Print from Airliners.net discussion forum
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/5637454/

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-17 06:49:41 and read 16804 times.

Hello fellow A.nutters,

I am planning to relocate to the environs of SFO next year, and with all the changes coming to SFO and the rest of the Bay Area I thought it would be best to create a full discussion thread.

So far we know:
*NH will be launching NRT-SJC on the 788 on Jan. 11.
*UA will be launching CDG, TPE, and FLL.
*TK has SFO as part of a large wishlist.
*AA will move from the 762/763 to the 321 in 2014, and DL will soon move to the 762.
*VX is interested in further expansion.
*UA to GRU has been rumored but not from a formal source.

In terms of aircraft up/downgauges, is the LH 388 here to stay? Also, will AF resend the 388, and when will CX move to all 77W? Has LA announced f they will send the 788 to SFO?

Post any thoughts here!

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: southwest737500
Posted 2012-12-17 06:52:07 and read 16821 times.

What kind of expantion do you think VX wants to do

TPA,CLT,BNA,DEN,PHX maybe

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Superfly
Posted 2012-12-17 06:54:16 and read 16816 times.

I believe SAS will be starting service in the spring with their beautiful A340s.



View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Chen Sheng Kun

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: modesto2
Posted 2012-12-17 07:01:50 and read 16790 times.

Point of clarification regarding DL at SFO. DL no longer operates the 762 and will maintain 752 (75E subfleet) equipment on JFKSFO.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-17 07:10:16 and read 16771 times.

Ah yes, I forgot SK. Is the DL 762 only going JFK-LAX then?

As for VX, do they feed VS's 744 to LHR from SAN, PHX etc.?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: southwest737500
Posted 2012-12-17 07:55:52 and read 16705 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 4):

Dude VX doesn't even fly to PHX and VS doesn't even fly to SAN or PHX

Also DL doesn't operate the 762 anymore

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: planespotting
Posted 2012-12-17 08:46:46 and read 16650 times.

I'm flying SFO-NRT and SYD-SFO in February and am stuck on the old 747-400 for both legs. I typically don't poo-poo any chance to fly a 744, but since I'm not in J the experience won't exactly be pleasant, especially for 11 and 13 hours at a time.

Anyone know the timeline on the 747-400s as the main TranPac metal for UA (out of SFO and LAX), and will the replacements end up as two 787s for one 744, or just shifting currently in-fleet 777s around to reduce capacity overall?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: shengzhurou
Posted 2012-12-17 09:14:13 and read 16610 times.

SQ will operate A380 on the SFO-HKG flight soon, CX will is keeping the 744 for a while, since their SFO base crew are 747 only, a triple daily 77W could happen if more loads on business class. UA's 744 are mainland base out from SFO in which I tried to avoid for going NRT or HKG. No Hawaii for VX at the moment until the ETOPS A320 arrive, rumor that they have frozen the ETOPS program. we still see KLM's MD11 in the winter.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-17 09:44:38 and read 16552 times.

Southwest-I thought VX flew to PHX. Oops.
My question, which may have been phrased confusingly, is whether VS and VX codeshare on each other's flights for routings where VS operates LHR-SFO and VX operates SFO-smaller city.
Overall, is VX ex-SFO interested in any connecting traffic or only point-to-point?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-17 09:52:28 and read 16538 times.

Also, is there any chance AI will launch their strange DEL-SIN-SFO flight as they suggested?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: iowaman
Posted 2012-12-17 10:51:47 and read 16462 times.

Any one know how WN is performing in SFO? Certainly must be decent as they have added a little over the past few years since the station was opened (unlike IAD which has been cut since station opening). Is there any terminal/ramp space for them to add additional flights? I would expect any expansion by any airline will be fairly limited in SFO due to delays and limited space.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Superfly
Posted 2012-12-17 10:57:29 and read 16450 times.

Quoting planespotting (Reply 6):
Anyone know the timeline on the 747-400s as the main TranPac metal for UA (out of SFO

SFO will remain 747-400s to Tokyo.  
Enjoy the 747s while you can. The new interiors on UA are just fine in coach. I've done the SFO-NRT leg in the new coach and it was fine.

Quoting planespotting (Reply 6):
will the replacements end up as two 787s for one 744, or just shifting currently in-fleet 777s around to reduce capacity overall?

All the other UA NRT destinations will be downgraded to a 777.
LAX will downgrade to a 787.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: PHX787
Posted 2012-12-17 11:06:44 and read 16413 times.

Greetings from the desert  
Quoting southwest737500 (Reply 1):
TPA,CLT,BNA,DEN,PHX maybe

I keep hearing about VX starting up at PHX from SFO but everyone I have talked to has drawn so much speculation to the profitability of it.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 11):
SFO will remain 747-400s to Tokyo.

Love it  

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: B747forever
Posted 2012-12-17 11:07:37 and read 16417 times.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
I believe SAS will be starting service in the spring with their beautiful A340s.



Yes, will be CPH-SFO 6x weekly beginning April 8.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Superfly
Posted 2012-12-17 11:16:10 and read 16389 times.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 13):
Yes, will be CPH-SFO 6x weekly beginning April 8.

Sadly they're dropping Bangkok.
I lived in San Francisco for 15 years and SAS always 'talked' about coming to San Francisco and nothing happened. Then I move to Bangkok and now SAS is dropping Bangkok in favor of San Francisco.
SAS doesn't like me.  

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-17 11:17:12 and read 16396 times.

Welcome to SFO Dolphin

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 9):

Also, is there any chance AI will launch their strange DEL-SIN-SFO flight as they suggested?

No

Quoting planespotting (Reply 6):
nyone know the timeline on the 747-400s as the main TranPac metal for UA (out of SFO and LAX), and will the replacements end up as two 787s for one 744, or just shifting currently in-fleet 777s around to reduce capacity overall?

The 747's are all being moved to SFO. There will be 2 flights operating from LAX, but rotated back when need to SFO for maintenance.



Quoting iowaman (Reply 10):
Any one know how WN is performing in SFO?

They are doing well according to an inside source. However I don't see much expansion while they merger/transition continues with AirTran. Also, they have no additional gate space available to them.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
I believe SAS will be starting service in the spring with their beautiful A340s.

Service begins April 8th with 6 weekly (X2) CPH

An addition to this, China Eastern has express they will start service April 6th SFO-PEK

http://airlineroute.net/2012/08/14/mu-sfo-s13/

On an exciting note for UA, the steel for concourse E has arrived and is starting to go up. We should see the full frame work doen in the coming months.

The new ATC tower is well underway between T-1 and T-2. I don't know the timeframe for when you will see the structure moving up. Currently the underground work is being done, but there has been a 200 ft crane in place for about 2 weeks, so could be soon for a frame to show.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-17 11:18:05 and read 16390 times.

Nice thread.

A couple of other notes.

MU will restart their PVG-SFO service coming April on a daily A332.

UN applied for seasonal service twice a week this coming Spring.

Non aviation but airport related. SFO will once again have an onsite Hotel. It will be located in a current overflow lot near the A- Pier of the International Terminal. It will not be connected to the Terminal but I would expect the air train to be reconfigured to allow access. No word on the operator.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: PSA727LAX
Posted 2012-12-17 11:23:23 and read 16374 times.

Quoting planespotting (Reply 6):
Quoting planespotting (Reply 6):
Anyone know the timeline on the 747-400s as the main TranPac metal for UA (out of SFO and LAX), and will the replacements end up as two 787s for one 744, or just shifting currently in-fleet 777s around to reduce capacity overall?

Per another thread last week on 787s out of SFO & LAX it appears UA plans on using the 787 exclusively out of LAX and will continue the 744/777 out of SFO. The 777 rules the roost at SFO for long haul routes across the Pacific.

Per AA & VX they both are enjoyin the new T2 but not sure that VX has any firm expansion plans for Q1 of 2013. My guess is they will have a formal announcement in mid January regarding new slot pairings. I know that SMF has been courting them for the new Terminal B. AA most likely will need to sort out the issue of merge or not before they offer up any new slot pairs.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: panpan
Posted 2012-12-17 11:24:26 and read 16374 times.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 13):
Yes, will be CPH-SFO 6x weekly beginning April 8.

I hope this route does well. SAS has a great product and CPH is a wonderful airport to arrive in/connect through.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Superfly
Posted 2012-12-17 11:25:11 and read 16371 times.

Quoting as739x (Reply 15):
An addition to this, China Eastern has express they will start service April 6th SFO-PEK

Nice!
Great to see some more 4-engine aircraft coming to San Francisco.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-17 11:33:25 and read 16354 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 16):

You beat me to the correction Legs. PVG!!

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-17 11:35:15 and read 16353 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 16):
Non aviation but airport related. SFO will once again have an onsite Hotel. It will be located in a current overflow lot near the A- Pier of the International Terminal. It will not be connected to the Terminal but I would expect the air train to be reconfigured to allow access. No word on the operator.

Funny you mention that. I dropped my wife of this morning at 4am to work a flight and the lot was being used with a bus operating through it. They got that lot up and running fast.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: B747forever
Posted 2012-12-17 11:41:43 and read 16341 times.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 14):
Sadly they're dropping Bangkok.



In order to operate SFO SAS have to drop a long haul destination because of the limited long haul fleet.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-17 11:46:13 and read 16321 times.

Quoting PSA727LAX (Reply 17):
The 777 rules the roost at SFO for long haul routes across the Pacific.

Very much the opposite. The 747 will be the dominate bird T-PAC

This summer. Daily 747 across the Pacific

SFO-NRT 747
SFO-KIX 747 (as of June)
SFO-ICN 747
SFO-PVG 747
SFO-PEK 747
SFO-HKG 747
SFO-SYD 747

and

SFO-NRT 777
SFO-TPE 777

In addition to T-PAC this summer

SFO-FRA 747 (2 daily
SFO-LHR 747 daily in addition to a 777

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: B747forever
Posted 2012-12-17 11:50:36 and read 16312 times.

Quoting as739x (Reply 23):
Quoting PSA727LAX (Reply 17):
The 777 rules the roost at SFO for long haul routes across the Pacific.


Very much the opposite. The 747 will be the dominate bird T-PAC

Isnt the whole UA 747 fleet going to be based at SFO?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-17 11:53:09 and read 16796 times.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 24):

Yes, your correct. All other flight will rotate the 747's to/back from SFO as needed. The ORD 747 pilot base is in the process of closing as well.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: B747forever
Posted 2012-12-17 11:55:51 and read 16736 times.

Quoting as739x (Reply 25):
All other flight will rotate the 747's to/back from SFO as needed. The ORD 747 pilot base is in the process of closing as well.



Then the 744 will only do SFO-XXX-SFO rotations?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-17 12:09:09 and read 17013 times.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 26):

Most of the time. Most flights will return to SFO. The SYD flight could rotate back to LAX to support the LAX-SYD flight.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: B747forever
Posted 2012-12-17 12:13:57 and read 16948 times.

Quoting as739x (Reply 27):
Most of the time. Most flights will return to SFO. The SYD flight could rotate back to LAX to support the LAX-SYD flight.



Oh, of course, I forgot about the LAX-SYD 744. Should have known that one.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2012-12-17 12:15:31 and read 16998 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Thread starter):

I am planning to relocate to the environs of SFO next year,

Welcome to town! What brings you here?

Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
I believe SAS will be starting service in the spring with their beautiful A340s

Woot! A340's make me so happy.  
Quoting as739x (Reply 23):

SFO-FRA 747 (2 daily
SFO-LHR 747 daily in addition to a 777

SFO-LHR has a UA 744 and UA 777, two BA 744's and a VS 744.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-17 12:33:18 and read 16921 times.

Quoting as739x (Reply 21):
Funny you mention that. I dropped my wife of this morning at 4am to work a flight and the lot was being used with a bus operating through it. They got that lot up and running fast.

They certainly did. They have light polls and everything.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-17 14:03:21 and read 16810 times.

@Doc—I won't move until (most likely) the fall but I'll be studying in the Bay Area.

How serious is TK's desire to fly to SFO? It seems like a good 3x weekly 77W route to offer connections to India and the Middle East. Neither EY nor QR has announced a flight to California yet so TK could fill that gap. Also, as a *A hub SFO must have lots of *A FFs.

For an out-of-the-box idea, what about BA sending a 788 (though the 763 has the legs) to SJC?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2012-12-17 14:41:56 and read 16743 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 31):

@Doc—I won't move until (most likely) the fall but I'll be studying in the Bay Area.

This wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that Stanford released their Early Admission decisions on Friday, would it?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Superfly
Posted 2012-12-17 15:04:43 and read 16747 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 31):
For an out-of-the-box idea, what about BA sending a 788 (though the 763 has the legs) to SJC?

Why?
They send two 747s daily to SFO which is just 35 miles away from SJC.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: B747forever
Posted 2012-12-17 15:18:29 and read 16702 times.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 33):
Why?
They send two 747s daily to SFO which is just 35 miles away from SJC



Well BA and AA have together 13 daily flights to JFK, and yet BA sends another 3 daily flights to EWR. Distance between JFK and EWR, 21 miles.

It might not be a fair comparison, because the NYC market is much larger, but point is, there might still be a demand for a SJC flight to LHR in the future, even if it is so close to SFO.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-17 15:32:25 and read 16614 times.

@B747, that was my analysis as well. I fly NYC-CDG a lot and the fact that BA serves both EWR and ORY in addition to JFK and CDG is a huge plus. San Jose is a large city, and the Silicon Valley area has large links (both wealthy VFR and business) to places like IKA, BOM, BLR etc. Being the only longhaul carrier at an airport certainly helps, and BA would get this at SJC (NH doesn't count because with the exception of California-India, BA and NH don't connect on similar routes.

I know that in NJ many people will pay a premium to avoid flying out of JFK, is that the case with SJC in the South Bay or is SJC's international network too weak for that to be a question?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Superfly
Posted 2012-12-17 15:45:05 and read 16565 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 35):
is that the case with SJC in the South Bay or is SJC's international network too weak for that to be a question?

SFO is a great airport and I rarely hear of complaints about catching flights out of SFO. It's only problem is fog.
SJC is much smaller and smaller than EWR.
AA used to have a 777 to NRT out of SJC but I can't think of any international service out of SJC to Europe or Asia.
There may be service to Mexico but I'm not sure.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-17 15:51:15 and read 16518 times.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 36):
AA used to have a 777 to NRT out of SJC but I can't think of any international service out of SJC to Europe or Asia.
There may be service to Mexico but I'm not sure.

AA also did SJC-CDG and SJC-TPE for about 6 monhts in 2001. 9/11 helped end that. As you noted, Asia did in fact have international service from SJC since NRT is in Asia. CDG was SJC's only Europe non-stop ever.

AA was about to start LGW and GDL about the same time, but it never happened. If it had, AA would have had international flights from SJC to LGW, CDG, NRT, TPE and GDL.

SJC currently has GDL on AS and Volaris and SJD on AS, the latter being seasonal. MX also flew to Morelia and I think MEX at one time. AS also once had seasonal service to PVR. AC did YYZ for several years and YOW for a very short time (for high tech traffic). QQ, Air Cal, AA and Canadian Regional Airlines each did SJC-YVR at one time or another. There in no current Canada service from SJC.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2012-12-17 15:58:51 and read 16495 times.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 36):
SFO is a great airport and I rarely hear of complaints about catching flights out of SFO. It's only problem is fog.

That "only" is a big problem. If the weather isn't clear, delays of ~3h are pretty common. Leaving that aside, SFO is a great airport.

SJC really isn't an alternative to SFO for most of the Bay Area because it's really at the extreme south end of the Bay Area and it doesn't have an awful lot of service. Back in the 1990's when AA had a hub there, it made more sense in the middle of a silicon boom, but it's very far from SF, far from a good portion of Silicon Valley (the break-even point is rougly at Stanford), and far from the East Bay.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-17 16:20:45 and read 16357 times.

I guess. So do you think NH's SJC flight will be able to hold?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-17 16:21:39 and read 16404 times.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 38):
SJC really isn't an alternative to SFO for most of the Bay Area because it's really at the extreme south end of the Bay Area and it doesn't have an awful lot of service. Back in the 1990's when AA had a hub there, it made more sense in the middle of a silicon boom, but it's very far from SF, far from a good portion of Silicon Valley (the break-even point is rougly at Stanford), and far from the East Bay.

A friend of mine lives near the 92/280 interchange in San Mateo. He used to fly out of SJC, over SFO, for business trips to places like NRT and BOS because he felt it was so much more convenient to get in and out of than SFO. San Mateo is much closer to SFO than SJC, yet here's an example of someone who preferred SJC.

What's the cachement area for SJC itself, something like 2 million people?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-17 16:25:26 and read 16370 times.

Well, if every other day the NH flight gets two Silicon Valley businessmen going to Tokyo who are ready to pay a premium to have only a 10 minute drive to the airport, that in itself may turn the flight from money-bleeding to profitable. However, I'm sure that only NH management knows the profitability of their own flights.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: UA735WL
Posted 2012-12-17 16:45:17 and read 16258 times.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 38):
SJC really isn't an alternative to SFO for most of the Bay Area because it's really at the extreme south end of the Bay Area and it doesn't have an awful lot of service. Back in the 1990's when AA had a hub there, it made more sense in the middle of a silicon boom, but it's very far from SF, far from a good portion of Silicon Valley (the break-even point is rougly at Stanford), and far from the East Bay.

I think that SJC could really benefit from the proposed (controversial?) BART extension into Santa Clara county, with a similar BART arrangement as SFO. I'm sure that they would be able to draw business pax from SFO and the rest of the Bay Area looking to escape the roulette-esque delays at SFO. Heck, I used to know businessmen from my old digs up in Berkeley who were willing to make the hour-long drive to SJC to bypass SFO.
But then again, that was around 11 years ago when SJC still had transpacific service.... Under the same situation, though, I also think that SJC could capture leisure pax from SFO if the Y fares were low enough to be competitive with OAK.

[Edited 2012-12-17 16:51:36]

[Edited 2012-12-17 16:53:52]

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-17 17:00:20 and read 16190 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 39):
I guess. So do you think NH's SJC flight will be able to hold?

I don't see why not. AA's SJC-NRT flight used to do very well until AA gave up on SJC. The 787 is a smaller airplane and very economical to operate. I assume that NH has done their homework and traffic projections and are marketing and advertising very well. From what I know of NH, those folks at HND are not dummies. If they let San Jose talk them into flying into SJC, I expect that they feel it will be successful and be able to hold.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2012-12-17 17:05:09 and read 16139 times.

Well, I still didn't find out where you just found out you'll be studying. Hoping it is, indeed, my alma mater.  

We will need to do an SFO Airport Meetup. The favored place is El Torito, which is a Mexican place with a view on the 28's.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: warden145
Posted 2012-12-17 17:35:57 and read 16017 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 43):
I don't see why not. AA's SJC-NRT flight used to do very well until AA gave up on SJC. The 787 is a smaller airplane and very economical to operate. I assume that NH has done their homework and traffic projections and are marketing and advertising very well. From what I know of NH, those folks at HND are not dummies. If they let San Jose talk them into flying into SJC, I expect that they feel it will be successful and be able to hold.

Couple that with the fact that a large percentage of the Bay Area's senior executives live in the South Bay, and many of them would love nothing more than to be able to bypass SFO in favor of SJC, I suspect that NH's service will do well.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 38):
That "only" is a big problem. If the weather isn't clear, delays of ~3h are pretty common. Leaving that aside, SFO is a great airport.

What he said. I don't fly as much as I'd like to these days, but my job has me practically living at SFO, and I regularly have the "pleasure" of sitting around and waiting 3 or 4 hours for pax on the delayed flights. "Frustrating" is an understatement...

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 38):
SJC really isn't an alternative to SFO for most of the Bay Area because it's really at the extreme south end of the Bay Area and it doesn't have an awful lot of service. Back in the 1990's when AA had a hub there, it made more sense in the middle of a silicon boom, but it's very far from SF, far from a good portion of Silicon Valley (the break-even point is rougly at Stanford), and far from the East Bay.

You make a good point; OTOH I think there's enough of a population base in the South Bay that I think SJC can still be a viable alternative, especially since a considerable portion of the Bay Area's wealth is in the South Bay (Saratoga, Los Gatos, Los Altos, etc). The biggest issue is a lack of service...I've lost track of how many clients I've driven who've flown out of SFO but would have preferred SJC...

BTW, good thread    nice to see the SFO area finally get some love...now, if only someone (WN or VX) would start an SFO-BUR flight to compete with UA Express's ridiculous fares...

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-17 17:37:47 and read 16057 times.

As we all know, SQ will start service into SFO this month on SQ 1/2 using their A380. I snapped these shots at SFO of a display. Out of curiosity, how much does one of these models cost? I would say a couple of thousand.






Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-17 17:47:58 and read 15946 times.

Quoting warden145 (Reply 45):
Couple that with the fact that a large percentage of the Bay Area's senior executives live in the South Bay, and many of them would love nothing more than to be able to bypass SFO in favor of SJC, I suspect that NH's service will do well.

Another question is would these CEO types settle for J as the NH flight will not have an F class? IMO, the new SJC flight is not really a new market for NH but an extension of their SFO flight. NH has added double daily into JFK,LAX and ORD(?) the last year or so.

SFO still handles 90% + of the nonstop International traffic into the Bay Area.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 43):
AA's SJC-NRT flight used to do very well until AA gave up on SJC.

AA is on record stating the flight was losing money the last couple of years before cancellation. After the LAX-NRT flight was added and the pull down of the SJC hub, it was a natural goner.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: PHX787
Posted 2012-12-17 17:52:31 and read 15914 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 46):
As we all know, SQ will start service into SFO this month on SQ 1/2 using their A380. I snapped these shots at SFO of a display. Out of curiosity, how much does one of these models cost? I would say a couple of thousand.

Where is this connecting to? HKG?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-17 17:57:33 and read 15894 times.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 48):
Where is this connecting to? HKG?

Yes, routing is SIN-HKG-SFO

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: 9V-SPJ
Posted 2012-12-17 18:19:04 and read 15790 times.

@ DolphinAir747, welcome to the Bay Area in advance!

@ DocLightning, an SFO meetup sounds fun! I enjoy going to the park opposite the Westin, especially when the heavies to Europe or Asia are leaving the A gates!

I am debating on whether to fly the NH B788 to NRT to DEL or the SQ WhaleJet.... Lets see what the price gods say early next year!

9V-SPJ

[Edited 2012-12-17 18:19:23]

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: warden145
Posted 2012-12-17 18:20:23 and read 15766 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 47):
Another question is would these CEO types settle for J as the NH flight will not have an F class?

That's a fair question and I'm not sure as to the answer. However, I get the impression that it's getting more and more difficult for corporate travelers (except those at the VERY top) to even be allowed to fly Business, let alone First Class, so I'm not sure how much of an effect that'll have.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 47):
SFO still handles 90% + of the nonstop International traffic into the Bay Area.

That is true, and I would be very surprised if that changed. However, I think a few SJC flights would be successful as a niche.

Re: SQ's A380 service, IIRC it's being started as a seasonal service. I want to say that it's ending in March, but I don't remember off the top of my head. Does anyone know if it's going to be permanently seasonal, or is this a trial period to see if it works and may become permanent later?

[Edited 2012-12-17 18:21:37]

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-17 18:50:40 and read 15543 times.

Quoting warden145 (Reply 51):
Re: SQ's A380 service, IIRC it's being started as a seasonal service. I want to say that it's ending in March, but I don't remember off the top of my head. Does anyone know if it's going to be permanently seasonal, or is this a trial period to see if it works and may become permanent later?

They may be trying a AF move and bring it in to test the market. AF brought in their A380 last summer season due to the Japan tragedy and drop off in traffic. SQ was using their A380 on the JFK run but I tend to believe the traffic drops off during the Winter season from Europe. LH extended their A380 into SFO through the Holiday season.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-17 20:58:13 and read 15081 times.

9V, how about via FRA so you can get the A380 and the 747-8i? However, that does require connecting at FEA

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-17 21:09:55 and read 15028 times.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 19):
Quoting as739x (Reply 15):
An addition to this, China Eastern has express they will start service April 6th SFO-PEK

Nice!
Great to see some more 4-engine aircraft coming to San Francisco.

Will be a A332. So only 2 engines.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2012-12-17 21:36:29 and read 14947 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 47):
AA is on record stating the flight was losing money the last couple of years before cancellation. After the LAX-NRT flight was added and the pull down of the SJC hub, it was a natural goner.

At present SJC-NRT might be able to support a 787 daily. I think JL is going to give it a try (or is it NH?).

I see it as being better as a domestic hub. SFO has better connections to Bay Area transit, domestic connections, etc. etc. etc.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: 9V-SPJ
Posted 2012-12-17 21:41:47 and read 14930 times.

@ DolphinAir747... hadn't looked at LH, but having just looked now, its about $500 more than SIA!

Lets see if the price goes down!

Thanks for the suggestion  

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-17 21:50:17 and read 14900 times.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 55):
At present SJC-NRT might be able to support a 787 daily. I think JL is going to give it a try (or is it NH?).

Yes, NH will start service on the NRT-SJC route next month. The layout of NH's 787 is 46J and 112 Y. One thing that might help this flight is the connections out of NRT and any cargo that may be carried.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-17 21:57:32 and read 14873 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 57):
Quoting DocLightning (Reply 55):
At present SJC-NRT might be able to support a 787 daily. I think JL is going to give it a try (or is it NH?).

Yes, NH will start service on the NRT-SJC route next month. The layout of NH's 787 is 46J and 112 Y. One thing that might help this flight is the connections out of NRT and any cargo that may be carried.

One downside is that NH won't have any connections at SJC. At most there might be a UA SJC-DEN connection.

AA had connections from the NRT-SJC flight to SNA, SAN, LAX, AUS, LAS, BOS, DFW, SEA, etc. But as I said, I'm still optimistic that it will work, or NH wouldn't be starting it. From what I know of NH, they are a well-run airline with smart leadership.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-17 22:03:58 and read 14855 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 58):
One downside is that NH won't have any connections at SJC. At most there might be a UA SJC-DEN connection.

This is why I believe it will primarily be O&D on the SJC side. NH can use SFO as their connection points to the rest of the US.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Asiaflyer
Posted 2012-12-17 22:50:50 and read 14744 times.

Quoting warden145 (Reply 51):
Re: SQ's A380 service, IIRC it's being started as a seasonal service. I want to say that it's ending in March, but I don't remember off the top of my head. Does anyone know if it's going to be permanently seasonal, or is this a trial period to see if it works and may become permanent later?


It is just a seasonal change. The SIN-HKG-SFO A380s are coming from SIN-FRA-JFK, which gets the 77W Dec 28 until Mar 23.
After Mar 23 the aircrafts are swapped again so SIN-JFK goes back to A380 and SIN-HKG-SFO becomes 77W again.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Superfly
Posted 2012-12-18 00:01:44 and read 14580 times.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 44):
We will need to do an SFO Airport Meetup. The favored place is El Torito, which is a Mexican place with a view on the 28's.

I had fun hanging out at the last meet there with HoonsAir a few years ago.
I really miss the early Airliners.net meets inside the TWA terminal back in 2000 and 2001.
Wow that sounds so dated now. Impossible for non-ticket holders to be inside the airport and of course TWA is no longer with us.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 54):
Will be a A332. So only 2 engines.

Darn.  

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Irishpower
Posted 2012-12-18 02:06:00 and read 14375 times.

What about these airlines and destinations? Some are new (and may have been rumored) and some used to have service-

SU to SVO
VN to SGN
JQ to SYD or BNE
CZ to CAN
AB to TXL or DUS
Any airline to GRU
EY to AUH
and as mentioned above AI to BOM or DEL

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: B747forever
Posted 2012-12-18 02:09:24 and read 14369 times.

Quoting Irishpower (Reply 62):
AB to TXL or DUS

Isnt Air Berlin returning to the summer?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: chiawei
Posted 2012-12-18 02:09:39 and read 14390 times.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 38):
SJC really isn't an alternative to SFO for most of the Bay Area because it's really at the extreme south end of the Bay Area and it doesn't have an awful lot of service. Back in the 1990's when AA had a hub there, it made more sense in the middle of a silicon boom, but it's very far from SF, far from a good portion of Silicon Valley (the break-even point is rougly at Stanford), and far from the East Bay.

What are you talking about?

Majority of hi-tech company are much closer to SJC than SFO. Apple, Cisco, Google, FB... etc are all closer to SJC.

I would glad to pay slightly more to fly out of SJC instead of SFO. SJC is too small to handle international traffic. But it does not mean customers are happy to go up north to catch flight out of SFO.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: chiawei
Posted 2012-12-18 02:17:34 and read 14381 times.

Quoting Asiaflyer (Reply 60):
It is just a seasonal change. The SIN-HKG-SFO A380s are coming from SIN-FRA-JFK, which gets the 77W Dec 28 until Mar 23.
After Mar 23 the aircrafts are swapped again so SIN-JFK goes back to A380 and SIN-HKG-SFO becomes 77W again.

I really would hope SQ makes this permanent change.

I flew on SQ1 on 12th and will return on SQ2 on 23rd. The J is pretty much full.

I miss the first A380 flight on 12/22. SQ is sending the A380 on friday. For that just one day before the 28th official launch.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: warden145
Posted 2012-12-18 07:14:05 and read 13895 times.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 63):
Isnt Air Berlin returning to the summer?

Nope  
http://www.airberlingroup.com/en/pre...2013-inspired-by-efficiency-drive-

Quote:
The United States are a strategic growth market for airberlin. This will continue to be the case in the future. By restructuring its network in North America, airberlin has set the course for further growth in this market from summer 2013 onwards. The new non-stop service between Berlin and the American Airlines hub of Chicago from March 2013 underpins the strategy of the second largest German airline as regards developing the existing synergies from that association.

Against this background, airberlin will also be increasing its non-stop services to New York JFK, Los Angeles and Miami from May 2013 onwards, while at the same time cancelling its seasonal non-stop flights from Düsseldorf to Las Vegas, San Francisco and Vancouver.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: mikeology
Posted 2012-12-18 09:33:27 and read 13807 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 40):
A friend of mine lives near the 92/280 interchange in San Mateo. He used to fly out of SJC, over SFO, for business trips to places like NRT and BOS because he felt it was so much more convenient to get in and out of than SFO. San Mateo is much closer to SFO than SJC, yet here's an example of someone who preferred SJC.

I also live in San Mateo and have not once in my life taking a flight from SJC. Granted I only take about 3 international trips a years and maybe some hops down to so-cal I have never once been delayed. Maybe i'm lucky. Its just funny to hear all the talk about fog and not once in my 27 years of existence been affected by it. Just sayin

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 44):
We will need to do an SFO Airport Meetup. The favored place is El Torito, which is a Mexican place with a view on the 28's.

That would be awesome. Can I join? Lol. Also Elephant bar is a good view point too

Quoting B747forever (Reply 63):
Isnt Air Berlin returning to the summer?

Nope. Glad I got to try it while I was hear. Loads sucked so i'm not surprised

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-18 10:08:08 and read 13766 times.

Quoting mikeology (Reply 67):
Quoting DocLightning (Reply 44):
We will need to do an SFO Airport Meetup. The favored place is El Torito, which is a Mexican place with a view on the 28's.

That would be awesome. Can I join? Lol. Also Elephant bar is a good view point too

I'm flying to San Jose tomorrow afternoon for the holidays and will have some free time for a few days before the girlfriend arrives on Saturday (not sure she'd like to sit there and watch airplanes all day with other A.net geeks). I'd love to join in.

Might you be doing your meet-up this week? Where is the Elephant Bar? Is that out in that waterfront area in Burlingame near the 28s? (been so long since I lived in that area, I forget the name of that road).

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2012-12-18 10:12:57 and read 13761 times.

Quoting mikeology (Reply 67):
That would be awesome. Can I join? Lol. Also Elephant bar is a good view point too

Yes, but the drinks are expensive and the food is "meh."

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-18 10:19:46 and read 13752 times.

Quoting Irishpower (Reply 62):
SU to SVO
VN to SGN
JQ to SYD or BNE
CZ to CAN
AB to TXL or DUS
Any airline to GRU
EY to AUH
and as mentioned above AI to BOM or DEL

VN: No, not unless they stop enroute. The flights to long and a very low yield route
JQ: QF just dropped SFO last year, why would they launch this with JQ
CZ: They are busy flying empty A380's to LAX. No need to start SFO. UA has route authority on SFO-CAN
AB: Stated below, just been dropped
EY: Been talked about, but honestly haven't heard anything new.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 63):
Isnt Air Berlin returning to the summer?

No, they will not be returning next summer

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: mikeology
Posted 2012-12-18 10:25:51 and read 13748 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 68):
Where is the Elephant Bar?

Right next to El Torrito  
Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 68):
I forget the name of that road)

Bayshore Highway even though its a continuation of Airport Blvd

Found this when I went to dinner with some friends at a local Japanese restaurant this past Saturday

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: B747forever
Posted 2012-12-18 10:26:29 and read 13727 times.

Quoting warden145 (Reply 66):
Nope http://www.airberlingroup.com/en/pre...rive-

What a pity!

Well at least they will be seen at LAX.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: turk0167
Posted 2012-12-18 11:09:23 and read 13692 times.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 36):
It's only problem is fog.

Not to worry. I'm sure the California senators will soon be introducing new fog control legislation.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2012-12-18 11:12:05 and read 13685 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 68):

Might you be doing your meet-up this week?

This week is a bad week. Christmas, then New Year's. Better to wait until after the holidays.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-18 11:38:51 and read 13665 times.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 74):
Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 68):

Might you be doing your meet-up this week?

This week is a bad week. Christmas, then New Year's. Better to wait until after the holidays.

Yeah, but I won't be in town then.   I'm in the Bay Area from 12/19-12/31. Then back to the lovely Pacific Northwest.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2012-12-18 11:51:38 and read 13658 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 75):

Yeah, but I won't be in town then.

Well, poo!

Anyway, both El Torito and Elephant Bar are south/east of SFO on the shore of the bay. They are both at the eastern end of the 28's. Especially fun when takeoffs are off the 19's. Your smartphone should be able to tell you. Elephant Bar is sort of California Fusion-esque cuisine. They're a national (international?) chain, so you can check out their website. I've never been a huge fan of their food, and they are a bit pricey. El Torito is Mexican food with good (not amazing) margaritas and good (not amazing) Mexican food, but prices are reasonable. The other favorite local spotting spot is BayShore Park, which is just before the Hyatt (I think it's the Hyatt).

Also, Benihana has a restaurant some ways down the road. When you walk in, if you go to the sushi bar side (to the left when you walk in the door) that dining room has a beautiful view right down the 28's.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-18 12:37:56 and read 13582 times.

Judging by their expansion rate, TK seems the most likely...however not every "announced destination has become a reality.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-18 13:18:22 and read 13560 times.

Quoting mikeology (Reply 67):
Nope. Glad I got to try it while I was hear. Loads sucked so i'm not surprised

AB averaged a 80-85% LF for the summer season so that really was not the issue. They are in an identity crisis. Am I scheduled or charter and am I focusing on leisure or business paxs. They are not doing well financially and just sold their frequent flier program. In the end, they are doing what QF did at SFO. Focus on their OW hubs and partners. They are closing LAS and YVR also.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-18 13:39:46 and read 13524 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 78):
AB averaged a 80-85% LF for the summer season so that really was not the issue. They are in an identity crisis. Am I scheduled or charter and am I focusing on leisure or business paxs.

That describes the situation well, in addition to the whole alliance problem.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2012-12-18 13:55:46 and read 13505 times.

If we do something that is not this calendar year, I will attend it.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-18 14:03:24 and read 13499 times.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 80):
If we do something that is not this calendar year, I will attend it.

NS

Send me a note please if you do. I'll be traveling back to SJC every month or two for family reasons in the upcoming months. I'd love to join you guys if I'm down there. Thanks.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Turkish350XWB
Posted 2012-12-18 14:09:22 and read 13526 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Thread starter):
*TK has SFO as part of a large wishlist.

Citing LaxIntl from the Turkish Aviation forum:
IST-LAX: 77% LF, 45% O&D vs 53% transfer, top 5 destinations IKA, BEY, TLV, BOM, AMM
As loads seem to be good SFO makes perfectly sense to me as capacity will be added to the entire west-coast.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: chiawei
Posted 2012-12-18 15:11:59 and read 13454 times.

Quoting mikeology (Reply 67):
I also live in San Mateo and have not once in my life taking a flight from SJC. Granted I only take about 3 international trips a years and maybe some hops down to so-cal I have never once been delayed. Maybe i'm lucky. Its just funny to hear all the talk about fog and not once in my 27 years of existence been affected by it. Just sayin

I fly international once a month (made UA GS every year for last 5 years- usually able to renew status about 7 months into the year).

Fog is a problem for me. I have been delayed by Fog about three times this year. Usually on the inbound flights from Asia that arrives early in the morning. To me its pain in the rear.

In addition, because of all UA international arrival in the morning, often it would take close to an hour to get out of baggage claim. Even traveling in J, I have never made out of SFO in less than 30 minutes after getting off the plane. Those three times i was delayed, i was not able to get out of airport until close to 11am, three hours after getting to SFO air space.

I hate SFO. Way too crowded and in-efficient. I fly into Japan, China, Hong Kong, and Singapore a lot. Narita, PVG, HKG, and Changi all do a better job in getting me out of custom. Last week I was able to get out of HKG airport into my limo 12 minutes after landing.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-18 15:32:23 and read 13431 times.

Quoting chiawei (Reply 83):
I hate SFO. Way too crowded and in-efficient. I fly into Japan, China, Hong Kong, and Singapore a lot. Narita, PVG, HKG, and Changi all do a better job in getting me out of custom. Last week I was able to get out of HKG airport into my limo 12 minutes after landing.

Your comparing Apples to Oranges. HKG is a primary Int'l airport, not exactly a lot of domestic service. The comparing USA airports vs. Asia gets old. You seem very bitter about SFO, but the fact is if your a UA GS, then live with it or use NH's new SJC service via NRT to your destination. SFO is what it is.

The fog is a problem, however until the new GPS procedures go into effect it will continue to be so.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-18 15:38:15 and read 13433 times.

Quoting as739x (Reply 84):
The fog is a problem, however until the new GPS procedures go into effect it will continue to be so.

Is AS the only airline that does RNP procedures into SFO? Doesn't WN do them too?

Quoting as739x (Reply 84):
then live with it or use NH's new SJC service via NRT to your destination.

That's not a bad choice. Deal with fog delays and long waits, or fly a NH 787 into the very convenient SJC. That's not a bad deal at all. Hopefully a lot of people will feel the same way and the SJC-NRT flight will prosper. How about a KL AMS-SJC flight while we are at it.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-18 16:14:51 and read 13406 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 85):
That's not a bad choice. Deal with fog delays and long waits, or fly a NH 787 into the very convenient SJC. That's not a bad deal at all. Hopefully a lot of people will feel the same way and the SJC-NRT flight will prosper. How about a KL AMS-SJC flight while we are at it.

As is obvious, SJC biggest problem in the gorilla up the road called SFO. SJC courted BA,VS and EI but nothing ever developed. Will the 787 change this? maybe. SJC is a niche' airport. The big European carriers are not going to fly into SJC and drain their yields/LF out of SFO.

The only Asian carriers I could possibly see is either CI or BR. I would say CI more as BR will shortly be in *A and will have UA as a partner.

Quoting chiawei (Reply 83):
I hate SFO. Way too crowded and in-efficient.

This is not a new thought. But, SFO is poised to have its best passenger year ever with passenger counts surpassing 41 million. If SFO had SJC passenger counts, there would be barely a delay.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: mikeology
Posted 2012-12-18 16:54:37 and read 13369 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 86):
This is not a new thought. But, SFO is poised to have its best passenger year ever with passenger counts surpassing 41 million. If SFO had SJC passenger counts, there would be barely a delay.

Funny too is SFO must not see a problem with fog. Taking on what 4 new carriers next year plus an added UA flight?

On a side note is XL Airways coming back next year or was that a one time thing?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-18 17:27:38 and read 13324 times.

Quoting mikeology (Reply 87):
On a side note is XL Airways coming back next year or was that a one time thing?

I would expect XL to come back next summer. So, for S13, there will be 4 daily flights to Paris on certain days of the week.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2012-12-18 17:55:49 and read 13295 times.

Also I will only attend an outing I can access from BART and where nobody is offended I am carrying a flask.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-18 18:08:54 and read 13287 times.

Can anyone supply data to the top 3-5 International destinations not served from SFO?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: adipasqu
Posted 2012-12-18 18:32:23 and read 13292 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 90):
Can anyone supply data to the top 3-5 International destinations not served from SFO?

If I had to guess, I'd say FCO, DME/SVO, DUB, DEL, and BKK might be on that list?

Just a guess, though...

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2012-12-18 18:36:17 and read 13265 times.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 89):

Also I will only attend an outing I can access from BART and where nobody is offended I am carrying a flask.

I'll only be offended if you don't share the contents of said flask.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: mikeology
Posted 2012-12-18 18:39:41 and read 13266 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 90):
Can anyone supply data to the top 3-5 International destinations not served from SFO?
Quoting DocLightning (Reply 92):
I'll only be offended if you don't share the contents of said flask.

It should be noted then that whenever this meet takes place it involves a bar or one in near proximity

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-18 18:54:52 and read 13254 times.

When the new ATC Tower opens, are they planning on tearing down the old Tower? Wishful thinking but it would be nice if they opened an outdoor or even covered observation deck. Kind of like NRT.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: chiawei
Posted 2012-12-18 19:22:43 and read 13256 times.

Quoting as739x (Reply 84):
Your comparing Apples to Oranges. HKG is a primary Int'l airport, not exactly a lot of domestic service. The comparing USA airports vs. Asia gets old. You seem very bitter about SFO, but the fact is if your a UA GS, then live with it or use NH's new SJC service via NRT to your destination. SFO is what it is.

I don't think i am. The SFO international terminal is indep. of domestic operation. So i don't understand the bag issues. UA has shanghai, PEK, HKG, NRT flights coming early morning. I believe those are the only 4 flights that arrives that early. I can somewhat understand number of flights.

HKG on the other hand has a lot more flights coming at morning rush hour. I believe majority of NA flights arrives between 6-9am. But I was still able to come out within 12 min.

I have no choice to live with SFO. But does not mean i like it at all. When ANA starts to NRT from SJC. I will take that flight over UA out of SFO.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 86):
This is not a new thought. But, SFO is poised to have its best passenger year ever with passenger counts surpassing 41 million. If SFO had SJC passenger counts, there would be barely a delay.

I don't know about that. I am still always amazed how UA is not able to handle 4 wide body flight in timely manner. When i come in from Asia. Often it will be packed with UA 838, 858, 888, and 862. Being SFO is UA hub and these flights has been operating for a long time, you would think UA will have enough ground crew to handle bags.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-18 19:55:06 and read 13200 times.

Quoting mikeology (Reply 93):
Quoting legacyins (Reply 90):
Can anyone supply data to the top 3-5 International destinations not served from SFO?
Quoting DocLightning (Reply 92):
I'll only be offended if you don't share the contents of said flask.

It should be noted then that whenever this meet takes place it involves a bar or one in near proximity

Yeah, and your point is?   I like that plan. Liquid refreshments are always in order when engaging in our other favorite hobbies - namely watching airplanes. hope you guys plan it when I'm in town, so I can join in. Otherwise, SEA isn't a bad place to watch plane either - especially if you happen to like somber looking Eskimos.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2012-12-18 19:56:44 and read 13202 times.

Look, I can show up anywhere on the Western seaboard as long as UA flies there and there is a bar.

Just not until the New Year. Cause I'm going to COS tomorrow. During a snowstorm.

Ahh, home.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-18 19:57:22 and read 13236 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 86):
SJC courted BA,VS and EI but nothing ever developed.

SJC also courted NW to put an A330 on SJC-NRT to replace the dearly departed AA 777. Like I said, NH is an excellent carrier from my particular experience with them. I'm really glad they decided to start SJC and I wish them luck, and really expect they'll make it prosper.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-18 19:57:49 and read 13225 times.

Quoting chiawei (Reply 95):
I don't know about that. I am still always amazed how UA is not able to handle 4 wide body flight in timely manner. When i come in from Asia. Often it will be packed with UA 838, 858, 888, and 862. Being SFO is UA hub and these flights has been operating for a long time, you would think UA will have enough ground crew to handle bags.

Well, this is an airline issue you are describing, not an airport issue. There are 4 high capacity baggage carousels in the G- International arrivals. If the ground crews for United are not getting the luggage up in a timely manner, you should ask UA.

I also fly across the Pacific often out of SFO and UA is not my first choice even as *G.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: chiawei
Posted 2012-12-18 20:19:51 and read 13214 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 99):
Well, this is an airline issue you are describing, not an airport issue. There are 4 high capacity baggage carousels in the G- International arrivals. If the ground crews for United are not getting the luggage up in a timely manner, you should ask UA.

I think its mixture of both. Customs at SFO also quiet long- I think they are really short staffed. I was there earlier in the summer when the custom systems crashed and it took them 1 hour to get backup system (ancient pentium laptop) to start clearing custom. Each passenger took about 5 to 10 min to clear. So SFO does have rooms for improvement.

UA- I am already given up on UA in terms of service. But UA is my company preferred carrier, so at times I am forced to take UA. But I have been clever in getting around the system by stopping at places like Seoul and SIN so I can fly SQ.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-18 20:58:52 and read 13171 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 85):
Is AS the only airline that does RNP procedures into SFO? Doesn't WN do them too?

Quoting as739x (Reply 84):

Actually back when AS did the RNP program it never got launched. Even though it was approved, NorCal needed an additional controller and they wouldn't do it. They later approved the controller and all aircraft that are able/approved can do the RNAV approaches as far as I know.

Quoting mikeology (Reply 87):
Funny too is SFO must not see a problem with fog. Taking on what 4 new carriers next year plus an added UA flight?

Int'l carrier don't fall into the delay program. They could care less. As long as they plan for holding fuel and have planned alternates they will be fine.

United new service is the same. TPE/CDG will just have local holds. The new FLL service arrived in the evening which is not as delayed prone as am 8a-1130a.

Quoting chiawei (Reply 95):
I don't think i am. The SFO international terminal is indep. of domestic operation. So i don't understand the bag issues. UA has shanghai, PEK, HKG, NRT flights coming early morning. I believe those are the only 4 flights that arrives that early. I can somewhat understand number of flights.

Sorry I am not following all your arguements. If its the baggage time or ATC delays?? If it's the baggage issue I can give you many reason, none that I can discuss on a public forum in my current position. But again you comparing Asian city's vs. US city's, that all i will get into there.

Quoting chiawei (Reply 100):
I think its mixture of both. Customs at SFO also quiet long- I think they are really short staffed

This is my personal opinion, but you do come off Anti-SFO here. Iv'e recently flown Int'l into LAX/IAD and IAH during arrival banks and SFO moved faster then all of these.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-18 21:02:08 and read 13196 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 94):
When the new ATC Tower opens, are they planning on tearing down the old Tower? Wishful thinking but it would be nice if they opened an outdoor or even covered observation deck. Kind of like NRT.

All coming down. Both ATC and Shadow Tower as well as the 6 level bulding below. All non-FAA offices have already been reloacted from the building, with the exception of the company offices contructing the new tower.

T-2 will look much different in a few years.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-18 21:05:09 and read 13190 times.

Quoting chiawei (Reply 100):
I think its mixture of both. Customs at SFO also quiet long- I think they are really short staffed. I was there earlier in the summer when the custom systems crashed and it took them 1 hour to get backup system (ancient pentium laptop) to start clearing custom. Each passenger took about 5 to 10 min to clear. So SFO does have rooms for improvement.

I have a little experience here. Yes, if the systems go down, it is all stop. It needs to go up the chain of command to go to the various backup procedures. Not sure if you remember, about two summers ago, same thing happened at LAX. Thousands of passengers in the arrivals hall, passengers held on arriving aircraft. Total disaster.

Staffing is always an issue, no matter where you are. They use ratios in determining Officers to passengers. It use to be 45 to 1. Still in the end, there is always one passenger out there that might be of a concern. Better to play it safe and have a little inconvenience than not to have the Golden Gate Bridge in the morning, if you know what I mean.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-19 06:05:12 and read 13026 times.

Has TK announced an official start date to SFO yet?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-19 10:07:09 and read 12953 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 104):
Has TK announced an official start date to SFO yet?

Not yet. It my understanding that they notified the financial/regulatory(?) bodies in Turkey of their proposed list of destinations they would like to serve. Nothing firm and still a ways off yet.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: AADC10
Posted 2012-12-19 12:27:46 and read 12873 times.

Quoting chiawei (Reply 100):
UA- I am already given up on UA in terms of service.

sCO is sending a large number of new hire FAs to SFO. Perhaps that will make a difference.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-19 13:26:28 and read 12856 times.

Are SFO flight crews only pmUA? A month ago I flew a pmCO route, PHX-EWR, on a 320 in Tulip livery with a pmUA crew which was surprising.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: as739x
Posted 2012-12-19 13:32:49 and read 12841 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 107):
Are SFO flight crews only pmUA?

sUA Pilot and FA's
sCO FA's only

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-19 13:36:22 and read 12831 times.

Interesting.

Also, there's a separate thread on UA making EWR-SFO 14x daily. I need to fly that route 5 times or so next year so I selfishly hope this leads to trash fares in the short term!

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: B747forever
Posted 2012-12-19 13:41:09 and read 12835 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 109):
Also, there's a separate thread on UA making EWR-SFO 14x daily. I need to fly that route 5 times or so next year so I selfishly hope this leads to trash fares in the short term!



I am sure that UA's fare will come down. So far they have only started phase one of the war, wait for phase two to begin soon, the pricing war  

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2012-12-19 14:12:19 and read 12812 times.

I am sitting in the GB next to 74 if anyone is nearby and wants to amuse me.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-19 16:13:51 and read 12758 times.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 110):
I am sure that UA's fare will come down. So far they have only started phase one of the war, wait for phase two to begin soon, the pricing war

My fellow 747, I will be watching this with great pleasure.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2012-12-19 16:25:52 and read 12762 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 112):

My fellow 747, I will be watching this with great pleasure.

If you have a choice between flying UA and VX, go with VX. Trust me.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-19 16:49:49 and read 12758 times.

My guess is that UA will be using more of the G- International Terminal to handle the increase of domestic flights.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: warden145
Posted 2012-12-19 17:46:52 and read 12692 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 114):
My guess is that UA will be using more of the G- International Terminal to handle the increase of domestic flights.

That wouldn't surprise me in the slightest, unfortunately. I understand the necessity of it, but it annoys me to no end! Same with UA using Terminal 1 for some flights. There's no consistency on where the passengers are going to come out from those flights, and it makes meeting people very difficult...you never know whether they're going to come out of the Terminal 3-F security exit, or if they don't have checked luggage and will come out either the Terminal 1-B exit or the Domestic Arrivals exit out of the International Terminal. Of course, the passenger then gets annoyed and calls my company's office screaming about how his driver didn't meet him where he was supposed to...

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-19 18:14:16 and read 12672 times.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 113):
If you have a choice between flying UA and VX, go with VX. Trust me.

I would if VX were in an alliance. Domestic service on American carriers is so bad anyways, so I really care about being able to gain/redeem miles on NH, SQ, NZ, TK, and (unfortunately) LH.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-19 21:15:47 and read 12632 times.

To keep this thread going....

SFO is constrained by space. They are surrounded by either a Bay or development. If they were to expand Terminal space, would it be possible to tear down the Super Bay and build a Terminal with underground train access?

Any other thoughts?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: N782NC
Posted 2012-12-19 22:08:31 and read 12569 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 117):

I guess that's always possible. Getting United to give up the space is another matter.

Let's assume that some time in the not so distant future, a new runway is actually built parallel to the 10/28's. With that done, how about ripping up the 1/19's and building a satellite terminal in their place, connected to the new Terminal 1 development through an underground walkway. With a single linear terminal you could add around 30-40 Cat IV gates.

Put AA and VX into the new terminal and give T2 to UA, AC, and US. This would definitely give United the extra gates they most desperately need.

Of course one can dream....

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: SCL767
Posted 2012-12-19 22:14:52 and read 12551 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Thread starter):
Has LA announced f they will send the 788 to SFO?

Nope. LAN Perú will continue to utilize the B-767-316ER on the GRU-LIM-SFO route.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-19 23:04:05 and read 12536 times.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 119):

Speaking of LAN. They have been flying into SFO for about two years now and have not expanded from their 4-5 weekly flights. Any possibility of going daily in the future?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: SCL767
Posted 2012-12-19 23:13:27 and read 12529 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 120):
Speaking of LAN. They have been flying into SFO for about two years now and have not expanded from their 4-5 weekly flights. Any possibility of going daily in the future?

LAN is in the process of reorganizing the schedule at the LIM hub. You will notice that LAN will change its schedule into SFO in the coming months; as well as the flight numbers, (LA2010/LA2011).

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-20 06:34:25 and read 12436 times.

Does LA market their flight as the only "direct" link between SFO and Brazil?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: SCL767
Posted 2012-12-20 06:41:45 and read 12437 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 122):
Does LA market their flight as the only "direct" link between SFO and Brazil?

LAN markets the service as, "The only Non-Stop from San Francisco to South America":
http://www.lan.com/files/asociados/informacion/from_sfo_to_saa.pdf

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-20 14:00:25 and read 12310 times.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 123):
LAN markets the service as, "The only Non-Stop from San Francisco to South America":

Which is a true statement. They are the only carrier to offer non-stop service from SFO to South America.

I have heard some grubblings with LANs proposed schedule change into SFO. I guess the flight departs/arrives into GRU very early in the morning. I understand they are developing their LIM hub but I tend to believe most of their paxs are from LIM and there is not a lot of paxs connecting from GRU?

When the LIM hub is developed, can there be more connections from S. America that are timed to connect to the SFO flight?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: PHX787
Posted 2012-12-20 14:34:43 and read 12298 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 124):
Which is a true statement. They are the only carrier to offer non-stop service from SFO to South America.

I'm surprised UA doesn't offer more service to S. America from SFO. But then again, IAH .....

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: SCL767
Posted 2012-12-20 14:43:38 and read 12291 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 124):
I understand they are developing their LIM hub but I tend to believe most of their paxs are from LIM and there is not a lot of paxs connecting from GRU?

The service operates as a direct service between GRU and SFO. Also, the service is geared towards connections to HKG via SFO. Perhaps LAN wants to offer connections to HND on JAL via SFO...

Quoting legacyins (Reply 124):
When the LIM hub is developed, can there be more connections from S. America that are timed to connect to the SFO flight?

Yes, TAM plans to launch GIG-LIM and LAN plans to add new routes and more flights to destinations in the Southern Cone from the LIM hub.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-20 15:11:50 and read 12291 times.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 126):
Yes, TAM plans to launch GIG-LIM and LAN plans to add new routes and more flights to destinations in the Southern Cone from the LIM hub.

maybe at that time, they might increase to a daily flight.

I saw their 767, with winglets, today at SFO. I always liked their sharp livery.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: SCL767
Posted 2012-12-20 15:19:11 and read 12293 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 127):
maybe at that time, they might increase to a daily flight.

Next year, LIM-LAX will increase from 13x weekly to 2x daily and LIM-SFO should get an additional frequency.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: mikeology
Posted 2012-12-20 15:53:50 and read 12263 times.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 126):
The service operates as a direct service between GRU and SFO. Also, the service is geared towards connections to HKG via SFO. Perhaps LAN wants to offer connections to HND on JAL via SFO...

Correct. I believe the flight arrives at 7am. Plenty of time for the many noon time flights leaving for Asia

Quoting legacyins (Reply 127):
I saw their 767, with winglets, today at SFO. I always liked their sharp livery.

My favorite livery for a 767. Great looking plane. Wish it were at SFO everyday

Anybody know what the loads are like on the SFO-LIM route?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-20 22:18:56 and read 12140 times.

Does anyone know why 19L/R was being used today for arrivals? It was a pretty nice day but who knows how strong the winds were above.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: warden145
Posted 2012-12-21 02:46:00 and read 12053 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 130):
Does anyone know why 19L/R was being used today for arrivals? It was a pretty nice day but who knows how strong the winds were above.

I'm pretty sure it has something to do with the storm that's on its way in...supposed to hit tonight and into tomorrow morning. There were a number of flight delays also, although I don't know how much of that had to do with SFO and how much of it had to do with the weather elsewhere...

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-21 11:28:22 and read 11890 times.

I'm flying out of SFO this morning down South and pretty fierce weather out there. Delays about an hour and alternate runway use.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2012-12-21 11:52:27 and read 11858 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 132):
I'm flying out of SFO this morning down South and pretty fierce weather out there. Delays about an hour and alternate runway use.

They are taking off on the 12s at SJC now, later morning 12/21. What runways are they using at SFO today, the 10s?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: N782NC
Posted 2012-12-21 12:46:27 and read 11819 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 133):

Departures on the 10's, arrivals on the 19's.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: PSA727LAX
Posted 2012-12-21 12:55:27 and read 11840 times.

Quoting as739x (Reply 23):
Very much the opposite. The 747 will be the dominate bird T-PAC

Last time i looked SFO has huge #'s of T7's and yes still a large # of 47's too. I would love nothin more than for the Queen of the sky's (747) to keep on ruling the air but also know that a lot of the TPAC routes are or have gone to the T7's

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-21 14:57:38 and read 11765 times.

On another note, if the A380 is too much plane for FRA-SFO, will LH consider sending the 747-8i to SFO?

I'm also surprised that SFO-FRA is larger than LAX-FRA.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-21 15:18:27 and read 11773 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 136):

On another note, if the A380 is too much plane for FRA-SFO, will LH consider sending the 747-8i to SFO?

I'm also surprised that SFO-FRA is larger than LAX-FRA.


LH has no problem filling their A380 into SFO. They even extended the usage through the Holiday season.

As for all the FRA flights. You have two very strong *A airports at either end.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-21 15:58:15 and read 11722 times.

Doesn't LAX have lots of *A feed too? Or is it split with AA also being hubbed there?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: B747forever
Posted 2012-12-21 16:05:19 and read 11724 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 138):
Doesn't LAX have lots of *A feed too? Or is it split with AA also being hubbed there?

Maybe UA/LH prefer to transfer their PAX through SFO, which is a bigger hub for UA compared to LAX.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-21 17:36:25 and read 11673 times.

I still think the flights must have mostly O&D California side. Routings like FCO-FRA-LAX-DEN involve backtracking, and last I checked DEL-HNL isn't a huge market.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-21 18:35:25 and read 11648 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 140):

A lot of Germans and Europeans in general head for Hawaii and connect through SFO. This is of course after they tried the Canary Islands, Azores and Majorca. Also, visitors may start their journey in SFO and depart from LAX and vise versa.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: warden145
Posted 2012-12-21 20:48:05 and read 11586 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 141):
Also, visitors may start their journey in SFO and depart from LAX and vise versa.

I've seen that quite a bit...also, I wonder if people on the Pacific Northwest (PDX, SEA, etc) would go through SFO if they're loyal to Star? Granted I don't know what sorts of offerings PDX and SEA have, but there are quite a few UA Express flights from small cities west of the Rockies to SFO that probably help to feed.

I see a large number of corporate clients coming home to SFO who flew here from FRA, but connected at FRA from all over Europe as well, not to mention India...

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-21 20:53:38 and read 11591 times.

Quoting warden145 (Reply 142):
I've seen that quite a bit...also, I wonder if people on the Pacific Northwest (PDX, SEA, etc) would go through SFO if they're loyal to Star?

What will be interesting to see is when SK starts service into SFO. When they flew into SEA, they had connecting traffic on AS from the bay Area. I am sure they will have some connecting traffic from the Pacific Northwest to SFO even though they have the option of flying BA/LH.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-22 02:04:18 and read 11478 times.

Speaking of India, did EY serve SFO in the past?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-22 08:22:45 and read 11421 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 144):

Speaking of India, did EY serve SFO in the past?


No, not EY. The only Indian Carrier to serve SFO in the past was 9W. They had high ambitions but it never worked out.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-22 08:41:32 and read 11398 times.

Is QR a strong possibility?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2012-12-22 21:14:56 and read 11188 times.

I've been hearing tell for 2 years that India and Tel Aviv are on the radar from UA... I'd think with 50 787s on the way, they can indeed make both work.

I don't recall what the delivery schedule for the 25 sUA ones are... I am hoping they get cracking on those, and that the 789 isn't going to be late for its 2014 deliveries.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Schweigend
Posted 2012-12-22 21:59:18 and read 11181 times.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 147):
I've been hearing tell for 2 years that India and Tel Aviv are on the radar from UA... I'd think with 50 787s on the way, they can indeed make both work.

I have heard the same thing. Particularly exciting is the fact that SFO-DEL or -BOM service would allow pax to fly UA RTW, say:

SFO-DEL-EWR-SFO

Which would take you over the Pacific and Atlantic oceans, China and Central Asia -- sweet!!



Unless, of course, the new Indian destination is one not currently served from Newark, such as Bangalore.

Cheers,
Scottie

p.s. -- If I'd been near the GB the other day when you were there, I'd certainly have popped in. I love day trips to SFO, A.M. arrival, redeye home.

edited to add image

[Edited 2012-12-22 22:15:38]

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-23 13:31:42 and read 11002 times.

I doubt the yields to India would be good enough...

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: rickabone
Posted 2012-12-23 16:04:24 and read 10953 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 117):
SFO is constrained by space. They are surrounded by either a Bay or development. If they were to expand Terminal space, would it be possible to tear down the Super Bay and build a Terminal with underground train access?

I think a better place would be the DHL and Asiana Cargo Ramp areas and the parking structure in between. Tear that down, extend Terminal F (that now ends at gate 90) all the way to Taxiway Y and use Y as the access loop to get to the back side.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: rickabone
Posted 2012-12-23 16:10:01 and read 10963 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 149):
I doubt the yields to India would be good enough...

I don't... It is my understanding that a large number of passengers that fly out of SFO on both Emirates and Lufthansa are connecting through to India. Likely enough to fill 1 daily 787.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: rickabone
Posted 2012-12-23 16:15:57 and read 11028 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 124):

I have heard some grubblings with LANs proposed schedule change into SFO. I guess the flight departs/arrives into GRU very early in the morning. I understand they are developing their LIM hub but I tend to believe most of their paxs are from LIM and there is not a lot of paxs connecting from GRU?

Actually the times at GRU are pretty good, LIM is in the middle of the night, but from my experience on the flight, I would say well over half of the people were flying GRU-SFO or vice versa. LIM-SFO (&SFO-LIM) traffic accounted for about 30% of the passengers on the flights I was on.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-23 16:24:14 and read 11011 times.

Quoting rickabone (Reply 150):
I think a better place would be the DHL and Asiana Cargo Ramp areas and the parking structure in between. Tear that down, extend Terminal F (that now ends at gate 90) all the way to Taxiway Y and use Y as the access loop to get to the back side.

This would be an interesting proposal. Unfortunately, the Asiana Building is relatively new, within the last five years, and I believe there a few long term leases that would need to be renegotiated..

On a side note, the proposed Termnal 1 rebuild looks promising. I like the Idea of the swing gates at the end that can be used for International flights. I believe there would be 2-3 Gates.

I was reading the Airport minutes, yes quite exciting, and came across a bid to reconfigure a gate or two for A380 use. Right now there is only one Gate capable of handling the A380 at the G Terminal.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: rickabone
Posted 2012-12-23 16:29:12 and read 11035 times.

As far as fog & low ceiling related delays at SFO, they should be reduced significantly by the end of this year as a system called CASPRS is instituted. The current arrival rate to the 28's in good weather is 60 aircraft per hour. SOIA (Simultaneous Offset Instrument Approaches) allows for 45 aircraft per hour, while ILS to 28R (or 28L if the right is closed) results in an arrival rate of only 30 aircraft per hour. To run visuals we usually need a 4000' ceiling, SOIA requires a 2100' ceiling, so it is only useful when the ceiling is less than 4000' but greater than 2100' and it requires significant set up time for both NCT and the pilots. CASPRS would have a similar arrival rate to SOIA, but a much lower ceiling requirement than SOIA. I don't remember exactly what CASPRS stands for, but in essence it reduces the spacing required between two aircraft landing on the parallel runways by increasing the glide slope of one of the ILS's and offsetting the touchdown zone (28R I think). This will allow aircraft to be 1.5 miles apart for the parallels instead of the standard IFR separation of 3 miles. It is not quite as efficient as SOIA since you can run SOIA with near side-by separation, and for both SOIA and CASPRS, you will still need a 4 mile hole between pairs to launch departures off the 1's in the most common configuration at SFO (landing on runways 28 and departing on runways 01).

The system won't get rid of weather related delays completely, but my guess is that on a day where you would normally encounter 2 hour delays into SFO due to fog or low ceilings, you will see those delays cut down to less than 1 hour.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: rickabone
Posted 2012-12-23 16:36:00 and read 11007 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 153):

This would be an interesting proposal. Unfortunately, the Asiana Building is relatively new, within the last five years, and I believe there a few long term leases that would need to be renegotiated..

On a side note, the proposed Termnal 1 rebuild looks promising. I like the Idea of the swing gates at the end that can be used for International flights. I believe there would be 2-3 Gates.

I was reading the Airport minutes, yes quite exciting, and came across a bid to reconfigure a gate or two for A380 use. Right now there is only one Gate capable of handling the A380 at the G Terminal.

Yeah, I know it would be a difficult proposal with the cargo ramp leases and the money they make off of the parking structure, but given the Terminal 1 redesign, I don't think you could even think of starting this until well into the 2020's, so it would be a very long term proposal (with construction beginning only after the 3 or more phases of the terminal 1 redesign are complete)

I also agree that the Terminal 1 redesign looks pretty cool. Though it won't add too many gates (I think 3-4 by my last count) it will smooth things out as far as taxiing and pushing go since most aircraft will be able to push out of their gates without blocking taxiway A or without blocking an alley.

It has been interesting to see how many fewer United/Skywest aircraft have to wait without gates now that they are parking CRJ2's and E120's at Terminal 1 and using the 76 & 77 gates for United Mainline along with CRJ7's. Even during the peak traffic periods this summer when they just started doing it, it was working out much better than before.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-24 11:10:38 and read 10794 times.

Quoting rickabone (Reply 151):
I don't... It is my understanding that a large number of passengers that fly out of SFO on both Emirates and Lufthansa are connecting through to India. Likely enough to fill 1 daily 787.

At what cost? Load factors do not equal profitability if one fills the plane with cheap fares.

Also remember that passengers are flying from SFO to many different Indian cities, as well as IKA which is a large market to California, so a flight just to DEL would not help those passengers.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-25 04:44:33 and read 10601 times.

With the development of the 787, city pairs have opened up that may not have been viable using a larger aircraft. ANA will soon start SJC and JL has opened up SAN and BOS.

SFO has always had larger aircraft as the 777, 747 and to some extent the A380. Are there any routes out there that could come online using the 787? I was thinking possibly India, S. America and possibly S. Europe.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: rickabone
Posted 2012-12-25 17:03:09 and read 10456 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 157):
SFO has always had larger aircraft as the 777, 747 and to some extent the A380. Are there any routes out there that could come online using the 787? I was thinking possibly India, S. America and possibly S. Europe.

I would think India would be one of the first choices. Sao Paulo would be a good second choice to compete with LAN, Madrid in Southern Europe might work, maybe Moscow?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2012-12-25 18:14:20 and read 10429 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 149):
I doubt the yields to India would be good enough...

I am uncertain.

Well, I am thinking certainly this:

A 777 from the Bay Area to really any Indian destination would be low in yield.

A 787-8 from the Bay Area to a number of locations in India might do quite well.

A number of global Bay Area cities, including behemoths like Cisco and Dell, have opened major owned-and-operated centers in Bangalore and surrounds, and some other places I'm less familiar with. Whilst I was there, Cisco would contribute easily 100+ pax to an LH flight during the week getting to India, and I'm sure that they now put a large number on United via Newark (United is a "preferred vendor", Continental was not, on a lot of routes).

Wealthier Indian families in the Bay Area also do tend to travel home for a couple weeks a year... so I think, again, a 787 might do nicely.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-25 19:27:05 and read 10385 times.

With UA having 50 787 on order, they would be a natural choice to offer service from their hub at SFO. As I do not care for one carrier to have such a large share of flights from a particular airport, I would prefer a foreign carrier, who flies the 787, to offer the service.

I would say AI would be the strongest candidate to offer service from India to SFO using their 787 aircraft. It would also nice to see CZ start service from CAN using their 787 aircraft. UA still has the route authority but market conditions for a 777 may not be there. I would like to see UA open up DUB, TLV and GRU using their 787s.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-27 19:45:19 and read 10134 times.

Singapore Airlines will be flying in their A380 into SFO tomorrow for a short three month period. They will be using gate 101 at the G-terminal but the arrival time will be less than desirable for photo ops.

Speculation is that they may extend the flight beyond the March 2013 services but they seem adamant that it will only be until March 24th. Presumably, it will return to the JFK run.

Here is hoping the flight is successful and they change their minds and extend the period.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2012-12-29 10:29:54 and read 9830 times.

Maybe DEL or BOM could work on a 788, but EWR-BLR still seems like a better new 788 route to India for UA.

Will UA launch CAN or is that too low-yielding?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: rwy04lga
Posted 2012-12-29 11:35:54 and read 9795 times.

Another thread has this GREAT video of a LH 388 approaching and landing SFO 28R,,,,

Check it!

(VIDEO) Landing @ SFO OnBoard LH Airbus A380 (by werdywerd Dec 27 2012 in Civil Aviation)

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: UA787DEN
Posted 2012-12-29 11:42:58 and read 9799 times.

SFO-CAN might start. Most major Chinese Airports aren't that low yielding. UA already has well established PEK and PVG service. The issue is that CAN is a China Southern, and therefore SkyTeam hub. Also, it is near HKG which has 744s on UA. I think we will eventually see SFO-CAN, but it might be a few years still.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: flySFO
Posted 2012-12-30 01:16:39 and read 9628 times.

Once terminal 3-E is reopened, will the new tenants be US, AC, and UA? Will UA still need to use the 5 or so gates it is using as overflow in 1-B right now?

Assuming the above scenario, who would be left in terminal 1? By my count it would be AS, WN, HA, DL, and F9. WN would finally have the room to expand by taking a full rotunda in 1-B, who would take the other one?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-30 01:47:47 and read 9634 times.

Quoting flySFO (Reply 165):

When Pier E reopens, it will have a total of 10 Gates. It is my understand that AC and US will move over and I am sure UA will be in there also. What is still a mystery is if US merges with AA. It is unlikely the new AA will split their operations but I am not sure if there would be room for them at T-2.

Also, a few years out, is the total refurbishment of T1.

Quoting flySFO (Reply 165):
Assuming the above scenario, who would be left in terminal 1? By my count it would be AS, WN, HA,

HA is in the International Terminal.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-30 20:15:28 and read 9472 times.

The BAT did a nice story on SQ A380 arrival into SFO. Pictures and story provided by BAT.


Last Friday (Dec 28), a giant double-decker Singapore Airlines Airbus A380 arrived at San Francisco International from Hong Kong at 7:10pm, marking the first A380 flights between SFO and Asia. (SFO has seen A380s from Lufthansa and Air France previously.) Singapore Airlines is offering this “pop-up” service on the San Francisco>Hong Kong>Singapore route between now and March 24 only– and will switch back to standard Boeing 777 service after that.)
To mark the occasion, Singapore held a reception at the gate for its flight SQ 1, departing at 11:48pm for Hong Kong and then continuing on to Singapore. There were 438 passengers on the departing flight, with eight in the jumbo’s well-known luxury suites (first class); 45 in business class, and 385 in economy class.

The big bird departs from gate 101 at SFO’s international terminal– specially designed to accommodate passengers entering the upper and lower levels. When boarding, economy class passengers take an escalator down to the lower level for boarding. Business and first class passengers board from the terminal’s main level via a third jetway connected to the plane’s upper deck. (See photo)

Unlike other carriers, Singapore’s seat configuration on the A380-800 has its 12 first class suites at the front end of the lower deck, with 311 economy class seats behind. Upstairs, there are 60 business class seats in the front end of the deck, then 88 economy class seats behind that. (Here’s a link to the configuration.) There are staircases at both the front and the rear of the aircraft.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: UA787DEN
Posted 2012-12-30 20:37:38 and read 9454 times.

Is there any special reason SQ is flying the 380 to SFO? Or just because they can and maybe testing the waters for future service?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Nimish
Posted 2012-12-31 01:35:19 and read 9366 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 149):
I doubt the yields to India would be good enough...

For UA - a SFO-BLR route would probably be highly yielding from the start (no data to back this up, just anecdotal experience on this route). Of course, their JV with LH will suffer slightly - as currently they feed pax via LH at FRA.

Alternatively (as someone suggested), EWR-BLR would fit in well with EWR as being the hub of choice for India ops.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: warden145
Posted 2012-12-31 02:23:52 and read 9358 times.

Quoting UA787DEN (Reply 168):
Is there any special reason SQ is flying the 380 to SFO? Or just because they can and maybe testing the waters for future service?

SFO's a major Star hub, would be my guess...coupled with downgauging the JFK route for the winter. I'm hoping there's also an element of testing the waters, and I would love to see SQ happy enough with the up-gauge to SFO to make it year-round   

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2012-12-31 03:51:32 and read 9323 times.

Quoting warden145 (Reply 170):
SFO's a major Star hub, would be my guess...coupled with downgauging the JFK route for the winter.

Yes, the A380 came from JFK and the 77W went to JFK from SFO.

They had some pretty cheap fares from SFO to HKG and I can imagine this is the reason for the high LF.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-02 16:54:41 and read 9007 times.

Quoting Nimish (Reply 169):
For UA - a SFO-BLR route would probably be highly yielding from the start (no data to back this up, just anecdotal experience on this route). Of course, their JV with LH will suffer slightly - as currently they feed pax via LH at FRA.

Alternatively (as someone suggested), EWR-BLR would fit in well with EWR as being the hub of choice for India ops.

Even if there is some business traffic between the Silicon Valley and Bangalore, is the market large enough? it seems strange to operate that route without having any other California-India flights, especially with SFO-BLR being longer than SFO-DEL and really pushing the limits of the 788.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: irishair98
Posted 2013-01-02 17:21:43 and read 8983 times.

would EI ever restart SFO is the demand there ??

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-02 18:09:12 and read 8962 times.

Quoting irishair98 (Reply 173):
would EI ever restart SFO is the demand there ??


I do not believe EI will restart SFO or the West Coast in the foreseeable future. There was talk that they were looking at the route last year but the economics did not work out. various chambers and business groups on both sides of the Atlantic petitioned them but to no avail.

I was thinking that UA may have a chance with a 2 class 767. They are restarting CDG this Spring using this type of aircraft.

http://www.ittn.ie/bulletins/aer-lin...-us-west-coast-and-funchal-routes/

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: irishair98
Posted 2013-01-02 18:36:52 and read 8926 times.

EI have stated they are looking to expand on there long haul in the coming years and in my opinion SFO and YYZ would be first on EI 's list.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-02 18:42:01 and read 8910 times.

Quoting irishair98 (Reply 175):
EI have stated they are looking to expand on there long haul in the coming years and in my opinion SFO and YYZ would be first on EI 's list.

I agree. It would be nice to see the green shamrock at SFO again.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: irishair98
Posted 2013-01-02 19:04:19 and read 8977 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 176):

likewise i was in SFO last month returning to DUB and it was th ebiggest pain ever connecting in ORD and nearly missing my flight back. It would have been nice to fly back to DUB direct from SFO .

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Nimish
Posted 2013-01-02 22:32:19 and read 8865 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 172):
Even if there is some business traffic between the Silicon Valley and Bangalore, is the market large enough? it seems strange to operate that route without having any other California-India flights, especially with SFO-BLR being longer than SFO-DEL and really pushing the limits of the 788.

Market is certainly large enough - again based on anecdotal inputs only.

SFO-DEL would work well as well, but then they already have EWR-DEL. Hence perhaps an EWR-BLR service is a better option than SFO-DEL.

For BLR - a SFO-NRT/HKG-BLR routing would be interesting - utilizing their Asian hubs to tag on an additional sector to BLR. That way the entire flight can be on their own metal and retain the hubbing benefits at their Asian hubs.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-02 23:27:33 and read 8836 times.

Quoting Nimish (Reply 178):
For BLR - a SFO-NRT/HKG-BLR routing would be interesting - utilizing their Asian hubs to tag on an additional sector to BLR. That way the entire flight can be on their own metal and retain the hubbing benefits at their Asian hubs.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't UA have an around the World Flight a few years ago that connected through HKG to DEL and onto LHR? I may be off on the routing but I believe DEL was in there somewhere.

On a side note, I believe this would be a good route for AI and their 787. Even though the mass of people is there, 9W failed at stimulating the traffic using a 77W. There were other reasons but it always dumbfounded me why this service never took off, so to speak.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: warden145
Posted 2013-01-02 23:42:34 and read 8826 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 179):
On a side note, I believe this would be a good route for AI and their 787. Even though the mass of people is there, 9W failed at stimulating the traffic using a 77W. There were other reasons but it always dumbfounded me why this service never took off, so to speak.

IIRC 9W pulled out right about the time the recession hit...I don't know how the route did throughout its short lifespan, but could the recession have played a significant role?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: AADC10
Posted 2013-01-03 00:16:14 and read 8807 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 179):
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't UA have an around the World Flight a few years ago that connected through HKG to DEL and onto LHR? I may be off on the routing but I believe DEL was in there somewhere.

That was the old RTW flights 1/2. The last time it operated I believe it was IAD-LHR-DEL-HKG-LAX-IAD (the other flight went the other direction) mostly on a 744, although it had different stops and different gauges over the years. I recall that the segments to DEL had to be a smaller aircraft or had very restrictive capacity rules. 1 & 2 may have passed through SFO at one time or another.

Like China, demand to India turned out to be weaker than expected. When the open skies deal was signed, carriers rushed to India and several withdrew some flights and some went into bankruptcy. You can get there in one stop on LH to several destinations in India. SFO-BLR or DEL would be marginal at best on UA.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: hereandthere41
Posted 2013-01-03 09:51:08 and read 8703 times.

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 181):

If I'm not mistaken, UA 1/2 operated JFK-LHR-DEL-HKG-LAX-JFK, not via IAD. I believe the LAX-JFK-LHR-DEL portion was flown on a 762/763 while DEL-HKG-LAX was a 744. This was when JFK still had intl flying including NRT, LHR, EZE, GRU/GIG, CCS, and SJU.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-03 09:53:37 and read 8703 times.

American carriers have had lots of trouble with India in the past. In the past U.S. carriers served India from ORD, JFK, and ATL, but these routes were cut recently. UA has probably realized that they can't compete with EK, QR, TK etc. on India and will instead focus on other markets. SFO-DEL/BLR is not impossible, but I doubt it can work.

Wouldn't SFO-BCN/MAD be too seasonal and reliant on low-yielding tourist traffic.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: hereandthere41
Posted 2013-01-03 10:01:30 and read 8694 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 183):

Times have changed drastically. Much of the flying is done with feed from alliance partners. On the daily SFO-FRA flight, the majority of the plane is connecting onto LH flights to India, Africa and Eastern Europe. I doubt we'll see any major deviance from the current plan of building on strengths, instead of experimenting with long, thin routes with narrow margins.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: AirCalSNA
Posted 2013-01-03 15:23:59 and read 8621 times.

Interesting maneuver of a United 747 over Pacific/Presidio Heights at about noon today. It was much lower than normal and turned from about 360 degrees to due west when I lost sight of it. I thought perhaps it was a publicity flight for shots over the Golden Gate Bridge.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2013-01-03 16:32:35 and read 8561 times.

In the eveningtime, that's a fairly common procedure. I can hear them directly over my house often.

I used to have a chart of the arrivals and departures.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-03 18:03:19 and read 8506 times.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 186):

Being an aviation enthusiast , low flying and possibly noisy commercial aviation aircraft does not bother me. My neighbor, however, hates it and always sends an email to the SFO noise abatement office. He showed me one of their responses one time and they give the airline name, flight altitude, speed and agrees with the divination of the flight path.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: AirCalSNA
Posted 2013-01-03 18:15:12 and read 8503 times.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 186):
In the eveningtime, that's a fairly common procedure. I can hear them directly over my house often.

I used to have a chart of the arrivals and departures.

NS

Yep, you can practically set your watch by the various Europe-bound afternoon departures. But this was extra low and a bit early in the day.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-04 02:28:13 and read 8367 times.

As part of a Federal mandated program to extend runways for a safety barrier, SFO will shut down various runways on the weekends. This will impact operations and affect mostly short haul flights. details below:

http://www.sfexaminer.com/local/tran...h-due-runway-closures?category=103

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-04 14:12:43 and read 8242 times.

With the global expansion of the Middle Eastern carriers, I am very doubtful of a new India-U.S. nonstop service anytime soon, period. If UA hasn't launched BLR from EWR yet, why would they fly SFO-BLR?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2013-01-04 15:11:55 and read 8205 times.

Because they haven't yet had the right plane, first off.

Second off, SFO-BLR would cater to a very, very specific market that is extremely high in yield.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: sfoa380
Posted 2013-01-04 16:07:31 and read 8170 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 190):
If UA hasn't launched BLR from EWR yet, why would they fly SFO-BLR?

What is the demand from NYC-BLR vs. Bay Area-BLR?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: AADC10
Posted 2013-01-04 16:27:52 and read 8150 times.

Quoting hereandthere41 (Reply 182):
If I'm not mistaken, UA 1/2 operated JFK-LHR-DEL-HKG-LAX-JFK, not via IAD.

Yes, it did go through JFK at one time but my recollection of the last time it operated, it was through IAD. I recall taking the LAX-IAD segment several times. UA gave up on their push into JFK and LGA and slowly moved flights to IAD. Stalwarts like JFK-NRT and JFK-LHR bit the dust.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-04 16:45:57 and read 8135 times.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 191):
Because they haven't yet had the right plane, first off.

Second off, SFO-BLR would cater to a very, very specific market that is extremely high in yield.


If you have any actual numerical data on yields, I would be very interested.

SFO-DEL already pushes the limits of the 788, so would SFO-BLR even be doable nonstop both ways?

Also, even if there are some business ties between the Silicon Valley and Bangalore, are there enough pax to fill an entire plane (even a 788—it's not that big of a difference compared to a 772, though ).

The 787 may be second only to the 747 for me, but it can certainly not accomplish as many new routes as A*nutters generally say. The fact is, airlines generally tend to concentrate their international operations to certain areas at one or two hub airports, as UA has done with EWR-India (just as AA has no LAX/ORD-South America service, DL has no Asia service apart from NRT—not even ICN!—from ATL, etc.). Considering that three or four major cities on the West Coast have demand to at least five or six major cities in India, covering only the city pair SFO-BLR would not help for pax flying LAX-BOM, SEA-HYD, etc. UA has no exisiting flights to BLR, even from EWR, and no SFO-DEL/BOM flights.

UA often has trouble capturing high-yielding business pax on EWR-BOM/DEL, with many regular business travelers opting to fly BA, LH, etc. instead due to superior service, so that would certainly not help yields. Finally, until someone invents a new plane that can can connect any two points on Earth in any season with a full load cheaply, ULH routes will continue to be problematic—with the exception of SYD-DFW which is already a challenge, ULH routes have taken huge blows in the past few years.

Again, I'm not saying that SFO-BLR is not possible—IT even announced the route in 2007 but didn't launch—but I doubt that it can overcome the stated obstacles.

Finally, think of the poor, sad LH 747-8is to BLR that would end up being empty...

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: LAXintl
Posted 2013-01-04 17:06:49 and read 8136 times.

Greetings from SoCal.

Let me add a bit more color to various comments here.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 31):
How serious is TK's desire to fly to SFO? It seems like a good 3x weekly 77W route to offer connections to India and the Middle East.

TK as its required to do for regulatory reasons announces a "wish list" of markets it is looking at.

If/when SFO starts up the minimum frequency would be 4x weekly. That tends to be the minimum TK finds viable.

Only prob with SFO, is that the local SFO-Turkey market is only about 40% of the size of the LAX-Turkey market, so TK would need to work much harder on generating transfer traffic flow from the Bay Area.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 90):

Can anyone supply data to the top 3-5 International destinations not served from SFO?

Delhi
Ho Chi Minh
Montreal
Mumbai
Rome
Tel Aviv

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 136):
On another note, if the A380 is too much plane for FRA-SFO, will LH consider sending the 747-8i to SFO?

I'm also surprised that SFO-FRA is larger than LAX-FRA.

LH tends to use SFO has a transfer hub across the Western US and to places like Hawaii. LH LAX flights are much more focused on local traffic. The underlying local markets to Germany are larger from LA basin then Bay Area.

LH also stated its 748s were meant for markets that drove more business demand, while A380 worked better on routes with heavier leisure component.

Quoting Nimish (Reply 178):
SFO-DEL would work well as well, but then they already have EWR-DEL. Hence perhaps an EWR-BLR service is a better option than SFO-DEL.

Well Delhi is the Bay Area's largest directly unserved market. But its a heck of a long way nonstop (7700mi).

Considering economic difficulties with ULH services, can probably be better served 1-stop basis or with connection with partners (see my comments below).

Quoting Nimish (Reply 178):
For BLR - a SFO-NRT/HKG-BLR routing would be interesting - utilizing their Asian hubs to tag on an additional sector to BLR. That way the entire flight can be on their own metal and retain the hubbing benefits at their Asian hubs.

Anything done via Asia would be in cooperation with ANA as part of the carriers JV pact and would almost certainly operate utilizing NH equipment.

For info UA/NH just commenced NRT-DEL in October as part of the venture.

Quoting sfoa380 (Reply 192):
What is the demand from NYC-BLR vs. Bay Area-BLR?

Virtually identical.

PDEW (passengers daily each way)
NYC - BLR: 100
SFO - BLR: 97

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-04 17:25:20 and read 8120 times.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 195):
Well Delhi is the Bay Area's largest directly unserved market. But its a heck of a long way nonstop (7700mi).

Considering economic difficulties with ULH services, can probably be better served 1-stop basis or with connection with partners (see my comments below).

Bingo. Again, BLR is even further than DEL. Out of the 97 daily passengers, I doubt that too many of them would be ready to pay a huge premium to fly nonstop rather than via FRA, LHR, DXB, or SIN (an out-of-the way transfer point, yet a popular one for airline quality-conscious business pax).

Out of the list of top unserved destinations, all of them has either yields or distance as the erason for lack of service.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-05 17:43:54 and read 7911 times.

What are the PDEW numbers for SFO-DEL and SFO-BOM?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: questions
Posted 2013-01-05 18:02:57 and read 7900 times.

When is the remodel and reconstruction work on Terminal 1 scheduled to begin/end?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-05 22:14:59 and read 7846 times.

Quoting questions (Reply 198):

When is the remodel and reconstruction work on Terminal 1 scheduled to begin/end?


The Terminal 1 remodel is a long term plan and is in line to start after the pier E remodel going on now.

Here is a link to the proposal.

http://www.wtsinternational.org/assets/84/22/WTS_022311_SFO.pdf

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-06 04:30:08 and read 7744 times.

Nice piece in The Chronicle about ANA starting service to NRT this coming Friday. They do mention SFO and the contrasts between the two airports.

http://www.sfgate.com/business/artic...-to-Asia-4170266.php#photo-3985196

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: LAXintl
Posted 2013-01-06 11:15:20 and read 7657 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 197):
What are the PDEW numbers for SFO-DEL and SFO-BOM?

SFO - DEL = 208

SFO - BOM = 117

Kinda interesting how much more demand skews for Delhi in the Bay Area. In comparison from LA basin, both Delhi and Mumbai are virtually equal.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-06 12:02:38 and read 7677 times.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 201):
SFO - DEL = 208

SFO - BOM = 117

Kinda interesting how much more demand skews for Delhi in the Bay Area. In comparison from LA basin, both Delhi and Mumbai are virtually equal.

That's ineteresting. So even if Bangalore-Silicon Valley is a market with lots of business demand, planes can't be filled on it. SFO-DEL would be an interesting route, and some LAX-originating pax might prefer a domestic connection in SFO to an international connection between two longhauls. The flight is long but not undoably long; however UA would have to try hard to gain corporate contracts (and not offend LH), in addition to having a product on par with top foreign airlines.

Maybe NH will steal some of the SFO-DEL market, since they launched DEL last year and are about to launch SJC in addition to their existing SFO presence.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: LAXintl
Posted 2013-01-06 12:44:56 and read 7648 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 202):
Maybe NH will steal some of the SFO-DEL market, since they launched DEL last year and are about to launch SJC in addition to their existing SFO presence.

The NRT-DEL route was launched as part of the UA/NH JV (similar to how NRT-MNL).

Nearly 50% of the enplanements are transpac feed at the moment.

Not sure why UA would look to do SFO-DEL on its own, when it seemingly has something good (and much lower risk) running with ANA at the moment.

The new NRT-DEL segment finally returns to UA a good inhouse transpac link that was lost when the HKG-DEL segment was dropped with UA1/2 going away.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-07 10:06:24 and read 7480 times.

I checked and NH has short connection times on SFO-NRT-DEL. NH should launch BLR and time it to connect with the SJC flight.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2013-01-07 16:15:16 and read 7446 times.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 195):
Quoting legacyins (Reply 90):

Can anyone supply data to the top 3-5 International destinations not served from SFO?

Delhi
Ho Chi Minh
Montreal
Mumbai
Rome
Tel Aviv

Is that in order?

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 201):
SFO - DEL = 208

That doesn't surprise me, and if you match it with United's connecting traffic, SFO-DEL probably has the traffic to drive a 787.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-07 16:26:17 and read 7438 times.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 205):
That doesn't surprise me, and if you match it with United's connecting traffic, SFO-DEL probably has the traffic to drive a 787.

Don't overestimate the connecting traffic—LAX is the only reasonably sized market to India which would make sense for connections. The flight would still rely primarily on Bay Area O&D.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2013-01-07 17:04:06 and read 7398 times.

Does anybody know what gate NH is going to use at SJC? 15 or 16? Will check-in be in Terminal A, or Terminal B (the latter of which is much nicer)?

Hopefully Tom or one of you guys down there can get some good photos on Friday. I'm stoked for it and I'm not even down there now.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: laca773
Posted 2013-01-07 17:44:26 and read 7379 times.

Second off, SFO-BLR would cater to a very, very specific market that is extremely high in yield.

NS[/quote]

The India based airlines are such a mess financially, I don't see either of them starting SFO-India services in the near term. The 787s would definitely be a right size a/c for them, and the money they could make.......!

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 195):
Only prob with SFO, is that the local SFO-Turkey market is only about 40% of the size of the LAX-Turkey market, so TK would need to work much harder on generating transfer traffic flow from the Bay Area.

Perhaps, TK should get a few 77Ls in the mean time, and perhaps order the 787s so they would have a right size a/c for SFO-IST. It seems like the 77W will be too much a/c at present.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 201):

SFO - DEL = 208

SFO - BOM = 117

Kinda interesting how much more demand skews for Delhi in the Bay Area. In comparison from LA basin, both Delhi and Mumbai are virtually equal.

The 787 would be a perfect a/c for these markets. I would think the yields would be higher too since the capacity would be limited on an a/c such as the 787-8.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2013-01-07 18:12:12 and read 7365 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 206):
Don't overestimate the connecting traffic—LAX is the only reasonably sized market to India which would make sense for connections. The flight would still rely primarily on Bay Area O&D.

I am not so sure. I'd think Phoenix, Seattle, Portland, and the like make sense as connecting markets.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-07 19:23:04 and read 7343 times.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 209):
I am not so sure. I'd think Phoenix, Seattle, Portland, and the like make sense as connecting markets.

NS

Is SEA-SFO-DEL much shorter than SEA-DXB-DEL (to speak nothing of pax going to BOM, BLR, HYD, etc?) And I mean, how many PDEW is PHX-DEL? Probably not a ton.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-07 20:13:59 and read 7307 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 207):
Does anybody know what gate NH is going to use at SJC? 15 or 16?

Since the new lounge is located across from Gate 15, the flight can use either gate. I believe Volaris has a flight certain days of the week that overlap .

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 207):
Will check-in be in Terminal A, or Terminal B (the latter of which is much nicer)?

According to the SJC website, they are using Terminal A.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: questions
Posted 2013-01-07 20:43:09 and read 7291 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 199):
The Terminal 1 remodel is a long term plan and is in line to start after the pier E remodel going on now.

Here is a link to the proposal.

http://www.wtsinternational.org/assets/84/22/WTS_022311_SFO.pdf

Thanks for the link.

Any word on which airlines will be going into the new T1 Boarding Area B? Will DL and its Sky Club move from Boarding Area C into B?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2013-01-07 23:14:43 and read 7228 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 210):
Is SEA-SFO-DEL much shorter than SEA-DXB-DEL (to speak nothing of pax going to BOM, BLR, HYD, etc?) And I mean, how many PDEW is PHX-DEL? Probably not a ton.

I ain't gonna fight on that topic, but lets say they contribute amongst all of them to 25 pax a day. That's a full flight for DEL.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Nimish
Posted 2013-01-07 23:18:17 and read 7231 times.

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 204):
NH should launch BLR and time it to connect with the SJC flight.



Ideally to the wider UA/NH trans pacific bank (if one exists) - that way they can feed the NRT-BLR flight with traffic not just from SJC, but from all of the Trans-Pacific traffic they get...

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: LAXintl
Posted 2013-01-08 08:52:23 and read 7162 times.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 205):
Is that in order?

Yes

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 210):
how many PDEW is PHX-DEL? Probably not a ton.

About 7 per day.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 213):
I ain't gonna fight on that topic, but lets say they contribute amongst all of them to 25 pax a day. That's a full flight for DEL.

Need to keep in mind just because SFO-DEL might be 200'ish PDEW, even a nonstop would likely capture at best about 50% of that.

People for various reasons will still opt for other choice - price, frequent flyer allegiance, service, timing, etc.
So folks like EK, BA, LH, KL, SQ, etc will still manage to carry a good deal of the Bay to India traffic regardless.

And for connections, yes there are markets like LA basin, that could feed a SFO-India flight, but once you make the travel option 1-stop the ability to capture consumers becomes even harder.
There literally are several dozen ways to get from LA basin to Delhi on 1-stop basis, and a SFO-India flight would merely be a single option that must fight for its share of the pie amongst the many options available.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: MarcoPoloWorld
Posted 2013-01-08 22:00:00 and read 7048 times.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 195):
Can anyone supply data to the top 3-5 International destinations not served from SFO?

Delhi
Ho Chi Minh
Montreal
Mumbai
Rome
Tel Aviv


Can somebody explain why there wouldn't be sufficient demand between San Francisco and Montréal (metro areas of about 8 and 4 million population, respectively, on the same continent) to run at least a daily nonstop year round? Air Canada does fly the route nonstop as AC 760/761 during the summer, but no nonstop is provided during the winter half. All other major cities in Canada are served direcly to/from SFO year round, so why not YUL?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: point2point
Posted 2013-01-09 00:22:39 and read 6981 times.

Quoting MarcoPoloWorld (Reply 216):
Can somebody explain why there wouldn't be sufficient demand between San Francisco and Montréal (metro areas of about 8 and 4 million population, respectively, on the same continent) to run at least a daily nonstop year round? Air Canada does fly the route nonstop as AC 760/761 during the summer, but no nonstop is provided during the winter half. All other major cities in Canada are served direcly to/from SFO year round, so why not YUL?

This is a puzzle to me as well.

Besides having about 122 PDEW, (and how seasonal could this be?) these are really both major *A hubs...........YUL gets EWR, IAD, ORD, DEN, IAH, LAX, and even CLE year round, and not SFO?

 

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: LAXintl
Posted 2013-01-09 07:34:28 and read 6894 times.

Well Air Canada does not have much between YUL and LA either - a market of 17+ million.

Only a single A319 flight.

But regarding SF - Montreal, its only about 110 PDEW - rather tiny demand ultimately in a market that has countless 1-stop possibilities via other hubs. AC be lucky if they captured 50% of that on a nonstop.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: DolphinAir747
Posted 2013-01-09 17:00:24 and read 6796 times.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 213):
I ain't gonna fight on that topic, but lets say they contribute amongst all of them to 25 pax a day. That's a full flight for DEL.
Quoting LAXintl (Reply 215):
Need to keep in mind just because SFO-DEL might be 200'ish PDEW, even a nonstop would likely capture at best about 50% of that.

People for various reasons will still opt for other choice - price, frequent flyer allegiance, service, timing, etc.
So folks like EK, BA, LH, KL, SQ, etc will still manage to carry a good deal of the Bay to India traffic regardless.

And for connections, yes there are markets like LA basin, that could feed a SFO-India flight, but once you make the travel option 1-stop the ability to capture consumers becomes even harder.
There literally are several dozen ways to get from LA basin to Delhi on 1-stop basis, and a SFO-India flight would merely be a single option that must fight for its share of the pie amongst the many options available.

Spot-on. Plus, with both LH and UA increasing their flights to India, *A doesn't want to flood the market and kill yields.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2013-01-10 15:29:54 and read 6606 times.

Is anybody going to be at SJC tomorrow to get photos of the first NH 787 there? That will be great!

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Tomassjc
Posted 2013-01-10 17:40:47 and read 6553 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 220):
Is anybody going to be at SJC tomorrow to get photos of the first NH 787 there? That will be great!


Hopefully I'll get a shot! I'll be working. AS's GDL inbound aircraft will come into Gate 16 as usual, but will tow over to the B gates for the 10am outbound to OGG, instead of departing from Gate 16 as it usually does. NH will be using Gate 15.

Evidently the airport does not want to risk holding NH passengers on board in the event AS is running late and NH arrives early, since boarding at Gate 16 involves cutting through the sterile corridor. NH is not able to use Gate 16 because of the 787 wingspan would mean blocking Gate 17, a Southwest gate. The Volaris flight that follows AS at Gate 16, will not create an issue since NH will have deplaned (Hopefully) by the time Volaris arrives. Does that all make sense?  

Tomas SJC

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2013-01-10 18:43:47 and read 6517 times.

Quoting Tomassjc (Reply 221):
Evidently the airport does not want to risk holding NH passengers on board in the event AS is running late and NH arrives early, since boarding at Gate 16 involves cutting through the sterile corridor. NH is not able to use Gate 16 because of the 787 wingspan would mean blocking Gate 17, a Southwest gate. The Volaris flight that follows AS at Gate 16, will not create an issue since NH will have deplaned (Hopefully) by the time Volaris arrives. Does that all make sense?

Sure it makes sense. So only one of the international gates can handle anything bigger than a 737? That seems like poor planning. What if eventually another carrier wanted to start an overseas flight at around the same time as NH?

One time I was on the NW A332 SEA-NRT and we arrived in NRT very early, so they deplaned us at a remote stand and bussed us to the terminal. I assume the same thing would happen at SJC if too many international arrivals at once.

Speaking of international flights, I was surprised last week to see an AS 734 taxiing by in late morning. It obviously wasn't any of the Hawaii flights. My SEA flight was s 738. I think it might have been the SJD flight?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2013-01-10 18:48:57 and read 6527 times.

Do you guys still plan that SFO A.net plane watching session at El Torito in Burlingame, as was discussed early in this long-running thread?

I'll be in SJC around 1/31-2/4. Can I talk you guys into doing it then? I'll see if Tomassjc wants me to swing by and pick him up and meet the rest of you guys up there. Or I assume it's a long walk from Caltrain, but doable.

That would be a blast. It would be the one time we'd hope they are just landing on the 28s as standard, and not one of the unusual arrivals.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: Tomassjc
Posted 2013-01-10 20:47:59 and read 6446 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 222):
Speaking of international flights, I was surprised last week to see an AS 734 taxiing by in late morning. It obviously wasn't any of the Hawaii flights. My SEA flight was s 738. I think it might have been the SJD flight?

Indeed it was!

Tomas SJC

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-12 20:18:56 and read 6224 times.

Does anyone know when LH will restart their A380 service from SFO? I believe they are using a 744 at this time.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2013-01-12 22:54:32 and read 6175 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 223):
Or I assume it's a long walk from Caltrain, but doable.

You can easily get to SFO from the Millbrae Caltrain station - its about a $2 ride on BART, but they are generally well timed to provide connecting opportunities.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-13 00:45:58 and read 6169 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 223):
Or I assume it's a long walk from Caltrain, but doable.

It is doable. I live in Milbrae on Murchison drive. Once in a while I will take a walk over to the Bay Park. Just walk over to Millbrae avenue and walk over the bridge until you hit the water. The Westin Hotel will be on your right. Right onto Bayshore and walk about a half mile and El torito will be on your left. Probably a 20-30 min walk from Catrain.

Quoting gigneil (Reply 226):
You can easily get to SFO from the Millbrae Caltrain station - its about a $2 ride on BART, but they are generally well timed to provide connecting opportunities.

The OW fare is actually $4.05. Plus how is he going to get from SFO to El Torito? Maybe sneak on the Marriott shuttle?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: warden145
Posted 2013-01-13 01:34:24 and read 6154 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 227):
Plus how is he going to get from SFO to El Torito? Maybe sneak on the Marriott shuttle?

That's an option...he could also call a car service. I happen to know a very good one...  

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: BoeingGuy
Posted 2013-01-13 16:12:13 and read 6025 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 227):
It is doable. I live in Milbrae on Murchison drive.

I grew up on Frontera Drive as a child, between Loyola and Sebastian. My grandparents sold the house in 1979. Guess how I got my passion for airplanes.   The house was on line with the 1s, and I discovered binoculars.

Do you guys want to plan an SFO plane watching outing at El Torito for sometime during 1/31-2/4?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: gigneil
Posted 2013-01-13 17:44:09 and read 5957 times.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 227):
The OW fare is actually $4.05. Plus how is he going to get from SFO to El Torito? Maybe sneak on the Marriott shuttle?

I'm more a big picture kind of guy.

NS

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: mikeology
Posted 2013-01-13 20:46:40 and read 5892 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 229):
Do you guys want to plan an SFO plane watching outing at El Torito for sometime during 1/31-2/4?

Preferably the weekend but yeah those dates would be fine

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-14 19:10:54 and read 5741 times.

I often admire the photos taken from the Bay Park area showing aircraft departing from the 28s. What type of lens would be appropriate? Would a 80-400mm be too much?

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: AirCalSNA
Posted 2013-01-14 19:35:14 and read 5728 times.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 229):
Do you guys want to plan an SFO plane watching outing at El Torito for sometime during 1/31-2/4?

I would have to do it on the weekend as well, but it sounds like it would be a cool thing to do.

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-15 04:34:31 and read 5606 times.

This kind of came out of the blue. San Francisco Supervisor proposes adding Harvey Milk into the Airport name.

http://news.yahoo.com/san-francisco-...g-citys-airport-gay-071347707.html

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-16 19:59:30 and read 5374 times.

Looks like the proposal to rename the airport is getting a luke warm response from the airport commission.

http://www.sfexaminer.com/local/2013...out-renaming-hub-after-harvey-milk

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-17 19:55:37 and read 5260 times.

Cathay Pacific is winding down their 744 operations into SFO for W13. They will be offering 744 service only three days per week but will keep frequency levels at twice daily with their 77W/ 777W D.



Hong Kong – San Francisco eff 02JAN14 Daily Boeing 747-400 operation on CX870/879 will be reduced to 3 weekly. The remaining 4 weekly operates with 4-class Boeing 777-300ER
CX872 HKG0100 – 2105-1SFO 77W D
CX870 HKG1405 – 1000SFO 744 357
CX870 HKG1405 – 1000SFO 77W x357

CX879 SFO1150 – 1850+1HKG 744 357
CX879 SFO1150 – 1850+1HKG 77W x357
CX873 SFO2305 – 0600+2HKG 77W D

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: legacyins
Posted 2013-01-18 23:00:04 and read 5047 times.

United recently announced a new club design that opened at ORD. The International Red Carpet at SFO has been open for approximately 12 years now and IMO, needs a fresher look. I am sure it is in line for the make over but does anyone have a timeline when this may happen?


http://www.frequentbusinesstraveler....ge-of-the-future-at-chicago-ohare/

Topic: SFO Aviation Thread Part 1
Username: iowaman
Posted 2013-01-19 08:45:07 and read 4907 times.

This thread is getting quite lengthy so please continue the discussion here:

SFO Aviation Thread #2 (by iowaman Jan 19 2013 in Civil Aviation)


The messages in this discussion express the views of the author of the message, not necessarily the views of Airliners.net or any entity associated with Airliners.net.

Copyright © Lundgren Aerospace. All rights reserved.
http://www.airliners.net/