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Hubs: Which Airline Will Blink First?  
User currently offlineTom in NO From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 7194 posts, RR: 32
Posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4924 times:

A Wall Street article out today discusses the current state of airline hubs, the fact there aren't enough connecting passengers to support the more than 30 hubs, and wonders which airline will be the first to "blink", and shut down a hub.

WSJ seems to think that the most likely candidates are US at PIT, CO at CLE, NW at MEM, DL at DFW, possibly even AA at STL.

The article can be seen at http://archives.californiaaviation.org/airport/msg26350.html.

Tom in NO (at MSY)


"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
53 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePROSA From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5644 posts, RR: 4
Reply 1, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4894 times:

It's funny how the article said "even" AA's hub at STL when it listed candidates for closing. That made it sound as if STL would be the least likely to go. In fact, I would consider it among the very top candidates, as (1) it's an "inherited" hub; (2) it's too close to ORD and maybe DFW; and (3) AA has shown a willingness to close hubs when necessary, i.e. BNA and RDU.


"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
User currently offlineJrlander From United States of America, joined Aug 1999, 1105 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4874 times:

I can see DL closing the DFW hub if the relationship between Delta, Northwest and CO gets closer. However, the SE has a whole lot of loyal DL frequent flyers in a huge number of small and medium size markets. These people fly from airports which are often not served by AirTran or SW. They use the DFW hub to connect to flights to the west. My hometown of Jackson is one such place. Delta has long been the dominant carrier there, even with SW service. Flying to ATL or CVG to connect to the west is not convenient. However, they will happily take a DL RJ to DFW. Recently JAN got 2 more RJ flights as part of the restructuring of DFW.

Now, if the relationship between CO and DL were to grow and (who knows what will happen in the next few years) eventually merge (they certainly have talked about it before), then certainly shutting down DFW in favor of the CO dominance of IAH would make perfect sense. DL customers would happily connect through IAH instead. This could even happen without a merger, a sort of dual hub of cooperating carriers could emerge. Customers could fly to IAH on either a CO or DL regional jet, and then transfer to either a CO or DL plane in Houston. But DL needs a hub there for all of that traffic.

Why would they not fly AA, one might ask. Well, AA has no other service to many of the cities like JAN other than DFW. If you want to go to the East, you have to go to DFW. If you want to go to AA hubs of STL, ORD or MIA, you have to connect through DFW. This is why Delta maintians so much dominance of a market like JAN. It servers ATL, CVG, and DFW providing a huge amount of connecting traffic. Even for international service, DL provides many more connections in those three hubs than AA has to offer at DFW alone. JAN isn't the only city in the South like this. Shreveport, Montgomery, Mobile are others. Than there are the host of small cities which DL servers from both directions with DCI. Meridian, Gulfport, Alexandria, etc.... There are lot of people who fly in all of these cities and no one else provides the service.


User currently onlineJohnJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1659 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4862 times:

"That same quandary perplexes other airlines. Others in the industry point to
Continental Airlines' Cleveland operation, Northwest Airlines' Memphis hub,
Delta Air Lines' Dallas operation, even American Airlines' St. Louis hub as
operations that are excessive in this economic environment -- and probably
for many years to come."

The NW Memphis hub consistently comes up in any discussion about airlines closing their hubs. MEM apparently does have a major weakness in the O&D traffic area, but I would think that a decision by NW to close this hub would be far-reaching in their route network. Their other two North American hubs, DTW and MSP, are along the northern fringe of the U.S. It would seem that if the airline has any interest in serving the Southeast/Southwest parts of the country effectively, they need a hub in the south. Someone who wanted to travel on NW from, say, Orlando to Los Angeles would have to go all the way up to Detroit or Minneapolis, then back down and across to LA. It's not likely they'd get to many takers on a routing like that. The connection in MEM is much more reasonable.

Conversely, the other hubs mentioned - PIT, STL, CLE, and DAL, all have suitable alternates for their host airlines.


User currently offlineGoingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 16
Reply 4, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4828 times:

Dang...I remember the days when Delta used to fly DC-8's between DFW and JAN. Then they offered about 5 trips a day on either 737's or 727's. Now it's just RJ's.

User currently offlineTom in NO From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 7194 posts, RR: 32
Reply 5, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4810 times:

Yeah, that "even Amerrican Airlines' St. Louis hub..." line got my attention. That was why I noted it the way I did.

I'm curious about NW's MEM hub, as well. The thought has been percolating through my mind lately about how soon we can expect to see RJ's on the MEM-MSY run. Could it become a RJ hub, with larger mainline aircraft on the longer and busier routes (say west coast and the northeast)?

Tom in NO (at MSY)



"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
User currently offlineAtcboy73 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1100 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 4596 times:

Thats a great article on a great topic. I have been wondering this for some time now.

My guess is that CO will be the first to close a hub and it will be CLE. My reasoning is that it seems to be mostly RJs now. If there is going to be anything easy to reallocate its going to be a fleet of RJs. They may also opt to keep some of the RJs at CLE as it could probably support 4 (or so) flights a day to BOS, LGA, DCA and maybe 5 a day to ORD. Also, from what I have heard on these boards the management at CLE is not the quickest nor does it operate an efficient operation at low cost to CO. CO also could easily reroute traffic through the NW hub at DTW and if the DL/CO/NW relationship matures there is also CVG. To maintain an operation at CLE just doesn't seem to make sense.

Im pretty interested in the new Delta operation at DFW and don't really think its going to be closed down right now. After all Delta doesn't have that much exposure there anymore, its mostly their RJ operators, and with so many RJs coming to the hub I would be very surprised to see them lose money on what few mainline they operate. And its not like they are operating huge mainline aircraft anymore either.

Man, from what I hear MEM has pitiful O&D numbers also but as someone stated above it is their only hub in the south. These alliances could change all that though.

AA at STL, oooooooo that is the big question and it just has me watering at the mouth to know what they are thinking about doing with that one. My guess is this (please let me know what you think about this one).

AA at STL goes to 8 daily banks much like the DL hub at DFW and goes down to about 100 mainline to the major coastal cities with the rest being Connection RJs. But not a total closing of the hub.

If STL were to close the whole industry would be better off though, just look at where it is. Right in the middle of the country, and it would affect everyone, UA at ORD and even DEN, AA at ORD and DFW, NW at all their hubs, DL at CVG and maybe even a little at DFW, and don't forget SWA.

HHHAaaaa just my .02  Big thumbs up

Thanks for posting the article and guys, let me know what ya think about my rant.


User currently offlineAtcboy73 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1100 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 4576 times:

And just another thought about the "and even AA at STL" stuff.

Maybe one of the reasons the writer put it like that would be this. The STL hub, when operated by TWA a few years back was really HUGH, BIG BIG BIG. And many people do realize this. I know AA DFW and AA ORD are big, so is UA ORD and DL ATL, we all know these are big hubs but they are traditional big travel cities with big airlines. Many people don't know that in its hay day the TWA STL operation was 12 banks, 6 in each direction and almost every bank with over 30 mainline A/C, not to mention commuters. Its not the number of A/C that should floor you but the total number of banks. Do we all agree 12 banks a day is a lot?

Maybe the writer realizes this and cant believe, like me that it could be significantly reduced or closed all together.


User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12110 posts, RR: 48
Reply 8, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 4558 times:
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I would be surprised to see CLE closed totally down as a CO hub. I could see it downsized even more than it is now. I believe CLE would fight to keep CO here in CLE, also interesting note CLE is the only airport in Ohio with a hub so to say, CVG is actually in KY.


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12110 posts, RR: 48
Reply 9, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 4550 times:
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I also think if US leaves PIT before CO decides on CLE that would help to keep them here in CLE.

Pit and US I do see them going there separate ways.

STL and AA yeah I can see that being downsized way more than it already is.



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineRedngold From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 6907 posts, RR: 44
Reply 10, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 4522 times:

Anyone who thinks that CLE is an all-RJ hub ought to look up CLE arrivals on the following flight tracking website: http://www.flytecomm.com/cgi-bin/trackflight around 8:30 PM ET, at which time 99% of that day's flight plans have been filed for CLE. We have a sizeable mainline operation that CO can't afford to lose by closing their third hub. Moving it to PIT would be an option if US were to leave, but CO can't just close CLE without losing quite a bit of business.

redngold



Up, up and away!
User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 4416 times:

NWA's MEM hub was inherited in the Republic merger (it was a Southern hub prior the their merger w/North Central to form Republic; Southern also had a hub @ ATL that Republic kept up until the early 80s). It would make sense to keep it open as a hub in the Southeast, but some larger cities already have mainline service to NWA's other hub cities. ATL has NWA service to MEM, DTW, and MSP, and the ATL-MEM service is a legacy route, which dates back to Southern Airways, and with AirTran and Delta offering flights on the route, NWA really has no need to fly the route. The main reason for keeping the MEM-ATL route open in the past was for MX reasons, so they could send DC-9s down to the DC-9 MX base @ ATL for checks. With the closure of the DC-9 MX base @ ATL, there really is no need to keep the route open as a mainline route, Airlink is already doing several of the flights a day right now with an ARJ.

User currently offlineTekelberry From United States of America, joined May 2003, 1459 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 4407 times:

By routing all the current AA STL traffic through ORD would probably be more efficient.

NW's MSP/DTW hub also seems like a waste since they have another hub only 2 states away.


User currently offlineDCA-ROCguy From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 4506 posts, RR: 33
Reply 13, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4316 times:

Indeed a great article on a great topic, as Atcboy noted.

One reason that I think both CLE and MEM are going to be around awhile is that both NW and CO have only three hubs. It seems to me that part of a network carrier's "critical mass" is having at least three hubs. (Or at least two hubs and some big focus operations, which is what I think US will have when PIT closes. Baldanza and Siegel spoke generously in this article. Everything else I've heard out of US is that PIT will be an RJ hub if the fees drop, and less than an RJ hub if they don't.)

Closing CLE would leave CO with only two hubs and no domestic focus operations; that would threaten CO's critical mass. Closing MEM would leave NW with only two hubs, and small focus operations at SEA and LAX, thus threatening NW's critical mass. Remember that NW/ CO/ DL is only an alliance, and each airline only makes money on its own flights.

AA can most afford to blink by closing STL. AA will still have ORD, DFW, and MIA superhubs, and big focus operations at JFK, LAX, LGA, BOS, and DCA. AA loses the least critical mass by closing STL, as I see it. Pax in the Midwest will still have ORD and DFW options for connections.

Also, I think we'll see UA close down IAD. UA will still have ORD, DEN, SFO, LAX superhubs and good focus operations at SEA and MIA. IAD has not been competitive as an East Coast hub (US, CO, DL hubs in the east blow it away).

Jrlander, your point about DL at DFW and westbound traffic from Delta pax in the Southeast is well taken. I bet DFW stays for the reasons you listed.

And of course, if anyone goes Chapter 7 all bets are off.

My .02, for what it's worth.

Jim



Need a new airline paint scheme? Better call Saul! (Bass that is)
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12110 posts, RR: 48
Reply 14, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4279 times:
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DCA-ROCguy
Your ideas and thoughts are right on if you ask me.



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5190 posts, RR: 8
Reply 15, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 4253 times:

Here are my opinions:

DL at DFW: Hopefully they abandon this white elephant of a hub as the codeshare with CO picks up and benefit from some feed at IAH.

CO at CLE: I believe CO will leave CLE only if a more suitable hub opens up or if UA goes under.

AA at STL: This hub is redundant in my opinion and is a likely candidate for closure.

NW at MEM: I don't think this will happen. NW would be foolish to let it go; it should at least be kept as an RJ hub-I didn't even know it was not profitable-is it?

US at PIT: This is the most likely closure to me. It is fairly close to the other US hubs.



Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineBhmal From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 140 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 4203 times:

At least for the current schedule, MEM has downgraded mainline significantly. I don't have the exact total of mainline departures now compared to say, a year ago which was 103. But several cities who have in the past saw only mainline NW to MEM which was eventually split between ARJ/CRJ and mainline now have only ARJ/CRJ. Examples: BHM, VPS, BNA, SDF, JAN, GPT, JAX, OKC. This is the first schedule since NW started ops at BHM when they acquired Republic that has no mainline 9's to MEM. Right now we get one nine a day to DTW. Also, the schedule at MEM has been cut drastically at MEM. I know the 4th bank has been reinstated but cities like SFO, SEA, BOS and MIA who used to have 2-4 daily nonstops are now down to either 1 or 2 per day. The aircraft on these runs are smaller too. For the first time in 10 years the LAX and SFO runs had 125 seat planes (A319's) on them. In the past ten years these routes have been run exclusively with 727/320/757.

So I'll have to at least buy the argument that MEM may very possibly become a more dominant RJ hub with larger mainline flights to the bigger cities.


User currently offlineHlywdCatft From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 5321 posts, RR: 6
Reply 17, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 4180 times:

The MEM hub might close for the same reason someone said that DFW (Delta) would close. If the Delta/Continental and Northwest deal comes about it would be pointless having Memphis and Atlanta so close- just like CLE being so close to DTW.

MEM is making money, they don't care about the red tails when they got the purple tails that is really making the money in the town of Elvis.


User currently offlineJrlander From United States of America, joined Aug 1999, 1105 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 4155 times:

Drerx7:

I would hardly refer to DFW as a white elephant for Delta. Webster's defines white elephant as:

"a property requiring much care and expense and yielding little profit b : an object no longer of value to its owner but of value to others c : something of little or no value "

I don't think that it meets any of these definitions. It is of value. Before DL started putting everything in ATL, and before Eastern went under, DFW was a huge hub for Delta. At one point they even served Frankfurt from DFW. As I said before, the value of keeping those SE flyers loyal to Delta is worth a lot. Those customers have always been Delta's bread and butter. Delta has a large maintenance operation at DFW. The 757 maintenance program is based there. DFW is one of the few operations other than ATL to have any engineers located there. it is a very important piece of Delta's operation.

However, IAH could supplant it if conditions were right.


User currently offlineContinental From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5517 posts, RR: 17
Reply 19, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 4149 times:

Tekelberry: Why is MSP/DTW for NWA bad? MSP serves mostly the Asian routes, while DTW covers the Europeon routes. Keep in mind MSP has a lot of Mexican routes as well! I think the two hubs are perfect!

co


User currently offlineSllevin From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 3376 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 4132 times:

I don't think NW will give up any of it's hubs.

If anything, look for SEA and LAX to ramp up and the three hubs to stay. MEM is important because it's typically a better weather hub. And in a sense, having DTW and MSP, while close, again provides SOME weather separation. If you merged those hubs, your entire airline would halt if you had just one hub and the weather moved in.

I believe that either NW will ramp up in the West, or purchase AS. Yes, I know, blah blah blah, but I still think it would not only work, but would result in a significantly stronger airline, even if operated as separate entities with just tighter schedule and FF integration.

Steve


User currently offlineTekelberry From United States of America, joined May 2003, 1459 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4105 times:

"Tekelberry: Why is MSP/DTW for NWA bad? MSP serves mostly the Asian routes, while DTW covers the Europeon routes. Keep in mind MSP has a lot of Mexican routes as well! I think the two hubs are perfect!

co"


I didn't really want to make it sound bad, I just think it is kind of strange to have 2 major hubs so close to each other.

Closing MEM would leave NW with only two hubs, and small focus operations at SEA and LAX, thus threatening NW's critical mass.

You're forgetting the to-be focus city in MKE starting 7/1.


User currently offlineIndustrialPate From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 4030 times:

I highly doubt NW will consider closing MEM. MEM is one of the lowest cost hubs within the country and has a quick, efficient design. If you price fares on NW, you may be able to fly XXX-YYY for the exact same cost no matter which hub you connect through – but the actual fare is always higher if you choose MEM, as there’s no PFC and NW doesn’t pass the savings to the passenger. In other words, given the lower fees and “pocketed” PFC, NW makes more money if a pax chooses MEM. It’s really no surprise that MEM is seeing increased RJ flying as NW takes delivery of more RJ – a few years ago NW proposed (during talks to renovate MEM) that they’d like the gate area to be gradually redesigned to handle up to 60 RJ. I believe MEM, which has a strategic location, will eventually see 6 banks of mostly RJs – but it’ll be an overall increase in the number of flights, which is a good thing for both the airport and the passenger (with the exception that the flights are on RJ…).

FWIW, both MSP and MEM are at/near pre-9/11 flight levels, whereas DTW is down quite significantly; MSP is now NW’s largest hub. Throughout its history with NW (and even RC) MEM has seen very little B757 flying, and most of those B757 (and all of the DC-10) were/are headed to DTW and MSP.

Also, it’s unfair to say MEM is a leftover from the RC merger – that was 17 years ago! Before the merger, NW didn’t have any hubs (although it had a presence at both MSP and DTW) and was mostly a trans-Pacific carrier. Since then, NW has changed dramatically… MEM has developed its own flavor and is a huge part of NW.


User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5190 posts, RR: 8
Reply 23, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3938 times:

You make good points about Delta at DFW; however how long will Delta keep their "loyal" FF base if they keep downgrading flights to RJs? RJs are not exactly popular choices for customers; they are more popular than Brasilias and ATRs -- but how much cutting is too much before folks start to sway to other airlines? It just seems as though Delta has been fighting a losing battle against American at Dallas. Almost as if using a ton of RJs is a cop out. Just some thoughts--I'm not a DFW fan or DL fan for that matter.


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineAlpha 1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (11 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3927 times:

Conversely, the other hubs mentioned - PIT, STL, CLE, and DAL, all have suitable alternates for their host airlines.

PIT and CLE have "suitable alternates"? Who, what, where, when and why? WN would add flights, but they certainly wouldn't replace even a fraction of the almost-300 flights a day operated by CO/COEX out of CLE. CLE loses CO, and it's a huge blow to the city.

Gordon challenged CLE corporate leaders to start flying CO more, and, since he was here to make that pitch, loads have gone way up. Coincidence? Maybe.

My guess is that CO will be the first to close a hub and it will be CLE.

CLE has just renegotiated landing fees with the carriers, at the urging of CO. CO is working with the city, and the new Chief at Hopkins to come up with long-term strategies for CO at CLE. CLE has invested a ton of money in CLE.

Does that mean CLE won't go away? Of course not, but it's obvious that CLE and CO are committed to make it work here, and it's going to be a while-at least a year-before any serious talk of relocation of closure takes place.

In fact, CLE is adding RJ, mainline and Commutair flights for the summer. That certainly isn't an indication of immenent doom for CLE. I think people are jumping the gun here.  Smile


25 JohnJ : PIT and CLE have "suitable alternates"? Who, what, where, when and why? US Airways has PHL, which is only a couple of hundred miles away from PIT. How
26 Tom in NO : Question to all: Noting IndustrialPates comment about the fact that MEM does not currently have a PFC in effect, I'm curious about the following: How
27 Alpha 1 : JohnJ, I was referring to "suitable alternatives" for those actual airports. PIT and CLE have no carriers who will jump in and fill the void left behi
28 HlywdCatft : **Tekelberry: Why is MSP/DTW for NWA bad? MSP serves mostly the Asian routes, while DTW covers the Europeon routes. Keep in mind MSP has a lot of Mexi
29 LV : I've said it before and I will say it again, I am convinced that AA will give up on STL, even after the economy rebounds and traffic comes back. I thi
30 Jrlander : I really don't think most customers care or know what plane they are flying on. DL customers who are loyal FF members will choose DL over other carrie
31 Luv2fly : The loayl FF are the ones seeking the upgrades to the forward cabin, and RJ's do not offer them.
32 Jrlander : but that doesn't mean they won't choose them. If their points are all with one airline, and it is other offering the front cabin, they have nothing to
33 Scottb : Actually, I don't believe that Delta sees many of its customers in the Southeast defecting to AA for flights to and through DFW. In the states east of
34 DeltaBoy777 : I have a couple of really good points to discuss about Delta not leaving DFW. FIRST Delta slowly built up operations at DFW, as a relief to ATL in the
35 IndustrialPate : ~DeltaBoy777~, 1) DL acquired its SLC from Western Airlines... it downsized and reshaped the operations, but it certainly hasn't built SLC up. 2) It's
36 ATA L1011 : No way will Delta shut down th DFW hub, although downsized like Scottb said it serves it purpose quite well. I do miss the early 90's when I use to se
37 DeltaBoy777 : Hey, I said nothing about SLC being the major hub!! If anything I think SLC is a very weak hub for Delta!!! Only there to get Delta the Olympics!! But
38 Cloudy : ) It's foolish to think AA would liquidate... AA is a Texas company and our president is a business-friendly Texan... hmm... UA would liquidate before
39 Ord : I don't think Delta's DFW maintenace facilities have anything to do with keeping a hub. Didn't Northwest inherit a huge maintenance complex in Atlanta
40 Nonrevman : I don't think Delta's DFW maintenace facilities have anything to do with keeping a hub. Didn't Northwest inherit a huge maintenance complex in Atlanta
41 Yyz717 : NW inherited a DC-9 mx base at ATL that survived thru the Republic & NW mergers. It was recently announced though that it will be closed. [Edited 2003
42 Luv2fly : I believe that there will be more adjustments and downsizing as we go forward. Remember there is just way to much capacity in the market right now as
43 Tom in NO : Ord: Continental Express recently took over an existing building at SHV for a maintenance complex. Could that be the one you're looking at? Everyone:
44 Nonrevman : Tom in NO, I think he is referring to the Baton Rouge base for ASA.
45 Tom in NO : My bad, I missed noticing ASA's new hangar at BTR. Looks like the ribbon cutting was May 6. I have to run up there for a different dedication fairly s
46 Post contains links Scottb : Tom- Check out http://www.mscaa.com/finance/stats.htm and http://www.mscaa.com/April%2003.htm. In 2002, 11,685 enplanements per day (including Pinnacl
47 Tom in NO : Scott, Thanks for posting those numbers. At $4.50 per PFC that MEM is not charging, it looks like Northwest et al pocketed about $54,279 per day in Ap
48 IndustrialPate : Cloudy, My reasoning was partially sarcastic based on previous comments made on this topic. In all serious, I (like everyone else, including DL) have
49 ATA L1011 : Actually 763's were operated at DFW until April 6th by DL.
50 DeltaBoy777 : IndustrialPate- How can you say that Delta is not happy with CVG!!! CVG is Delta's second largest hub, second only to Atlanta. Every scheduling period
51 Ord : LAX is still a hub for United. They cut after 9/11 but have not really cut since. They have about 120 mainline flights. American is down to about 90 f
52 IndustrialPate : How can you say that Delta is not happy with CVG!!! I said DL's management isn't happy with the performance of any hub other than ATL... this doesn't
53 Sllevin : I agree with IP that in all reality, DL is the most likely to retreat from hubs. If you look at patterns since 9/11, Delta has actually been the most
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