Mr Spaceman From Canada, joined Mar 2001, 2787 posts, RR: 8 Posted (12 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 6247 times:
I have a question about Toronto Intl Airport (YYZ).
Have the names of the outer markers for runway's 05 and 06L been changed?
Runway 05 at YYZ used to have an outer marker called "TANGO". Over the past several days (around 5), I keep hearing pilot's receive clearance to intercept rwy 05's ILS and to maintain 170 knots untill reaching "MEADOVALE" for example. Is Meadovale the new name for rwy 05's outer marker?
Also, rwy 06L used to have an outer marker named "JULIET". Now I hear pilots being intructed to contact the tower once they cross "BRITANIA" while they're on the ILS glideslope for 06L. Is Britania the new name for rwy 06L's outer marker? (Note: The road that leads to the main control tower and ATC facilities at YYZ is called Britania. It's almost under 06L's approach path).
If they have infact changed the outer marker's names for rwy's 05 and 06L, does anyone know the reason why? Could it be because the phonetic alphabet uses the same names and there's been some confusion during ATC comminications? If this is the reason, will they be changing other outer markers names too?
At YYZ, rwy 23's outer marker is XRAY, rwy 15L's is ROMEO and rwy 33R's is LIMA.
JetCaptain From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 236 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (12 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 6198 times:
Yes they changed the names of the outer markers at YYZ.
Tango is now Meadowvale (ZLP)
Juliet is now Britannia (ZLB)
Romeo is now Woodhill (ZTO)
Xray is now Rexdale (ZDH)
Lima is now Queensway (ZYZ)
I suspect that they did this to avoid confusion with other similarily named and identified waypoints in aircraft flight management system (FMS) databases. Although I can't find an official reference to confirm that, it would make sense. The American Airlines B757 accident in Colombia comes to mind here.
Mr Spaceman From Canada, joined Mar 2001, 2787 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (12 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 6166 times:
>> JetCaptain, Thanks again for providing me with an excellent link.
Thank You for confirming for me that some of the runway's outer markers have indeed had their names changed. I wasn't just hearing things!
The Airport Authority has obviously chosen to re-name only the markers with phonetic titles, and I believe the reason most likely involves the one you guys mentioned ...... to avoid any confusion about waypoints in an airliner's FMS computer's database.
The new names are interesting too, if you're on final approach to runway 33R (it's outer marker is now Queensway), you will fly over the Queensway highway just north of the lakeshore. If you're on approach to runway 23 (it's outer marker is now Rexdale), you will fly over an area of Toronto that's called Rexdale with it's Rexdale Blvd.
>> Was the AA B757 accident the one where the airliner crashed into a mountain because the pilots where tuned to the wrong waypoint ..... thus they where off course?