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Topic: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-10-23 17:14:14 and read 19393 times.

Welcome to the #86th edition of the New Zealand Aviation Thread, In thread #85 New Zealand Aviation Thread #85 (by NZ1 Oct 11 2010 in Civil Aviation) we learnt and discussed:

- JQ agent arrested for assalt
- More NZ 'wish lists'
- NZ introduces 'Ricco' for its new B77W adverts on youtube.
- Is NZ considering a MAN service?
- Is NZ considering adding extra long haul lift? Ex SQ B772s?
- NZ/DJ commit to maintaining/adding extra services on routes affected by their codeshare
- Rob Fyfe announced CEO of the year for Asia Pacific region
- NZ announces suspension of TBU-APW-LAX services effective January 2011
- NZs TIU-WLG-TIU routes - upgrade to Q300s?
- B77W ZK-OKM - first picture

That was the round up of thread #85 so enjoy #86

Edit: Link to thread #85 wasn't working

[Edited 2010-10-23 17:16:53]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ1
Posted 2010-10-23 22:41:20 and read 19265 times.

Quoting 777ER (Thread starter):
B77W ZK-OKM - first picture

I have to admit that the fuselage does look rather plain without the Pacific Wave on it.

NZ1

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-10-23 23:15:35 and read 19237 times.

ZK-OKM needs some more colour on it, its too white, ! won't it get dirty a lot quicker? and it means a lot more time in the hanger being cleaned!

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-23 23:44:18 and read 19187 times.

Quoting zkojh (Reply 2):
won't it get dirty a lot quicker?

Well to be honest, the other aircraft don't seem too dirty whenever I see them and there are only a couple of strips that make the difference between that and the 744.. Plus, you're not going to notice a slightly dirty white plane from far away as you would with a different colour like dark blue, similar to what you notice between colours on cars.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: mariner
Posted 2010-10-23 23:49:18 and read 19184 times.

Quoting NZ1 (Reply 1):
I have to admit that the fuselage does look rather plain without the Pacific Wave on it.

I agree. Is this it, or can the wave be applied later as a decal?

mariner

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-23 23:52:04 and read 19179 times.

Quoting mariner (Reply 4):

Is someone going to plan a petition to NZ or something? 

Oh well, at least we all know the interior will look great. Lets hope it doesn't stay in its current form for tooooooo much longer...

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: mariner
Posted 2010-10-23 23:55:02 and read 19168 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 5):
Is someone going to plan a petition to NZ or something? 

LOL.

I'm always a bit wary of jumping to conclusions about things like this - maybe they're planning some other thing. Was the "Lord of the Rings" a decal - a very big decal?

mariner

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: kaitak
Posted 2010-10-24 00:04:35 and read 19148 times.

It will look great when it finally enters service. Has NZ announced what configuration the aircraft will have when it enters service?

What line number did it have?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZdsgnr
Posted 2010-10-24 00:07:26 and read 19146 times.

Quoting mariner (Reply 4):
I agree. Is this it, or can the wave be applied later as a decal?
Quoting mariner (Reply 6):
Was the "Lord of the Rings" a decal - a very big decal?

My undertstanding was that the wave was painted on when fresh from the factory and then decals when the aircraft were getting repainted.

and the LOTR were big decals

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-10-24 00:37:37 and read 19111 times.

Quoting kaitak (Reply 7):
It will look great when it finally enters service. Has NZ announced what configuration the aircraft will have when it enters service?

yep - it's on the website...

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: jayeshrulz
Posted 2010-10-24 00:47:08 and read 19110 times.

Guys, here is the first 777-300ER for Air New Zealand! Enjoy !  

NZ's first 77W

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: mattcawby
Posted 2010-10-24 00:57:56 and read 19081 times.

Quoting jayeshrulz (Reply 10):
Guys, here is the first 777-300ER for Air New Zealand! Enjoy

Why did you cut the watermark off my picture?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: cchan
Posted 2010-10-24 04:13:31 and read 18956 times.

Have we got some updates on the NZ A320 delivery schedule in 2011?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: jayeshrulz
Posted 2010-10-24 04:32:03 and read 18945 times.

Quoting mattcawby (Reply 11):
Why did you cut the watermark off my picture?



I did not cut it :/
I just took it up from facebook and put it in here.
Sorry!

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: PA515
Posted 2010-10-24 05:56:41 and read 18912 times.

Quoting mariner (Reply 6):
I'm always a bit wary of jumping to conclusions about things like this - maybe they're planning some other thing. Was the "Lord of the Rings" a decal - a very big decal?

Decals was my recollection. I just hope they don't plaster Hobbits all over it later. Turkish have used a grey stylised Tulip on the rear fuselage. Perhaps something similar would work for Air NZ.

Quoting kaitak (Reply 7):
What line number did it have?

Appears to be L/N 902.

http://www.777fleetpage.com/777fleetpage8.htm

PA515

[Edited 2010-10-24 06:20:04]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-10-24 21:29:26 and read 18652 times.

think the 1st brand new A320 is due in Feb wearing the 'all blacks'' colours. they seem to go mad either they get a plane thats all white or a plane thats all black. hahaha

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: TheCommodore
Posted 2010-10-24 23:13:04 and read 18579 times.

Quoting mattcawby (Reply 11):
Why did you cut the watermark off my picture?

There is another copy of it here. With watermark.

http://paineairport.com/kpae3231.htm

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ZKSUJ
Posted 2010-10-25 01:37:28 and read 18454 times.

Just reading the airline quality website and it seems that a couple of the latest flight reviews aern't the greatest. What got me was a customer posting about the new TT product (4 choices thing) and saying it now no longer made NZ the legacy carrier it used to be etc... Has anyone heard many other reviews about the new scheme from passengers or in general?

I'll leave my opinion out of this at this stage, just curious what the people that booked and flew the new scheme actualy think.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: PA515
Posted 2010-10-25 03:48:36 and read 18364 times.

Someone on SQTalk says the SIN-AKL-SIN 77W and 77E flights will be replaced with an A380 from Northern Winter 2011. On present schedules that would have EK and SQ A380's in AKL at the same time. AIAL has said the new pier can take two A380's at a time.

PA515

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-25 03:54:58 and read 18360 times.

Quoting PA515 (Reply 18):
Someone on SQTalk says the SIN-AKL-SIN 77W and 77E flights will be replaced with an A380 from Northern Winter 2011. On present schedules that would have EK and SQ A380's in AKL at the same time. AIAL has said the new pier can take two A380's at a time.

Wouldn't that be a sight to see! Well knowing how delayed EK 412 can be, SQ 286 can sometimes be out of AKL by the time it arrives. But bad news for those who like the night flight to SIN so they can have a full day in Singapore without having to pay for an extra night's accommodation. Sounds like it could delay any upgrade of EK406/434 to an A380 if there's any slight clash in times.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-10-25 04:19:24 and read 18338 times.

Quoting PA515 (Reply 18):
Someone on SQTalk says the SIN-AKL-SIN 77W and 77E flights will be replaced with an A380 from Northern Winter 2011. On present schedules that would have EK and SQ A380's in AKL at the same time. AIAL has said the new pier can take two A380's at a time.

Would be great but It might not happen because SQ282 leaves after 1am and offers connections from SIN that doesnt require the long wait that would be required flying on SQ286 after 1pm. I think if it does happen it the A380 will just replace the 77W and the 772 will continue the second flight, but its a whole year away so its a wait and see.

Does anyone know what the loads like at the moment particularly on SQ286? I havent been on SQ in ages, but everytime I went it was full in all three classes when the 744 was used on the route. There must be some shortage of capacity right since i think the 77W holds 297 pax, whereas the 774 had a lot more capacity and was always packed.

[Edited 2010-10-25 04:33:17]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-10-25 04:29:41 and read 18328 times.

Quoting PA515 (Reply 18):

Never thought an airline would offer all their daily (except NZ if they ever do order it) AKL flights as A380s. Is the Northern winter from January 2011 or December 2011?

Could understand during the RWC but never daily

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-10-25 04:37:23 and read 18314 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 21):

Never thought an airline would offer all their daily (except NZ if they ever do order it) AKL flights as A380s. Is the Northern winter from January 2011 or December 2011?

Could understand during the RWC but never daily

The post just says northern winter 2011, here the link: http://www.sqtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10239&page=3
I think it would probably be DEC 2011 just because JAN 2011 is a bit too soon really and it would have been better to do so around Nov-Dec

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-10-25 05:43:39 and read 18273 times.

Quoting PA515 (Reply 18):
Someone on SQTalk says the SIN-AKL-SIN 77W and 77E flights will be replaced with an A380 from Northern Winter 2011

It has been on the cards for a while. SQ merged flights for CDG & ZRH into a 388 so it was only a matter of time.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 22):
I think it would probably be DEC 2011 just because JAN 2011 is a bit too soon really and it would have been better to do so around Nov-Dec

No rumblings from the engineers yet, so it's not really possible until late next year. Usually they're first to know cos they require type training.. I think SQ would need a few more aircraft delivered first too.

Quoting PA515 (Reply 18):
AIAL has said the new pier can take two A380's at a time.

Technically it could have 4 potential A380s at any one time .... With a 388 capable layover spare(see below answer to explain)

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 19):
Sounds like it could delay any upgrade of EK406/434 to an A380 if there's any slight clash in times.

Not necessarily. EK often is required to tow the A380 off from Gate 15/16 (388 terminal gates) so that the gate can be vacant for mid-afternoon hub arrivals/dep by NZ/QF/DJ/EK/JQ. The aircraft tows off to Layover 17 (and 18/19 are also 388 capable hard stands). EK406/407 and EK434/35 also currently tow off their respective gates to layovers due to their extended turn times so they don't occupy a gate at peak times. I'm sure EK would have minor adjustments to the schedule if it meant they could drop another A380 (or two) in

Technically gate allocation could work something like this....(I've touched up a few times to suit)

1115-1315 SQ G15 turnaround
1250-1350 EK413 arr G16---->tow off to L17
1350-1715 EK406/7 arr G15 turnaround
1435-1815 EK434/5 arr G16
1730-1900 EK412 tow G15



On a related note, A6-EDM operated to AKL today - that was only delivered last month. It has been to AKL several times already.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-10-25 05:54:28 and read 18266 times.

Also keep in mind that SQ would likely completely re-time their schedule to suit system-wide A380 services due to only having a fleet of 11 (soon 13) to operate SYD/MEL/LHR/ZRH/CDG/HKG/NRT and AKL.

SQ has a far greater scope for schedule change than EK... They could retime to a night time flight like SQ282, or an early morning flight a la the original timing of SQ282 or they could push it back to a mid afternoon departure.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: BlackLabel
Posted 2010-10-25 06:53:19 and read 18383 times.

Quoting PA515 (Reply 18):
Someone on SQTalk says the SIN-AKL-SIN 77W and 77E flights will be replaced with an A380 from Northern Winter 2011. On present schedules that would have EK and SQ A380's in AKL at the same time. AIAL has said the new pier can take two A380's at a time.

I hope not, the choice of the two SQ flights is very useful for me and most of my colleagues who are regular pax on the SIN flights. I often need to use SQ282 to get back to Singapore mid-week.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 20):
Does anyone know what the loads like at the moment particularly on SQ286? I havent been on SQ in ages, but everytime I went it was full in all three classes when the 744 was used on the route. There must be some shortage of capacity right since i think the 77W holds 297 pax, whereas the 774 had a lot more capacity and was always packed.

Every time I've taken SQ285/286 it's been completely full in Y and C, and nearly full in F. SQ281 is often full but SQ282 less so on Wednesdays but usually very full on Fridays.

There's a surprising amount of O&D - or at least SIN layover traffic - on SQ286 in all classes.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerokiwi
Posted 2010-10-25 07:43:58 and read 18360 times.

Quoting BlackLabel (Reply 25):
I hope not, the choice of the two SQ flights is very useful for me and most of my colleagues who are regular pax on the SIN flights. I often need to use SQ282 to get back to Singapore mid-week.

My work finds that too - both for our travel and guests from abroad. The frequency is extremely useful and I doubt SQ would give up on that advantage any time soon. Unless they got NZ to operate the second daily flight. Hmmmmmm   

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-25 16:26:37 and read 18393 times.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 23):
Not necessarily. EK often is required to tow the A380 off from Gate 15/16 (388 terminal gates) so that the gate can be vacant for mid-afternoon hub arrivals/dep by NZ/QF/DJ/EK/JQ. The aircraft tows off to Layover 17 (and 18/19 are also 388 capable hard stands). EK406/407 and EK434/35 also currently tow off their respective gates to layovers due to their extended turn times so they don't occupy a gate at peak times. I'm sure EK would have minor adjustments to the schedule if it meant they could drop another A380 (or two) in

Technically gate allocation could work something like this....(I've touched up a few times to suit)

1115-1315 SQ G15 turnaround
1250-1350 EK413 arr G16---->tow off to L17
1350-1715 EK406/7 arr G15 turnaround
1435-1815 EK434/5 arr G16
1730-1900 EK412 tow G15

Yeah, it'll need a little tweak. I guess I can never see that far from landside or stay at the airport long enough to see EK 412/3 come and go on the same day. Which surprises me why AKL only built the new pier initially to hold 2 A380s.. I guess it shows that when they planned it, none of them were really expecting many A380s down here. But just imagine seeing more A380s in AKL daily.. Then again, I don't really think anyone else would be looking to bring A380s down here in the near future. QF seem happy with the A332 to LAX.

But I can also foresee the carnage if the EK birds arrive at the same time (due to the lengthy delays that we know EK412 is akin to) and they have to end up sending one to a remote stand to disembark..

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 24):
They could retime to a night time flight like SQ282, or an early morning flight a la the original timing of SQ282 or they could push it back to a mid afternoon departure.

Although they might have a greater scope of flexibility than EK, it still seems more logical for them to keep it at around the same time SQ285/6 is. If they found that SQ281/2 was creating more interest, they could have easily put the 77W on that route instead of the 772. I wouldn't be too surprised to see it stick to a similar time as the current 285/6 if it changed to an A380.

Quoting aerokiwi (Reply 26):
Unless they got NZ to operate the second daily flight

Interesting thought! Save a 763 for a AKL-SIN run after updating J and introducing Y+!

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-10-25 19:00:32 and read 18320 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 27):
nteresting thought! Save a 763 for a AKL-SIN run after updating J and introducing Y+!

It would be cool to see that happen but I think we have seen the last of NZ at SIN, they dont even codeshare with SQ anymore.
I would like to see EK flights going to SIN via MEL/BNE again from AKL...could we see these returning some time again in the future? EK has switched between one-stop and two-stop flights to DXB from AKL several times over the years it has operated to NZ.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-25 20:15:49 and read 18271 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 28):
EK has switched between one-stop and two-stop flights to DXB from AKL several times over the years it has operated to NZ.

Well, not really that much switching.. AKL was only served by EK418/9 for the extra capacity the 77W brought and instead of sending the 77W to CHC, it made perfect sense to send it to AKL instead of an A345 (which CHC got unitl the A380 came). Once MEL and BNE were switched to the A345, they never went back to going via SIN. I think the majority of the passengers from NZ either go to Australia or all the way to Dubai and beyond as people would rather take the nonstop option to Asia, also at times that are not so horrible either.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-10-25 20:36:47 and read 18251 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 29):
Well, not really that much switching.. AKL was only served by EK418/9 for the extra capacity the 77W brought and instead of sending the 77W to CHC, it made perfect sense to send it to AKL instead of an A345 (which CHC got unitl the A380 came). Once MEL and BNE were switched to the A345, they never went back to going via SIN. I think the majority of the passengers from NZ either go to Australia or all the way to Dubai and beyond as people would rather take the nonstop option to Asia, also at times that are not so horrible either.

True that. I would still prefer to do a one-stop on EK to SIN than direct flying on SQ which is weird. SQ is way better than EK but for some reason i still prefer to fly with them even when it means longer travelling time...I cant figure out why i prefer EK over other carriers.

Just looking at other Asian carriers, are CX and KE operating 774s yet or are they still on A343 and 772?

Have QF (not including JQ) been doing ok in operations on the trans-tasman routes and AKL-LAX routes. From what i remember they mainly operated their loss-making domestic ops to feed flights on tasman and LAX routes which arent doing that well. They have downgraded to A332 to LAX and tasman routes have a lot of competition.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-25 21:02:35 and read 18235 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 30):
are CX and KE operating 774s yet or are they still on A343 and 772?

Nobody operates the 774.

 

Oh, if you were meaning other aircraft, CX are going back to operating the 744 again on CX107/8 over summer..

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-10-26 00:19:45 and read 18068 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 31):
Nobody operates the 774.

 

Oh, if you were meaning other aircraft, CX are going back to operating the 744 again on CX107/8 over summer..

lol my bad i meant 744. It would be cool just to more 4 engine aircraft at AKL like the A345, A346, and 744.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ZK-NBT
Posted 2010-10-26 01:11:27 and read 18025 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 21):
Could understand during the RWC but never daily

Why might I ask? SQ are unlikely to use a mix of 77W and A380 on the same flight due to the difference in Suites and First. It will be one ir the other IMO and the A380 is likely soon.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 24):
Also keep in mind that SQ would likely completely re-time their schedule to suit system-wide A380 services due to only having a fleet of 11 (soon 13) to operate SYD/MEL/LHR/ZRH/CDG/HKG/NRT and AKL.

I believe they will have 14 by the Northern Summer. No 12 will cover the 11 already in service as they will get more use for a couple of months until no 12 arrives as SYD gets its second daily A380 from next week. Now SQ are starting SIN-BCN-GRU needing 77W and also I believe another 77W route from March 2011 meaning I think that AKL and MEL 2nd daily A380 will quite likely start in March to free up 2 77Ws, I could be wrong though.

For winter schedules I think SQ could operate a little earlier, most of their evening India flights leave between 1900-2000 ex SIN whereas SQ286 usually arrives around 1900, so I could see it maybe timed to arrive SIN just before 1800 which does make the connections to Europe longer but if they want to keep a decent amount of connections they will need to change a little, SQ285 leaves SIN at 2100 and connects from a LHR services around 1845 plus flights from all over Asia. So could retimed to leave a bit earlier.

SQ285 SIN 2000 AKL 0940
SQ286 AKL 1130 SIN 1800

If that fits then they could still use the same aircraft SIN-AKL more than 1 day not that they have to as there are other A380s on the ground in SIN. I guess going back a few years SQ286 with a 744 used to leave AKL at 1400 arriving SIN like 2030 which didn't connect to that many flights other than Europe before the second flight existed. Though SQ281/282 operated from AKL in the morning when it first started arrived 0730 left 0900. Will be interesting to see what they do.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 23):
No rumblings from the engineers yet, so it's not really possible until late next year.

Menzies handle SQ now, do NZ still do some of their work?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-10-26 03:07:49 and read 17933 times.

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 33):
Menzies handle SQ now, do NZ still do some of their work?

SQ aircraft at AKL use NZ engineering... As you say passenger services is handled by menzies..

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-10-26 05:34:24 and read 17866 times.

Rob Fyfe talks about 'Ricco' http://simpliflying.com/2010/exclusi...d-mascot-with-an-edgy-personality/

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-26 15:34:47 and read 17699 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 32):
Quoting NZ107 (Reply 31):
Nobody operates the 774.



Oh, if you were meaning other aircraft, CX are going back to operating the 744 again on CX107/8 over summer..

lol my bad i meant 744. It would be cool just to more 4 engine aircraft at AKL like the A345, A346, and 744.

774 could be a brilliant prediction by you - the 777 NG perhaps? This is the month that EK asked Boeing to tell them if a 777 with improved payload might be available. So perhaps a 774 will look like a 77W, with six extra rows of seats. Launched by EK, ordered by SQ, CX. Maybe operating into Auckland by 2017.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-10-26 19:05:24 and read 17564 times.

and hopefully by 2017 we have a second runway at AKL!!

any more news from the jetstar camp yet on other services within new zealand, i.e ROT, IVC, DUD...

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-10-26 19:08:49 and read 17563 times.

Quoting zkojh (Reply 37):
and hopefully by 2017 we have a second runway at AKL!!

hahahahaha what a sense of humour you have... 

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-26 19:18:47 and read 17575 times.

The 77W safety video has been released. Starring Rico of course. It's cringeworthy stuff if you ask me!

http://www.youtube.com/airnewzealand

In a way, people could take it to be an inference between the video and how NZ rate safety.. I know it was made to be funny and all but in a real situation, you're likely to pass out before you can get the oxygen masks back off your ears and onto where it should be.. But I'm sure glad he didn't put the mask somewhere else..

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-10-26 20:57:54 and read 17493 times.

Man you gotta love the team at AIR NZ!! Rico is just too funny!
I wonder if this will actually be used as the actual safety vid as Air NZ have said that these new vids are just for mktg and available online only

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-10-26 21:04:29 and read 17493 times.

the second 77W is almost out of the shed as well...

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZdsgnr
Posted 2010-10-26 21:11:06 and read 17477 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 39):
t's cringeworthy stuff if you ask me!

It is a very disappointing video, especially after the bare essential and rugby ones, and yes i did cringe, but mostly from seeing the first male FA

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: kiwiandrew
Posted 2010-10-27 00:21:49 and read 17341 times.

Wonder if this will cause heart failure for one of our regular posters


http://www.voxy.co.nz/business/road-...growth-chinese-mice-market/5/69239


....Air New Zealand has been flying Shanghai - Auckland direct three times per week since 2006, and Beijing - Auckland twice per week since 2008. It also has daily direct flights from Hong Kong. The airline offers special services for MICE* groups including arrival card preparation and special check-in facilities for groups. On board 80 per cent of the crew are Chinese.

Jessica Yip, Air New Zealand's regional marketing manager, North Asia, saidthe airline was working on increasing capacity on these routes to match increasing demand. ....


*MICE = Meetings , Incentives , Conventions and Events

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-10-27 01:15:54 and read 17281 times.

oh here we go , another play at the china market... at the moment they got 7 flights per week, so which one gets the lucky increase. I would have to go with PVG, and think the expo might have had something to do with that. PEK still needs to be worked on. i flew on the AKL-PEK flight the other month and having no more then 85 pax's in y class, you can see why this happens.
Who needs 'skycouch' when you end up getting a row to yourself. more advertising for a start, start getting some 'air new zealand staff' rideing around on bikes in downtown Beijing showing off the airline. how about paint a subway train in NZ colours (oh wait - its only A LONG white tube) the times are ok, a lot better then before. all they seem to be shipping up from New Zealand is 'Kiwi fruits' butter and wine!! just go around many of the supermarkets and your see not a lot sells.. the Chinese don't know what a kiwi fruit is....

the big factor is to work out the cost of the flights, its still expensive even for a chinese person to pay, for what I paid for £50 pound more I could have done a return to London !! a lot of people fly on Air China to Sydney then accross for as little as 3,000CHY all in.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: PA515
Posted 2010-10-27 07:14:13 and read 17095 times.

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 43):
Jessica Yip, Air New Zealand's regional marketing manager, North Asia, said the airline was working on increasing capacity on these routes to match increasing demand. ....

That suggests the 744's will go on AKL-PVG/PEK. There aren't enough 77E's for extra frequency and PEK slots are hard to get.

PA515

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ1
Posted 2010-10-27 11:50:08 and read 17044 times.

Quoting PA515 (Reply 45):
That suggests the 744's will go on AKL-PVG/PEK. There aren't enough 77E's for extra frequency and PEK slots are hard to get.

744's definitely are not planned for China.

NZ1

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: DavidByrne
Posted 2010-10-27 15:22:43 and read 16929 times.

Rumour on the Australian thread that QF will drop SFO in favour of DFW, using their 744ERs. If that's the case, I predict that NZ's AKL-SFO will stay daily year-round, and will be the route on which the two retained 744s will operate. Then when the 789s come into the fleet, AKL-SFO will be run by 789s, and AKL-ORD will open, also with 789s, to pick up the capacity lost. Just my predictions . . . !

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: xiaotung
Posted 2010-10-27 15:55:23 and read 16879 times.

Quoting PA515 (Reply 45):
That suggests the 744's will go on AKL-PVG/PEK. There aren't enough 77E's for extra frequency and PEK slots are hard to get.

Shanghai based crew are not trained to operate on a 744 so they can't. I think capacity increase means frequency increase.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-10-27 16:14:03 and read 16871 times.

Quoting DavidByrne (Reply 47):
AKL-SFO will stay daily year-round, and will be the route on which the two retained 744s will operate.

I'm certain someonee here said that AKL-SFO is being changed to B744s. Maybe the spare B772s will go to China?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: PA515
Posted 2010-10-27 18:25:37 and read 16764 times.

Quoting NZ1 (Reply 46):
744's definitely are not planned for China.

Thanks. That narrows it down a bit more.  

PA515

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-10-27 22:34:36 and read 16633 times.

would the 763W make PVG? since the pacific islands are getting the chop, shift the 763 accross to the asia market?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: kiwiandrew
Posted 2010-10-27 22:44:09 and read 16683 times.

Quoting zkojh (Reply 44):
the Chinese don't know what a kiwi fruit is....
Quoting zkojh (Reply 51):
uld the 763W make PVG? since the pacific islands are getting the chop, shift the 763 accross to the asia market?

As far as I was aware all that is getting the chop is a single weekly AKL-TBU-APW-LAX return flight , so that doesn't free up a whole lot of capacity. I guess the 763s might just be able to do AKL-PVG , though I don't think J class pax connecting through from Europe would be very impressed at getting the old style business class .

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-10-27 23:22:53 and read 16665 times.

Air New Zealand in January 2011 is to operate Boeing 767-300ER aircraft on Auckland – Noumea on selected dates. The 767 service is replacing A320 on the dates mentioned below:

04JAN11/25JAN11

NZ072 AKL0825 – 0915NOU 767
NZ073 NOU1015 – 1455AKL 767

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-10-28 00:29:09 and read 16584 times.

Quoting zkojh (Reply 51):
would the 763W make PVG? since the pacific islands are getting the chop, shift the 763 accross to the asia market?

Should have the range to do AKL-PVG. Whether or not it'd have the payload/cargo space is another thing... I'm sure the Business class wouldn't be that keen either unless they went through an AC style refit...

Quoting zkojh (Reply 53):
Air New Zealand in January 2011 is to operate Boeing 767-300ER aircraft on Auckland – Noumea on selected dates. The 767 service is replacing A320 on the dates mentioned below:

This is probably because SB aircraft have business class and NZ in all likelihood have an reciprocal agreement with SB.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: KiwiRob
Posted 2010-10-28 03:21:32 and read 16458 times.

Quoting zkojh (Reply 44):
the Chinese don't know what a kiwi fruit is....

Surprising since the kiwifruit is native to China.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-28 04:04:59 and read 16416 times.

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 55):
Surprising since the kiwifruit is native to China.

But remember the name Kiwifruit was a marketing move by NZ. Maybe if it was called the Chinese Gooseberry, it could prosper but the whole point would seem to be getting the name kiwifruit into the market so that people can associate it with NZ and spread the word of our country - maybe even visit it...

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-10-28 04:58:38 and read 16381 times.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 54):
Quoting zkojh (Reply 53):
Air New Zealand in January 2011 is to operate Boeing 767-300ER aircraft on Auckland – Noumea on selected dates. The 767 service is replacing A320 on the dates mentioned below:

This is probably because SB aircraft have business class and NZ in all likelihood have an reciprocal agreement with SB.

If thats the case then why use a B763 only twice?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-10-28 05:28:44 and read 16371 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 57):
If thats the case then why use a B763 only twice?

true - I read it as a schedule change...likely just high season...possibly in line with the jazz festival thing they have up there every year /school holidays.... Then is the time private schools like to send up their French school trips as well

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-10-28 16:25:37 and read 16215 times.

NZ are looking for a man who made an in-flight call on his phone from CHC-HLZ

http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/new...ch-for-man-who-made-in-flight-call

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: v2fix
Posted 2010-10-29 00:57:00 and read 15931 times.

From another thread :

--------------------------
BA ordered six 77Ws of which G-STBC is the third.

The order was negotiated to compensate for the late delivery of the 787s that the airline had previously ordered. The bridging order for 77Ws comprised two aircraft to be bought by BA and 4 aircraft to be leased by BA from GECAS.
---------------------------

So if BA get 6 77Ws (presumably a a bargin basement price) for compensation for the late 787s - what should we expect Air New Zealand to get in compensation for the 789s ?

Or, because they were the launch customer - and this has inherent risks associated with it - the original price is so low to Boeing are not compelled to compensate.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: TravellerPlus
Posted 2010-10-29 01:58:54 and read 15853 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 59):
NZ are looking for a man who made an in-flight call on his phone from CHC-HLZ

Telecom is also tracking this guy down. They want to know how he got cellphone coverage south of Taupo...

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-29 04:23:06 and read 15751 times.

Just what we've been waiting for!

Air Asia X announces new CHC-KUL service

Well it was either AKL or CHC, I guess CHC seemed logical as there wouldn't be much govt intervention.. No date is stated though, and no idea if it'll be via OOL or non-stop.. However the words "direct long haul" make it sound like it'll be non-stop.

[Edited 2010-10-29 04:27:20]

[Edited 2010-10-29 04:34:30]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-10-29 04:32:10 and read 15723 times.

Quoting TravellerPlus (Reply 61):

HAHA, thanks for the good laugh!!!

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 62):

Nice to see the route offically announced at long last!

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-10-29 04:44:30 and read 15713 times.

how will NZ respond to the tax increase ex LHR from the 1st of Novemeber, I've just tried to do a booking for next May and gave up when I saw the amount of tax now have to PAY!! (this is based on LHR-AKL rtn)

TAXES LEVIES & SURCHARGES

GB - Air Passengers Duty GBP£85.00
IA Passenger Security Charge GBP£5.30
KK Passenger Facility Charge GBP£13.80
UB Passenger Service Charge GBP£22.97
XA U.S. Animal and Plant Health Inspection Services Fee GBP£3.20 !!! what the heck is this..
XY Immigration User Fee GBP£4.50
YQ Fuel Surcharge GBP£218.00 what a killer!

the basic fare was £628 then you add on the
Total TAX of £ 352.77

Total £980.77

its so silly because you can get to Syd for £700 and then a cheap ticket accross the tasman, and still bring it within the £800.00 mark.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-10-29 07:19:56 and read 15673 times.

From 31OCT10, Shanghai Airlines terminates its membership with Star Alliance, as the airline is realigning operation after the merger with parent China Eastern Airlines, which opt to join Skyteam sometimes in 2011.

From the same date, codeshare service with Air New Zealand, ANA, Lufthansa, UNITED will be terminated as well.

Did NZ have a great codeshare with Shanghai airlines out of PVG, will they switch it all to Air China now??

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: PA515
Posted 2010-10-29 07:54:00 and read 15658 times.

Quoting zkojh (Reply 64):
TAXES LEVIES & SURCHARGES

GB - Air Passengers Duty GBP£85.00
IA Passenger Security Charge GBP£5.30
KK Passenger Facility Charge GBP£13.80
UB Passenger Service Charge GBP£22.97
XA U.S. Animal and Plant Health Inspection Services Fee GBP£3.20 !!! what the heck is this..
XY Immigration User Fee GBP£4.50
YQ Fuel Surcharge GBP£218.00 what a killer!

the basic fare was £628 then you add on the
Total TAX of £ 352.77

Total £980.77

Some clarification:

YQ - Fuel Surcharge GBP218.00
This goes to the airline and is really part of the fare.

XA - U.S. Animal and Plant Health Inspection Services Fee GBP3.20
The equivalent of a MAF Fee.

GB - Air Passengers Duty GBP85.00
This UK Government Tax has increased from GBP55.00. The Tax applies to all airlines from all airports in the UK, and the GBP85.00 amount applies to New Zealand AND Australia.

Nothing you can do about it except arrive in the UK and depart from elsewhere in Europe, but that will increase your total fare and possibly eliminate any saving.

Being discussed on another thread here

PA515

[Edited 2010-10-29 07:59:35]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: PA515
Posted 2010-10-29 09:13:13 and read 15665 times.

Regarding the possibility of two Air NZ 744's being retained beyond 2012.

I understand there are four alternatives being considered to address a capacity shortfall due to the 789 delay coinciding with the 77E upgrade.
1. Retain two 744's beyond March 2012.
2. Obtain a 77E.
3. Obtain a 77W.
4. Do nothing.

As the 2nd and 3rd options relate to just one aircraft, does that mean the two 744's option is really just one aircraft in continuous service plus a maintenance spare. If so, retaining three 744's would be more productive and release a 77E for new services.

PA515

[Edited 2010-10-29 09:24:30]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-10-29 14:39:00 and read 15497 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 62):
Well it was either AKL or CHC, I guess CHC seemed logical as there wouldn't be much govt intervention.. No date is stated though, and no idea if it'll be via OOL or non-stop.. However the words "direct long haul" make it sound like it'll be non-stop.

Yep definitely direct flights between Kuala Lumpur and Christchurch starting around March 2011, with 4 return services per week.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/4289051/600-new-airport-jobs

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: gemuser
Posted 2010-10-29 14:57:59 and read 15464 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 68):
Yep definitely direct flights between Kuala Lumpur and Christchurch starting around March 2011

Ok, it's a direct flight, but is it a non stop flight?

Gemuser

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-29 15:28:05 and read 15455 times.

Quoting gemuser (Reply 69):
Ok, it's a direct flight, but is it a non stop flight?

No mention of OOL, I suppose you'd leave it out if it were a non-stop flight or it might get people interested about the prospects in also flying to OOL. But then again it probably depends on what sort of planes they have free around that time because I don't see them operating an A330 non-stop.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-10-29 17:19:57 and read 15390 times.

well done to CHC, just love how the media say '' AirAsia X flies Airbus A330-300, A340-300 and A350-900 aircraft!! really did not know the aircraft had been built yet''.!!

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: xiaotung
Posted 2010-10-29 17:37:45 and read 15355 times.

Quoting zkojh (Reply 65):
Did NZ have a great codeshare with Shanghai airlines out of PVG, will they switch it all to Air China now??
CA only operates limited number of flights out of PVG as its main hub is PEK. I suspect most PVG pax are O&D anyway. However nothing has stopped QF to codeshare with MU when the latter has opted for SkyTeam. Now MU+FM have more than 50% of domestic market share in Shanghai.

I understand PVG is performing better than PEK. If I were NZ I would axe PEK and up PVG frequency and codeshare with CA onward to PEK. There are 6 or 7 daily CA flights to PEK mostly widebodies. Up until a couple of years ago all CA flight out of Australia stopped in PVG first before continuing to PEK.

[Edited 2010-10-29 17:42:57]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-29 17:58:09 and read 15341 times.

Quoting xiaotung (Reply 72):

I understand PVG is performing better than PEK. If I were NZ I would axe PEK and up PVG frequency and codeshare with CA onward to PEK. There are 6 or 7 daily CA flights to PEK mostly widebodies. Up until a couple of years ago all CA flight out of Australia stopped in PVG first before continuing to PEK.

Don't forget that they can also fly via HKG.. Plenty of frequencies to places from there too.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-10-29 20:33:57 and read 15257 times.

Another link on the CHC D7 announcement..

http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/region...-links-south-island-by-air-to-asia

Quote:
The airport company says it headed off bids from cities such as Auckland and Sydney for the deal

LOL. I've never heard a company talk themselves up so much. Sydney isn't getting their service because the Malaysian Govt won't allow them to fly it.

They sure must be proud of themselves for achieving that!  duck 

[Edited 2010-10-29 20:35:31]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-29 23:21:54 and read 15134 times.

According to some other threads Air Asia X is keen to fly to Paris. If they get their hands on a couple of A340-300s, they could introduce CHC-KUL-ORY at the same time. This would be good because we can fly home from Paris and avoid UK APD.

Air Asia will be good for tourism. They build Tune Hotels in cities which they serve - a new one just opened in London. They could open Tune Hotels in CHC and perhaps also at Queenstown for Asians who want to visit the snow. A Tune Hotel in Paris would be handy as well.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-10-29 23:44:41 and read 15121 times.

UK departure tax is now so high that Air NZ should consider copying BA1/2 and route NZ1 via Shannon to allow passengers to pre-clear US customs and immigration there.

For those of you who have not seen the news, UK long haul departure tax is about to rise to £170 for Premium Economy and Business Premier and £85 for Economy Class, but with a Shannon stop would fall to £22 and £11 respectively.

The ninety minute stopover would not have any negative impact on through passengers to AKL, who would get US formalities out of the way in Ireland, and would not be much worse for passengers terminating in LAX than the current situation.

The problem for NZ is that a lot of leisure passengers are likely to downgrade to Economy Class to reduce their APD burden: a family of four would save £340 by doing that. An Ireland stopover could help keep yields up.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: kiwiandrew
Posted 2010-10-29 23:54:07 and read 15134 times.

Quoting koruman (Reply 76):
The problem for NZ is that a lot of leisure passengers are likely to downgrade to Economy Class to reduce their APD burden: a family of four would save £340 by doing that. An Ireland stopover could help keep yields up.

Based on my understanding of how the ADP works If the pax were ticketed LHR-LAX or LHR-AKL then that level of ADP would apply even if the aircraft made a brief stop in SNN , the only way it would lower the ADP is if the pax were actually terminating in SNN rather than continuing .

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-30 00:29:36 and read 15093 times.

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 77):
Quoting koruman (Reply 76):
The problem for NZ is that a lot of leisure passengers are likely to downgrade to Economy Class to reduce their APD burden: a family of four would save £340 by doing that. An Ireland stopover could help keep yields up.

If you travel from London or other UK port to Dubai on EK, you would pay an APD based on that distance. My reading is that you must stay at an intermediate point for at least 24 hours to pay the APD based on travelling to that point, rather than based on paying all the way to Australia/NZ. So question would be whether you can stopover in Dubai for less than the cost of the APD for a journey to NZ. Or catch the Eurostar to Paris.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-10-30 00:42:50 and read 15078 times.

The airlines need to find some way around UK APD, because these new levels are absurd.

For my part, given that I pay to take my family with me often when I travel, I guess I will always break my journeys at LAX. I see no reason why I should give £680 to the UK taxman.

Our January family airfares to the UK seemed a bit steep when I paid for my wife and two kids' tickets, but I assumed it was high season. Now I am annoyed that it is going to the UK taxman.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-10-30 00:53:49 and read 15071 times.

Just reviewing the new UK APD:

Passengers stopping in LAX pay £60 tax in Economy, £120 in PPE or BP.

Passengers stopping in HKG pay £75 or £150.

Passengers flying straight through to NZ pay £85 or £170.

As I Wrote earlier, I doubt that Business Premier loads will suffer, but most Premium Economy travel is self-funded and discretionary, and the tickets are primarily bought by couples.

And a couple will pay £240 tax if they take an LAX stopover, £300 if they take an HKG stopover and £340 if they fly Premium Economy to AKL without a stopover. Those levels will surely impact upon sales.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-10-30 00:57:25 and read 15063 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 78):
Or catch the Eurostar to Paris.

Catching the Eurostar to Paris and flying from Paris will cost more unless you can find a really cheap airfare from Paris then it will cost less compared to LHR

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: gemuser
Posted 2010-10-30 05:04:52 and read 14911 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 81):

Catching the Eurostar to Paris and flying from Paris will cost more unless you can find a really cheap airfare from Paris then it will cost less compared to LHR

Don't know from NZL but from Oz the logical thing to do would be an "open jaw" ticket routing (say) SYD-SIN-LHR-(off ticket)-FRA(or where ever)-SIN-SYD. You can usually get such a fare for the same as SYD-SIN-LHR-SIN-SYD. Of course you have the cost LHR-FRA (or where ever).

Gemuser

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-10-30 07:59:57 and read 14872 times.

One of the problems that Air NZ has not yet had to contend with is that the 70% of passengers to/from the UK who don't reside in the southeast are already starting to get used to flying out of Manchester, Glasgow, Newcastle or Birmingham to the USA (various American carriers) or Asia, Africa and Oceania (Emirates and Etihad).

BA / QF / NZ require them to transit LHR, so they simply use other carriers which don't.

With the new APD, perhaps another alternative is for Air NZ to downguage LHR services to a daily 787 via LAX, while using Dublin as a hub for a 77W service, with daily codeshared services beyond to every UK airport, and MH/JL style subsidized overnight Dublin hotel stays on offer too for any passengers prioritizing APD avoidance over speed.

This would be an improvement for APD avoiders and for passengers from the provinces seeking to avoid LHR, but also for anyone wanting to pre clear US formalities prior to departure.

And those passengers going to / from London wanting a quick, direct service and to undergo US formalities at LAX still could.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: MillwallSean
Posted 2010-10-30 09:31:29 and read 14839 times.

This British tax is very high and will strike rather un-proportionally against Oceanic carriers.
I compared it to the German tax that's being introduced in 2011 and the german one is more reasonable.

Also there is already a tax in place. The rise of the tax isnt that steep for smaller sectors. But for the long sectors and those that fly premium classes its pricey.

Somehow I don't think alternative destinations makes sense. People will pay anyway.
Just look at how we happily pay for the fuel surcharge an amount that is higher than this tax.

Also I see this tax coming in various forms all over the EU. Aviation have gone untaxed for decades. now with the green mantra rolling across the continent there is no way aviation fuel and its emissions can go untaxed.
Taxing aviation fuel according to emissions seems like an open door to punch in for politicians.
We might say this is just another way to enrich the government and has nothing to do with environmentalism but they hide behind the green mantra and will get away with it.

Ah dont give me another Manchester, Dublin or Glasgow thread. Fact is they dont have enough yield.
But it is interesting to note that so far carriers haven't caused much of a stir over this tax. I means its hardly been in the news and I read two British newspapers daily.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-10-30 09:58:40 and read 14848 times.

Sean, last northern summer I flew into Manchester, Edinburgh and Newcastle and was surprised to find that the BA long haul void had been filled by flights on US Airways, Continental, Delta and American, and of course Manchester shortly goes up to double daily EK A380s.

Air NZ is really pushing it in expecting those passengers to continue to use LHR, when they wouldn't for any other long haul destination. The world is changing.

I agree that many passengers will just pay the APD, but I think it leaves Premium Economyin a precarious state.

At the moment, NZ force all passengers to transit LHR, and soon all will pay huge UK APD. I am speculating that a Dublin flight with US pre clearance and onward connections to all UK airports operated alongside an AKL-LAX-LHR might leave everyone happy.

My last four business trips to the UK were to Edinburgh (twice), Glasgow and Harrogate. I probably would avoid LHR if I could.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: TravellerPlus
Posted 2010-10-30 10:49:19 and read 14830 times.

The APD is based on the ticketed journey and not the actual journey. If one flies from the UK to Europe on one ticket, then ex Europe on another, the European tax of GBP12 applies. My aunt lives near Birmingham and we'd always send her LH in economy from BHX to FRA so she could the connect to QF in business. She'll certainly be using this route in future. The interline connections work for baggage, check-in etc (QF and LH both use Amadeus as their booking and check-in IT platform.)

The APD is based on the distance bands between London and the capital of the destination. Therefore a traveller flying from London to Hawaii only pays GBP60 (Band B) even though the actual distance between London and Hawaii should place it in the same band as NZ (Band D). Another illogical output is that Thailand is in Band C, while the commonwealth nations of Singapore and Kuala Lumpur are in Band D.

Germany will also be introducing a tax, but at a rate of EUR8 within Europe, EUR 25 for travel to the Middle East and EUR 45 for the rest of the world. The taxes are not class based. In this case the Middle East carriers will have an advantage. Again, the tax could be lowered by a stopover, but it is doubtful that one could get a stopover in the Middle East for EUR20.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: Knid
Posted 2010-10-30 12:37:20 and read 14792 times.

Quoting MillwallSean (Reply 84):
Somehow I don't think alternative destinations makes sense. People will pay anyway.
Just look at how we happily pay for the fuel surcharge an amount that is higher than this tax.

I agree, people are simply resigned to the fact that they will need to pay tax, if the tax affects all carriers equally its not really the individual airlines problem. When you consider the state of the government finances there wont be any room for airlines to negotiate or use alternative routings to lower the cost, as the government will just change the law to suit.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: planemanofnz
Posted 2010-10-30 17:04:35 and read 14668 times.

Quoting koruman (Reply 85):
I am speculating that a Dublin flight with US pre clearance and onward connections to all UK airports operated alongside an AKL-LAX-LHR might leave everyone happy.


What a smart idea. This actually might become a real possibility if the rumours about EI joining Star Alliance eventuate; EI Regional has many connections to all the UK regional and Continental European airports. In addition, DUB Terminal 2 is opening in the coming weeks with CPB and it has been well known that the Dublin Airport Authority have been offering 'special deals' to get in new long-haul carriers (such was the case with the proposed AI European hub moving from FRA to DUB).

Quoting ash185 (Reply 68):
direct flights between Kuala Lumpur and Christchurch starting around March 2011


Well done to CHC, although I think the reason why SYD and AKL haven't started yet is because MH flies to these destinations and the Malaysian government would have interfered. *Yes I know MEL and PER are also both MH and D7 services, but SYD has so much demand that MH makes so much money out of SYD that allowing D7 to take some of that money away would be ridiculous, while AKL has very little demand and as such, D7 services could force MH to pull out.

Quoting 777ER (Thread starter):
NZ introduces 'Ricco' for its new B77W adverts on youtube.

For a full on advertisement, yes 'Ricco' is fine. However, on the new 77W safety video? I don't like it. Having a stuffed toy speaking with a strong accent creates confusion for the viewer and takes away from the seriousness of the message, IMO.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-10-30 17:05:04 and read 14676 times.

Quoting Knid (Reply 87):
Quoting MillwallSean (Reply 84):
Somehow I don't think alternative destinations makes sense. People will pay anyway.
Just look at how we happily pay for the fuel surcharge an amount that is higher than this tax.

If you look at the Earlybird Offers from Singapore Airlines, you will see a range of airfares to European cities, all fairly close together - and those differences are often affected by the taxes. You will now have to look very carefully at offers from all airlines, to make sure that all these charges are indeed included in the headline offer, and the APD does not become a surprise when you inquire further.

It may not affect people on a.net but right now is the season for signing people up to do Bus tours around Europe ( do a.netters take European bus tours?) A lot of these tours involve flying to London, taking a bus over to Europe, and then you do your 21 days. Bus ride back to London. It would now make sense for those tours to finish their land content in Paris and people fly home to Australia/NZ from there. Many of the airlines who fly us to London also fly to Paris and other European cities (Singapore AL, Cathay, Malaysian.) This would be good for KLM/AirFrance since those airlines fly people into their main cities, and fly people over to the UK as a side trip

People could fly AirNZ to Asia or North America and take a codeshare flight to FRA. Quite a lot of regional UK cities are available on LH's European network,a nd it is an alternative to LHR.

Quoting TravellerPlus (Reply 86):
Again, the tax could be lowered by a stopover, but it is doubtful that one could get a stopover in the Middle East for EUR20.

When you fly some airlines to Europe, some of them give you credits towards Ground Content. EK already does give free hotel nights if you have a long connection. KLM or Air France could easily give a 48 hour stop at a transfer point.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-10-30 18:06:45 and read 14635 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 89):
Bus tours around Europe ( do a.netters take European bus tours?) A lot of these tours involve flying to London, taking a bus over to Europe, and then you do your 21 days. Bus ride back to London

Yes I did a Contiki tour in 2008 and totally loved it. Contiki's tours let you depart from Paris. Mostly all NZ booked tickets have you going via LHR, so would have to make sure it involves a Paris-LAX/HKG sector instead

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-10-30 20:41:17 and read 14508 times.

is this a great time to release a new product then?? will it effect loads up the front that much? lets look for another plan, a,b,c,d,e, ummmmm maybe F!!

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: anstar
Posted 2010-10-31 00:35:26 and read 14358 times.

Quoting koruman (Reply 85):
My last four business trips to the UK were to Edinburgh (twice), Glasgow and Harrogate. I probably would avoid LHR if I could.

Well you CAN avoid LHR but it means not flying NZ. But you still choose to. So what incentive is there for NZ to take that risk and start a new route when pax who WANT to fly them will come to LHR.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: FlyingSottsman
Posted 2010-10-31 01:24:40 and read 14318 times.

Quoting NZ1 (Reply 1):
B77W ZK-OKM - first picture

There is so much ANZ can do with that livery if they realy use their heads. The Pacific wave was a nice touch and broke up the livery a bit. I just dont know why we have to have a nother boring whie livery surley we are all over that now time for some thing different.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZdsgnr
Posted 2010-10-31 04:48:01 and read 14185 times.

Quoting FlyingSottsman (Reply 93):

There is so much ANZ can do with that livery if they realy use their heads. The Pacific wave was a nice touch and broke up the livery a bit. I just dont know why we have to have a nother boring whie livery surley we are all over that now time for some thing different.

they had another livery planned but it was put on hold due to the recession. and I believe that they removed it because they had issues with it, and couldn't make a decal fade in the middle

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerokiwi
Posted 2010-10-31 07:02:37 and read 14144 times.

Quoting MillwallSean (Reply 84):
But it is interesting to note that so far carriers haven't caused much of a stir over this tax. I means its hardly been in the news and I read two British newspapers daily.

I'm in the UK now and it actually led, or was in the top 2 stories of, the news for at least 12 hours (an eternity under the 24 hour news cycle) until the package bombs threat was revealed.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: pugsley
Posted 2010-10-31 22:49:12 and read 13884 times.

Air New Zealand has welcomed
AirAsia X plans to operate
flights from Kuala Lumpur to
Christchurch.

http://www.travelweekly.com.au/getat...c1-412b-a591-cea12d89d59a/pdf.aspx
(page 2)
I found this a strange comment, but who knows if and when it would happen. Why would NZ welcome D7 to Christurch? Is this a typo, should it read the New Zealand Government welcoms D7 to New Zealand?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-11-01 05:37:17 and read 13643 times.

so rules out NZ flying its own services to KUL now,

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: cchan
Posted 2010-11-01 06:07:46 and read 13633 times.

Quoting pugsley (Reply 96):
Why would NZ welcome D7 to Christurch?

KUL-CHC won't be in direct competition with NZ, so why not have the courtesy to welcome them?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: sunrisevalley
Posted 2010-11-01 07:12:37 and read 13609 times.

The D7 service at 4x weekly and 70000 passengers a year suggests ~ 175-passengers per flight in and out. Certainly it is not going to be non-stop with 300-seats available.! Why wouldn't NZ welcome them . I suggest that they will get good revenue from providing to and from feeds to this service from all over NZL.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: nzrich
Posted 2010-11-01 13:09:54 and read 13482 times.

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 99):
The D7 service at 4x weekly and 70000 passengers a year suggests ~ 175-passengers per flight in and out. Certainly it is not going to be non-stop with 300-seats available.! Why wouldn't NZ welcome them . I suggest that they will get good revenue from providing to and from feeds to this service from all over NZL.

Also i bet NZ have put in a bid to do their ground handling

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-11-01 14:19:08 and read 13445 times.

Quoting zkojh (Reply 97):
so rules out NZ flying its own services to KUL now,

They would have known long ago that D7 was coming to NZ.. Not only that but I replied to an earlier reply in the last thread that the thought of MH not going back to daily would be some signal towards NZ wanting to fly there. It wouldn't seem viable especially as it lacks a decent Star feed and O&D doesn't seem to be overwhelmingly strong for another full cost carrier. Quite a striking similarity to Australia I might add - QF don't fly to KUL and the direct market is wide open for MH and D7 to fight out. Looks to be the same deal here.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-11-01 14:43:49 and read 13519 times.

The new Air Asia X service has been picked up by the Otago Daily Times Regional section today, with a very strange comment from the Chairman of Queenstown Airport, Mark Taylor, that Air Asia already flies to Auckland Airport. Somebody asked why AAX were not going into Queenstown itself.



If the service does start in March, that is the end of the summer tourism season when people tour around, and just a few weeks before the ski season starts. AAX is not an airline that normally does interlines, though there is a first time for everything. So if Asians arrive for a skiing holiday, will AAX put them into a bus to Queenstown, or will they arrange on carriage fares with AirNZ or Jetstar? If Asians are coming to NZ for a touring holiday, that will really kick off during November. Of course, AAX could be turning up in CHC to give South Islanders another way of getting to Europe, but that is not mentioned.

There will be some firsts - if AAX does operate the flights as continuations of flights to Australian cities, this will be the first time they have operated tag on flights. AAX has a small number of A340s in their fleet - I have not heard of them increasing the number of A340s, and KUL-CHC would be a long flight in an A330-300 in AAX configuration.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZB
Posted 2010-11-01 15:48:10 and read 13465 times.

The last days of ZK-NBS.
Looks like it's on the final chopping block.
Photo's a month old so probably cut up by now.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Untit...8Air-New/Boeing-747-419/1806141/L/

[Edited 2010-11-01 15:52:07]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ZKSUJ
Posted 2010-11-01 16:28:49 and read 13398 times.

Quoting NZB (Reply 103):

Yea I saw that, kinda sad TBH

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-11-01 18:34:12 and read 13357 times.

Quoting NZB (Reply 103):

It deserves more justice than just a link:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © JayDeeKay

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: CHCalfonzo
Posted 2010-11-01 21:02:54 and read 13261 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 102):
There will be some firsts - if AAX does operate the flights as continuations of flights to Australian cities, this will be the first time they have operated tag on flights. AAX has a small number of A340s in their fleet - I have not heard of them increasing the number of A340s, and KUL-CHC would be a long flight in an A330-300 in AAX configuration.

All sources so far seem to have sugested a direct service. D7 operates some 230t MTOW A333s I believe which have a range with max pax (according to Airbus) of 5600nm. KUL-CHC is only 4700nm on a GC track, well within that range.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: timb777
Posted 2010-11-01 21:34:53 and read 13223 times.

Another thread has reported that an EK a380 performed a flyover of the Melbourne cup today:

Quoting AeroplaneFreak (Thread starter):
A6-EDA of Emirates Airlines performed a flyover of today's Melbourne Cup in Australia.

A6-EDA flew direct from Sydney and returned immediately after performing the flyover

Does anyone know how this was timetabled? Does SYD now get 2 daily a380's? i thought this bird would be in AKL, not SYD this afternoon?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-11-01 22:39:27 and read 13177 times.

seems Japan is doing some good at the moment. Just days after Air Asia X come out with CHC then ANZ do this..

In Northern Winter 2010 season effective 31OCT10, Air New Zealand resumes Tokyo Narita – Christchurch service, operating 3 times a week. Further in November 2010, it is operating extra Auckland – Osaka service with Boeing 767-300ER aircraft.

Planned operational date and schedule below:

Auckland – Tokyo Narita – Christchurch/Auckland
NZ099 AKL0915 – 1625NRT 772 D

NZ090 NRT1830 – 0920+1AKL 772 x126
NZ090 NRT1830 – 1000+1CHC1115+1 – 1235+1AKL 772 126

Auckland – Osaka Kansai
NZ1097 AKL0110 – 0840KIX 19NOV10/20NOV10/26NOV10/27NOV10/03DEC10

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: Haggis73
Posted 2010-11-01 23:06:40 and read 13161 times.

Quoting timb777 (Reply 107):
Does anyone know how this was timetabled? Does SYD now get 2 daily a380's? i thought this bird would be in AKL, not SYD this afternoon?

EK412-EK413 (SYD-AKL-SYD) was cancelled about 3 weeks ago according to the email that we got from Menzies. I thought it was for maintenance, but obviously not.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: timb777
Posted 2010-11-01 23:28:15 and read 13133 times.

Quoting Haggis73 (Reply 109):
EK412-EK413 (SYD-AKL-SYD) was cancelled about 3 weeks ago according to the email that we got from Menzies. I thought it was for maintenance, but obviously not.

Ah ha, interesting.
I wonder what they did with the pax booked on the AKL-SYD flight. I guess those booked through to DXB would have been put on the BNE and MEL flights, but for those terminating in SYD it would be a pain to go a day earlier/later. Did they rebook the pax onto NZ? Or fly them to BNE/MEL than get a QF flight to SYD?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-02 01:26:24 and read 13037 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 105):

sad day (moment) in New Zealand aviation history

Quoting CHCalfonzo (Reply 106):

Certainly looking forward to their launch fare sale! Already decided if the price is too good to resist that I'm off to KUL

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: DavidByrne
Posted 2010-11-02 04:04:21 and read 12912 times.

Quoting zkojh (Reply 108):
seems Japan is doing some good at the moment. Just days after Air Asia X come out with CHC then ANZ do this..

In Northern Winter 2010 season effective 31OCT10, Air New Zealand resumes Tokyo Narita – Christchurch service, operating 3 times a week. Further in November 2010, it is operating extra Auckland – Osaka service with Boeing 767-300ER aircraft.

. . . .

Auckland – Osaka Kansai
NZ1097 AKL0110 – 0840KIX 19NOV10/20NOV10/26NOV10/27NOV10/03DEC10

Not actually extra services - if you check the schedule, you can see that it's just the "normal" KIX flight put back by 1h 10m on these days . Because the original flight was scheduled at 2359 departure, the retimed service is moved into the following day, and they have to change the flight number to avoid confusion. NZ often has added the "10" prefix to a flight number in these situations.

[Edited 2010-11-02 04:06:45]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: xiaotung
Posted 2010-11-02 18:50:20 and read 12687 times.

China Southern didn't eventuate their BNE-AKL plan but China Airlines now have. CI from 1 Jan 11.

CI053 TPE2350 – 1035+1BNE1215+1 – 1825+1AKL 333 146
CI054 AKL2045 – 2125BNE2315 – 0600+1TPE 333 257

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: planemanofnz
Posted 2010-11-02 19:23:27 and read 12650 times.

Quoting xiaotung (Reply 113):

That's great news! 2011 is going to be a stunner of a year for long-haul aviation in New Zealand with: AKL-BNE-TPE on CI, AKL-SIN on JQ, AKL-HOU on CO and CHC-KUL on D7 all starting.

Do you have a link to this story?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-11-02 20:09:42 and read 12610 times.

Quoting planemanofnz (Reply 114):
AKL-BNE-TPE on CI,

Probably one of the worst airlines from China/Taiwan that could fly here haha. But an A333 nonetheless.

Quoting planemanofnz (Reply 114):
AKL-HOU on CO

Might have to put that on hold because Boeing might be delaying deliveries again.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-11-02 21:20:48 and read 12548 times.

whats the plan ''if'' Boeing come up with another delay on the 787 - which looks like its going to happen, can NZ keep saying ''oh yea will hold on'' we want this plane. can they go to airbus and see if they can lease some a/c.. great news tho for akl, another airline looks like xmas has come early!!

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-11-02 21:58:03 and read 12512 times.

Air New Zealand has signed a one-year agreement, extendable up to five years, for Pratt & Whitney's EcoPower engine wash service, which will help the airline reduce fuel burn. Pratt & Whitney is a United Technologies Corp. (NYSE: UTX) company.

Under the agreement, the Christchurch Engine Center, a joint venture between Pratt & Whitney and Air New Zealand, will use portable equipment to perform the washes in either Auckland or Christchurch, New Zealand. The service will be performed on all turbofan engine types within Air New Zealand's existing fleet, including CFM56-3, V2500, CF6-80C2, RB211-524G and Trent 800 engines, and will also cover the GE90-115B and Trent 1000 engines on order by the airline. As Pratt & Whitney's New Zealand EcoPower franchise, the Christchurch Engine Center is able to wash other engine types and also can provide the service for third-party customers.

http://www.traveldailyasia.com/Indus...Specific/Detail.aspx?Section=48610

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-11-03 01:15:12 and read 12364 times.

the **PINK FLIGHT IS BACK**

Air New Zealand’s Annual “Pink Flight” in 2011 is scheduled on 04MAR11. Boeing 767-300ER is operating extra flight on Auckland – Sydney ONEWAY sector, featuring Sydney Mardi Gras-themed service.

The flight is only available to book on the airlines’ website.

Planned schedule:

NZ1105 AKL1600 – 1730SYD 763 04MAR11

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-03 17:20:16 and read 12082 times.

From a thread about BA announcing its top 5 list of airlines it would like to purchase/merge with I noticed this interesting comment

Quote:
=LHRFlyer,reply=17]Some BD slots have already been disposed of to other *A airlines

Has NZ purchased any extra LHR slots from BD?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-03 23:08:46 and read 11925 times.

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l149/alpinej/USAFB752.jpg
Credits to Derek Quinn for taking the picture and letting me use it

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-04 02:42:31 and read 11762 times.

Does anyone know if an NZ flight from CHC-WLG on Monday morning was cancelled due to a cracked wind screen?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: nz1
Posted 2010-11-04 03:38:22 and read 11733 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 121):
Does anyone know if an NZ flight from CHC-WLG on Monday morning was cancelled due to a cracked wind screen?

Haven't heard about that one Jase.

NZ1

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-11-04 04:34:20 and read 11697 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 121):
Does anyone know if an NZ flight from CHC-WLG on Monday morning was cancelled due to a cracked wind screen?

NGO I think was the aircraft concerned. I only noticed it in passing so I'm not sure routes etc..

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-04 05:44:22 and read 11668 times.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 123):

I heard a rumor about a WLG flight being cancelled but hadn't heard anything on here so thought I would ask. Thanks for confirming.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: fxramper
Posted 2010-11-04 06:14:06 and read 11649 times.

Will NZ roll out special 'The Hobbit' liveries soon on any of their fleet?   

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-04 06:31:45 and read 11653 times.

Quoting fxramper (Reply 125):

Only new liverys coming soon is the All Blacks A320 for the rugby world cup and the long awaited new NZ livery (if it ever happens).

Would be interesting to see a 'Hobbit' livery

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: fxramper
Posted 2010-11-04 06:50:10 and read 11679 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 126):
Would be interesting to see a 'Hobbit' livery

I guess they will have to wait for the artwork to officially be released before they can make it happen. Will be exciting to see the Hobbit livery on NZ.   

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerokiwi
Posted 2010-11-04 09:49:28 and read 11652 times.

Quoting fxramper (Reply 127):
Will be exciting to see the Hobbit livery on NZ.

Minus the hairy mutant feet, I hope  

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: b767erwinglets
Posted 2010-11-05 00:22:32 and read 11393 times.

FJ410 AKL-NAN today apparently encountered bird strike on take off. Anyone got any more news or pics from it? Heard it destroyed the nose cone........................???????????????????

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-11-05 01:04:22 and read 11356 times.

Quoting b767erwinglets (Reply 129):
FJ410 AKL-NAN today apparently encountered bird strike on take off. Anyone got any more news or pics from it? Heard it destroyed the nose cone........................???????????????????

Can't wait to see the pics on monday then... all the interesting stuff never happens on my shift...hahaha

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-05 12:24:09 and read 11176 times.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 130):

Isn't that really a good thing thou, leave all the extra work for someone else?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-11-05 17:44:56 and read 11013 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 131):
Isn't that really a good thing thou, leave all the extra work for someone else?

An interesting busy day is always better than a quiet day ..lol

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ5
Posted 2010-11-05 20:18:00 and read 10964 times.

ZK-OKM was planned to have first flight today but only went through taxi testing.

Click here to see today's video of ZK-OKM

http://paineairport.com/images/kpae6380.jpg
Photo credit of course to Matt Cawby

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: darenw
Posted 2010-11-05 20:26:31 and read 10930 times.

Quoting NZ5 (Reply 133):
ZK-OKM was planned to have first flight today but only went through taxi testing

WOW great video, thanks for sharing

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-11-06 12:55:57 and read 10676 times.

Just a question on the latest possible 787 delays and CO. Could this mean that their auckland to houston route be pushed back? Im not sure about the flying distance between the two cities and any aircraft that they have that could fill in this gap (aside from the 772LR which may be too big).

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: kiwiandrew
Posted 2010-11-06 13:01:15 and read 10669 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 135):
(aside from the 772LR which may be too big).

There is also the little problem that UA/CO don't have any 772LRs in their fleet  

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-11-06 13:06:06 and read 10662 times.

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 136):

lol true dat, was thinking of DL  

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-11-06 16:22:13 and read 10571 times.

Air Asia X To Launch KUL-ORY 4 X Per Week (by dennys Nov 6 2010 in Civil Aviation)

Link shows that AAX will be starting Orly four times weekly on Feb 14 with A340-300. Apparently reducing London Stansted. which is a pity, but so long as they have a seat available to both cities that is OK.

So Christchurch to KL transit stop, a couple of nights at Tune Hotel
Air Asia Kuala Lumpur to Phuket side trip. Stay at the Yorkshire Hotel (where you go if you need steak and chips in Thailand, and you want to watch British soccer matches)

KL to Stansted.

Find some way to get to Paris that is cheaper than Eurostar and nicer than a Ferry.

A couple of nights wild living in Paris.

Home from Paris. Too tired for another side trip at KL so straight home to CHC. Hope that Atomic Shuttle will call in at CHC because too expensive to fly to DUD.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-11-06 16:31:30 and read 10557 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 137):

Fingers crossed DL want to come to AKL.. I'd love to see a 764 down here from LAX.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: alangirvan
Posted 2010-11-06 17:07:00 and read 10538 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 135):
Just a question on the latest possible 787 delays and CO. Could this mean that their auckland to houston route be pushed back? Im not sure about the flying distance between the two cities and any aircraft that they have that could fill in this gap (aside from the 772LR which may be too big).

Great Circle Mapper shows that IAH-AKL is not such a long distance as some other sectors already operated by CO with 777-200ERs out of EWR to HKG, DEL and BOM. Depending on winds, the route might be possible with existing 77Es

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: kiwiandrew
Posted 2010-11-06 17:30:46 and read 10523 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 139):
I'd love to see a 764 down here from LAX.

Does a 764 have the necessary range ? Looking at the Boeing website and bearing in mind the need to be able to reach an alternate it seems to me that it would be cutting things pretty fine on LAX-AKL .

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-11-06 17:34:12 and read 10526 times.

great to see on the UA website the link to the ''new zealand'' site again, shame thats its blank when it loads. think UA are concernd about houston, cos there ment to be opening bookings on this route this month arn't they??

and what happened to China airlines new service, nothing from the airport on this yet??

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-11-06 17:52:51 and read 10516 times.

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 141):
Does a 764 have the necessary range ? Looking at the Boeing website and bearing in mind the need to be able to reach an alternate it seems to me that it would be cutting things pretty fine on LAX-AKL .

Just the thought of a 764 from anywhere would be nice.. Even HNL. Nevermind, it looks as though the 764 has less range than the 763.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-11-06 18:01:15 and read 10525 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 139):
Fingers crossed DL want to come to AKL.. I'd love to see a 764 down here from LAX.

Would be cool to just see some US airlines back in NZ...I wouldnt fly on them lol especially when NZ's 77W arrives

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: sunrisevalley
Posted 2010-11-06 19:18:12 and read 10465 times.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 140):
Great Circle Mapper shows that IAH-AKL is not such a long distance as some other sectors already operated by CO with 777-200ERs out of EWR to HKG, DEL and BOM. Depending on winds, the route might be possible with existing 77Es

True. At the time I noted a westbound timetable time of 14hr 40m which suggests an ESAD of ~6700nm. However this time has to assume that the 788 has an EDTO rating out of the gate of quite a bit better than 240min. The 777 has a rating of ~417k one engine out cruise. This changes the GC distance of 6444nm to about 6780nm fly around distance. This means an ESAD around 7100nm, very similar to EWR-HKG.
This service requires the approval of the regulators of both countries and I find it hard to believe that both are going to agree to this sort of extended time on a brand new airframe/engine combination to do this sector in 14hr 40m.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-06 23:58:59 and read 10341 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 144):
I wouldnt fly on them lol especially when NZ's 77W arrives

Even thou flying UA to IAH would be easier for East Coast connections, it wouldn't be easy to book on CO, just hope NZ decide to launch ORD soon.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-11-07 00:34:13 and read 10308 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 146):

Even thou flying UA to IAH would be easier for East Coast connections, it wouldn't be easy to book on CO, just hope NZ decide to launch ORD soon.

Just asking why might it not be easy booking on CO?
I wonder if it would prove popular for passenger from Oz making a one-stop in AKL, it beats stopping over in LAX, not sure about SFO...never been there.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-07 01:30:20 and read 10267 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 147):
Quoting 777ER (Reply 146):

Even thou flying UA to IAH would be easier for East Coast connections, it wouldn't be easy to book on CO, just hope NZ decide to launch ORD soon.

Just asking why might it not be easy booking on CO?

Always prefer flying long haul with NZ, but if UA/CO was cheaper or they had a good Y+ product then I would seriously consider them

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-11-07 01:32:47 and read 10262 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 147):
I wonder if it would prove popular for passenger from Oz making a one-stop in AKL, it beats stopping over in LAX, not sure about SFO...never been there.

To be frank, that entirely depends upon the ability to connect on NZ's widebody Tasman services rather than the appalling A320 product.

Many of us in Australia but outside Sydney have chosen to fly to North America on Air NZ via Auckland for years. The connections were good, and we got a proper international product all the way.

But the A320 product is so bad now that hardly anyone will chose it for hours 16-20 of a 20 hour trip.

To be honest, the first few weeks of the new Tasman service have gone a long way to destroying Air New Zealand's brand value in Australia, and with V Australia now offering an alternative I suspect that Air NZ's days of attracting long-haul passengers from Australia are coming to an abrupt close.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-07 07:30:17 and read 10075 times.

Quoting ash185 (Reply 147):
not sure about SFO...never been there

The only time I've past throu SFO was while I was running to make it to NZs AKL flight after arriving on a very delayed UA DEN service and I found SFO to be a very easy airport to run throu but the stairs and ramps made a good challange

Quoting koruman (Reply 149):
To be honest, the first few weeks of the new Tasman service have gone a long way to destroying Air New Zealand's brand value in Australia, and with V Australia now offering an alternative I suspect that Air NZ's days of attracting long-haul passengers from Australia are coming to an abrupt close.

Lets just wait and see the figures on how much NZs new offering has really destroyed its brand value in Australia before comments like "destroying Air New Zealand's brand value in Australia" surface.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ash185
Posted 2010-11-07 09:47:18 and read 10030 times.

Quoting koruman (Reply 149):
To be frank, that entirely depends upon the ability to connect on NZ's widebody Tasman services rather than the appalling A320 product.

Is it the same as the 767s? Im not a fan of narrowbody aircraft nor do I like travelling on them but surely its not that bad is it???

Quoting 777ER (Reply 148):
Always prefer flying long haul with NZ, but if UA/CO was cheaper or they had a good Y+ product then I would seriously consider them

Would definitely fly if it was just CO but since its now UA/CO well its a wait and see lol but in the end price will rule

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: v2fix
Posted 2010-11-07 13:22:33 and read 10016 times.

Spotted on another thread that AI has 3 777LRs for sale and only 12 K on the clock.
Cost : approx 300M US$

What would be the incentive or opportunity for NZ to open it's cheque book ?
How would you deploy them to make a healthy return.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: Knid
Posted 2010-11-07 13:39:08 and read 10001 times.

Quoting v2fix (Reply 152):
How would you deploy them to make a healthy return.

AKL-PER-LHR !!!

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-11-07 13:53:32 and read 10002 times.

Quoting v2fix (Reply 152):
How would you deploy them to make a healthy return.

I thought I've heard on here that any sector over 6 hours and the 77L is more efficient than the 772. Therefore deploying it to anywhere such as YVR would still be worth it.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-11-07 14:22:08 and read 9972 times.

Quoting v2fix (Reply 152):
What would be the incentive or opportunity for NZ to open it's cheque book ?
How would you deploy them to make a healthy return.

This was discussed on a previous NZ thread when I raised the possibility of fleet capacity increases to cover the 787 delay debacle.. I'd like it if they kept a similar config to AI (8/35/195) maybe 26/36/180 and keep the 3-3-3 config, but Alas not... especially for any ULH operation...

I'd like to see them utilized to South America. Say 3 a week, effectively operating AKL-GIG-GRU-AKL-BOM and AKL-BOM-AKL-GRU-GIG-AKL.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-07 22:32:43 and read 9759 times.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 155):

I'm certain another NZ employee announced that extra B777s are being discussed in HQ to cover the shortfall and to enable new routes to start

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-11-08 15:19:52 and read 9427 times.

Auckland Airport builds on Asia success strategy

MH going 6x weekly AKL-KUL from March but instead of having all flights operating at the usual "Asia Rush Hour" time slot, they're being mixed up.. Interesting to see. I wonder if they'll be looking to make it like what SQ are doing at the moment if loads are sustainable.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-11-08 17:51:15 and read 9335 times.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 157):
if loads are sustainable.

If being the operative word. I expect Air Asia X to take a large chunk of traffic on those days it does operate.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZCH
Posted 2010-11-08 19:32:34 and read 9280 times.

Hi all,

I was just looking at Air New Zealands, Schedules, and tonight, there are 2 flights scheduled for AKL-CHC via WLG. First flight NZ6226 departing at 23.45pm and second flight NZ6227 at 03.30am. I am just wondering why there is these flights, at this time of the night. I believe these flight numbers are of A320 domestic flight numbers?? I stand to be corrected on those though.

Regards NZCH

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ107
Posted 2010-11-08 20:11:44 and read 9242 times.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 158):
If being the operative word. I expect Air Asia X to take a large chunk of traffic on those days it does operate.

Indeed. What I'd be interested in is the number of passengers booking return flights CHC-AKL-CHC who seem to be flying D7. Only then can we more accurately judge the effect of D7 on MH's AKL-KUL. It'd seem as though you'd only fly D7 if you're on an extremely low budget and didn't mind having to catch another flight up to AKL as for convenience sake, there would be those who would stick with MH. Interesting times lie ahead.

[Edited 2010-11-08 20:13:12]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-11-08 20:12:50 and read 9246 times.

Quoting NZCH (Reply 159):
I believe these flight numbers are of A320 domestic flight numbers

Without knowing for sure I'd say they'd be heading down to CHC to be refitted from 8/144 to Y171. The 'rollout' is in 10 days time. I've been on the new aircraft that are already out but there's still a few to go..

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZCH
Posted 2010-11-08 23:00:23 and read 9092 times.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 161):

True, i have heard that the re-fit is being done down here in CHC. But why would the aircraft be going via WLG?

NZCH

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-11-08 23:05:48 and read 9092 times.

Quoting NZCH (Reply 162):
But why would the aircraft be going via WLG?

to get revenue on the way down?? possibly flying AKL-WLG to sub the aircraft that then goes WLG-CHC?? I don't know exactly... I'll try and remember to check tomorrow..

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-09 00:38:40 and read 8989 times.

Quoting NZCH (Reply 159):

I noticed those flights last night. Can't be an A320 doing a domestic as no flights (unless an emergency or VIP) can land/take off at 3.30am. Wonder how NZ got special permission?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: nz1
Posted 2010-11-09 00:57:09 and read 8971 times.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 161):
Quoting NZCH (Reply 159):
I believe these flight numbers are of A320 domestic flight numbers

Without knowing for sure I'd say they'd be heading down to CHC to be refitted from 8/144 to Y171. The 'rollout' is in 10 days time. I've been on the new aircraft that are already out but there's still a few to go..

These flights are to re-position A320's due to the delays caused by the storm in SYD last night, and thefact that OJC was U/S all day casing flight cancellations.

Flights that are NZ6XXX are positioning or test flights.

NZ1

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZCH
Posted 2010-11-09 01:27:36 and read 8928 times.

Quoting nz1 (Reply 165):

Hey NZ1, cheers thankyou for giving me the answer to my question. I couldnt figure out why today's Emirates flight to CHC had been cancelled. but now know why, obviously something to do with SYD.

NZCH

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-09 03:27:06 and read 8851 times.

An NZ and JQ flight were cancelled this evening due to a threat being made via telephone against a CHC bound flight from AKL

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/4327119/Flights-on-hold-after-threat

Looks like JQ258 CHC-AKL is affected tonight with its 12.10am arrival in AKL being pushed back to 1.55am

Quoting nz1 (Reply 165):

But why send the A320s via WLG? Is it because there are actually four A320s being shifted but using two flight codes?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-09 08:13:01 and read 8748 times.

Extra Asia flights raise spinoff hopes

Extra flights from Asia to New Zealand were announced yesterday, offering yet more routes for tourists to visit Queenstown and the lower South Island.

Auckland International Airport announced China Airlines would start services from Taiwan in January and Malaysia Air would increase its single weekly service from Kuala Lumpur to six flights in March.


http://www.stuff.co.nz/southland-tim...a-Asia-flights-raise-spinoff-hopes

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ001
Posted 2010-11-09 09:26:25 and read 8720 times.

a bit of topic, but I can't wait to got to NZ in a few weeks.
Looking foward to my travel with the fantastic Air New Zealand  

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-11-09 14:53:52 and read 8585 times.

NZ001, don't fly on an A320 service or your illusions will be shattered.

Don't pay for IFE as it is invisible when the person in front reclines.

Don't pay for food, as your table won't open when the person in front reclines.

Don't bring your laptop, for the same reason

Don't bring hand luggage, as there aren't enough lockers.

Apart from that, Air NZ is still great.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-11-09 19:52:26 and read 8459 times.

sounds like this single class on the A320's is going to need a rethink by the end of the year??!!

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-11-09 20:17:49 and read 8441 times.

jetStar from 13DEC10 is adjusting operational schedule on Auckland – Gold Coast route. From Auckland, Thursdays and Sundays departure moves to evening hours. From Gold Coast, Mondays and Fridays moves to late-morning and Thursdays/Sundays move to evening hours.

New operating schedule from this date as follows:

JQ238 AKL0710 – 0730OOL 320 x47
JQ240 AKL1805 – 1820OOL 320 47

JQ239 OOL0915 – 1515AKL 320 236
JQ241 OOL1115 – 1715AKL 320 15
JQ243 OOL1900 – 0100+1AKL 320 47

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: CHCalfonzo
Posted 2010-11-09 21:19:55 and read 8399 times.

Quoting zkojh (Reply 172):
jetStar from 13DEC10 is adjusting operational schedule on Auckland – Gold Coast route. From Auckland, Thursdays and Sundays departure moves to evening hours. From Gold Coast, Mondays and Fridays moves to late-morning and Thursdays/Sundays move to evening hours.

New operating schedule from this date as follows:

JQ238 AKL0710 – 0730OOL 320 x47
JQ240 AKL1805 – 1820OOL 320 47

JQ239 OOL0915 – 1515AKL 320 236
JQ241 OOL1115 – 1715AKL 320 15
JQ243 OOL1900 – 0100+1AKL 320 47

This is to accommodate JQs new OOL-ZQN and MEL-ZQN flights which begin next month.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-11-09 21:20:45 and read 8403 times.

VS are to fly from MAN to SFO, so time to wack another codeshare on the ANZ flight from AKL? so if and when NZ start MAN means we can rule out SFO then.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-10 00:37:42 and read 8237 times.

Quoting koruman (Reply 170):
Don't pay for IFE as it is invisible when the person in front reclines.

Don't pay for food, as your table won't open when the person in front reclines.

Sounds like you simply got a not so working table seat. the IFE depends on how tall you are

Quoting zkojh (Reply 171):

Why? If its being done to match the DJ offering for their planned alliance then I can't see anything changing.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-11-10 00:57:55 and read 8226 times.

The new A320 product doesn't match DJ at all.

Their boss John Borghetti has made it crystal clear that no DJ jet will ever operate in an all-economy configuration, and that the current two class (economy and premium economy) fleet is to have a third (business) cabin added.

The A320 refit is all about poor management in an over-compartmentalised NZ, in which medium-haul services have been misclassified as short-haul, and the "short-haul" management has been given excessive licence to convert to LCC specifications services which actually carry significant numbers of long-haul passengers, but clearly won't for much longer......

We should lament that Air New Zealand doesn't have senior management with the experience, connections and judgment of a Borghetti. He was appalled when he flew Economy SYD-LAX on VA shortly after taking over and found passengers being charged for drinks outside mealtimes, and changed the policy on the spot - he understands that yields are driven by the perception of a service worthy of the price. Current NZ management seem blind to that on the Tasman, even though if Victorian and Queensland feed is lost the SFO and YVR services will have to be closed.

Air NZ has just plummeted past Virgin Blue on its way down, with DJ heading upmarket and NZ sinking into Tiger territory. The gap has become a chasm this month.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ001
Posted 2010-11-10 09:39:28 and read 8116 times.

Quoting koruman (Reply 170):

Apart from that, Air NZ is still great.

lol please don't shatter my illusions. My Dad being a business man has experienced it all - of all the major airliners, SQ, EK, CX .etc. He always says he prefers NZ best and thats why he always chooses to fly with them to WLG

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ZKEOJ
Posted 2010-11-10 11:35:57 and read 8058 times.

Quoting koruman (Reply 170):
NZ001, don't fly on an A320 service or your illusions will be shattered.

Don't pay for IFE as it is invisible when the person in front reclines.

Don't pay for food, as your table won't open when the person in front reclines.

Don't bring your laptop, for the same reason

Don't bring hand luggage, as there aren't enough lockers.

Apart from that, Air NZ is still great.

What NZ A320 have you been on? I just got back from APW, and it was a normal flight. Nothing great (and yes, I prefer the B767 as well - we had it on the outbound flight), but there was nothing wrong (or majorly different) to the A320s of other airlines.

IFE: The screen was perfectly fine, and the control panel in the seat back (rather than on the side) is a major plus! Don't like paying for movies, but for a 3-4 hour flight I am happy with the free TV programs.

Food: Outbound food was good, back was basic, but actually very tasty (surprising for any airline food).

Laptop: My partner used his (small) laptop perfectly fine to watch TV programs he had downloaded.

Locker space: I doubt you see any other A320 with more overhead locker space (not thinking of VIP versions and such)! It is not a matter of the A320 or NZ's configuration, but has more to do with the fact that people take half their household on board. A global trend I hate. I never understand why airlines are not stricter with that, but that has nothing to do with NZ's A320...

The only argument I can agree to is that NZ counts the TT and Pacific flights as "short-haul", but 3-4 hours are certainly medium haul (at least in my books), and it would be nice having more space for that.

Cheers
micha

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ001
Posted 2010-11-10 12:32:58 and read 8010 times.

Quoting ZKEOJ (Reply 178):
IFE: The screen was perfectly fine,

Ye I have seen on NZ website and reviews what they have. Believe me, that is a very good short haul service!

Just got back from New York, and flew on BA 744. Their Long Haul product is atrocious, a small little 6 inch screen with a few movies! I am shocked that these are the same planes carrying passengers 25 hours to New Zealand !

If NZ short haul beats BA long haul economy then the NZ long haul must be v good, not to mention the new one coming on the 77W's !

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-11-10 13:36:25 and read 7986 times.

NZ001, Air NZ long-haul is great but the problem is that medium-haul has just been reduced to all-economy 30 inch pitch, whereas previously frequent flyers enjoyed 35 inch pitch or Business Class.

Believe me, the pictures do not reflect the new cramped product.

It may be OK for the most price-sensitive pax on the shortest sectors, but for long-haul passengers on 5 hour sectors to and from Cairns or Adelaide it is horrible.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ZKSUJ
Posted 2010-11-10 15:12:39 and read 7915 times.

Quoting NZ001 (Reply 179):

Hope the flights go well and you post a trip report. I'm not the biggest fan about the whole so called 'cheapening' of the NZ brand with the choose the way you want to fly thing, as I agree with most that 3+ hours is mid-range and not short haul, but I'm sure the public will vote with their dollar.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ001
Posted 2010-11-10 15:54:28 and read 7895 times.

Quoting ZKSUJ (Reply 181):
Hope the flights go well and you post a trip report.

Ye me too. I have been looking forward to flying on NZ Business Premier for a long time. Will do trip report  
Quoting ZKSUJ (Reply 181):
I'm not the biggest fan about the whole so called 'cheapening' of the NZ brand with the choose the way you want to fly thing

Ye I couldn't agree more, although I am a huge fan of the 'Nothing to Hide' and 'Crazy about Rugby' campaigns.

Quoting ZKSUJ (Reply 181):
3+ hours is mid-range and not short haul,
Quoting koruman (Reply 180):
It may be OK for the most price-sensitive pax on the shortest sectors, but for long-haul passengers on 5 hour sectors to and from Cairns or Adelaide it is horrible.

Yes I see what you're saying, but I think that a country like NZ surrounded by ocean needs to get its Long haul product a priority.

I often fly LTN -TLV -LTN on U2. That is 5 hours without ANY entertainment, complimentary food or any seat recline - but that is just around copable and I except that from a low-cost airline.

However BA's short haul in contrast to NZ's doesn't have any on demand entertainment.
My point is BA's long haul aircraft feature small (around 6 inch I think) TV's with a few films which won't last you very long at all. They have these services to Australia and New Zealand! I would hate to be stuck in a seat like that for 25 hours!

What is the longest route NZ do on their 767 ?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: ZKSUJ
Posted 2010-11-10 16:57:44 and read 7857 times.

Quoting NZ001 (Reply 182):
What is the longest route NZ do on their 767

PPT, up to HNL and a few japan routes I think. I understand what you mean with BA long haul is not as 'great' etc, but my point is NZ won a few awards etc etc, and now it seems to many like a small step back. Who knows though, time will tell.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 767er
Posted 2010-11-10 17:22:57 and read 7845 times.

Quoting NZ001 (Reply 182):
Ye me too. I have been looking forward to flying on NZ Business Premier for a long time. Will do trip report

You will not be disappointed. When are you flying and what route are you taking.? The crews are great, excellant food and booze and the IFE is mind blowing. Try and sit in Zone A if you are flying the 744.


The lounhges are pretty nifty, especially SYD and LAX.

I am flying BP next month (my last was in Sept to LHR via LAX) to LAX to see the rellies. Alas, I have to fly that god awful A320 in 'Works Deluxe' SYD-AKL. Even the staff are not impressed with the new product so us a.netters are not alone.

Oh, welcome and welcome aboard to a.net

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: nz1
Posted 2010-11-10 19:21:00 and read 7779 times.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 167):
But why send the A320s via WLG? Is it because there are actually four A320s being shifted but using two flight codes?

Not sure why they were routed this way, but I know there was a positioning flight to ZQN also later the following day due to OJC going U/S in CHC. Was not a good day to be working in Ops Control.

NZ1

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: KiwiRob
Posted 2010-11-10 23:35:24 and read 7620 times.

Quoting koruman (Reply 170):
NZ001, don't fly on an A320 service or your illusions will be shattered.

Don't pay for IFE as it is invisible when the person in front reclines.

Don't pay for food, as your table won't open when the person in front reclines.

Don't bring your laptop, for the same reason

Don't bring hand luggage, as there aren't enough lockers.

Apart from that, Air NZ is still great.

Maybe you should do some short and medium haul flights around Europe before you knock NZ's A320's, my two main airlines are SAS and LH neither has IFE, SAS only give a free breakfast which I wouldn't feed to a dog, and I don't understand your complaint about lockers, this has nothing to do with NZ, maybe you should write a letter to Airbus. Your problem is NZ offered a lot in the past, they now offer a product not much different to, and in many cases better than the legacy carriers in Europe offer.

All said I believe a European would be impressed by what NZ offers.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ6
Posted 2010-11-11 01:15:55 and read 7512 times.

I might take back my earlier comments about the new short haul products. I think this may fail in it's current format.

Quoting koruman (Reply 170):
NZ001, don't fly on an A320 service or your illusions will be shattered.

Don't pay for IFE as it is invisible when the person in front reclines.

Don't pay for food, as your table won't open when the person in front reclines.

Don't bring your laptop, for the same reason

Don't bring hand luggage, as there aren't enough lockers.

Apart from that, Air NZ is still great.

How about you do a trip report with photos etc so we can all see?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: zkojh
Posted 2010-11-11 01:16:12 and read 7516 times.

The pilot of a plane that crashed on NZ in September, killing nine people including two Australians, tried to pull out of a dive before hitting the ground.

The Transport Accident Investigation Commission (TAIC) released an interim report on Thursday on the September 4 crash in the town of Fox Glacier, which was the worst air disaster in New Zealand in 17 years.

Investigators estimated the plane was off-balance and overweight when it crashed.

Witnesses said the plane was nearly vertical when it hit the ground. A fine mist or vapour shrouded the plane on impact moments before intense flames erupted.



http://www.skynews.com.au/world/article.aspx?id=537922&vId=1923268

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-11-11 02:13:14 and read 7464 times.

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 186):
Maybe you should do some short and medium haul flights around Europe before you knock NZ's A320's

I have done lots of flights within western Europe: this year I flew Economy Class on the following flights:

Frankfurt - Edinburgh (1034 km)
Edinburgh - Manchester (298 km)
Manchester - London (242km)

I have also flown a lot of
Gold Coast - Sydney (678 km)
Brisbane - Melbourne (1379 km)

The crucial difference is that all were genuine short haul flights, none of them more than 1100 km in length.

And to be honest, flying to Melbourne (1300 km) is the point at which I drive up the road to BNE to take Qantas and its full-service rather than LCC fare from the Gold Coast. That is my tipping point.

But compare those sector lengths with:
Auckland - Brisbane (2298 km)
Auckland - Adelaide (3259 km)
Auckland - Cairns (3619 km)

It really does highlight the folly of trying to argue that Tasman services are shorthaul, and that EVERY passenger will be happy with 30 inch pitch. How can anyone argue that the Tasman is anything less than a medium-haul flight?

Let us be absolutely clear on this. The only mass-market flights in Europe of similar duration to Tasman flights are cheap holiday charters from England to Greece and Turkey. EVERY major European route feeding into long-haul (e.g. MAN-AMS) is a fraction of the length of the flights on which Air New Zealand is now shoehorning 171 passengers onto an A320.

To put it into persepctive, even the A320s flying tourists from BNE to Bali only have 152 seats! And that is the ultimate leisure market.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: KiwiRob
Posted 2010-11-11 03:53:44 and read 7426 times.

Quoting koruman (Reply 189):
The crucial difference is that all were genuine short haul flights, none of them more than 1100 km in length.

I've done the following flights this year

Frankfurt - Moscow (2048km)
St Petersburg - Frankfurt (1748km)
London - Baku (4007km)
Riga - Baku (2621km)
Baku - Vienna (2775km)

All on either A320 or 737 aircraft, all in economy and all without IFE, I really don't see what you are complaining about, ANZ service and product is great compared to what I've endured on the above flights, the airlines are Lufthansa, Austrian, BMI and Air Baltic.

Quoting koruman (Reply 189):
Let us be absolutely clear on this. The only mass-market flights in Europe of similar duration to Tasman flights are cheap holiday charters from England to Greece and Turkey.

See above, lets be absolutely clear that you are wrong.

[Edited 2010-11-11 04:52:12]

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: aerorobnz
Posted 2010-11-11 04:17:19 and read 7422 times.

Quoting NZ001 (Reply 182):
What is the longest route NZ do on their 767 ?

AKL-KIX at around 11h45min

Has anyone except me actually been onboard the Y171 airbus?? While I'm not overly keen on it, I never was overly keen of the last config either.. but that goes for just about every A32x/737/757 I've ever flown on. That consists of airlines inc.NZ/QF/AV/CO/AS/VX/AC/U2/AZ/LX/FR and a few more besides....

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-11-11 04:50:57 and read 7408 times.

KiwiRob, all Air NZs flights on the Tasman exceed 2100 km: the only longer flights you did were from Europe to Asia (Baku), which is a destination which is yet to fully establish its reputation for aviation excellence or as a mass market for Western Europeans.

And by definition, if it's south of the Caucasus it's in Asia.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: KiwiRob
Posted 2010-11-11 05:03:38 and read 7406 times.

koruman so it's still a flight from Europe on a single aisle airliner where I sat for 3+ hours without IFE in a cramped seat. You expect more than what most Euopeans get.

Most flights to Moscow and St Petersburg from most western European Cities (namely Paris, London, Madrid, Lisbon, Brussels) are 3 hours plus, all in single aisle airliners, most without IFE and all with the same terribly small luggage racks and cramped seats as you get on an ANZ 737 or A320. Moscow and St Petersburg are mass market destinations, I've not yet been on an empty flight in my 3 years of travelling to Russia.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: Solent
Posted 2010-11-11 11:30:52 and read 7300 times.

Recently I have travelled LHR - FRA BA 321, FRA -IST-FRA LH 321, and CDG - LHR BA 320, they were all reasonaby squeezy load wise, and no entertainment except waiting for the food on LH, which was reasonably good. I have also travelled JQ 320 and Pacific Blue to Christchurch. Really didn't enjoy Blue. I have also caught a lot of QF and CX flights in the past year.

The best service was on the NZ 767's between SYD - AKL - SYD, the staff and the entertainment system was superb. When I got to SYD I had to swap to a QF 767 for a work trip, and you really did notice the difference with the aircraft and the service even though the service on the QF flight was good, it was nowhere near the NZ quality. I have to say the BA staff were good on my 320 flights.

I do feel all flights over 2 hours on a narrow body are a bit long, but saying tha,t they are better time wise than the DC6 and Electra on the same flights. Have done some quick Electra flights and also had some great service. Once TEAL entertained us with with continual airpockets all the way across the Tasman . One flight attendent, my mother and I were the only people who didnt vomit on the flight, in the cabin, that was entertainment, quite a ride.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-11-11 11:51:24 and read 7280 times.

My point is simply this:

Tasman passengers have a choice:

Three carriers offer LCC service, with luggage and food as extras and poor legroom, one of which is Air NZ.

Two carriers (EK and QF) offer full service, including business class.


As such, NZ's yields will head further south, and they will need full loads on all flights to avoid bigger losses. Any flight which has more than 3 empty seats will be a commercial catastrophe.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ001
Posted 2010-11-11 12:03:21 and read 7270 times.

Quoting 767er (Reply 184):
You will not be disappointed. When are you flying and what route are you taking.? The crews are great, excellant food and booze and the IFE is mind blowing. Try and sit in Zone A if you are flying the 744.


The lounhges are pretty nifty, especially SYD and LAX.

I am flying on NZ1 on 8th December. I've heard all about this award winning airline from my Dad who is a frequent flyer with them. My Dad has preferred the seats 4K 4A and 5K, but I hope we get them because they are the best!

Will be at Star Alliance lounge at LHR and SYD, MEL and is there one at Cairns?
Unfortunately won't go to Koru Lounge in LAX because it is a nightmare to get through customs there.

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 186):

All said I believe a European would be impressed by what NZ offers.
Quoting Solent (Reply 194):
The best service was on the NZ 767's between SYD - AKL - SYD, the staff and the entertainment system was superb.

Ye that's exactly what I was getting at. NZ may have changed their product but if you experienced the short haul economy we have here in Europe, and went back on an NZ A320 you would think you were on an SQ First Class Suite !


I am going on a mega holiday to Australasia in a few weeks. In total 8 NZ flights, 2 QF Flights and 2 JQ Flights.

What is the NZ and QF domestic service like ?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: mariner
Posted 2010-11-11 12:07:09 and read 7266 times.

Quoting koruman (Reply 195):
Any flight which has more than 3 empty seats will be a commercial catastrophe.

I would seriously question that number.

It suggests a BELF - break even load factor - of 98%. I don't know any airline that is predicated to be profitable on that percentage since it is effectively unachievable.

mariner

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 767er
Posted 2010-11-11 12:11:22 and read 7263 times.

Quoting NZ001 (Reply 196):
Will be at Star Alliance lounge at LHR and SYD, MEL and is there one at Cairns?

Koruman might know this one but I don't think there is Star lounge at Cairns.

Quoting NZ001 (Reply 196):
What is the NZ and QF domestic service like

Fairly basic on NZ as the flights are fairly short. Over to you Koruman on QF domestic as I never fly domestic - from all reports its fairly inconsistent

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ001
Posted 2010-11-11 12:17:33 and read 7252 times.

Ok thanks and also random question, but if I want to have a shower at Koru Lounge AKL, then do I need to book in advance?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-11 12:33:46 and read 7246 times.

Quoting NZ001 (Reply 196):
Will be at Star Alliance lounge at LHR and SYD, MEL and is there one at Cairns?

This link has all the information and locations of the International koru lounges http://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/international-lounge-directory, and this link http://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/koru-lounge-directory has all the infomation and location of the domestic lounges

Quoting NZ001 (Reply 199):

No pre booking for the showers is required, just turn up and use the next free shower!

Koru is certainly a nice relaxing area away from the crowded departure gates

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ001
Posted 2010-11-11 13:38:31 and read 7204 times.

thanks  

Not sure what to do this time at LAX because there's a 2 hour stopover and by the time you get through customs you have 10 minutes in Koru Lounge before you have to go back through customs. Normally just stay in the lounge next to plane.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 767er
Posted 2010-11-11 13:56:46 and read 7197 times.

Quoting NZ001 (Reply 201):
Not sure what to do this time at LAX because there's a 2 hour stopover and by the time you get through customs you have 10 minutes in Koru Lounge before you have to go back through customs. Normally just stay in the lounge next to plan

It very much depends on whether the NZ flight beat the VS and AF flights into LAX ( all 3 use Terminal 2). Last Sept I flew into LAX on NZ from LHR. We were the first to arrive and I was through Immigration and Customs in 30 mins.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ001
Posted 2010-11-11 13:59:49 and read 7196 times.

hmm I'll take that on board.

As a Brit I am not a fan of BA.
As a kiwi, are u a fan of your international airline?

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 767er
Posted 2010-11-11 14:16:10 and read 7185 times.

I am actually Australian and am a huge fan of NZ. It's the only airline I fly Long Haul

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: NZ001
Posted 2010-11-11 15:38:54 and read 7142 times.

oh ye forgot to look lol
I am greatly impressed with the long haul.
Will find out about the short haul in a month

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: koruman
Posted 2010-11-11 17:06:40 and read 7104 times.

Quoting 767er (Reply 198):
Over to you Koruman on QF domestic as I never fly domestic - from all reports its fairly inconsistent

I flew Qantas SYD-BNE yesterday, and it is a good product for a one hour flight.

One x 23 kg bag is included, and on board there was a drinks service and all passengers got a hot cheese toasted sandwich and an apple.

I keep saying this til I'm blue in the face, but the sort of short-haul flight in Europe which carries huge numbers of pax is things like LHR-CDG or FRA-MAN, which are one hour flights. Consequently airlines would be mad to install AVOD on aircraft which spend most of their time doing 45-90 minute flights.

But Tasman westbound flights are at least 200 minutes long, and Air New Zealand is positioning itself below Emirates and Qantas as an airline of low fares and low service.

And Mariner, if you model fares and loads with the old product, then account for the loss of Business Class (even with 1-2 paid pax) and Space Plus, with its own HVC, then you need to fill 24 of the 27 extra Economy seats to earn the same revenue, plus of course you need to buy fuel for 171 passengers instead of 152. I've seen what happened to Ted and Song and I know that it can't work for any airline to shed its HVC and hope to sell more low-yield tickets to offset that.

Topic: RE: New Zealand Aviation Thread #86
Username: 777ER
Posted 2010-11-11 17:21:20 and read 7095 times.

New Zealand Aviation Thread #87 (by 777ER Nov 11 2010 in Civil Aviation)


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