Print from Airliners.net discussion forum
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/5789483/

Topic: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ap305
Posted 2013-06-14 08:55:51 and read 27071 times.

From Reuters

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...rance-airbus-idUSBRE95D06520130614

"Evrard said that Airbus would soon add a customer in the United States, where industry sources say that United Airlines (UAL.N) is negotiating to upgrade and expand an existing order to 35 jets."

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: STT757
Posted 2013-06-14 08:58:36 and read 27082 times.

10 A350-1000s for a partial 744 replacement, with the other replacements being 777-9X?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ikramerica
Posted 2013-06-14 09:05:17 and read 26931 times.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 1):

I don't see UA committing to use or type. 35 would be useful no matter what they end up "replacing"

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: STT757
Posted 2013-06-14 09:10:45 and read 26815 times.

Combining this news with the 787-10 news it seems pretty clear where UA's longhaul fleet is heading:

787-8, 787-9, 787-10, A350-900, A350-1000

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: N14AZ
Posted 2013-06-14 09:23:56 and read 26633 times.

How I wish this will come true and UA will order some more aiframes. Not because of my nationality and the fact that some jobs here are linked to the A350-programme or that I have Airbus shares but simply because this would end all theses "UA-will-cancel-their-A-350s-posts". Imagine how much time we all would save! I think it'll be 10 minutes more time to play with our children or having the your after-work-beer 10 minutes earlier!  

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ual777
Posted 2013-06-14 09:36:37 and read 26448 times.

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 4):


How I wish this will come true and UA will order some more aiframes. Not because of my nationality and the fact that some jobs here are linked to the A350-programme or that I have Airbus shares but simply because this would end all theses "UA-will-cancel-their-A-350s-posts". Imagine how much time we all would save! I think it'll be 10 minutes more time to play with our children or having the your after-work-beer 10 minutes earlier!

Anybody that says that is a fool. I have talked to people who are as about as "in the know" as you can get and the 350 is coming to UA.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ORDBOSEWR
Posted 2013-06-14 09:50:29 and read 26216 times.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):
Combining this news with the 787-10 news it seems pretty clear where UA's longhaul fleet is heading:

787-8, 787-9, 787-10, A350-900, A350-1000

Pretty much can't disagree with this, except that it will take a quite a long time before this becomes the reality (maybe a decade or longer). I mean only 2 of those types are even flying (only 1 up until today).

UA is such a large airline that even a fleet of 20-30 of a type can be supported. They do not need to scale within a type like other airlines do. They have scale. So they could realistically have a fleets of 75- 787's, 75-A350's and still add another type.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: STT757
Posted 2013-06-14 10:03:00 and read 26066 times.

Quoting ORDBOSEWR (Reply 6):
Pretty much can't disagree with this, except that it will take a quite a long time before this becomes the reality (maybe a decade or longer).

Absolutely, the sCO GE Powered 777s, sCO 764s and sUA two class 763s will be flying with UA for a long time.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: atnight
Posted 2013-06-14 10:23:07 and read 25843 times.

I am happy to hear this... However if you look at the quote in the article, it is saying actually two things... that Airbus will add a customer in the US (United is an existing customer already, so they couldn't be adding a customer), and that people close to United are saying United will expand their order to 35. So this means that besides United, there will be another customer in the USA. I can only think of Delta, because AA will already have the ones coming from US Airways, unless they count AA still as separate and before their merge, AA orders the type.

Of course, maybe the article is written wrong and they are simply saying they will have an US customer add more frames.

Anyways, Paris is around the corner, I'm sure there will be many surprises.

Btw, the A350 is a awesome looking aircraft.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ap305
Posted 2013-06-14 10:38:24 and read 25635 times.

Quoting atnight (Reply 8):
I am happy to hear this... However if you look at the quote in the article, it is saying actually two things... that Airbus will add a customer in the US (United is an existing customer already, so they couldn't be adding a customer), and that people close to United are saying United will expand their order to 35

Perhaps Evrard means a new customer in the U.S for the -1000 which United will be if it orders the variant. Delta would be a coup for Airbus but weren't they looking for 330s/777s?

[Edited 2013-06-14 10:39:08]

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Roseflyer
Posted 2013-06-14 10:41:48 and read 25608 times.

Quoting atnight (Reply 8):
I am happy to hear this... However if you look at the quote in the article, it is saying actually two things... that Airbus will add a customer in the US (United is an existing customer already, so they couldn't be adding a customer), and that people close to United are saying United will expand their order to 35. So this means that besides United, there will be another customer in the USA. I can only think of Delta, because AA will already have the ones coming from US Airways, unless they count AA still as separate and before their merge, AA orders the type.

That might just be some confusion in wording chosen by the author. The only one left in the US to order the A350 would be Delta or AA via merger, and you'd think that the author would mention that. I think the key point is that UA may be expanding the A350 order, which is great news. The previous A350 order did not factor in network growth since the CO merger which now justifies more widebodies.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: atnight
Posted 2013-06-14 10:53:39 and read 25442 times.

Well, like I said, it could just be wrong wording,,, but knowing fully well that United is already a customer with orders already in place, it makes you wonder why he said "add a customer in the USA. Anyways, I have a feeling we are in for a surprise.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: JAAlbert
Posted 2013-06-14 11:42:44 and read 24994 times.

Quoting atnight (Reply 8):
Btw, the A350 is a awesome looking aircraft.

If only it's windows were a scooch larger! Come on Airbus, stop being stingy!

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: fcogafa
Posted 2013-06-14 11:56:26 and read 24845 times.

Quoting ap305 (Thread starter):
"Evrard said that Airbus would soon add a customer in the United States, where industry sources say that United Airlines (UAL.N) is negotiating to upgrade and expand an existing order to 35 jets."

The article doesn't say that, it (now) says :

=============
Evrard said Airbus would soon add a customer in the United States, where industry sources say United Airlines is negotiating to expand an order for 25 jets.
=============

[Edited 2013-06-14 11:59:21]

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: atnight
Posted 2013-06-14 12:05:33 and read 24766 times.

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 13):

Well, that's why I said that it seems as Airbus is going to add a new customer which is not United, since they are a customer already of the A350. It could mean that it's a US leasing company, but I think is possible that AA or Delta (would be a huge surprise) would be it.

Anyways, we will find out soon enough.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ap305
Posted 2013-06-14 12:06:57 and read 24743 times.

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 13):
The article doesn't say that, it (now) says :

=============
Evrard said Airbus would soon add a customer in the United States, where industry sources say United Airlines is negotiating to expand an order for 25 jets.
=============

They have edited it for some reason I guess. Perhaps that number was not supposed to be in the public domain.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: fxramper
Posted 2013-06-14 12:27:07 and read 24524 times.

I know it's early in the planning, but being a GS flyer on UA, I'd like to know if any A350 routes for UA have been discussed.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: EPA001
Posted 2013-06-14 12:27:15 and read 24524 times.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):

Combining this news with the 787-10 news it seems pretty clear where UA's longhaul fleet is heading:

787-8, 787-9, 787-10, A350-900, A350-1000

And that would be a perfect line-up imho.  .

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 4):
How I wish this will come true and UA will order some more aiframes. Not because of my nationality and the fact that some jobs here are linked to the A350-programme or that I have Airbus shares but simply because this would end all theses "UA-will-cancel-their-A-350s-posts". Imagine how much time we all would save!

  

Quoting ual777 (Reply 5):
Anybody that says that is a fool. I have talked to people who are as about as "in the know" as you can get and the 350 is coming to UA.

  

And so it should. They will nit throw away deposits and delivery slots just because some posters here would like to have them and keep them the all Boeing wide body fleet. They have selected the A350 for its qualities. And these have not changed since the merger with CO.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ual777
Posted 2013-06-14 12:42:27 and read 24241 times.

Quoting fxramper (Reply 16):
I know it's early in the planning, but being a GS flyer on UA, I'd like to know if any A350 routes for UA have been discussed.

Not really sure to be honest. I deal more with flight ops. If I was to throw a dart at a board, I would expect to see them going to Asia primarily with some long-range Europe thrown in to boot.

This is purely my own speculation, but since the merger, you can see that UA has really shifted around where the 777s fly. MUC, AMS, CDG, and FCO are all gone from the 777 schedule in IAD. They have been replaced by the 767s and 757s. Why? The 767-3/4 is better optimised for Europe, whereas the 777 has longer range and can carry more cargo to Asia/ME. With the exception of LHR, BRU, and FRA, the 777 out of IAD is all but gone from Europe. The 767-400s and -300s are taking its' place.

I would guess the A350 would go on routes to the mid-east, India, EWR-HKG, SFO/LAX-Australia, and other real "leg strechers" that push the 777 too hard range-wise. Anything you see a 747 on now will be gone, and the additional 10 aircraft will probably add to that some. There is a total of 25 potential options and I am of the opinion that if the aircraft performs as promised or better, we will see more of those options solidified, and may even see some -10s.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: PlymSpotter
Posted 2013-06-14 12:46:50 and read 24122 times.

Quoting atnight (Reply 14):
Well, that's why I said that it seems as Airbus is going to add a new customer which is not United, since they are a customer already of the A350. It could mean that it's a US leasing company, but I think is possible that AA or Delta (would be a huge surprise) would be it.

An order by Delta would not surprise me one bit.


Dan  

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: fxramper
Posted 2013-06-14 12:50:13 and read 24086 times.

Quoting ual777 (Reply 18):

India replacing a 777 with 350? Why? Guessing with United places their planes on certain routes would give anyone a headache. They clearly don't want to do anything consistent. Flying EWR-SFO often for work I've been on 10 different a/c. At least AA is consistent with the 762.

UA plans on using the 350 for a 777 replacement? As much as I want to like the 350 this seems insufficient. I'd love to see it go to IST, FRA, HNL, FCO, ZRH, AMS & CDG out of EWR.

I get a worn out 767 to AMS on Monday...

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Noise
Posted 2013-06-14 12:53:51 and read 23958 times.

The A350 is the most beautiful aircraft since the 757!

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: titus95
Posted 2013-06-14 13:12:46 and read 23489 times.

I will not rule out the A380 in the future United fleet.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: titus95
Posted 2013-06-14 13:24:15 and read 23209 times.

Reading another time , the Reuters article , i come to the conclusion , that if United is negociating for more A350s , a NEW US CUSTOMER will see the light , probably next week at Le Bourget. WHO ?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: N62NA
Posted 2013-06-14 13:29:18 and read 23129 times.

Quoting titus95 (Reply 22):
I will not rule out the A380 in the future United fleet.

I don't think so - too big for them. But the A350, yes, a lot of them in UAs future.

Quoting Noise (Reply 21):
The A350 is the most beautiful aircraft since the 757!

Perhaps! Anyway, I'm just glad the A350 doesn't continue the Airbus tradition of the A300 / 330 / 340 with the rear coach cabin rising upwards. That always looked so weird to me.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: jayunited
Posted 2013-06-14 13:35:08 and read 23877 times.

Quoting fxramper (Reply 16):
I know it's early in the planning, but being a GS flyer on UA, I'd like to know if any A350 routes for UA have been discussed.

I think one of the first places you will see the A350 deployed is on UA's routes to HKG and other routes where they need to get the 744 off the route. UA has already moved the 744 out of ORD and for UA's routes from ORD to PVG,PEK, and NRT the 772ER works great although we can't accommodate the same number of passengers as we could on the 744 the 772ER still gets the job done and we rarely encounter a weight restriction. HKG however is different and although we haven't encountered many weight restrictions on the flight from ORD-HKG (this is mainly due to the fact that we have had an unusual cool spring) the flight from HKG-ORD has been encountering weight restrictions almost everyday. In fact some days UA can't put any freight on the inbound flight from HKG due to weight restriction costing UA a lot of money. So I suspect that ORD-HKG will probably get the A350 as soon as possible and probably EWR-HKG although I'm not sure if the sCO 772ER is weight restricted out of HKG as well and maybe SFO-HKG. Perhaps SFO, LAX to SYD would get see the A350 as well and after that anyones guess is as good as mine because all the other flights out of SFO that are now operated with a 744 can be operated using the 772ER.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ual777
Posted 2013-06-14 14:19:26 and read 23020 times.

Quoting fxramper (Reply 20):

India replacing a 777 with 350? Why? Guessing with United places their planes on certain routes would give anyone a headache. They clearly don't want to do anything consistent. Flying EWR-SFO often for work I've been on 10 different a/c. At least AA is consistent with the 762.

UA plans on using the 350 for a 777 replacement? As much as I want to like the 350 this seems insufficient. I'd love to see it go to IST, FRA, HNL, FCO, ZRH, AMS & CDG out of EWR.

You probably wont see the A350 on any of those. It will go on really long-haul routes. Why? Full pax load and full cargo load. The bigger engines burn more fuel so why take a sledge hammer to smash a fly so to speak? The larger A350 only has a big cost advantage when you fill all the seats. If you can fill a 787/787 to 90-95% and take cargo, why put a plane on the route that will only go 80-85% full and half empty in the belly?

Why would the 350 be insufficient? If anything, all those routes out of EWR will probably go 787 when the 767 retires.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ual777
Posted 2013-06-14 14:22:46 and read 23588 times.

Quoting EPA001 (Reply 17):


And so it should. They will nit throw away deposits and delivery slots just because some posters here would like to have them and keep them the all Boeing wide body fleet. They have selected the A350 for its qualities. And these have not changed since the merger with CO.

They selected it because they put the screws to airbus and got a really good deal. That aside, it is a very capable airplane and will fit UA's fleet nicely.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: VC10er
Posted 2013-06-14 14:29:35 and read 23479 times.

So what will United be in 10 years? An absolute giant airline with a staggering amount of long legged widebody aircraft doing 12 to 20 hour missions (in some cases) but no First Class and by then dated Business Flat Bed seat in one of the world's most advanced aircraft. Do we see a new J product on the launch pad?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ual777
Posted 2013-06-14 14:42:11 and read 23160 times.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 28):
So what will United be in 10 years? An absolute giant airline with a staggering amount of long legged widebody aircraft doing 12 to 20 hour missions (in some cases) but no First Class and by then dated Business Flat Bed seat in one of the world's most advanced aircraft. Do we see a new J product on the launch pad?

Who is to say there won't be? I for one am cautiously optimistic about UA's future. Things service/operations wise are trending in the right direction.

The big ticket items in the near future (IMO) are:

1. Upgrading the United Express fleet
2. Finishing joint contracts
3. Finishing the total merger of the two cultures
4. Completing Wifi installs

I think we will also see a new smaller narrowbody fleet at mainline as well.

Just because a new product hasn't been announced doesn't mean it isn't coming.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: tortugamon
Posted 2013-06-14 14:57:47 and read 23025 times.

Bloomberg is announcing that UA will shift the A359 orders to the A351 and will convert options to the 787-10 and presumably some of the A350 options as well:

"The carrier will modify a 2009 order to take 25 wide-body A350-1000s instead of the smaller -900 variant as once planned, said the people, who asked not to be identified because the discussions are private. United also will convert options for a couple dozen A350s and Dreamliners into firm orders, with the Boeing jets being the new 787-10X model, the people said."

http://www.businessweek.com/news/201...st-787-a350-in-boeing-airbus-order

tortugamon

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: jayunited
Posted 2013-06-14 15:27:04 and read 22389 times.

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 30):
Bloomberg is announcing that UA will shift the A359 orders to the A351 and will convert options to the 787-10 and presumably some of the A350 options as well:

I just found this article on Yahoo news that also claims that United is in talks with both Airbus and Boeing they claim sources are telling them that United is in talks to switch it's order to the A351 and convert some options to firm orders it also says United is in talks with Boeing for the 787-10 although it not really clear whether United would convert options into firm orders or reduce the number of 788 they have on order and change some of those 788's over to 787-10.

I think United will keep the current order of 788 where it is because we have to replace our aging 763 international 3 cabin aircraft and I think United will convert some of their option to firm order for 787-10 as a replacement for some of sUA older non ER 772.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...iner-787-a350-1000.html?cmpid=yhoo

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: jfk777
Posted 2013-06-14 15:29:12 and read 22443 times.

Here goes another 777 airline getting A350-1000's. Hoping the Paris Air Show gets two Boeing newbies launched, the 787-10 & 777-9X. The best news for Boeing in Paris is more 787 & 777 get ordered then A350's.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ual777
Posted 2013-06-14 15:33:41 and read 22291 times.

I feel like Nostradamus today  

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: tortugamon
Posted 2013-06-14 15:40:14 and read 22082 times.

This quote is a little vague about how the A350 options will be used. IMO 25 orders of the 351 should be enough for an initial order to replace the 24 747s in UA's fleet (29 units would be a 1:1 swap in terms of seats). I wonder what further option conversions referenced is the article is referring to. They could be thinking that some of their 77E's would get upgauged to 351s or maybe the exercised options will be used to buy some 359s with later slots. Interesting wording for sure.

Bloomberg is usually on top of it, otherwise I would say that this was probably a misquote and the order conversion applies to the 787-10 only.

tortugamon

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: UnitedTristar
Posted 2013-06-14 16:11:21 and read 21559 times.

What would this mean for the A350 delivery slots? When is the first A351 flight suppose to happen? Will they make the same in service dates?

-m

  

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: jayunited
Posted 2013-06-14 17:15:14 and read 20762 times.

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 34):
This quote is a little vague about how the A350 options will be used. IMO 25 orders of the 351 should be enough for an initial order to replace the 24 747s in UA's fleet (29 units would be a 1:1 swap in terms of seats). I wonder what further option conversions referenced is the article is referring to. They could be thinking that some of their 77E's would get upgauged to 351s or maybe the exercised options will be used to buy some 359s with later slots. Interesting wording for sure.

I think it is more than just replacing sUA 744 fleet with this merger I think the combined UA is looking probably at up gauging some sCO routes as well. I can clearly remember reading on this website some peoples opinion that the A359 was not an appropriate replacement for the 744 fleet and once the merger happens many thoughts that some sCO routes currently being flown on 772ER could benefit from a larger aircraft that larger aircraft seems to be the A351 of these articles are confirmed. So I think this is more than just sUA original order to replace the 744's this probably is also about putting some larger aircraft on some international routes out of EWR as well and find the right aircraft to replace the744 and the A351 could be that aircraft for UA moving forward we will have to wait and see.

I personally thought UA would wait go for the 779x but it seems like that might be to much aircraft for UA because we don't need a aircraft that can do 20 hour nonstop missions with is what some Middle East airlines are looking for and are pressuring Boeing to do. If Boeing does give in to that pressure then it seems more and more likely that the A351 will be UA biggest widebody after the 744 are retired.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: tortugamon
Posted 2013-06-14 19:28:18 and read 19363 times.

Quoting jayunited (Reply 36):
So I think this is more than just sUA original order to replace the 744's

That appears to be the only answer if they are indeed converting a decent amount of options for the 351 in addition to the 25 changed orders. I would have thought that they would order in tranches and not such a large order though.

Quoting jayunited (Reply 36):
I personally thought UA would wait go for the 779x but it seems like that might be to much aircraft for UA because we don't need a aircraft that can do 20 hour nonstop

I thought the 777-9X had a small chance but I am not sure I would call it a 20 hour mission aircraft. -8X definitely but not the 9X. I agree that if there are 30+ orders for the 351 then the chances of a 779 are very low.

The 787-10 was on the horizon when they ordered the A359 so it could not have been that 78J made them change their mind to upgrade to the 351. Why take 50 options with your 20 orders, are they really thinking they could have a need for 70 A350s and not order the A359. I think United is better managed than that.

I think this will come out that they will use the 351 to replace the 744 and upgrade some 77Es and most of the rest of their routes will be filled by some 789s but mostly 78Js. However, I really cannot see them not keeping some of the A359s because it definitely would be the ideal aircraft for the high LF 77E missions above 5500nm which they have more than a handful of.

tortugamon

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: RayChuang
Posted 2013-06-14 19:42:19 and read 19293 times.

I would not be surprised that United converted the 25-plane A350XWB-900 order to A350XWB-1000. With the A35J, United can quickly retire the well-worn 747-400 fleet.

Now, United buying more 787-8 and 787-9 models could become a reality. United's 767 fleet needs to be replaced soon, and a big 787 order would fill UA's need for a smaller plane on medium to long range routes.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: AA77W
Posted 2013-06-14 21:32:46 and read 18297 times.

And here I was thinking it would be WN or AS! Oh the disappointment! (tongue firmly planted in cheek) :-P

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: onebadlt123
Posted 2013-06-14 21:55:08 and read 18100 times.

Quoting jayunited (Reply 25):
So I suspect that ORD-HKG will probably get the A350 as soon as possible and probably EWR-HKG although I'm not sure if the sCO 772ER is weight restricted out of HKG as well and maybe SFO-HKG. Perhaps SFO, LAX to SYD would get see the A350 as well and after that anyones guess is as good as mine because all the other flights out of SFO that are now operated with a 744 can be operated using the 772ER

Sometimes it can be a problem when the payloads reach the upper 80's to 90's+ and weather...etc. For the most part though, it isn't a real problem. Obviously this is on a enroute redispatch flight plan as well. If something is left behind it isnt really more than a few thousand pounds. Our sCO birds are pretty good as far as the -200's go.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Max Q
Posted 2013-06-14 22:42:28 and read 17631 times.

Well, it probably all makes sense but as an enthusiast of 4 engine types it's very boring !

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: scbriml
Posted 2013-06-15 00:09:46 and read 16860 times.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 32):
Here goes another 777 airline getting A350-1000's.

You should be getting used to it by now!   

FWIW, I think you'll see plenty of others as well. However, it should not be forgotten that UA doesn't operate the 77W and the -1000 seems destined to replace the 744 in their fleet. Does that help a bit?

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 32):
Hoping the Paris Air Show gets two Boeing newbies launched, the 787-10 & 777-9X.

Well, the -10 is just about a nailed-on cert, but I think the 777 update will be a while yet. Unless, of course, Boeing is suddenly feeling very rushed.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: awacsooner
Posted 2013-06-15 00:24:11 and read 16763 times.

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 4):
simply because this would end all theses "UA-will-cancel-their-A-350s-posts".

Dream on...until UA signs on the dotted line, the posts will continue.

Quoting atnight (Reply 8):
Btw, the A350 is a awesome looking aircraft.

IBTD...I think it's their ugliest plane yet...the entire tail section looks like they just gave up and slapped it together last minute...it doesn't look proportional at all to the rest of the fuselage.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: DocLightning
Posted 2013-06-15 01:39:13 and read 16073 times.

Quoting ual777 (Reply 26):
t will go on really long-haul routes. Why? Full pax load and full cargo load. The bigger engines burn more fuel so why take a sledge hammer to smash a fly so to speak?

It will fly on any route, long or short, on which it can be filled with passengers and cargo. UA even uses domestic 744s from time to time. If the aircraft can be filled and flown profitably, it will be filled.

Now, on some of the routes mentioned (IST, AMS, FCO) it will be 787s. But on fortress routes like IAD-FRA, the A350 will fly and it will fly full. Remember, the "range" is with full pax, not with full pax and cargo. Flying shorter than max range increases your cargo capacity.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: KarelXWB
Posted 2013-06-15 01:52:04 and read 16043 times.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):
787-8, 787-9, 787-10, A350-900, A350-1000

According to Bloomberg, UA will convert the existing order of 25 A350 aircraft to the larger A350-1000. If true, the fleet will become

> 787-8
> 787-9,
> 787-10
> A350-1000

Quote:
The carrier will modify a 2009 order to take 25 wide-body A350-1000s instead of the smaller -900 variant as once planned, said the people, who asked not to be identified because the discussions are private. United also will convert options for a couple dozen A350s and Dreamliners into firm orders, with the Boeing jets being the new 787-10X model, the people said.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...gest-dreamliner-787-a350-1000.html

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: scbriml
Posted 2013-06-15 03:00:21 and read 15257 times.

Quoting awacsooner (Reply 43):
Dream on...until UA signs on the dotted line

Er, they have already signed on the dotted line. From reports, they're about to sign on another Airbus dotted line.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: JerseyFlyer
Posted 2013-06-15 05:25:56 and read 13966 times.

I see this being similar to the expansion order by CX, i.e. take the first 15 359s for which they have early slots, convert 10 to 3510, and add 10 3510s - or similar.

Remember the 359 will be available at least 2 years before the 3510 and if they need the capacity before then I do not see them delaying the first available frames.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: fxramper
Posted 2013-06-15 08:00:05 and read 12377 times.

I'd love to see a 350 out of EWR to Asia. I got back from TLV today and they were chatting about 747 being run on that route. Any truth?

Quoting ual777 (Reply 26):
Why would the 350 be insufficient? If anything, all those routes out of EWR will probably go 787 when the 767 retires.

I wish. Haha. I'd have to commute down to IAH to get a ride on a 787. How soon will UA get their first 350?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: OH-LGA
Posted 2013-06-15 12:10:35 and read 11277 times.

Quoting fxramper (Reply 48):
I got back from TLV today and they were chatting about 747 being run on that route. Any truth?

They would love the capacity to TLV I'm sure, and it's *very* unlikely. With the dispatch reliability of UA's 747s being as poor as it's been lately, they've already pulled it out of all UA hubs save for SFO (and LAX-SYD).

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ual777
Posted 2013-06-15 14:09:00 and read 10955 times.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 44):

It will fly on any route, long or short, on which it can be filled with passengers and cargo. UA even uses domestic 744s from time to time. If the aircraft can be filled and flown profitably, it will be filled.

Now, on some of the routes mentioned (IST, AMS, FCO) it will be 787s. But on fortress routes like IAD-FRA, the A350 will fly and it will fly full. Remember, the "range" is with full pax, not with full pax and cargo. Flying shorter than max range increases your cargo capacity.

FRA is the exception because of the LH hub, and running a 744 once in a while doesn't count. We are talking scheduled, consistant service. If you look at what the "new" UA has done with moving aircraft around, the writing is on the wall.

Of course if Euro traffic rebounds, this changes everything.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: ual777
Posted 2013-06-15 14:12:28 and read 10943 times.

Quoting fxramper (Reply 48):


I wish. Haha. I'd have to commute down to IAH to get a ride on a 787. How soon will UA get their first 350?

2016 I believe. The 787 WILL come to Newark. Be patient, there are only 6 so far  

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: tortugamon
Posted 2013-06-15 14:43:15 and read 10940 times.

Quoting scbriml (Reply 42):
You should be getting used to it by now!

True. With 60+ customers purchasing over 1,400 777s it would be hard to find an intercontinental airline that doesn't have a 777  .

Quoting JerseyFlyer (Reply 47):

I see this being similar to the expansion order by CX, i.e. take the first 15 359s for which they have early slots, convert 10 to 3510

Not sure if this is a similar circumstance. CX was able to take over the very early delivery slots that EY gave up when they walked away from their 351s. Maybe Airbus has opened up new slots because they have decided to dedicate a second line to the 351?

As I have said before, despite this move, I do not see them giving up entirely on the A359.

tortugamon

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: STT757
Posted 2013-06-16 08:15:55 and read 10125 times.

So to summarize it appears that UA is converting all of their 25 A350-900s to 1000s, and possibly adding an additional 10 to their firm orders. That would give them 35 A350-1000s, which I think is the perfect number to replace their 23 744s and also take over certain other Asian routes currently operated by 777s.

My question is can the A350-1000 operate some of their longer Asian routes with sufficient payload:

EWR-HKG, EWR-BOM, EWR-DEL, ORD-HKG, LAX-SYD etc..

Quoting fxramper (Reply 48):
How soon will UA get their first 350?
Quoting ual777 (Reply 51):
2016 I believe

If UA has indeed converted all their A350-900s to 1000s then that pushes back their delivery date. I think the first A350-1000s are scheduled for delivery in 2017, hopefully UA can get delivery slots that early.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: neutrino
Posted 2013-06-16 08:29:22 and read 10070 times.

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 52):
it would be hard to find an intercontinental airline that doesn't have a 777

Nope, that will be easy and a major one at that.
Hint: starts with Q.  

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: kgaiflyer
Posted 2013-06-16 08:51:58 and read 9954 times.

Quoting titus95 (Reply 22):
I will not rule out the A380 in the future United fleet.

The problem is the 380 requires custom boarding facilities that exist only at four of UA's hubs and focus cities -- thus limiting its dispatch utility.

Otherwise, as the economy changes, someone might wind up absorbing parts of EK's huge ongoing 380 order.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: TP313
Posted 2013-06-16 10:06:09 and read 9711 times.

Quoting neutrino (Reply 54):
Quoting tortugamon (Reply 52):
it would be hard to find an intercontinental airline that doesn't have a 777

Nope, that will be easy and a major one at that.
Hint: starts with Q.  

Maybe not for long: the 777X seems taylor made for them.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: na
Posted 2013-06-16 10:23:34 and read 9648 times.

The A350-900 makes a great replacement for UAs aging 777 fleet.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: tortugamon
Posted 2013-06-16 11:24:53 and read 9413 times.

Quoting neutrino (Reply 54):
Nope, that will be easy and a major one at that.

You're right. Not sure that worked out well for them  .

tortugamon

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: AeroWesty
Posted 2013-06-16 11:30:41 and read 9368 times.

Quoting neutrino (Reply 54):
Hint: starts with Q.

I was thinking: L

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: UALWN
Posted 2013-06-16 11:54:35 and read 9283 times.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 59):
I was thinking: L

Would that be LH, LX or LA? None of them operate any passenger 777, for now.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: sancho99504
Posted 2013-06-16 12:02:28 and read 9212 times.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):

I may be naive or misinformed, but aren't the A350-900 and 787-10 in the same size class? Please correct me if I am wrong. Thanks

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: AeroWesty
Posted 2013-06-16 12:06:24 and read 9170 times.

Quoting UALWN (Reply 60):
LH

That would be the one which came to mind.  

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: scbriml
Posted 2013-06-16 12:27:08 and read 9093 times.

Quoting neutrino (Reply 54):
Nope, that will be easy and a major one at that.
Hint: starts with Q.

Then there's L and I and even a V.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: motorhussy
Posted 2013-06-16 13:46:06 and read 8946 times.

Quoting sancho99504 (Reply 61):
I may be naive or misinformed, but aren't the A350-900 and 787-10 in the same size class? Please correct me if I am wrong. Thanks

With both aircraft in a similar three class configuration, with 9-abreast in Y, the Boeing will seat 25 more in Y. The 78J will also be able to carry a few more cargo containers though not as far as the A359.

Looking at the conversion of UA orders from all A359 to all A35J, I'm hoping they'll place a new order for the former as for long-haul trans-Pacific flights where the A35J may not be warranted, a 9-abreast A359 is preferable to the inevitable 9-abreast 789.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: tommy767
Posted 2013-06-16 14:34:08 and read 8736 times.

I hope so. The A350 is a sexy plane. Dare I even say better looking than the 787.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: sancho99504
Posted 2013-06-16 14:37:21 and read 8746 times.

Quoting motorhussy (Reply 64):

I think for now, UA will keep 8 abreast on the 787 and 9 on the A350 which as long as they give a better product in Y, can command a higher fare, although shortly after posting this, a lot of people are going to say "people only care about price" which just isn't true.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: tortugamon
Posted 2013-06-16 15:00:50 and read 8632 times.

Quoting sancho99504 (Reply 66):
a lot of people are going to say

Some may say that UA does configure their 787s with 9 abreast in Y.


tortugamon

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: sancho99504
Posted 2013-06-16 15:12:42 and read 8567 times.

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 67):

My bad, I had thought I read they were going to be 8 abreast. Its a shame that they still think they have to cram someone into every nook and cranny to make a profit. How the hell did they make profits in the 90's with aircraft that were 50-60% full?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: gemuser
Posted 2013-06-16 15:29:27 and read 8521 times.

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 58):
You're right. Not sure that worked out well for them

PLEASE, lets NOT start another "Why didn't Qantas order the B777" discussion!!! There must be dozens on this site. Interestingly enough I can not remember any "Why didn't LH order the B777" discussions!

Gemuser

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: VC10er
Posted 2013-06-16 16:06:46 and read 8360 times.

I am now very confused by reading all this as it pertains to United:

Please can someone help clarify as much as possible for me? Please!

What is UA replacing TATL 757's with? Can any of the new 737's make the trip to the smaller European cities now served like Glasgow, Lisbon etc? (I get that they are keeping 14 or so 757's for p.s.) Won't the 787-8 be too much airplane to some of the current 757 TATL flights?

787's due to ultimately replace 767's (w 764 staying longer?)

Are 787-10's (which seem likely) on what missions? Do the replace anything or are they for added growth expectations?

747's replacements are presumed to be replaced by A350-1000's?

This is the one that really stumps me: 777's? Does United plan to have a hearty amount of 777's of some type or types flying side by side with a potential 50 A350-1000's and 50 787-10's?
Or is United going to just use up their current 777's? It's difficult for me to envision United, (even AA or DL) without them!

Last, 97.3% sure the answer is NO, but UA once mentioned the 747-8i wasn't entirely off the table (?!) has that gone to 100% NO? However SOME think United COULD have some A380's!

Again, thanks! This info would better help my understanding of thread.

R

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: EPA001
Posted 2013-06-16 16:28:41 and read 8238 times.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 53):
My question is can the A350-1000 operate some of their longer Asian routes with sufficient payload:

EWR-HKG, EWR-BOM, EWR-DEL, ORD-HKG, LAX-SYD etc..

Ferpe has done some interesting modelling on this. I do not have the data at hand but I guess one could say the A35J is like a B77W, only (supposed to be) 25% more efficient on fuel consumption.  

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Stitch
Posted 2013-06-16 16:30:56 and read 8254 times.

Quoting sancho99504 (Reply 68):
How the hell did they make profits in the 90's with aircraft that were 50-60% full?

Higher fares and cheaper fuel.


Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
What is UA replacing TATL 757's with?

I assume nothing for the moment. They have enough 757s in the fleet to keep them on those missions. Down the road, Airbus and Boeing will have new narrowbody families and it stands to reason one model will have the range (via fuel efficiency if nothing else) to perform those missions.



Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
787's due to ultimately replace 767's (w 764 staying longer?)

The 787-8 will replace the 767-300ER. I expect the 767-400ER to be replaced by the 787-9.



Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
Are 787-10's (which seem likely) on what missions? Do the replace anything or are they for added growth expectations?

The 787-10 will likely replace the 19 777-200s as well as 777-200ERs used on shorter stage lengths (East-Coast TATL and South America). The remaining 777-200ER fleet, used for longer missions (TPAC and West Coast TATL) will likely be replaced by A350-900s.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
747's replacements are presumed to be replaced by A350-1000's?

That appears to be the case.



Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
This is the one that really stumps me: 777's?

Phased out in favor as 787s and A350s arrive.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
Last, 97.3% sure the answer is NO, but UA once mentioned the 747-8i wasn't entirely off the table (?!) has that gone to 100% NO?

I would say that this is now the case (same with the A380).

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: tortugamon
Posted 2013-06-16 16:40:14 and read 8235 times.

Here is my crack at it:

Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
What is UA replacing TATL 757's

Those are relatively new frames and won't need a replacement for a while. The Max 9 and Max 8 HGW may be the replacement down the road and 787s for larger routes.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
Are 787-10's (which seem likely) on what missions? Do the replace anything or are they for added growth expectations?

Transatlantic and South American routes. Maybe some Northern Asia routes from the West Coast like NRT-SFO and PEK-SFO.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
747's replacements are presumed to be replaced by A350-1000's?

It appears that way.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
777's?

787-9s (they will need more) for transpacific secondary routes, 787-10s for Atlantic routes, and A351 for Hub to Hub routes. Although it looks like they will not have any A359s on order, it does seem like a good compliment as well especially if they only take 10 787-10s.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):
747-8i

I do not believe there is any chance at all.

tortugamon

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: mffoda
Posted 2013-06-16 17:05:07 and read 8184 times.

Quoting scbriml (Reply 63):
Quoting neutrino (Reply 54):
Nope, that will be easy and a major one at that.
Hint: starts with Q.

Then there's L and I and even a V.

This is fascinating... So 84.6% of the Worlds Alphabet Airline's fly the 777. And 34.6% of the Worlds Alphabet Airline's fly the A380...   Lovely...

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: VC10er
Posted 2013-06-16 17:39:40 and read 8094 times.

So NO 777's in United's future beyond using up / replacing what they have now? Is this a good theory or has United been specific on this?

Is the A350 as wide or wider than the 777?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: United1
Posted 2013-06-16 17:49:42 and read 8084 times.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 75):

So NO 777's in United's future beyond using up / replacing what they have now? Is this a good theory or has United been specific on this?

UA said a while ago that they were not interested in the current generation of 777s (ie 77W/77L.)

350-1000 (744)
350-900 (77E)
787-10 (77A)
787-9 (764/Growth)
787-8 (763/some 752/Growth)

....is probably the future wide body fleet. They could add the 77X but I think that would simply be redundant with the 350's already in the fleet.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 75):
Is the A350 as wide or wider than the 777?

350 cabin is about a foot narrower than the 777's.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: VC10er
Posted 2013-06-16 18:17:30 and read 8208 times.

What does that one foot mean in terms of Y? I think United has 9 abreast, should they keep that for the A350 ?

It is ironic how not long ago people thought UA had some buyers remorse over the A350 and how CO was so loyal to Boeing.

What will we discuss when everything just looks the same and performs about the same.

I wonder who's fleet will be most diverse 15 years from now?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Stitch
Posted 2013-06-16 18:24:40 and read 8236 times.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 77):
What does that one foot mean in terms of Y? I think United has 9 abreast, should they keep that for the A350 ?

UA will be 9-abreast on the A350 and comfort should be close to that found on their 9-abreast 777s. Their 787's at 9-abreast will be close to their 10-abreast 747s.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: STT757
Posted 2013-06-16 18:51:49 and read 8097 times.

Someone in another thread within the last month or two put up a graphic that displayed the size of the 787-8, 787-9, 787-10, A350-900, A350-1000, 747-8I, 77W, 777-8X, 777-9X, A380 together. It was interesting to look at and if someone could post that it would be great.

With regards to the A350-1000, I keep hearing it's going to be more efficient than the 77W , which I don't doubt. But isn't the A350-1000 smaller, and if so how much in terms of seating capacity. I think from the chart I mentioned seeing that the A350-1000 is bigger than a 777-200 but just smaller of the 77W.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Stitch
Posted 2013-06-16 19:26:57 and read 8029 times.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 80):
But isn't the A350-1000 smaller, and if so how much in terms of seating capacity. I think from the chart I mentioned seeing that the A350-1000 is bigger than a 777-200 but just smaller of the 77W.

In terms of cabin length, the A350-1000 and 777-300ER are about the same and so is there seating counts. zeke has noted that CX's four-class configuration on the A350-1000 can seat 273, which is 2 less than their four-class 777-300ERs.

The A350 cannot (realistically) do 2+4+2 in Business Class (BA is installing Club World in a 2+3+2 configuration on the 787 and A350) and the 777-300ER can accommodate wider seats in each class than the A350-1000 at the same row configuration.

[Edited 2013-06-16 19:29:30]

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2013-06-16 20:14:58 and read 7816 times.

Quoting scbriml (Reply 63):
Then there's L and I and even a V.

I got the Q, V and all the various Ls

But who is I?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Polot
Posted 2013-06-16 20:19:52 and read 7786 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 82):

I think he was referring to IB.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: RyanairGuru
Posted 2013-06-16 20:32:10 and read 7740 times.

Quoting Polot (Reply 83):
I think he was referring to IB.

Ahh, gotcha.

I guess there are also: F S and T

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: UALWN
Posted 2013-06-17 04:54:55 and read 7251 times.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 83):
I guess there are also: F S and T

And U.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: jayunited
Posted 2013-06-17 12:39:11 and read 6622 times.

Quoting sancho99504 (Reply 68):
My bad, I had thought I read they were going to be 8 abreast. Its a shame that they still think they have to cram someone into every nook and cranny to make a profit. How the hell did they make profits in the 90's with aircraft that were 50-60% full?

In the 90's crude oil was only $25-30 dollars a barrel, not the $119 dollars a barrel it is today. In the 90's a gallon of regular 87 octane gasoline was $.99 cents and today it at least S3.49 a gallon for the same gallon. Your not in the 90's any longer and crude oil prices are not going down. In today's market if an international flight consistently on a daily basis had a 50% or 60% load factor like we had in the 90's that flight today would be canceled because there is no way for a airline to make money on a international flight that only has a 50% load factor every day. Airlines made money in the 90's because fuel was cheap and ticket prices were high. Now fuel is very expensive and ticket prices they are fluctuate all over the place depending on the market and what the competition is doing.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Deltal1011man
Posted 2013-06-17 13:12:22 and read 6445 times.

Quoting sancho99504 (Reply 68):

been to a gas station lately? fuel is $2+ higher than it was in the 90s. (plus, higher fares, 9/11 and the economy all factor into it)

Quoting sancho99504 (Reply 66):
which just isn't true.

prove it.  
Quoting VC10er (Reply 70):

What is UA replacing TATL 757's with? Can any of the new 737's make the trip to the smaller European cities now served like Glasgow, Lisbon etc? (I get that they are keeping 14 or so 757's for p.s.) Won't the 787-8 be too much airplane to some of the current 757 TATL flights?

IIRC the CO 757s are pretty new. The should be fairly low cycle so its not impossible to think they make it to 2020-2025ish.
who knows what we will have by then.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: STT757
Posted 2013-06-18 05:17:36 and read 5931 times.

So now that the 787-10 order is official when might we hear about their A350s, and whether they are indeed expanding their order and converting to the A350-1000?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Stitch
Posted 2013-06-18 08:01:54 and read 5579 times.

Airbus was quiet at PAS today, so perhaps tomorrow?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: frigatebird
Posted 2013-06-18 08:13:49 and read 5488 times.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 88):
Airbus was quiet at PAS today, so perhaps tomorrow?

Not much news from the A350 indeed at PAS, but I expect an A350 day still to come  

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: KarelXWB
Posted 2013-06-18 08:51:49 and read 5297 times.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 88):
Airbus was quiet at PAS today, so perhaps tomorrow?

Do they announce orders only during the business days? If not, they might hold the A350 orders back until the A350 makes its appearance. I read the AF order will be announced "later this week".

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Stitch
Posted 2013-06-18 09:18:42 and read 5153 times.

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 90):
Do they announce orders only during the business days?

I would speculate that answer depends on how much of the media stays after the Business Days and whether or not the A350 is ready for a PAS fly-by.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: astuteman
Posted 2013-06-18 10:01:58 and read 5028 times.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 77):
I wonder who's fleet will be most diverse 15 years from now?

Anyone flying the 748i or A380  

Rgds

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: STT757
Posted 2013-06-20 05:08:28 and read 4283 times.

It's now official, 35 A350-1000 for UA. They converted their previous order for 25 A350-900s and added an additional 10. The 35 A350-1000s will enable UA to replace their 744s and leave room for for expansion and or replacing 777s on certain routes.

http://ir.unitedcontinentalholdings....-newsArticle&ID=1831528&highlight=

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Stitch
Posted 2013-06-20 05:40:36 and read 4129 times.

And with those 777-200s not replaced with the A350-1000 being replaced by the 787-10 per comments by UA, that should leave the future UA fleet at 35 A350-1000s and 115 787s (-8 / -9 / -10). So we should see another couple score of 787-10s ordered in the coming years.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: STT757
Posted 2013-06-20 06:03:53 and read 3985 times.

The A350-1000 looks like it will be a gorgeous aircraft, cannot wait to see it flying for UA.

http://www.airbus.com/fileadmin/media_gallery/photogallery/big/800x600_1371712410_A350-1000_United.jpg

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: scbriml
Posted 2013-06-20 07:35:03 and read 3639 times.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 94):
that should leave the future UA fleet at 35 A350-1000s

Do they not have options as well? Final tally could easily be higher.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: UnitedTristar
Posted 2013-06-20 07:43:04 and read 3582 times.

I wonder if they are excersizing 10 options or keeping all 25 options?

-m

  

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: jayunited
Posted 2013-06-20 08:13:13 and read 3455 times.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 94):
And with those 777-200s not replaced with the A350-1000 being replaced by the 787-10 per comments by UA, that should leave the future UA fleet at 35 A350-1000s and 115 787s (-8 / -9 / -10). So we should see another couple score of 787-10s ordered in the coming years

Don't take this question the wrong way I'm just picking your brain. Your post seems to suggest that you still expect UA to place yet another order for a replacement aircraft for the 744 fleet is that correct? You seem to suggest that the A351 would replace some 772 that are not being replaced by the 787-10 order. So in your opinion what what would be the appropriate aircraft to replace the 744 fleet. Would it be the 748i or the 779X? Or have I completely misunderstood your post?

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: kgaiflyer
Posted 2013-06-20 08:39:36 and read 3338 times.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 93):
It's now official, 35 A350-1000 for UA. They converted their previous order for 25 A350-900s and added an additional 10. The 35 A350-1000s will enable UA to replace their 744s and leave room for for expansion and or replacing 777s on certain routes.

Here's more from the UA Facebook page.

"Today we announced an order with Airbus for new A350-1000 aircraft. The agreement converts our existing order for 25 A350-900s into A350-1000s and adds 10 firm orders for A350-1000s, giving us a total order of 35 aircraft. The increased seating capacity of the A350-1000 will enable us to replace older, less efficient aircraft currently serving long-range, high-demand markets. We expect delivery starting in 2018.

“We look forward to taking delivery of the A350-1000,” said Jeff Smisek, our chairman, president and CEO. “This is a modern, fuel-efficient and advanced-technology aircraft that our customers and co-workers will enjoy flying. It will be a great addition to our fleet, and will allow us to meet demand on larger, long-haul markets in our world-leading network.”
The A350-1000 in United’s fleet
The A350-1000 is the largest member of the A350 WXB family and uses advanced materials including composites, titanium and aluminum alloys combined with the latest engine technology to make it lighter and more fuel efficient. The aircraft will consume approximately 20 percent less fuel per seat than the large widebody aircraft it will replace. It’s powered by new-generation Rolls-Royce Trent engines. The cabin will offer an improved customer experience with more headroom, wider panoramic windows and more overhead storage space.

“Less than a week after the success of the A350 XWB’s first flight, we see that demand for the new aircraft continues to grow, especially for the larger -1000 model. Airbus is proud to have United Airlines on board the exciting A350 program in such a significant way,” said Fabrice Bregier, Airbus President and CEO."

Big version: Width: 524 Height: 210 File size: 56kb


[Edited 2013-06-20 08:52:05]

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Stitch
Posted 2013-06-20 08:43:12 and read 3345 times.

Quoting jayunited (Reply 98):
Your post seems to suggest that you still expect UA to place yet another order for a replacement aircraft for the 744 fleet is that correct?

No. I always believed the A350-1000 will replace the 747-400 and UA have now confirmed that. So I do not believe UA will order the 777-8 or the 777-9.



Quoting jayunited (Reply 98):
You seem to suggest that the A351 would replace some 772 that are not being replaced by the 787-10 order.

UA needed 25 A350-1000s to replace their 747-400s, yet ordered 35. So either they are going to expand the fleet (which is quite possible) or they believe they have 10 777-200ER routes that could support an A350-1000 towards the end of the decade.

Per a post in another thread, UA stated they intend to use the 787-10 to replace the bulk of their 777-200 family, so they will need a fair bit more then the 20 they have ordered to date (as those just cover the 777-200A).

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: jayunited
Posted 2013-06-20 13:05:29 and read 2994 times.

The people at Airbus must be extremely happy converting the order to the A351 plus adding 10 more to that order probably means that UA largest aircraft by sometime at the end of this decade or at the beginning of the next decade will be an Airbus aircraft and not a Boeing aircraft. Never thought Airbus would take the top spot at UA I always thought a Boeing aircraft would always retain the top spot as the largest aircraft in UA's fleet. But in a way I am glad that UA went for the larger A351 over the A359 which really was to small to be an appropriate replacement for the 744 fleet.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Tankereng
Posted 2013-06-20 20:12:45 and read 2629 times.

Congrats to Airbus on the additional A350-1000 orders. Should fit well into United's fleet. So United will no longer has the A350-900 on order. Will the -1000 be the largest jet in United fleet, or does anyone think United might order the 777X?

Airbus still plans on the -800 flying before the -1000? If there is still the chance, I think the more popular -1000 should be launched next.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: Stitch
Posted 2013-06-20 20:16:18 and read 2623 times.

Quoting Tankereng (Reply 102):
So United will no longer has the A350-900 on order. Will the -1000 be the largest jet in United fleet, or does anyone think United might order the 777X?

I believe the A350-1000 will be the largest plane in UA's future fleet and the sole Airbus widebody. The rest of the widebody fleet will be a mix of 787-8s, 787-9s and 787-10s. I figure 35 A350s and 115 787s on a straight replacement basis, so that means about another 50 787s orders to be placed in the coming years.

Topic: RE: United May Expand A350 Order
Username: EPA001
Posted 2013-06-21 04:38:00 and read 2345 times.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 103):
I figure 35 A350s and 115 787s on a straight replacement basis, so that means about another 50 787s orders to be placed in the coming years.

UA also holds options for more A350's. So I can see them ordering more A350's as well. The majority of the WB-fleet will be B787's. I agree with you on that.


The messages in this discussion express the views of the author of the message, not necessarily the views of Airliners.net or any entity associated with Airliners.net.

Copyright © Lundgren Aerospace. All rights reserved.
http://www.airliners.net/