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Topic: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: mdword1959
Posted 2010-12-06 00:27:45 and read 10981 times.

Quote:
Emirates President Tim Clark told ATW he believes the Boeing 787 will be an outstanding aircraft but its current problems are slowing development of a 777-300ER upgrade sought by a number of airlines to meet the challenge of the Airbus A350-1000...
http://atwonline.com/news/other-headlines/

Interesting that Mr. Clark continues publicly pushing on this front despite having a lot on his own plate already.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: ebbuk
Posted 2010-12-06 01:13:53 and read 10837 times.

Dear me, you are not serious are you? What Tim has on his plates is crumbs compared to what Boeing is trying to grapple with (manage is not an apt word at this time). The longer the nightmare of the Dreamliner continues, there will be little progress on 777 upgrade/replacement. Doesn't take a professor to work that one out.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: mdword1959
Posted 2010-12-06 03:29:38 and read 10461 times.

Quoting ebbuk (Reply 1):
Dear me, you are not serious are you? What Tim has on his plates is crumbs compared to what Boeing is trying to grapple with (manage is not an apt word at this time).

It wasn't my intention to imply that any challenges faced by the respective organizations were of equal magnitude, weight or difficulty, I just find it interesting that with everything else already on Clark's plate, he keeps making a special effort to trot out the '50 tonne payload from Dubai to Los Angeles" spiel.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: goldenstate
Posted 2010-12-06 04:02:21 and read 10291 times.

Could someone please gag this guy already. You want a HGW 77W. We get it.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: ebbuk
Posted 2010-12-06 04:38:43 and read 10124 times.

Quoting mdword1959 (Reply 2):
I just find it interesting that with everything else already on Clark's plate, he keeps making a special effort to trot out the '50 tonne payload from Dubai to Los Angeles" spiel.

It is the only part of his jigsaw that is missing. He who shouts loudest, and often, always gets what he shouts for.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: Quokka
Posted 2010-12-06 04:56:37 and read 10021 times.

Quoting mdword1959 (Thread starter):
Interesting that Mr. Clark continues publicly pushing on this front


Who approached whom for the interview? And what would anyone expect Clark to talk about?

In the article Clark appears both calm and realistic stating

Quote:
“I know [our specifications are] a big ask but it will be an unrivaled aircraft if we get it,”

and wanting

Quote:
"manufacturers to focus on reliability as the number one criteria in aircraft design. “The knock on effect and cost is enormous of aircraft breakdowns and outweighs minor fuel savings,”


I'm not sure if this is a case of making noise in order to get attention or whether it presents a realistic assessment of Boeing's priorities at present.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: EPA001
Posted 2010-12-06 05:15:37 and read 9933 times.

Quoting ebbuk (Reply 4):
He who shouts loudest, and often, always gets what he shouts for.


Though that may be true, EK usually backs-up that loud shouting with considerable numbers of orders. See the A380 and B77W of which they have ordered huge numbers. And they have order quite a bunch of A350-XWB's as well.  

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: goldenstate
Posted 2010-12-06 05:54:00 and read 9783 times.

Quoting ebbuk (Reply 4):
He who shouts loudest, and often, always gets what he shouts for.

No. He who shouts loudest is just annoying.

Clark has plenty of clout with Airbus and Boeing to make his case privately, behind closed doors.

This isn't about wanting the heavier 777. It's about protecting the artifical competitive advantage EK and other carriers enjoy thanks to export subsidies by publicly making lots of noise about wanting to order lots of new airplanes.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: blueflyer
Posted 2010-12-06 06:01:18 and read 9737 times.

Actually, I find the last paragraph the most interesting of them all. He would rather have manufacturers focus more on reliability than fuel savings. I guess what with airlines keeping their schedules as tight as possible, any delay has long, expensive knock-on repercussions that weeks' worth of fuel savings are necessary to pay for.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: sunrisevalley
Posted 2010-12-06 07:51:04 and read 9437 times.

Quoting goldenstate (Reply 3):
Could someone please gag this guy already. You want a HGW 77W. We get it.
Quoting goldenstate (Reply 7):
This isn't about wanting the heavier 777.

You have it wrong. What Mr Clark wants is increased payload within the present MTOW by reduced MEW and fuel burn.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: Stitch
Posted 2010-12-06 08:00:20 and read 9380 times.

I'm sure Boeing has sufficient resources within the 777 Group to perform work on a "777-300ERX" with a lighter structure.

The problem is not designing a 777-300ERX. The problem is bringing it to market. It is the most expensive to produce airplane in Boeing Commercial's catalog and moving to CFRP wings or laser-wlded Al-Li fuselage panels is not going to make it any cheaper to build.

And I am sure EK, which pays less than half of list for a 77W thanks to the number they order, is not going to want to pay 20% more for the 777-300ERX because that's going to impact the profitability that extra payload is going to bring.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: andhen
Posted 2010-12-06 08:10:41 and read 9285 times.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 10):
The problem is not designing a 777-300ERX. The problem is bringing it to market. It is the most expensive to produce airplane in Boeing Commercial's catalog and moving to CFRP wings or laser-wlded Al-Li fuselage panels is not going to make it any cheaper to build.

I am not shure Boeing knows how to laserweld al-li panels.. I am quite shure they would have to outsource this to another manufacturer across the atlantic ocean..

But they could implement other changes i guess.

andhen

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: ckfred
Posted 2010-12-06 08:11:21 and read 9286 times.

Is an upgraded 777-300ER that big a deal. To me, the problems with the 787 are delaying Boeing's going forward with a new narrowbody.

A lot of airlines want something that is beyond the performance of the 737NG, the A320 series, and possibly the 757.

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: Coronado
Posted 2010-12-06 19:36:08 and read 3878 times.

Quoting goldenstate (Reply 3):

You are not Tim Clark's audience. Besides talking to management, EK is also sending messages to the owners of Boeing which if you will check on link below are essentially 100% Institutional Investors--- no little guys! The owners of Boeing i.e. institutional investors, are being reminded by EK on the product requirments of valuable customers such as EK, so they can exert their influence on the BOD which in turn has the say in Boeing management, who stays, who goes, resource allocations i.e. putting more into satelites than speeding up an update to their BCA's 777 program.

http://www.dailyfinance.com/company/...any/ba/nys/institutional-ownership

Topic: RE: EK: 787 Problems Slow Development Of 777 Upgrade
Username: MD-90
Posted 2010-12-06 19:53:20 and read 3771 times.

Quoting blueflyer (Reply 8):
He would rather have manufacturers focus more on reliability than fuel savings.

Translation: "Thank god we didn't order Rollers on our A380s."


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