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Topic: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: TK787
Posted 2013-03-07 06:34:43 and read 9897 times.

I guess we can say that it is official, coming from the Chairman of the Board Hamdi Topcu, from this Turkish article;
http://www.airporthaber.com/havacili...topcu-2003te-pilotlar-issizdi.html
He says 7 WB aircraft are leased and joining the fleet starting May.
This is on top of an order of 20 x 77Ws (first 3 arrive in 2014), 22 x 333s + 3 options, ( first 2 x 333s arrive this year, 5 more in 2014)
We had a thread earlier that suggested the 7 could be 777s, but that thread is locked,
Turkish Airlines To Lease 7x 777 (by tkfan Dec 22 2012 in Civil Aviation)
and this new information doesn't specify what type those 7 frames are.
So let the speculation begin; 332/333/77W/77L?

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: scouseflyer
Posted 2013-03-07 06:37:24 and read 9886 times.

A380, 748 perhaps 

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: JU068
Posted 2013-03-07 06:37:52 and read 9885 times.

Would it make sense for TK to order the B748? That is having in mind their current fleet structure.

[Edited 2013-03-07 06:40:45]

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: TK787
Posted 2013-03-07 06:49:47 and read 9733 times.

Not an order for new aircraft, since arriving in couple of months;
From the archived thread;
Post by karan69;
As per some sources a 4 aircraft deal has been signed with 9W , these will be the Current aircraft which are with TG which will go to TK as their leases expire

Karan

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: rutankrd
Posted 2013-03-07 07:45:20 and read 9405 times.

Quoting TK787 (Reply 3):
As per some sources a 4 aircraft deal has been signed with 9W , these will be the Current aircraft which are with TG which will go to TK as their leases expire

Back to the future then !

Good question is will they restore the first class offering as per previous 9W leases ?

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: TK787
Posted 2013-03-07 07:57:12 and read 9324 times.

Quoting rutankrd (Reply 4):
will they restore the first class offering as per previous 9W leases ?

Great question.
I have no idea. I for one would like to blow some miles on those F suites. But for fleet commonality, it is down the drain again. I am sure this is for stop gap measure and might be wet-lease, might be as short as 18 month long.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: HB-IWC
Posted 2013-03-07 15:37:00 and read 8467 times.

As I also mentioned in the other thread, the 9W B77Ws are alsmost certainly involved in this deal. Five aircraft are currently on lease with TG and will gradually return as TG is in the process of receiving its own B77Ws. Some of these aircraft have already been with TK before as TC-JJA/B/C/D.

Whether TK again takes these 4 aircraft, or all 5 that are now with TK or even 7 of the 10-strong 9W B77W fleet remains to be seen, but 9W is in the process of receiving A333 aircraft and could offload up to 7 B77W aircraft and use the remaining three aircraft for its 3 daily LHR rotations. That may not cover for any down time, but then 9W has last week announced that one out of 21 weekly LHR rotations will operate with A333, so the airline may well be preparing to transfer 7 B77Ws to TK.

If these are indeed the aircraft we are talking about, I doubt that TK will reinstate the First Class after that experiment failed last time around. I feel the 8 suites will be used as J to make for a 38-seat business class cabin.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: 4engines4lnghll
Posted 2013-03-08 02:42:05 and read 7023 times.

Off topic here, but is TK looking at DFW?

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: GCT64
Posted 2013-03-08 03:13:48 and read 6770 times.

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 6):
9W has last week announced that one out of 21 weekly LHR rotations will operate with A333

This week (Wednesday) VT-JWT A333 operated JAI120/JAI119 into LHR.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: PlymSpotter
Posted 2013-03-08 03:17:19 and read 6732 times.

I know they have the routes to fly them on, but for now I still wonder where on Earth they plan to park them all at IST.


Dan  

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: na
Posted 2013-03-08 03:23:31 and read 6666 times.

Likely shortterm leases to cover the time until the own 77Ws arrive then. I wonder why Jet Aw isnt selling part of their 77W fleet if they dont need them.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: TK787
Posted 2013-03-08 04:08:16 and read 6293 times.

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 6):
I doubt that TK will reinstate the First Class after that experiment failed last time around. I feel the 8 suites will be used as J to make for a 38-seat business class cabin.

Do you mean taking those 1 ton each F seats to make room for 38J seats for the short time TK will be leasing these aircraft?
Knowing TK, they wouldn't spend the time or the money and use them as they are on routes like JFK, LAX where TK might find F pax.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: HB-IWC
Posted 2013-03-08 05:01:30 and read 5906 times.

Quoting TK787 (Reply 11):
Do you mean taking those 1 ton each F seats to make room for 38J seats for the short time TK will be leasing these aircraft?

No, I mean selling the 8 F suites as J, thereby making a 38-seat J cabin, as there are also 30 J-seats in those aircraft.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: TK787
Posted 2013-03-08 05:14:10 and read 5810 times.

Quoting 4engines4lnghll (Reply 7):
Off topic here, but is TK looking at DFW?

I doubt that. Houston starts next month; Boston and SFO might be next for N.America.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: jreuschl
Posted 2013-03-08 05:37:45 and read 5639 times.

I know a 2nd flight has been rumored once in a while for ORD. Would they upgrade it to a 77W?

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: leftyboarder
Posted 2013-03-08 05:44:59 and read 5563 times.

Quoting jreuschl (Reply 14):

I know a 2nd flight has been rumored once in a while for ORD. Would they upgrade it to a 77W?

With almost no feed from UA at ORD, it makes little sense to do so. They are better off starting DTW if they want more feed from Midwest.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: TK787
Posted 2013-03-08 05:50:01 and read 5532 times.

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 12):
No, I mean selling the 8 F suites as J, thereby making a 38-seat J cabin, as there are also 30 J-seats in those aircraft.

You mean 8 people get the Suite, 30 people get the herringbone seat and ALL this will be J. That is not fair.
8 Suites J, 30 seats will become Comfort, as shown;
http://www.seatguru.com/airlines/Tur...kish_Airlines_Boeing_777-300ER.php

Quoting jreuschl (Reply 14):
I know a 2nd flight has been rumored once in a while for ORD. Would they upgrade it to a 77W?

IST-ORD is already a daily 77W flight.
AFAIK this is the first I hear a second flight to ORD. I was under the impression that ORD flights are not that profitable compared to JFK or LAX or YYZ.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: KL911
Posted 2013-03-08 06:20:48 and read 5269 times.

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 15):
With almost no feed from UA at ORD, it makes little sense to do so.

Huh? Isn't UA massive in ORD? I would think they have plenty of feed.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: leftyboarder
Posted 2013-03-08 06:36:14 and read 5106 times.

Quoting KL911 (Reply 17):
Huh? Isn't UA massive in ORD? I would think they have plenty of feed.

Except UA hasn't been the most cooperative partner for TK so far. Even AC offers more codeshares via YYZ to US cities to TK.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: JU068
Posted 2013-03-08 07:49:52 and read 4907 times.

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 18):

But doesn't Turkish Airlines have a network large enough to sustain a second daily flight without United's codeshare?

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: LAXintl
Posted 2013-03-08 08:16:24 and read 4838 times.

Quoting TK787 (Reply 16):
IST-ORD is already a daily 77W flight.

ORD sees the A330/A340 not 777.

Only US cities with the 77W currently are JFK and LAX. ORD and IAD are A330/340 markets.

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 18):
Except UA hasn't been the most cooperative partner for TK so far. Even AC offers more codeshares via YYZ to US cities to TK.

  

TK also made a broad deal with JetBlue and a smaller one with Virgin America.

United is too wrapped up with its A++ JV then to release seats at discount to TK.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: HB-IWC
Posted 2013-03-08 08:18:54 and read 4825 times.

Quoting TK787 (Reply 16):
You mean 8 people get the Suite, 30 people get the herringbone seat and ALL this will be J. That is not fair.
8 Suites J, 30 seats will become Comfort, as shown

No way TK is going to sell only 8 J seats on a longhaul aircraft, that is simply not enough, and since I also very much doubt that a short lived reintroduction of the First Class is in order, I am sticking to my position that it will be a 38 J cabin in which 8 lucky passengers will end up in a suite.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: TK787
Posted 2013-03-08 08:26:32 and read 4782 times.

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 21):
I am sticking to my position that it will be a 38 J cabin in which 8 lucky passengers will end up in a suite.

I hope you are not right. Since they might have those flights to JFK and I will not have the option to fly Comfort.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 20):
ORD sees the A330/A340 not 777.

LAXintl, again my fault. I even posted it after double checking TK17 stats, thinking TK17 is ORD. Sometimes in the morning the brain does weird things 

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: MeCe
Posted 2013-03-08 09:39:13 and read 4640 times.

Quoting TK787 (Reply 16):



8 seat j is not possible I guess. They will/should find a way not to introduce F class again. My vote goes removing all suites and put herringbone seats that area and have 2 class 777. This config works much better on mid haul flights too.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: AAMDanny
Posted 2013-03-08 14:16:51 and read 4334 times.

Does TK still have a A340 fleet? Would the ex-VS A346's be a good stop gap till 773ER's arrive?

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: TK787
Posted 2013-03-08 15:52:30 and read 4329 times.

Quoting AAMDanny (Reply 24):

TK has 7 x 343s.
TK doesn't need the range of the 346 and when so many 332s avail, I doubt that.
Then again, if the price is right, who knows.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: behramjee
Posted 2013-03-08 21:38:25 and read 4099 times.

Quoting TK787 (Reply 16):
You mean 8 people get the Suite, 30 people get the herringbone seat and ALL this will be J. That is not fair.
8 Suites J, 30 seats will become Comfort, as shown;

nopes...what should happen logically is that 8 pax paying a full J class level published fare will be eligible to sit in these 8 first class seats where as the remaining business class pax paying lower fares booked in C / D / Z / I classes etc will be seated in the normal business class cabin.

this is what Gulf Air too does on board its A332s which operate as 8F/24J in the front but sold as 32J with the 8 pax seated up front only if they paid the J class inventory level fare or if there are less than 8 pax on board in the premium cabin, then all the pax get treated to the front seats.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: Carfield
Posted 2013-03-08 22:17:40 and read 4155 times.

First, TG has been very rough with those 77Ws leased from Jet Airways. Those planes need some major fix or "cleanup" before putting in use by any airlines in the world. I flew those 77Ws last year and you could see the chips in the first class suite door, and some of the doors were not working. The locking mechanism was no longer working. I guess ideally, Thai Airways will have to do some work before returning them, but TK needs to perhaps check more carefully this time before receiving them.

Second, TK can perhaps sell those eight seats as a premium business section. Sort of like SAS's old concept of sleepers, or Virgin Australia's Row 5 in 77Ws (snooze zone)... If the surcharge is reasonable, I am sure people will pay for them. Or else, they can just reserve the section for its Elite Plus or Elite members (TK's top tiers frequent flyers). This will make the most sense especially for a short term lease. Anyway, TK has to be really careful because last minute aircraft substitution can be an issue, regarding refund and reseating.

Either way, I much prefer those herringbone seats than TK's current business class seats. I like direct aisle access and 9W's version is not too bad.

I sincerely hope a new business class design is on its way with the new batch of 77Ws, and we will possibly find out the fate of "Comfort Class," Turkish Airlines' Premium Economy cabin.

Carfield

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: MeCe
Posted 2013-03-09 07:06:19 and read 3749 times.

Quoting Carfield (Reply 27):
If the surcharge is reasonable, I am sure people will pay for them. Or else, they can just reserve the section for its Elite Plus or Elite members (TK's top tiers frequent flyers). This will make the most sense especially for a short term lease




This is best way for a short lease but I doubt surcharge will be reasonable. AFAIK this suites weighs more than 700 kg, it is not space only but also weight. Compare with the double business seat is around 100-150 kg it is much more heavier for paid price. Hope they will solve this with a practical way for everyone.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: Tdan
Posted 2013-03-09 07:35:43 and read 3678 times.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 20):
Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 18):
Except UA hasn't been the most cooperative partner for TK so far. Even AC offers more codeshares via YYZ to US cities to TK.



TK also made a broad deal with JetBlue and a smaller one with Virgin America.

United is too wrapped up with its A++ JV then to release seats at discount to TK.

         Even among the A++ partners, UA isn't the best at cooperating. They play the "we're the largest airline in the world so you should do what we want" card WAY too often. It's actually quite funny when you think that LH is the carrier at the other end of the table and they back down from no one. Some Star carriers like TK, SQ and NZ won't put up with UA's attempt at bullying and instead establish relationships with other carriers for feed.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: karan69
Posted 2013-03-09 10:42:58 and read 3396 times.

Quoting TK787 (Reply 3):
Not an order for new aircraft, since arriving in couple of months;
From the archived thread;
Post by karan69;
As per some sources a 4 aircraft deal has been signed with 9W , these will be the Current aircraft which are with TG which will go to TK as their leases expire

Hi Guys,

Altough the deal was as good as confirmed when i mentioned it previously, but the EY and Jet talks changed the whole situation,

A couple of things doing the rounds, yoll draw your own conclusions
If the deal went through,
EY wanted those 777s for themselves, for that to happen the TK deal had to be put on the back burner
EY wanted to wetlease 2 for GRU flights , have 9W shift the EWR flight via AUH instead of BRU, and lease some of their 777s to enhance their regular operations
Talks between the 2 ofcourse hit a standstill due to a number of reasons,
So Jet got back on the leasing market, but then again the recent purchase of Jets LHR slots by EY leaves a lot of things unclear

Just sharing what i have heard

Karan

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: TK787
Posted 2013-03-09 12:39:19 and read 3211 times.

Quoting karan69 (Reply 30):
EY wanted those 777s for themselves, for that to happen the TK deal had to be put on the back burner

Thanks for the update.
Mmmmmmm. Not sure what this means, but if TK told the press they have 7 widebodies starting to arrive in May, maybe some other frames/types?

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: sunrisevalley
Posted 2013-03-09 12:52:09 and read 3196 times.

Quoting Carfield (Reply 27):
I flew those 77Ws last year and you could see the chips in the first class suite door, and some of the doors were not working. The locking mechanism was no longer working. I guess ideally,

How about all the deficiencies you cannot see   

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: kaitak
Posted 2013-03-10 03:42:47 and read 2776 times.

There was mention on another site of some regulatory issues for TK regarding the ex-9W 777s; apparently neither the Americans nor the Japanese would allow the wet leased aircraft into their airspace; any particular reason for this? Of course, it still leaves plenty of destinations for these aircraft to serve, but doesn't help flexibility.

Certainly, the upcoming EY deal with 9W seems to have put the kibosh on things for now; it's probably a lesson to TK not to make announcements until the contract has been signed on the dotted line. Can't think where TK will be able to pick up 77Ws at such short notice, though no doubt Boeing will do its best to help.

I realise that the standard (i.e. non-ER) 773 would not be ideal, but with a range of 6,000nm, it could (on paper) do YYZ and JFK, as well as BKK, HKG and Chinese destinations. If SQ hasn't committed all of its 773s to Transaero, might this be a possible source?

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: nethkt
Posted 2013-03-10 09:56:14 and read 2480 times.

Why are we focusing on only B777s? How about A343s or A330s?

Since EK is getting more 77Ws and 380s they will get rid of 332s and 343s, could this be the option?
Not to mention CX's 343s and older 333s!

Would really love to see TK livery on A380 or B787!

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: 7BOEING7
Posted 2013-03-10 10:44:12 and read 2372 times.

It says "starting" in May, it doesn't say they will all show up in May. Why not new airplanes, GECAS has several 77W's on order and THY has leased 77W's from them before. Guess we won't know until May.

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: TK787
Posted 2013-03-10 11:19:48 and read 2300 times.

Also, where does TK planning on using this 15% increase in WB capacity.
AFAIK, only Houston is announced for April, and all 4 China destinations to go daily soon.
Could it be for a second daily IST-LAX?
Or give it try with SFO, BOS, Havana, Caracas, YUL, MEX??

Topic: RE: TK To Lease 7 WB Aircraft Arriving May.
Username: MeCe
Posted 2013-03-10 12:51:58 and read 2155 times.

Quoting TK787 (Reply 36):
Also, where does TK planning on using this 15% increase in WB capacity.
AFAIK, only Houston is announced for April, and all 4 China destinations to go daily soon.
Could it be for a second daily IST-LAX?
Or give it try with SFO, BOS, Havana, Caracas, YUL, MEX??

Maybe ORD get 777, or as you mentioned second daily LAX. 777s are used EU flights in summer, w/o addition new frames schedule will be very tight and may collapse only one failure. Additionaly C checks performing one by one now sometimes 2 planes missing several days for schduled maintenance.


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