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Topic: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: kann123air
Posted 2012-11-27 17:50:27 and read 6541 times.

Thought ya'll might find this interesting. A picture from the October 2002 WorldTraveler from NW that I got flying MEM-ATL on a DC-9. I found it cool to see 727s, DC-10s, and all those other old aircraft here.

http://i1144.photobucket.com/albums/o484/kann123air/northwestfleet.jpg

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: FWAERJ
Posted 2012-11-27 17:57:09 and read 6522 times.

A year before the first A330 entered the fleet, before the NWA silver livery was introduced, and before the 727 exited scheduled service at NWA, to be exact.

My, how times have changed between the DL/NW merger and the NW fleet changes in between. Hey, at least we still have the DC-9s (for now)  

[Edited 2012-11-27 17:58:21]

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: FI642
Posted 2012-11-27 18:42:39 and read 6412 times.

NW was fun working for in the early 1990's. The day started with an A320, then a 727, another 727, an MD80, DC9-40, 757, then another A320, 727, then a DC9-50. Diversions were fun too..... who knows what would wander in!

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: asiantourist
Posted 2012-11-27 19:05:32 and read 6352 times.

That is awesome! Thank you for sharing it!

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: CalebWilliams
Posted 2012-11-27 19:10:51 and read 6324 times.

I wonder if I still have the June 2002 version from flying MSP-AMS-CPH then LGW-MSP. First leg was DC-10 (KM) and but the second DC-10 was NW. What a nice memory.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: PSU.DTW.SCE
Posted 2012-11-27 19:22:07 and read 6274 times.

Man, I think I have that page around somewhere too.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: Coronado
Posted 2012-11-27 19:36:30 and read 6218 times.

That sure was a hefty 747 fleet. 36 beautiful jumbos plus we can't forget the additional 8 or was it then 7 all silver 747 freighters at that time frame?

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: VC10DC10
Posted 2012-11-28 12:02:51 and read 5782 times.

Those were great times! I remember flying NWA that very month from SEA to MSP. During my SEA layover (I flew in on QX) I recall seeing a 742 departing for ICN (I think... otherwise it was NRT, of course) and a DC-10-30 headed to HNL.

On another note, I certainly didn't recall Northwest Airlink operating 85 Saabs!

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: FWAERJ
Posted 2012-11-28 12:36:39 and read 5701 times.

Quoting VC10DC10 (Reply 7):
On another note, I certainly didn't recall Northwest Airlink operating 85 Saabs!

At one time, both 9E and XJ operated SAABs, so the number may have been even higher than 85. Keep in mind that 9E retired all of theirs as their CRJs arrived, while XJ kept theirs until several years after after the DL merger.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: PSU.DTW.SCE
Posted 2012-11-28 12:59:46 and read 5660 times.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 8):

At one time, both 9E and XJ operated SAABs, so the number may have been even higher than 85. Keep in mind that 9E retired all of theirs as their CRJs arrived, while XJ kept theirs until several years after after the DL merger

I believed the number peaked at ~104 in 1998-2001.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: MSPNWA
Posted 2012-11-28 20:56:58 and read 5353 times.

Quoting Coronado (Reply 6):
That sure was a hefty 747 fleet. 36 beautiful jumbos plus we can't forget the additional 8 or was it then 7 all silver 747 freighters at that time frame?

Would have been 8 silver jumbo freighters at the time plus another four in special paint schemes.

So that would make 48 747s. Hard to imagine at this point.

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 9):
I believed the number peaked at ~104 in 1998-2001.

That is something I didn't realize. I knew they had at least 50-60 (the XJ birds), but not that many with 9E too.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: XFSUgimpLB41X
Posted 2012-11-28 21:00:58 and read 5338 times.

Prior to the horde of RJs allowed by the rape of scope in bankruptcy. Kind of sad, really.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: JBo
Posted 2012-11-28 22:11:27 and read 5261 times.

I love how awkward the CRJ and Saab artwork is; neither aircraft is a very accurate portrayal. In fact, the CRJ looks like they just took the Saab art and put engines on the rear and a T-tail on it.

Also, it's too bad the 727 never made it into the silver livery. It'd have looked gorgeous:

http://www.cardatabase.net/modifiedairlinerphotos/photos/big/00007765.jpg

[Edited 2012-11-28 22:21:39]

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: PSU.DTW.SCE
Posted 2012-11-28 22:12:02 and read 5264 times.

Here is November 2000:
This was still back in the hey-day; the DC-10, DC-9, and Saab 340 fleets were at their max.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: DeltaDC8
Posted 2012-11-29 08:00:28 and read 5078 times.

Its nice to see such a low number of CRJs and a high number of DC-9s. Those beautiful workhorses will always be nice than a CRJ.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: PSU.DTW.SCE
Posted 2012-11-29 08:07:11 and read 5063 times.

I know, its funny to see they only had 7 CRJs in 2000. Also funny to think that when NW first got the CRJ they were based in MEM.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: WA707atMSP
Posted 2012-11-29 08:31:42 and read 5011 times.

Quoting DeltaDC8 (Reply 14):
Its nice to see such a low number of CRJs and a high number of DC-9s. Those beautiful workhorses will always be nice than a CRJ.

Agreed.

It's gratifying that the DC-9 outlasted half of the other aircraft types on this page in NW / NW* / DL service.

The 747-200, DC-10, 727, Avro RJ 85, and Saab 340 are all gone, but the DC-9-50 is still with us. Now, if only the -50s would outlast the CRJ 100!

The DC-9 truly is the "DC-3 of the jet age"!

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: FWAERJ
Posted 2012-11-29 10:16:40 and read 4917 times.

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 15):
Also funny to think that when NW first got the CRJ they were based in MEM.

They were based at MEM first because 9E was the original CRJ operator for NW, and 9E is based in MEM.

XJ's CRJs (both CR2 and CR9) didn't come until 2004 or so, and XJ got the last CR2 for a North American customer.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: kann123air
Posted 2012-11-29 15:29:45 and read 4734 times.

Quoting asiantourist (Reply 3):
That is awesome! Thank you for sharing it!

You're welcome! Knew ya'll would like it.

Quoting JBo (Reply 12):
Also, it's too bad the 727 never made it into the silver livery. It'd have looked gorgeous:

That does look gorgeous!

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: NWADTWE16
Posted 2012-11-29 16:45:17 and read 4675 times.

That 727 looks so sweet..they were very well worn by the time they left though. The Avro's were such a disaster..i really dont know why we ordered them and they left quickly, after causing many maintenance delays...just a revamped BAE146 wasnt it?

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: PSU.DTW.SCE
Posted 2012-11-29 16:55:04 and read 4650 times.

The ARJ was ordered initially to be a DC-9-10 replacement. Due to scope reasons, partially what led to the 1998 pilots strike the ARJ was limited to 69 seats instead of an 85 seat single class layout. The ARJ was the first regional jet to have a 2-class cabin.

The ARJ was quirky, but was also a favorite by passengers. It had the highest ratio of F vs. Y seats so upgraded were plentiful (16 seats).

The ARJ also enabled NW to fly routes like MSP/MEM - ASE.

However NW decided to retain the DC-9-10s longer and did not take the additional 36 options on more ARJs (their economics were not that great, the downturn was coming, and the CRJ was all the rage).

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: DeltaDc8
Posted 2012-11-29 21:58:46 and read 4477 times.

Does anyone have a seat map for the ARJ? Or the rest of Northwests fleet for that matter?

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: xjramper
Posted 2012-11-30 00:09:04 and read 4425 times.

http://www.seatmaestro.com/airlines-...ating-maps/northwest-airlines.html

http://boardingarea.com/blogs/freque...t-map-northwest-airlines-dc-10-40/

Google really is your friend  

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: WA707atMSP
Posted 2012-11-30 08:24:20 and read 4281 times.

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 20):
The ARJ was quirky, but was also a favorite by passengers. It had the highest ratio of F vs. Y seats so upgraded were plentiful (16 seats).

I flew the Avros often when they were used on MSP-FNT. I thought their F seats were more comfortable than the F seats in any other NW narrowbody. Their economics were dismal, but you're right - they were great airplanes to fly on.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: FWAERJ
Posted 2012-11-30 11:20:31 and read 4207 times.

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 10):
So that would make 48 747s. Hard to imagine at this point.

For a while after deregulation (1982 or so), NW ran a newspaper ad to launch their "The World Is Going Our Way" ad campaign. In it was a line that NW owned more 747s than UA, AA, and TW combined.

Which would make sense. UA's 747 fleet was small prior to the purchase of PA's Pacific Division, AA had sold some 747s (famously including one to NASA) and converted others to freighters, and TW sold many of their 747s to Shah-era Iran in the late 1970s (right before the Islamic Revolution of 1979) to pay the bills.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: WA707atMSP
Posted 2012-11-30 11:51:11 and read 4304 times.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 24):
Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 10):
So that would make 48 747s. Hard to imagine at this point.

For a while after deregulation (1982 or so), NW ran a newspaper ad to launch their "The World Is Going Our Way" ad campaign. In it was a line that NW owned more 747s than UA, AA, and TW combined.

Which would make sense. UA's 747 fleet was small prior to the purchase of PA's Pacific Division, AA had sold some 747s (famously including one to NASA) and converted others to freighters, and TW sold many of their 747s to Shah-era Iran in the late 1970s (right before the Islamic Revolution of 1979) to pay the bills.

Around the same time, when NW management made presentations to Wall Street analysts, they would show two slides:

I. The number of NW vice presidents (very few) vs the # of PA vice presidents (a lot)
II. NW's balance sheet (almost no debt, lots of equity) vs PA's balance sheet (almost no equity, drowning in debt)

NW could just as easily have added a third slide, comparing NW's windowless headquarters at MSP to the Pan Am building, in lieu of slide I, and drive home the point just as well.

Which trans pacific airline did the Wall Street analysts think was a better investment after the presentation, NW or PA?

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: flyabr
Posted 2012-11-30 11:58:59 and read 4296 times.

Oh the good old days when you could make a connection in MSP and actually see some interesting metal! Those days are long gone...ugh!

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: NWADTWE16
Posted 2012-11-30 17:20:29 and read 4195 times.

Quoting flyabr (Reply 26):
Oh the good old days when you could make a connection in MSP and actually see some interesting metal! Those days are long gone...ugh!

DTW is the same bore!! Really missing those big Blue birds KL used to send it daily

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: treebeard787
Posted 2012-12-01 08:59:37 and read 4008 times.

Quoting flyabr (Reply 26):
Oh the good old days when you could make a connection in MSP and actually see some interesting metal! Those days are long gone...ugh!

I used to fly on NW DC-10s PHX-MSP all the time up until they were replaced by 757s on the route, you could always count on seeing something interesting at MSP, I remember seeing SY 727s, NW classics like DC-10s, 727s, 742s, DC-9s. There were tons of Saab 340s too, and that was before the A and B gates were built, you actually rode a small bus to the aircraft. I remember when KLM flew a 747 on AMS-MSP, that was always cool to see. Now a days there isn't much variety in MSP, lots of DL and RJ's. One memorable flight for me was my first DC-10-40 flight, I flew LAX-MSP and connected to MSP-BJI on a Saab 340A .I remember being served a tasty hot meal in economy to MSP and I got to visit the flight deck of the Saab 340.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: toltommy
Posted 2012-12-01 19:57:25 and read 3826 times.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 17):
XJ's CRJs (both CR2 and CR9) didn't come until 2004 or so, and XJ got the last CR2 for a North American customer.

The first CR2's arrived at Mesaba shortly before bankruptcy in 2005. The CR9's arrived after bankruptcy and the removal of the RJ85 in 2006.

Quoting kann123air (Thread starter):
A picture from the October 2002 WorldTraveler

The picture shows the 757 as both -200 and -300. I don't think the -300 arrived until 2004. The 727 is still there, so it's interesting to see the -300 was added to the magazine well before the plane arrived.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: flyabr
Posted 2012-12-01 20:16:12 and read 3803 times.

Quoting treebeard787 (Reply 28):
I used to fly on NW DC-10s PHX-MSP all the time up until they were replaced by 757s on the route, you could always count on seeing something interesting at MSP, I remember seeing SY 727s, NW classics like DC-10s, 727s, 742s, DC-9s. There were tons of Saab 340s too, and that was before the A and B gates were built, you actually rode a small bus to the aircraft. I remember when KLM flew a 747 on AMS-MSP, that was always cool to see. Now a days there isn't much variety in MSP, lots of DL and RJ's. One memorable flight for me was my first DC-10-40 flight, I flew LAX-MSP and connected to MSP-BJI on a Saab 340A .I remember being served a tasty hot meal in economy to MSP and I got to visit the flight deck of the Saab 340.

I remember a couple different domestic DC-10 flights. One was from PHX to MSP back in the late 90s. Another from MEM to MSP right around 9-11. Two of the smoothest flights I've ever been on.   I really miss the roar/rumble of those old JT8Ds on the DC-9...but even more so those on the 727!  
Quoting NWADTWE16 (Reply 27):
DTW is the same bore!! Really missing those big Blue birds KL used to send it daily

I do recall once seeing a KLM 744 at MSP, and also an MD-11. I'm pretty sure the KLM MD-11 was a rarer visit to MSP than the 744, but i'm not sure about that?

[Edited 2012-12-01 20:21:18]

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: WA707atMSP
Posted 2012-12-01 20:28:04 and read 3756 times.

Quoting toltommy (Reply 29):
Quoting kann123air (Thread starter):A picture from the October 2002 WorldTraveler
The picture shows the 757 as both -200 and -300. I don't think the -300 arrived until 2004. The 727 is still there, so it's interesting to see the -300 was added to the magazine well before the plane arrived.


The photo database has a picture of NW's first 757-351 departure in revenue service from MSP in July, 2002. So, it would have been in service at the time of the magazine.

The photo of the 1st revenue takeoff isn't sharp enough to show me, standing across the runway from the photographer on the top level of the parking deck watching the 757 take off. I remember that a few minutes before the takeoff, a DC-10-40 was towed from its gate on the G concourse toward NW's ex-North Central hangar complex along I-494; the transition from DC-10-40s to 757-300s had begun!

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: FWAERJ
Posted 2012-12-01 20:28:17 and read 3762 times.

Quoting toltommy (Reply 29):
The picture shows the 757 as both -200 and -300. I don't think the -300 arrived until 2004.

Per this Boeing press release, NW received their first 753 in July 2002: http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2002/q3/nr_020722i.html

NW went from the bowling shoe to the silver bullet livery late in 2003, coinciding with the first A330. NW received 753s from Boeing in both bowling shoe and silver bullet liveries (all, of course, are now in DL Onward & Upward livery).

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: flyabr
Posted 2012-12-01 20:44:27 and read 3739 times.

Can't help but wonder if DL wishes NW had ordered more of those 753s before production was ended? According to DL the 753 and A333 are the fleets most economical aircraft. I'm not sure if that was based on seat mile costs or what, but it was mentioned in the DL magazine sometime ago.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: jetblueguy22
Posted 2012-12-01 22:20:54 and read 3652 times.

Quoting JBo (Reply 12):
Also, it's too bad the 727 never made it into the silver livery. It'd have looked gorgeous:

There is something about a T-tail with that silver livery that looks amazing IMO.

Quoting flyabr (Reply 26):
Oh the good old days when you could make a connection in MSP and actually see some interesting metal! Those days are long gone...ugh!

You mean to tell me you don't like seeing CRJ after CRJ?!
Thanks for sharing this! I have a few NW mags stashed in a box somewhere back home. I always like flipping through them to see the good ol days when I dreamed of flying for them! It's all thanks to an A319 captain in BOS in Aug 2001 who infected me with the aviation bug and got me where I am today. I'll forever be grateful to NW for that.
It is interesting to see the RJ-85 in there. I always wanted to ride on one of those. I remember seeing one at LSE back before they retired them. I always thought the high wing was so cool. I'll never forget the agent giving a couple F seats to some soldiers who were headed back overseas. I thought it was so cool!
Blue

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: XFSUgimpLB41X
Posted 2012-12-01 23:15:29 and read 3622 times.

The ARJ sounded like a poltergeist was taking over the plane when the flaps extended!

I only rode on it once, but I'm sure glad I did.

Old and sometimes boutique airplanes come and go. It would be good to treasure the boutique MD-90 fleet that DL operates as well as the coming 717 fleet before it is gone!

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: Deltal1011man
Posted 2012-12-01 23:37:30 and read 3616 times.

Quoting flyabr (Reply 33):

CASM.

I think you would find that the 333 and 753 have the lowest CASM of most airlines that have them.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: treebeard787
Posted 2012-12-02 10:14:45 and read 3481 times.

Quoting XFSUgimpLB41X (Reply 35):
The ARJ sounded like a poltergeist was taking over the plane when the flaps extended!

I only rode on it once, but I'm sure glad I did.

I only flew on the type with NW one time from DFW-MSP just before they were retired, and it was one of my favorite flights simply because the RJ-85 was so unique, there was nothing else like it. The only other flight I did on a 146 was with Air Wisconsin-UA DEN-MSO in the early 2000s. It's too bad they weren't more successful in the US.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: SavannahMark
Posted 2012-12-02 11:09:09 and read 3441 times.

Definitely reminds me of a better time when aircraft exteriors were more than a couple of flashy stickers slapped over a base white paint job.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: FWAERJ
Posted 2012-12-02 14:44:54 and read 3334 times.

Quoting flyabr (Reply 33):
Can't help but wonder if DL wishes NW had ordered more of those 753s before production was ended? According to DL the 753 and A333 are the fleets most economical aircraft. I'm not sure if that was based on seat mile costs or what, but it was mentioned in the DL magazine sometime ago.

Back in the PMNW days, NW management said that it was a mistake that they didn't buy more 753s before 757 production ended.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: NWAdeicer
Posted 2012-12-02 18:44:55 and read 3188 times.

Damn I miss those days.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: MSPNWA
Posted 2012-12-02 18:56:21 and read 3176 times.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 32):
NW went from the bowling shoe to the silver bullet livery late in 2003, coinciding with the first A330.

That was in July, 2003, IIRC.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 32):
NW received 753s from Boeing in both bowling shoe and silver bullet liveries (all, of course, are now in DL Onward & Upward livery).

Yep, and to be exact, N581NW-N589NW were delivered in the Bowling Shoe. N590NW and on were delivered in the new colors.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: PSU.DTW.SCE
Posted 2012-12-02 19:59:31 and read 3133 times.

The first 753s arrived about a year before the first A330.

Quoting XFSUgimpLB41X (Reply 35):
The ARJ sounded like a poltergeist was taking over the plane when the flaps extended!

I only rode on it once, but I'm sure glad I did.

The "dinosaur roar"!

The ARJs were great. The first class seats were the same as on the 757 at the time. They were great on routes like DTW-OMA, DTW-DSM, etc.

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: KingAir200
Posted 2012-12-03 09:57:35 and read 2926 times.

Quoting NWADTWE16 (Reply 19):

Ah but they never needed an airstart!

Topic: RE: NWA Fleet From WorldTraveler-2002
Username: kann123air
Posted 2012-12-03 16:48:24 and read 2783 times.

Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 31):
So, it would have been in service at the time of the magazine.

Yes, and in that magazine there is a page about the "new" 757-300 in the fleet.


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