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Topic: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: irishtexan
Posted 2012-08-10 13:40:20 and read 22005 times.

http://www.wusa9.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=216276
http://www.wjla.com/articles/2012/08...-commuter-plane-collide-78706.html

[Edited 2012-08-10 13:41:37]
Video of damaged United Expess just shown on FBN


[Edited 2012-08-10 13:42:52]

[Edited 2012-08-10 13:43:32]

[Edited 2012-08-10 13:46:40]

[Edited 2012-08-10 14:16:06]

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Today Lufthansa/United Express
Username: chootie
Posted 2012-08-10 13:48:28 and read 21922 times.

..I suppose the UAX and the LH may go AOG. Good thing that nothing worse happened, and no personal injuries!! i(I hope)   

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Today Lufthansa/United Express
Username: Roseflyer
Posted 2012-08-10 13:53:42 and read 21865 times.

And the match of A330 winglet vs Q400 rudder goes to A330 winglet!

In all seriousness, I’m surprised to see this happen at IAD since there is so much separation at IAD.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: LOWS
Posted 2012-08-10 14:53:28 and read 21352 times.

Glad no one is hurt, and am especially glad that it's not the new 748!

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: EASTERN747
Posted 2012-08-10 15:29:06 and read 21108 times.

Ok........who hit whom? ie whose fault?

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: My16sidedoffice
Posted 2012-08-10 15:55:20 and read 20690 times.

Re : the linked news report. "Collided on the runway". Typical media garbage, what a tool.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: kgaiflyer
Posted 2012-08-10 16:27:42 and read 20093 times.

In spite of what they're saying about no delays, one of my students' 5:55pm departure to SAN is now delayed until 9:30pm.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: strfyr51
Posted 2012-08-10 17:19:12 and read 19307 times.

it looks like the smaller airplanes will need to clear farther off the taxiway before stopping, This is the same thing that happened at JFK between a STJ and an A380 lees than a year ago. Just clearing the taxi way and and really being out of the way are not the same thing.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: B777LRforeveR
Posted 2012-08-10 18:14:25 and read 18558 times.

I'm assuming the Q400 did not get parked in a timely fashion and so the ramp controller may have forgotten he was out there and gave Lufthansa the clearance to taxi, which resulted in the Q400 getting clipped.

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 2):
In all seriousness, I’m surprised to see this happen at IAD since there is so much separation at IAD.

You would think that but surprisingly not especially on the Alpha and Bravo taxi ways with a lot of the regional jets sticking out of the alley there waiting to get parked. Also if you put a heavy on the Bravo taxiway and simultaneously use the Alpha crossover taxi ways for a regional jets, there is good chance of a clipping especially if the RJ doesn't hold back. I have some experience at the operations at IAD.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: toltommy
Posted 2012-08-10 18:19:39 and read 18483 times.

Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 6):

In spite of what they're saying about no delays, one of my students' 5:55pm departure to SAN is now delayed until 9:30pm.

No delay due to this incident (unless you on an aircraft involved of course). The east coast is getting hammered by weather, causing delays and diversions. The SAN departure delay has nothing to do with this incident.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: TonyBurr
Posted 2012-08-10 18:49:42 and read 18053 times.

Correct me if I am wrong, but the Lufthasnsa flight was departing for FRA, and the UX was coming in, or landing, so it was pulling in to the gate and the LH was coming down the taxiway for take off and clipped it?

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: capitalflyer
Posted 2012-08-10 19:18:25 and read 17638 times.

Which way was traffic? Was LH headed to 19L? I would think you would want to avoid the regional concourse with heavies.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: horstroad
Posted 2012-08-10 19:26:12 and read 17528 times.

"PLANE SCARE - two planes collide on the runway"


LOL


sounds like tenerife, is nothing but a bit scrapped metal and a big delay

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: irregking
Posted 2012-08-10 20:05:05 and read 17048 times.

The Lufthansa plane was LH417 - D-AIKK
It took off in the end at 5.50pm (instead of 3pm) and is supposed to arrive into FRA at 7AM instead of 5.15AM

All connex pax o/b LH417 who will miss their onward flight out of FRA have already been rebooked.

So the damage to the A333 was probably not substantial enough for the aircraft to go AOG.
But it's not the 1st time a plane has left with a damaged or even removed winglet. I could go search now and post the stories but TBH I really can't be bothered right now.

Where other airline pilots may run from the aircraft screaming for their mommies   , our boys have been taught:
"If it won't kill them (the pax), you're GOING! There's no wimping out!"

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: NWAESC
Posted 2012-08-10 20:10:14 and read 16980 times.

Sounds like a repeat of the NW A330 & QX Dash 8 in PDX a few years back...

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: Caspian27
Posted 2012-08-10 20:44:17 and read 16605 times.

Quoting B777LRforeveR (Reply 8):
I'm assuming the Q400 did not get parked in a timely fashion and so the ramp controller may have forgotten he was out there and gave Lufthansa the clearance to taxi, which resulted in the Q400 getting clipped.

Having clearance to taxi doesn't absolve a pilot from avoiding obstacles.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: C680
Posted 2012-08-10 21:41:37 and read 16007 times.

IIRC, ramp control is run by MWAA (airport authority) and not the FAA.

  

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: SASDC8
Posted 2012-08-11 01:55:45 and read 13697 times.

I just love the responsiveness in the USA. In one of the pictures I count no more than 18 cars that have arrived to deal with the seriousness of the tail clipping 
Quoting LOWS (Reply 3):
Glad no one is hurt, and am especially glad that it's not the new 748!
So a 330 is OK to crash but not the 748? Not the brightest of comments, but if is it was a 748 I imagine the damage (to the LH and UA plane) would be greater, due to the larger wingspan and engine placement.

[Edited 2012-08-11 02:52:18]

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: HAWK21M
Posted 2012-08-11 04:27:27 and read 12114 times.

Stay on the line folks..... stay on the line.......

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: chootie
Posted 2012-08-11 05:41:12 and read 11283 times.

Quoting irregking (Reply 13):
The Lufthansa plane was LH417 - D-AIKK
It took off in the end at 5.50pm (instead of 3pm) and is supposed to arrive into FRA at 7AM instead of 5.15AM

...Funny thing, when I got into work and checked---LH417/10AUG has an informative schedule.

The A/C is D-AIKE and is AOG @ IAD. D-AIKK operated the flight on 09AUG.         

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: flyiguy
Posted 2012-08-11 05:41:43 and read 11283 times.

Are you sure about that?

Quoting irregking (Reply 13):
The Lufthansa plane was LH417 - D-AIKK
It took off in the end at 5.50pm (instead of 3pm) and is supposed to arrive into FRA at 7AM instead of 5.15AM

The Aircraft in question is D-AIKE " LANDSHUT " . It is currently still parked at IAD at B-51. The winglet is removed from the starboard side and is taped over with aluminum tape.

FLY

[Edited 2012-08-11 05:55:20]

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: C767P
Posted 2012-08-11 07:12:32 and read 10128 times.

Quoting strfyr51 (Reply 7):

it looks like the smaller airplanes will need to clear farther off the taxiway before stopping

Or LH could stop! You can’t just taxi into the gate without any rampers at the gate, who take their sweet time at Dulles if they are not there when you get there.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: futureualpilot
Posted 2012-08-11 08:55:37 and read 8822 times.

Quoting C767P (Reply 21):

Thank you! I can't count the number of times I've gotten to the A gates in IAD only to have to wait for the ground crew to leisurely saunter over to park us. While doing this I've seen a number of inbound or outbound international airplanes squeeze through with only a few feet to spare, and this is after we inched as ar forward as we could go without rampers. E Q is a big airplane for what it is, it doesn't surprise me that it finally got clipped at the A gates in Dulles.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: panova98
Posted 2012-08-11 10:04:33 and read 8066 times.

Kind of amusing reading here about how bad the media is trying to report on this stuff. "Plane scare." "Dulles collision." Like we "expert" commenters have made everything really, really clear?

Who, what, when, and where.

Actually, the reporters didn't do all that bad of a job.

At Dulles, around 3:15 in the afternoon, although actually specically where and which plane was coming from/going to at the airport is not quite clear, but, like this is easy to discern? Like FlightAware, airline website, and FlightStats are so clear. Add an eyewitness, and who knows what happened.

Anyway, flights were apparently UA3912, which is clear as mud, as that was actually Colgan Air, dba United Express. Easy to figure out who' s plane that was...sure...why not throw in Pinnacle, bankruptcy, maybe the Silver aggregation, and that whole A gate picture.

Then there was the LH417, or UA8833. Again, very clear?

Airplane types seemed to be OK, which is surprising that the media whould have a clue as to differences between a Q400 and 333, or let's just call it an Airbus for simplicity sake!

How did these planes get to where they are in the pictures, which obviously don't show the actually tail/wing contact as it is happening. What gates are invovled here? What taxiways? What planned runways? The landing and takeoff patterns?

And then, the damage to each plane. Pictures are helpful, but from some comments, one would think the planes just carried on. Off to whever a Q400 goes? LH off to FRA?

Really, we are expecting a lot for the media to get all this down quickly, and accurately. Would we prefer they not report anything until a year or so after all the investigation is done?

Full disclosure: I dislike the path airlines are taking using more and more regionals. And, those A gate planes should never be even remotely close to the big boys. Do as we do with our highways. Well..., as we ought to!

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: kgaiflyer
Posted 2012-08-11 10:12:24 and read 7952 times.

Quoting toltommy (Reply 9):
No delay due to this incident (unless you on an aircraft involved of course). The east coast is getting hammered by weather, causing delays and diversions. The SAN departure delay has nothing to do with this incident.

You're right.

The aircraft -- 752 #5434 -- routed LAX-DEN-IAD-SAN -- had been late since it left LAX 35 minutes late earlier in the day. The plane (as UA240) left Dulles for San Diego 4 hrs 12 mins late.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: XFSUgimpLB41X
Posted 2012-08-11 11:33:29 and read 7303 times.

Quoting C767P (Reply 21):
Or LH could stop! You can’t just taxi into the gate without any rampers at the gate, who take their sweet time at Dulles if they are not there when you get there.

One interesting thing I've recently learned, but haven't confirmed, is that rampers are not allowed to run on the ramp- it's an OSHA violation.

Doesn't restrict fast walking, which sometimes a slow shuffle is all I've seen.  

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: my1le
Posted 2012-08-11 12:49:57 and read 6588 times.

Here are some photos from today - 8/11/12

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jdingell/sets/72157631020950152/

James

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: Semaex
Posted 2012-08-12 03:29:34 and read 5414 times.

Am I really the only one who thinks about the curiosity that the LH A330 is christened "Landshut" .... ? Let the superstition begin!   

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: HAWK21M
Posted 2012-08-12 04:12:41 and read 5322 times.

Quoting my1le (Reply 26):
Here are some photos from today - 8/11/12

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jdingel...0152/

Interesting pics...Thanks.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: irregking
Posted 2012-08-12 05:38:57 and read 5242 times.

Quoting chootie (Reply 19):
Quoting flyiguy (Reply 20):

I obviously don't know how to work our computer system hahaha
Sorry for the mis-info guys. I got the dates totally wrong.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: C767p
Posted 2012-08-12 07:55:24 and read 5082 times.

Quoting XFSUgimpLB41X (Reply 25):


One interesting thing I've recently learned, but haven't confirmed, is that rampers are not allowed to run on the ramp- it's an OSHA violation.

Doesn't restrict fast walking, which sometimes a slow shuffle is all I've seen.  


Figures. I would settle for normal pace walk. I swear a turtle would pass these guys up.

Topic: RE: Dulles Incident Aug.10 Lufthansa/United Express
Username: flyiguy
Posted 2012-08-12 09:57:31 and read 4915 times.

Quoting irregking (Reply 29):
I obviously don't know how to work our computer system hahaha
Sorry for the mis-info guys. I got the dates totally wrong.

It's cool, we are only human

FLY


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