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Topic: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: Gonzalo
Posted 2013-04-16 08:08:49 and read 7221 times.

AA filed formal plans to exit bankruptcy.
The reorganisation plan details some executive compensation and outlines measures for creditors and shareholders
Tom Horton, would receive a USD$19.9 million severance package.

Secured creditors would be paid in full, while unsecured creditors would receive shares of preferred stock.

All this steps are essential for the merger with US Airways.

More details :

http://news.airwise.com/story/view/1366116649.html


Rgds.
G.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: N62NA
Posted 2013-04-16 09:04:25 and read 7073 times.

Quoting Gonzalo (Thread starter):
Tom Horton, would receive a USD$19.9 million severance package.

That's interesting. I heard a news report over the weekend that Horton was supposed to get $20 million but that the bankruptcy laws don't allow that amount. Is the $19.9 number a revision to the $20 milliion?

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: usairways85
Posted 2013-04-16 09:25:33 and read 6957 times.

Amazing that a CEO is rewarded with $19million for driving an airline into bankruptcy.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: MIflyer12
Posted 2013-04-16 09:31:11 and read 6919 times.

Horton didn't drive AA into bankruptcy - he was just the guy in the Big Chair when the music stopped. The outcome had been obvious for a long time.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: realsim
Posted 2013-04-16 09:42:35 and read 6855 times.

Quoting usairways85 (Reply 2):
Amazing that a CEO is rewarded with $19million for driving an airline into bankruptcy.

He became CEO the same day AA filed for Chapter 11. However, before that, he was the CFO, so it's not like he arrived when the company was already almost bankrupt. He actually had something to do with it. That said, we've seen more significant changes and developments since he is the top executive than many years before, and I personally think that he would have done a good job if he didn't had to leave the company because of the merger. Anyway, such a compensation is outrageous.

[Edited 2013-04-16 09:50:57]

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: Revelation
Posted 2013-04-16 09:45:23 and read 6841 times.

Quoting realsim (Reply 4):
He became CEO the same day AA filed for Chapter 11. However, before that, he was the CFO, so it's not like he arrived when the company was already almost bankrupt...

$19.9M for a few month's work?

CEO pay in the US is ridiculous.

They get the windfall when times are good, AND when times are bad.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: steeler83
Posted 2013-04-16 09:49:26 and read 6812 times.

Quoting N62NA (Reply 1):
That's interesting. I heard a news report over the weekend that Horton was supposed to get $20 million but that the bankruptcy laws don't allow that amount. Is the $19.9 number a revision to the $20 milliion?

I say give him 19.9 million pennies!!! Altho that would still amount to $199k. Not even sure if he's worth that!    In any event, I really hope this merger goes through. I'm usually not someone who would support these things, but I see something exciting that would come out of this.

PHL remains a hub, and PIT could become and interesting market. Not to mention, I Like AA, and I would like to have a chance to fly with them again.  

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: shuttle9juliet
Posted 2013-04-16 10:16:56 and read 6700 times.

Quoting usairways85 (Reply 2):

How on earth do they recieve these bonuses, payoffs?
In my book, they are just as bad as bankers..
They should be going to prison, not getting rewarded???

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: cjg225
Posted 2013-04-16 10:20:18 and read 6665 times.

Quoting N62NA (Reply 1):
That's interesting. I heard a news report over the weekend that Horton was supposed to get $20 million but that the bankruptcy laws don't allow that amount. Is the $19.9 number a revision to the $20 milliion?

I thought it's always been $19.9 mil but the news just rounded it to $20 mil.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: usairways85
Posted 2013-04-16 10:25:54 and read 6624 times.

Quoting realsim (Reply 4):
He became CEO the same day AA filed for Chapter 11. However, before that, he was the CFO, so it's not like he arrived when the company was already almost bankrupt. He actually had something to do with it. That said, we've seen more significant changes and developments since he is the top executive than many years before, and I personally think that he would have done a good job if he didn't had to leave the company because of the merger. Anyway, such a compensation is outrageous.

Yes, some significant changes and developments have been made in the past 6-12 months. But it still amazes me that these guys (previous AA CEO's included) do a horrible job and have to be paid to walk.

Sorry for the rant.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: Revelation
Posted 2013-04-16 10:29:02 and read 6601 times.

Quoting shuttle9juliet (Reply 7):
How on earth do they recieve these bonuses, payoffs?

Because they are decided upon by other members of the executive elite.
Even those elected to the board of directors, who are appointed to watch out for the shareholders.
It's in all of their interest to raid the company coffers when the opportunity presents itself.
An exec whose pay you vote for may be a board member of your future company, etc.
Thus you don't dare oppose his money grab, lest he oppose yours in the future.
Disgusting, greedy ******** all of them!

Keep in mind that $19.9M comes right out of the company bottom line at the exact time they could use the money.
Yet he and is other elites don't care.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: Gonzalo
Posted 2013-04-16 10:41:33 and read 6535 times.

The "compensation" for Mr. Horton is really a hard to swallow pill. It almost becomes a big suppository. A company struggling to exit the bankruptcy should not be allowed to give any compensations to anyone until the financial situation is completely healthy, with blue numbers for years, and after eliminating any possible conflicts with the workforce and creditors. But I guess that is just a fairy tale. The only option available for us "the common people" is praying for a casual date with a fat girl with last name....Horton  

Rgds.
G.

And by the way, could the U$19,9 Million help to get a system actually running ?

BREAKING: AA All Systems Down (by plateman Apr 16 2013 in Civil Aviation)

Rgds.
G.

[Edited 2013-04-16 10:44:56]

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: shuttle9juliet
Posted 2013-04-16 10:48:10 and read 6492 times.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 10):

Even if they are getting massive bonuses, why is it not kept quiet?
Why does the public have to know about it?
How do all the AA staff who have lost jobs, sacrificed everything feel about that?
I think it's downright appalling...
He should stand up and donate that money to some sort of cause.
Greedy s"'&@

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: cjg225
Posted 2013-04-16 10:49:46 and read 6492 times.

Because... it's a public proceeding about a publicly-held private company?

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: flyguy89
Posted 2013-04-16 10:57:13 and read 6443 times.

Quoting shuttle9juliet (Reply 7):
They should be going to prison, not getting rewarded???

Go to prison for what? What laws have airline CEO's violated?

Quoting Revelation (Reply 10):
Disgusting, greedy ******** all of them!

Why do you care so much? It's not your money.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: shuttle9juliet
Posted 2013-04-16 10:58:09 and read 6436 times.

Quoting cjg225 (Reply 13):

It just gets people's backs up....these fat cats that have no clue on how to run company's are rewarded for being inept and useless.
They remind me of footballers in the UK, massive salaries, kiss the badge, love the club they play for ect ect
A month or two down the line, they are off to another club $$$$$$ pays more...
Greedy bandits ...

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: shuttle9juliet
Posted 2013-04-16 11:02:17 and read 6415 times.

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 14):

It probably actually is the employees well deserved money

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: flyguy89
Posted 2013-04-16 11:23:41 and read 6320 times.

Quoting shuttle9juliet (Reply 16):
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 14):

It probably actually is the employees well deserved money

Unless they hold stock in the company, it isn't.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: Revelation
Posted 2013-04-16 11:24:51 and read 6317 times.

Quoting shuttle9juliet (Reply 15):
It just gets people's backs up....these fat cats that have no clue on how to run company's are rewarded for being inept and useless.

I wouldn't go that far. By all accounts Horton did a decent job with the steaming pile he was left with when his predecessor bailed. It's kind of hard to keep all the others focused on their jobs whilst the ship is sinking around them. The real question I have is why is that good job worth a $20M payoff? Executive salaries in the US should be scaled to max out at some multiple of the lowest paid worker's salaries. If that makes a bunch of the greediest buggers seek greener pastures elsewhere, good riddance.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: brilondon
Posted 2013-04-16 16:03:14 and read 5356 times.

Quoting shuttle9juliet (Reply 12):

Quoting Revelation (Reply 10):

Even if they are getting massive bonuses, why is it not kept quiet?
Why does the public have to know about it?
How do all the AA staff who have lost jobs, sacrificed everything feel about that?
I think it's downright appalling...
He should stand up and donate that money to some sort of cause.
Greedy s"'&@

SEC rules dictate the disclosure of all financials. That includes the compensation to the officers of the corporation.

I don't understand your opposition to his buy out. People have been calling for him to resign and now he has an out and you are complaining again. He probably donates more money to charities than you earn in a year.

I don't understand why people are whining about how much other people make, kind of sad IMO.

[Edited 2013-04-16 16:06:47]

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: Gonzalo
Posted 2013-04-16 16:48:54 and read 5020 times.

Quoting brilondon (Reply 19):
I don't understand why people are whining about how much other people make, kind of sad IMO.

IMHO, I think is all about fairness perception from the people. In my personal case ( despite the joke of dating a fat girl with last name Horton in an earlier reply ) , I can assure you it is not envy. Envy is not in my book ( Like I said in another thread in Non Av , I'm a happy person, I mean come on !! I live in a free country, my human rights are respected every day, I have good health, a wife that loves me, a good job that I love, I live in a good house and I have a car, all my relatives and friends are OK... What else can I ask? ). The problem with this executives who takes this big pieces of the cake is, IMO, Is it fair ? Not with me, I don't care, is not my money, my airline or even my country. But is it fair with those who are still waiting for an answer from AA, like creditors, retired pilots, jobless workers ? Mr. Horton was the CFO of AA for "some" time. He has something to do with the AA's financial situation.

Rgds.
G.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: shuttle9juliet
Posted 2013-04-16 16:53:09 and read 4979 times.

Mate, I don't work for AA but I just feel for the staff that have had to go through an awful 12 years and don't forget the TW staff too.
This reminds me of when Carty left before.
Fair enough the SEC decides but it is a kick in the balls to these normal working class frontline staff to have to deal with the day to day running, cutbacks, furloughs, ect, whilst these people walk away with a golden handshake??
Tell me how much do you make a year?
Obviously enough that you don't live in the real world like us hard working frontline staff who sometimes struggle to get by.
" you don't understand why people are whining"??
Welcome to the real world my friend

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: SJUSXM
Posted 2013-04-16 17:40:07 and read 4674 times.

Its $10 million in cash $10 million in stock, so he's not getting $20 million out of the bottom line, only (like $10 million is ONLY...ANYWAY) $10 million. Considering all that Horton did to turn the company around (see revenue growth while in bankruptcy) and execute perhaps the best run airline bankruptcy of this century (full recovery for creditors, even some for stockholders), he's being given $20 million dollars to step aside. We've seen more positive developments out of AA in the last 18 months than in the last 8 years prior. Parker and company are forcing him out. I guarantee you he would have preferred to exit BK as a standalone and then consider and probably merge with US. And if that had happened, he probably would have still been involved with the company, possibly even the CEO. He's being forced out-which is what most of the AA employees wanted. Apparently the price-tag for that is $20 million.


As for Carty's money, while I disagree with it too, let's not forget that the unions had the same money and voted for it in a different package. They also voted to let Carty have the money. Then complained when he got what they had helped draft.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: Gonzalo
Posted 2013-04-16 19:31:20 and read 4150 times.

At least Mr. Horton is doing "all kind of stuff" to justify its compensation :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2o3d6QRL2k

Rgds.

G

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: Mcoov
Posted 2013-04-16 20:48:58 and read 3787 times.

So is AA changing its paint or not?

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: brilondon
Posted 2013-04-17 15:32:17 and read 2207 times.

Quoting Mcoov (Reply 24):
So is AA changing its paint or not?

Why would they change from the current paint? The just introduced it this year and the merger was announced shortly there after. Since it would take a lot longer for a merger to be negotiated than a couple of weeks I would make the assumption that the present AA paint scheme is here to stay. Now I don't think that this is the thread to bring up the new look AA.

Topic: RE: AA Plan To Exit Chapter 11
Username: steeler83
Posted 2013-04-17 17:04:05 and read 2095 times.

Quoting brilondon (Reply 25):
Why would they change from the current paint? The just introduced it this year and the merger was announced shortly there after. Since it would take a lot longer for a merger to be negotiated than a couple of weeks I would make the assumption that the present AA paint scheme is here to stay. Now I don't think that this is the thread to bring up the new look AA.

Agreed. I motion to stick with how AA will restructure itself and merge with US. Regarding the merger, was it discussed how the new AA will use the various aircraft, especially the US A320s?

And I think we've already established that Horton is not worthy at all of his little parting gift...  Wink

[Edited 2013-04-17 17:10:49]


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