Print from Airliners.net discussion forum
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/5783513/

Topic: CityJet Sold
Username: PlymSpotter
Posted 2013-06-07 09:29:42 and read 11378 times.

A provisional deal has been reached to sell CityJet to Intro Aviation GmbH, a specialist in turning around companies.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...tro-aviation-as-cityjet-buyer.html

Good news for CityJet. Will be interesting to see what their turnaround plans are, if they keep the AF/KLM flying and what happens about fleet replacement.


Dan  

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: EIDL
Posted 2013-06-07 12:37:25 and read 10771 times.

I would have preferred ASL to get it, if only to ensure their HQ isn't moved (well, it might have moved the ~1km between WX's existing HQ and ASL's HQ the other end of Swords Village) but at least it definitely looks like its saved.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: waly777
Posted 2013-06-07 12:42:27 and read 10732 times.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Thread starter):
Good news for CityJet. Will be interesting to see what their turnaround plans are, if they keep the AF/KLM flying and what happens about fleet replacement.

Ah it will certainly be interesting to see as the CEO (Christine Ourmières, a very nice and articulate lady) at a lecture earlier this year already plotted some interesting expansion plans with much less dependence on the AF flying.

Interestingly, she said when they took all figures into consideration, including capex....that the Avro's were still more efficient and cheaper for them than the E-jets. Lol and I def rem her mentioning that LCY operations are a major financial drain for the carriers that operated from the airport, including cityflyer that is making heavy losses.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: rutankrd
Posted 2013-06-07 12:42:36 and read 10732 times.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Thread starter):
Good news for CityJet. Will be interesting to see what their turnaround plans are, if they keep the AF/KLM flying and what happens about fleet replacement.


Bunch of asset strippers.

CityJet will be gone within 18 months, just like previous acquisitions.

[Edited 2013-06-07 12:44:36]

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: PezySPU
Posted 2013-06-07 13:09:05 and read 10520 times.

Quoting EIDL (Reply 1):
but at least it definitely looks like its saved.

It looks that way. But it seems Intro may be more interested in forwarding the airline to someone else once it's financially sound, rather than actually investing for the long haul. In that case, CityJet still has an uncertain future ahead.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: vfw614
Posted 2013-06-07 13:22:00 and read 10398 times.

Intro Aviation, by the way, also owns Intersky, the Austro-German regional airline at FDH.

Quoting rutankrd (Reply 3):
CityJet will be gone within 18 months, just like previous acquisitions.

Previous acquisitions were sold, that is why there are gone.

dba > airberlin
LTU > airberlin
FlyNext > Germania

The fact that airberlin today flies domestically and long-haul pretty much has to do with airberlin acquiring dba and LTU from Intro.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: PlymSpotter
Posted 2013-06-07 13:29:23 and read 10333 times.

Quoting waly777 (Reply 2):
Interestingly, she said when they took all figures into consideration, including capex....that the Avro's were still more efficient and cheaper for them than the E-jets.

Than the E-Jets, which are about to fall a generation behind the current technology. CityJet are going to need to modernise their fleet, even if it means taking on second hand E-Jets.

Quoting waly777 (Reply 2):
Lol and I def rem her mentioning that LCY operations are a major financial drain for the carriers that operated from the airport, including cityflyer that is making heavy losses.

That depends on your business model - right now the downturn in the City has hit BACF and CityJet quite badly.

Quoting rutankrd (Reply 3):
Bunch of asset strippers.

CityJet will be gone within 18 months, just like previous acquisitions.


Firstly, what assets? To my knowledge they have a few reasonable slots and a bunch of RJ-85s/F50s, which are hardly in demand. Secondly - what asset strips? I haven't followed them particularly closely, but I am aware of their involvement with InterSky, LTU and dba, none of which appear to have been treated as ready meat.


Dan  Smile

[Edited 2013-06-07 14:02:00]

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: Bongodog1964
Posted 2013-06-07 13:33:13 and read 10295 times.

Quoting waly777 (Reply 2):
and I def rem her mentioning that LCY operations are a major financial drain for the carriers that operated from the airport, including cityflyer that is making heavy losses.

When a CEO states that both they and their largest competitor at an airport are both making heavy losses, you have to wonder if one part is true, and the other part wishful thinking, especially when the competitor is part of a group with a reputation for axing unprofitable routes even if the pr fall out might look bad.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: skipness1E
Posted 2013-06-07 13:49:44 and read 10166 times.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 6):
right now the downturn in the City has hit BACF

Difference being BA moved domestic capacity out of LHR into LCY to an extent, they advertise LCY in a way they don't LHR and LGW as it allows fewer Shuttle slots to be used. It wouldn't surprise me if CFE were loss making but if WX fold that may change.

btw This may explain the focus on Germany in recent routes, this may have been on the cards for ages.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: waly777
Posted 2013-06-07 13:52:28 and read 10153 times.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 6):
Than the E-Jets, which are about to fall a generation behind the current technology. CityJet are going to need to modernise their fleet, even if it means taking on second hand E-Jets.

Indeed, the jumbolinos certainly need to be phased out and their fleet updated asap. Can't remember if she said their fleet was already paid for though. I suppose they could certainly start looking at the CS100 or possibly the next gen E jets cos availability of the E jets on the market is very limited.

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 7):
When a CEO states that both they and their largest competitor at an airport are both making heavy losses, you have to wonder if one part is true, and the other part wishful thinking, especially when the competitor is part of a group with a reputation for axing unprofitable routes even if the pr fall out might look bad.

Indeed, but the city has been hit pretty bad in general. I doubt it's wishful thinking to be frank because unprofitable routes are sometimes left on because of the effect on the general network (e.g. loyalty of FF's). The city is next door and short-haul is convenient, however when long haul comes, those customers on city flyer would most likely stay on with BA. Not to mention the rather high airport charges LCY has on aircraft in the size category that serves that airport.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: PlymSpotter
Posted 2013-06-07 14:06:45 and read 10042 times.

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 8):
It wouldn't surprise me if CFE were loss making but if WX fold that may change.

Well, fold or get out of certain markets. I can see less competition between the two in future.

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 8):
btw This may explain the focus on Germany in recent routes, this may have been on the cards for ages.

That crossed my mind too. If it has been a done deal behind closed doors for a while, then I also wonder if they could be responsible for one of the unannounced/firmed CS100 orders/LOIs.

Quoting waly777 (Reply 9):
I suppose they could certainly start looking at the CS100 or possibly the next gen E jets cos availability of the E jets on the market is very limited.

A little bird tells me that the ATR-72 might get a look in too. Going to be interesting, that's for sure.


Dan  

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: EIDL
Posted 2013-06-07 14:12:24 and read 9989 times.

Quoting rutankrd (Reply 3):
Bunch of asset strippers.

I believe the main reason this sale took so long is that WX have very few assets.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: Thomas_Jaeger
Posted 2013-06-07 20:35:54 and read 7687 times.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 10):
That crossed my mind too. If it has been a done deal behind closed doors for a while, then I also wonder if they could be responsible for one of the unannounced/firmed CS100 orders/LOIs.

I do not think so, Cityjet was talking to various parties before, some of them not German. I think that has to do with some opportunities opening up but also with German regional airports desperate for a London route and willing to throw money at Cityjet.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 10):
A little bird tells me that the ATR-72 might get a look in too. Going to be interesting, that's for sure.

I think for many routes that would be a very decent alternative to the ARJ-85s.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: BestWestern
Posted 2013-06-07 21:04:38 and read 7595 times.

Quoting Thomas_Jaeger (Reply 12):
I think for many routes that would be a very decent alternative to the ARJ-85s.

And quietly match another Irish airlines regional fleet.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: waly777
Posted 2013-06-07 22:43:07 and read 7219 times.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 10):
A little bird tells me that the ATR-72 might get a look in too. Going to be interesting, that's for sure.

Ooh well, that will certainly be interesting. Not sure how well it will suit them though particularly with regards to frequency and the time diff on some of the longer routes versus the competition.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: BestWestern
Posted 2013-06-07 23:09:28 and read 7050 times.

No doubt Intersky and Cityjet will be merged into cityJet.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: Pe@rson
Posted 2013-06-08 00:02:15 and read 6735 times.

Quoting EIDL (Reply 11):
I believe the main reason this sale took so long is that WX have very few assets.

Indeed: 11 of its 19 in-service AR8s and 9 of its 11 in-service F50s are leased, per Flightglobal.

Topic: RE: CityJet Sold
Username: vfw614
Posted 2013-06-08 00:12:02 and read 6686 times.

I am not so sure. INTRO restructures and props up an airlines with a view of selling them sooner than later. Their main concern is too have a tradeable outfit. It was very different when they bought dba and LTU and sold them to airberlin as all three were operating on the same market and had complementary core areas of business. That is not the case with Cityjet and Intersky. They are both regional airlines, but that's it. I am not sure if every potential buyer would be interested in acquiring an airline operating on the English/Irish market if a small operation somewhere deep in southern Germany is attached to that. The synergies that are there can also be use to good effect by INTRO without merging its two regional airlines (e.g. aircraft purchase)

As we are just at it, I would not get too carried away by the ATR72 prospects. I guess this rumour comes from another forum where it has been pointed out that the guy behind INTRO, Hans Rudolf Wöhrl, has a declared love for ATRs. He is the founder/owner of Nürnberger Flugdienst (NFD) that operated a large fleet of ATR42/72s in the 1980/1990 (and later became Eurowings through a merger with ATR42 operator RFG). At Intersky, one of his first decisions was too buy two ATR72-600 in addition to the airlines' Q300 (not everybody is convinced that this has been a smart move). But that's pretty much the whole story.


The messages in this discussion express the views of the author of the message, not necessarily the views of Airliners.net or any entity associated with Airliners.net.

Copyright © Lundgren Aerospace. All rights reserved.
http://www.airliners.net/