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Topic: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: skycub
Posted 2013-01-28 21:27:15 and read 8656 times.

Hi all...

I am hoping someone can answer this question.

In the mid-1990s what 737 series did British Airways operate?

I know, at the time (looking through the photos on the anet database) that OTHER carriers operating as BA (such as Deutche BA and TAT and GB Airways) operated 737s on BA's behalf.... but what series 737s were actually operated by the TRUE BA in the mid-90s?

From what I have gathered from the photo database, it looks like probably the 737-200 and 737-400 with the 737-300 operated by other carriers on their behalf..... but I don't know if that is correct.

Can anyone help?

Thanks!

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: Ndebele
Posted 2013-01-28 21:32:15 and read 8651 times.

This link might help: BA historic fleet, with delivery date and exit date:
http://www.planespotters.net/Airline...ays?show=historic#AirlineFleetList

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: babaero
Posted 2013-01-28 21:52:35 and read 8604 times.

Basically mid nineties 737-200s , plus four 737-300 leased from Mearsk but based in Berlin, and also the 737-300s aquired from Dan-Air. then came the 737-400s around mid nineties

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: bluesky73
Posted 2013-01-29 01:36:07 and read 8313 times.

The 734s, G-DOC*s started arriving 1992 if memory served right. I remember working in Kingston in 92 and seeing first of the official classics ordered by BA. All other classics were from Maresk, Dan air and later on GB airways.
BA still operated plenty of 732s in 90s and quite a few we're painted in the utopia world tails livery.

Does anyone know why registered G-DOC as usually BA associate with aircraft:

G-CIV*=400
G-BYG*=big
G-ZZZ*=777
G-DOC*= Just a random reg or a coded association?

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: skipness1E
Posted 2013-01-29 02:52:27 and read 8202 times.

http://www.airfleets.net/flottecie/British%20Airways.htm
Also worth a look.
Not sure of G-DOC*, G-GBTA was Guild of British Travel Agents and G-RAES was the Royal Aeronautical Society. I never got G-BYG* as big until now. I'll get me coat.....
G-VII* was of course roman for 7 which is why they got G-RAES and not G-VIII (!)

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: bluesky73
Posted 2013-01-29 02:58:51 and read 8193 times.

Sorry the 734s (G-DOC*s) started delivery in Oct 91 but remember them becoming regular site in 92.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: shuttle9juliet
Posted 2013-01-29 06:42:51 and read 7918 times.

Quoting bluesky73 (Reply 3):

G-DOCA- Z stood for DOmestiCAircraft, G-BNLA, Boeing New Large Aircraft , G-BNWA, Boeing New Wide Body ect.

As for the G-BYGA reg, these don't stand for anything but were just normal sequence on the register.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: skipness1E
Posted 2013-01-29 07:11:22 and read 7854 times.

Weren't G-BNL* and G-BNW* also in sequence? I think they were.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: shuttle9juliet
Posted 2013-01-29 07:43:30 and read 7794 times.

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 7):

Yeah both were,are..

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: BA777ER236
Posted 2013-01-29 09:31:43 and read 7655 times.

Quoting skycub (Thread starter):
In the mid-1990s what 737 series did British Airways operate?

In the mid - 90s, BA were operating the -436 at LHR (G-DOCx series). At LGW there were a number of -236s, -436s, but we also had 7 x ex-Dan Air -400s. 3 were originally Air Europe (G-BVNM,'NN & 'NO) and they were -4S3 models. The other 4 were -4Q8s (G-BSNV,'NW & G-BUHJ,'HK). Very occasionally we also operated GB Airways aeroplanes, but the only one that I think we used was G-BUHL which was another -4Q8.

When I left the fleet in 1998, we also had 2 x -300 a/c. They were G-XMAN and G-ODUS (I think). These were ex BHX/MAN based and I think were -3Q8s.

I hope that helps.

Cheers
 

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: shuttle9juliet
Posted 2013-01-29 09:46:32 and read 7619 times.

Quoting BA777ER236 (Reply 9):

Was G-OFRA there too? I remember these aircraft well.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: VV701
Posted 2013-01-29 11:19:54 and read 7461 times.

Quoting BA777ER236 (Reply 9):
When I left the fleet in 1998, we also had 2 x -300 a/c. They were G-XMAN and G-ODUS (I think). These were ex BHX/MAN based and I think were -3Q8s.
Quoting shuttle9juliet (Reply 10):
Was G-OFRA there too? I remember these aircraft well.

BA leased four 737 36Qs from Boullioun:

G-ODUS was previously operated by Deutshe BA and was initially operated from 17 April 1998 by BA Regional out of MAN. It was transferred to the BA EuroGatwick fleet on 13 June 00 where it stayed until it was returned to the lessor on 11 February 02.

G-OFRA was delivered to BA new and was ferried BFI-YYR-LGW on 5/6 May 98 in BA livery with a white tail. After its tail was painted and it cabin furbished it was delivered to BA Regional at MAN on 20 May. It was transferred to the BA EuroGatwick fleet in April 00 where it stayed until it was returned to the lessor in March 02.

G-OHAJ was was ferried BFI-YYR-LGW on 2/3 June 98 in BA livery with a white tail. After its tail was painted and its cabin furbished it was delivered to BA Regional at BHX on 18 June. It operated for BA Regional until the end of April 02 when it was parked at LGW for three weeks before it was returned to its lessor.

G-OMUC was in full BA "Colum" (Ireland) livery when it was ferried BFI-YYR-LGW on 30 June/1 July 98 for cabin furbishment. It was delivered to BA Regional at MAN on 20 July. It operated for BA Regional Until it was returned to its lessor in June 02.

BA also leased two 737 36Ns from GECAS:

G-XBHX was delivered to BA new and was ferried BFI-YYR-LGW on 21/22 May 98 in BA livery with a white tail. After its tail was painted and it cabin furbished it was delivered to BA Regional at BHX on 6 June. On 21 December 00 it was transferred to the BA EuroGatwick fleet. It was withdrawn from use on 30 November 02. It was returned to GECAS on 9 December.

G-XMAN was ferried BFI-YYR-LGW on 18/1 9 June 98 again in a white=tail BA livery . After tail painting and cabin furbishment it was delivered to BA Regional at MAN on 10 July. On 9 May 00 it was transferred to the BA EuroGatwick fleet. It was withdrawn from use on 27 December 02 and painted white at LHR in mid February before being returned to Spar Leasing in early April.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: BA777ER236
Posted 2013-01-30 00:09:08 and read 4842 times.

Quoting VV701 (Reply 11):
G-XMAN was ferried BFI-YYR-LGW on 18/1 9 June 98 again in a white=tail BA livery . After tail painting and cabin furbishment it was delivered to BA Regional at MAN on 10 July. On 9 May 00 it was transferred to the BA EuroGatwick fleet. It was withdrawn from use on 27 December 02 and painted white at LHR in mid February before being returned to Spar Leasing in early April.

Hi VV701, thanks for the clarification. I don't have access to my logbook at the moment, but now you have given us the comprehensive list I remember that it was G-XMAN and G-OFRA that I flew just before leaving the fleet in 2000. I also remember that they were different models as you highlight.

I'm very confident about the -4S3 and 4Q8 fleet though as I flew those many times!

Cheers
 

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: ba319-131
Posted 2013-01-30 00:22:32 and read 4831 times.

Quoting BA777ER236 (Reply 12):
I'm very confident about the -4S3 and 4Q8 fleet though as I flew those many times!

- Indeed, as did I once they joined BA.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: VV701
Posted 2013-01-30 04:14:10 and read 4716 times.

Quoting BA777ER236 (Reply 9):
Very occasionally we also operated GB Airways aeroplanes, but the only one that I think we used was G-BUHL which was another -4Q8.

Thanks for this. I recall seeing photos of GB Airways 737s, if I recall correctly both 732s and 734s, at airports (like ARN and ZRH) not served by GT:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Johan Ljungdahl



I had assumed that they were being operated by GT on charter flights as, for example, the aircraft pictured above on 8 August 97 at ARN was leased by GT from 18 March 97 to 27 Jaqnuary 98. But from your comment it is probable that the aircraft were actually being operated by or for BA on scheduled flights. But which? Your comment strongly suggests that they were being operated with BA flight and cabin crews. Is this correct? Do you know if these flights originated at LGW, LHR or both? Can you recall whether they were ad hoc operations of a single flight or if they were transferred to BA to operate several flights?

Sorry to be so inquisitive and such a bore. But many thanks for any further insight you can give.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: BA777ER236
Posted 2013-01-30 09:09:23 and read 4596 times.

Quoting VV701 (Reply 14):
I had assumed that they were being operated by GT on charter flights as, for example, the aircraft pictured above on 8 August 97 at ARN

Hi VV701. It's really difficult to say! By '97 BA were only operating the -436 at LHR, whereas BA (EOG) were operating the -236 and the -400 fleet as previous. I was not 'dual rated', so only flew the -400s and latterly the 2 x -300s as previously discussed also. I do recall getting a letter from Flt Ops management stating that we would occasionally 'borrow' GB Airways aircraft if our fleet fell short for tech reasons etc.

So, the photo you showed could be 'DB being 'borrowed' by EOG to operate LGW - ARN (we certainly operated that route at the time), or it could be being operated by a GB crew on a sub charter to BA. It also could be (as you originally surmised) a charter being operated by GB Airways.

Sorry to be so 'woolly' on this, maybe one of my colleagues who was 'dual rated' at the time will remember using ex BA GB Airways a/c on an occasional basis!

Cheers
 

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: Tristarsteve
Posted 2013-01-30 10:11:39 and read 4557 times.

Quoting VV701 (Reply 14):
the aircraft pictured above on 8 August 97 at ARN was leased by GT from 18 March 97 to 27 Jaqnuary 98.

Bit long ago for memory, but I remember that LGW-ARN nightstop was operated by GB airways for a whole season about then. We tried to charge them for working their aircraft, but never got any money as it was central budget!!
The crews looked like BA, but I assume they were GB crew in BA uniform.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: shuttle9juliet
Posted 2013-01-30 10:15:46 and read 4549 times.

Remember the 737 436s went back to LHR around 2001'2 to backfill for the departing 75s, until more 320s arrived..

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: BA777ER236
Posted 2013-01-31 02:16:31 and read 4403 times.

Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 16):
The crews looked like BA, but I assume they were GB crew in BA uniform.

I think that the GB cabin crew wore BA uniform, but usually the flight crew used GB uniform.

Quoting shuttle9juliet (Reply 17):
Remember the 737 436s went back to LHR around 2001'2 to backfill for the departing 75s, until more 320s arrived..

Some, but not all, from memory.

Cheers
 

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: VV701
Posted 2013-01-31 09:39:53 and read 4279 times.

Quoting BA777ER236 (Reply 15):
Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 16):

Thank you both for your input. As a well known retailer says "Every little helps".

While on the question of BA's 737s I have always been a little mystified by their "first" aircraft, 236 G-BGDA (Line # 599). It took to the air for the first time on 12 September 1979 as N1285E. But it was not delivered by Boeing to BA until over two years later on 4 December 1981. By then all the other aircraft from the BA initial order for 19 aircraft and the first follow-up order for nine more aircraft had been delivered and in service with BA for around eight months or longer. (The 27th of these aircraft , G-BGJM (Line # 751) was delivered on 8 April 1981.)

I had always wondered about this two-year delay in delivering a well established product (with the 737-200 Advanced already around ten years old). Was the delay somehow associated with BA's need for the same Category 3A Autoland Certification on their 732 and 752 fleets that they already had on their HS 121 Trident fleet? Recognising that the BA and DL 752 launch orders were placed in February1979 and that BA and its predecessor, BEA had been operating Tridents with an autoland capability since 1965 was it associated with developing an autoland capability for the 757?

[Edited 2013-01-31 09:43:02]

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: Tristarsteve
Posted 2013-02-01 00:03:04 and read 4116 times.

Quoting VV701 (Reply 19):
Was the delay somehow associated with BA's need for the same Category 3A Autoland Certification on their 732 and 752 fleets that they already had on their HS 121 Trident fleet?

Yes. The BA B737-200 had a new digital AFCS, automatic flight control system, never seen on a B737 before. It had double autopilot actuators to drive this. So the aircraft were quite different from previous B737 in this regard, and Boeing kept GDA for two years for systems development.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: BA777ER236
Posted 2013-02-01 00:24:46 and read 4103 times.

Quoting VV701 (Reply 19):
Was the delay somehow associated with BA's need for the same Category 3A Autoland Certification on their 732 and 752 fleets that they already had on their HS 121 Trident fleet?

Hi VV701. I think that you are probably right....and wrong!

Before I start on the right bit..The Trident, Tristar, 757 and 747-236 fleets (& Concorde I believe?) were all fitted with CAT3B autoland. Certainly in the Tristar & 757 case this was certified for 0ft Decision Altitude (DA) and 75m touchdown visibility (RVR) on appropriately equiped runways (LHR, LGW, BHX, MAN, GLA, EDI & NCL are all so equiped in the UK).

The 747-136 fleet were only fitted with 2 x autopilots and were therefore only capable of CAT3A (50ft DA, 200m TD RVR), whereas the 747-236 fleet were fitted with 3 x autopilots. If an autoland was planned or anticipated whilst flying a -236 into a suitably equiped airport using Low Visibility Procedures (LVPs), then the Flight Engineer would go through a lengthy checklist to seperate parts of the electrical system (in particular) to ensure that the 3 x autopliots had, effectively, 3 different power sources. This effectively created a 'triplex' system that was required for CAT3B. This was also called a 'fail operational system', which means that should one element fail (autopilot, ILS receiver, electric system etc.) then the other 2 parts are still capable of performing a successful autoland. As the 747-136 was only dual at best, this is called a 'fail passive' system and is not capable of an autoland with similar failures and is therefore only CAT3A.

The Trident, as you know was pioneering in the triplex autoland sense. The Tristar had a brilliant system that was effectively a dual/dual system and definitely 'fail operational'. The 757/767 was designed from the outset as a triplex/fail operational/CAT3B system and was/is very good. The 747-436 fleet has a very similar system fitted. The A320 fleet has 2 x autopilots fitted but they are both dual channel, so like the Tristar, has effectively a dual/dual system that is fully CAT3B capable. In fact, the A320, should one autopilot be unserviceable, is still CAT3A. I'm sure that Concorde had a triplex CAT3B system, but I'm no expert on Concorde!

....and the 'right' bit!....

The 737 fleet is and was dual/fail passive/CAT3A. It is therefore, in the autoland sense, the poor relation in the main BA fleets.

However, the 737-236 was (along with the Lufthansa -230 a/c) the first version to have fitted a new autopilot that was more advanced than previous versions for the 737. Although with only 2 x autopilots, the Mode Control Panel (MCP) was (and is) quite similar in usage terms to the 757.

So, I suspect that G-BGDA was used for autopilot/CAT3A development for some while after the initial BA delivery. She would then have been 'refurbished' before delivery, I'm sure.

Cheers
 

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: BA777ER236
Posted 2013-02-01 00:29:06 and read 4101 times.

Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 20):
Yes. The BA B737-200 had a new digital AFCS, automatic flight control system, never seen on a B737 before. It had double autopilot actuators to drive this. So the aircraft were quite different from previous B737 in this regard, and Boeing kept GDA for two years for systems development.

Thanks Tristarsteve, I was typing out my reply when you posted yours, so you've elaborated on the actual autoplilot bit!

Cheers
 

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: Tristarsteve
Posted 2013-02-01 01:12:19 and read 4086 times.

Quoting BA777ER236 (Reply 21):
Although with only 2 x autopilots, the Mode Control Panel (MCP) was (and is) quite similar in usage terms to the 757.

Just to add that all previous B737-200 built had a single channel autopilot. If it failed it failed, so there was no autoland capability.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: VV701
Posted 2013-02-01 07:02:33 and read 4008 times.

Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 20):
Quoting BA777ER236 (Reply 21):

Again many thanks to both of you.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: Robbb
Posted 2013-02-01 13:28:27 and read 3991 times.

THIS MIGHT HELP:

The list below shows all the 737s (AFAIK) operated by BA with the years they joined and left the fleet (if no leaving date is shown the aircraft is still in the fleet).

It includes aircraft leased in from other airlines and operated by BA but not wet-leased aircraft or aircraft acquired by BA solely to be leased out to other carriers.

Some aircraft operated with BA before or after being operated by other airlines flying as BA.


737-200

BGDA 81 01
BGDB 80 97
BGDC 80 95
BGDD 80 95
BGDE 80 01
BGDF 80 01
BGDG 80 98
BGDH 80 95
BGDI 80 98
BGDJ 80 01
BGDK 80 98
BGDL 80 01
BGDN 80 95
BGDO 80 00
BGDP 80 98
BGDR 80 01
BGDS 80 00
BGDT 80 01
BGDU 80 92

BGJE 82 01
BGJF 82 99
BGJG 82 94
BGJH 83 99
BGJI 83 97
BGJJ 82 98
BGJK 83 94
BGJL 83 84 W/O at MAN while operated by British Airtours
BGJM 83 95

BKYA 84 00
BKYB 84 00
BKYC 84 98
BKYD 84 95
BKYE 84 99
BKYF 84 98
BKYG 84 98
BKYH 84 01
BKYI 85 99
BKYJ 85 99
BKYK 85 99
BKYL 85 99
BKYM 85 99
BKYN 85 00
BKYO 85 99
BKYP 85 00


737-400

DOCA 91
DOCB 91
DOCC 91 02
DOCD 91 04
DOCE 91
DOCF 91
DOCG 91
DOCH 91
DOCI 92 04
DOCJ 92 02
DOCK 92 02
DOCL 92
DOCM 92 04
DOCN 92
DOCO 92
DOCP 92 05
DOCR 92 04
DOCS 92
DOCT 92
DOCU 92
DOCV 93
DOCW 93
DOCX 93
DOCY 93
DOCZ 93
GBTA 93
GBTB 93

BNNK 92 95 ex-DA
BNNL 92 95 ex-DA
BPNZ 92 95 ex-DA
BSNV 92 03 ex-DA
BSNW 92 03 ex-DA
BUHJ 93 02 ordered by DA but delivered to BA
BUHK 93 03 ordered by DA but delivered to BA
BUHL 93 96 ordered by DA but delivered to BA
BVNM 92 04 ex-DA
BVNN 92 04 ex-DA
BVNO 92 04 ex-DA
TREN 92 97 ex-DA


737-300

BNNJ 92 94 ex-DA
BOWR 92 93 ex-DA
SCUH 92 93 ex-DA

BOZA 88 92 leased from Maersk
BOZB 88 92 leased from Maersk
CMMP 88 91 leased from Maersk
CMMR 90 91 leased from Maersk

OAMS 97 02
ODUS 98 02
OFRA 98 02
OHAJ 98 02
OMUC 98 02
XBHX 98 03
XMAN 98 03

LGTE 00 09
LGTF 01 09
LGTG 01 09
LGTH 01 09
LGTI 01 09


737-500

GFFA 00 09
GFFB 00 08
GFFC 00 05
GFFD 00 09
GFFE 00 08
GFFF 00 09
GFFG 00 09
GFFH 00 09
GFFI 00 10
GFFJ 01 09

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: VV701
Posted 2013-02-02 18:27:47 and read 3687 times.

Quoting Robbb (Reply 25):
The list below shows all the 737s (AFAIK) operated by BA with the years they joined and left the fleet (if no leaving date is shown the aircraft is still in the fleet).

I think you could also have included:

200s

EI-BTW leased from GPA 88 89 then rereg. G-IBTW - see below
EI-BTZ leased from GPA 88 88 then rereg. G-IBTZ - see below
G-IBTW rereg. from EI-BTW - see above - 89 90
G-IBTZ rereg. from EI-BTZ - see above - 88 89. Caledonian sublease 89 90. GB Airways sublease 90 91. BA ret. 91 91
PH-TVD leased from Transavia 78 79
PH-TVE leased from Transavia 78 80
PH-TVH leased from Transavia 78 80
PH-TVI leased from Transavia 77 78 and 79 80

300s

OY-MMP leased from Maersk 88 88 - lease continued after rereg as G-CMMP - see Robbb listing
OY-MMR leased from Maersk 88 90 - lease continued after rereg. as G-CMMR - see Robbb listing

There was also a 330, TF-ABL that does not really qualify as it was a WET lease from Air Atlanta. However unlike all other BA 737 wet leases which were very short term leases either to cover for a temporary shortage of operational aircraft or crews, this aircraft was wet leased for most of Summer Season 1998 and was painted with "British Airways" titles and their Speedmarque.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: YVRLTN
Posted 2013-02-02 19:31:04 and read 3700 times.

When did BA order the 734? And why did they order it instead of the 320 - or as well as the 320 - when they were taking over BCal's 320 order?

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: Tristarsteve
Posted 2013-02-03 00:54:45 and read 3615 times.

Quoting YVRLTN (Reply 27):
When did BA order the 734? And why did they order it instead of the 320 - or as well as the 320 - when they were taking over BCal's 320 order?

It was ordered around the end of 1988, after the first A320 were in service.
I remember that both types were considered, and the B734 was ordered. Why? We will never know. BA had a large fleet of B732 at the time, and was seriously considering selling the A320. We know the B734 uses more fuel than an A320, but fuel was cheap then, and this was for one hour sectors.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: FlyCaledonian
Posted 2013-02-03 06:14:17 and read 3468 times.

Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 28):
It was ordered around the end of 1988, after the first A320 were in service.
I remember that both types were considered, and the B734 was ordered. Why? We will never know. BA had a large fleet of B732 at the time, and was seriously considering selling the A320. We know the B734 uses more fuel than an A320, but fuel was cheap then, and this was for one hour sectors.

I also think that around the time the order was made BA was ordering significant numbers of 747-436 and 767-336ER aircraft from Beoing. So I suspectt that BA (which in the 1980s and early 1990s was said to stand for Boeing Always) was offered a good deal on the 737s as part of a package of orders and options on the 747/767. The msn numbers for many of the 737-436s/747-436s/767-336ERs show how aircraft were ordered together, or very close together: -

25267 737-436 G-DOCA

25304 737-436 G-DOCB
25305 737-436 G-DOCC

25349 737-436 G-DOCD
25350 737-436 G-DOCE

25406 747-436 G-BNLU
25407 737-436 G-DOCF
25408 737-436 G-DOCG

25428 747-436 G-BNLV
25429 737-436 G-DOCH

25432 747-436 G-BNLW
25433 747-436 G-BNLX (Cancelled)
25434 747-436 G-BNLY (Deferred and delivered as G-CIVF)
25435 747-436 G-BNLZ (Delivered as G-BNLX)

25442 767-336ER G-BNWO
25443 767-336ER G-BNWP
25444 767-336ER G-BNWN

25806 757-236 G-BPEI
25807 757-236 G-BPEJ
25808 757-236 G-BPEK
25809 747-436 G-CIVH (Originally intended to be G-CIVA?)
25810 747-436 G-CIVU (Originally intended to be G-CIVB?)
25811 747-436 G-CIVB (Originally intended to be G-CIVC?)
25812 747-436 G-CIVC (Originally intended to be G-CIVD?)
25813 747-436 G-CIVG (Originally intended to be G-CIVE?)
25814 747-436 G-CIVI (Originally intended to be G-CIVF?)
25815 747-436 Cancelled - Originally intended to be G-CIVG?
25816 747-436 Cancelled or option not taken up? - Originally intended to be G-CIVH?
25817 747-436 G-CIVJ (Originally intended to be G-CIVI?)
25818 747-436 G-CIVK (Originally intended to be G-CIVJ?)
25819 747-436 G-CIVV (Originally intended to be G-CIVK?)
25820 747-436 G-CIVR (Originally intended to be G-CIVL?)
25821 747-436 G-CIVT (Originally intended to be G-CIVM?)
25822 747-436 G-CIVW (Originally intended to be G-CIVN?)
25823 747-436 G-BYGC (Originally intended to be G-CIVO?)
25824 747-436 G-BYGF (Originally intended to be G-CIVP?)
25825 747-436 Option not taken up? - Originally intended to be G-CIVR?
25826 767-336ER G-BNWS
25827 767-336ER Option not taken up?
25828 767-336ER G-BNWT
25829 767-336ER G-BNWU
25830 767-336ER Option not taken up?
25831 767-336ER G-BNWW
25832 767-336ER G-BNWX
25833 767-336ER Option not taken up?
25834 767-336ER G-BNWY
25835 767-336ER Option not taken up?
25836 767-336ER Option not taken up?
25837 767-336ER Option not taken up?
25838 767-336ER Option not taken up?
25839 737-436 G-DOCI
25840 737-436 G-DOCJ
25841 737-436 G-DOCK
25842 737-436 G-DOCL
25843 737-436 G-DOCM
25844 737-436 Deferred and delivered as G-BVBY then G-DOCY
25845 737-436 Cancelled or option not taken up?
25846 737-436 Cancelled or option not taken up?
25847 737-436 Cancelled or option not taken up?
25848 737-436 G-DOCN
25849 737-436 G-DOCO
25850 737-436 G-DOCP
25851 737-436 G-DOCR
25852 737-436 G-DOCS
25853 737-436 G-DOCT
25854 737-436 G-DOCU
25855 737-436 G-DOCV
25856 737-436 G-DOCW
25857 737-436 G-DOCX
25858 737-436 G-DOCZ Originally delivered as G-BVBZ
25859 737-436 G-GBTA Originally delivered as G-BVHA
25860 737-436 G-GBTB Originally delivered as G-BVHB
25861 737-436 Option not taken up?
25862 737-436 Option not taken up?
25863 737-436 Option not taken up?

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: VV701
Posted 2013-02-03 10:08:39 and read 3374 times.

Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 29):
I also think that around the time the order was made BA was ordering significant numbers of 747-436 and 767-336ER aircraft from Beoing.

  

In October 1988 BA placed the order for 24 Boeing 737 300/400/500 - type to be determined. At the same time they ordered six 763ERs and a single 752.

Another factor that probably influenced the BA negotiations with Boeing was that the order was placed at a time when BA had been an A 320 user for only six or seven months and was then operating a small fleet of three of that type (that had been delivered to BA but had been ordered by BCal). To be able to point out that an internationally recognised European operator of the 320 had placed a significant orde for the 737 may well have been perceived as being commercially advantageous by Boeing.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: gabrielchew
Posted 2013-02-03 14:19:27 and read 3240 times.

Quoting shuttle9juliet (Reply 6):
G-DOCA- Z stood for DOmestiCAircraft, G-BNLA, Boeing New Large Aircraft , G-BNWA, Boeing New Wide Body ect.

Fascinating! I had no idea these letters actually meant anything. I like the Virgin way of numbering a bit better, although obviously this doesn't work on a large fleet

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: shuttle9juliet
Posted 2013-02-03 15:15:29 and read 3208 times.

Quoting gabrielchew (Reply 31):

I am thinking of others, G-STBA, debatable at work but most think it's StreTched Boeing Aircraft , but others think it's named after our maintenance base at hatton cross TBA, TBC, ect.

I agree virgin are very clever with their regs..

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: robbb
Posted 2013-02-04 03:26:37 and read 3081 times.

Always happy to be corrected.

I had completely forgotten the Transavia aircraft. Were these actually operated by BA or wet-leased?

I didn't include the G-IBT* aircraft as I thought they were purely operated by other airlines, initially GB Airways, hence the registrations.

I didn't include the OY registrations as they later went onto G registrations but I did get the dates wrong as I only looked at them on the UK register.

I didn't include the Atlanta Icelandic aircraft as it was a wet-lease, albeit fairly longish-term.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: skipness1E
Posted 2013-02-04 05:04:18 and read 3035 times.

The G-IBT* aircraft were never flown in BA colours as I recall, thought G-IBTW appears to have flown for Caledonian.
The Transavia aircraft remained on the Dutch register and were flown in a non standard BA livery.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: ACDC8
Posted 2013-02-04 07:09:41 and read 2987 times.

Quoting VV701 (Reply 11):
G-OMUC was in full BA "Colum" (Ireland) livery when it was ferried BFI-YYR-LGW on 30 June/1 July 98 for cabin furbishment. It was delivered to BA Regional at MAN on 20 July. It operated for BA Regional Until it was returned to its lessor in June 02.

I saw a B737 with blanked out titles arriving at YLW last week, the reg is N405GT and me being curious, I looked up to see if I can find out where she came from. Turns out the B737 was B-2111 from Shandong Airlines which was G-OMUC in her earlier life. Now she's sitting infront of Kelowna Flightcraft which means she's got another lease on life in the skies  

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: VV701
Posted 2013-02-04 08:26:45 and read 2949 times.

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 34):
The G-IBT* aircraft were never flown in BA colours as I recall, thought G-IBTW appears to have flown for Caledonian.

  

EI-BTW was leased by BA on 1 June 88. It was operated painted white with "British Airways" titles until reregistered G-IBTW to BA on 11 April 89. It was sub-leased to KT on 5 May 89 who operated it in full KT livery with "Caledonian" titles. It was returned to BA on 1 November 89. BA then operated it in Caledonian livery but with "British Airways" titles. It was returned to the lessor, GPA, on 28 March 90. Its BA registration was cancelled on 30 March 90. It was leased to LADECO as CC-CLD on 1 April. Here is a photo from when it was operating for BA before the KT sub-lease:


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Photo © Frank Schaefer



EI-BTZ was leased by BA on 26 March 88. It was operated painted white with a light grey belly with "British Airways" titles. On 13 December it was registered to BA as G-IBTZ. It was suleased by KT on 10 April 89 and then by GB Airways on 1 April 90. It was then operated in full GB Airways livery (name Gibel Tarik). It was returned to BA on 19 February 1992 and then to the lessor, GPA on 15 April 92. It was registered to BA between 13 December 88 and 22 October 90 and to GB Airways between 22 October 90 and 1 June 92 when it was reregistered to East West Airlines as VT-EWC.

Quoting robbb (Reply 33):
I had completely forgotten the Transavia aircraft. Were these actually operated by BA or wet-leased?

Initially the aircraft were leased as part of BA's evaluation of a new short-haul aircrafrt. I am therefore thinking that they may have been on full and not a wet lease. But that's a guess. What I do know is that BA also evaluated the DC-9 41 by using leased in Finnair aircraft for the LHR-HEL-LHR BA772/73 rotation throughout November and December 1977. I know these flights had BA cabin crew but am unsure about the flight crew.

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 34):
The Transavia aircraft remained on the Dutch register and were flown in a non standard BA livery.

The grey belly of Transavia aircraft painted in BA livery was more extensive than on BA aircraft and the "Boeing 737" engine titles were on the Transavia aircraft but not the BA aircraft. Compare and contrast:


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Photo © Udo K. Haafke
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Photo © Kjell Nilsson



However some of the early leased aircraft remained in full Transavia livery but with "Transavia Holland on lease to British Airways" titles:


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Photo © Arno Janssen

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: VV701
Posted 2013-02-04 08:44:30 and read 2930 times.

Should have said that the titles on the right side of the aircraft in Transavia colours read a little differently, namely "British Airways on lease from Transavia Holland" Here's another photo with the same aircraft somewhat later by then almost in full BA livery:


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Photo © Stefan Sjogren - Stockholm Arlanda Photography
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Photo © TriplET

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: jwhite9185
Posted 2013-02-04 11:13:41 and read 2851 times.

Quoting shuttle9juliet (Reply 17):
Remember the 737 436s went back to LHR around 2001'2 to backfill for the departing 75s, until more 320s arrived..

They certainly did - I flew G-DOCC between LHR and MAN in October 2001. Replaced the scheduled 757.

Then on the return from MAN, the flight previous to the one I was on was operated by an A32X. First time I remembered seeing anything other than a 757 on the LHR-MAN route. I figured the smaller aircraft were due to the downturn after 9/11.

Topic: RE: British Airways 737 In The 90s Help
Username: BSRadar
Posted 2013-02-05 08:08:48 and read 2671 times.

Quoting W701 & FlyCaledonian: "Another factor that probably influenced the BA negotiations with Boeing was that the order was placed at a time when BA had been an A 320 user for only six or seven months and was then operating a small fleet of three of that type (that had been delivered to BA but had been ordered by BCal). "

Indeed. BA was very much a Boeing airline, and I recall a sharp spat between Airbus and BA (I think Lord King involved himself) at the time the A320's were being delivered. BA gave the quite strong impression that they really they didn't want them, as they were somewhat limited (range?), but had to take them through the BCal deal. The Airbus chief at the time defended his companies product, and called BA's bluff with "We'll take them back if that's the way you feel about them" - or similar. The first few A320's were the -100 series, which had a shorter range than the later 200's., but nevertheless the --100's stayed until recently.

Seemingly, the bluff was well called, and if there was pudding on faces, who's got it now - given the numbers of the A320 family now in the BA fleet?


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