rebounded again, with the re-introduction of DJ, TT and now QF onto the route.

Strange move indeed, but its all about getting ahead of Tiger. TT's new Managing Director is quite interested in Darwin, and TR is also rumored to be linking Singapore next year. Tiger Management are looking at more overnight aircraft usage, linking Darwin and Adelaide overnight. Connections right through to Singapore and even the new Thai Tiger base mabye?. Going ahead, say in 4 years time, ADL/MEL//BNE/DRW/CNS (Tiger bases) should connect all connect to Asia. Tiger's low cost base in Asia will make them that little bit stronger than JQ.

And Tiger's upcoming involvement with SEAIR (Operating as Tiger for SEAIR) could have put Manila-Darwin on the table, so JQ really getting in early ahead of Tiger and Cebu.

Also AirAsia will now most likely not even venture onto DPS-DRW, even though the flight times were released, they never went on sale.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-11 01:41:58 and read 20892 times.

Quoting cwalt (Reply 7):

This had been rumoured for quiet a while, but am i reading it right, please someone feel free to correct me, but JQ want to send pax SYD/MEL/BNE/CNS/ADL-DRW-SIN-MNL? by the time pax have done that wouldnt it just be cheaper to say, purchase a PR ticket direct to MNL? or even take the QF flight SYD-BNE-MNL?

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 10):

Citiflyer, although priding itself on freequency, it is also more about the 'on-board' product offering, More catering choice for J Class (3 choices of food, Cheese and Ice-Cream and other amenities) if its going to be like a Perth Citiflyer its going to be more in line with a International Business 'offering' and as MEL-DRW would be classed as a 'long sector' this is more then likely going to happen.

I think that JQ could expand big time thru DRW to South East Asia, im surprised that CGK hasnt been added, and the old KUL flight used to go out with a 80% load factormost of the time althought from SYD, but im sure they could make it work out of DRW, the options are endless really..

And with Strategic (VC) starting TSV-DPS it makes me think that there is money to be made from alot of South-East Asian ports.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2010-10-11 03:29:22 and read 20796 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 17):
Citiflyer, although priding itself on freequency, it is also more about the 'on-board' product offering

About a month ago I flew BNE-CBR on a Dinner flight and they were charging for alcohol. This was the first time I've seen this (or was aware that it was happening).

Every other time I can think of alcohol was definitely free with dinner.

So is this a new innovation/cost cutting?

The flight was on a Sunday, so I don't know if that makes a difference.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-11 03:35:40 and read 20788 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 18):

Yes, this is right. Citiflyer on the east coast only operates Monday thru to Friday, and alcohol is free after 1600, BUT, Perth Citiflyer routes are 7 days a week and alcohol is free on 'lunch time' flights onwards.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: cwalt
Posted 2010-10-11 03:43:30 and read 20771 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 17):
Quoting cwalt (Reply 7):

This had been rumoured for quiet a while, but am i reading it right, please someone feel free to correct me, but JQ want to send pax SYD/MEL/BNE/CNS/ADL-DRW-SIN-MNL? by the time pax have done that wouldnt it just be cheaper to say, purchase a PR ticket direct to MNL? or even take the QF flight SYD-BNE-MNL?


Jetstar are planning for the Darwin-Manila route to be non-stop, not operating via Singapore.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-11 03:47:53 and read 20767 times.

Quoting cwalt (Reply 20):

Good, because that would be a pain in the behind  
It will be interesting to see what crew get to operate this flight.... no doubt SIN crew.....

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2010-10-11 04:17:56 and read 20725 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 19):
Citiflyer on the east coast only operates Monday thru to Friday

Thank's for that! That makes a load more sense now.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 16):
Strange move indeed, but its all about getting ahead of Tiger

Surely if the intention was to get ahead of TT, an increase in JQ's presence on the route would be more useful than QF. Surely they're going for different markets?

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 16):
ADL/MEL//BNE/DRW/CNS

While I agree with all five, what about OOL? Obviously SYD won't happen because it's slot constrained but is NTL to distant from Sydney to be a base? (Obviously they don't fly there [yet] but I was thinking in the future)

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-11 04:27:27 and read 20706 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 22):

NTL is already a JQ base ....  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ZuluAlpha
Posted 2010-10-11 04:35:24 and read 20692 times.

I didn't see this in the previous Oz Aviation thread, Apologies if it was.

http://www.aviationrecord.com/Search...ds-capacity-to-mining-regions.aspx

Qantaslink to expand capacity to mining regions.

I wonder if we will see a jet soon into EMD with the number of services now opperating ?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: DJMEL
Posted 2010-10-11 06:56:10 and read 20914 times.

Heard today at work that new deliviries of Virgin Blue aircraft from November onwards will be in hybrid livery, an all white fuselage and tail with Virgin in red on the tail, in preparation for the re-launch in February.

VH-VUY - 737-800 due late November
VH-VUZ - 737-800 due in December / January

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: anstar
Posted 2010-10-11 08:31:50 and read 20812 times.

Quoting DJMEL (Reply 25):
Virgin in red on the tail

Cool - looks like it will be more consistant with the other Virgins and their red tails heheh

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-10-11 14:04:34 and read 21021 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 17):
And with Strategic (VC) starting TSV-DPS it makes me think that there is money to be made from alot of South-East Asian ports.

I dont know what Strategic are thinking most of the time (neither do their employees too!), but they will probably be off that route in 6 months time.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 22):
While I agree with all five, what about OOL?

OOL market is currently saturated, yield is at its lowest it has ever been, especially from Sydney. Tiger's once daily presence on SYD-OOL really shows the market dominance by the other two, anymore from Tiger really just drags everyone down. If you want to take baggage on that route, Virgin/Jetstar will just about always end up cheaper. Tiger now dominates the region offering flights from both Tulla/Avv, going forward with around 5 flights combined. They dropped the Adelaide flight, and a few months ago they dropped it on Tue/Wed (JQ did also). I can see good connections mabye to HBA/MKY/CNS, but profitable? Not really.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-10-12 02:21:02 and read 20631 times.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 27):
I dont know what Strategic are thinking most of the time (neither do their employees too!), but they will probably be off that route in 6 months time.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 22):

They are desperate to find utilisation for their planes. Thats the only reason they are trying so many oddball routes, in an attempt to hopefully create a market, along with keeping their planes flying.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: smi0006
Posted 2010-10-12 23:02:12 and read 20017 times.

Looking out accross the QF food court here in Mel looks like there is a 744 on gate 10. I would imagine it's heading over to PER, glad to see this is happening I miss seeing the 743s around MEL! I hope at some point this becomes more regular. Is this a sub due to capacity needed or simply due to an aircraft going tech?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: pilotdude09
Posted 2010-10-13 06:42:23 and read 19592 times.

Hey Guys,

Maybe a bit early, but when is it possible to tell what reg is scheduled to run a service(Qantas)? I'm aware this is subject to change due to a million reasons but just interested to know when a certain aircraft is scheduled to run.

I'm Crossing my fingers and toes I don't get stuck with the one A330 that doesn't have AVOD!

I'm flying:
18th October: QF 580 PER-SYD
19th October: QF 11 SYD-LAX

If anyone is able to tell me that'd be great, If I should ask again in a few day's no worries  

Can't wait to try out Y+ on the A380, should hopefully make the 14hr flight a little bit easier!

Cheers,

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: anstar
Posted 2010-10-13 08:59:28 and read 19530 times.

Sorry for some possibly incorrect info

As I posted above Strategic did lose their French AOC

Source:

http://blog.seattlepi.com/worldairlinenews/archives/221207.asp

The 320's aren't heading back to Australia - looks like they will be going to Luxembourg instead!

source:

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/busi...wings/story-e6frg8zx-1225937856594

[Edited 2010-10-13 09:30:45]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Auchmithie
Posted 2010-10-13 12:10:28 and read 19523 times.

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 29):
Looking out accross the QF food court here in Mel looks like there is a 744 on gate 10

VH-OJB operated QF441 SYDMEL and QF452 MELSYD today,

Source: http://www.theqantassource.com

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-13 20:52:45 and read 19284 times.

Quoting pilotdude09 (Reply 30):

The A330-200 that you mention is VH-EBJ, the new config is ready for jetstar to take it  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-10-13 22:45:09 and read 19184 times.

Quoting Auchmithie (Reply 32):
VH-OJB operated QF441 SYDMEL and QF452 MELSYD today,

Why they using them on MEL-SYD. I thought there was enough capacity on that route.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: smi0006
Posted 2010-10-14 08:40:45 and read 18858 times.

Looks lik are canning BNE, according to airlineroute.net:

Philippine Airlines has announced it’ll be canceling service to Brisbane effective 31OCT10, which the airline currently operates 2 weekly Manila – Melbourne – Brisbane – Manila routing.

Accompanied by the change, service to Australia remains 5 weekly to Sydney and 4 weekly to Melbourne, all operated by Boeing 777-300ER.

Minor routing adjustment also in effect from 31OCT10, schedule below:

1 weekly Manila – Sydney vv
PR211 MNL2235 – 0900+1SYD 77W 6
PR212 SYD1150 – 1630MNL 77W 7

1 weekly Manila – Sydney – Melbourne – Manila
PR211 MNL2235 – 0900+1SYD 77W 5
PR212 SYD1020 – 1145MEL1305 – 1745MNL 77W 6

3 weekly Manila – Melbourne – Sydney – Manila
PR209 MNL2100 – 0730+1MEL0900+1 – 1020+1SYD 77W 247
PR210 MEL0900 – 1020SYD1150 – 1630MNL 77W 135

Has an AI schedule been released in GDS yet?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-10-14 14:49:14 and read 18758 times.

Whats all this about a 787 coming for QF's 90th birthday..

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2010-10-14 17:24:07 and read 18679 times.

Speaking of Australia-MNL flights, what's up with QF's once weekly SYD-BNE-MNL flight (other operate nonstop SYD-MNL)? A once a week BNE service is hard to justify- is it some cabin crew union thing where so many international destinations have to be served from the BNE base??? Please tell me- I've always wondered about this flight!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ditzyboy
Posted 2010-10-14 18:36:55 and read 18592 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 37):
is it some cabin crew union thing where so many international destinations have to be served from the BNE base???

If it wasn't so insulting your statement would be funny!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2010-10-14 18:46:17 and read 18582 times.

There's nothing insulting about it- if a union agreement can state there must be X number of crew on an aircraft then it's a perfectly logical suggestion. Again- why has this flight operated for years with a once weekly stop in BNE when all the other days BNE pax transit SYD? It's not like the once weekly LAX-APW-TBU-AKL flight where demand is satisfied with only one weekly flight and there are limited alternatives.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-14 21:22:10 and read 18455 times.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 36):

ive heard no such thing.....

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-14 21:37:13 and read 18454 times.

QF want to bring a flying boat home, that has been grounded in Thailand since last year due to engine trouble, in-time for its 90th Anniversary.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/09/28/3023452.htm

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ditzyboy
Posted 2010-10-14 21:47:16 and read 18426 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 39):
There's nothing insulting about it- if a union agreement can state there must be X number of crew on an aircraft then it's a perfectly logical suggestion.

With reference to the original comment, can you identify any instance anywhere in the world where a union dictates a company must fly a certain route? The cabin crew operate the whole way SYD-BNE-MNL or vv anyway. It is nothing to do with there being a Brisbane cabin crew base, which is a relatively new thing for Long Haul division anyway.

The Long Haul union does not have minimum crewing levels as part of the EBA, apart from CASA minimums. The Short Haul unions does have numbers agreed with the company for service purposes as part of the EBA, though these are relatively fluid and change when the product is varied and trialled. The unions have WAY less power than you think they do!

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 39):
It's not like the once weekly LAX-APW-TBU-AKL flight where demand is satisfied with only one weekly flight

How do you know that demand does not justify a stop in Brisbane on the days it operates? Do you know about passenger or cargo loads to or from Brisbane on those days? Perhaps it is to satisfy a corporate contract or the wishes of either the Australian or Philippines government?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: smi0006
Posted 2010-10-14 21:58:05 and read 18409 times.

Isn't there a requirment by the long haul union that one flight per week must be operated all the way through to LHR by SYD based long haul crews? Why couldn't the SYD-BNE-MNL route be the same? I don't think it was meantyo e an insult seems like a valid question to me!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: qf744fan
Posted 2010-10-14 22:00:25 and read 18432 times.

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 29):
I would imagine it's heading over to PER
Quoting smi0006 (Reply 29):
Is this a sub due to capacity needed or simply due to an aircraft going tech?

Was wondering the same thing. We had a QF 744 in PER just prior to the AFL grand final replay. My first thought was regarding capacity, though neither WA team was playing.

Would be great to see 744s in Perth again!!!!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-14 22:03:09 and read 18429 times.

Quoting qf744fan (Reply 44):

its been replacing the A333 flight alot lately... i hope itss a permanant thing  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: qf744fan
Posted 2010-10-14 22:07:34 and read 18405 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 45):
its been replacing the A333 flight alot lately... i hope itss a permanant thing

Agreed!!! Is it a daily replacement?

I'd also wonder as to the utilisation. I would imagine the ship is available thanks to A380 deliveries, which makes we wonder about configuration.

Also, the old 743's used to fly SYD - PER - MEL and back again, almost exclusively. I wonder if different 744's will be rotated in to save them sitting on the ground at Sydney and Melbourne???

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2010-10-14 22:47:27 and read 18370 times.

There's also only a once weekly BNE-NOU flight. Now that one maybe is purely for holiday travel as it's a Saturday operated by a 738. But the question still remains about why one SYD-MNL flight stops in BNE and has so for years. It appears one forum member has misinterpreted this simple question as a personal affront- it needn't be.

Is it for a cargo contract?
I don't know- maybe that's the answer- or maybe there's some reason why the cargo can't be moved BNE-SYD-MNL.

Is it for pax commercial reason?
I don't know- but it makes no sense as other days pax can be routed via SYD as for years (until recently) there were no non-stop alternatives. In the example above of NZ's LAX-AKL 763 milkrun, the reason IS there is only enough demand from the USA to Samoa and Tonga (and v.v.) to support a once wekely service and the fares reflect the supply & demand of that service.

Is it for an operational reason?
Again- I don't know the answer. I'm summizing that ***maybe*** there's some weird clause in a union agreement that in order to have a crew base there must be X number of overseas destinations served and as the BNE market isn't as developed as SYD/MEL, perhaps one way around the requirement is to have a once weekly NOU & MNL service.

Please don't shoot the messenger- I'm really a nice person when you get to know me!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-14 23:23:47 and read 18310 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 47):
But the question still remains about why one SYD-MNL flight stops in BNE

Perhaps there is enough demand of people who insist on a direct flight BNE-MNL for only 1 day/week. Although I'm not completely sure why you'd originate in SYD.

Quoting qf744fan (Reply 44):
Would be great to see 744s in Perth again!!!!

I think this possibility doesn't make a huge amount of sense. The 2 class 744s are the only ones with a cabin config which might be suitable for such a flight, and they are a little busy right now. I don't think you'd actually want to use a 4 class bird on that route. Then reconfigure some other 744s? You'd still have a heavy plane optimised for longer haul than SYD-PER, so you'd take a hit on fuel burn. I've always thought, and still think that the most logical thing is to reconfigure some of the A333s for the transcons. Then you can use the remaining A330s and 744s on international runs based on loadings.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2010-10-15 01:10:46 and read 18206 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 47):
There's also only a once weekly BNE-NOU flight

QF codeshare with AirCalin so the route actually goes something like 4 a week. In that case it's a short-haul crew and can be done as a there-and-back (BNE-NOU-BNE is about the same as BNE-MEL-BNE). All that it takes is towing a 737 from Domestic to International.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 47):
Again- I don't know the answer. I'm summizing that ***maybe*** there's some weird clause in a union agreement that in order to have a crew base there must be X number of overseas destinations served and as the BNE market isn't as developed as SYD/MEL, perhaps one way around the requirement is to have a once weekly NOU & MNL service.

Ditzyboy is a long-haul flight attendant. I'm therefore presuming he knows the nature of the agreement between the union and management. In fact, of the regular posters on this forum, nobody is better qualified to answer your question: which he did in the negative.

It could be any number of factors: some form of contract would seem most likely however. My first thought was maybe demand for BNE-MNL only supports 1 a week, but why start in SYD? Second thought maybe demand was for only 1/2 an A330/week, but that seems highly unlikely since it would be an inefficient use of resources. If there were genuinely only 100-150 people a week put them through SYD. Therefore I have no further ideas.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 47):
some weird clause in a union agreement that in order to have a crew base there must be X number of overseas destinations served

Maybe I'm the one going out on a limb now, but I highly doubt the union will object to new jobs being created even if only for a handful of flights! Also ***if*** you're argument has salience it would be more likely to be based on number of flights as opposed to number of destinations. I think it is safe to say this is not the reason. But, as you say, who knows what is?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2010-10-15 02:57:33 and read 18092 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 49):
some form of contract would seem most likely however

Just to clarify: by that I meant cargo etc, not crew conditions

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-10-15 03:41:55 and read 18064 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 40):

ive heard no such thing.....

yeah, 20th November apparently.

Believe it when I see it though..

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-15 03:51:57 and read 18131 times.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 51):

If so, then they have kept that one under a very tight wrap.... i dont think they will get it then....

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: BNE
Posted 2010-10-15 04:52:01 and read 18093 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 47):
But the question still remains about why one SYD-MNL flight stops in BNE and has so for years. It appears one forum member has misinterpreted this simple question as a personal affront- it needn't be.

Who know why the have that SYD-BNE tag but I hope it stays there until after May 26.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: smi0006
Posted 2010-10-15 07:58:46 and read 18012 times.

Some intersting changes from BI, I will be interested to see how this impacts their MEL plans:

As per 15OCT10 GDS timetable display, Royal Brunei Airlines from 30NOV10 is introducing Boeing 777-200ER service on Bandar Seri Begawan – Perth service, replacing Airbus A319/320.

As a result with the aircraft change, overall frequency reduces from 4 to 3 weekly. By Dec 2010, all Australia and New Zealand operation operates with Boeing 777 aircraft.

Schedule below:

till 29NOV10
BI065 BWN1240 – 1800PER 320 6
BI065 BWN1240 – 1800PER 319 1
BI067 BWN2130 – 0250+1PER 320 24

BI066 PER0030 – 0550BWN 320 7
BI066 PER0030 – 0550BWN 319 2
BI068 PER1400 – 1920BWN 320 35

eff 30NOV10
BI065 BWN1240 – 1800PER 777 256
BI068 PER1200 – 1720BWN 777 6
BI068 PER1400 – 1920BWN 777 37

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TN486
Posted 2010-10-16 04:39:20 and read 17723 times.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 51):
yeah, 20th November apparently.

Believe it when I see it though
Quoting JQflightie (Reply 52):
If so, then they have kept that one under a very tight wrap.... i dont think they will get it then....

I am hearing the same thing from other sources too, re a 787 assisting the QF 90th birthday celebrations, however the sources are not "impeccable". Can you just imagine the crowd at MEL on the day of the first arrival, if going by the first arrival of the A380 is a guide, then it will be huge. Sigh. Another 0500 arrival at "the spotters outdoor lounge" to get one of the best seats in the house. (there will be a mutiny if its not a 34 arrival).

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: smi0006
Posted 2010-10-16 06:32:21 and read 17669 times.

Looks like BI will commence MEL services in late march next year, 4 weekly 777 service! Source airlineroute.net looking forward to this one for sure!!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TruemanQLD
Posted 2010-10-16 19:33:35 and read 17440 times.

Quoting http://au.news.yahoo.com/a/-/australian-news/8147366/jetstar-complains-about-darwin-costs/:

The Darwin Airport chief executive says there is truth in Jetstar's complaint that the airport is the most expensive in the country, after the airline has reportedly said it cannot guarantee it will use the airport in future.

The Qantas Group and the airport have just reached a long-term pricing arrangement to help fund a $33 million terminal expansion.

But the airline's Bruce Buchannan has told The Northern Territory News the airport's costs are too high and he cannot guarantee Jetstar will continue to operate out of Darwin.

The airport's chief executive, Ian Kew, says the airline is getting value for money.

"We are a smaller airport in terms of volume - we certainly are only a tenth of the volume of a Melbourne or a Perth," he said.

"But we have all of the facilities those airports have as well so very good infrastructure facilities, we're open 24 hours which comes at a cost.

"So we are more expensive, but do offer excellent services and facilities for those airlines."



Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2010-10-16 21:58:37 and read 17348 times.

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 56):
Looks like BI will commence MEL services in late march next year, 4 weekly 777 service! Source airlineroute.net looking forward to this one for sure!!

It's also now on the RBA site, so it must be happening this time... proposed schedules still allow for a spare and some leeway if an a/c goes tech... with PER now 772 it might free up the baby buses to increase frequency on KCH/PVG/SGN/SUB.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: smi0006
Posted 2010-10-16 23:24:15 and read 17280 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 58):
It's also now on the RBA site, so it must be happening this time...

We thought tha about AI... but 20th of November is rapidly approaching and I don't belive that the flights are bookable yet, although Melbourne airport has commenced renovations on two Airline offices, so fingers crossed.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 58):
with PER now 772 it might free up the baby buses to increase frequency on KCH/PVG/SGN/SUB.

I think they need to up their frequencies I can't currently see their being enough feed even from LHR and DXB in either directon for these flights and the PER upgrade, but fingers crossed they can make it work.

Schedule looks like the following:

BI051 BWN1220 – 2215MEL 777 36
BI053 BWN2200 – 0755+1MEL 777 25

BI052 MEL0140 – 0550BWN 777 47
BI054 MEL1340 – 1750BWN 777 36

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: gardermoen
Posted 2010-10-16 23:44:32 and read 17268 times.

Quoting smi0006
Schedule looks like the following:

BI051 BWN1220 – 2215MEL 777 36
BI053 BWN2200 – 0755+1MEL 777 25

BI052 MEL0140 – 0550BWN 777 47
BI054 MEL1340 – 1750BWN 777 36


Basically the flights are bunched up so close together on the days of operations (some 11 ish hours apart).
I would have thought they would have wanted to space out the frequencies more evenly across the week.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: smi0006
Posted 2010-10-17 00:16:57 and read 17224 times.

Also be interesting to see how they roster their staff, most contracts stipulate a min 10 hour rostered turn around, looks to me a struggle. 1hr post flight paper work, 3hrs checkin may 2hrs pre-checkin for general admin at best guessaybe more. They were planning on having only two reps at the airport. They may have to employ more not so good for the cost base or have the city office do some of the work hmm interesting!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2010-10-17 22:46:18 and read 16816 times.

Quoting gardermoen (Reply 60):
Basically the flights are bunched up so close together on the days of operations (some 11 ish hours apart).
I would have thought they would have wanted to space out the frequencies more evenly across the week.

Educated guess is the 777 AKL/BNE/MEL/PER flights are all scheduled in the same way so you never have all these stations fighting for the same seats on the daily LHR flight on a given day. The pattern seems to be 50% of flights connect to Asia, the other 50% connect to LHR. It's an interesting strategy, but to make it work I think they really need to operate a supplemental BWN-DXB-LHR flight (or possibly BWN-LHR nonstop) 3 times/week.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-10-17 23:26:19 and read 16765 times.

BI will struggle on this route IMHO.

There is already ample capacity into Asia and Europe, so the only way to steal market share is to go in with low prices. This depresses yields and is not an easy strategy to sustain. Starting at 4 weekly is a big risk, but you would hope they have done their research.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-18 02:28:02 and read 16577 times.

QF have just announced codeshare agreements with KQ on NBO-BKK-SYD
http://www.etravelblackboard.com/art...nya-airways-codeshare-opens-africa

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-18 03:05:43 and read 16527 times.

and also back in september:
FQ announced it would be exiting the BNE-PQQ-BNE route by the end of this year.
TL announce extra services to Dili and all flights to be on the E70

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: pilotdude09
Posted 2010-10-18 05:41:49 and read 16399 times.

Was lucky enough to be on EBM on the Per-Syd run today and my first time to experience the new Cityflyer domestic economy.....

Really great product, seat was pretty uncomfortable though and I wasn't the only one.....ALOT of restless people, never had a sore back from any other airline seat before but this one just seems to be pretty average.

In terms of the IFE.....awesome selection for a 4hr flight and plenty to entertain everyone

Also first time I've experienced the new food service, new trays with places for the meal and roll and an actual glass for wine and it is also designed to fit snug in the A332's tray table cup holder and I assume other a/c as well.

Good to see QF headed in the right direction.....also is the new domestic J class seat the exact same seat as premium economy just with different colours? Looked very similar......

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-18 06:49:57 and read 16362 times.

Quoting pilotdude09 (Reply 66):

wow, i dont know if im aloud to say this.. haha im crew and i do not find the new J class seat comfortable at all! if im travelling around the country, i will now delibrately take a 767 or 738 in J class (if i cant get on a 333) the Y class product on the new 332's is fantasic! I find the seat to be comfortable.. food is great, wine is great... QF i think may have the best domestic product in the world with this new roduct coming onto line! its going to be very hard to beat!  and yes im Bias!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ditzyboy
Posted 2010-10-18 17:31:26 and read 16195 times.

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 43):
Isn't there a requirment by the long haul union that one flight per week must be operated all the way through to LHR by SYD based long haul crews? Why couldn't the SYD-BNE-MNL route be the same?

A minimum of one LHR flight per day must be operated by an Australian based crew. This was so that the union would agree to a London base and dramatically increasing the number of overseas based crew employed on inferior conditions.


This is vastly different to Qantas flying a particular route just to satisfy some bizarre union demand. It is common sense. The costs involved with operating a flight where there isn't the demand or income to justify it are massive - and well beyond what Qantas would do to satisfy a union.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 47):
I'm summizing that ***maybe*** there's some weird clause in a union agreement that in order to have a crew base there must be X number of overseas destinations served and as the BNE market isn't as developed as SYD/MEL, perhaps one way around the requirement is to have a once weekly NOU & MNL service.

The BNE-MNL-BNE route had been around decades prior to Qantas opening a Brisbane base for Long Haul cabin crew.

BNE-NOU-BNE is operated in conjunction with Air Calin as part of a broader agreement. Also, this flight is operated by Short Haul crew on a 737.

I think I understand where you are coming from though, for the purposes of industrial and employee relations, Long Haul and Short Haul divisions may as well be separate companies/airlines! A 737 flight to NOU would not go towards satisfying any agreements between Qantas and the FAAA-International.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 48):
Perhaps there is enough demand of people who insist on a direct flight BNE-MNL for only 1 day/week. Although I'm not completely sure why you'd originate in SYD.

I agree! Having operated the route in this manner for decades, perhaps Qantas sees the value in maintaining this route. Has anyone actually checked the passenger numbers or cargo volumes on this route? Or is everyone assuming that this route is a financial drain on Qantas?!

The BNE-MNL and MNL-BNE operate on different days. The flight originates and terminates in Sydney as the flight BNE-MNL goes back to Sydney direct. The MNL-BNE originates in SYD. It is not operated in a W pattern. The are still a number of passengers who make the whole journey to or from MNL with a stop in BNE. Not every flight in every market is non-stop. It seems some people on a.net (not necessarily in this thread) think a flight with a stop is inferior or potentially on the chopping block due to poor performance?!

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 47):
Please don't shoot the messenger- I'm really a nice person when you get to know me!

I am sure you are a nice person. The 'insult' comment was said tongue in cheek. I was/am a little offended, not by yourself, as there seems to be people out there who think the FAAA is this strong union that makes ridiculous demands and is unreasonable. That sentiment could not be further from the truth. That holds true for the domestic and international divisions. (Divisions of a union I hear you ask? Don't ask for my opinion on that - we'd be hear all day!). So, I apologise if it seemed I was insulted by you. I was not in the true sense of the word at all! Was trying to be funny in saying the statement was absurd - was actually trying NOT to offend you!

[Edited 2010-10-18 17:34:21]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-18 18:07:08 and read 16126 times.

Quoting ditzyboy (Reply 68):

The BNE-MNL-BNE route had been around decades prior to Qantas opening a Brisbane base for Long Haul cabin crew.

Couldn't this flight be crewed by short haul cabin crew?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: pugsley
Posted 2010-10-18 18:11:14 and read 16154 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 67):
wow, i dont know if im aloud to say this.. haha im crew and i do not find the new J class seat comfortable at all!

I would have to agree. If i was traveling on a QF aircraft with the new J and Y products, i'd actually prefer to be in Y. I know that is a strange comment but like JQflightie, the new QF domestic J seat has its downsides.

While many do not like the current millennium seat that is fitted to the current aircraft, it has one feature that is missing from the new J seat. And this is the cushion back support is not in the new seat.

The new J seat does have a large panasonic AVOD in the armrest and it has a much higher seat back, however it only features limited recline and the footrest does not extend far at all. On the plus side it is only 6 abrest in a 2-2-2 layout, so no more middle seat and the seats are wider than the current offering, so for a domestic J class product, its quite unique in that matter. As crew, it is much nicer to work on this aircraft compared to others as their is more space to move around. (However, seats 1A,B and 1J,K are all 1inch smaller than the other seats due to the tapering of the aircraft, aisle and coat lockers etc... the funny thing about this, these are the seats reserved for top level frequent flyers, and they are actuall small then the others, it quite noticable as well.)

I would prefer to be in the Y seat, only because when you recline the seat, the base slides forward putting you in a more comfortable seated position.

Quoting pilotdude09 (Reply 66):
also is the new domestic J class seat the exact same seat as premium economy just with different colours?

I have wondered this myself, there are subtle differences, such as the premium ecemomy has a different padded seat back (looks like 4 seperate cushions) and the Business J seat has a single cushion (a smooth cushion) but that is the only difference i could see. Anyone else with more info? I've looked on qflyer but it does not state who makes the W seat so i'm not sure where else to check to find an answer.

**edit**
other differences between the seats are W seat has a different foot and leg wrest to the J seat, the J seat only has a leg wrest. And the w seat has the life vest in the leg wrest, while the J seat has the life jackets under the middle arm rest.

[Edited 2010-10-18 18:18:26]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: pugsley
Posted 2010-10-18 18:27:07 and read 16107 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 69):
Couldn't this flight be crewed by short haul cabin crew?

It could be, and occasionally may be. About this time last year sydney short haul crew were operating the Manila route for about one/two months. It then returned to Long Haul.

Currently i believe their is a ruling that 95% of internationl regional (read long haul/international 767/A330) flying is to be operated by LongHaul crew. This ruling came into place about three years ago when Qantas established QCCA. This ruling was one of the conditions put forward for the existing LongHaul crew when they were voting and agreeing to alow the set up of QCCA as a part of the existing EBA. (some may say it was a sweetner to help get the deal through so QF could establish the set up of the significantly cheaper QCCA crew.)

Before this time, a lot of regional flying was being operated by Shorthaul crews, destinations included BOM, SIN, HKG, MNL etc...

When this ruling was passed, there was a large transfer of shorthaul crew who were casual FA's to QCCA, so while their was a shift in the flying from short haul to long haul, their was also a shift in cabin crew from short haul to long haul at the same time so it was evened out overall.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: pilotdude09
Posted 2010-10-18 19:07:54 and read 16082 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 67):

  At least you are being honest!! Thats interesting to hear from a crew members perspective, I guess if there are enough complaints and once Virgin shows off their J class seat it all might change anyway!!

Agree with it being one of the best domestic product and even shorthaul, for Y not too many aircraft with those facilities around!

Quoting pugsley (Reply 70):

Thanks for that   I'm flying Y+ in a couple of hours, if QF11 doesn't keep getting delayed!!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ditzyboy
Posted 2010-10-18 19:38:39 and read 16036 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 69):
Couldn't this flight be crewed by short haul cabin crew?

It could. Since 2003 anyway. The point I was trying to make was that the flight in question does not exist because there is a Long Haul cabin crew base in Brisbane and there needs to be a certain number of international routes.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ditzyboy
Posted 2010-10-18 20:13:51 and read 16033 times.

Quoting pilotdude09 (Reply 66):
also is the new domestic J class seat the exact same seat as premium economy just with different colours?

The new domestic Business seat is made by Sicma. I am pretty sure it is an off the shelf model with Qantas having no say in the design. The international Premium Economy seat is designed by Marc Newson for Qantas and made by Recaro.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-18 20:48:39 and read 16003 times.

Quoting pilotdude09 (Reply 72):

All of the new 738's and Domestic A330 will be coming online with the same products, i believe there is already 3 new 738's on the Trans Tasman routes with the new Panasonic IFE in Y class and seats  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2010-10-19 02:18:36 and read 15743 times.

Quoting pugsley (Reply 71):
Currently i believe their is a ruling that 95% of internationl regional (read long haul/international 767/A330) flying is to be operated by LongHaul crew. This ruling came into place about three years ago when Qantas established QCCA. This ruling was one of the conditions put forward for the existing LongHaul crew when they were voting and agreeing to alow the set up of QCCA as a part of the existing EBA. (some may say it was a sweetner to help get the deal through so QF could establish the set up of the significantly cheaper QCCA crew.)

That suddenly makes so much more sense! thank you.

I knew that it used to be quite common for SH crews to do Asia routes, but wasn't sure why that seemed to stop again.

Just a question: am I right in thinking that only LH crews do HNL because of the need to have a USA visa?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: pugsley
Posted 2010-10-20 04:04:10 and read 15404 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 76):
Just a question: am I right in thinking that only LH crews do HNL because of the need to have a USA visa?

You are correct.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: tayser
Posted 2010-10-20 05:11:08 and read 15335 times.

it's been reported MEL had the following stats for September 2010:

International: 519,042 +15.7% (y/y)
Domestic: 1,888,106 +10.8% (y/y)

christ in 2-3 years we're probably going to be talking about MEL cracking 30million annually! That's going to be a figure that will trigger many airport-related projects, for instance serious planning/consideration for proper non-auto-centric links (given that the last study into a rail link was done almost 10 years ago).

T3: you're long overdue for a rebuild.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2010-10-20 07:32:50 and read 15258 times.

Quoting tayser (Reply 78):
christ in 2-3 years we're probably going to be talking about MEL cracking 30million annually!

In #40 there was much discussion about the Melbourne Airport long-term plan, but I remain skeptical... With analysts suggesting that Melbourne will be bigger than Sydney by 2025, I really don't think MEL has got the infrastructure planned to bigger than SYD *now* let alone in 15 years time. Maybe I've missed something, please correct me!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: tayser
Posted 2010-10-20 14:08:20 and read 15190 times.

Melbourne's population has been growing faster than Sydney for a decade and in the past 2-3 years it has accelerated with the previous estimate seeing the gap close (Sydney grew better than expected) - Melbourne has been adding 2 jobs for every 1 job that Sydney creates in the past 24 months.

The Melbourne to be bigger than Sydney in XYZ years headlines that were splashed about 6 months ago were all about extrapolating growth from the previous 5 years and projecting forward - there is of course a major problem with that: it's subject to change. Regardless, Melbourne's importance & stature will be growing just as fast and most likely faster than Sydney in the years to come and that's going to translate into airport passenger growth - Victoria favours population growth whereas NSW shuns it and in the past has actively discouraged it.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-10-21 13:17:30 and read 14809 times.

Tiger will today announce a further two A320's to be based at Melbourne, will arrive early next year. As well as VH-VNP which is due in a couple of weeks.
Bringing fleet to:
ADL-2
MEL-8
AVV-2

Part of Brumby and Tiger's 10 aircraft deal in the state.

Jetstar also returning to MEL-Ballina.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: tayser
Posted 2010-10-21 14:35:31 and read 14733 times.

how many 'buses does JQ have based in MEL/AVV? (roughly).

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: jrfspa320
Posted 2010-10-21 15:40:15 and read 14700 times.

Just wondering is there any plans to fit Y+ to the international A330s? As then people can travel LHR/FRA-BNE/PER/ADL in the same class as well as Oz-JFK. And im sure the asian flights would benefit?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-10-21 16:36:12 and read 14671 times.

Quoting tayser (Reply 82):
how many 'buses does JQ have based in MEL/AVV? (roughly).

1 at AVV, and around 12~ at Tulla from memory (stand to be corrected). There are alot of JQ 320's being delivered with no extra capacity, plenty of downtime.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: EK413
Posted 2010-10-21 23:52:59 and read 14457 times.

Quoting Auchmithie (Reply 32):
VH-OJB operated QF441 SYDMEL and QF452 MELSYD today,
Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 34):
Why they using them on MEL-SYD. I thought there was enough capacity on that route.

The QF441 - QF452 was operated by VH-OJB due to major disruptions and cancellations...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: gstepho
Posted 2010-10-22 18:34:42 and read 14097 times.

According to the ministers statement there will be a increase in flights to and from China over the summer. It also shows a Hainan Airlines flight from Shenzhen to Sydney.

http://www.minister.infrastructure.g...leases/2010/October/AA450_2010.htm

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: boof
Posted 2010-10-23 15:00:23 and read 13753 times.

Whilst its not exactly the biggest route announcement in history I was surprised to find that QF are going to operate a 2 x weekly return service on BNE-HBA route over the coming summer. Operated on Tue and Sun, it will be 737 operated and run from Dec 12 through Jan 25.

I know DJ carry a lot on that route during the year with the daily service they offer, but I wouldn't have thought QF would bother with an 8 week route. I wonder if this isn't a trial for a more permanent route given that in HBA there are only direct QF services from MEL 2x Daily and from SYD 1x Daily?? Funny that up until 2 years ago there was a JQ direct service 3 weekly on this route and they canned it.

Source: http://www.themercury.com.au/article...10/10/20/180435_tasmania-news.html

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: smi0006
Posted 2010-10-23 20:20:43 and read 13593 times.

Quoting gstepho (Reply 86):
According to the ministers statement there will be a increase in flights to and from China over the summer.

I beleive QF will be operating somer services with 744s, but I don't think the route will be upgraged after the end of the chinese new year travel period.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-23 23:08:26 and read 13462 times.

Quoting boof (Reply 87):
Whilst its not exactly the biggest route announcement in history I was surprised to find that QF are going to operate a 2 x weekly return service on BNE-HBA route over the coming summer. Operated on Tue and Sun, it will be 737 operated and run from Dec 12 through Jan 25.

Doesn't seem much point in bothering.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Quokka
Posted 2010-10-24 00:02:17 and read 13414 times.

Quoting boof (Reply 87):
but I wouldn't have thought QF would bother with an 8 week route.

How many passengers like to travel between BNE and HBA during what appears to be the school holiday period?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TN486
Posted 2010-10-24 02:11:32 and read 13328 times.

Quoting boof (Reply 87):
Funny that up until 2 years ago there was a JQ direct service 3 weekly on this route and they canned it.

When JQ canned BNE-HBA, didnt they push those 3 services over to BNE-LST to make it up to a daily flight?
The quoted link also mentions the QF Regional General Manager - Tasmania suggesting "xtra capacity follows recent completion of a new commercial agreement with Hobart Airport". One can conjecture what this means. Maybe some one with knowlege of how these things "work" may like to comment, and how we see this 8 week BNE-HBT service fits in the scheme of things. QF, as usual, seem to have done their homework re economics of this proposed service as they are using a 738. I still suspect it is only seasonal, and shall finish as stated after the 8 weeks.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: brad330
Posted 2010-10-27 02:42:40 and read 12700 times.

Hello fellow a-netters,

I am flying MEL-WLG-MEL a couple of times in the next few months. I am flying in J and all flights are operated by 734's does anybody have any info on QF's trans-tasman product? e.g. meal options, seats, entertainment, amenities, lounges (MEetc...

Thanks,

BRAD330

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: miami1
Posted 2010-10-27 03:36:58 and read 12665 times.

Watch this space.
QF to drop SFO in favour of DFW nonstop from SYD on 747ER.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-10-27 03:47:17 and read 12644 times.

Quoting miami1 (Reply 93):
Watch this space.
QF to drop SFO in favour of DFW nonstop from SYD on 747ER.

Makes sense, as having SFO and LAX is not exactly that strategically important to QF. With AA stronger in LAX, compared to SFO , and DFW providing access to AA's main hub, it will give QF great coverage to the US and parts of the Carribean and Sth America.

If it continues to service JFK, LAX and starts DFW, there will be ample coverage of the US by QF and OneWorld in general from/to Australia.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: vhqpa
Posted 2010-10-27 04:01:14 and read 12593 times.

Quoting brad330 (Reply 92):
I am flying MEL-WLG-MEL a couple of times in the next few months. I am flying in J and all flights are operated by 734's does anybody have any info on QF's trans-tasman product? e.g. meal options, seats, entertainment, amenities, lounges (MEetc...

You'll be flying on a Jetconnect aircraft which use the same Millennium Seats found on Domestic Business on the 73H/763 fleets. I'm not quite sure but you may get a portable entertainment unit if not it would just be a movie on overhead screens. you'll get access to the Qantasclub lounge in both Melbourne and Wellington. If be chance one of your 734 flights happens to be subbed for a Jetconnect 73H you'll get the new tasman product with sicma seats (similar in appearance to longhaul Y+ seats) and AVOD

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TN486
Posted 2010-10-27 05:00:09 and read 12517 times.

Quoting miami1 (Reply 93):
Watch this space.
QF to drop SFO in favour of DFW nonstop from SYD on 747ER

If this is to happen, would there be enough traffic for JQ to fly to SFO via AKL or HNL? Could an A330 do AKL/SFO non-stop?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: The Coachman
Posted 2010-10-27 05:19:05 and read 12487 times.

PIty re the dropping of SFO.

Have never been through DFW but is it any better for connections than LAX (AA's massive hub at DFW notwithstanding)?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ZuluAlpha
Posted 2010-10-27 06:03:03 and read 12445 times.

Quoting miami1 (Reply 93):
Watch this space.
QF to drop SFO in favour of DFW nonstop from SYD on 747ER.

Any sources on this info or when it is going to happen ?

I guess it is a pre emptitive with CO and their flight to IAH

Quoting The Coachman (Reply 97):
PIty re the dropping of SFO.

Have never been through DFW but is it any better for connections than LAX (AA's massive hub at DFW notwithstanding)?

Indeed a pitty about it, with the 744ER going to DFW, I wonder, in the new year the BNE services, that were going to get the 744ER's

DFW is a monster! I have transited through DFW both international (LHR-BA-DFW-AA-SEA, LAX-AA-DFW-ACA-DFW-AA-SFO) and domestically (SEA-AA-DFW-AA-HNL), both post Sept11. I have had no troubles with customs and Immigration, the queues were vey minimal, to the point where the the only pax in the queue were the same people on the plane. Transfering between terminals is a lot easier at DFW, where you have miltiple train doing loops, in opposite directions to get you to the appropriate terminal. If QF do this, as a part of the flight attendants "Welcome to DFW" speal, I think it would be adventageous to do like what AA do, have a list of all the oncarrige flight PAX and advise what gate and/or terminal their nex flight is departing from.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-27 13:00:11 and read 12351 times.

Quoting TN486 (Reply 96):
Could an A330 do AKL/SFO non-stop?

Yes, it's not much further than AKL-LAX which is currently being flown by an A330.

I'd probably guess wait until the 787 comes before this route becomes active again. Good news for Air NZ - looks like they're into win with their SFO flight..

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: gemuser
Posted 2010-10-27 14:08:48 and read 12313 times.

Quoting miami1 (Reply 93):
QF to drop SFO in favour of DFW nonstop from SYD on 747ER

Got me doubts!

B744ER nominal range (from QF web site) = 12971 km
MEL-LAX distance (from G C mapper) = 12748 km
SYD - DFW = 13804 km
SYD -SAN -DFW (if necessary) = 13990 km

So, it's 1052 km further than MEL-LAX (GC), there's a payload hit right there, without factoring the winds, especially westbound.

Is it too big a payload hit? [I ask the question, I don't know the answer]

QF might be prepared to run it at a loss until the B787s or the post 2012 A380 arrive, just to get the bloody route finally open!!!

Gemuser

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2010-10-27 14:45:38 and read 12280 times.

I doubt DFW right now too.

1. If the route was viable even with a payload hit, QF would already be flying it. WIth the global economy the way it is, now is not the right time to operate routes at a loss. I doubt the lepiechaun would agree to it.

2. A set of 744ER's wouldn't come from SFO which doesn't require it. Compared to LAX there isn't as much connecting traffic for SFO, so the route could remain. The ER's would have to come from SYD-JNB (no way), SYD-BUE (maybe) or the soon to commence SYD-LAX-BNE-LAX-SYD routing... SYD/BNE could revert to standard 744's.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-27 21:48:59 and read 12083 times.

Quoting miami1 (Reply 93):
Watch this space.
QF to drop SFO in favour of DFW nonstop from SYD on 747ER.

Still being sold into September 2011, at 4pw, which is down one weekly frequency from what it was a couple of years ago.

I doubt SYD-DFW on a 744ER non stop in both directions. That would be an awful payload hit heading westbound, although possibly doable eastbound. Much more likely on an improved A388 or a B789.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-27 23:21:43 and read 11988 times.

I asked the question in another forum about 744s and the distance on SYD-DFW - this was my question:

(Sorry for asking, but can someone confirm that 8500 miles is within the range of a 747-400ER with full pax and some freight. When this route has been previously discussed, I thought a stop in Auckland was a possibility.

8500 miles looks like a 787 sort of distance.)

This was the reply from another person on that forum:

(The still-air distances are (from great circle mapper):

SYD (33°56'46"S 151°10'38"E) DFW (32°53'49"N 97°02'17"W) 7454 nm
DFW (32°53'49"N 97°02'17"W) BNE (27°23'03"S 153°07'03"E) 7215 nm

The distances previously quoted are statute miles.

As a comparison, LAX-MEL is about 6900 nm. Given that DFW-BNE would have a lower headwind component, the air distance would be comparable, and with tailwinds, SYD-DFW would be fine for an ER as well, though I'd expect it to need full fuel and the possibility of reduced payload. You'd still get a full pax load (about 310) but reduced freight.)

Because of winds the people on the other forum think a stop in BNE is required, so the flights would operate
SYD-DFW-BNE-SYD.

SFO is still a good port, so I hope QF will still be there even if DFW does start.

As a marketing exercise - this will be a big battle between Star Alliance through IAH and OneWorld through DFW. Qantas will get codeshare access to LGA and DCA, which is one benefit over flying into the West Coast. Since AA is huge in New York there will be lots of people flying to Australia on this service. Will people from NY prefer AA and QF and the 744 via Dallas, or will they use the CO/UA 787 via IAH with a change to AirNZ Trans Tasman A320s at AKL?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TN486
Posted 2010-10-27 23:34:45 and read 11969 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 103):
Will people from NY prefer AA and QF and the 744 via Dallas, or will they use the CO/UA 787 via IAH with a change to AirNZ Trans Tasman A320s at AKL

You can expect those who have a more than passing interest in aviation to try out the 787, however most would prefer a sameplane service.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-27 23:42:59 and read 11960 times.

Quoting TN486 (Reply 104):
You can expect those who have a more than passing interest in aviation to try out the 787, however most would prefer a sameplane service.

It will depend whether UA or AA is offering the better Miles offer at the time of travelling. I wonder if Qantas would have their own Club lounge at DFW or would they use an AA lounge or the BA lounge?

Question about the possible stop in BNE - I know that in the past some airlines have done Inflight Redespatch, where the plane is cleared to an intermediate point, and then when they reach that point, if they have enough fuel to reach the place they really wanted to go to, they divert there. Continental was one airline which did this on flights over the Atlantic.

I wonder if Qantas has ever used Inflight Redispatch? They could dispatch the plane to BNE and divert to SYD.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-27 23:45:16 and read 11953 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 103):

(Sorry for asking, but can someone confirm that 8500 miles is within the range of a 747-400ER with full pax

Only if those are statute miles, old son.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 103):

SFO is still a good port,

Yes, and why pull out of it now, when the 787, which could only help this port is so near?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: kiwiandrew
Posted 2010-10-27 23:49:34 and read 11955 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 103):
SFO is still a good port, so I hope QF will still be there even if DFW does start.

It would seem very strange for QFto withdraw SFO service ..... but I am sure that NZ and UA will be extremely happy if they do decide to cut it .

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-27 23:58:59 and read 11949 times.

If Qantas DID pull out of SFO - would that make SFO a possibility for V Australia? JB would at least have to think about it, even though his first six planes are spoken for - if 5 and 6 go to AUH.

SFO would be a good port for VA to connect onto Virgin America. Even with the Delta Joint Venture, if that goes ahead, SFO would give an alternative to LAX. United would be delighted if Qantas hand them back a monopoly on non stop SFO-SYD.

VA could go back to their friends at EK or perhaps the nice people at SQ and ask about some preloved 777-200ERs for SFO ( and they would be good for BNE-LAX as well).

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-28 00:07:10 and read 11926 times.

Quoting TN486 (Reply 104):
You can expect those who have a more than passing interest in aviation to try out the 787, however most would prefer a sameplane service.

It'd be interesting to see people who want to try out an A380 vs people who want to try out the 787. The A380 has attracted many people just to fly on it, as shown by AF's LHR-CDG flights and other flights too.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 108):
If Qantas DID pull out of SFO - would that make SFO a possibility for V Australia?

I would like to think so. If this DJ/DL venture did go through, it would allow passengers to go via either port. VX has a hub in SFO (they do have one in LAX too, might I add, but I'd come across SFO as being easier to transfer in) as well if the JV proposal was turned down.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-28 00:07:34 and read 11940 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 105):

I wonder if Qantas has ever used Inflight Redispatch? They could dispatch the plane to BNE and divert to SYD.

Pretty sure this is used routinely on LAX flights. I think the intermediate point is NAN for SYD flights.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Ben175
Posted 2010-10-28 02:39:24 and read 11801 times.

I haven't seen them posted here, so here is the schedule for CX's new 3 x weekly service to PER, to compliment the daily midnight run.

CX 137 HKG-PER 2255 0635 + 1
CX 136 PER-HKG 0755 1535

Also, when will Batavia Air's new DPS service, expected to commence Dec 10, open for ticketing? Perth is still not listed on their website.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: gemuser
Posted 2010-10-28 02:39:47 and read 11821 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 110):
Quoting alangirvan (Reply 105):

I wonder if Qantas has ever used Inflight Redispatch? They could dispatch the plane to BNE and divert to SYD.

Pretty sure this is used routinely on LAX flights. I think the intermediate point is NAN for SYD flights.

According to a B744ER driver of my acquaintance QF have for many years used a "continuous dispatch" method where the ops computers/people continually monitor the aircraft's position and fuel state, the weather, distance to nearest alternate, etc, etc to ensure compliance with the all regs and alert the PIC is a "situation" is brewing. You Inflight Redispatc sounds the same or very similar.

Gemuser

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: gemuser
Posted 2010-10-28 02:51:29 and read 11807 times.

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 107):
It would seem very strange for QFto withdraw SFO service
Quoting eta unknown (Reply 101):
2. A set of 744ER's wouldn't come from SFO which doesn't require it. Compared to LAX there isn't as much connecting traffic for SFO, so the route could remain. The ER's would have to come from SYD-JNB (no way), SYD-BUE (maybe) or the soon to commence SYD-LAX-BNE-LAX-SYD routing... SYD/BNE could revert to standard 744's.

2 B744ER on SYD-JNB, 2 B744ER on SYD-EZE and 2 on SYD-DFW sounds reasonable, when MEL-LAX goes A380 daily. That leaves the second daily SYD-LAX and BNE-LAX for B744s, on the Pacific.

Gemuser

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-28 03:56:22 and read 11735 times.

Quoting miami1 (Reply 93):
Watch this space.
QF to drop SFO in favour of DFW nonstop from SYD on 747ER.

What ! Is SFO not working for Qantas? Because this will be the 2nd time that they have dropped SFO if this is true. With the A333's are Qantas using them just between Auckland and LAX, or are the flights orginating in BNE, SYD or MEL?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-28 04:00:16 and read 11717 times.

Can't 1 plane do SYD-EZE?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-28 04:07:25 and read 11707 times.

Quoting FlyingSottsman (Reply 114):
With the A333's are Qantas using them just between Auckland and LAX, or are the flights orginating in BNE, SYD or MEL?

A332, not A333. Routing: SYD-AKL-LAX-JFK-LAX-AKL-SYD.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 115):
Can't 1 plane do SYD-EZE?

Depends on frequency?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-28 04:25:45 and read 11695 times.

Hi A-netters this is my very first question on here its great to be able to share my avaition passion with people from all over the world. I was woundering if Qantas are still using their 763's from SYD to HNL, and have they, or will they replace this AC with an A330-300?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-28 04:30:57 and read 11685 times.

Quoting FlyingSottsman (Reply 117):
I was woundering if Qantas are still using their 763's from SYD to HNL

Yes they are, though only 3x weekly and JQ has more frequency than QF on this route. It seems to me as though they'd send JQ daily before changing the QF plane on this route. But I highly doubt the A333 would be suitable for this, A332 max, if anything.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: BNE
Posted 2010-10-28 04:31:20 and read 11704 times.

Tiger Airways flights between Sydney and Brisbane have gone on sale today, priced from $38.95 for flights 7 February 2011 to 26 March 2011.

TT6101 Dep SYD 0800 Arr BNE 0825
TT6102 Dep BNE 0855 Arr SYD 1130

TT6107 Dep SYD 1645 Arr BNE 1710
TT6108 Dep BNE 1740 Arr SYD 2015

http://www.tigerairways.com/au/en/real_deals.php

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-28 04:31:55 and read 11710 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 116):
A332, not A333. Routing: SYD-AKL-LAX-JFK-LAX-AKL-SYD

Thanks NZ107 I didnt relise they were flying them on to JFK, I knew Qantas flew them on the MEL-AKL-LAX run for a while then put back the 744 on it and I think now its a 738 to AKL then switch to a 744 to LAX please correct me if I am wrong, but yeah I didnt know they were running all the way to JFK. Will have to try that flight on my flight simulator.     

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-28 04:34:05 and read 11703 times.

Quoting FlyingSottsman (Reply 117):
Hi A-netters this is my very first question on here its great to be able to share my avaition passion with people from all over the world. I was woundering if Qantas are still using their 763's from SYD to HNL, and have they, or will they replace this AC with an A330-300?
http://www.qantas.com.au/travel/airlines/timetable/global/en
So, yes, it is still 767. I have read that they have plans to retire 767s from international, but not done yet.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-28 04:40:24 and read 11694 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 118):
Yes they are, though only 3x weekly and JQ has more frequency than QF on this route. It seems to me as though they'd send JQ daily before changing the QF plane on this route. But I highly doubt the A333 would be suitable for this, A332 max, if anything.

Ok yeah I often wounder if Qantas will pull out of HNL altogether in the future and give it to JetStar, It seemed that the MEL HNL never realy worked, that last time I flew from MEL to HNL was in 1989 and that was with Air Pacific when they did the MEL-NAN-HNL-LAX it was a Qantas flight flown in FJ metal. For Qantas HNL seems to only work for them from SYD.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-28 04:44:43 and read 11689 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 121):
So, yes, it is still 767. I have read that they have plans to retire 767s from international, but not done yet.

yes The Geek I to have heard that, thats why I was asking, I dont know where I saw it, it might have been on here even but I think they were saying that Qantas from November will use the A330s on the SYD-BNE-MNL route.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-28 04:54:25 and read 11690 times.

Quoting FlyingSottsman (Reply 123):
So, yes, it is still 767. I have read that they have plans to retire 767s from international, but not done yet.

I think the 763s are still used on the SYD-BNE-MNL route and SYD-HNL route, not sure they are still on the Tasman route, but most of Qantas's SE Asian network I think is A330 now. And the 763s are on the long haul domestic,correct me if I am wrong tho.  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: brad330
Posted 2010-10-28 05:25:43 and read 11666 times.

Quoting FlyingSottsman (Reply 124):
And the 763s are on the long haul domestic

the 763's are used on the following routes

Domestic:

DRW-SYD
DRW-BNE
CNS-SYD
CNS-MEL
CNS-BNE
CBR-MEL
PER-BNE
PER-SYD
PER-MEL
ADL-MEL
ADL-SYD
BNE-SYD
BNE-MEL
SYD-MEL

International:

SYD-HNL
SYD-BNE-MNL
SYD-MNL
BNE-MNL

763's are no longer used on Trans Tasman flights. It would be nice to see QF start BNE-NRT or CNS-BNE-NRT since JL dropped BNE. and maybe 3x weekly MEL-NRT

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: 9mmpd
Posted 2010-10-28 05:35:22 and read 11657 times.

Quoting brad330 (Reply 125):
International:

You can unfortunately add PER - NRT. That is still a 763 service.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: sydks
Posted 2010-10-28 05:40:24 and read 11762 times.

Has anyone flown the SYD-AKL-LAX route with QF since the A330-200 took over? Would be curious to know from any QF crew or pax who have experienced it if they are able to deliver the same standard of inflight service as onboard the 744 and A380. Has there been any changes to the food/service offering due to galley/space constraints? It seems like such a long flight for pax to be couped up in a (relatively) small plane.

What is pax feedback like? The super early departure from SYD (6.15am) and nearly 4 hour layover in AKL are not particularly attractive...

Trying to book FF seats over to the states and it seems to be my only option for the dates I need, but love to know more before I commit.

Thanks! sydks

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: PA515
Posted 2010-10-28 07:10:57 and read 11709 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 116):
Quoting thegeek (Reply 115):
Can't 1 plane do SYD-EZE?

Depends on frequency?

One aircraft can do it.

SYD-EZE Mo We Sa 1100/1000 Mo We Sa (13h 00m)
EZE-SYD Mo We Sa 1305/1740+1 Tu Th Su (14h 35m)

PA515

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Ben175
Posted 2010-10-28 16:55:04 and read 11516 times.

Quoting 9mmpd (Reply 126):
You can unfortunately add PER - NRT. That is still a 763 service.

I know many people who say that flight is absolutely unbearable. Alot of the time, you end up with a domestic configured 763 with no IFE, restrictive seats and mediocre food.

Oh, not to mention how ridiculously overpriced it is.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2010-10-28 20:36:27 and read 11359 times.

Quoting sydks (Reply 127):
What is pax feedback like? The super early departure from SYD (6.15am) and nearly 4 hour layover in AKL are not particularly attractive...

Trying to book FF seats over to the states and it seems to be my only option for the dates I need, but love to know more before I commit.

The 06:15 SYD-AKL is on a 737. Basically, if you want free, you gotta take what's on offer or be flexible with dates. I can't imagine there being any service quality issues 747 vs 330. As for saying the 330 is a "(relatively) small plane", think of the positives: less crowded!!!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: 9mmpd
Posted 2010-10-28 22:39:36 and read 11232 times.

Quoting Ben175 (Reply 129):
I know many people who say that flight is absolutely unbearable. Alot of the time, you end up with a domestic configured 763 with no IFE, restrictive seats and mediocre food.

Oh, not to mention how ridiculously overpriced it is.

I know. I have a couple of friends who will travel with CX via HKG to NRT to avoid the terrible J Class seats on that flight. I have been trying to convince them to go with QF via SIN and connect with JL as the J class would be better than CX's coffin J seat but they are wanting to try it out plus the SIN option is a lot longer.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TN486
Posted 2010-10-28 23:00:14 and read 11211 times.

Quoting FlyingSottsman (Reply 117):
Hi A-netters this is my very first question on here its great to be able to share my avaition

Yeah, its not a bad site, always provides loads of info (and some laughs). Welcome to the Aussie thread by the way.
I refer you to two sites that are very brilliant sources of info re the QF group of companys:
www.qflyer.info/ and www.theqantassource.com/index.html
Both these sites are used as reference material in our QF discussions.
Cheers

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-29 01:00:43 and read 11084 times.

Quoting Ben175 (Reply 129):

No, incorrect.. it maybe a domestic looking config in Y but in J it is the 25 seat config, and all tho very old school, its quiet comfortable! and its all about the monopoly on that route, and profitality.. unless someone else starts flying PER-NRT, there is no need to change the quipment... its a smart business move.. althought i dont agree and yes some pax do suffer.. but id much rather a profitable route then not making money on it  
Quoting eta unknown (Reply 130):

QF141 that departs at 0615:
Monday A332
Tuesday A332
Wednesday A332
Thursday A332
Friday A332
Saturday A333
Sunday B738

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: SCL767
Posted 2010-10-29 01:14:09 and read 11063 times.

LAN has a new e-ticketing agreement between LAN and its affiliates (LA, LP, XL, 4M) and Jetstar Airways (JQ). Hopefully a code-share follows in the future.
http://www.lan.com/gc/asociados/proc...acuerdo_jetstar_solo_us/index.html

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Zkpilot
Posted 2010-10-29 02:45:17 and read 10958 times.

Quoting sydks (Reply 127):
Has anyone flown the SYD-AKL-LAX route with QF since the A330-200 took over? Would be curious to know from any QF crew or pax who have experienced it if they are able to deliver the same standard of inflight service as onboard the 744 and A380. Has there been any changes to the food/service offering due to galley/space constraints? It seems like such a long flight for pax to be couped up in a (relatively) small plane.

Service is almost exactly the same. The IFE is more reliable than on the 744 also. Pax seem to like it...crew...not so much. It's 30mins+ slower and the air onboard is a lot drier. Only service difference I can think of is in Y with only 1 bakery service offered (space constraints).

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: skyhigh
Posted 2010-10-29 03:11:22 and read 10942 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 133):
its all about the monopoly on that route, and profitality.. unless someone else starts flying PER-NRT, there is no need to change the quipment... its a smart business move.

Yes it may be the only direct route but I imagine that Qantas is loosing a large amount of passengers to SQ, MH, CX and TG, especially any business class passengers.

I've had friends fly on the NRT-PER route and I feel that the old product on the 767 is damaging QF's image as a premium carrier. It has domestic style offerings on a 10½ hour flight! As much as i've tried to convince them otherwise, it has certainly put my friends off flying Qantas ever again.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-29 04:17:52 and read 10873 times.

Quoting skyhigh (Reply 136):

And i completely agree.. but for convienience .... and just the one flight... no lay-overs... its kinda appealing  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-10-29 14:09:39 and read 10705 times.

What are people's thoughts on Jetstar pulling out of Avalon? The only service that really does any good is the 6am AVV-SYD, and apparently Tiger are launching a 6.10am service in the new year. Pretty obvious what Tiger intentions are....

With all the new terminal and so on, JQ might be in a contract with them?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: DJ748
Posted 2010-10-29 16:16:16 and read 10644 times.

Quoting brad330 (Reply 125):
International:

SYD-HNL
SYD-BNE-MNL
SYD-MNL
BNE-MNL

The SYD-BNE-MNL flights can be taken off the list as the 767 last served the route on Thursday just been, and subsequently SYD-MNL have now transitioned to the A333.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-29 19:52:02 and read 10503 times.

Quoting skyhigh (Reply 136):

I've had friends fly on the NRT-PER route and I feel that the old product on the 767 is damaging QF's image

Isn't it about time this flight became A332? What's holding it up? Shouldn't they have made one of the A332s which they configured for domestic suitable for this flight?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-10-29 20:28:33 and read 10463 times.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 138):
What are people's thoughts on Jetstar pulling out of Avalon? The only service that really does any good is the 6am AVV-SYD, and apparently Tiger are launching a 6.10am service in the new year. Pretty obvious what Tiger intentions are....

With all the new terminal and so on, JQ might be in a contract with them?

I do not see JQ retreating from AVV for the time being. JQ is a defensive weapon against TT and DJ, so pulling out totally would admit defeat there.

JQ apparently had some sort of an exclusivity contract at one point from AVV but that appeares to have ceased.

AVV's strength is its cheap landing costs and its proxiity to Geelong and the Surf Coast, along with the best access to the GOR. The peak for tourism in those areas is Summer, which gives more potential for flights to be taken, given its great position to service those needs.. Business traffic is never really that high from AVV, and the area needs further regional development to happen to get it to take off further in that sector. Geelong becoming a bigger business base would help in that regard, but that will take time. Until then, it will be a harder market to get to work.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TN486
Posted 2010-10-29 23:12:25 and read 10330 times.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 138):
What are people's thoughts on Jetstar pulling out of Avalon? The only service that really does any good is the 6am AVV-SYD, and apparently Tiger are launching a 6.10am service in the new year. Pretty obvious what Tiger intentions

Thoughts. My first thought is your statement suggesting "the only service that does any good is the 0600 AVV-SYD". Do you have a source for this? My first thought was to check the JQ website with a search on the cheapest fares AVV-SYD on any given week in the future. Randomly, I picked the week 24 - 30 Nov 2010. This is what I came up with:
Wed 24 Nov JQ 604 $39 JQ 614 $49 JQ 616 N/A JQ 626 $49
Thu 25 Nov JQ 604 $49 JQ 614 $59 JQ 616 $59 JQ 626 $49
Fri 26 Nov JQ 604 $59 JQ 614 $99 JQ 616 $79 JQ 626 $79
Sat 27 Nov JQ 604 $59 JQ 614 $59 JQ 616 N/A JQ 626 $49
Sun 28 Nov JQ 604 $49 JQ 614 $119 JQ 616 $119 JQ 626 $139
Mon 29 Nov JQ 604 $59 JQ 614 $59 JQ 616 $59 JQ 626 $39
Tue 30 Nov JQ 604 $39 JQ 614 $49 JQ 616 N/A JQ 626 $39

Note: JQ 616 only flies Mon, Thu, Fri and Sun.

This revenue management tells me that, apart from the Sat morning flight, pax prefer JQ 614, the afternoon service to SYD.

IMHO, JQ will stay in AVV, and I suspect that in the future you will see Adelaide and Perth services restored.

Tigers intentions: lower their cost base, get a share of the revenue available to/from AVV.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: brad330
Posted 2010-10-30 01:09:03 and read 10262 times.

I was flying out of LHR today and saw 2x380's and 2x744's at remote stands. I looked at QF'S website and the aircraft spend up to 17hrs on the ground. This got me thinking could QF send 1 or 2 of there a/c to JFK and operate on behalf of BA/AA or on its own with OW codeshare?

Approximately:

06:30 LHR-10:00 JFK
11:00 JFK-21:40 LHR

with 380 a/c it could be a big hit, what are everyones thoughts?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-30 01:16:56 and read 10247 times.

Quoting brad330 (Reply 143):
with 380 a/c it could be a big hit, what are everyones thoughts?

FWIW, my thinking would be that it would be all too hard. The bilaterals between Aus & UK, and Aus & US may need to be changed, but even if they don't, then you would still be really struggling to find flight crew. And do you see too many 747s flying out of LHR to the US? Some, no doubt, but I would think that QF would have real trouble filling it. And why would BA want to help with a service which would be competing with flights on their own metal?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-30 02:32:30 and read 10172 times.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 138):

AVV flights are mostly at 85-90% load factor.... JQ will not pull out of this route. They have a Aircraft based there and a crew base.. its a cheap base to operate out of.... i think you'll see further expansion if tiger are going in there!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-10-30 02:40:40 and read 10167 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 145):
AVV flights are mostly at 85-90% load factor.... JQ will not pull out of this route. They have a Aircraft based there and a crew base.. its a cheap base to operate out of.... i think you'll see further expansion if tiger are going in there!

Totally agree. JQ will fight it out, as they know that TT are less stable than themselves. Fare wars, or route changes may likely be the way that this pans out from AVV, but I can not see JQ losing out.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-30 02:59:59 and read 10158 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 146):

Look at the past.. where ever TT go, JQ throw themselves at it with a big force twice the size of TT and then drive them out.. and, also, looking at TT website for flights on November 1st (for another thread, i wouldnt get on a TT flight if you paid me $1M) MEL-SYD they are asking $168-$229 one way! no wonderr why they are just breaking even...for that price you can get on a QF flight...

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-10-30 03:13:57 and read 10162 times.

The fact is that TT and DJ a fighting a very savvy competitor. The QF Group knows how to deploy JQ, and where it should pull back and use its resources more wisely.

AVV has had:

JQ
SYD
BNE
PER
ADL

As soon as TT announced PER and ADL from MEL , JQ responded by redeploying those AVV flights to MEL. As soon as TT announced SYD flights, JQ was deployed into MEL to compete on the route.

Ultimately, I see JQ moving a daily PER and ADL flight back to AVV to bring more economies of scale into that operation, further strengthening its product from there against TT. It wants to be the carrier of AVV, as it was the original there, so I am sure they will go all out to maintaining a strong presence there, with the aim of weakening TT.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-30 03:32:38 and read 10132 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 148):

Let the blood bath start, we all know who will come of worse  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TN486
Posted 2010-10-30 06:17:45 and read 10029 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 145):
JQ will not pull out of this route
Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 146):
Totally agree. JQ will fight it out
Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 148):
Ultimately, I see JQ moving a daily PER and ADL flight back to AVV
Quoting TN486 (Reply 142):
IMHO, JQ will stay in AVV, and I suspect that in the future you will see Adelaide and Perth services restored

it would appear the 3 of us agree on this  
Quoting JQflightie (Reply 147):
Look at the past.. where ever TT go, JQ throw themselves at it with a big force twice the size of TT and then drive them

Did JQ ever do MEL - MKY? or MEL - ROK? I would agree with you in some aspects, (e.g MEL - SYD) but JQ were around before TT, and JQ seemed to know where TT was going to go before they did, and yes, they then did as you suggested, but only if it was "economic" to do so.

[Edited 2010-10-30 06:24:51]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-10-30 15:06:41 and read 9927 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 148):
Ultimately, I see JQ moving a daily PER and ADL flight back to AVV to bring more economies of scale into that operation, further strengthening its product from there against TT. It wants to be the carrier of AVV, as it was the original there, so I am sure they will go all out to maintaining a strong presence there, with the aim of weakening TT.

JQ has added another Perth flight from Melbourne, early morning in competition with Tiger's morning AVV flight, so they are clearly not interested in operating it from Avalon. They also added another Adelaide flight from Tullamarine.

Going into 2011, JQ's schedule is down to 3 AVV-SYD's and 1 AVV-BNE on some days.I dont know where you got 80-90% load factors from but I can assure you mid week its down to the 20's.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 147):
Look at the past.. where ever TT go, JQ throw themselves at it with a big force twice the size of TT and then drive them out..

Where? JQ just pulled BNE-ROK with Tiger's entrance, cut back MEL-CNS frequencies very quietly...MEL-ASP/MKY/ROK/CBR? Going forward you are going to find its starting to become the opposite, its Tiger launching onto JQ/DJ routes.

The past is different, especially in Tiger early days, being unprofitable they had no choice to chop and change along with a incompetent management team. But now they are profitable (not in Singas at the moment), have costs 30% lower than JQ, and their brand is known and out there.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-30 16:46:32 and read 9886 times.

JQ seems to be a totally reactive airline - reacting to what TT does, even if sometimes that is pre-emptive strikes - reacting to what they think TT will do.

An early morning flight out of AVV - well the catchment area is basically the same as for MEL, but with a longer drive. Do people really want to get out of bed at 3.30am to fly AVV-PER? AVV might be OK for people who are visiting Melbourne City - they can use public transport to go from AVV to Melbourne CBD - People could fly into AVV and home from MEL.

As an Avalon thought, rather than a Tiger thought, I wonder if AVV would work as a Trans Tasman gateway. it could be JQ who does it - perhaps with Smart Gate technology.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ditzyboy
Posted 2010-10-30 20:18:46 and read 9760 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 101):
The ER's would have to come from SYD-JNB (no way

JNB is ops by non-ER Kangaroo configured 744s.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-30 22:45:57 and read 9638 times.

Quoting TN486 (Reply 132):
Yeah, its not a bad site, always provides loads of info (and some laughs). Welcome to the Aussie thread by the way

[quote=TN486,reply=132]Yeah, its not a bad site, always provides loads of info (and some laughs). Welcome to the Aussie thread by the way[/qu

Thanks TN486 I will have a look at those sites to.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-30 22:58:10 and read 9633 times.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 151):

that new PER flight is because of crewing constraints. its a new triangular pattern. so there is now no overnights done in ADL now.

week commencing 1/11/2010 - 7/11/2010
AVV-SYD-AVV has a load factor of 85-90% with 2 flights on wednesday full.

BNE-ROK was because they couldnt meet in the middle with airport costs, and the upgrade of aircraft and schedual from QLink.

MEL-CNS the extra flight in the morning is only ever seasonal and is sometimes even done with the 332, so any extra capacity on that route is an added bonus.

I think your forgetting that there are some places that we wont be going because of QF... Premium pax on ASP and CBR... polititans dont want row 13 on a A320, they want Business class.

and we used to have MEL-MKY... i admit it was very short lived.. but this was way before TT came on the scene, and even then.. it wasnt a popular service. If JQ wasnt making money on a rout it will soon be pulled! AVV is here to stay!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-10-31 00:02:07 and read 9565 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 155):
week commencing 1/11/2010 - 7/11/2010
AVV-SYD-AVV has a load factor of 85-90% with 2 flights on wednesday full.

Spring racing carnival in Melbourne over the next week, not many seats to/from Melbourne over the next week.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 155):
BNE-ROK was because they couldnt meet in the middle with airport costs

Buchanan and his excuses..JQ operating a once daily flight, which was to become Australia's lowest yielded route with Tiger bringing in overcapacity...there is absolutely no hope in hell of keeping up with Tiger and remaining sustainable. Overheads would be quite high for a once daily operation. There was a period of two weeks when TT/JQ clashed on this route, both carriers were pulling 50pax max. Tiger still only gets 100-120 on Tue/Wed, and has lead in fares of around $20-30 on those days..

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-31 00:22:22 and read 9544 times.

Rockhamton, Mackay, Launceston - all these cities are hard ones to serve on the Qantas Group network. Apparently, there are some business travellers who would like start of the day flights to BNE or from LST, and the A320s aimed at leisure passengers are not quite what they want. I would have thought the Qantaslink Q400s are a bit slow for ROK to BNE, but perhaps they are what the business travellers want.

Maybe, these cities could be served by aircraft similart to the American Eagle CRJ-700s with about 6 Business Class seats at the start of the day. A320s are huge aircraft for the size of these cities. Mixed Class CRJs are also used by Air Canada.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-31 00:54:15 and read 9496 times.

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 56):
Looks like BI will commence MEL services in late march next year, 4 weekly 777 service! Source airlineroute.net looking forward to this one for sure!!

My Wife's Auntie's husband works at Mel, told me last night BI are comming in March next year to, will be great to see them come in also still no word regarding the starting of operations of Air India yet.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-31 01:06:29 and read 9490 times.

Quoting gemuser (Reply 100):
Got me doubts!

Dont Know Gemuser the SYD-EZE is done with a 744ER and looking at my globe right next to me it sure seens a lot longer than SYD-DFW. With that route from SYD -EZE does Qantas over fly New Zealand or does it go down the middle of the Tasman then turns Eastwards aound the Southren Coast of the South Island then the trans Polar route to EZE? I did that flight on my Flight Simulator and thats the way it took me. So if thats the way it does go in real life then I would say the 744 would do SYD - DFW.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-31 01:19:47 and read 9482 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 4):
'm not sure that will have much impact down here. I think I'm more likely to grown wings than QF are to ever serve MAD

Yes I think you are right there Ryan, I cant see Qantas serving any other European City apart form LHR and FRA,when they have their Oneworld partners that goes to every part of Europe. Look at BA's network alone in Europe. So i dont think you will see any changes down this part of the world regarding BA/IB/AA, maybe with the UA/CO merger you might see AKL served once again in UA metal. What will happen to Continental MIke, will that stay the same or will that become United?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-31 01:57:58 and read 9433 times.

Has anyone seen the new QF tv commercial? what are peoples thoughts? its not on youtube yet!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: smi0006
Posted 2010-10-31 03:10:31 and read 9362 times.

JQFlightie that is spooky!! I was just about to post my views on them!

I must confess I do like it apart from the music. I find the music is not 'Australian' enough, not that I have any objection to this normally it's just not inline with QF. Although perhaps they have finally woken up to the fact that playing the Australian card is no longer working? In which case this is a good thing! I must confess whilst I like the adds they are a bit blah and lack substance.

For those who haven't seen the adds they features the 'refreshed' of Domestic products and the Tasman products. imporvements such as the next generation check-in, lounges inline with their international counter parts and combined with some alterations with domestic and tasman inflight product, although these are hardly major changes.
message/tagline is: 'There's a new Spirit of Australia in the air' followed by ' Qantas, Enjoy the journey'.

I like the add as it is in with the image that Qantas is wanting to project regarding it's branding, and thus it is true to that. I don't like the add (apart from the next generation check-in) as I feel that target too much at improving branding and not product focused enough. I do look forward to see new adds from the rebranded DJ and the subsiquent QF adds.

I would imagine this is a pre-emptive move against DJ. I do hope that QF move to improve their international product and marketing as isn't that where they are starting to significantly loose market share? Where as domestic is doing okay?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: gemuser
Posted 2010-10-31 04:19:30 and read 9288 times.

Quoting FlyingSottsman (Reply 159):
Dont Know Gemuser the SYD-EZE is done with a 744ER and looking at my globe right next to me it sure seens a lot longer than SYD-DFW

In fact SYD-DFW is 1,090 nm further than SYD-EZE, (on a great circle basis), 6366 nm to EZE, 7454 nm to DFW.
See: SYD-EZE%2C+SYD-DFW&MS=wls&DU=nm" target="_blank">http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=SYD-EZE%2C+SYD-DFW&MS=wls&DU=nm

I don't doubt the B744ER can do, but will the payload hit, especially westbound, be too much? As I said in reply 100, is it too much? I don't know.

Sunrise Valley, you're pretty good at this, got any comments?

Gemuser

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2010-10-31 07:14:18 and read 9174 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 157):
I would have thought the Qantaslink Q400s are a bit slow for ROK to BNE

The Q400 does 1h15 up and 1h00 down, exactly the same block times as TT

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 157):
Apparently, there are some business travellers who would like start of the day flights to BNE or from LST

Absolutely, a decent number of people travel ROK to BNE for the day on business and they would appreciate a breakfast flight down and dinner flight back (albeit without the meals on Link). It's no different to SYD-MEL just a lot more parochial. There's a market so therefore QF serve it. Makes sense. It's just a 737 or A320 would be too big to be operated profitably, or with a business-friendly frequency.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: 747m8te
Posted 2010-10-31 10:30:23 and read 9141 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 164):
The Q400 does 1h15 up and 1h00 down, exactly the same block times as TT


Exactly! on routes that length the difference in flying time on the Q400s and A320s/737s is minimal...

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 157):
Rockhamton, Mackay, Launceston - all these cities are hard ones to serve on the Qantas Group network. Apparently, there are some business travellers who would like start of the day flights to BNE or from LST, and the A320s aimed at leisure passengers are not quite what they want. I would have thought the Qantaslink Q400s are a bit slow for ROK to BNE, but perhaps they are what the business travellers want.

Maybe, these cities could be served by aircraft similart to the American Eagle CRJ-700s with about 6 Business Class seats at the start of the day. A320s are huge aircraft for the size of these cities. Mixed Class CRJs are also used by Air Canada.

Personally I just don't see the benefit a CRJ-700, flight times aren't any greater, and no real capacity gain over the Q400, which are also more efficient for the airline then a CRJ would be on these sectors.

And actually, considering the population centers ROK, MKY and LST serve, they actually can sustain A320/737 size aircraft quite well if you look at the number of flights from each city...the fact that TT or JQ pulled out of routes is the market is already overserved...not that smaller aircraft are needed....

Take a look at the busiest routes from each of these cities...

LST-MEL
QFlink - 3xDaily Q400
DJ - 4-5xDaily 737 (with the odd E190 depending on day)
JQ - 3-4xDaily A320

MKY-BNE
QFlink - 5xDaily Q400 (with the odd Q300???)
DJ - 4-5xDaily 737 and E190
JQ - 4xDaily A320

ROK-BNE
QFlink - 4xDaily Q400
DJ - 4-5xDaily 737 and E190
TT - 1xDaily A320

Looking at the market of each of these cities...that is quite alot of capacity, and I would say the QF group actually are serving these cities quite well, and wouldn't be surprised if we see QF mainline back on some of these route again.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Rotation
Posted 2010-10-31 13:58:32 and read 9080 times.

Without having been a business traveller myself, I guess I can't comment on whether or not they prefer the Q400s - but having lived in Mackay myself and with family still there, I recall a few people being annoyed/upset when QF pulled the jets from the route and left it with turboprops. What is the general consensus for business travellers and turboprops?

Given the size of MKY I wouldn't have thought the business market would be too big anyway. Despite the number of mines around, most of them usually have chartered flights to the mine or township close to them.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-31 15:57:46 and read 8986 times.

A quick look at Qantas timetables showed Alliance Fokker 100s on some BNE-ROK flights, with times shown as similar to Q400 times.

BNE-ROK and MEL-LST may not have been the best examples. There must be a cross over point where a CRJ starts to have an advantage over the Q400. When Dornier were making the Dornier 328 and the 328 JET, they thought the point was about 300 miles, perhaps the Q400 takes it up to about 400 miles, or maybe 350 miles.

The CRJs are very controversial aircraft, in terms of economics and passenger comfort, though the larger ones, especially the CRJ-900 or CRJ-706 seems to be improved in both respects. For distance, CRJs might be better for routes that are 400-600 miles long.

It was much simpler when TAA and Ansett had DC-9s (and AN had 732s for a short time) and shared them between MKY and ROK. Three times daily BNE-ROK-MKY. 733s were too big, so 146s were tried. 717s. Fokker 100s, only recently as charters from Alliance.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: sydscott
Posted 2010-10-31 16:48:00 and read 8933 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 94):
Makes sense, as having SFO and LAX is not exactly that strategically important to QF. With AA stronger in LAX, compared to SFO , and DFW providing access to AA's main hub, it will give QF great coverage to the US and parts of the Carribean and Sth America.
Quoting miami1 (Reply 93):
QF to drop SFO in favour of DFW nonstop from SYD on 747ER.

I doubt it. I was on QF74 yesterday on the 744ER and it has full to the brim. SFO represents a strategically important direct service to a key biomedical, banking and IT heavy area of the US. People from NorCal don't like commuting to LAX for anything in the same way people hate connecting in Sydney. So for QF to pull out of SFO completely would, I think, be a pretty dumb decision and would lose them some Corporate $$$ which would otherwise go to UAL. I think at 3 to 4 services per week it is a sustainable service until the 787 comes along to take it over.

The only other thing QF should do at SFO is to stop sharing the JAL Sakura lounge which is complete, total and utter rubbish in its facilities.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: sunrisevalley
Posted 2010-10-31 17:26:02 and read 8885 times.

Quoting gemuser (Reply 163):
Sunrise Valley, you're pretty good at this, got any comments?

The way I read it is that DFW-SYD is about 8200nm ESAD interpolating from the LAX-MEL value of ~7500nm ESAD. The winds shouldn't be too much difference since the headings are very similar.
The DOW of the 744ER set up for 413 seats would be ~190t. The L/R chart suggests ~209t ZFW at 8200nm which leaves 19t payload a way less than the 39t needed for max. passenger load.
QF should have ordered the 77L four years ago; there were well placed insiders who believed it was a done deal. They could now be doing SYD-DFW/JFK - SYD and PER-LHR-PER. Goodness only knows why Dixon got cold feet. Another poster talked of the A380 on the route. It's going to be at least post-2012 before it has the legs for this distance.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-31 18:38:36 and read 8817 times.

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 169):
QF should have ordered the 77L four years ag

Their plan may have been to have the A380 doing this route by now. If things had worked out the way they expected, that may not have been too bad.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Allrite
Posted 2010-10-31 18:42:10 and read 8814 times.

Been away flying JQ to SIN and QF back, then DJ to ROK and QF back! TR's coming soon, but I obviously have some catching up to do with this thread.

Quoting TruemanQLD (Reply 57):
We are a smaller airport in terms of volume - we certainly are only a tenth of the volume of a Melbourne or a Perth," he said.

"But we have all of the facilities those airports have as well so very good infrastructure facilities

Bahahaha, you must be dreaming is all I can say. When I was transiting for SIN a couple of weeks ago the international departures area was overcrowded and consisted of a medium sized duty free store, a tiny cafe and a minuscule newsagent. Dreadful experience, especially as most of the passengers seemed to be Bali bound bogans.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 155):
BNE-ROK was because they couldnt meet in the middle with airport costs, and the upgrade of aircraft and schedual from QLink.
Quoting Rotation (Reply 166):
Without having been a business traveller myself, I guess I can't comment on whether or not they prefer the Q400s - but having lived in Mackay myself and with family still there, I recall a few people being annoyed/upset when QF pulled the jets from the route and left it with turboprops. What is the general consensus for business travellers and turboprops?

I have to laugh that ROK is such a crap city even Jetstar doesn't fly there anymore.   Almost no idea why leisure travellers would go there, except that the beaches on Great Keppel Island are nice, even if the resort facilities aren't. I have only visited for family reasons and over the years seen it downgraded from 737s and A320s to smaller aircraft.

Tiger's tiny schedules to ROK are useless if you come from somewhere other than BNE or MEL and are thinking of connecting. Not that you'd want to risk it from what I've heard. DJ run a non-daily direct SYD-ROK flight, but that is on a E170, which I've heard they are getting rid of. Wonder if they will use a E190 instead. Flew a DJ E190 BNE to ROK and it was much nicer than the QF Q400 on the way back. The Q400's window seats are very uncomfortable with reduced legroom due to fuselage curvature. Also, you park on a remote stand and need to go back through security if transiting in BNE. That said, there is some "romance" in flying with them at the lower cruise altitude and you do get fed pink cupcakes.  

I once saw Sol Trujillo fly in a Q400 from CBR to SYD, so at least one "businessman" was willing to fly in one and you could say that I am on business trips when on that route (though not for the private sector). I would personally rather fly the jets than the turboprop - they are more comfortable.

That said, If DJ are removing the E170 from their fleet and QF are ordering more Q400s it would suggest to me that the QF strategy is the more profitable one.

Quoting skyhigh (Reply 136):
I've had friends fly on the NRT-PER route and I feel that the old product on the 767 is damaging QF's image as a premium carrier. It has domestic style offerings on a 10½ hour flight!

Having flown 767's between SYD - CNS - KIX/NRT I can kind of understand, but the only full service offerings between Australia and Japan are single daily flights SYD-NRT with QF and JL. Everything else is JQ and their aircraft fitouts are the equivalent of a domestic 767 anyway, without the additional service. It's interesting that the QF group think that this is sufficient for now.

Maybe I'm just being a romantic, but after a couple of recent domestic flights must say I don't mind the creaky old QF 767s and their interiors. Really enjoyed those two flights.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 161):
Has anyone seen the new QF tv commercial? what are peoples thoughts? its not on youtube yet!
Quoting smi0006 (Reply 162):
I must confess I do like it apart from the music. I find the music is not 'Australian' enough, not that I have any objection to this normally it's just not inline with QF.

I like the add because of the music, which is sung by (and may be largely composed by, who knows with Hans Zimmer and his clones?) an Australian, Lisa Gerrard. It's from the Gladiator soundtrack. Not sure what the message is though, because the track title is "Now we are free".   I think it works in the same way the Enya "Storms in Africa" track did for Ansett. I miss the old JQ "Let's fly away" music for the same reasons too.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-31 19:25:50 and read 8753 times.

Quoting Allrite (Reply 171):
Flew a DJ E190 BNE to ROK and it was much nicer than the QF Q400 on the way back. The Q400's window seats are very uncomfortable with reduced legroom due to fuselage curvature.

There is the same comparison in NZ between the Q300s and the ATRs, where the ATRs have much better ankle room at the window seat.

Quoting Allrite (Reply 171):
I once saw Sol Trujillo fly in a Q400 from CBR to SYD, so at least one "businessman" was willing to fly in one and you could say that I am on business trips when on that route (though not for the private sector). I would personally rather fly the jets than the turboprop - they are more comfortable.

That said, If DJ are removing the E170 from their fleet and QF are ordering more Q400s it would suggest to me that the QF strategy is the more profitable one.

That would have a lot to do with the distance between SYD and CBR. Generally thought that E-170s are just a bit too small as jets (so are CRJ-700s), but you should see the large order by FlyBe in the UK for E-175s with 88 seats, so maybe there is there is a sweet spot, where this size of aircraft works. FlyBe already has a fleet of E-195s, which are bigger than the DJ E-190s.

Quoting Allrite (Reply 171):
Having flown 767's between SYD - CNS - KIX/NRT I can kind of understand, but the only full service offerings between Australia and Japan are single daily flights SYD-NRT with QF and JL. Everything else is JQ and their aircraft fitouts are the equivalent of a domestic 767 anyway, without the additional service. It's interesting that the QF group think that this is sufficient for now.

When V Australia build up their fleet of A330-200s, maybe Sydney to Haneda will be a route for them.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-31 20:00:10 and read 8709 times.

Quoting Allrite (Reply 171):
Maybe I'm just being a romantic, but after a couple of recent domestic flights must say I don't mind the creaky old QF 767s and their interiors. Really enjoyed those two flights.

I agree with this. Much rather a "creaky" old 767 than a brand new 738. *cough* 734 *cough*. Seat comfort is probably better on the JQ A320 rather than the Boeing planes in Y, IMHO. Not sure if it is the width or the seats that the individual airline has placed in the planes. I also hate having to wait 15 minutes or so to get off the plane if I am up the back.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 172):

When V Australia build up their fleet of A330-200s, maybe Sydney to Haneda will be a route for them.

Don't you mean Narita? I don't think VA will be getting HND landing rights. And why would they compete with QF on flights out of SYD when there is a completely untapped market out of BNE. Not sure about MEL. Japan possibilities as a long short for VA, as it mightn't be that price sensitive a segment of the market.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Allrite
Posted 2010-10-31 20:01:43 and read 8702 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 172):
There is the same comparison in NZ between the Q300s and the ATRs, where the ATRs have much better ankle room at the window seat.

As most people probably already know, the Bombadiers have greater performance, but in my limited experience, the ATR had a jet-like cabin with superior comfort.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 172):
That would have a lot to do with the distance between SYD and CBR. Generally thought that E-170s are just a bit too small as jets

Looking at QantasLink's route map I guess that the Q series gives them a lot of flexibility to serve small destinations economically and I can see that the Q400's climb performance may be an advantage on the milkruns of Qld (for example). The E190 is probably overkill for many of these routes so DJ may not be able to compete on them (should it want to).

I note the QantasLink use National Jet System's 717's on some routes where jets make more sense. I wonder if National Jet might acquire some Embraer or Bombardier jets sometime in the future.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 172):
When V Australia build up their fleet of A330-200s, maybe Sydney to Haneda will be a route for them.

But they'll be competing against QF and (I suppose) JL which already have full service flights. The question is how much full (or "best") service capacity is required for Japan flights from different parts of Australia, seeing as how inbound Japanese tourism is poor, Australian business trips are presumably reduced compared with the past. My own frequent recent flights, along with those of colleagues and relatives, have been driven by cheap leisure fares or tag ons from elsewhere in Asia.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-31 20:11:51 and read 8690 times.

Quoting Allrite (Reply 174):
I note the QantasLink use National Jet System's 717's on some routes where jets make more sense.

This is mostly routes in WA. There a couple of tag ons into QLD via NT though. Which makes a lot of sense to me, as the distances are large in WA and a prop wouldn't cut it.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ZuluAlpha
Posted 2010-10-31 22:21:23 and read 8560 times.

Quoting Allrite (Reply 174):
I wonder if National Jet might acquire some Embraer or Bombardier jets sometime in the future.

I was very fortunate in August to pose this same question to Lyell Strambi, QF Group Executive for Qantas Opperations. He advised that the 717's are still quite young (if my memory is correct they were from Impulse who bought them new from Boeing), and where there is quite intense competition form these 100 seater jets. He advised as well as Embraer Ejets and Bombardier with their new C series, there is also Mitsubishi Reagonal Jet. He made an off hand comment, maybe in about 5 years time

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ZuluAlpha
Posted 2010-10-31 22:23:37 and read 8601 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 175):
Quoting Allrite (Reply 174):
I note the QantasLink use National Jet System's 717's on some routes where jets make more sense.

This is mostly routes in WA. There a couple of tag ons into QLD via NT though. Which makes a lot of sense to me, as the distances are large in WA and a prop wouldn't cut it

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I think there is a twice a week KGI ADL ?

I know Ansett flew it daily, I wonder how QF is going with it

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: pugsley
Posted 2010-10-31 22:43:51 and read 8580 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 161):
Has anyone seen the new QF tv commercial? what are peoples thoughts? its not on youtube yet!
Quoting smi0006 (Reply 162):
For those who haven't seen the adds they features the 'refreshed' of Domestic products and the Tasman products. imporvements such as the next generation check-in, lounges inline with their international counter parts and combined with some alterations with domestic and tasman inflight product, although these are hardly major changes.
message/tagline is: 'There's a new Spirit of Australia in the air' followed by ' Qantas, Enjoy the journey'.

I'm not a huge fan of the new QF domestic advertising campaign. While its great that it has been aligned to the A380 adds, same music, same soft lighting etc.... And this is a major part of the new Qantas domestic refresh, making domestic and international services identical so it feels like passengers who connect from internationl to domestic feel like they are flying the same airline. I'm not convinced with this add.

I do not think customers will pick up that the images of the lounges are those of the new and updated lounges, as for the other shots, its all very "blury", lots of fading in and out and you dont really see what is new. My theory on that is: because QF do not want to show new AVOD seats, because there is only two domestic aircraft with that fit out etc... I feel it is all blury and discuising as not much is actually changing so they can not sell what they do not actually have, they cant really advertise a new product because it does not really exist. There is lots of focus on the Lounges, because that is where a lot of changes are taking place.

As for the onboard stuff, that is being phased in over the next few months and while all domestic aircraft are coing to have the colour of their seats changed to match the "red" seat covers of the international 747's and A332's, this will take a long time to implement and a start date for the cabin refreah has not yet been announced.

Nice add, but does not really show us any of the changes clearly enough to make any impact.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-10-31 23:02:13 and read 8566 times.

Quoting ZuluAlpha (Reply 177):

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I think there is a twice a week KGI ADL ?

Correct. Sun & Tue afternoons.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-31 23:17:49 and read 8567 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 164):
Quoting 747m8te (Reply 165):

The Q400 can match jet aircraft speeds.. especially on SYD-CBR.. there is usually a Q400 that will leave just after our QF flight, but will get in 5mins earlier then the 738 or 734

Quoting Allrite (Reply 171):

the 767 GE are getting retro-fitted with the new Panasonic AVOD system.. not sure on the new overhead lockers or not... aparently are going to be here until 2019 ... and i find something special about these birds... i feel safe on them .. they are solid old things 
Quoting thegeek (Reply 175):
Quoting ZuluAlpha (Reply 176):

thegeek...... all i can say right now... watch this space   props in QLink colours may not be such a strange idea  

some of those 717 ar ex TWA birds with an average age of 14yrs or more.... im lead to believe QF are not exactly happy with the perfrmance of these aircraft economically.

Quoting ZuluAlpha (Reply 177):

Yes twice a week on a 717....

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-31 23:23:56 and read 8574 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 173):
Don't you mean Narita? I don't think VA will be getting HND landing rights.

I mean Haneda. The US airlines are all queuing up to go into Haneda, and Air France and BA will be flying there, as well as into NRT. Singapore AL and Thai will be flying to HND.

For some reason there does not seem to have been an interest in HND from Australian or NZ airlines. By the time Qantas gets interested in HND, all the slots will be full.

Perhaps someone on the forum can explain why the rest of the world is making HND a high priority airport for service, but not airlines from Australia/NZ.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-10-31 23:43:44 and read 8553 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 181):

I know last year, JQ applied to fly to HND from SIN but was not awarded the slots, instead SQ was allocated the slots, so JQ decided the best way into Japan was a A320 flight SIN-TPE-KIX

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-10-31 23:47:58 and read 8550 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 181):
Perhaps someone on the forum can explain why the rest of the world is making HND a high priority airport for service, but not airlines from Australia/NZ.

Quite simplely that these slots would not come cheap. Australia/NZ routes from/to Japan are not usually high yield, which makes such a slot ovepriced and possibly enough to make routes less than economical. The fact is that the airlines will not get more yiield from the flights to overcome to increases associated with HND service, unlike many other carriers/routes would, that have a strong mix of demand.

QF/JQ/NZ are better off staying at NRT, than trying to get in on the frenzy at HND.

[Edited 2010-10-31 23:49:42]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-11-01 00:05:14 and read 8518 times.

maybe we will see NH fly to Australia/New Zealand from HND  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: mariner
Posted 2010-11-01 00:26:09 and read 8482 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 183):
Quite simplely that these slots would not come cheap. Australia/NZ routes from/to Japan are not usually high yield, which makes such a slot ovepriced and possibly enough to make routes less than economical.

How does that work? I have not heard the US airlines are not buying, or paying for, their slots at HND.

mariner

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-11-01 00:38:08 and read 8467 times.

Quoting mariner (Reply 185):
How does that work? I have not heard the US airlines are not buying, or paying for, their slots at HND.

Thats not what I have heard at all.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2010-11-01 01:11:45 and read 8443 times.

Quoting JQflightie (Reply 184):
maybe we will see NH fly to Australia/New Zealand from HND

No way, simply because NH quit Australia because it viewed their NRT slots as too valuable to waste on lower yield Australia flights. Now as HND slots are more valuable than NRT ones... you get the picture.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: mariner
Posted 2010-11-01 01:29:25 and read 8416 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 186):
Thats not what I have heard at all.

If they were buying them, I'd assume they'd try for better times.

My understanding is that it is a government-to-government deal, with four pairs (four landing/four take-offs) available to US airlines and all between the hours of 10 pm and 7 am.

http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/2...0-tokyo-haneda-international_N.htm

" Haneda airport will open up to international flights next month as Japan works to maintain Tokyo's status as an Asian travel hub. But it comes with a big catch for U.S. airlines who've been squeezed into the least convenient time slots."

mariner

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-11-01 01:55:27 and read 8388 times.

Quoting mariner (Reply 188):
If they were buying them, I'd assume they'd try for better times.

My understanding is that it is a government-to-government deal, with four pairs (four landing/four take-offs) available to US airlines and all between the hours of 10 pm and 7 am.

http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/2...0-tokyo-haneda-international_N.htm

" Haneda airport will open up to international flights next month as Japan works to maintain Tokyo's status as an Asian travel hub. But it comes with a big catch for U.S. airlines who've been squeezed into the least convenient time slots."

That might be the case for the Americans, but look at that catch. That certainly changes things and makes it less than ideal.

Other countries have a very different situation, and that certainly involves many other dealings and costs. Whenever theres a slot restriction there is winners and losers.

The japanese carriers will not look at using their highly prized assets (slots) at HND for a low yield route like Australia. They will use them very strategically.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: mariner
Posted 2010-11-01 02:50:49 and read 8332 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 189):
Other countries have a very different situation, and that certainly involves many other dealings and costs. Whenever theres a slot restriction there is winners and losers.

Sure, but I'd be interested to see anything that suggests airlines from other countries can actually buy slots at HND. I am told they are tightly regulated.

mariner

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-11-01 02:58:20 and read 8322 times.

Quoting mariner (Reply 190):
Sure, but I'd be interested to see anything that suggests airlines from other countries can actually buy slots at HND. I am told they are tightly regulated.

Regulated by cash  

It comes down to dealing, so it untimately comes down to cash. Once things have stablised, it will becoming clearer as to how it all actually works, but to get initial slots it was very much a frenzy of dealing for nations and the carriers to get a chance to fly there.

Eventually a clear cost per slot will come out, along with a mechanism to use or lose slots.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: mariner
Posted 2010-11-01 03:06:18 and read 8326 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 191):
It comes down to dealing, so it untimately comes down to cash. Once things have stablised, it will becoming clearer as to how it all actually works, but to get initial slots it was very much a frenzy of dealing for nations and the carriers to get a chance to fly there.

I'll try again - I'm just asking for some hard evidence of your statement in post #183, that these slots are "not cheap" and may be "overpriced."

To me that means an exchange of cash, that the slots are for sale, but - again - I have seen no evidence of that.

mariner

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: xiaotung
Posted 2010-11-01 06:05:07 and read 8155 times.

Hainan Airlines from Shenzhen to Sydney from Dec 9, 2010 three time a week:

HU7913 HGH1700 – 1910SZX2030 – 0850+1SYD 330 135
HU7914 SYD1030 – 1700SZX1820 – 2010HGH 330 246

I have not seen so many Chinese airlines so appressively expanding in Australia recently.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: sunrisevalley
Posted 2010-11-01 06:57:48 and read 8115 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 170):
Their plan may have been to have the A380 doing this route by now. If things had worked out the way they expected, that may not have been too bad.

Are you meaning that the planned post -2012 upgrades being available post -2009.? There is work to be done to get a 700nm improvement . Time will tell if this is achievable within one increment. Astuteman is the man to ask on this.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Ben175
Posted 2010-11-01 08:24:51 and read 8072 times.

Quoting xiaotung (Reply 193):
Hainan Airlines from Shenzhen to Sydney from Dec 9, 2010 three time a week:

HU7913 HGH1700 – 1910SZX2030 – 0850+1SYD 330 135
HU7914 SYD1030 – 1700SZX1820 – 2010HGH 330 246

I have not seen so many Chinese airlines so appressively expanding in Australia recently.

Amazing. All we need now is a direct link from China to PER!  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: QF175
Posted 2010-11-01 14:42:24 and read 7988 times.

China Southern's new Brisbane-Guangzhou service commences today - B-6135, an A330-200 is operating the inaugural service and will shortly touch down in Brisbane, before a quick turnaround and back to Guangzhou.

Cheers

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: thegeek
Posted 2010-11-01 19:52:59 and read 7789 times.

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 194):

Are you meaning that the planned post -2012 upgrades being available post -2009.? There is work to be done to get a 700nm improvement . Time will tell if this is achievable within one increment. Astuteman is the man to ask on this.

More or less. If the two year delay to the A380 had not occurred then the post 2012 improvements may be available in 2010. Even with lesser improvements, it could still do the flight with a smaller payload hit than a 744ER.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2010-11-01 21:58:56 and read 7681 times.

Quoting Ben175 (Reply 195):
Amazing. All we need now is a direct link from China to PER!

Tbh, with all the flights now into MEL and SYD, why flights like PER are not looked at instead is rather strange. Its uptapped as a market from China, so I am sure they will see a few flights a week at some stage fairly soon.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-11-02 02:02:46 and read 7515 times.

Tiger's OTP was 65% last month, is this officially the worst in history?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Aussie_
Posted 2010-11-03 02:46:51 and read 7015 times.

China Airlines (CI) have announced plans to extend their 3x weekly TPE-BNE onto AKL. Another trans-tasman option!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ZuluAlpha
Posted 2010-11-03 14:49:52 and read 6768 times.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 199):
Tiger's OTP was 65% last month, is this officially the worst in history?

If I was TT management, I would be genuinly curious to get to understand why the poor OTP. With a shut out of check in at @ 45min proir to departure, one thing that can be iliminated would be late PAX

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: ptrjms
Posted 2010-11-04 03:39:42 and read 6454 times.

I dont know if this has been mentioned before but I could not find anything in regards to it, but I have heard that XR are only going to be using their A320 flying in and out of Cloudbreak. A bit of a waste of an A320 when they could use it for so much more.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: Airbusa322
Posted 2010-11-04 13:09:07 and read 6281 times.

Will JT's 707 visit Melbourne besides BNE/SYD?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: 747m8te
Posted 2010-11-04 19:09:29 and read 6124 times.

Quoting ptrjms (Reply 202):
I dont know if this has been mentioned before but I could not find anything in regards to it, but I have heard that XR are only going to be using their A320 flying in and out of Cloudbreak. A bit of a waste of an A320 when they could use it for so much more.

If the capacity is needed for Cloudbreak then its not a waste....by the way, aren't they using the A320 on the MEL service too?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: TN486
Posted 2010-11-04 19:24:47 and read 6110 times.

Quoting 747m8te (Reply 204):
If the capacity is needed for Cloudbreak then its not a waste....by the way, aren't they using the A320 on the MEL service too

I spot at Tulla every Sat morning and I continually see the F100 parked to the right of JH, (it arrives MEL Fri night and departs Sun arvo) so, no, I suspect not. They have just received all their final clearances (last Monday I believe) from the OZ authorities, hence the Cloudbreak info.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2010-11-04 21:55:09 and read 6015 times.

Quoting Airbusa322 (Reply 203):

Its visiting PER too 

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread #41
Username: acidradio
Posted 2010-11-05 00:28:48 and read 5909 times.

It looks like Australian Aviation Thread # 42 has started up to replace this one. I will lock this thread. Please continue at Australian Aviation Thread #42 (by TN486 Nov 5 2010 in Civil Aviation). Thanks!


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