Just wondering, which large(ish) airlines have no aircraft from one of the major two manufacturers, Airbus or Boeing?

The only ones that come to mind, and I'm not sure if I'm correct but:

American (Boeing only? No more A300s)
Iberia?

And low cost carriers don't count either, because almost all of them fly a single manufacturer.

[Edited 2012-11-16 10:46:55]

Quoting 3rdGen (Thread starter): And low cost carriers don't count either, because almost all of them fly a single manufacturer.

That does seem slightly odd, considering it's single manufacturer fleets that you are asking for.

Others which come to mind:

TAP
Aer Lingus
Finnair
El Al
RAM
Icelandair

If you discount those also operating BAe, Bombardier or Embraer aircraft under the main brand, there are many more.


Dan  

American currently doesn't have any Airbus planes, but that will be changing in the years ahead (doubly so if they merge with US Airways).

I don't know if you'd consider them "large", but Alaska Airlines only flies Boeing.

And I believe you would consider Southwest and Ryanair to be large and they're all-Boeing. As is easyjet (all Airbus).

[Edited 2012-11-16 10:32:20]

No, what I am asking for is fleets with either: no boeing aircraft, or no airbus aircraft. i.e. American Airlines, which contains MDs and Boeings (although they have airbus on order). There are very few large airlines that lack either an Airbus or Boeing type.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 2): And I believe you would consider Southwest and Ryanair to be large and they're all-Boeing. As is easyjet (all Airbus).

Ya its easy with the LCCs, because they usually only fly one type anyway, so its not hard. I was thinking more along the lines of a Legacy carrier with a number of different types for different missions, short/medium/long haul. American is the best example I can think of

[Edited 2012-11-16 10:34:34]

I too was confused by the thread title; thought you were asking for airlines operating neither Airbus nor Boeing (in which case there aren't any, depending on your definition of "large airline"). Only one manufacturer out of the two; now that's a long list. PlymSpotter named quite a few.

Alaska
Southwest
West Jet
ANA (I think they phased out their A321s already)
Ryanair

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 4): I too was confused by the thread title; thought you were asking for airlines operating neither Airbus nor Boeing

Ya sorry for that, don't really know what else to call this thread.

EDIT: added the "either" in the title, maybe that will help.

[Edited 2012-11-16 10:48:02]

isn't JAL all Boeing ? LH is nearly all Airbus

Japan Airlines....no Airbuses now
Swiss......no Boeings
Alaska.....no Airbuses
South African Airways.....no Boeings?
Transaero, Kenya Airways, LOT , Ethiopian .....no Airbuses
Cyprus Airways, Air Malta, MEA .....no Boeings

Interesting question....gets the brain going!

Quoting n729pa (Reply 8): Japan Airlines....no Airbuses now

NH is retiring their A320s soon, (or already have) so they'll too become an all-B airline.

JS flies neither Airbus or Boeing

  

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 1): Finnair

Has AY already phased out all their Boeing 757?

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 7): LH is nearly all Airbus

LH still has quite a few B737 and B747-400 to get rid of first. However, LH have just recently started taking delivery of the new B747-8i, so I guess Boeing aircraft will remain in the LH fleet for a while yet.

The largest one i can think of that doesn't operate either Airbus or Boeing is Flybe - they operate Dash 8s and Embraers only and have a fleet of about 70 aircraft

Quoting 3rdGen (Reply 3): There are very few large airlines that lack either an Airbus or Boeing type.

I'd venture a guess that there are more majors/flag carriers with such a fleet than major LCCs flying just one type.

AeroMexico
TACA
Belavia
LOT
Swiss
Olympic Air/Agean
UTAir (A321 on order)
Gulf Air (788 on order)
Air Mauritius
Yemenia
MEA
Ethiopian (350 on order)
Kenya Airways
Brussels Airlines (737s wfu)
Transaero
Air Malta
Cyprus Airways

For every carrier with a new manufacturer on order, I can think of another which is going to a one manufacturer fleet.


Dan  

Quoting Fuling (Reply 10): Has AY already phased out all their Boeing 757?

Good point, was thinking they were operated by Air Finland, but they are no longer around.


Dan 

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 7): LH is nearly all Airbus

LH is the launch customer for the 747-8I, so "nearly" doesn't count.

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 7): isn't JAL all Boeing ?

Yep, if you count the MD-90s they inherited from JAS as Boeing.

Quoting n729pa (Reply 8): South African Airways.....no Boeings?

They fly the 737-800.

Widerøe neither A or B only Bombardier

Flybe neither A or B only Embraer & Bombardier

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 7): LH is nearly all Airbus

LH has 221 Airbus and 70 Boeing. that´s 3.1 : 1, I wouldn´t call that 'nearly all airbus'

Jetstar could be put in if we include LCC, however they have B787 on order.

Probably not what you're thinking of, but regional airlines can be quite large and don't possess either Boeing or Airbus equipment. OO for example has over 320 airframes, all Bombardier or Embraer.

COPA in Panama has a whole lot of Boeing 737NGs, a couple Embraers, but no Airbus aircraft.

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 7): LH is nearly all Airbus

You must be joking! In addition to the 737s and 747s of LH mainline that have already been pointed out, their wholly owned subsidiaries operate one of the most varied fleets of western airliners that you can find. ATRs, Avros, Boeings, Bombardiers/Canadairs, Embraers, Fokkers, MDs... they have them all.

Quoting aloges (Reply 20): You must be joking! In addition to the 737s and 747s of LH mainline that have already been pointed out, their wholly owned subsidiaries operate one of the most varied fleets of western airliners that you can find. ATRs, Avros, Boeings, Bombardiers/Canadairs, Embraers, Fokkers, MDs... they have them all.

Really ... you're counting cargo divisions now ?

LH mainline is ~75% Airbus so calling it "mostly Airbus" isn't too stretching it. LH+OS+LX probably increases the Airbus ratio even further.

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 21): LH mainline is ~75% Airbus so calling it "mostly Airbus" isn't too stretching it.

I think the reason people are disagreeing so strongly is that the absolute numbers involved are so large.

On LH mainline, there about 220 Airbus aircraft vs. over 70 Boeing aircraft.

That does make LH a "mostly Airbus" airline, but it makes them irrelevant to this thread because - after all - they operate a sub-fleet of Boeings that is larger than most airlines' total fleet.

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 21): Really ... you're counting cargo divisions now ?

Since LH Cargo is a wholly owned subsidiary, I counted it - that shouldn't be

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 21): stretching it

too far for someone who considers a fleet with 25% Boeing aircraft in it to be

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 7): nearly all Airbus

[Edited 2012-11-16 13:35:54]

Quoting flyingalex (Reply 22): That does make LH a "mostly Airbus" airline, but it makes them irrelevant to this thread because - after all - they operate a sub-fleet of Boeings that is larger than most airlines' total fleet.

Then at what point is "mostly" a suitable descriptor ? 90%? 95%?

UA mainline is "only" 78% Boeing, so I guess you can't call it "mostly Boeing" either.

y'all are forgetting SkyWest/ExpressJet ...

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 24): Then at what point is "mostly" a suitable descriptor ? 90%? 95%?

Technically 50.000000001% and above  

IB doesn't fly any Boeing. Neither do VY or U2.

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 24): Then at what point is "mostly" a suitable descriptor ? 90%? 95%?

"Mostly" is far from the same as "nearly all", your use of which was the reason for my strong disagreement in the first place. I'll happily agree with "mostly".

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 26): Technically 50.000000001% and above

Interesting, we do have a "smirk" smily.   

By my book, flybe is pretty large, certainly larger than some of the other airlines already mentioned, and it has no aircraft from Airbus and Boeing.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 12): Brussels Airlines (737s wfu)

All the 737s are out already?

Quoting aloges (Reply 23): Since LH Cargo is a wholly owned subsidiary, I counted it

Perhaps, but Lufthansa Cargo has its own AOC, as does Singapore Airlines Cargo, so they probably deserve to be treated distinctly from their passenger brethren, and neither operates Airbus aircraft.

Those who live in France probably remember Air Inter, it used to be a French domestic airline. They flew mostly French built planes (A300, A320, A330, Caravelle and Mercure) except the Fokker 27 and the Vickers Viscount, but the main point is they never flew any US built planes.

Malev has never flown any Airbus model, neither did El Al.

There is also Air Koryo - neither A nor B.

All Airbus

Sri Lankan Airlines
Aegean Airlines
Sichuan Airlines
Afriqiyah
MEA
Cyprus Airways
Onur Air
Aircalin
Virgin America
Mandala
Tiger Airways
Spring Airlines
Volaris
Ural Airlines
IndiGo
Go Air
Air Arabia

Perhaps why not change the thread title to "Which large airlines have either only A or B planes". I feel that it is still a bit misleading.

What ever happened to the speculation of the widebody order from South African Airways?

Quoting blueflyer (Reply 29): All the 737s are out already?

I think they have two left, one 300 and one 400. They'll be gone early next year. By then SN will be Boeing free.

Quoting blueflyer (Reply 29): All the 737s are out already?

I was under the impression that they are being used as 'hot spares' but are weeks from leaving altogether.

Quoting anrec80 (Reply 31): There is also Air Koryo - neither A nor B.

Well they have Antonovs but no Berievs   


Dan  

Apart from the Ebrarer regionals, Royal Jordanian operates an entirely Airbus fleet, until the 787 begins arriving.

Azul is all ERJ, right

Frontier is all Airbus.

Horizon Air has neither A or B.

Virgin blue doesnt operate airbus

Finnair still has their fleet of 757's, and ANA still has A320's, so they're out of the question. South African has some 737's, I believe they are -800's. I don't believe that Gulf Air has any more 777's, so they're all Airbus, except for their Embraer jets. Lastly, airlines like Adria and Aegean airlines are based on an all A320 fleet.

Westjet in Canada has a fleet of Boeing 737NGs.

As an aside, Jazz Air has a fairly large (relative to other CDN airlines) fleet of Bombardier aircraft. No Boeing or Airbus.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 1): American currently doesn't have any Airbus planes, but that will be changing in the years ahead

This will change already in one year from now, even if AA doesn't merge with US or B6. The first A319 or A321 is expected end of 2013. American will have remained Airbus free only for four years, from 2009 to 2013.

Jet Blue flies the A320 and the ERJ (170 or 190 not sure which, I know it's one of the two) but no Boeing.

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 39): Horizon Air has neither A or B.

That's a regional subsidiary of Alaska.
Because if I follow your reasoning, then one could say American Eagle has neither A or B.

TWA has never flown any Airbus, however they did consider seriously the A330 for long hauls and the A318 for short hauls.

Delta wouldn't be flying any Airbus plane if they didn't merger with Northwest. The only Airbus they ever flew prior to the merger was the A310.

Quoting n729pa (Reply 8): South African Airways.....no Boeings?

I thought that they had B737's.

Quoting American 767 (Reply 43): TWA has never flown any Airbus, however they did consider seriously the A330 for long hauls and the A318 for short hauls.

Didn't they have them on order?

Quoting brilondon (Reply 44): Quoting n729pa (Reply 8): South African Airways.....no Boeings? I thought that they had B737's.

Yes, that's what I said in an earlier post - 737-800s.

Quoting American 767 (Reply 30): Those who live in France probably remember Air Inter, it used to be a French domestic airline. They flew mostly French built planes (A300, A320, A330, Caravelle and Mercure) except the Fokker 27 and the Vickers Viscount, but the main point is they never flew any US built planes.

I think they merged with AF. Air Inter did look seriously at the 737-500, but went with Airbus instead. I remember when they were bidding for a fleet renewal and did come to Boeing.

Quoting American 767 (Reply 43): TWA has never flown any Airbus, however they did consider seriously the A330 for long hauls and the A318 for short hauls.

Didn't they have them on order? I think it was more than just considering.

Quoting brilondon (Reply 44): Quoting n729pa (Reply 8): South African Airways.....no Boeings? I thought that they had B737's.

Yes, that's what I said in an earlier post - 737-800s.

Quoting American 767 (Reply 30): Those who live in France probably remember Air Inter, it used to be a French domestic airline. They flew mostly French built planes (A300, A320, A330, Caravelle and Mercure) except the Fokker 27 and the Vickers Viscount, but the main point is they never flew any US built planes.

I think they merged with AF. Air Inter did look seriously at the 737-500, but went with Airbus instead. I remember when they were bidding for a fleet renewal and did come to Boeing.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 2): As is easyjet (all Airbus).

And originally all Boeing.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 46): Quoting American 767 (Reply 43): TWA has never flown any Airbus, however they did consider seriously the A330 for long hauls and the A318 for short hauls. Didn't they have them on order? I think it was more than just considering.

TWA ordered 20 A330s (with options on 20 more) in 1989, 3 years before the A330 had even flown.
http://www.nytimes.com/1989/03/28/bu...a-order-to-airbus-is-expected.html

In 1998 they ordered 50 A318s and 25 others from the A320 family (plus 50 717s).
http://articles.baltimoresun.com/199...iness/1998344136_1_a318-boeing-twa

Quoting American 767 (Reply 43): Jet Blue flies the A320 and the ERJ (170 or 190 not sure which, I know it's one of the two) but no Boeing.

...and soon the A321 too. B6 flies the E190, but not the E170. They were actually the launch customer for the E190.  

Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 48): ...and soon the A321 too

Neo!

Quoting rjm777ual (Reply 49): Neo!

The A321's are not going to be NEOs, in fact they are going to start arriving in 2013. The NEOs (as of right now) are A320's and those aren't due to start rolling in until like 2016 I think.

Quoting JumboJim747 (Reply 40): Virgin blue doesnt operate airbus

Well Virgin Blue doesn't exist in that form anymore. However Virgin Australia operates the following (not counting Skywest's ATR72 operation)

- 18 Embraer 190
- 4 Boeing 737-700
- 68 Boeing 737-800
- 5 Airbus A330-200
- 5 Boeing 777-300ER

So they don't qualify as all Boeing but no Airbus operator.

[Edited 2012-11-17 16:06:10]

Quoting American 767 (Reply 43): Because if I follow your reasoning, then one could say American Eagle has neither A or B.

Which you would be correct.

Quoting American 767 (Reply 43): That's a regional subsidiary of Alaska.

So? The QX pilots don't fly the 737 and the AS pilots don't fly the Q400 nor the CR7's. Horizon may be under the AAG but they are still Horizon Air, a separate company. So this counts.

Well, to be pedantic, QX doesn't fly the CR7 for AS anymore. That flying is now done by OO.
Skywest (OO) is also non A or B airline, that while operating as a regional is classified as a major airline.

Air Tahiti Nui is only A340!

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 21): LH mainline is ~75% Airbus so calling it "mostly Airbus" isn't too stretching it.

Doesn't matter as it still doesn't apply in the context this thread.   

AirAsia group of airlines only operates A320 and A330. Indonesia AirAsia used to operates several classic 737 though.

Not the largest airlines but to name a few:

All Boeing
Arkefly
Transavia
Pegasus Airlines
Turkmenistan Airlines
SunExpress
Anadolujet

All Airbus
Atlasjet
Onur Air
Cyprus Airways

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 36): Quoting anrec80 (Reply 31): There is also Air Koryo - neither A nor B. Well they have Antonovs but no Berievs

lol

[Edited 2012-11-18 07:25:05]

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 4): you were asking for airlines operating neither Airbus nor Boeing (in which case there aren't any

That is not true, as some people have brought up, Skywest, although a regional, is still not operating either and operates a very large and vast fleet.

Quoting American 767 (Reply 43): Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 39): Horizon Air has neither A or B. That's a regional subsidiary of Alaska

Actually, Horizon is its own company and up until recently flew under its own banner as a sister airline of AS.

There's Mesa Airlines, which flies a Canadair/Bombardier/De Havilland Canada fleet for a host of legacy carriers. Thus neither Airbus nor Boeing.