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Topic: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: CRJ900X
Posted 2012-11-09 14:55:24 and read 3831 times.

At the end of the article, it states that Skywest Airlines is speaking to Bombardier and Embraer about an order for additional regional jets.

Link: http://atwonline.com/airline-finance...rts-209-million-3q-net-income-1107

Based on the current fleet of CRJ700/900's in the fleet (and the additional ex-Comair machines), would it be a safe assumption that Bombardier would be able to win this order? Any idea on how many numbers of aircraft that Skywest is looking to order?

It also appears that the large order for the MRJ will be firmed up in the next little while.

Cheers,
CRJ900X

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: FWAERJ
Posted 2012-11-09 15:57:06 and read 3845 times.

Quoting CRJ900X (Thread starter):
Based on the current fleet of CRJ700/900's in the fleet (and the additional ex-Comair machines), would it be a safe assumption that Bombardier would be able to win this order? Any idea on how many numbers of aircraft that Skywest is looking to order?

I'm willing to bet that it has a lot to do with large near-term increases of 70/76-seat RJs at both DL and AA.

Since it's OO we're talking about, it's likely that Bombardier will win this order... but with EV's extensive use of ERJs, I wouldn't rule out E-Jets for OO or EV.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: cbphoto
Posted 2012-11-09 19:43:46 and read 3839 times.

I think a lot of it has to do with what the mothership airlines are looking for in regards to a new order. While on the surface, it would seem Bombardier would be a shoe in. However, if OO can have better placement with say E-175s and have a long time commitment for them, then it could be feasible for them to look at and even open a new training program for the 175s. They might even split the order as FWAERJ was getting at, and take on Bombardier for OO and EV could get bigger ERJs. Question is, who would these fly for (err..paint scheme wise)?

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: Goldenshield
Posted 2012-11-09 19:57:59 and read 3837 times.

Quoting cbphoto (Reply 2):
They might even split the order as FWAERJ was getting at, and take on Bombardier for OO and EV could get bigger ERJs.

If anything, a Bombardier order is going to be C-Series. I don't see Q's in the short-medium term either. The CRJ series is pretty much dead now. Partially because there's a glut of them, and partially because technology and efficiency has marched on.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: JayDub
Posted 2012-11-10 01:28:06 and read 3835 times.

If OO were to make an order with Bombardier in the near-term, I think it would be for a Q.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: AA737-823
Posted 2012-11-10 02:51:18 and read 3834 times.

Quoting JayDub (Reply 4):
If OO were to make an order with Bombardier in the near-term, I think it would be for a Q.

Maybe. But the reliability of the Q has been iffy, supposedly, so I'm not sure they're willing to go that route.

And, regarding a C-series order, while I would LOVE to see one, I think that's too big. The carriers don't need a 130 seat aircraft flown by SkyWest.

[Edited 2012-11-10 02:53:50]

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: RWA380
Posted 2012-11-10 05:55:29 and read 3838 times.

Quoting JayDub (Reply 4):
If OO were to make an order with Bombardier in the near-term, I think it would be for a Q

I would love to see OO taking steps towards the replacement of the EMB-120's, a Q200 would easily fill the gap that will be left when the 120's leave the fleet. I expect several communities will loose service all together if OO does not order something along those lines. OO must have quite a hodge podge of CRJ's in their fleet by now, didn't they take over the AS/QX planes, then turned around and started flying them for AS?

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: SLCPilot
Posted 2012-11-10 06:44:32 and read 3836 times.

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 3):
If anything, a Bombardier order is going to be C-Series. I don't see Q's in the short-medium term either. The CRJ series is pretty much dead now. Partially because there's a glut of them, and partially because technology and efficiency has marched on.

G-Shield,

Granted your perspective is different than most, I doubt a C-series order would ever happen due to scope, unless OO starts a branded and code-share operation. It isn't hard for me to imagine a CRJ900 or 1000 order with a double sized cargo area for Alaska operations. It could serve Alaska on routes up north that don't merit a 737. There is also speculation about additional Airways and American flying with two class planes.

Cheers!

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: BD500
Posted 2012-11-10 07:21:27 and read 3836 times.

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 3):
The CRJ series is pretty much dead now. Partially because there's a glut of them, and partially because technology and efficiency has marched on.

To better understand your comment, when you say the CRJ are behind in term of technology and efficiency, you are referring to things such as fly by wire? For efficiency, I'm not sure your right; the weight of the CRJ is lower than the one of E series which should advantage the CRJ in terms of efficiency and might help Bombardier winning this order.

Otherwise, Embrear would not be developing an E175+ as it was stated last month.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: Goldenshield
Posted 2012-11-10 07:36:03 and read 3836 times.

Quoting AA737-823 (Reply 5):
The carriers don't need a 130 seat aircraft flown by SkyWest.
Quoting SLCPilot (Reply 7):
I doubt a C-series order would ever happen due to scope, unless OO starts a branded and code-share operation.

Who said anything about a CS300?

The CS100 can be fitted with more first class seats, and even a Real Galley with Ovens™, and still fall within the 85 seat restriction for Airways and (lack of restriction with) AS.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 6):
I would love to see OO taking steps towards the replacement of the EMB-120's

I'd love to see a manufacturer take that step first. The Q3/400 is too big for most markets. The DH8-200 is no longer manufactured. The closest alternative we have right now is the ATR42. EMB hasn't shown any interest in pursuing a replacement for the E120.

And then you have to deal with the majors, of which, a certain major out there has already offered new turbopropr flying, but wants to pay rates below what a decent regional would need in order to break even on that flying...

Kind of a conundrum, don't you think?

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: lightsaber
Posted 2012-11-10 08:09:38 and read 3837 times.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 1):
I'm willing to bet that it has a lot to do with large near-term increases of 70/76-seat RJs at both DL and AA.

Ditto. That is a big demand known to be coming. I doubt this is for larger aircraft (as some have speculated and I would hope for).

Lightsaber

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: neveragain
Posted 2012-11-10 08:09:48 and read 3836 times.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 1):
Since it's OO we're talking about, it's likely that Bombardier will win this order... but with EV's extensive use of ERJs, I wouldn't rule out E-Jets for OO or EV.

My sense is (but this is without anything other than compiling in my head what I've read for the past couple of years), that in a CRJ-900 versus E-Jet decision in North America, the more advantageous operating economics of the CR9 will always win.

Besides, when's the last time an airline in North America ordered E-Jets? (And I wouldn't count California Pacific.) Perhaps a better question--when is the last time a North American airline already operating E-Jets add to that order?

In any case, I doubt the fact that EV already operates ERJ-145s will be a major factor. For the CR9 it's more relevant, as the cockpit and a lot of the parts are similar.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: B727FA
Posted 2012-11-10 09:17:43 and read 3834 times.

RAH...a couple of years ago. So?

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: futureualpilot
Posted 2012-11-10 10:06:51 and read 3843 times.

Quoting JayDub (Reply 4):
If OO were to make an order with Bombardier in the near-term, I think it would be for a Q.

Word is SkyWest was offered the Colgan Q400s before RAH was and turned them down because of estimated maintenance costs, and the cost of adding a new type to the certificate and the fleet to include training, staffing, etc.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 6):
I would love to see OO taking steps towards the replacement of the EMB-120's, a Q200 would easily fill the gap that will be left when the 120's leave the fleet.

It wouldn't make sense to get rid of turboprops that are paid for, make money hand over fist less than half full and already have the infrastructure necessary to support them, only to replace them with airplanes to make payments on, retrain and re-staff, and build a whole new inventory of parts and support for. To my knowledge -200s aren't made any longer so you would also be getting second hand airplanes. The Bro at OO has a long history of "being on the way out" but it is still going strong. It has a limited life, to be sure, but it seems the draw-down plan for the airplane is revised to keep it in service longer and longer.

[Edited 2012-11-10 10:15:06]

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: jporterfi
Posted 2012-11-10 10:37:05 and read 3836 times.

Quoting JayDub (Reply 4):

If OO were to make an order with Bombardier in the near-term, I think it would be for a Q.

I'm not so sure that OO would go with the Q series if the aircraft were to be operated for AA and/or DL. UA I can see, because they already operate props, but aren't props generally unpopular with many members of the traveling public (myself and some other a.netters excluded!)? I'd love to see props back in the DL and AA regional fleets, but I just don't know if it is feasible, as it hasn't been that many years since DL and AA ditched their Saab 340Bs.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: N62NA
Posted 2012-11-10 11:15:50 and read 3835 times.

Quoting jporterfi (Reply 14):
I'd love to see props back in the DL and AA regional fleets, but I just don't know if it is feasible, as it hasn't been that many years since DL and AA ditched their Saab 340Bs.

Up until November 15th of this year, American Eagle is still flying quite a few ATR props, and they've been doing it for years, so to have another prop pop up in the American Eagle fleet wouldn't be an unusual step at all.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: futureualpilot
Posted 2012-11-10 11:23:22 and read 3837 times.

Quoting N62NA (Reply 15):
Up until November 15th of this year, American Eagle is still flying quite a few ATR props, and they've been doing it for years, so to have another prop pop up in the American Eagle fleet wouldn't be an unusual step at all.

I know before 9E/9L ran into trouble, they took a Q400 to DFW for AA to look at, evidently they loved the airplane as well as the performance but the company was having too many staffing issues so nothing ever happened with it. I'd agree that it isn't outside the realm of possibility.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: neveragain
Posted 2012-11-11 08:50:21 and read 3835 times.

Quoting futureualpilot (Reply 16):
I know before 9E/9L ran into trouble, they took a Q400 to DFW for AA to look at, evidently they loved the airplane as well as the performance but the company was having too many staffing issues so nothing ever happened with it.

"We really like the plane, but due to 'staffing issues,' we can't fly it."

Doesn't make much sense to me.

AA didn't have to contract with 9L after all.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: JBo
Posted 2012-11-11 10:00:14 and read 3834 times.

Quoting neveragain (Reply 17):
"We really like the plane, but due to 'staffing issues,' we can't fly it."

Doesn't make much sense to me.

AA didn't have to contract with 9L after all.

It makes perfect sense ... AA probably was interested in the aircraft type but wasn't interested in contracting with Pinnacle/Colgan due to the staffing/operational issues. Contracting with 9L would've been cheaper than AA ordering and taking on the aircraft type themselves. There really isn't another Q400 operator to contract with aside from Horizon Air unless RAH were to step up.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: neveragain
Posted 2012-11-11 10:27:54 and read 3834 times.

Quoting JBo (Reply 18):
There really isn't another Q400 operator to contract with aside from Horizon Air unless RAH were to step up.

Or the aircraft was added to MQ's certificate, which would have been the most logical thing to do.

If AA really "wanted" the aircraft, it would have issued an RFP. And it would've gotten responses, including some perhaps from airlines not operating the Q400 today.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: rlwynn
Posted 2012-11-11 12:18:30 and read 3834 times.

Do they still sell CRJ200's

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: gcb5196
Posted 2012-11-11 12:50:35 and read 3834 times.

They make what looks a CRJ200, but do not offer it to airlines, it is only offered as a business jet. Don't know if that is cuurently the case, that's what it was a few years ago.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: CRJ900
Posted 2012-11-11 14:39:36 and read 3833 times.

Quoting neveragain (Reply 11):
more advantageous operating economics of the CR9 will always win.

A new video has appeared on YouTube, made by Bombardier, showing off the new slimline seats for the CRJ900 - and they claim that in a typical CR9 layout the new seats shave off around 400 lbs of weight. Is that enough to make a significant contribution in lowering costs and fuel consumption even more?

I think Lufthansa is installing these seats in their CR9s and they have added 4 more seats (the LH website seat map now shows 90 seats with the same galley config they had with 86 seats) and LH usually know what they're doing.

Is the E175 available with these seats?

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: neveragain
Posted 2012-11-11 15:42:47 and read 3833 times.

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 22):
Is that enough to make a significant contribution in lowering costs and fuel consumption even more?

It certainly won't hurt!

I still can't get over the difference between the CR9 and the CR2--night and day, even though they have the same fuselage!

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: Viscount724
Posted 2012-11-12 14:28:18 and read 3832 times.

Quoting rlwynn (Reply 20):
Do they still sell CRJ200's
Quoting gcb5196 (Reply 21):
They make what looks a CRJ200, but do not offer it to airlines, it is only offered as a business jet. Don't know if that is cuurently the case, that's what it was a few years ago.

I believe airline production ended in 2005. The CRJ100/200 had a good run with 1,021 delivered.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: FWAERJ
Posted 2012-11-12 14:31:17 and read 4016 times.

Quoting JayDub (Reply 4):

If OO were to make an order with Bombardier in the near-term, I think it would be for a Q.
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 24):
I believe airline production ended in 2005. The CRJ100/200 had a good run with 1,021 delivered.

IIRC, it was none other than OO that got the last CR2 delivered.

It's safe to say that SkyWest and Bombardier have a very strong relationship that just might win them this order.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: N62NA
Posted 2012-11-12 16:33:13 and read 4012 times.

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 22):
in a typical CR9 layout the new seats shave off around 400 lbs of weight. Is that enough to make a significant contribution in lowering costs and fuel consumption even more?

At the rate at which Americans are gaining weight, it probably doesn't matter (though perhaps in other countries it would).

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: neveragain
Posted 2012-11-12 16:50:29 and read 4129 times.

Quoting N62NA (Reply 26):
At the rate at which Americans are gaining weight, it probably doesn't matter (though perhaps in other countries it would).

Carrying fat people around in lighter seats versus regular seats generates the same 400-lb savings.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: Goldenshield
Posted 2012-11-12 17:32:24 and read 4132 times.

Quoting neveragain (Reply 27):
Quoting N62NA (Reply 26):
At the rate at which Americans are gaining weight, it probably doesn't matter (though perhaps in other countries it would).

Carrying fat people around in lighter seats versus regular seats generates the same 400-lb savings.

Exactly. The fuel burn different is pretty marginal, and on paper, it's the same. Though, I would suspect that the feds will be wanting to do another average here within the next decade.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: crj900lr
Posted 2012-11-12 17:44:33 and read 4141 times.

Quoting JBo (Reply 18):
AA probably was interested in the aircraft type but wasn't interested in contracting with Pinnacle/Colgan

Smart on their part, a good choice to stay as far away from Pinnicle/Colgan as possible. I know we couldnt wait until we could eliminate their name (Colgan) from our "family" of express carriers.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: KingAir200
Posted 2012-11-12 18:06:15 and read 4164 times.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 25):
IIRC, it was none other than OO that got the last CR2 delivered.

The last CRJ-200 delivered to an airline from the US was N602XJ, delivered to Mesaba in September of 2005.

[Edited 2012-11-12 18:06:46]

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: B727FA
Posted 2012-11-13 22:13:03 and read 4119 times.

Quoting neveragain (Reply 23):
I still can't get over the difference between the CR9 and the CR2--night and day, even though they have the same fuselage!

But now, instead of 50 people waiting for "pink tag" bags, you get nearly 80. THAT'S customer service for ya!

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: gcb5196
Posted 2012-11-14 10:54:56 and read 4078 times.

The next gen's have a larger overhead bin and will fit a little less than the "dead yak" people are packing these days. The sad thing is as far as my experience just about no one, including the people working the flight, knows that. I would tell the flight attendant that the plane is a next gen and I'm going to let the passengers keep their carry on's and then she nicely collected the carry on's inside the door, because they were to big, for me to put underneath. The bins will fit a 22 inch roller no problem granted it isn't exceeding it's design limits or one of the ones that doubles in size when it's expanded.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: CRJ900
Posted 2012-11-14 13:20:17 and read 4062 times.

Quoting gcb5196 (Reply 32):
The next gen's have a larger overhead bin and will fit a little less than the "dead yak" people are packing these days.
Quoting gcb5196 (Reply 32):
The bins will fit a 22 inch roller no problem granted it isn't exceeding it's design limits or one of the ones that doubles in size when it's expanded.

What about the "old gen" bins, can they carry small rollers in real life? BBD had pictures of the old bins with roller bags in them before revamping the website. There are quite a few old-gen CR9s flying in the US.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: OB1504
Posted 2012-11-14 21:05:58 and read 4032 times.

Quoting N62NA (Reply 15):
Up until November 15th of this year, American Eagle is still flying quite a few ATR props, and they've been doing it for years, so to have another prop pop up in the American Eagle fleet wouldn't be an unusual step at all.

November 15th is when the ATR 72 will leave MIA, but the type will remain in American Eagle service from SJU until April 1st.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: B727FA
Posted 2012-11-15 08:57:53 and read 4031 times.

OO and PSA crews put their 22" bags in the overhead. It's not that they WON'T fit, it's that they CAN'T fit all of them for everyone.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: Antoniemey
Posted 2012-11-16 00:29:51 and read 4013 times.

Quoting gcb5196 (Reply 32):
The bins will fit a 22 inch roller no problem granted it isn't exceeding it's design limits or one of the ones that doubles in size when it's expanded.

Many regionals are going to a "no carry on" policy, which means it doesn't matter if it fits, it's not going in the cabin. This gains available weight for the aircraft because they don't have to assume that every passenger has a 35lb carryon with them, just a personal item at whatever weight for that has been averaged out. So they're not getting hit twice for the 25 gate claim bags that won't fit on every flight.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: gcb5196
Posted 2012-11-16 07:40:43 and read 3991 times.

Good point, I know ASA had that policy when I used to work their flights. Not sure if that is how it is today with their merger.

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: CRJ900
Posted 2012-11-29 13:41:59 and read 3754 times.

Any chance of SkyWest (or Delta) asking BBD for a "CRJ905" or "CRJ900XR" (my bright idea) - a CRJ900 with one additional 31-inch fuselage frame ahead of the wings allowing four more seats and a larger centre fuel tank plus incorporating CRJ1000 wings, engines, and fly-by-wire rudder?

It might be easier to expand scope clauses to 79-80 seats from today's 76 than 90-100 seats. Then they can offer 15F+64Y=79 or 12F+68Y=80 seats. And 300-400kg more fuel will give a little extra range, allowing it to compete even more with Embraers upgraded E175.

Is this realistic or am I talking completely out of my ass?   An order for 50-60 such aircraft might make it worthwhile?

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: B727FA
Posted 2012-11-29 18:53:51 and read 3425 times.

PSA is a "no-carryon" airline. And they don't need to stretch the CRJ-900, DL already did, it's the RJ-2000 (aka) MD-8R/9K!

Topic: RE: SkyWest Airlines To Order More CRJ's?
Username: flightsimer
Posted 2012-11-29 19:04:11 and read 3388 times.

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 38):

Why not just take a -1000 and outfit it in a better cabin with the lower seat density? After all, the 705 was not a stretch of the -700, but a -900 with a -700 sized cabin installed.

[Edited 2012-11-29 19:05:39]


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