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Deutsche BA @ Tempelhof?  
User currently offlineSetjet From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 1119 posts, RR: 0
Posted (11 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2708 times:

Today there was a report that Deutsche BA is considering moving all their operations froim Tegel to Tempelhof to save the future of the airport. Tempelhof is due to close in October 2004 (they have a SPD socialist government in Berlin, that says it all!).

Can anybody confirm these plans? Also on a sidenote: Is Cirrus Airlines still serving Temnpelhof with their codeshare agreement with Lufthansa? What's with the rumors that Lufthansa cancelled their contract with Cirrus?

13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineThomas_Jaeger From Switzerland, joined Apr 2002, 2386 posts, RR: 28
Reply 1, posted (11 years 23 hours ago) and read 2672 times:

Yes, I can confirm dba is planning to do this. The new owner of dba, Hans Rudolf Wöhrl, was a big supporter of Tempelhof airport for years.

Cirrus Airlines still operates out of Tempelhof to Mannheim and Saarbruecken as well as seasonal services to the islands of Sylt and Usedom. Cirrus is however no longer part of Team Lufthansa, flights are now operated on a codeshare basis. It's basically the same with Cimber Air and it's German domestic service from Kiel to Frankfurt.



Swiss aviation news junkie living all over the place
User currently offlineSetjet From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 1119 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (11 years 23 hours ago) and read 2666 times:

Technically, what's the difference if they are no longer part of Team Lufthansa but still operate in Lufthansa colors and under LH flight numbers?

I hope Whoerl succeeds in his efforts to save Tempelhof!


User currently offlineThomas_Jaeger From Switzerland, joined Apr 2002, 2386 posts, RR: 28
Reply 3, posted (11 years 22 hours ago) and read 2643 times:

Before they were operating as a franchisee of Lufthansa using Lufthansa flight numbers and paid a franchise fee to Lufthansa for marketing and selling tickets, using their name etc. but they had the full economical risk on their side anyhow. Now, they are operating under C9 flight numbers again, don't pay a franchise fee to LH and LH is paying them for the seats they sell on their flights under LH codeshare flight numbers.


Swiss aviation news junkie living all over the place
User currently offlineGodbless From Sweden, joined Apr 2000, 2752 posts, RR: 16
Reply 4, posted (11 years 22 hours ago) and read 2637 times:

I heard about the dba-THF thing a week or so ago. It would really be good for Berlin and also it is the only true city airport (LCY compared to THF is out in the Boondocks rather then "in the city").
If dba would move all it's operations to THF (more then 30 flights/day) it would open some extra space for TXL to grow and THF would no longer cost money as dba would take care of the THF-debt of about 10 Mio. Euro/year.

Now that BBI is not to be opened on time (thank god!) it might be time to rethink all the decisions made and brink the airport discussion back into a fact-based one again. Berlin does not need any major airport but just an optimisation of the capacity it already has today (TXL, SXF and THF).
Add the second terminal to Tegel, bring airlines back to THF and make SXF an excepeted airport and forget BBI!

Max


User currently offlineTwa@fra From China, joined Nov 2000, 147 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (11 years 21 hours ago) and read 2606 times:

Does THF can really handel B737, thought due to runway restriction etc.. they can only handel "smaller" aircrafts ???
If THF can, I do not understand why so many Airliners use TXL and do not use and fight for THF.

rgds
nic



User currently offlineNdebele From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 2899 posts, RR: 23
Reply 6, posted (11 years 20 hours ago) and read 2589 times:

Does THF can really handel B737, thought due to runway restriction etc.. they can only handel "smaller" aircrafts ???
Well I'm always surprised what "bigger" aircraft can use THF's rather short runways:

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But I think that noise restrictions wouldn't allow 30+ daily 733 flights into THF  Confused


User currently offlineTwa@fra From China, joined Nov 2000, 147 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (11 years 19 hours ago) and read 2549 times:

o.k. slightly bigger than a b737  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

User currently offlineGodbless From Sweden, joined Apr 2000, 2752 posts, RR: 16
Reply 8, posted (11 years 15 hours ago) and read 2505 times:

One must consider that before TXL was opened THF was the only Berlin airport in the west to get airliner service. And that means that all the Pan Am 707's and so on flew there on a regular basis and it worked...

Twa@fra,
We have never seen you here before... Why don't you get hooked up with our "Deutsche a.net Fraktion"? Always good to know a few more people here that also tend to hang out at FRA...

Max


User currently offlineKM732 From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 232 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (11 years 14 hours ago) and read 2477 times:

I saw a short report on N24 (German news channel) today about the future of THF. They interviewed a representative of the Berlin Airport Holding and she said that they were NOT interested at all in keeping Tempelhof open, even if dba started flying at THF. Can´t remember the reasons exactly...

Maybe somebody can find a full report on that.


Stefan

P.S.: First visit to MUC today:

OA B734 SX-BKD, special "Olympics 2004" c/s

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Photo © Jean-Marc Camilleri



User currently offlineOO-VEG From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 1081 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (11 years 12 hours ago) and read 2448 times:

To be honest I don't see why THF should remain open... I shall explain

I understand the historic importance of it. But let's face the situation. Tempelhof is currently a really sleepy place. It maybe more central than LCY but there is hardly any traffic at the airport. And DBA flies to TXL at this moment. Only now THF may close they are willing to have a look at it.

Nonono THF has had it's time and now. They have a capacity of 1,5 milion passengers, 2 runways of 2km and behind the fences you have got the city centre of Berlin. So that also means noise for a lot of people and not to forget the danger. Flying a 737 on a 2km runway could be possible. But what happens when such an aircraft can't brake properly and ends up behind the fence? Or worse?

You can't expand, a lot of people have more noise and there is a level of danger. As safe as aviation may be, there is always a risk.. but the risks of aircraft crashing into a field is always better then the risk of crashing into the centre of a city.

How would you feel about the idea if they turned THF into a museum for aviation?? They have a very large terminal building and there is the platform on where you can store a lot of aircraft. Maybe the current Technik museum in Berlin would be interested in such an idea, they have some aircraft stored there.. but on a real airport that would look so much more interesting. Maybe this way you could revive a bit of the glory days of THF.


User currently offlineThomas_Jaeger From Switzerland, joined Apr 2002, 2386 posts, RR: 28
Reply 11, posted (11 years 8 hours ago) and read 2416 times:

Passenger numbers at THF are shrinking because the airport holding is trying to prevent airlines from flying there by doing everything they can to make it unattractive. While they claim that THF would loose 10 million EUR a year, basically they are loosing 80-90% of this amount because the building is empty and they don't find tenants. The current situation is that they cannot offer any additional usable slots in TXL and now they are trying to lure airlines such as SN Brussels Airlines, City-Air, Cirrus, Swiss, Luxair etc. to go to SXF. Reportedly, there were several investors which offered to buy the airport for a symbolic amount of 1 EUR. I am sure that the airport could be run very profitable if someone interested in new airlines serving the airport would run in instead of some politically thinking guys trying to get rid of all airlines at THF in order to tell the public that the airport is needed any longer. In the meantime, they are dreaming of their BBI project ...


Swiss aviation news junkie living all over the place
User currently offlinePatroni From Luxembourg, joined Aug 1999, 1403 posts, RR: 14
Reply 12, posted (11 years 7 hours ago) and read 2400 times:

@Thomas Jaeger :
I can only second your thoughts! I have lived in Berlin (and worked only 100m from THF airport) for 7 years, and always had the impression that for political reasons the Airport company is trying to shy away as much business as possible in order not to make the airport profitable. From what I heard (unconfirmed sources, yet the best ones that I had), rental fees for office space at THF were kept at a very high level, sending many interested companies to off-airport locations. I also heard of the idea of installing a conference center in the airport building, which was rejected, but certainly would have made money.

Anyway, even when the airport should close, the building is a historic landmark which must not be destroyed, so the cost for maintenance etc will remain, but then without the potential revenues of the airport.

I would love to see THF open for a long time to come and enjoy every flight to this airport, which is in my eyes the most userfriendly in the world. However I fear that they will sacrifice it for the sake of the megalomaniac BBI project.

Cheers,

Tom


User currently offlineThomas_Jaeger From Switzerland, joined Apr 2002, 2386 posts, RR: 28
Reply 13, posted (11 years 5 hours ago) and read 2388 times:

@Tom: That's exactly what I heard. Rumours are that they are also trying to get costs up by heating the unused offices all winter etc.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


Swiss aviation news junkie living all over the place
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