I can't believe they've added an extra two rows, even with the slimline seats the pitch should be quite a bit tighter...? The removal of the 3rd lav makes sense though. Although what is the "crew use only" that replaces it?



Also, Tiger is celebrating it's 5th anniversary with various promotional bits and pieces and is apparentl;y approaching their 10 millionth passenger flown.

http://australianaviation.com.au/2012/11/oneworld-qantas-a330-arrives/

Edited to post links and Tiger comment.

[Edited 2012-11-26 14:58:23]

Print from Airliners.net discussion forum
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/5617027/

Topic: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: QF175
Posted 2012-11-22 02:38:29 and read 25373 times.

G'day and welcome to the Australian Aviation Thread # 66. In the previous thread, the following points were discussed/raised:

* China Eastern Airlines makes surprise announcement - Cairns service to become year round in 2013
* Brisbane Airport RWY01/19 overlay works
* Brindabella Airlines announces it will base a J41 in Sydney
* Malaysia Airlines operates 747 and 330 charter flights through Rockhampton
* Emirates inaugurates Adelaide services
* Perth Airport redevelopment
* Air China to upgrade SYD services to 77W in December
* Second Sydney Airport talk
* Qantas to take delivery of a new A330 later this month which will feature a oneworld livery
* United Airlines services to Australia
* Korean Airlines confirms it will suspend Melbourne services in March 2013
* Jetgo takes delivery of its second ERJ 135
* Melbourne Airport passenger leakage to other Airports
* Qantas announces a $100m share buyback
* Emirates alludes to A380 services to Perth commencing 2013
* Brisbane storms and a spectacular photo of a lightning strike
* Brindabella Airlines to offer Sydney-Moree services from March 2013 (replacing QantasLink)
* REX successfully retained sole operation rights on its 8 subsidised intra-NSW routes
* Brisbane and tag on flights
* Qantas and its impending Dubai services
* Dixon and Co setting sights on a Qantas takeover
* Virgin Australia AGM and CEO John Borghetti's remuneration package
* Singapore Airlines and Virgin Australia announce codeshare expansion
* QF108 air turnback - LAX
* Melbourne Airport and its planned third runway
* Qantas aircraft now sporting the revised livery
* Perth set to receive Australia's first scheduled/regular 787 services (Qatar Airways)
* C-17 flyover of Brisbane and the Gold Coast
* Garuda Indonesia confirms Brisbane - Denpasar (Bali) and Jakarta services from August 2013

Australian Aviation Thread # 65

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: QF175
Posted 2012-11-22 02:56:03 and read 25392 times.

* Air New Zealand has confirmed a second season of nonstop flights between the Sunshine Coast (Maroochydore) and Auckland in response to high demand through this year's season. Services in 2013 will continue to operate twice weekly, however flights will operate for a period of 17 weeks (this year's flying program saw flights over a 12 week period)

* VH-ZPE, Virgin Australia's second E190 fitted with the new Business Class product re-entered service today. The Aircraft joins VH-ZPK as aircraft fitted with 6J class seats. VH-ZPA will have the reconfiguration carried out over the coming days

* QantasLink's first reconfigured 717-200 VH-NXH re-entered service today. The Aircraft features a new 125Y configuration along with:

Quote:
New ergonomically-designed seats will provide customers with increased levels of comfort featuring:
* A top-mounted magazine box to maximise legroom;
* An additional seat pocket ideal for the storage of personal electronic devices;
* An adjustable headrest; and
* A sliding tray table.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: xiaotung
Posted 2012-11-22 03:49:08 and read 25275 times.

No one seems to have picked up MU starting thrice weekly Beijing-Nanjing-Sydney route from 21 December.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-11-22 04:01:35 and read 25254 times.

Quoting xiaotung (Reply 2):

It's been discussed already Australian Aviation Thread # 65 (by QF175 Nov 5 2012 in Civil Aviation)

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Fuling
Posted 2012-11-23 02:21:27 and read 24748 times.

Quoting QF175 (Reply 1):
QantasLink's first reconfigured 717-200 VH-NXH re-entered service today. The Aircraft features a new 125Y configuration along with:

Are these new seats similar to what LH and a few other carriers have? Any photos out there?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-11-23 06:07:30 and read 24590 times.

Quoting Fuling (Reply 4):
Are these new seats similar to what LH and a few other carriers have? Any photos out there?

The photo's in the link below show the new configuration and also gives you an idea of what the slimline seats would look like on the B717 fleet...

http://www.ausbt.com.au/qantaslink-d...ng-717-slim-seats-but-more-of-them

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: QF762
Posted 2012-11-26 14:57:00 and read 24063 times.

From May next year Australian Aviation is reporting that QF will operate A330s on all weekday flights between PER and SYD/MEL. After searching a random week in June there were 7 daily (weekday) returns between SYD-PER and 8 daily (weekday) returns between MEL-PER all using a mix of A330 and B767 aircraft. I find it interesting that they said A330s only inteh article, but presumably meant wide-bodies only. (Which by then all the B767s should have the refreshed interiors).

Quoting EK413 (Reply 5):
The photo's in the link below show the new configuration and also gives you an idea of what the slimline seats would look like on the B717 fleet...
Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-11-26 15:11:58 and read 24035 times.

Quoting QF762 (Reply 6):
the pitch should be quite a bit tighter...

It would appear that they're adding one row each side of the wing. With the narrower seat backs and moving the magazine rack to the top of the seat I wouldn't expect the seat pitch to feel much different, no more than half an inch.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ditzyboy
Posted 2012-11-27 12:09:15 and read 23639 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 7):
It would appear that they're adding one row each side of the wing. With the narrower seat backs and moving the magazine rack to the top of the seat I wouldn't expect the seat pitch to feel much different, no more than half an inch.

The QantasLink/Impulse 717s with the ex-TWA slimline seats (VQF-K at the time) were converted to the Jetstar 125Y layout 6-8 weeks before the launch of Jetstar and no one noticed. At the time I remember thinking it felt as if it had the same level of comfort as the 73Hs.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: eaglefarm4
Posted 2012-11-27 16:07:18 and read 23511 times.

Hawaiian Airlines innaugral flight to BNE is on it's way this time.

N588HA appears to be the aircraft a 767-300 with winglets.

ETA BNE is 1540 local.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-11-28 00:51:01 and read 23248 times.

Quoting eaglefarm4 (Reply 9):
Hawaiian Airlines innaugral flight to BNE is on it's way this time.

Good news.

It will certainly be a big couple of months on the HNL routes with HA adding BNE and JQ adding MEL next month.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: QF175
Posted 2012-11-28 01:16:41 and read 23212 times.

Welcome to Brisbane Hawaiian Airlines!  

Nice to see an Airline on the route once again after Air Australia's demise in February of this year.

http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/12558_463658840362945_1887803813_n.jpg
Image source - BNE Airport Facebook page

http://sphotos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/465655_10151192983038505_1480433066_o.jpg
Image source - Hawaiian Airlines Facebook page

[Edited 2012-11-28 01:20:23]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-11-30 00:53:14 and read 22694 times.

Finally the 1st of 7 ex-BA B763 in the QF fleet is heading to the desert this month...

 

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZuluAlpha
Posted 2012-12-01 03:43:18 and read 22140 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 12):

Finally the 1st of 7 ex-BA B763 in the QF fleet is heading to the desert this month...

And the planned ex-BA B763 is VH-ZXB. It has a planned departure date from Australia on 11Dec12. at 0800hrs ex SYD flying to HNL with an overnight stop-over in HNL then the following morning to VCV to arrive into VCV on 12Dec to arrive into VCV @ 1420 hrs.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: TN486
Posted 2012-12-02 04:22:20 and read 21744 times.

Spending some time "spotting" on Flightradar24 this evening and noticed the QF44 AKL to SYD diverted to MEL earlier in the evening (lots of doughnuts in the sky around all flightpaths into SYD at that time).then noticed QF44 making a fastrun up to SYD, on approach down to 1800ft then a very quick climbout (time is now 2300 - curfew time!!), out to sea and currently at 24000 heading south again. Assuming Flightradar24 has got this tagged correctly, maybe some very unhappy guests on board, they still wont see SYD tonight. I suspect ac is back on its way to MEL.

[Edited 2012-12-02 04:23:16]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: TN486
Posted 2012-12-02 04:36:27 and read 21727 times.

Quoting TN486 (Reply 14):
Spending some time "spott

QF 44 arrived MEL 2111, dep for SYD approx 2200, missed curfew at SYD (2300) and now ETA MEL 0010. This curfew is an absolute farce! That ac got down to 1900 ft on approach to SYD!!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-02 05:19:28 and read 21695 times.

The QF44 ain't the only diversion... There was 2 other diversions tonight both to CBR...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: qf002
Posted 2012-12-02 08:56:36 and read 21595 times.

Quoting TN486 (Reply 14):
Quoting TN486 (Reply 15):
Quoting EK413 (Reply 16):

It's a shame that CBR can't take flights from AKL -- they would have easily made it into SYD had they diverted there instead.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-02 15:08:54 and read 21447 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 17):

I guess that raises the 2nd airport question yet again, why not grant CBR custom clearance etc for international diversions... In this scenario the flight was from AKL, aren't Australia and New Zealand flights proposed to be handled as domestic flights in the foreseeable future...?

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: SYDSpotter
Posted 2012-12-02 15:21:07 and read 21429 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 18):
In this scenario the flight was from AKL, aren't Australia and New Zealand flights proposed to be handled as domestic flights in the foreseeable future...?

Yes that was the plan, but nothing has come of it yet.

I think there needs to be a bit of commonsense applied to the curfew sometimes, to make an aircraft turn back when it is minutes away is stupidity. Some flexibility should be allowed, blatant breaches of course are another story.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-02 16:02:33 and read 21388 times.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 19):

Under last night circumstances the curfew rules could've been pushed aside & aircraft given clearance... The weather played a role in the diversions therefore clearance should've been granted considering the aircraft was minutes away from touchdown... It's an absolute joke...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ditzyboy
Posted 2012-12-02 16:26:01 and read 21359 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 17):
It's a shame that CBR can't take flights from AKL

Why do you say that?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-02 17:05:39 and read 21304 times.

Quoting Ditzyboy (Reply 21):
Why do you say that?

Because if it had departed from CBR it would have made it to SYD before 23:00 due to the shorter flight.

Also, even if it had overnighted they could just hirer a few buses and get people to SYD by 1 am, rather than have to overnight them in hotels.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-02 18:18:30 and read 21215 times.

Quoting Ditzyboy (Reply 21):

I believe he was pointing out how CBR can not accept International flights... I've been under the impression CBR was going to be converted into an Domestic / International airport if not already has been granted permission...
Didn't Obama or Princess Charles fly directly into CBR during their recent visit down under...?

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ditzyboy
Posted 2012-12-02 19:06:29 and read 21156 times.

Canberra has accepted international diversions before. I can think of a Qantas 747 a few years ago. Perhaps in this case they were not confident of being able to head back to Sydney for another go?

A Jetconnect 737 has diverted to East Sale, but that was due to a medical.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-02 19:48:54 and read 21282 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 23):
I've been under the impression CBR was going to be converted into an Domestic / International airport if not already has been granted permission...

CBR has had regularly scheduled flights to NAN before (not that they lasted long!) although I'm not sure how they were handled. CBR doesn't have a "sterile" international area (unless it's hiding behind a locked door) and even if you could separate domestic and international passengers by bussing them off the plane, I have no idea where they would do immigration and customs inspections.

Once the new terminal is fully operation there will be some swing gates that can handle international ops, but I am 99% certain that there aren't any right now.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 23):
Didn't Obama or Princess Charles fly directly into CBR during their recent visit down under...?

Obama, the Queen, and several other heads of state + our own government (I assume that CBP still applies to them?)

In this case I assume that, with all the organisation that goes into such a trip, that special provisions are made. After all, it isn't as though they have to line up with everyone else!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-02 20:18:27 and read 21254 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 25):
Once the new terminal is fully operation there will be some swing gates that can handle international ops, but I am 99% certain that there aren't any right now.

Any indication as to when the NEW terminal will become operational...? I love the design, sleek & modern...

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 25):
In this case I assume that, with all the organisation that goes into such a trip, that special provisions are made. After all, it isn't as though they have to line up with everyone else!

What makes them any different from you and me  Just because they get to fly around on a luxury jet liner & in Obama case a 7 star hotel...
The more I think about it I believe CBR wasn't able to handle international flights due to the length of the runway which has since been extended...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: qf002
Posted 2012-12-02 20:44:19 and read 21457 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 18):
aren't Australia and New Zealand flights proposed to be handled as domestic flights in the foreseeable future...?

What is happening with that? It makes so much sense, even if they just agreed on some kind of pre-clearance system that would allow passengers to arrive domestic arrivals (ie US-Canada style).

Quoting Ditzyboy (Reply 24):
Perhaps in this case they were not confident of being able to head back to Sydney for another go?

Likely, and hence why CBR wasn't an option. But if CBR did have the necessary facilities to process international arrivals then it would likely be favoured over MEL in a similar situation in the future.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 25):
In this case I assume that, with all the organisation that goes into such a trip, that special provisions are made. After all, it isn't as though they have to line up with everyone else!

They'll be covered by the same procedures that apply to the senior government officials and military personnel who fly in/out of CBR on government aircraft. It's not just the public figures, but also the vast numer of people travelling with them who are also entering the country.

What form this takes, I'm not sure. The facilities are probably part of the military side of the airport, and they wouldn't need much to process VIPs very quickly on their plane/as they leave the airport (just a laptop and passport scanner for immigration and a pair of gloves for customs).

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-02 20:50:01 and read 21451 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 25):
Obama, the Queen, and several other heads of state + our own government (I assume that CBP still applies to them?)

Further to my own post, these flight technically go to RAAF Fairbairn rather than Canberra International Airport. I realise that this is a technicality, but they aren't "normal" flights and I'm pretty sure that lends itself special circumstances.

I know from standing on the ramp at Fairbairn that day, when the media parade came in for the Obama trip (in the form of a DL 767, quite a sight at CBR!) "quarantine" involved one sniffer dog and not much else. I didn't see what they did with passports, however.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-02 20:59:05 and read 21448 times.

On a far more serious note the rules and regulations surrounding the curfew @ SYD need reviewing... Why are airlines & their passengers being inconvenienced due to weather...? Is it so difficult to give the carrier special clearance taking the above factors into account...
The SYD curfew is ridiculous!

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ditzyboy
Posted 2012-12-02 21:06:40 and read 21448 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 29):
Is it so difficult to give the carrier special clearance taking the above factors into account...

I have worked flights in the past where we have landed after 2300 due to a lifting of the curfew where it was due to weather and all carriers had been affected. I can think of at least two occasions, but both were a few years ago. Perhaps the government is stricter for political reasons? Does anyone know when the last time such exemptions were granted?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-02 21:10:49 and read 21441 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 27):
What is happening with that? It makes so much sense

I believe the biggest issue is quarantine, both countries are paranoid about what unsavoury things may end up there. This even applies to Trans-Tasman, NZ doesn't want fire ants for example.

One solution might be to do what the US does from HI and SJU to the mainland: quarantine inspection before checkin. While it is technically a domestic flight and therefore no customs, you put you cases through a scanner (like arriving in Aus/NZ) before going to the bagdrop. I realise that this sounds cumbersome (having a separate section of the domestic check-in for NZ departures) but it would be a lot easier to facilitate than the US-Ca set-up

Another issue is immigration: I believe that Australia is concerned about people applying for NZ visas (more often than not easier to get) and then hopping across the ditch.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 27):
even if they just agreed on some kind of pre-clearance system that would allow passengers to arrive domestic arrivals (ie US-Canada style)

Realistically this might be the best we get, although I'm not sure that it would be economically viable. Both my parents have at separate times this year pre-cleared in Canada and raved about how quick it is, but it is a cumbersome set-up and takes up valuable terminal space, not to mention the cost of employing people to man it.

(As an aside, my mum says she might connect in YVR rather than LAX in future, she did it once out of necessity but couldn't believe how painless it was in comparison. Yes, even with having to go through CBP twice!)

[Edited 2012-12-02 21:33:47]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-02 21:30:36 and read 21412 times.

Quoting Ditzyboy (Reply 30):

I recall this happening on a few occasions too and the airlines have been fined to top it off, from memory CZ, CX, EK just to name a few while QF opted to reschedule the QF21 to depart the following morning....

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Quokkas
Posted 2012-12-02 21:44:38 and read 21395 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 25):
After all, it isn't as though they have to line up with everyone else!

In the case of the Queen that is just as well. As HM doesn't have a passport she would be immediately arrested for trying to enter the country without proper travel documents. Imagine, she thinks she coming to Australia and ends up in Nauru. 

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-02 21:52:41 and read 21362 times.

Quoting Quokkas (Reply 33):

Well hopefully she never decides to cruise down on the Queen Mary, that would surely make her "irregular maritime arrival"  

Of course, the Queen aside, these people have Diplomatic Passports so immigration will be a mere formality anyway.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sydscott
Posted 2012-12-02 22:24:37 and read 21360 times.

Quoting TN486 (Reply 14):
on approach down to 1800ft then a very quick climbout (time is now 2300 - curfew time!!), out to sea and currently at 24000 heading south again

I was in the taxi line at the QF domestic terminal at 2300 and saw a 737 flying low over the airport on a right hand turn out to sea. Was wondering what was going on.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-02 22:49:42 and read 21286 times.

Quoting sydscott (Reply 35):

That would've been an impressive sighting too, however not from a passenger perspective onboard the flight executing the go around...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ditzyboy
Posted 2012-12-02 23:27:03 and read 21226 times.

Quoting sydscott (Reply 35):
I was in the taxi line at the QF domestic terminal at 2300 and saw a 737 flying low over the airport on a right hand turn out to sea.

The aircraft would have been making more noise than if it had just gone ahead and landed. Ludicrous!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-02 23:56:45 and read 21192 times.

Quoting Ditzyboy (Reply 37):

Politicians and their curfew policy can go jump as far as I am concerned!

Clearance to land should've been granted...

EK413

[Edited 2012-12-02 23:57:30]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: a36001
Posted 2012-12-03 00:29:25 and read 21193 times.

It must of been tempting for the crew to gun the throttles and make as much noise as they could on climb out! I would of.....HA and I live in Newtown!  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: QF762
Posted 2012-12-03 01:19:28 and read 21163 times.

Quoting QF175 (Reply 11):

Isn't 9 cabin crew quite a lot for an international B767-300ER flight? I remember on my AC flight to HNL from SYD back in 2006 there were 7 cabin crew I believe. (Or did HA just have more crew on the inaugural flight to ensure things went smoothly?)

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-03 02:00:07 and read 21041 times.

Quoting QF762 (Reply 40):

Correct, it's usually 3 tech crew and 7 cabin but probably course the flight was the inaugural HA operated with 9 crew... Qantas did the same with the introduction of the OOL services providing 2 additional crew to provide assistance and training etc...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: TN486
Posted 2012-12-03 02:37:14 and read 20983 times.

Quoting a36001 (Reply 39):
It must of been tempting for the crew to gun the throttles and make as much noise as they could on climb out! I would of.....HA and I live in Newtown!

The climbout was in fact fast AND steep, so you may not be Robinson Crusoe in your thinking.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-03 04:29:51 and read 20842 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 26):

Well I thought I'd dig up the status of the CBR terminal works...

Source http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=349537&page=29

$420 million airport project inches past 70 per cent completion
Shaped like a stingray the size of Woden Plaza, Canberra Airport's new $420 million terminal is 70 per cent complete.
Since 2008 an estimated three million passengers a year have passed through the terminal re-construction site unaware
of the cutting edge infrastructure being installed under their feet. In a warren of halls and rooms below and besides the
public areas a gas-fired tri-generation power station, long banks of switch boards and 22 kilometres of cabling layered on trays keep the place heated, cooled and operational as a high security facility.
A back-up diesel plant with enough capacity to run 90 per cent of the airport for four days is in place should the power station, or main grid fail. As well, a bank of batteries sits on standby, able to power essential functions such as security for hours on end if the diesel option is lost.The western concourse will mirror the southern concourse terminal which was completed in 2010 and occupied by Qantas. An eye-popping 28m-high atrium will separate the two concourses.
Virgin Airlines remains in the old terminal, which is being dismantled in stages, and will move into the western concourse once it's completed. The new terminal will have capacity for more carriers, international travellers and associated services such as Customs.
Construction Control senior project manager Ross Cleaver said staging of aircraft parking, passenger and vehicle access and parking, taxi services, rental cars and keeping all of the services and utilities going while replacing everything in the precinct had been one of the main challenges.
"It's like a game of chess, getting access to these areas," Mr Cleaver said while walking across new sections of the airport apron.
"And I'm not good at chess," he added. More than 80,000 square metres of new apron is replacing 30-year-old, heavily patched bitumen. Parked planes put the heaviest stress on the apron, and stand on 400mm thick concrete with heavier aggregate to handle the load. Crane working heights are limited at various points around the precinct and aren't allowed to operate in fog as Canberra's biggest privately-funded infrastructure project inches forward. Mr Cleaver said all the heavy lifting for the atrium, including the installation of 17 tonne steel beams and nine-metre long glass panels, had been completed. Apron works, including the demolition of the remaining old terminal should be finished in November next year.

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-03 09:01:39 and read 20721 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 43):
the size of Woden Plaza

Is that it? Woden Plaza feels pretty cramped inside, so doesn't inspire me with much confidence!

That said, everything we've seen so far has been excellent, so I am looking forward to its completion.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 43):
An eye-popping 28m-high atrium will separate the two concourses.

I'm looking forward to seeing this!

Quoting EK413 (Reply 43):
the demolition of the remaining old terminal should be finished in November next year.

Interesting, that's good to know.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 43):
Virgin Airlines remains in the old terminal

And who might they be precisely    

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sydscott
Posted 2012-12-03 13:42:00 and read 20614 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 36):
That would've been an impressive sighting too, however not from a passenger perspective onboard the flight executing the go around...

I actually thought it was a missed approach it was so low. I would have been pissed if I was a passenger on there!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-03 15:12:23 and read 20527 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 44):

Over all the terminal design is nice and sleek... I love it... Wish SYD could have a similar terminal, however on a larger scale...


Quoting sydscott (Reply 45):

That would make 2 of us especially if I was looking forward to getting home after a weekend away... Really p#ssed!

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: NZ107
Posted 2012-12-03 15:17:35 and read 20524 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 31):
quarantine inspection before checkin.

Wouldn't work - one could easily pick up an apple (could be fresh or could be rotten and have fruit flies) or other such items in the lounge/in the terminal/on the plane and take that across the border. The only effective way is after landing.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: SYDSpotter
Posted 2012-12-03 17:20:47 and read 20443 times.

There is an article in today's SMH outlining the growing Intl presence on Virgin's share registry:

http://www.smh.com.au/business/airli...-virgin-stakes-20121203-2ar24.html

Would Foreign ownership limits be impacted should SQ and EY want to increase their stake up to 20% each?

Certainly interesting times ahead, having 3 different foreign airlines on board is a juggling act to say the least, especially as not all 3 have the same underlying interests. Of particular interest is the dynamic between EY & SQ, unless EY and SQ are eyeing a closer relationship, there is a bit of a conflict with VA putting their code on both EY and SQ services (some of which will inevitably overlap).

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: tullamarine
Posted 2012-12-03 19:53:54 and read 20275 times.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 48):
Would Foreign ownership limits be impacted should SQ and EY want to increase their stake up to 20% each?

No, following the restructure of the VA companies, the listed company only covers the domestic airline and that is not subject to foreign ownership limits. There is a 20% limit under takeover laws which is why they all sit at no more than 20%.

Assuming SQ and EY want to move to 20%, it will be interesting to see if VAH issue more shares so as to improve cash on hand or the foreign airlines buy on-market which should give the existing general shareholders a bit of a hike in their share price. It is important to remember that a lot of VAH's "mum and dad" shareholders didn't actually buy shares in Virgin. They were given them when Toll divested its share so a lot of them (me included) would be happy to sell if the price was OK.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: gemuser
Posted 2012-12-03 20:28:56 and read 20245 times.

Quoting tullamarine (Reply 49):
No, following the restructure of the VA companies, the listed company only covers the domestic airline and that is not subject to foreign ownership limits.

OK, WHAT RESTRUCTURE? I've asked this before but got no answer. People keep referring to this, BUT I have seen nothing on it! (I could have easily missed it if it happened since 1/9/12).
Could somebody please supply a link?

Gemuser

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-03 21:34:37 and read 20200 times.

Quoting gemuser (Reply 50):
OK, WHAT RESTRUCTURE?

Virgin Australia Holdings has split into two separate corporate bodies, each with an individual legal personality: Virgin Australia Holdings and Virgin Australia International Holdings. The former operates domestic flights within Australia under the Virgin Australia brand, while the latter operates international under that same brand.

The purpose of this was to allow further foreign investment in VAH. Australian airlines that operate international flights must be majority Australian owned, while airlines that only operate domestic flights can be 100% foreign owned. Therefore, because Virgin Australia Holdings only operates domestic flights it can attract as much foreign investment as it likes.

That's how much I know. I have no idea how these two separate corporate bodies are linked, and who owns VAIH.

http://centreforaviation.com/analysi...ow-further-foreign-ownership-68720

[Edited 2012-12-03 22:29:10]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: gemuser
Posted 2012-12-03 21:44:03 and read 20200 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 51):
Virgin Australia Holdings has split into two separate corporate bodies

Thank you! At least that's something.

Gemuser

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-03 22:40:32 and read 20134 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 51):
Quoting gemuser (Reply 52):

Let's not forget this is why QF ain't happy... The flexibility VA have over QF...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sydscott
Posted 2012-12-04 13:34:24 and read 19746 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 53):
Let's not forget this is why QF ain't happy... The flexibility VA have over QF...

And because they can't do the same because of the Qantas Sale Act. Otherwise I'm sure QF would re-structure to drive their share price higher.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: BonzoLab
Posted 2012-12-04 18:27:12 and read 19600 times.

Hi all can anyone tell me why QF121 SYD-ZQN diverted to NZCH on Dec 5th? Cheers

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Zkpilot
Posted 2012-12-04 20:01:40 and read 19518 times.

Whats the deal with arrivals landside at MEL? It went from being alright to being a complete shambles now. Absolutely no room to move about inside the international arrivals landside area...crowded very bad design! and only 2 exits (each end which you can't get to because of the congestion!) the exits in front are now only emergency exits! ridiculous!
and to get across the road there are only 2 crossings (neither of which is convenient). Is this going to change?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-04 20:45:22 and read 19486 times.

Quoting BonzoLab (Reply 55):

I believe it diverted due to navigational equipment...

On a positive note Saturday's QF3 SYD-HNL service has been upgraded from B763 to an A333...
Anyone booked on the flight will be impressed with the equipment upgrade when compared with the aged B763...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sydscott
Posted 2012-12-04 22:07:59 and read 19401 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 57):
On a positive note Saturday's QF3 SYD-HNL service has been upgraded from B763 to an A333...

I wonder if we will see this more often on this route over the Dec/Jan peak travel period.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-04 22:11:35 and read 19411 times.

Quoting sydscott (Reply 58):

Quoting EK413 (Reply 57):
On a positive note Saturday's QF3 SYD-HNL service has been upgraded from B763 to an A333...

I wonder if we will see this more often on this route over the Dec/Jan peak travel period.

I hope it's a permanent upgrade to be honest... It's great to see the QF A333 on the Honolulu route & probably should add the QF583 has been downgraded to a B73H...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: qf002
Posted 2012-12-04 23:01:54 and read 19334 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 31):
Realistically this might be the best we get, although I'm not sure that it would be economically viable

Checked luggage can be screened for customs clearance very easily (ie the same sort of thing as bags that connect onto domestic flights and just get churned out on the domestic carousel), and a checkpoint at the gate could be used to screen hand luggage and do the necessary passport checks.

I think the volume is there to justify the cost, but it definitely requires a lot of consideration and work.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 47):

If there was a check of hand luggage at the gate (at the same time as checking passports), then it would be difficult to get anything through. The only risk would then be food from the plane, which could be managed quite easily.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 57):
On a positive note Saturday's QF3 SYD-HNL service has been upgraded from B763 to an A333...
Anyone booked on the flight will be impressed with the equipment upgrade when compared with the aged B763...

There was an additional rotation in September operated by an A333 as well (linked to a charter I think). Any idea why the upgrade?

Quoting sydscott (Reply 58):
I wonder if we will see this more often on this route over the Dec/Jan peak travel period.

Not likely. The peak for HNL traffic is in our autumn/winter (which is why you see QF/JQ go to double daily in April, along with HA's extra 3 weekly flights).

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: bjwonline
Posted 2012-12-04 23:41:55 and read 19319 times.

QF News boasts that from May next year all SYD-PER and MEL-PER flights will be on A330. Obviously the news releases sells it as something amazing but I was thinking, does this mean the end of 744 flights to the west cost?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-05 01:39:11 and read 19172 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 60):

Definitely not a charter Saturday's upgrade is a scheduled QF3 opposed to September which I believe operated as QF6003 (I can't recall exact flight number for JQ charters)...
I wish QF would bring back a few B743's & throw it back on the route to give it that Hawaii vacation feel once the B763 is made redundant...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: SYDSpotter
Posted 2012-12-05 02:01:55 and read 19150 times.

Quoting bjwonline (Reply 61):
QF News boasts that from May next year all SYD-PER and MEL-PER flights will be on A330. Obviously the news releases sells it as something amazing but I was thinking, does this mean the end of 744 flights to the west cost?

Yes I guess so, no more 747's and no more 738's either which will be a relief to most people (I travelled in the middle seat in a 738 to Perth a while ago from SYD and it wasn't much fun!!). Although the press release mentions weekdays only, so the 737's and 747's will still be there on weekends. But a significant increase in capacity and product over the 767's and 737's.

I'm guessing it will be a mix of 332's and 333's (both in domestic and intl config)?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sydscott
Posted 2012-12-05 14:41:42 and read 18872 times.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 63):
I'm guessing it will be a mix of 332's and 333's (both in domestic and intl config)?

The press release states that with the delivery of the newest A332, QF have 9 A330's flying domestically. That's 5 in domestic config and the other 4 would be in international config. I find that interesting considering QF's re-focus on Asia should, and I stress should, mean that they would need further A330 capacity for point to point routes into Asia. It's also interesting to note that there schedules also don't show every flight being an A330 as yet.

Frankly I was hoping they'd keep some 767's on there with the new IPAD IFE system.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: MilesDependent
Posted 2012-12-05 18:12:42 and read 18740 times.

Just wondering... Do the QF tech and cabin crew who fly domestic 332s also operate the 332 international sectors? Or do QF have separate short and long haul crews for their 330 ops?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-05 20:21:53 and read 18634 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 60):
Checked luggage can be screened for customs clearance very easily (ie the same sort of thing as bags that connect onto domestic flights and just get churned out on the domestic carousel), and a checkpoint at the gate could be used to screen hand luggage and do the necessary passport checks.

I think that you are describing the Hawaii model I referred to. I agree that, if workable, this would be best.

UA-CA style pre-clearance, however, would require a major redesign of Australian (and New Zealand) airport terminals. Once pre-cleared, passengers have to be kept totally segregated from domestic and international passengers, as they are legally in the USA not Canada. This means that you need, in effect, a whole different terminal, or sub-terminal, to handle pre-clearance. Go luck at the maps of some Canadian airports, it is a far from efficient setup.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 60):
If there was a check of hand luggage at the gate

This is possible, but it would slow boarding. Especially on the NZ, DJ and JQ narrowbody turns, this could significantly increase turn times. When I flew UIO-MIA there was a handbagage search at the gate, but they started boarding a 757 (188 seats, 11 more than a JQ A320) an hour before departure so that we could get away on time. This was with three bag search stations.

Quoting MilesDependent (Reply 65):
Do the QF tech and cabin crew who fly domestic 332s also operate the 332 international sectors? Or do QF have separate short and long haul crews for their 330 ops?

For pilots, it is one work group. The same pilot can fly BNE-HKG and MEL-PER (The same applies to the 767 fleet: it might be SYD-MEL one day and SYD-HNL the next)

For flight attendants there are [basically] three work groups: Domestic (737, 767, A330), International (767, A330, 747) and QCCA (A380).

The domestic crew can (and do) fly any flight up to 10 hours. For example, ADL-SIN is almost always staffed by the ADL base rather than International crews. Basically any A330 flight to Asia is fair game to be crewed by Domestic, but I have no idea how they decide which groups get which routes on which days. Domestic crews cannot, however, work the HNL flight because all crews operating to the USA need a US visa (I know, ridiculous) and only International and QCCA have these.

[Edited 2012-12-05 20:25:04]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: thegeek
Posted 2012-12-05 22:33:29 and read 18537 times.

Didn't know there was an ADL base. Is it new? I presume cabin crew only.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ditzyboy
Posted 2012-12-05 23:10:44 and read 18520 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 66):
The domestic crew can (and do) fly any flight up to 10 hours.

You are quite close. SH cabin crew can be rostered up to 14 hours total planned/rostered duty time on regional international trips. Noumea, NZ, Denpasar and Perth-Jakarta were originally included, but reverted back to domestic rules. As you say, the company has the flexibility to use SH cabin crew in all of Asia. The unions more recently have agreed on giving LH a much larger share of the flying. In determining the ratio, East Coast - Perth A330 is considered in tandem with Asia flying for this purpose. Back in 2003 Qantas wanted to give 100% of A330 flying to SH cabin crew. The LH union had to lobby aggressively to get some of the flying. In the end, LH cabin crew agreed to a reduction in slip times and rest at home after these patterns (although the LH definition of these patterns is slightly different) in order to increase their share of the flying. It would seem that this was an industrial strategy to reduce costs from the start.

I am back at SH now and miss the variety that existed when we did the Asia flying. That said, I always felt that the intention behind giving SH the flying was to direct leave onto LH cabin crew (who now had less work) and reduce costs. Once this was achieved, the flying went back to its rightful owners.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 62):
Definitely not a charter Saturday's upgrade is a scheduled QF3 opposed to September which I believe operated as QF6003 (I can't recall exact flight number for JQ charters)...

There was a scheduled flight in each direction, to accommodate a charter for a large company. QF84 HNL-SYD and QF83 SYD-HNL a few days later.

http://airlineroute.net/2012/09/06/qf-hnl-sep12/

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: skyhawkmatthew
Posted 2012-12-05 23:47:30 and read 18468 times.

At about 3:50 this afternoon I saw a completely white A340 on final for 16R in Sydney. Does anyone know what this aircraft is/what it was doing?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2012-12-05 23:59:54 and read 18465 times.

HiFly A340 CS-TQM, leased by Adagold for Australian Govt. military charters. Usual routing 2x/week is BNE-SYD-DRW-Minhad Aif Force Base in Dubai. The majority of contracted cabin crew are DRW based. Eventually the RAAF A330 MRTT tankers will probably take over this role.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-06 00:52:38 and read 18369 times.

Quoting Ditzyboy (Reply 68):

Cheers... Would appear the A333 has replaced the regular B763 due to the 1st B763 under going Q Stream fit out...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: VH-BZF
Posted 2012-12-06 01:22:34 and read 18308 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 62):

Don't forget the Hawaii marathon is on as well so this may have generated some additional pax? Great to see the A330 across the pacific in QF colours!

BZF

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-06 02:23:53 and read 18230 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 71):

International B763 (typo)

Quoting VH-BZF (Reply 72):

I hope it's a permanent sub once the B763 fleet refurbishment is complete...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: skyhawkmatthew
Posted 2012-12-06 02:23:59 and read 18225 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 70):

Thanks! Thought it must have been something like that.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: thegeek
Posted 2012-12-06 17:29:21 and read 18015 times.

BITRE stats for Sep:
SYD->DFW 10289, 94% LF
DFW->BNE 5049
DFW->SYD 2767

72% LF westbound ignoring blocked seats.

Can they get a month with 99% LF eastbound?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-06 19:19:44 and read 17901 times.

Quoting Ditzyboy (Reply 68):
In the end, LH cabin crew agreed to a reduction in slip times and rest at home after these patterns (although the LH definition of these patterns is slightly different) in order to increase their share of the flying. It would seem that this was an industrial strategy to reduce costs from the start.

Thanks for that, I didn't realise that SH could fly up to 14 hour segments.

From what you say I take it that SH are now operating a lot less Asia flying than in the past? Other than ADL-SIN, are there any other routes that they do operate, or is it all LH now?

Quoting thegeek (Reply 67):
Didn't know there was an ADL base

It was opened in December 2010.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 75):
94% LF

That's exceptional! Especially in a shoulder season.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 75):
DFW->BNE 5049
DFW->SYD 2767

These numbers are really fascinating, since it appears that QF are carrying less and less traffic from DFW to SYD.

I remember reading on these threads over the past 18 months that "almost half", then "half", then "the majority" of the traffic was leaving QF8 in BNE, and it's now down to 2/3.

Obviously this doesn't mean that BNE is their final destination, and it suggests that they are carrying a lot of connecting traffic as the slight decrease in convenience connecting at BNE is more than compensated by the convenience of connecting at DFW.

Nonetheless it would appear that the SYD originating traffic has collectively decided to shun this flight and continue to go via LAX.

I'm flying QF8 DFW-BNE when I go home for Christmas, and I'm really looking forward to it! It should be a good flight

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ditzyboy
Posted 2012-12-06 22:14:53 and read 17830 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 76):
I didn't realise that SH could fly up to 14 hour segments.

The 14 hours is inclusive of sign on/report and sign off/release times. 12.5 hours would be the longest block time.


Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 76):
Other than ADL-SIN, are there any other routes that they do operate, or is it all LH now?

ADL-SIN appears to be going back to LH after mid Jan. That will leave SH with SYD-CHC/ZQN/NOU 737 flying.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: thegeek
Posted 2012-12-06 23:05:47 and read 17783 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 76):
94% LF

That's exceptional! Especially in a shoulder season.

Unsurprising if you ask me.

I always thought the decision to defer the 13th and 14th A380s was incomprehensible, and still do. Similarly sticking with the idea of using 787s on SYD-DFW. BNE-DFW may be different, and may withstand a JQ service.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 76):
These numbers are really fascinating, since it appears that QF are carrying less and less traffic from DFW to SYD.

Hmm, July figure was 2882. Nice observation. Which is another reason why QF needs the A380s on SYD-DFW. The asymetric passenger flows have to be harming it's revenue/flight, as compared to what they would be if they could fly DFW->SYD non stop.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-06 23:36:40 and read 17769 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 78):
Similarly sticking with the idea of using 787s on SYD-DFW. BNE-DFW may be different, and may withstand a JQ service.

If SYD-DFW was operated by 787s, then BNE will definitely be mainline. The 94% load factor says it all. While the BNE-DFW O&D market is probably tiny, BNE-DFW would be designed for feed from MEL, PER, ADL, CNS, CBR etc just as QF7 is now.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 78):
Which is another reason why QF needs the A380s on SYD-DFW.

I thought that the eventual consensus was that the A380 would still struggle to make DFW-SYD non-stop.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-06 23:38:36 and read 17752 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 78):
may withstand a JQ service.

Further to my last post, JQ will never fly to DFW. The whole point of the service is QF-AA connections.

If you take that out of the equation, then I sincerely doubt that even SYD-DFW could support JQ given the size of the Australia-Texas market.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZuluAlpha
Posted 2012-12-07 01:54:46 and read 17610 times.

Can someone help me here .. when are QF due their next A380's. Something in the back of my mind tells me the end of 2013 ?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: QF15
Posted 2012-12-07 02:13:54 and read 17596 times.

Quoting ZuluAlpha (Reply 81):
Can someone help me here .. when are QF due their next A380's. Something in the back of my mind tells me the end of 2013 ?

The next two A380's are due 2016-17, then the last six are due from 2018-19 onwards, subject to change of course...

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sunrisevalley
Posted 2012-12-07 10:56:09 and read 17374 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 79):
thought that the eventual consensus was that the A380 would still struggle to make DFW-SYD non-stop.

On a 16hr sector time day the 569t / 293t DOW is good for max passenger load . The 450-seat version would allow for some freight. But at 75% load factor for the 747-400ER there seems to be a need for the market to develop some more.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: thegeek
Posted 2012-12-07 14:20:14 and read 17258 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 80):
JQ will never fly to DFW. The whole point of the service is QF-AA connections.

Good point. I was thinking that would be provided, but if they don't want to do that, they would probably rather channel BNE people via LAX and others via the SYD-DFW flight, or continue the 744ER on BNE-DFW. 789 isn't coming to QF for a long time.

Quoting QF15 (Reply 82):
The next two A380's are due 2016-17

Deferred from 2013. These aircraft were also more capable than the 569t versions IIRC.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-07 14:24:36 and read 17266 times.

Speaking of A380's last night's EK413 SYD-DXB service was cancelled... Any idea what happened...?

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: SYDSpotter
Posted 2012-12-07 15:39:12 and read 17162 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 85):
Speaking of A380's last night's EK413 SYD-DXB service was cancelled... Any idea what happened...?

Probably some sort of tech issue. Flight is rescheduled for 2pm today.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-07 17:47:15 and read 17070 times.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 86):

Is this the same A380 involved in the engine failure a few weeks ago...?

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: qf002
Posted 2012-12-07 18:53:15 and read 17001 times.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 63):
747's

I doubt it. Sundays are already operated with a 767 and there seems little point in retaining one aircraft that is so vastly different to the rest of the fleet for a single weekly flight.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 66):

I don't deny that the are a number of issues to work through, but I do think its worth working towards a solution... But given that the existing system isn't really all that bad, I doubt that we'll see it happen any time soon.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 78):
I always thought the decision to defer the 13th and 14th A380s was incomprehensible, and still do. Similarly sticking with the idea of using 787s on SYD-DFW.

But these figures could be seen to show that the A380 is not the right aircraft for the route out of SYD. It's far cheaper for QF to channel connecting traffic through BNE (because the long haul sector is so much shorter) and just run the more expensive SYD flights for traffic in SYD/NSW.

In that scenario, two daily 787s makes a lot of sense to me. SYD-DFW will easily fill a dedicated daily 270 seat flight (given the number rof passengers already SYD-bound, plus the boost that going nonstop would provide), and BNE can handle the majority of the connecting traffic.

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 83):
But at 75% load factor for the 747-400ER there seems to be a need for the market to develop some more.

We don't know what the load factor on QF8 actually is though, because we don't know how many seats are blocked due to operating restrictions. If there are only 280-300 seats offered on this flight then QF is generating similar loads as the QF7 sector, and would probably be able to fill more seats if they had them.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZuluAlpha
Posted 2012-12-08 00:47:59 and read 16765 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 88):
We don't know what the load factor on QF8 actually is though, because we don't know how many seats are blocked due to operating restrictions. If there are only 280-300 seats offered on this flight then QF is generating similar loads as the QF7 sector, and would probably be able to fill more seats if they had them.

The QF7/QF8 as we all know uses the 744ER, all of them are now reconfigured to 270Y/36W/58J, I have seen where there are as little as 30 seats blocked, I have seen as many as 170 seats blocked, but the average has come about to 70 seats blocked. The higher blocked seats as we can all guess comes down to not so favourable climatic conditions (strong headwinds, hot weather in DFW). And they are always blocked in economy.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Flyingsottsman
Posted 2012-12-08 01:03:00 and read 16725 times.

Is QF still using 763s to HNL from Syd or are they A330s now ?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: qf002
Posted 2012-12-08 01:42:40 and read 16681 times.

Quoting ZuluAlpha (Reply 89):

Cheers. So assuming that QF can sell up to 305 seats on each flight (though I imagine this average could vary significantly between months with seasonal winds), the September figures suggest an 85% load factor, which is very healthy.

Quoting Flyingsottsman (Reply 90):
Is QF still using 763s to HNL from Syd or are they A330s now ?

767s.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-08 01:46:22 and read 16683 times.

Quoting Flyingsottsman (Reply 90):
Is QF still using 763s to HNL from Syd or are they A330s now ?

The route continues to be served by the International configure B763ER... With 16 frames under going the refurbished cabin and Q Streaming leaves everyone wondering what is to happen with VH-OGR, OGS, OGT, OGU...? Will the aircraft receive the cabin fit out and reconfiguration...?

By the way tonight's QF3 was operated by a A333...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: vhebb
Posted 2012-12-08 02:26:52 and read 16641 times.

The 4 international B763s VH-OGR/S/T/U will be getting the upgrade and Q streaming as all 4 frames are included in the 16 to be upgraded.

Cheers

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-08 03:04:33 and read 16611 times.

Quoting vhebb (Reply 93):
The 4 international B763s VH-OGR/S/T/U will be getting the upgrade and Q streaming as all 4 frames are included in the 16 to be upgraded.

Which probably means;

a) The QF3 SYD-HNL route to be upgraded from a B763 to A332/A333

OR

b) HNL route capacity increase on the B763 with an extra 5 J/C and 18 Y/C seats includes 2 Y/C crew rest seats...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ditzyboy
Posted 2012-12-08 03:19:07 and read 16590 times.

OGR has had the QStreaming upgrade, but retains an international configuration. QStreaming is only available on domestic flights at this stage. I assume due to the galley unit that houses the iPad charging carts being required for catering (as well as other logistical reasons with respect to the iPads). As a side note the DVD players in J are due to be replaced by iPads in the near future. Not sure whether they are preloaded or streaming (my guess is the former).

I don't know what has been done to the seat coverings. I assume that Business still features the Dreamtime seat as it is still internationally configured with tech crew rest compartment (which blocks 25AB when activated) and four non-saleable cabin crew rest seats.

[Edited 2012-12-08 03:27:08]

[Edited 2012-12-08 03:28:47]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-08 03:39:38 and read 16542 times.

Quoting Ditzyboy (Reply 95):

From memory the iPad charging stowage positions are 604, 605 & 606...

Don't they block off 2 Y/C seats with the flight sold as 202 Y/C...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: vhebb
Posted 2012-12-08 11:26:39 and read 16382 times.

Did VH-OGR get the new side wall panels, curtains, lighting etc?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ditzyboy
Posted 2012-12-08 14:08:22 and read 16294 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 96):

The internationally configured aircraft are sold as 204Y. When the tech crew rest is activated the aircraft are sold as 202Y as 25AB become unusable. The rear panel of the tech crew rest is moved back against those seats to allow the seat in there to go flat. Like the 333 and international 332s the four cabin crew rest sears are never part of the equation. You never hear the 333s being referred to having 271Y, for example.

I think you are getting confused with the two seats on domestic 30J/224Y aircraft not being sold as it would require an eighth flight attendant (252 seats in total, instead of 254). Theoretically, any two seats could be unsold to meet the requirement. The last two AB seats are blocked as a standard thing. On these aircraft, if the cabin crew rest is activated the last two rows of AB seats are not not sold and the curtain drawn around them. You'll often see the sole 30J/221Y aircraft sold as 219Y. I think this is in case of an equipment sub as those seats could be sold an not need additional cabin crew.

Quoting vhebb (Reply 97):

I am not sure. Nothing has been said other than internationally configured OGR has received the QStreaming upgrade. I am sure the lighting would upgraded at the same time as the IFE. As to the seat covers, bulkheads and curtains - who knows? The sidewalls remain the same with this refresh.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-08 14:45:17 and read 16237 times.

Quoting Ditzyboy (Reply 98):

I believe your referring to VH-OGV which is sold as 219Y/C & as for the QF3 ive noticed 2Y/C seats are blocked selling it as 202 not 204...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ADDICT4QF
Posted 2012-12-08 19:19:53 and read 16090 times.

QF should fly 1 A380 DXB-LHR-DXB. I don't know how QF have demand for 900pax per day from SYD & MEL wanting to go to LHR as a destination. This may have been the case when pax were using LHR as a hub; it's no longer going to be the case. Everyone will hop off QF at DXB and onto a EK service to Europe.

Even better the service should turn immediately at LHR. As LHR will be served as a desintation in its own right (not a hub), you do not need to be a late departure out of LHR to allow for pax to connect to LHR. If pax are time sensitive, use a EK afternoon/night service.

This should free up A380 time for an A380 SYD-DFW-SYD service .

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: qf002
Posted 2012-12-08 21:00:22 and read 16006 times.

Quoting ADDICT4QF (Reply 100):
I don't know how QF have demand for 900pax per day from SYD & MEL wanting to go to LHR as a destination. This may have been the case when pax were using LHR as a hub; it's no longer going to be the case. Everyone will hop off QF at DXB and onto a EK service to Europe.

Most passengers flying with QF have LHR as their final destination. Passengers flying to CDG and FCO (which QF cite as the next two most popular cities for Australian travellers outside LHR/FRA) were already covered by the AF and CX codeshares, so there is no loss in traffic through LHR there.

What traffic did connect onto BA will be replaced with local market traffic provided by EK. The timings are actually very good for local DXB-LHR traffic and will fill a gap that EK's schedule has (the return timings are good, but mimic existing EK flights).

Quoting ADDICT4QF (Reply 100):
Even better the service should turn immediately at LHR

I agree, but will point out that QF has to work with what they've got (which is two slots in the morning and two in the evening, an hour apart in both cases). I daresay we will see things develop down the track once QF gets the slots that are currently leased to BA back and grows closer to EK.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ditzyboy
Posted 2012-12-09 05:21:29 and read 15695 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 99):

As mentioned, the two Y seats that are blocked are 25AB, which are unavavailable when the tech crew rest is activated. The rear wall of the unit is moved backward to allow the seat within to fully recline. The seat bottom cushions at 25AB are removed and the unit sits right up against the seats. This is also why these bulkhead seats do not have in-arm traytables, but tables which are stored in an overhead locker and fitted by cabin crew (when 25AB are useable of course).

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-09 16:32:11 and read 15451 times.

Quoting Ditzyboy (Reply 102):

Thanks for clarifying which seats are blocked in Y/C...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: NZ107
Posted 2012-12-09 17:05:56 and read 15447 times.

Quoting maxter (Reply 104):

And that's what Auckland Airport looked like in real life on Thurs!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: VH-BZF
Posted 2012-12-09 17:09:06 and read 15431 times.

Looks as though the late Thai B744 (TG471?) arrival Sunday night diverted into Melbourne and overnighted there, heading up here to Sydney this afternoon as TG8468, anyone have any details?

BZF

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: thegeek
Posted 2012-12-09 17:18:00 and read 15413 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 88):
But these figures could be seen to show that the A380 is not the right aircraft for the route out of SYD. It's far cheaper for QF to channel connecting traffic through BNE (because the long haul sector is so much shorter) and just run the more expensive SYD flights for traffic in SYD/NSW.

In that scenario, two daily 787s makes a lot of sense to me. SYD-DFW will easily fill a dedicated daily 270 seat flight (given the number rof passengers already SYD-bound, plus the boost that going nonstop would provide), and BNE can handle the majority of the connecting traffic.

I'm really confused by these comments.

I would have said that the figures show that there is indeed demand for a daily A380 SYD-DFW-SYD. SYD is a better airport to reach many destinations than BNE, although for a few places in Qld BNE is far superior like ISA.

There is also huge disparity in SYD-LAX-SYD with the eastbound flights going out far emptier than the westbound flights are coming back. I am sure this is a function of the DFW flight at least in part.

It's hardly ideal to run a flight with a large number of blocked seats. Triangular flights aren't good either.

Quoting ZuluAlpha (Reply 89):
The QF7/QF8 as we all know uses the 744ER, all of them are now reconfigured to 270Y/36W/58J, I have seen where there are as little as 30 seats blocked, I have seen as many as 170 seats blocked, but the average has come about to 70 seats blocked. The higher blocked seats as we can all guess comes down to not so favourable climatic conditions (strong headwinds, hot weather in DFW). And they are always blocked in economy.

Thanks. On average 19% of seats are blocked then.

I'm wondering if the reduction in LF westbound in Sep as compared to July is purely due to increased blocking of seats.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-09 19:31:12 and read 15268 times.

Quoting VH-BZF (Reply 105):

I believe it's one of three additional services TG will be operating this month...

EXTRA TG 744/777 SERVICES

MEL will be welcoming back TG 744 services, there will be 1 such service (the other being an extra 777 flight) coupled with SYD, flights are bookable, and are in ADDITION to the current x2 Daily services, F will be available on the 744 flight. TG flights flying out on 14DEC are nearly booked out, all 3 flights have fewer than 8 seats left in all 3 classes, inbound from BKK also having less than 8 seats per flight left bookable.

11/12/2012
Thai Airways Intl (TG 8625)
dep: 00:30 - Melbourne (MEL)
arr: 05:40 - Bangkok (BKK)
equipment: Boeing 777-300

14/12/2012
Thai Airways Intl (TG 472)
dep: 12:20 - Melbourne (MEL)
arr: 17:30 - Bangkok (BKK)
equipment: Boeing 747-400

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=548727&page=267

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: mah584jr
Posted 2012-12-09 19:46:39 and read 15256 times.

Hey All,

I have a few questions about Qantas domestic.

Why are there no seat maps when you are trying to make a booking?

If I choose a business fare (domestic) can I book any seat I want to in business class? Or will the seats be blocked off?

I'm rather picky when it comes to seats and I'd really like to fly Qantas domestic, but if I don't know which seats are available with a business fare at the time of booking I'd probably be less likely to book with them.

Thanks for your help in advance!

-mah584jr

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Vhqpa
Posted 2012-12-09 20:20:53 and read 15215 times.

Quoting mah584jr (Reply 108):

There isn't an option to choose seats during the booking process. However once your ticket is issued you can choose seats in the my bookings section

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: mah584jr
Posted 2012-12-09 20:39:17 and read 15190 times.

Quoting Vhqpa (Reply 109):
There isn't an option to choose seats during the booking process. However once your ticket is issued you can choose seats in the my bookings section

So when you purchase the business fare, will you have the option to choose any seat in the business class cabin?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Vhqpa
Posted 2012-12-09 20:54:34 and read 15172 times.

Quoting mah584jr (Reply 110):

Provided it isn't already assigned/blocked. Yes

Also if your flying on a high frequency route ie. between SYD-MEL/BNE I Don't see why you can't keep changing your flight (as long as the new flight isn't more expensive than the flight you paid there is no fee to do so) until you find a seat you like.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: qf002
Posted 2012-12-10 01:22:10 and read 14971 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 106):
SYD is a better airport to reach many destinations than BNE, although for a few places in Qld BNE is far superior like ISA.

My point is that it is cheaper for QF to fly traffic through BNE wherever possible. BNE-DFW is shorter than SYD-DFW (it's not a massive difference, but I'd say it's a significant one) and therefore cheaper to operate. Give the scale and efficiency of QF's domestic network, it will be far cheaper for QF to fly a passenger PER-BNE-DFW, MEL-BNE-DFW etc than through SYD. I doubt that the difference is huge, but QF would be stupid not to squeeze every last cent they can out of their long haul flights.

SYD appears able to support its own daily 787 service (and can easily handle those cities that don't have direct link to BNE), while connections from other major centres can be easily handled through BNE at a higher profit margin.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 106):
There is also huge disparity in SYD-LAX-SYD with the eastbound flights going out far emptier than the westbound flights are coming back. I am sure this is a function of the DFW flight at least in part.

I'm advocating for two daily fights -- one from BNE and one from SYD. The 789 should make it possible for the SYD flight to return nonstop to SYD, which would help to solve these issues.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 106):
It's hardly ideal to run a flight with a large number of blocked seats. Triangular flights aren't good either.

Agreed. Double daily 789s should solve these issues -- I doubt the A380 would solve both (even the more capable version).

So what I am trying to say is:

1. Two daily 787s (from SYD and BNE) allows them far greater flexibility in directing traffic towards a more profitable routing than a single A380 in/out of SYD.
2. The 787 will allow them to run nonstop into SYD with a full passenger and cargo load while the A380 will probably still be restricted in some way nonstop to SYD.
3. It's also worth noting that two 787s will carry more cargo than a single A380. This route appears to be very cargo heavy, so that's a big consideration for QF.

From that, I'm suggesting that the A380 is not the ideal aircraft for the route, and that two daily 787s is the better alternative. Hope that makes sense now  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-10 01:29:41 and read 14957 times.

Approximately 85-90 economy seats are blocked on the DFW-BNE sector...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: thegeek
Posted 2012-12-10 05:05:46 and read 14779 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 112):
My point is that it is cheaper for QF to fly traffic through BNE wherever possible. BNE-DFW is shorter than SYD-DFW (it's not a massive difference, but I'd say it's a significant one) and therefore cheaper to operate. Give the scale and efficiency of QF's domestic network, it will be far cheaper for QF to fly a passenger PER-BNE-DFW, MEL-BNE-DFW etc than through SYD. I doubt that the difference is huge, but QF would be stupid not to squeeze every last cent they can out of their long haul flights.

Beg to differ. I am sure that the CASK of the A380 on SYD-DFW will brain the 789 on BNE-DFW. SYD also has far more O&D than MEL. Not sure how the MEL/ADL/PER people are to be encouraged to avoid the SYD flight. The SYD flight would presumably be far higher yielding than the BNE flight on a daily 789 BNE-DFW + daily 789 SYD-DFW.

Besides, one plane is on order and the other isn't - the 789 only has options.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: SYDSpotter
Posted 2012-12-10 06:06:45 and read 14720 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 112):
So what I am trying to say is:

1. Two daily 787s (from SYD and BNE) allows them far greater flexibility in directing traffic towards a more profitable routing than a single A380 in/out of SYD.
2. The 787 will allow them to run nonstop into SYD with a full passenger and cargo load while the A380 will probably still be restricted in some way nonstop to SYD.
3. It's also worth noting that two 787s will carry more cargo than a single A380. This route appears to be very cargo heavy, so that's a big consideration for QF.

From that, I'm suggesting that the A380 is not the ideal aircraft for the route, and that two daily 787s is the better alternative. Hope that makes sense now

Hmm interesting suggestion, any idea of what % of passengers on the existing SYD-DFW flight is ex-SYD vs MEL/ADL/PER? Your idea would only work if the number of ex-SYD passengers is not greater than the capacity of a 787, otherwise you're leaving a chunk of ex-SYD passengers off the direct flight. If a high proportion of the current 747 flight is ex-SYD then an A380 makes more sense and you will have residual MEL/ADL/PER feeding the SYD-DFW direct.

Also a little surprised at the low numbers of the SYD bound passengers on the DFW-BNE-SYD leg, is the stop via BNE putting the SYD bound passengers off (who then connect in LAX direct) or is it a case that SYD demand is not that high (and hence a good chunk of the passengers on SYD-DFW are ex MEL/ADL/PER etc)??

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-10 06:18:38 and read 14722 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 114):
I am sure that the CASK of the A380 on SYD-DFW will brain the 789

I'm not, but I can't say definitively

Quoting thegeek (Reply 114):
SYD also has far more O&D than MEL.

That, by your own figures, 168 people per day at present use QF8 who are not going to SYD, shows that their is a market is market for a "Rest of Australia" flight vs SYD.

Hopefully I don't need to remind you that only about 25% of Australia's population lives in the Sydney metropolitan area.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 114):
The SYD flight would presumably be far higher yielding than the BNE flight

I wouldn't say "far higher", but you're right in that it would probably be higher yielding. Two points:

(1) QF16 is lower yielding than the SYD flights, and it doesn't stop them flying it
(2) If we assume that a MEL-DFW fare is the same as a SYD-DFW fare, then obviously a portion of the fare will be apportioned to the MEL-BNE flight. However, the amount that is apportioned is normally tiny, with the overwhelming amount of revenue going to the longhaul flight. What I am getting at is that the BNE-DFW portion could well be 95%+ of the SYD-DFW fare. Not too bad really...

Quoting thegeek (Reply 114):
Not sure how the MEL/ADL/PER people are to be encouraged to avoid the SYD flight.

That's very easy to do, and airlines do it every single day. You simply don't display it in the booking window as an option. Also, it is not uncommon for them to only have a tiny number of seats available in low fare booking classes. If QF were to do BNE-DFW, don't be at all surprised if classes EGHKLMNOQSVX have something like 0-2 seats available for SYD-DFW if connecting from ADL. BNE however? Why, availability is conveniently wide open.

I'm 100% with qf002 on this. The cost of operating the flight through BNE, in terms of shorter distance, lower airport costs, and not having to block premium domestic travel out of SYD makes the BNE a no brainer from a cost perspective.

And anyway, by 2016 it's highly likely that 1x A380 will be too small for the market.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-10 08:47:10 and read 14671 times.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 115):
is the stop via BNE putting the SYD bound passengers off (who then connect in LAX direct)

It would appear that way, although in my mind a stop in BNE, which doesn't involve a terminal change, is preferable to LAX, which does.

Between minimising the amount of time spent on AA (the less the better!) and avoiding LAX, I would personally take QF8 even if going to SYD. It would appear, however, that I'm in a minority on that position.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 115):
is it a case that SYD demand is not that high

No, I don't think that's it. According to thegeek QF carry more traffic LAX-SYD than they do SYD-LAX, which would imply that people are choosing to fly SYD-DFW/LAX-SYD

(thegeek: do you have a link to the data you are using? I couldn't find it on BITRE)

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sunrisevalley
Posted 2012-12-10 13:49:57 and read 14607 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 112):
2. The 787 will allow them to run nonstop into SYD with a full passenger and cargo load while the A380 will probably still be restricted in some way nonstop to SYD

Based on Ferpe's work of a couple of weeks ago it appears that the 789 at 128t DOW on a 16hr 15min day ( based on a one off flight plan for a 77W) DFW-SYD is good for max passenger load only as is the A380. So it is hard to see at this time what would work best on this route other than a 77L.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 113):
Approximately 85-90 economy seats are blocked on the DFW-BNE sector...

so does this suggest the total passenger load is around 250 to 260 seats? This rather jives with a 75% load factor before blocked seats

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sydscott
Posted 2012-12-10 14:17:51 and read 14588 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 112):
I'm advocating for two daily fights -- one from BNE and one from SYD. The 789 should make it possible for the SYD flight to return nonstop to SYD, which would help to solve these issues.

Can I state the obvious, (since I don't think it's been said above), the only reason QF stops in BNE is because it has to. That is why connecting pax get off in BNE rather than continue on a pointless journey to SYD. Once QF has an aircraft that eliminates the need to stop in BNE there will no longer be a DFW-BNE service and all connections will be funneled via SYD. We can argue the merits of a stand alone BNE-DFW-BNE service but lets not get ahead of ourselves here. The QF focus is on SYD-DFW and if they had an aircraft capable of doing the return economically, non-stop the stop in BNE would be gone.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-10 15:21:34 and read 14536 times.

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 118):

Correct, the number of blocked seats varies from flight to flight but it's very close to what I provided...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: thegeek
Posted 2012-12-10 16:19:03 and read 14492 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 117):
(thegeek: do you have a link to the data you are using? I couldn't find it on BITRE)

I'm using the city pair info in table 5. This forum seems to not like the link, but click on on " International Airline Activity—Monthly Publications " and then the month you want.
http://www.bitre.gov.au/publications...=s:%22aviation%22&link-search=true

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: thegeek
Posted 2012-12-10 16:37:57 and read 14479 times.

Quoting sydscott (Reply 119):
Once QF has an aircraft that eliminates the need to stop in BNE there will no longer be a DFW-BNE service

That's what I think too, but it does seem that there are a number of people who like leaving the flight in BNE. If QF have an aircraft that could do MEL-DFW, like the 789, I'd say that would be the next connection, and BNE-DFW would be the third city to get a flight.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-10 17:00:46 and read 14453 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 122):

Would it be possible to operate MEL-DFW & BNE-DFW alongside the LAX services...?

Sydney 2nd airport debate... It's on again...

There is more than a trace of smoke to suggest that NSW’s O’Farrell government may ambush the Gillard Government’s peculiar and opaque resistance to a 2nd Sydney Airport at Badgerys Creek in the course of changing its own anti any new Sydney airport stance.

This situation is being driven by three factors.

The big end of town thinks a 2nd Sydney Airport is needed ASAP
The western Sydney business and political attitude is moving toward supporting the jobs and opportunities the new airport would bring, and
Labor is, whether correctly or otherwise, seen as shielding real estate interests in preserving the Badgerys Creek site for anything but its intended purpose which is a major new airport in the Sydney basin.
A very substantial report on the Sydney airport crisis appears in today’s AFR.

http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalk...lard-govt-over-2nd-sydney-airport/

http://www.businessspectator.com.au/...121210-2UJW2?OpenDocument&src=hp15

EK413

[Edited 2012-12-10 17:14:16]

[Edited 2012-12-10 17:17:30]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: qf002
Posted 2012-12-10 18:20:38 and read 14359 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 114):
I am sure that the CASK of the A380 on SYD-DFW will brain the 789 on BNE-DFW

Perhaps, I don't know. It's irrelevant though if they can generate higher profits by flying more people out of DFW on slightly less efficient aircraft, AND carry more cargo on the route.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 114):
Not sure how the MEL/ADL/PER people are to be encouraged to avoid the SYD flight.

The same way that they encourage connecting traffic to use QF7/8 to cities served one stop through LAX. As RyanairGuru said, it's as simple as not showing other options.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 114):
Besides, one plane is on order and the other isn't - the 789 only has options.

Irrelevant, since both aircraft will be available to QF at pretty much the same time (2016-2017), and QF has said that they will take 789s if they can make money with them.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 115):
Hmm interesting suggestion, any idea of what % of passengers on the existing SYD-DFW flight is ex-SYD vs MEL/ADL/PER? Your idea would only work if the number of ex-SYD passengers is not greater than the capacity of a 787, otherwise you're leaving a chunk of ex-SYD passengers off the direct flight. If

True. SYD bound passengers made up about 60% of QF8 when it commenced (around 180 seats on each flight from memory), so I figured that a 270 seat aircraft would be a pretty good fit. If capacity is tight on the DFW flights then it's easy for QF to direct traffic flying to big centres through LAX (ie ORD, MIA, IAD, BOS traffic is currently directed through DFW but could easily be handled through LAX), especially if QF107/108 is upgauged to an A380 as the final 744s are replaced towards the end of the decade.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 116):
I'm 100% with qf002 on this

Thanks  
Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 116):
And anyway, by 2016 it's highly likely that 1x A380 will be too small for the market.

     

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 117):
It would appear, however, that I'm in a minority on that position.

I think the issue lies in traffic coming from cities that can reach SYD in one stop through LAX vs two stops through DFW and BNE. My Dad travels to ORD 4-5 times a year and always takes QF7 outbound then comes back through LAX which allows him to do a full day of work in Chicago before heading for the airport and means that he gets back to SYD early enough to do a full day of work. It also significantly reduces the risk of a diversion.

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 118):
Based on Ferpe's work of a couple of weeks ago it appears that the 789 at 128t DOW on a 16hr 15min day ( based on a one off flight plan for a 77W) DFW-SYD is good for max passenger load only as is the A380. So it is hard to see at this time what would work best on this route other than a 77L.

The 789/A380 will probably still work better than the 77L because they burn so much less fuel, even at a reduced load. In any case, we don't know how the 789 will perform yet, and QFs will probably be better than the first few. If they end up being 8500nm aircraft (though that seems very optimistic), then they probably won't have any issues.

Quoting sydscott (Reply 119):
Once QF has an aircraft that eliminates the need to stop in BNE there will no longer be a DFW-BNE service and all connections will be funneled via SYD.

The route has performed exceptionally in terms of passenger uptake, and it doesn't appear to have come at the cost of existing services either (despite having also added capacity to QF107/108 and QF15/16 this year). A single daily A380 isn't going to be enough capacity to serve this market in 4-5 years time, so they must surely be looking at how else they can capitalise on its success.

You are right to point out that QF has been notoriously conservative in the past though. I'm hoping we'll see some more interesting moves in future though (like the EK deal).

Quoting thegeek (Reply 122):
If QF have an aircraft that could do MEL-DFW, like the 789, I'd say that would be the next connection, and BNE-DFW would be the third city to get a flight.

Will the 789 have the range to do DFW-MEL though? It's an extra 400nm past SYD (the difference between BNE and SYD is only 200nm).

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sydscott
Posted 2012-12-10 18:43:13 and read 14383 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 124):
A single daily A380 isn't going to be enough capacity to serve this market in 4-5 years time, so they must surely be looking at how else they can capitalise on its success.

You are right to point out that QF has been notoriously conservative in the past though. I'm hoping we'll see some more interesting moves in future though (like the EK deal).
Quoting qf002 (Reply 124):
Will the 789 have the range to do DFW-MEL though? It's an extra 400nm past SYD (the difference between BNE and SYD is only 200nm).

MEL-AKL-DFW. That's what I see as the next DFW route to kill 2 birds with 1 stone. According to Great Circle Mapper it's around 7,440 miles still air, the 789 has a range of 8,000 to 8,500 so it should be just doable with the aircraft depending on winds Westbound. Assuming NZ or UA don't start AKL-IAH it'll also land a jump on Star in the region.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: MilesDependent
Posted 2012-12-10 19:29:17 and read 14336 times.

http://www.smh.com.au/business/jumbo...rget-australia-20121211-2b6vu.html


...
Two 777s weekly to Sydney

Australia is FiftyOne’s second-largest market, after Canada, accounting for about 20 per cent of sales through its system, DeSimone said. After the company began shipments to Australia in 2010, sales doubled in the first year and then doubled again, and DHL Express operates two dedicated Boeing 777 freight flights a week from Cincinnati to Sydney to ship parcels for FiftyOne’s partner stores, Mr DeSimone said.
...


LOL - WTF?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: thegeek
Posted 2012-12-10 19:31:39 and read 14389 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 124):
It's irrelevant though if they can generate higher profits by flying more people out of DFW on slightly less efficient aircraft, AND carry more cargo on the route.

I guess, but there's a few ifs in that. And you didn't mention that there also needs to be a demand for cargo at the price required for such a long haul.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 124):
Irrelevant, since both aircraft will be available to QF at pretty much the same time (2016-2017), and QF has said that they will take 789s if they can make money with them.

To a degree I agree with this. I expect that the decision point is earlier with the 789 than what it is with the A380. I'm sure they will want to see more than one route which they would make a profit with the 789s before they exercise the options.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 124):
Will the 789 have the range to do DFW-MEL though? It's an extra 400nm past SYD (the difference between BNE and SYD is only 200nm).

Probably. We are talking about the 2016 (or later) version of that plane. What it's capabilities will be involves a fair bit of speculation. I'm sure that the 789 will eventually be good for it.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 123):
Would it be possible to operate MEL-DFW & BNE-DFW alongside the LAX services...?

I reckon it would.

Quoting sydscott (Reply 125):
MEL-AKL-DFW.

It would be pretty odd to fly this route while not flying AKL-LAX. Can't any 744 manage AKL-DFW? I think this is a route which should have been tried ages ago.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sydscott
Posted 2012-12-10 20:26:09 and read 14344 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 127):
It would be pretty odd to fly this route while not flying AKL-LAX. Can't any 744 manage AKL-DFW? I think this is a route which should have been tried ages ago.

It depends on what your target market is. Similar to the SYD-DFW, if your target market is US East Coast & South bound travellers, and it's a unique route which allows service into DCA/LGA etc from DFW, then I can see how it would work and why QF wouldn't want to compete with NZ on the LAX run. I also think JQ will end up on AKL-LAX thereby covering the package/holiday maker market into and out of NZ while having a premium link into DFW to cover everything else. It would put immense pressure on NZ/UA to respond with AKL-IAH.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 127):
I reckon it would.

I think eventually its inevitable. I could easily see a scenario where both BNE-LAX and BNE-DFW are operated by 787's. But I also think that's a fair way down the track and that DFW needs more time to build up with an appropriate aircraft. It'll also be interesting to see what happens to the 2nd daily SYD-LAX service under such a scenario. If you're going to fragment the market by adding BNE-DFW and MEL-DFW I'd suggest that the 2nd daily SYD-LAX, operated by a 744, would eventually go. You'd then see LAX, eventually, with 2 A380's and a 787 service alongside DFW with 1 A380 and 2 787 services daily.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: eta unknown
Posted 2012-12-10 23:16:24 and read 14229 times.

Latest rumour doing the rounds: CZ suspends PER-CAN from early APR 2013.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-10 23:22:29 and read 14221 times.

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 129):
Latest rumour doing the rounds: CZ suspends PER-CAN from early APR 2013.

That would be a very interesting development, considering it is the only mainland China destination from PER, that they tried for quite a while to get an airline to fly it.

Given the amount of capacity that is being added into PER though its hardly a shock that someone will fall back, either reducing frequencies or suspending flights.

CZ has had mixed performance so far into Australia. Its frequencies increased quickly nto MEL and SYD only for them to pull back and increase seasonally. They had big ambitions for 3 daily at one point, but struggle to maintain 2 daily outside of the peak periods. Seasonal flights might be all that PER will sustain.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: SYDSpotter
Posted 2012-12-11 01:28:08 and read 14092 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 130):
CZ has had mixed performance so far into Australia. Its frequencies increased quickly nto MEL and SYD only for them to pull back and increase seasonally. They had big ambitions for 3 daily at one point, but struggle to maintain 2 daily outside of the peak periods. Seasonal flights might be all that PER will sustain.

CZ are very much trying to tap into the Oz-Europe market by marketing CAN as a stopover point. So PER was I guess of mix of both the mining connections with China + transit market. Trouble is that with the current visa requirements for China, you can't get a visa on arrival so for those who are wanting to stopover for a few days it is a massive hassle to get a visa in advance. I did read though the other day that Beijing was offering a 72 hour visa on arrival (you are limited to Beijing only).
So their biggest plus point at this stage is price, but in terms of frequency/product vs other Oz-Europe carriers (SQ, EK, CX etc), they are going to struggle.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-11 02:39:47 and read 14003 times.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 131):

Would appear PVG have jumped onboard offering a 72 hour visa for transit passengers...

Shanghai allows visa-free stay for transit travelers from 45 countries

SHANGHAI, Dec. 9 (Xinhua) -- Shanghai will allow transit passengers from 45 countries to stay in the city for 72 hours without a visa, following a similar policy announced by Beijing.

The municipal authorities of Shanghai on Sunday said the visa-free transit policy was recently approved by the State Council, or the Cabinet. Shanghai has been offering free-visa transit stay for some countries' citizens, but only for 48 hours.

The countries on the list include the United States, Canada, Australia, Japan, Singapore, a number of European countries, among others.

Transit passengers can enter Shanghai through the city's two airports -- Hongqiao and Pudong after the policy goes into effect on Jan. 1, 2013, the authorities said.

The Beijing municipal government on Wednesday announced the 72-hour free-visa transit policy for citizens from 45 countries. The policy will also be enacted on Jan. 1, 2013.

Experts expect the move to help the Beijing Capital International Airport become an international air hub.

According to Gao Lijia, a general deputy manager with the Beijing airport, the new policy is estimated to bring 600,000 to 800,000 transit visitors in 2013 alone.

Officials have started talking about developing tours and services to serve the influx of transit air passengers which include more duty-free shops at the Beijing airport.

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-11 03:10:22 and read 13989 times.

Its official...

http://airlineroute.net/2012/12/10/cz-per-s13update/

As per 10DEC12 GDS inventory display, China Southern Airlines has closed reservation for its 3 weekly Guangzhou – Perth service, for flights on/after 02APR13. At present time, it is unknown whether the airline is converting this route to seasonal-only, or adjusting operational schedule.

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-11 03:53:54 and read 13906 times.

^^ That's not official yet. Corrections are often made, and it does state at the end the possibilities for this move.

We will need to wait for something official.

SYDspotter, I agree that they are chasing transit pax too as part of their model, but the amount of capacity added into PER chasing this same market is getting to a point something has to give. With EK's increase and QR's arrival alone, the market now has to handle more capacity to what is still not huge in size.

The mining boom is driving increases in prosperity and population growth, but there's only so much a market can sustain with 2 million people in the state, in an isolated position which limits the catchment zone and a fairly limited tourist market at this stage, although growing too.

It is a city that has gone through many roller coasters of boom and bust in the past. Time will tell.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-11 04:54:43 and read 13834 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 134):

Okay, let me return to my man cave until an official report is released...   

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-11 05:00:27 and read 13822 times.

^^ hehe.. Sorry if it came across abruptly.

Just stating that that site often makes changes a few days later after the GDS entries are revised. Seen it a few times now,

Will be interesting to see it move to a seasonal service atleast, but a total suspension would certainly be a concern to tourism authorities in WA.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Flyingsottsman
Posted 2012-12-11 05:57:16 and read 13785 times.

To everyone on this thread and to all A.netters merry Christmas to you all and I hope you have a happy and safe new year and happy plane spotting in 2013.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ben175
Posted 2012-12-11 08:40:02 and read 13771 times.

It would be hugely disappointing to see CZ pull out of PER, especially seeing as they planned to go daily by the end of the year. I hope atleast it's just a seasonal cut.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: vhebb
Posted 2012-12-11 14:03:50 and read 13710 times.

Looks like QF are progressing with an Asian expansion and A330 upgrade/refit:

http://afr.com/p/business/companies/..._asian_push_X9XxIsj1ZiXazx31wbKvKN

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-11 14:20:45 and read 13681 times.

Quoting vhebb (Reply 139):

A new business class product offering on the A330s and possibly sourcing a further 5 x A330s... Interesting times ahead with international operations focusing on Asian destinations...
The man which was said to be destroying the flying kangaroo is turning out to be the saviour...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: DavidByrne
Posted 2012-12-11 14:27:48 and read 13669 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 127):
It would be pretty odd to fly this route while not flying AKL-LAX. Can't any 744 manage AKL-DFW? I think this is a route which should have been tried ages ago.

Years ago QF announced that it would fly AKL-DFW but nothing subsequently came of it.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: AusA380
Posted 2012-12-11 14:52:06 and read 13651 times.

Quoting vhebb (Reply 139):
The man which was said to be destroying the flying kangaroo is turning out to be the saviour...
Quoting vhebb (Reply 139):
http://afr.com/p/business/companies/..._asian_push_X9XxIsj1ZiXazx31wbKvKN

It might be worthwhile looking at the chart in the AFR article. Apart from JetStar Asia, Qantas has either pulled out of Asia or failed to execute a strategy in Asia.

I would not be holding my breath to see if this strategy will be the "saviour". In the world of management, part performance is a strong indicator of future performance. Not a good indicator in this case.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-11 15:00:01 and read 13642 times.

Quoting AusA380 (Reply 142):

I recommend you quote the correct reply

Quoting EK413 (Reply 140):

... In the past Alan Joyce has been criticized for his focus on JQ expansion & now it seems cards have changed... If the plan pans out then he certainly would be the saviour...

On a sidenote Air China have deployed their B77W on the PEK-SYD route...

EK413

[Edited 2012-12-11 15:02:09]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: AusA380
Posted 2012-12-11 15:10:33 and read 13622 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 143):
I recommend you quote the correct reply

Sorry EK413, used the autoquote function of the site - will check more closely next time;

Quoting EK413 (Reply 143):
In the past Alan Joyce has been criticized for his focus on JQ expansion & now it seems cards have changed... If the plan pans out then he certainly would be the saviour

I agree that he has been too focused on JetStar in Asia, my point is that he has had other strategies in Asia that haven't worked, so I think it is too early to talk about Joyce being the saviour - his track record (and that of the board that endorses the strategy and takes ultimate responsibility for strategic directions) have not bee good. I think the AFR graphic is a useful reference point.

If they are able to succeed, great - but I will be sitting back and watching and not getting too excited.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-11 15:28:58 and read 13617 times.

Quoting AusA380 (Reply 144):

I guess we better find a comfy seat, fasten our seat belts & watch the show... I just hope it pans out in a positive way...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: vhebb
Posted 2012-12-11 16:49:21 and read 13575 times.

Looks like the retiming of Asia flights will be announced in January with additional flight frequency to be announced later:

http://mobile.bloomberg.com/news/201...rivals-to-win-business-travel.html

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: sydscott
Posted 2012-12-11 18:59:10 and read 13477 times.

Quoting vhebb (Reply 146):
Looks like the retiming of Asia flights will be announced in January with additional flight frequency to be announced later:

And the most interesting thing in there is Simon Hickey mentioning Dragonair by name, along with CX, as being the essential connections into China. A J/V LCC @ HKG sitting alongside a coded full service partner with pax able to choose either for connections. We may finally be seeing some sense come of the QF/CX relationship.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Zkpilot
Posted 2012-12-11 21:51:45 and read 13381 times.

Quoting DavidByrne (Reply 141):

Quoting thegeek (Reply 127):
It would be pretty odd to fly this route while not flying AKL-LAX. Can't any 744 manage AKL-DFW? I think this is a route which should have been tried ages ago.

Years ago QF announced that it would fly AKL-DFW but nothing subsequently came of it.


This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife

Word on the grapevine is that BNE is going to be dropped in favour of AKL very soon. AKL allows for better payload, better transit for pax, reinstates a QF flight from NZL to the US for its kiwi passengers (albeit possibly only in one direction), gives QF a boost in freight capacity across to SYD from AKL and it can be mostly crewed by AKL based cabin crew

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: aerokiwi
Posted 2012-12-11 22:05:17 and read 13341 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 127):
It would be pretty odd to fly this route while not flying AKL-LAX. Can't any 744 manage AKL-DFW? I think this is a route which should have been tried ages ago.

To the contrary - I think it makes much more sense than AKL-LAX, where a substantial number of pax are transferring anyway (no idea of the exact figures), and where NZ is the dominant, now monopoly carrier. DFW would open up the east coast, the southern states and the midwest to Kiwis through a pretty tremendous hub.

Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 148):
Word on the grapevine is that BNE is going to be dropped in favour of AKL very soon. AKL allows for better payload, better transit for pax, reinstates a QF flight from NZL to the US for its kiwi passengers (albeit possibly only in one direction), gives QF a boost in freight capacity across to SYD from AKL and it can be mostly crewed by AKL based cabin crew

Sad for BNE, but would be great news for AKL. But do you mean that AKL will only be used on the westbound leg or as a standalone from SYD, maybe as a continuation flight from MEL or BNE? I think it would be an excellent option for MEL pax wanting to avoid the hassle of a domestic-to-international transfer at Sydney.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-11 23:23:07 and read 13225 times.

Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 148):
Word on the grapevine is that BNE is going to be dropped in favour of AKL very soon. AKL allows for better payload, better transit for pax, reinstates a QF flight from NZL to the US for its kiwi passengers (albeit possibly only in one direction), gives QF a boost in freight capacity across to SYD from AKL and it can be mostly crewed by AKL based cabin crew

Makes sense.

BNE is still a fair way from DFW, which pushes the limits of that sector, and there are numerous connection possibilities from AKL to Australian destinations on QF and EK if the flights are timed well.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZK-NBT
Posted 2012-12-12 00:03:37 and read 13183 times.

Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 148):
Word on the grapevine is that BNE is going to be dropped in favour of AKL very soon.



Certainly not disagreeing with you although if I recall you have said this before, I do hope you are right from an enthusiasts point of view. While as you say AKL would allow better payload it doesn't offer the connections that BNE offers so would it really be a good thing. And probably only in one direction aswell. Unless it was a new flight as said above say MEL-AKL-DFW? But QF are retiring all bar 9 744s and won't have aircraft to run any new services.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ben175
Posted 2012-12-12 00:09:49 and read 13309 times.

Any news on the developing rumour of QF/EK starting PER-AKL?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: QF175
Posted 2012-12-12 04:21:32 and read 13071 times.

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 151):
While as you say AKL would allow better payload it doesn't offer the connections that BNE offers so would it really be a good thing?

+1

Qantas Group operated destinations such as ADL, ASP, BME, CBR, CNS, DRW, GLT, HTI, ISA, KTA, LST, PER, PHE, TSV to name a few, as well as the frequency to match. Admittedly traffic to some of these smaller ports would be low, however anecdotal evidence has suggested a solid amount of traffic flies on to resource intense places such as WA and its capital Perth.

Qantas will no doubt need to look long and hard at this and weigh up the pros and cons of such a move (i.e. DFW-AKL). The Airline will ultimately make a move that suits its best interests whether that results in the BNE stop being eliminated and replaced with Auckland or keeping the status quo. Regardless of this, the BNE stopover or any stopover for that matter would be seen as an impediment in offering SYD-DFW-SYD rountrip services.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: QF175
Posted 2012-12-12 04:28:22 and read 13055 times.

This recent article from CAPA is of interest!  
Quote:
Buenos Aires-Sydney service turns the corner

The Sydney operation has been profitable since Sep-2012, two months after a stop in Auckland was dropped. The main driver in improving the performance of the route, which had been a perennial loser, was the reduction in costs that resulted from eliminating the Auckland stop, particularly the cost of a second landing fee and overnighting the crew for the second leg.

A small portion of passengers picked up the flight in New Zealand so the decision to bypass Auckland and start flying the route non-stop has scarcely impacted demand. Probably more importantly, Qantas also dropped its Sydney-Buenos Aires flight in Mar-2012 in favour of a new Sydney-Santiago service, leaving Aerolineas as the only carrier with non-stop flights in the Australia-Argentina market.

Continues...
Article source

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: aerokiwi
Posted 2012-12-12 15:08:13 and read 12846 times.

Quoting QF175 (Reply 154):
This recent article from CAPA is of interest!

Undoubtedly the Qantas withdrawl is the driving factor. The AKL stopover would've added cost, but they maintained it for so long (20 plus years?) that it must've been outweighed by revenue gains at some point. From my understanding, reliability was a serious issue for AR - has this improved on the SYD service?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-12 18:03:02 and read 12705 times.

Just witnessed a Eurolantic B772ER at SYD...

Is it operating a FJ charter due To the B744 fleet under going maintenance in SIN...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: qantas747
Posted 2012-12-13 00:48:23 and read 12398 times.

Yes, eurolantic are operating for fj. Interesting product, i flew on it a couple of weeks ago. Good ife, good looking portuguese cabin crew and a modern aircraft. Fj still have a fa on board up front, but overall a good way to get home.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-13 00:53:44 and read 12387 times.

Quoting qantas747 (Reply 157):

Just curious where did Eurolantic source the B772ER...? Is it an ex-SQ aircraft...?

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: tim
Posted 2012-12-13 02:54:20 and read 12219 times.

Qatar daily 787 Perth-Doha is now bookable on the airlines website for services from Feb 1.

[Edited 2012-12-13 02:55:16]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: PA515
Posted 2012-12-13 04:16:32 and read 12123 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 158):
Just curious where did Eurolantic source the B772ER...? Is it an ex-SQ aircraft...?

L/N 144 delivered to SQ in Jun 1998 as 9V-SRA. To EuroAtlantic in Jan 2010 as CS-TFM.

PA515

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: CXfirst
Posted 2012-12-13 04:29:06 and read 12125 times.

Quoting tim (Reply 159):
Qatar daily 787 Perth-Doha is now bookable on the airlines website for services from Feb 1.

Excellent. Finally something concrete from the airline themselves (I've heard other relatively concrete info). Although surprised they haven't made a press release regarding this, they (for good reason) seem to be making a lot of 787 related press releases, with this one being first scheduled service of 787 into Australia.

-CXfirst

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Ben175
Posted 2012-12-13 05:22:49 and read 12089 times.

So glad PER gets bragging rights for the first port for a new aircraft type in Australia! I'll definitely be there when it touches down.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-13 16:15:40 and read 11892 times.

Quoting PA515 (Reply 160):

Cheers... Would explain the excellent IFE onboard the aircraft...

Qantas' 3rd refurbished B763 has entered service...

The third refurbished Boeing 767 with updated seats and Q Streaming in-flight entertainment entered service yesterday, operating from Brisbane to Darwin. VH-OGI Port Augusta, joins other refurbished B767s, VH-OGQ Birdsville and VH-OGR Corowa, currently in operation. Three more refurbished B767s are planned to enter service by Christmas. Qantas announced an acceleration of the B767 fleet refresh on 1 November, with all 16 refreshed B767s expected to be in operation by the end of March 2013.

There is talk of a review on the Sydney Airport curfew...

NSW Government airport proposal – NSW Premier Barry O'Farrell yesterday released a plan to increase the flight volume at Sydney airport and increase flights during the curfew shoulder period of 11pm to midnight and 5am to 6am. The plan also includes road works on the four main "pinch points" around the airport, at a cost of $300 million over the next five years. Yesterday, Infrastructure Minister Anthony Albanese dismissed the plan and said the federal government does not support changes to the cap or curfew.



EK413

[Edited 2012-12-13 16:20:25]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: QF175
Posted 2012-12-14 05:33:23 and read 11551 times.

Regional Australia Airline & Airport News

There's been a number of announcements and media articles of late concerning Regional Aviation in Australia and it's important that these be highlighted given they often take the backseat when compared to the news and happenings at Australia's major capital city Airports. Not only that, but a lot of the times the articles and announcements are of great interest.

Brindabella Airlines

Brindabella Airlines has today announced it will commence services from Sydney to Orange in February 2013 using a mixture of J31/J41 equipment. As it stands today Regional Express (REX) is the sole operator on the route and is charging what some would say to be 'pricey' airfares. Brindabella Airlines has also announced changes to its existing schedules and today launched a new website. Come early 2013, the combined Brindabella Airlines/Aeropelican network will be as follows:

* Brisbane - Coffs Harbour
* Brisbane - Narrabri
* Brisbane - Tamworth
* Canberra - Newcastle
* Sydney - Cobar
* Sydney - Cooma/Snowy Mountains (seasonal)
* Sydney - Moree
* Sydney - Mudgee
* Sydney - Narrabri
* Sydney - Newcastle
* Sydney - Orange

The press release may be located here.

Brindabella Airlines has certainly grown significantly over the past few years and combined with its charter operations will have an impressive network for what is a relatively small Airline.

Toowoomba - New Airport

Quote:
Second airport to be 'turning point' for Toowoomba

A proposal to build Toowoomba's second airport still needs to get clearance from the Civil Aviation Safety Authority (CASA).

A council assessment panel yesterday approved the Wagners Group's plans to build a jet-capable airport at Charlton, on Toowoomba's outskirts.

The Wagners Group says it is confident of getting the necessary CASA approval and is also negotiating with the Defence Department over concerns the airport will be too close to the Oakey Army Aviation Base.

"We're very confident as to how it's going to progress," the chairman of the Wagners Group, John Wagner, said.

"It's a fantastic thing for this region. It'll be a turning point for Toowoomba and the region generally.

"It's a real game changer, so I think common sense will prevail and we'll have to do some re-engineering of the air space but I'm sure it can all be achieved in a timely fashion."

News article - source

From an Aviation industry point of view, this is fantastic news for Toowoomba and the Darling Downs, Granite Belt and surrounding region as a whole. No doubt there will be staunch opposition during the construction process and from other parties such as Defence, however this will no doubt bring long term economic benefits to the region (and a new Airport built from scratch with better facilities will be much better than the existing, pokey Airport located within the outer suburbs of Toowoomba city).

It is envisaged that eventually A320/737-sized aircraft would operate services in to Toowoomba and that the Airport would handle future future freighter aircraft that could, for example bring Mining and other equipment directly to the region bypassing Brisbane Airport.

Initially (at least) it'd be expected Skytrans would move its 6x weekly Toowoomba-Sydney and regular Toowooma-Brisbane and Western Queensland services to this new Airport. Furthermore, a new Airport facility with a much larger runway and terminal would be rather attractive to the likes of other regional Airlines such as Virgin Australia, QantasLink and REX with their turboprop aircraft and smaller jets.

Bundaberg Airport

Local media in Bundaberg is reporting that JetGo Australia is in talks with Council regarding ERJ-145 services in and out of Bundaberg. It has been suggested on another forum that JetGo will reportedly take delivery of two more ERJ-145s and would use these aircraft to operate a Bundaberg-Brisbane service as well as possibly Bundaberg-Sydney. The Airline does not at this point in time operate RPT services and would need to undertake the necessary authorisation processes for this to occur.

When questioned, Virgin Australia made mention that while Bundaberg wasn't on their radar, they are always reviewing new route opportunities.

Virgin Australia

Quote:
Hope for deregulated air service to take off soon

The chairman of the Weipa Town Authority says regional residents should not have to wait another two years for a second airline.

The Queensland Government has confirmed it has extended an exclusive contract with QantasLink on the Weipa to Cairns service and others until the end of 2014.

Deputy Premier Jeff Seeney is seeking a meeting with Virgin Australia about its desire to gain more access to regional Queensland routes, including Weipa.

The authority's Peter McCulkin says while he welcomes the Government's comments about deregulation, it is not happening soon enough.

"[It] completely disadvantages all the people on Western Cape as well as other regions around Queensland, so ... we're hopeful that intervention by Jeff Seeney will have a positive outcome for us all," he said.

"Now the Deputy Premier has got his teeth into it.

"I've got a lot of respect for Jeff Seeney, so I'm hopeful that he and his staff will look at this closely in the coming days and certainly if the contracts haven't been finalised and not only for Weipa but there's a number of other routes around Queensland that certainly need the review and deregulation would certainly provide a better service."

I'm all for Virgin Australia gaining access to routes that should by rights be deregulated and that could handle two carriers operating services, i.e. Roma.

Miscellaneous

* While this news is a little old, Airnorth has increased its Darwin - Townsville services to thrice weekly with the introduction of a new Wednesday service, complementing its existing services on MON/FRI. Townsville flights are operated by the Airline's E70s and complement the existing 2x weekly Gold Coast - Mount Isa - Darwin services
* QantasLink has recently opened a new lounge in Devonport, Tasmania, located airside and adjacent to the departure gate. Furthermore, the Qantas Club at Alice Springs has had a refresh bringing in to line with a number of other Qantas lounges. WiFi is one of the new features along with new carpets and a modernised interior
* Alliance Airlines has taken delivery of a third Fokker 70LR aircraft which is expected to enter revenue service in February 2013 operating FIFO services

[Edited 2012-12-14 05:35:48]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: eaglefarm4
Posted 2012-12-14 12:18:55 and read 11419 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 158):

Eurolantic 777 was replaced yesterday by a Atlas 744 (pax) N465MC.It will now operate for FJ.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-14 12:53:28 and read 11394 times.

Quoting eaglefarm4 (Reply 165):

Ex-UA B744 aircraft...?

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Jetstar315
Posted 2012-12-15 20:12:19 and read 10862 times.

No, ex Japan Airlines JA8077 24784/798

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZKOKQ
Posted 2012-12-16 19:18:36 and read 10417 times.

ZK-OKP was in BNE today, here is a shot I got as she was on short finals.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=438520909530673&set=a.270741692975263.57466.256895087693257&type=1&theater

[Edited 2012-12-16 19:52:17]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: deconz
Posted 2012-12-16 19:25:16 and read 10373 times.

Quoting ZKOKQ (Reply 168):
ZK-OKP was in BNE today, here is a shot I got as she was on shot finals.

Excellent picture ZKOKQ

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-17 22:13:22 and read 9837 times.

2 bits of MEL news:

http://www.theage.com.au/business/ai...d-in-melbourne-20121218-2bkpi.html

Air Canada is considering adding a second Australian destination – most likely Melbourne – in an attempt to boost the number of Australian tourists visiting Canada.

Speaking in Sydney today, the airline’s chief executive, Calin Rovinescu, said he was eager to do more to promote Canada as a tourist destination because ‘‘we are just scratching the surface’’.

Air Canada has boosted weekly flights on the Sydney-Vancouver route – the longest in its network – from seven to 10 in an attempt to take advantage of the busy Christmas travel period and tap the number of Australians eager to fly to North America to ski.

The extra three services began on Sunday for a period of six weeks, and will be used as a test to see whether there is sufficient demand to repeat the additional services next year.

Mr Rovinescu said the airline was eyeing a second Australian destination but conceded that it would not be possible until it began taking delivery of the first of its long-haul Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner aircraft in 2015.

Alternatively, it could launch another Australian route earlier by redepolying a Boeing 777 plane.

‘‘Melbourne would be the logical next destination,’’ he said. ‘‘Australia remains a market to grow. We believe there are opportunities to add at least a second destination to Australia.’’

Air Canada is taking a leaf out of Qantas’s book by launching a new low-cost airline, which will begin with five planes before increasing its fleet to as many as 50 over the coming years.

It is due to reveal early tomorrow morning the name of the airline and the destinations it will serve in Europe and the Caribbean. It will be operated as a subsidiary of Air Canada.

Mr Rovinescu said Air Canada’s yields on the trans-Pacific route between Australia and Canada had been stronger year-on-year. In October, its load factor – a measure of seats occupied by paying passengers – on the route was almost 85 per cent.

The airline has about 34 per cent of the air-travel market on the Australia-Canada route.

SingAir adds flights to Australia

In a further challenge to Qantas, Virgin Australia’s alliance partner Singapore Airlines announced today that it will increase daily services between Melbourne and Singapore from three to four in July. It will also increase frequencies to Adelaide to 12 a week from 10.

The extra services will take the total number of flights operated to Australia by Singapore Airlines and its subsidiary SilkAir to 121, up from 104 a year ago.

Singapore Airlines has a 10 per cent stake in Virgin Australia.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-17 23:40:59 and read 9719 times.

I'm surprised there isn't any news concerning EY signing a 3 year deal with TA...

Etihad has signed a $6 million partnership with Tourism Australia (TA), the three year partnership will target visitors from the Middle East and Europe. Last month Qantas and Jetstar suspended a $50 million partnership with Tourism Australia due to a potential conflict of interest with TA Chairman and former Qantas CEO Geoff Dixon. Qantas remains the biggest private investor in marketing Australia to the world and we’ve committed that we won’t spend a dollar less on promoting Australia as a result our decision to suspend support for TA...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-17 23:49:36 and read 9697 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 171):
I'm surprised there isn't any news concerning EY signing a 3 year deal with TA...

Must say I figured it had already been touched on, but it appears it hasn't.

Given VA/DJ's move to partner with TA this wasn't a big surprise.

It appears QF will just move its support to the state based organisations anyway, so in the enmd its likely a win-win for all.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-18 00:01:48 and read 9682 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 172):

A big loss for TA though considering QFs partnership was in the sum of $40+ million... But in saying that it's still a win win situation for all carriers...

I've started a thread due to the Australian thread exceeding 170+ replies...

EY Sign $6 Million Partnership With TA (by EK413 Dec 17 2012 in Civil Aviation)

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZuluAlpha
Posted 2012-12-18 03:56:39 and read 9486 times.

In news on the QF / EK partnership, it has been announced today that the first codeshare flights have started with the QF flight number appearing on the connecting flights to/from DXB to MAN and MXP. The flights are loaded and for sale from 01Apr13

At this stage the new codeshare flights only allow for transit, not stopover and of course, this is all subject to the ACCC approval.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: 6thfreedom
Posted 2012-12-18 04:00:25 and read 9487 times.

SQ is increasing SIN/MEL to four times daily from 1 July 2013!

not quite sure of the schedule yet, but that is BIG news!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: tayser
Posted 2012-12-18 13:28:33 and read 9292 times.

Bold = new flight. Easy to remember flight numbers to boot!

SQ207 SIN0735 –> 1655MEL 333 Daily
SQ217 SIN0955 –> 1915MEL 388 Daily
SQ227 SIN2100 –> 0620+1MEL 388 Daily
SQ237 SIN2355 –> 0915+1MEL 773 Daily

SQ218 MEL0005 –> 0605SIN 388 Daily
SQ238 MEL1025 –> 1615SIN 773 Daily
SQ228 MEL1545 –> 2145SIN 388 Daily
SQ208 MEL1810 –> 0005+1SIN 333 Daily

They must be surely moving up the ranks within spitting distance of being the international carrier with the most seats in MEL (behind NZ)??

and re: AC, yes hurry up and source another 1-2 77L and start flying here!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-18 14:34:54 and read 9353 times.

Quoting tayser (Reply 176):
Bold = new flight. Easy to remember flight numbers to boot!

Loving that numbering. Sure is clever work  

With CZ also looking at starting flights to EZE via Australia or NZ, lets hope they choose MEL to fly the route. It could bring some stability to their frequencies year round and gives MEL a destination/continent it currently does not have serviced.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: thegeek
Posted 2012-12-18 16:44:43 and read 9257 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 177):

With CZ also looking at starting flights to EZE via Australia or NZ, lets hope they choose MEL to fly the route.

I have not heard this, at least that I can remember. Is there a source/thread?

[Edited 2012-12-18 16:45:07]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: NZ107
Posted 2012-12-18 16:52:08 and read 9251 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 178):

Nor here.. Would they get the rights for it? And do they have a plane which can actually travel that far with restrictions? I want to see a return of AR to AKL before another CZ plane. That's of course if you're not confusing them with CX.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-18 18:49:33 and read 9160 times.

The QF21 SYD-NRT on the 17th had to divert to CNS...

On 17 December a Qantas flight from Sydney to Tokyo diverted to Cairns to offload an unruly passenger for poor and threatening behaviour towards passengers and crew. Qantas crew did an excellent job managing this situation and bringing it under control. The Australian Federal Police (AFP) met the aircraft in Cairns to take the passenger into custody and the flight continued to Tokyo. This is an extreme and rare event but we have a zero tolerance approach for anti-social behaviour, and any actions that could compromise the safety of anyone on our aircraft. Following the incident, the AFP has warned that unruly passengers will now face charges. In 2011/12, the AFP responded to more than 1,000 alcohol-related incidents at major airports and charged 145 people with various offences.

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-18 21:18:12 and read 9018 times.

Quoting thegeek (Reply 178):
I have not heard this, at least that I can remember. Is there a source/thread?

I had heard it recently and then it was in the AFR (Australian Financial Review) a few days back.

No idea on rights though, as this was the first thing I thought of, along with the lack of suitable aircraft for the route. It would likely need a 4 engined aircraft of which they only have the A380. Hardly ideal.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: pugsley
Posted 2012-12-18 22:36:16 and read 8915 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 177):

Having just spent 27 hours traveling EZE-SCL-SYD-MEL a direct flight would be very welcome. I can't find the AFR article you mention, but look forward to reading about it.

I was able to find reference to China Southern and Aerolineas Argentineas signing a code share when AR entered skyteam with connections via Sydney.

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...na-southern-sign-codeshare-375888/

[Edited 2012-12-18 22:44:00]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-18 22:48:26 and read 8883 times.

The article was about CZ wanting to make CAN a bigger hub, and generating traffic from Sth America, with East Coast Australia or NZ considered options to commence services through to EZE.

It wasn't exactly the clearest article, as it had very little detail, but highlighted that they were looking at the options at present.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: pugsley
Posted 2012-12-18 22:50:09 and read 8879 times.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 183):

I finally found it, but as I don't subscribe to AFR, can't access the full article.

http://www.afr.com/p/business/compan...antas_niche_m03f2bQGO7UrHXp9Ktwb9N

China Southern eyes Qantas niche market
PUBLISHED: 17 DEC 2012 00:05:25 | UPDATED: 17 DEC 2012 09:01:49

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-18 23:56:52 and read 8793 times.

Quoting pugsley (Reply 184):
I finally found it, but as I don't subscribe to AFR, can't access the full article.

Well found.

I only get to read the AFR as its available to read at work each day. Some interesting articles from time to time.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: tullamarine
Posted 2012-12-19 00:02:38 and read 8793 times.

Quoting tayser (Reply 176):

Another A330 to Melbourne. At least the SQ A330 is a first time visitor joining just about every other Asian carrier as well as VA, QF and JQ

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-19 00:34:53 and read 8749 times.

Quoting tullamarine (Reply 186):
Another A330 to Melbourne. At least the SQ A330 is a first time visitor joining just about every other Asian carrier as well as VA, QF and JQ

The A330 is taking over the skies in general it seems  

Its disappointing though that there isn't the same variety that once seemed to exist, but time moves on though.

We await the next lot of twins with the B787 and A350.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: MilesDependent
Posted 2012-12-21 18:55:50 and read 8122 times.

Notice QF 8 went DFW AKL BNE SYD again today, no doubt due fuel....

MD

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Zkpilot
Posted 2012-12-22 01:48:56 and read 7880 times.

Quoting MilesDependent (Reply 188):
Notice QF 8 went DFW AKL BNE SYD again today, no doubt due fuel....

Yup...todays one did, yesterdays one made it to BNE, the day before it went to AKL as well.
Time to drop BNE and just route the flight SYD-DFW-AKL-SYD all the time.
= Better loads, better payload, better reliability, happier pax, less diversion costs, better crew utilization (Oz), better utilization of AKL crew, widebody freight AKL-SYD ($$$), better connections for MEL pax, no more bags left behind/transferred to LAX service.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-22 03:13:35 and read 7777 times.

The diversions are due to strong headwinds & all flights westbound have been weight restricted...

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: eaglefarm4
Posted 2012-12-22 13:09:12 and read 7566 times.

QF 108 LAX-SYD was also planned to drop into BNE but did not in the end..

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZKOKQ
Posted 2012-12-22 16:48:44 and read 7447 times.

Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 189):

Why drop BNE? It currently works as the load factors suggest provided by other users. Removing BNE removes ease of transfer for other passengers. Who would want to have to fly to SYD to fly to a mine up north?

QF wouldn't keep the BNE tag if it didnt work. Its not in their plans to drop BNE till they get an A380 to be able to make the trip. I hope that BNE will still get a 789 service though.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZK-NBT
Posted 2012-12-22 17:51:21 and read 7387 times.

Quoting ZKOKQ (Reply 192):
Why drop BNE? It currently works as the load factors suggest provided by other users

As ZKpilot says its a little unreliable when the aircraft is regularly tech stopping for fuel.

Quoting ZKOKQ (Reply 192):
Removing BNE removes ease of transfer for other passengers. Who would want to have to fly to SYD to fly to a mine up north?

It does to a degree yes, from AKL you would still be able to get to MEL and BNE with a transfer in AKL though and maybe ADL and PER if they start these.

Quoting ZKOKQ (Reply 192):
QF wouldn't keep the BNE tag if it didnt work. Its not in their plans to drop BNE till they get an A380 to be able to make the trip

Isn't it? Just asking.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: qf002
Posted 2012-12-22 18:22:51 and read 7344 times.

Quoting ZKOKQ (Reply 192):
QF wouldn't keep the BNE tag if it didnt work

It doesn't seem to working though.

If QF can make more money filling more seats and more cargo space and flying through AKL then that's what they will do. The increased occurrence of diversions this year over last year would suggest to me that they're trying desperately to fit more on the plane to try and squeeze some profit from these flights. Stopping in AKL would give them far more opportunity to make money, even if it does mean that they risk losing a few passengers who aren't headed for SYD/MEL/BNE.

That said, I'm still a big fan of a BNE-DFW service down the track, and think the AKL service should only be a temporary measure until the airline fixes up its completely messed fleet. Those two A380s that were due next year would have solved a lot of problems until the 787s start arriving down the track.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZKOKQ
Posted 2012-12-22 18:40:13 and read 7332 times.

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 193):
Quoting ZKOKQ (Reply 192):
Why drop BNE? It currently works as the load factors suggest provided by other users

As ZKpilot says its a little unreliable when the aircraft is regularly tech stopping for fuel.

Quoting ZKOKQ (Reply 192):
Removing BNE removes ease of transfer for other passengers. Who would want to have to fly to SYD to fly to a mine up north?

It does to a degree yes, from AKL you would still be able to get to MEL and BNE with a transfer in AKL though and maybe ADL and PER if they start these.

Quoting ZKOKQ (Reply 192):
QF wouldn't keep the BNE tag if it didnt work. Its not in their plans to drop BNE till they get an A380 to be able to make the trip

Isn't it? Just asking.

Thats not what the flight is about. Its about a one stop service to Australia. Not via NZ, add the NZ tag, it removes why they started the flight. Thats why it works.

[Edited 2012-12-22 18:41:50]

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZK-NBT
Posted 2012-12-22 19:11:16 and read 7299 times.

Quoting ZKOKQ (Reply 195):
Thats not what the flight is about. Its about a one stop service to Australia. Not via NZ, add the NZ tag, it removes why they started the flight. Thats why it works.

True, but thats also why it doesn't work as it surposed to be be DFW-BNE which is at the absolute maximum for the 744ER with a reasonable load. Going via AKL means they can carry a full load.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 194):
If QF can make more money filling more seats and more cargo space and flying through AKL then that's what they will do. The increased occurrence of diversions this year over last year would suggest to me that they're trying desperately to fit more on the plane to try and squeeze some profit from these flights.

  

Quoting qf002 (Reply 194):
That said, I'm still a big fan of a BNE-DFW service down the track, and think the AKL service should only be a temporary measure until the airline fixes up its completely messed fleet. Those two A380s that were due next year would have solved a lot of problems until the 787s start arriving down the track.

  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: ZKOKQ
Posted 2012-12-22 19:22:15 and read 7297 times.

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 196):
True, but thats also why it doesn't work as it surposed to be be DFW-BNE which is at the absolute maximum for the 744ER with a reasonable load. Going via AKL means they can carry a full load

It doesnt even really divert that much. QF have a good plan in place to make the route work and right now, I think its a success and no need for a change,

There are alot of airlines pushing the max for their aircraft. Where would we be if they didnt push the envelope?

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: EK413
Posted 2012-12-23 01:33:46 and read 7073 times.

Today's SYD-WLG QF047 service diverted to AKL... Any indication as to why...?

EK413

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: haggis73
Posted 2012-12-23 01:51:00 and read 7053 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 198):
Today's SYD-WLG QF047 service diverted to AKL... Any indication as to why...?

Fog in WLG, rolled in around 1pm, still there now, hoping it will clear late tomorrow morning.

MEL-WLG QF037 also diverted to AKL.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/travel...-sees-Wellington-flights-cancelled

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: TN486
Posted 2012-12-24 01:54:51 and read 6577 times.

To all of you who celebrate christmas, have a merry one, and a safe and happy new year. Cheers.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: IndianicWorld
Posted 2012-12-24 02:13:19 and read 6558 times.

Quoting TN486 (Reply 200):
To all of you who celebrate christmas, have a merry one, and a safe and happy new year. Cheers.

Thanks man. Same to you and your family also.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: FlyboyOz
Posted 2012-12-25 22:13:35 and read 6022 times.

You too everyone!! Hope you had a lovely christmas!

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: texan
Posted 2012-12-26 19:01:42 and read 5605 times.

A few days old but haven't seen it discussed:

CASA suspends Barrier Aviation--Cairns-based carrier--due to safety concerns.

Texan

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2012-12-26 19:02:08 and read 5638 times.

I was on QF8 leaving Dec 22/arr Dec 24 - and indeed had to go via AKL. Wunala went tech there so we enjoyed 7 hours on the ground, but that's a different story.

As has been commented, almost every flight this week is going into AKL. BUT when they say "strong winds", what they mean is practically unprecedented winds. I doubt that QF even modelled for winds this strong when they launched the route.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 190):
The diversions are due to strong headwinds
Quoting eaglefarm4 (Reply 191):
QF 108 LAX-SYD was also planned to drop into BNE

They're that strong!

In light of this, cut BNE some slack. The route's historical performance is approximately 1 stop per month which isn't too lousy.

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 193):
As ZKpilot says its a little unreliable when the aircraft is regularly tech stopping for fuel.

Cut the sensationalism. 95% completion factor, while not fantastic, does NOT constitute a "regular" tech stop

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 151):
While as you say AKL would allow better payload it doesn't offer the connections that BNE offers so would it really be a good thing

I'm starting to come round to this thinking. While I want it non-stop to BNE for purely selfish reasons, AKL would probably make more money for them. After all, if the route has a 97% lf eastbound then there is clearly a lot of unsatisfied demand (ie lost revenue) lying around at the moment.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 163):
Yesterday, Infrastructure Minister Anthony Albanese dismissed the plan and said the federal government does not support changes to the cap or curfew.

I'm sure he did, his constituency happens to be under the SYD flightpath. It's a sad indictment on leadership in this country that an essential infrastructure project that can be delivered for the princely sum of $0, is hijacked by short-term electoral politics. I'm not suggesting that we should develop a five runway airport at Mascot, but the Premier's proposal is relatively modest and wouldn't have too significant an impact on local residents.

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: QF175
Posted 2012-12-30 02:54:51 and read 4993 times.

Australian Aviation Thread # 67 is now up and running!  

Topic: RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 66
Username: Flyingsottsman
Posted 2012-12-30 03:41:31 and read 4955 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 204):
I'm sure he did, his constituency happens to be under the SYD flightpath. It's a sad indictment on leadership in this country that an essential infrastructure project that can be delivered for the princely sum of $0, is hijacked by short-term electoral politics. I'm not suggesting that we should develop a five runway airport at Mascot, but the Premier's proposal is relatively modest and wouldn't have too significant an impact on local residents.

Thats because this is a Fedral Government that is desprate to stay in power, and Kingford Smith sits in for what has been over the years a safe Labour seat and if polls are correct Labour are not doing to good at the moment, so they will say or do any thing to appease the constituency around Kingford Smith Airport. You are right it is a sad indictment !


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