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Topic: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: kann123air
Posted 2013-05-03 12:08:21 and read 7024 times.

Hi everybody, I was wondering what exactly determine what routes QF operates with their 747-400s versus their -400ERs. I've noticed that on some days QF 107/108 (SYD-LAX-JFK-LAX-SYD) operated by the -400 (I noticed that -OJU, the Boxing Kangaroo, is operating it today). However, I've seen VH-OEH, which is a -400ER, doing it multiple times over the past few days.

So am I right by saying:

1) QF 107/108 is randomly switched out between the -400 and -400ER?

2) QF 7/8 (SYD-DFW-BNE-SYD) is always a -400ER?

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: United_fan
Posted 2013-05-03 12:18:37 and read 6992 times.

Quoting kann123air (Thread starter):
So am I right by saying:

1) QF 107/108 is randomly switched out between the -400 and -400ER?

2) QF 7/8 (SYD-DFW-BNE-SYD) is always a -400ER?

I would think the DFW flight have to be an -ER.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: indcwby
Posted 2013-05-03 12:35:58 and read 6918 times.

Quoting United_fan (Reply 1):

I would think the DFW flight have to be an -ER.

DFW - Only the -400ER could fly this route without an additional stopover........

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: Jetstar315
Posted 2013-05-03 18:04:53 and read 6447 times.

Even the QF 747-438ERs are challenged at certain times of the year with the Southbound Leg from DFW going to Auckland, NZ for fuel, before continuing on to Brisbane, then Sydney. Last November (2012) for example, approximately 7 tech stops were made in Auckland. The 787 would eliminate that I guess, thus providing more reliability which is what passengers want IMO.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2013-05-03 18:14:39 and read 6410 times.

QF7/8 is always the ER

QF107/8 and QF15/16 don't need the extended range of the ER, but are always operated by the refurbished aircraft.

There are 9 747s that have been refurbished, the 6 ERs and 3 non-ERS. OJU is one of them, so from a passenger perspective there is no difference between OJU and an ER. I think that OJM and OJT are the other 2 refurbished non-ERs.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: qfatwa
Posted 2013-05-03 18:39:19 and read 6361 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 4):
I think that OJM and OJT are the other 2 refurbished non-ERs.

Sorry Ryanair Guru - OJS & OJT are the two refurbished - these three OJS/T/U are newer than the first 18 747-400 purchase.

OJL &OJM still have a first class cabin [for HKG service] along with OEB [which is claimed to be soon have a minor reconfiguration to make its J/C and Premium Y match OJL/M].

Remaining 3 class aircraft are OJA, OJC, OJE, OJI [originally for Frankfurt and Narita, now also seen on Johannesburg and Singapore terminators].

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2013-05-03 18:44:39 and read 6341 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 4):
OJS & OJT are the two refurbished - these three OJS/T/U are newer than the first 18 747-400 purchase.

OK thanks, I knew about U, was pretty sure about T, but didn't know the third one. I should probably have been able to work that out as they have consecutive registrations.

Quoting qfatwa (Reply 5):
Sorry

No need to apologise, my mistake  
Quoting qfatwa (Reply 5):
OJL &OJM still have a first class cabin [for HKG service]
Quoting qfatwa (Reply 5):
Remaining 3 class aircraft are OJA, OJC, OJE, OJI

Thanks for that.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: EK413
Posted 2013-05-03 19:08:47 and read 6261 times.

Quoting kann123air (Thread starter):
So am I right by saying:

1) QF 107/108 is randomly switched out between the -400 and -400ER?

2) QF 7/8 (SYD-DFW-BNE-SYD) is always a -400ER?

The QF107/108 is randomly switched between both -400ER & non -ER. As for the QF7/8 the route is strictly -ER metal.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 4):
QF107/8 and QF15/16 don't need the extended range of the ER, but are always operated by the refurbished aircraft.

Technically yes, but the route ain't always operated by the refurbished -400's. I flew JFK-LAX on the 25th of March & I flew on VH-OJA.

EK413

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: kann123air
Posted 2013-05-03 19:53:50 and read 6152 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 4):
QF107/8 and QF15/16 don't need the extended range of the ER, but are always operated by the refurbished aircraft.
Quoting EK413 (Reply 7):
The QF107/108 is randomly switched between both -400ER & non -ER. As for the QF7/8 the route is strictly -ER metal.

Ah, that clarifies my doubts. Thanks!

A slightly off-topic question, but does QF gain or lose any money by operating the -400ER over the -400? I wouldn't see why.... But still.

Quoting Jetstar315 (Reply 3):
The 787 would eliminate that I guess, thus providing more reliability which is what passengers want IMO.

I would LOVE to see the 787 in DFW. That'll compliment the growing list of international long-haul heavies that now comprise of BA, LH, EK, KL, and QF.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: EK413
Posted 2013-05-03 20:25:32 and read 6056 times.

Quoting kann123air (Reply 8):
A slightly off-topic question, but does QF gain or lose any money by operating the -400ER over the -400? I wouldn't see why.... But still.

I highly doubt it. I'm not well educated on the technical side but I know the choice of aircraft basically comes down to range and obviously the -ER wins hands down over the RR & non -ER GE aircraft.

EK413

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: SexyAdonis
Posted 2013-05-03 20:26:56 and read 6053 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 7):

This is correct. I practically live on the QF 107 and the QF 108 and not always do we get a refurbished a/c. I stay away from QF 11 and QF 12 unless, like it happened at the end of March, the A380 is swapped by a Boeing 747-400 as some A380 are rotated into maintenance and change to the QFuture configuration.

Nothing beats crossing the Pacific in a good old 747 with our experienced QAL crew and not those QCCA "kids" in the A380s

Sexy Adonis

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2013-05-03 20:49:54 and read 5991 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 7):
Technically yes, but the route ain't always operated by the refurbished -400's
Quoting SexyAdonis (Reply 10):
This is correct. I practically live on the QF 107 and the QF 108 and not always do we get a refurbished a/c.

Sorry I should have been more specific, the intention (obviously operational situations sometimes get in the way) is for QF15/16 BNE-LAX and QF107/108 LAX-JFK to be operated by refurb aircraft. This is to offer A380 product in those markets. QF107/108 SYD-LAX, though, isn't always a refurb, although (as I understand it) they try and minimise the number of non-ERs on the route.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: Roseflyer
Posted 2013-05-03 20:59:17 and read 5969 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 9):

A 747-400 takes weight restrictions if alternate fuel is required on the LAX-SYDNEY route when there is bad weather. The 747-400ER allows MEL as an alternate. Also the 400ER allows more payload and cargo. I believe the 400ER can actually take more cargo than the A380 when you factor in the additional passenger baggage with the extra seats on the A380.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: ADDICT4QF
Posted 2013-05-03 22:44:01 and read 5828 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 9):

I stand to be corrected, however I thought the ERs have an extra fuel tank which takes up the space that cargo would be held in a non ER. Hence lost Freight revenue possibly (?)

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: qf002
Posted 2013-05-04 00:04:23 and read 5686 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 11):
the intention (obviously operational situations sometimes get in the way) is for QF15/16 BNE-LAX and QF107/108 LAX-JFK to be operated by refurb aircraft

So QF claims, though QF107/8 was operated by non-refurbed aircraft 6 times through April. I can understand the odd sub, but that's a 1 in 5 chance of getting an old aircraft, which is pretty poor IMO when QF markets these flights as having the new seats.

All the more reason to hurry up and retire the planes they don't plan to keep.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: EK413
Posted 2013-05-04 00:31:28 and read 5616 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 11):
Quoting EK413 (Reply 7):
Technically yes, but the route ain't always operated by the refurbished -400's
Quoting SexyAdonis (Reply 10):
This is correct. I practically live on the QF 107 and the QF 108 and not always do we get a refurbished a/c.

Sorry I should have been more specific, the intention (obviously operational situations sometimes get in the way) is for QF15/16 BNE-LAX and QF107/108 LAX-JFK to be operated by refurb aircraft. This is to offer A380 product in those markets. QF107/108 SYD-LAX, though, isn't always a refurb, although (as I understand it) they try and minimise the number of non-ERs on the route.

           

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 12):
A 747-400 takes weight restrictions if alternate fuel is required on the LAX-SYDNEY route when there is bad weather. The 747-400ER allows MEL as an alternate.

Cheers, I probably should've been specific with my response, the question raised by

Quoting kann123air (Reply 8):

concerning fuel efficiency of the -400 vs -400ER. Is it safe to say the -400ER is far more fuel efficient?
The advantage QF have over UA is the fact they have minimal weight restrictions on their LAX flights.

Quoting ADDICT4QF (Reply 13):
Quoting EK413 (Reply 9):

I stand to be corrected, however I thought the ERs have an extra fuel tank which takes up the space that cargo would be held in a non ER. Hence lost Freight revenue possibly (?)

Apparently belly cargo and luggage continues to be left behind on the west bound leg. Has this been resolved with the F/C cabins removed and reducing the overall weight of the aircraft?

Quoting qf002 (Reply 14):
All the more reason to hurry up and retire the planes they don't plan to keep.

Agreed. The entire aircraft on my flight from JFK to LAX when we flew on VH-OJA had nil IFE, I hope the issue was resolved from LAX to SYD.

EK413

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: kann123air
Posted 2013-05-04 07:54:30 and read 5304 times.

Quoting SexyAdonis (Reply 10):
Nothing beats crossing the Pacific in a good old 747 with our experienced QAL crew and not those QCCA "kids" in the A380s

I noticed this too. What does QCCA stand for? And why do they keep the most experienced QF crew members on the second-largest aircraft?

Quoting EK413 (Reply 15):
Is it safe to say the -400ER is far more fuel efficient?

I thought this would be the case too....

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: 777STL
Posted 2013-05-04 10:47:19 and read 4538 times.

Quoting kann123air (Reply 16):
I noticed this too. What does QCCA stand for? And why do they keep the most experienced QF crew members on the second-largest aircraft?

QCCA is Qantas Cabin Crew Australia which is a wholly owned subsidiary of Qantas. QAL are Qantas Airlines crew.

Basically, QCCA was established as a way to circumvent the union agreements with QAL - the QCCA crews work more hours for less money, and they're generally younger as well. QCCA crews operate both the 380 and the 744, but I think QCCA is exclusive to the 380 whereas they're not with other aircraft types.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: kann123air
Posted 2013-05-04 14:05:02 and read 3955 times.

Quoting 777STL (Reply 17):
QCCA is Qantas Cabin Crew Australia

Ah

Quoting 777STL (Reply 17):
Basically, QCCA was established as a way to circumvent the union agreements with QAL - the QCCA crews work more hours for less money, and they're generally younger as well. QCCA crews operate both the 380 and the 744, but I think QCCA is exclusive to the 380 whereas they're not with other aircraft types.

Cool, haha I had no clue!

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: EK413
Posted 2013-05-04 16:53:03 and read 3791 times.

Quoting 777STL (Reply 17):
QCCA crews operate both the 380 and the 744, but I think QCCA is exclusive to the 380 whereas they're not with other aircraft types

I believe QCCA crew have been restricted to the A380 & their employment status is 'casual' from memory.

EK413

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2013-05-04 17:04:51 and read 3763 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 19):
I believe QCCA crew have been restricted to the A380

  

QCCA only operated the 747 during the grounding, otherwise they're A380 only.

Quoting SexyAdonis (Reply 10):
our experienced QAL crew and not those QCCA "kids" in the A380s

I have to say that in my experience QAL have more smiles, are friendlier, and more professional.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: EK413
Posted 2013-05-04 21:54:10 and read 3543 times.

Looks as though QF is either A) shortage of QCCA crew or B) redundancies in the pipeline?

QF Cabin Crew Australia Flight Attendant

http://www.qantas.com.au/travel/airl...search-current-vacancies/global/en

EK413

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: qf002
Posted 2013-05-04 22:21:52 and read 3509 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 21):
Looks as though QF is either A) shortage of QCCA crew or B) redundancies in the pipeline?

It's illegal for them to fire legacy crews in order to replace their positions with cheaper labour, so it's probably A.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: gemuser
Posted 2013-05-05 01:20:30 and read 3344 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 22):

It's illegal for them to fire legacy crews in order to replace their positions with cheaper labour, so it's probably A.

True, but it's not illegal to offer legacy crews voluntary redundancy and replace them with cheaper labour. This is some times worth while for a company to do, particularly if it pays out a defined benefit super scheme. So it still could be B).

Gemuser

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2013-05-05 02:49:54 and read 3221 times.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 22):
It's illegal for them to fire legacy crews in order to replace their positions with cheaper labour, so it's probably A.

True, although...

Quoting gemuser (Reply 23):
but it's not illegal to offer legacy crews voluntary redundancy and replace them with cheaper labour

This is a good point. That said if they were to do this they would need to introduce another type to QCCA. Are they allowed to work the same flight as QAL? If not we might end up seeing the same as the BA WW/MF dichotomy with some routes being operated by QAL and some by QCCA.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 19):
their employment status is 'casual' from memory.

From the link you posted it looks like they're employed on PFT, not casual.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: qf002
Posted 2013-05-05 03:45:38 and read 3246 times.

Quoting gemuser (Reply 23):
True, but it's not illegal to offer legacy crews voluntary redundancy and replace them with cheaper labour. This is some times worth while for a company to do, particularly if it pays out a defined benefit super scheme. So it still could be B).

Very true -- I hadn't thought of that. And now would be the right time to take the financial hit...

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 24):
That said if they were to do this they would need to introduce another type to QCCA. Are they allowed to work the same flight as QAL?

It would be interesting to know this -- I was thinking they might be recruiting for domestic A330 crews (though the 767 crews will obviously play a part in this), or that there could be increased demand for Australian crews with the move from SIN to DXB (do UK crews operate all the way to Australia or just the leg from LHR?)

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: EK413
Posted 2013-05-05 05:40:51 and read 3149 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 24):
Quoting EK413 (Reply 19):
their employment status is 'casual' from memory.

From the link you posted it looks like they're employed on PFT, not casual.

Correct, however I know QCCA have the flexibility to be employed on 'casual' basis too. Don't quote me, perhaps this advertisement is for existing 'casual' being given opportunity to become PFT?
I'm just throwing it out there factoring in QF ain't expanding any A380 routes so its the only other possibility plan C).

EK413

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2013-05-05 17:48:23 and read 2875 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 26):
however I know QCCA have the flexibility to be employed on 'casual' basis too

Actually you might be onto something, and - I think - QD as well.

Given that QD and QAL mix on the domestic flights I imagine that QCCA and QAL can co-crew 747 or 330 flights, rather than the BA divide.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: Mikey86
Posted 2013-05-05 20:44:03 and read 2689 times.

I think QF51/52 BNE-SIN-BNE is sometimes operated with an ER.

Topic: RE: QF 747-400/-400ER Schedules To The USA
Username: JQflightie
Posted 2013-05-06 06:59:08 and read 2405 times.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 26):
Correct, however I know QCCA have the flexibility to be employed on 'casual' basis too. Don't quote me, perhaps this advertisement is for existing 'casual' being given opportunity to become PFT?I'm just throwing it out there factoring in QF ain't expanding any A380 routes so its the only other possibility plan C).
Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 27):
Actually you might be onto something, and - I think - QD as well.Given that QD and QAL mix on the domestic flights I imagine that QCCA and QAL can co-crew 747 or 330 flights,

When QCCA was first created back in 2008 the first batches of these 'kids' (remembering that the QAL's were kids once upon a time in the 70's) were trained on both A380/B747 as there were only a couple of A380's in the fleet, however as more 380's joined the fleet there were converted to A380 only.
As for casual, QCCA's cannot be employed casually, this is purely Full Time only.

The Advertisement is for QCCA A380. FULL TIME

All casual crew flying in the network are employed by MAM and external recruitment company used by QF.

QD's are FULL TIME and are not employed on a 'casual' basis, i revert back to the statement above.


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