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Airlines You'd Like To See At Your Home Airport?  
User currently offlineCodeshare From Poland, joined Sep 2002, 1854 posts, RR: 1
Posted (11 years 6 days ago) and read 12937 times:

I'm based at Warsaw (WAW/EPWA), so here goes:

AA - although it has codeshare with LO.
UA - member of Star, so?
AC - same as UA
Iberia - also codeshare with LO
Aer Lingus
TAP Air Portugal
Olympic
Icelandair
Emirates (as part of the ever expanding network  Smile )
the Low costs (Ryanair, Easyjet etc.)
Varig.
JAL or ANA

That's a long wishlist, but with Poland joining the EU next year (most likely), some of these could appear.

codeshare


How much A is there is Airliners Net ? 0 or nothing ?
109 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBadischerGreif From Germany, joined Jun 1999, 101 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (11 years 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 12867 times:

I´d like to see Swiss at Basel  Wink/being sarcastic

User currently offlinePlugger From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 83 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (11 years 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 12858 times:

AirTran in Sarasota would be the greatest blessing imaginable!

User currently offlineCritter From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 267 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (11 years 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 12833 times:

FedEx in HGR (Hagerstown, Md) so I would only have to drive one mile to work instead of 85 to BWI.........Just dreaming! I'm sure that would never happen. I am allowed to dream though.

critter


User currently offlineRJ100 From Switzerland, joined Nov 2000, 4118 posts, RR: 29
Reply 4, posted (11 years 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 12833 times:

LOL at BadischerGreif  Smile

But I agree with you...

RJ100



none
User currently offlineUsairwys757 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (11 years 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 12809 times:

I would like to see BA come back to CLT. I think it would be great!!

User currently offlineCanyonBlue From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (11 years 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 12801 times:

I would love to see some more international carriers in ROC

BA or VS to LHR/LGW
LH to FRA
AF to CDG
AM to MEX and CUN


*Sigh* That'll be the day.............


User currently offlineLPL From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 1055 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (11 years 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 12754 times:

I think BMI would be good for Liverpool. They'd give plenty of domestic destinations (which LPL needs) and perhaps in the future maybe a transatlantic flight.

User currently offlineNtspelich From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 764 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (11 years 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 12743 times:

These would be nice at PIT:

B6
LH
AC (mainline or Tango; just one flight on something bigger than the Jazz we have now)
EI (seasonal weekly service only)
MX (seasonal weekly service to break up the US rule on this route (although, we'll see how TZ and USA3000 can affect prices this winter)

NS



United 717 heavy, you're facing the wrong way. Any chance you can powerback to get off of my deice pad?
User currently offlineWolfpacker From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 354 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (11 years 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 12741 times:

RDU

An international airline or 2 would be nice. And I'm pretty sure we are on the list for Jetblue although we will probably have to wait for the RJs.


User currently offlineSkymileman From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (11 years 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 12731 times:

I am at Billings, MT, so as you could imagine, the list is fairly extensive.

US Airways
America West (Mainline)
Southwest
American
Alaska
British Airways (Or some foreign carrier. It is an International Airport after all.)

-Lane


User currently offlineWedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5902 posts, RR: 6
Reply 11, posted (11 years 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 12713 times:
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I would like to see Horizon Air at Wichita to serve SEA with their CRJ-700's and B6 with their ERJ-190's. Also, expanded Air Tran flights would be a plus.

User currently offlineWedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5902 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (11 years 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 12704 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I would like to see Horizon Air at Wichita to serve SEA with their CRJ-700's and B6 with their ERJ-190's. Also, expanded Air Tran flights would be a plus.

User currently offlineHurricane From United States of America, joined Feb 2002, 1443 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (11 years 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 12657 times:

Just to expand on your thoughts, Wolfpacker...
...at RDU I think it would be reasonable to look foreward to JetBlue and Frontier...
...and I'd love to see Lufthansa and Virgin or BA come here.

And on the not-so-reasonable list, I'd love to see Alaskan direct to SEA and ANC, and QANTAS.  Big thumbs up


User currently offlineUpsmd11 From United States of America, joined May 2003, 814 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (11 years 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 12641 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

At SDF I would like to see:

America West: to PHX or LAS (CRJ700 or something like that)
Frontier: to DEN (Does Frontier fly small aircraft)
United (already has ORD/sometimes IAD): to DEN (CRJ would be fine)
AirTran: to ATL (717)
Delta (in addition to ATL/CVG/DFW): to SLC (CRJ)
JetBlue: to Midwest hub if it comes to fruition (900)
Southwest: to DAL if they go with smaller aircraft as mentioned on this forum
(Southwest already serves STL/MDW/BHM/BWI/TPA/MCO/are there more?

Regards,
John


User currently offlineTom in NO From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 7194 posts, RR: 32
Reply 15, posted (11 years 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 12623 times:

MSY (New Orleans):

domestic: Alaska

international: British Airways, Air France, Mexicana

Tom at MSY



"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
User currently offlineSsides From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 4059 posts, RR: 21
Reply 16, posted (11 years 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 12605 times:

At DFW, I would love to see the following:

Qantas (maybe in the works, who knows)
Air France (rumored to be coming back)
JAL (also rumored to be coming back)
KLM (but they already serve Houston)
Eva Air (passenger service)
Air Canada (mainline)
Mexicana (I can't believe they're not here)
LanChile (they're a oneworld member, maybe it could work)
Singapore Airlines (doubtful)
Thai (they used to be here)
South African (doubtful now that they're aligned with DL)
Aeroflot (keep dreaming)

I'd also love to see BA or someone launch 747 service, but I don't think that's in the picture for the near future.



"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
User currently offlineSWAFA30 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (11 years 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 12603 times:

(Southwest already serves STL/MDW/BHM/BWI/TPA/MCO/are there more? from SDF....

Yes there is also nonstop service to LAS and PHX.



User currently offlineHlywdCatft From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 5321 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (11 years 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 12593 times:

well at MCO we get pretty much everything domestic here these days give or take a couple West coast airlines.

Maybe a couple domestic cargo like

Polar 742
Atlas 744
Kalitta 742, DC-8
Gemini DC-10
USAJet DC-9


So International I would like to see...

From Europe

Lufthansa- A340-300 or 744
Air France- A340-300, 744 or 772
Alitalia 772
British Midland A330
Swiss A330
Austrian A340
LOT 763
Aeroflot 772
KLM 744
Iberia A340-600

From South America

Varig MD-11
Lan Chile A340
Aerolineas Argentinas 742
Avianca 763
Avensa DC-10

From Asia

Japan Airlines 744
ANA 744
Cathay Pacific A340-600
Korean 744
Asiana 773
China Airlines 744
Air China 744
EVA 744

From Mideast

Saudi Arabian- 772
Emirates 773
Egypt Air 772
El Al 744
Gulf Air A340




User currently offlineHomer71 From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 2242 posts, RR: 14
Reply 19, posted (11 years 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 12589 times:

I want to start seeing Asian airlines at IAH, such as JL, KE, SQ, etc., along with QF and NZ


"On spaceship earth there are no passengers...only crew."
User currently offlineEldoylio From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2003, 96 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (11 years 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 12570 times:

I would like to see AA back at BHX . . . . Permanently!

I would also like to see:

Virgin Atlantic
South African
Gulf Air (not sure how Emirates would feel about this)
Quantas

I would especially like to see BA introduce heavier equipment (777 / 744). The runway would definitely need lengthening first though!



Q. How does an A340 gain altitude - A. With the curve of the Earth
User currently offlineSNARN From Sweden, joined Aug 2003, 49 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (11 years 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 12541 times:

I would like to see DL, AA, UL and CX back at ARN (Stockholm)

I heard that MH might start up flights to ARN - does anyone know about that?

I love CO .. Would be great if they would come as well  Smile

Patrick


User currently offlineN951U From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (11 years 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 12498 times:

To be realistic, as opposed to some posts above, I'd like to see Frontier come to Jacksonville. Currently this city of a million people has no service to any point west of Dallas.

For existing airlines, American to Chicago would be nice, and could make it feasible to fly American to the northeast (after Nov 1 will just have 2 x STL, 3 x DFW, 3 x MIA).


User currently offlineDC-10 Levo From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2001, 3432 posts, RR: 3
Reply 23, posted (11 years 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 12493 times:

I really want BA to fly to EMA, it'd make my home airport a lot more busier. But there is probabaly too much competition from the low-cost carriers like Easyjet and Bmibaby.

DC-10


User currently offlineStarAC17 From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 3362 posts, RR: 9
Reply 24, posted (11 years 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 12488 times:

at YYZ:

Qantas, Qantas and more Qantas it was here up until 9/11 I believe


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Darcy Stevens




Engineers Rule The World!!!!!
25 Post contains links and images Swissgabe : ZRH Unique Airport and of course: View Large View MediumPhoto © Michael Carter
26 Luv2fly : Wolfpacker I hope you do not have to wait for B6's RJ's as they are not getting any! The 190's are considered mainline jets and not regionals.
27 TheGov : For MEM, I would love to see: Frontier Lufthansa AeroMexico or Mexicana and the one that everyone in crying for: Southwest!!!!
28 ConcordeBoy : New Orleans/Armstrong Domestic: Alaska Spirit International: Air France and/or British Airways Mexicana Varig
29 MSYtristar : From New Orleans,LA... Domestic: Alaska to SEA, ATA to MDW International: Lufthansa to FRA or Air France to CDG, Mexicana to CUN
30 Rattibone : For YYZ: Qantas definitely Emirates - Sweet paintjob and nice aircraft to boot Swiss - Want them back! Air New Zealand would be sweet too. BMI Air Gre
31 QB737 : For Vancouver (YVR) Air France Air Tahiti Nui I would like to see Qantas And Malaysia Airlines back. Ben
32 Srbmod : ATL: Domestic: Alaska Airlines (ATL-SEA, ATL-PDX) International: bmi British Midland (ATL-MAN) Virgin Atlantic (ATL-MAN or ATL-LGW) Aer Lingus (ATL-DU
33 Post contains images Funflyer : Well im at MHT so i would like to see: American Airlines JetBlue AirTran USA3000 Frontier Spirit Hooters Just Thinkin
34 USAir330 : PHL Virgin Atlantic Qantas ANA JAL Alaska Hawaiian Alitalia That's pretty much it... I'd be satisfied!
35 STT757 : Newark (EWR).. First of all bring back these former EWR carriers: Aer Lingus Phillipines Airlines Korean Airlines Hapag Llyod Other Airlines I would l
36 STT757 : JFK: Iraqi Airways Atlantic City International Airport: COEX UAL Express American Eagle Southwest Air Tran NWA US Airways Express Air Canada Express (
37 KAL744 : At MST or DUS I would like to see: KLM (B 747-400) Korean Air (B 747-400) Qantas Airways (B 747-400) All of them I would like to see at least once in
38 Dsuairptman : Form Gulfport/Biloxi (GPT): Northwest: Replace a couple of CRJ flts w/DC9/ARJ equip.to provide needed seats and first class service. Add 3x daily to D
39 Post contains images Concorde1518 : At Sacramento, I'd like to see JetBlue and AirTran come out here, along with more service from the guys that are here already.
40 PROSA : I consider both ISP and JFK "home" airports. Sticking with realistic new service, I'd like to see the return of AA and DL mainline at ISP, maybe US ma
41 Caribb : At YUL (Montreal) I'd like to see Alitalia Iberia TAP Air Portugal United (Mainline) Continental (Mainline) SAS El Al Royal Jordanian Varig Lan Chile
42 MSPXJGuy : Im based in MSP so we have pretty much nothing except for NW. Id like to see British Airways or Virgin, Qantas, and maybe Singapore for International,
43 Eastbay : In Tucson, would love to see JetBlue. Continental used to do seasonal nonstops to EWR, JetBlue would be a welcome addition to JFK and maybe LGB/OAK as
44 Cmckeithen : MSY: Lan Chile British Airways Lufthansa Virgin* Qantas** Hawaiian** Singapore Korean KLM** * = Coming in 03-04 ** = Codeshared (CO, DL or NW)
45 Noise : In Montreal-Dorval Airport: America West JetBlue Midwest Express Alitalia Iberia SAS BMI Varig Lan Chile JAL
46 A340600 : LGW- BMI British Midland SAA Icelandair (more 753s at LGW) KLM Lufthansa Thai Airways Air India
47 Post contains images Planesarecool : ANYTHING good at Dunsfold . After all it is my HOME airport Okay my home Intl airport is Gatwick and I'd love to see i few more Asian carriers there,
48 N6376M : At GNV: American Eagle or ASA (Delta Connection) to MIA Airtran to ATL (to give ASA some competition) -76M
49 Aussie747 : Back in Sydney I would love to welcome back the following who used to grace our shores previously KLM, Air France, Air Zimbabwe, Alitalia, Air India,
50 Post contains images Vincent32 : Here in ALB it would be nice to see FL and B6...with our runway extensions (one done, one soon to start) maybe that will be a possibility. Other than
51 Kevin752 : I would like to see thes airlines at my home airport. My fhomw airport is LAX. Croatia Airlines Sobel air Mandarin Airlines Turkish Airways
52 KQ777 : For SFO: Aer Lingus Air New Zealand Alitalia Emirates Finnair SAS Scandinavian Swiss International Thai Airways International Iberia Qantas Varig Braz
53 Arsenal@LHR : At LHR: Vietnam Airlines (Possibility) Lan Chile(haven't heard anything about LAN to LHR) Delta(Open skies needed) Northwest(Open skies) US airways(Op
54 Post contains images BOSugaDL : I live 5 minutes away from ORH (Worcester, MA)...I's like to see any airline come back. Pre 9/11 we had a pretty good schedule: 2 AA Eagle ERJ to ORD;
55 TLHFLA : Here are some semi-realistic additions I would like to see here at Tallahassee, FL (TLH): Restoration of Airtran mainline to ATL Restoration of USAirw
56 Elwood64151 : @ BDL: AirTran, JetBlue, Frontier @ MCI: JetBlue, Alaska, British, AeroMexico, GroupoTACA, Vanguard (sniff!) Cheers!
57 Irishpower : At SFO I'd like to see the return of Qantas (anyone know why they left?) Thai Emirates Air New Zealand Malaysian Air India SAS Alitalia (they still ha
58 Kimmykun : At MAZ: US Airways Express Continental Connection At PSE: AirTran jetBlue TMA or Pan Am 3 At BQN: Spirit AA Song At SJU: Virgin or BA Lufthansa
59 Northwesta319 : At MDW I Would Love To See: Mexicana (again) Song American- Something bigger then the F100 they use United Express Midwest Express
60 MSPman : For GRR Jetblue to JFK (190 or A320) Frontier to DEN (A319 or CRJ) United to IAD For MSP BA to LGW (777) AF to CDG (330) B6 to JFK & LGB (320) Thats m
61 Post contains images AMX : Eastbay, When did AeroCalifornia stop serving Tucson??? I thought it was still operating 3x to Hermosillo... Regards, AMX
62 Post contains images Mike77 : My hometown airport is SFO and I have really missed seeing Southwest here. I would love for them to come back. I still get to see them coming in over
63 9V-SVC : Let me see , this is an interesting topic . I would like to see more North American Carriers in Singapore like USairways , American Airlines ( Not cod
64 Post contains links and images Airways6max : I would like to see BNA (Nashville) have more international flights. View Large View MediumPhoto © Paul Robbins Such as:
65 Post contains links and images Lan_Fanatic : I'd like to see in Santiago de Chile (SCL) the following: View Large View MediumPhoto © David James Clelford from Newark View Large View MediumPh
66 Post contains links and images Thenoflyzone : I am not asking for too much, because I would like for these airlines to RETURN to Montreal - Dorval Intl (YUL), as they flew here not so long ago (se
67 FlyAA : I'd like to see the following in TUL: AA-keep service to STL, reinstate nonstop mainline service to LAX, and launch nonstop service to BNA (via an Eag
68 ARCJET : For CHS (Charleston,SC) AirTran to ATL Southwest to BWI, MCO, and MDW American to DFW, MIA All mainline aircraft, we only have Delta 757s and MD88s al
69 Futureualpilot : Being based at SAN, I seriously doubt any of these will efer happen, but I can dream! British Airways(they will be stopping the SAN-LHR service in Oct
70 Continental : MSP: jetBlue (I heard they are going to come here, so it's more of a reality!) British Airways Lufthansa (Rumours!) co
71 Aviatortj : GFK/FAR (school): Sun Country -> MSP UA (mainline) -> DEN I know these are long shots but DC-9s every few hours put me to sleep. Luckily at FAR today,
72 Upsmd11 : (Southwest already serves STL/MDW/BHM/BWI/TPA/MCO/are there more? from SDF.... Yes there is also nonstop service to LAS and PHX. Yeah.... I know those
73 PVD757 : For PVD, I'd like to see (realisticlly): Frontier: (2x DEN 318) SONG: (MCO, FLL, PBI, TPA any freq. would be great) Jetblue: (5x JFK 190, and whatever
74 BH346 : For Wichita, I'd like to mostly see more frequencies and/or larger equipment being used by the current airlines as the economy improves. More specific
75 Tommy767 : My home airport: EWR More United: They have 8 gates, why not use them all???? I would like to see MIA again, SEA again, BOS again, MCO again and more
76 Kl911 : I live close to MRS , so: Those 3 to give some cheap weekend breaks.... Ryanair Easyjet Air Berlin Bastiaan
77 7E7 : Aussie747, add to that list MEA (BEY-KUL-SYD) I believe their new A330's are capable of flying BEY-KUL in one hop?! GF's return is certainly something
78 Eastbay : AMX, Whoops, you're mostly correct, they serve HMO out of TUS three times weekly. I travel in and out of Tucson frequently and haven't seen them in a
79 Copaair737 : At GUM, i would like to See: Virgin Blue (or pacific) QANTAS Singapore Airlines Thai Hawaiian in SFO Aer Lingus Copa SAS BMI Thai Emirates (said to co
80 Post contains images Mexicana757 : At ORD I would like to see Aeroflot Virgin (come back) Singapore (come back) Thai Airways Asiana All Nippon Airways ANA (I think they used to come to
81 N670UW : It'd be great to see LH at Pittsburgh. I hope they choose PIT for the new MUC flight.
82 Tavong : I'm in Bogota (Colombia) so there is my list 1-Virgin Atlantic 2-Cathay Pacific 3-BMI 4-SAS 5-Southwest (Something like Southwest Colombia)
83 Post contains links and images Alohaguy : Depends on what you would deem as "my airport"? I live in St. Albert, Alberta which would reasonably give me 3 airports: 1) St. Albert (3200' gravel)
84 Gsoflyer : Here at Greensboro, we'd take jsut about anything.... JetBlue RJs, I'm sure will be on the way Southwest is still promosing (like they are for RIC) Bu
85 Planefreak : ATL needs more international carriers!!! I would like to see KLM, Swiss and Austrian return!! We need more Far East traffic too. Delta welcomes the co
86 GSPSPOT : Here at GSP in luverly South Carolina, we'd LOVE to see Air Tran or their JetConnect service. God help us if we got Southwest...
87 CALMSP : anything other than NW, thats all we see here. the only excitement is when Iceland Air flies in. How about some other international carriers Northwest
88 Aa757first : ABE. Formerly Allentown Bethlehem Easton, now Lehigh Valley International. jetBlue with EMB-190. AA with 738 services to MIA, ORD, and DFW.
89 Paddy : Here at PDX: Domestic - US Airways to PHL and CLT Jet Blue to JFK and FLL International - Any of these five: JAL or ANA to NRT Korean to ICN(Asiana hi
90 Post contains images BN747 : LAX, I'd like to see these guys return: Avianca Aerolineas Argentinas AeroPeru (now LAN Peru) JAT TAP Iberia (poss) Alitalia (poss) Egyptair Royal Jor
91 707cmf : At CMF ? Definitely Air France. They left just when I arrived... 707
92 Post contains images Eham : Emirates and Qantas would be nice for my home airport Amsterdam Schiphol
93 JGPH1A : For Nice: Service to another US gateway - CO/EWR, AA/ORD - or direct service to BOS(nobody hubs there, which is a shame). EI/DUB in time to connect to
94 Post contains images 9V-SVE : At SIN -
95 JAL : Love to see Asian airlines fly to Montreal plus love to see more low cost airlines!!
96 Post contains links and images UA 777 : At HAM, I would first of all like to see some transatlantic traffic again. It would be nice if Delta returned for example. We would be happy about any
97 BCAInfoSys : Airtran (717's, yay!) into SEA. Also AS into SLC.
98 Ex NWA : ABQ... New service with new carriers I'd like to see. Airtran 2x daily to ATL 717 Alaska 2x daily to SEA 73G USAirways 1x daily to CLT 1x daily to PHL
99 Turk223 : I agree totally with PVD757... I think PVD could realistically see: Song to MCO FLL PBI TPA jetBlue to JFK Frontier to DEN AirTran to ATL and existing
100 Post contains links and images Marco_polo : At Phoenix Sky Harbor airport, PHX, would love to see a lot of these Asians and European. View Large View MediumPhoto © Jay Piboontum, View Large
101 AA623BDLSJU : I like this topic. Well, my home airport is HVN (New Haven, CT). I definitely want to see American Eagle RJ service to ORD (finger's crossed) or maybe
102 Post contains images Aloha717200 : My actual home airport....or my preferred home airport? Actual airport: Delta, Southwest, Jetblue, Frontier, Alaska Preferred home airport (vicinity):
103 Planemannyc : At JFK: Thai Airways Emirates Qatar Airways Kenya Airways SriLankan Airlines Ethiopian Airlines Aloha Alaska SouthWest Bahamasair Tahiti Nui Increased
104 Chi-town : I want to see America West and Mexicana back at MDW. Air Canada at MDW would be awesome too. I think Air Canada would do great here at MDW. It would b
105 PVD757 : Turk223, glad to here from someone new in the PVD area! I forgot Icelandair...we came very close to getting them 1 maybe 2x per week, but I was told t
106 Expressjetphx : I agree with Marco_polo. I think that PHX could support: Korean Air (3x weekly) ICN-PHX Cathay Pacific (1x weekly) HKK-PHX JAL/JAL Resort Express (2x
107 Hockey55dude : What I'd like to see at San Diego is: Airtran Allegiant air Great Plains Airlines Southeast spirit airlines west jet jets go Midwest Express Airlines
108 Futureualpilot : Hockey55dude Maybe Song will start a SAN-JFK service to compete with JetBlues services!? How nice would that be to see here in SAN?
109 Expressjetphx : North American Airlines I'd like to see at PHX: AirTran jetBlue Great Plains Allegiant Spirit West Jet Hooters Air Mexicana (Why haven't they started
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