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Flying By A Volcano Smoke  
User currently offlineLamyl_hhlco From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 621 posts, RR: 2
Posted (11 years 8 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2428 times:

That is a great picture !
But aren't they suppose to avoid this area ? the airplane seems pretty close to the smoke~


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Patrick Lutz



Lamyl

14 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineLPL From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 1055 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (11 years 8 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2423 times:

I thought that after the BA flight 9 incident, aircraft weren't allowed to go anywhere near an ash cloud.

User currently offlineLamyl_hhlco From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 621 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (11 years 8 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2411 times:

What happened to the BA flight 9?

User currently offlineFlyf15 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (11 years 8 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2413 times:

Like all pictures taken with telephoto lenses and lacking a common unrelated point of reference, it is very hard to judge distance. It could be quite a few miles from this cloud.

User currently offlineJhooper From United States of America, joined Dec 2001, 6206 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (11 years 8 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2408 times:

You DEFINITELY don't want to be in a volcanic ash cloud in an airplane. It's probably an illusion, because the plane probably had more than adaquate clearance from the cloud.


Last year 1,944 New Yorkers saw something and said something.
User currently offlineLamyl_hhlco From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 621 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (11 years 8 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2396 times:

i hope it is! I wonder from where the picture was taken?

User currently offlineAJ From Australia, joined Nov 1999, 2397 posts, RR: 25
Reply 6, posted (11 years 8 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 2379 times:

Speedbird ash encounter: http://aviation-safety.net/database/1982/820624-0.htm

User currently offlineLamyl_hhlco From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 621 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (11 years 8 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 2375 times:

Lucky was a 747 and at FL370, otherwise .....

User currently offlineBapilot2b From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 927 posts, RR: 21
Reply 8, posted (11 years 8 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 2372 times:

VOLCANIC DUST

Avoid flight into areas of known volcanic dust. If volcanic dust is encountered exit as quickly as possible. If engines surge, loose thrust and/or EGT is high;

Thrust Levers ..... Close
disengage autothrottle if on.

Wing Anti-Ice Switch ..... On

Engine Anti-Ice Switches ..... On

If EGT Continues to increase:

Accomplish affected engine shutdown and then attempt to restart. A sucessful start(s) may not be possible until out of the volcanic dust. Engine(s) may be slow to accelerate to idle at high altitudes:

Engine Start Selectors ..... FLT

Fuel Control Switch (ES) ..... CUTOFF then run
repeat until engine start(s) acheived; remain approximately 30 seconds in each position during start attempts.

APU (if avaliable) ..... Start
consider delaying APU start until out of volcanic dust

-------------------------------------------------------------

Taken from my Boeing 767-204 Operations manual, seems like serious stuff!

Yours Sincerely,
Jason Nicholls



Jason Nicholls - v1images
User currently offlineJBirdAV8r From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 4491 posts, RR: 21
Reply 9, posted (11 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 2270 times:

Ash is very abrasive...

It scratches the windows up pretty badly and plays havoc with the very small compressor blades in the engines. Sort of like sandblasting a JT9D whilst running...not the best idea in the whole world.



I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
User currently offlineAJ From Australia, joined Nov 1999, 2397 posts, RR: 25
Reply 10, posted (11 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 2246 times:

It also becomes a gel at high temperatures which is why lowering engine operating temperatures, ie reducing power, is imperative to prevent flame out.

User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29840 posts, RR: 58
Reply 11, posted (11 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 2244 times:

You can get up pretty close to a volcano as long as you are upwind of it.

Downwind you can get into trouble pretty fast.

We conducted Flight operations 37 miles away from Pavloff Volcano with Electras and 727's throughout the eruption of 1995 and 96. Pretty much constant ash. Never had to cancel a flight since the prevailing wind was mostly west to east.



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineJBirdAV8r From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 4491 posts, RR: 21
Reply 12, posted (11 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 2238 times:

Ah, yes, there's a reason...I suppose...that we have to learn those godforsaken Volcanic Ash Dispersion charts in pilot training  Big grin


I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
User currently offlineDustweek From Japan, joined Aug 1999, 77 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (11 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 2188 times:

Hi guys.

I did it in 1989....

In December, 1989, Redoubt Volcano in Alaska erupted. That was when a KLM 747-400 lost all 4 engines at 7500 meters as they entered a cloud that had ash in it, and got them started again at only 1500m above the mountains.

Anyway, I was stuck in Fairbanks, Alaska trying to get to Florida.
Understandably, none of the airlines were going to risk flying -- EXCEPT Alaska Airlines. They correctly reasoned that if there was daylight and the skies were clear (except for the volcanic ash plume), they could simply fly to the upwind side of the volcano.

So that's what we did....a direct flight from Fairbanks to Seattle, taking a long detour to the west of Redoubt. What a sight! A huge, beautiful gray plume in the sky. Pretty much everyone in the full plane took turns looking out the left side (I think it was an MD80, but not sure).

I still have great respect for Alaska Airline's ability to fly safely in Alaska in conditions that make others give up.



User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined exactly 15 years ago today! , 2995 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (11 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 2140 times:

The ash doesn't actually become a gel at high temperatures. Keep in mind that these explosive eruptions form ash clouds composed of fragments of one kind of rock, Rhyolite. This rock has a very high Quartz content. Quartz melts at a very low temperature, one that is readily attained in jet engines. What you end up with is a slurry of melted quartz, along with feldspar and mica chunks coming through the engine, abrading the delicate parts in a way much unlike water, being that it is 3 times the density. The other bad part of low temperature silicates is that once they cool enough, they will resolidify and can gum up the moving parts in an instant.

But upwind of these volcanoes, there is no problem whatsoever.

T.J.



The last of the famous international playboys
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