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AA To Start Daily Miami-Richmond, VA Service  
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33194 posts, RR: 71
Posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 6207 times:

American Airlines regional affiliate American Eagle, in it's continued expansion at Miami International Airport, will add non-stop daily service between Miami and Richmond, Virginia effective 6 January 2004. The service will operate with an ERJ-135 aircraft. Richmond, Virginia is the seventh all-new non-stop destination that AA has added from Miami since July, adding to Columbus, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Minneapolis, Indianapolis, and Guanacaste Liberia.

From Richmond, Virginia American Eagle also flies non-stop to Boston and O'Hare and American Airlines flies non-stop to Dallas.


a.
41 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineScottysAir From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 6116 times:

This is very wonderful news for AA is continues expansion to northern Viriginia flight and is that possible for only 1 daily roundtrip nonstop, right? Which onen of those city could to be next of announces with the new flight? Thanks!  Smile

User currently offlineJohn From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 1374 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 6062 times:

Still waiting for that inevitable PVD-MIA announcement, however I don't think this route would be feasible with ERJ service. They'd fill up at least a daily 738 out of PVD, I'm sure. Good news for Richmond, VA travelers, just the same. Surprised they're only using the 37 seat ERJ-135. You'd think the CRJ-700 would make more sense on that route....

User currently offlineAA777MIA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 686 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5971 times:

WOW, had not heard that, that is good news...

User currently offlineProudtoflyaa From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5947 times:

So which LCC is this a predatory move toward?

 Big grin


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33194 posts, RR: 71
Reply 5, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5876 times:

Surprised they're only using the 37 seat ERJ-135. You'd think the CRJ-700 would make more sense on that route....

I think it is because there are no RJs based in Miami. The ERJ will rotate from Boston with Boston-based crew (flying BOS-RIC-MIA-RIC-BOS).



a.
User currently offlineL1011 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1681 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5847 times:
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Good to hear this, but it would be much better with a full-sized jet. Everything here seems to be turning into RJ flights. For years we supported full-sized aircraft to EWR, LGA, DCA, IAD, BWI, and quite a few others. We even had a UA DC-8-61 from RIC to IAD, and an EA DC-8-63 service from RIC-EWR. We also had an EA L-1011 to ATL on Tuesdays. It was an A300 the rest of the week. Where are all these potential passengers?

Bob Bradley
Richmond, VA



Fly Eastern's Golden Falcon DC-7B
User currently offlineProudtoflyaa From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5828 times:

Where are all these potential passengers?

1.) I would question the load factors of those larger aircraft... under regulation, those Eastern L-1011s may have flown mostly empty.

2.) Probably driving to other airports.


I'd be happy with RJ service instead of no service at all. The service is matching the market demand, and there isn't enough demand to financially support mainline aircraft, otherwise it would be operated with one.


User currently offlineJBLUA320 From United States of America, joined May 2002, 3179 posts, RR: 19
Reply 8, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5817 times:
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In regards to the LCC post..

Its interesting because it doesnt seem like any LCCs have a stronghold on this route from any neighboring airports..

Southwest into FLL maybe the only airline they are butting heads with on ths route, but it seems as if RIC definately has the space to accomodate an LCC

In any event, good for American. Those RJs just keep taking longer and longer flights these days, dont they....

JBLU


User currently offlineDCAYOW From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 605 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5799 times:

The problem with PVD-MIA is the ERJs don't have the range currently.

Also the M80s are problematic on PVD-MIA unless AA uses one that is overwater capable. PVD's runway at 7,166 ft. doesn't help on hot summer day to MIA.

The overwater M80 would allow for more direct routing on PVD-MIA and could probably make it.

AA just added PVD-DFW so we can hope PVD-MIA will be technically possible soon.




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User currently offlineScottysAir From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 5744 times:

Exactly and doesn't have with the range on ERJ either. This is better way to need get small plane with B737-800 or Super MD-80 aircraft. It is only for the range is 500 or 800 miles on their flight. Thanks!  Smile

User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33194 posts, RR: 71
Reply 11, posted (10 years 12 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Southwest into FLL maybe the only airline they are butting heads with on ths route,

This is the only non-stop service between South Florida and Virginia excluding Dulles and WN does not fly to RIC (though are you referring to RIC being in ORF's cachetment area?). It has been said for a while that AA is annoucing eight new non-stop destinations this year from MIA (RIC is 7th), but, I must say, RIC surprised me. It's great news, but I was surprised it was chosen over GSO, ORF, or some other larger markets. And I was also surprised it is going to be daily, when CMH and CVG are still running only on weekends.

The problem with PVD-MIA is the ERJs don't have the range currently.

That's no problem. Providence is the single largest O&D destination from Miami not served non-stop, and, if I am not mistaken, the reverse is also true. More people fly between South Florida and Providence every day than to Indianapolis, Raleigh, Nashville, and Atlantic City, to name a few with multiple daily non-stops to South Florida. No need for MD80s either, because the 738s are perfectly suited for the route.



a.
User currently offlineDCAYOW From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 605 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 5613 times:


The problem with PVD-MIA is yield as well. The yields are horrible and American is a conservative airline when it comes to putting eqp into a low yield market. They don't like to go into these markets with the largest capacity. They usually start routes with M80 then upgauge if market demands it.


However if ERJ had the sufficient range they could manage the low-yield traffic.

Right now American has effectively ceded PVD-Caribbean traffic to USAirways (via PHL / CLT) and Continental (via EWR) which are the only real options.

Since FLL is PVD's largest O&D market without nonstop service, they are probably afraid of starting PVD-MIA with something that would then be matched by WN doing PVD-FLL.






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User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33194 posts, RR: 71
Reply 13, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 5579 times:

The problem with PVD-MIA is yield as well. The yields are horrible and American is a conservative airline when it comes to putting eqp into a low yield market. They don't like to go into these markets with the largest capacity.

Yields might not the best, but that does not stop them from running and filling M80s from Miami to Cleveland, Indianapolis, Nashville, and Pittsburgh, among other places. Miami is a not a discount bargain tourist destination, and neither are many Caribbean islands (the average family cannot afford 3a vacation to Grand Cayman or Casa de Campo).

Since FLL is PVD's largest O&D market without nonstop service, they are probably afraid of starting PVD-MIA with something that would then be matched by WN doing PVD-FLL.

MIA and FLL are the same exact market. I doubt that AA is very much worried at all. They compete with WN on every route WN flies out of FLL except ISP (and MDW if you count MDW/ORD seperately).



a.
User currently offlineDCAYOW From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 605 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 5529 times:


Then the only reason why they are not doing must be the M80 performance on PVD's rather short 7,166 runway. The second or third shortest of medium hub airports.



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User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33194 posts, RR: 71
Reply 15, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 5514 times:

Then the only reason why they are not doing must be the M80 performance on PVD's rather short 7,166 runway. The second or third shortest of medium hub airports.

Like I mentioned, they could use the 738, which is used on a lot of NE routes to Philadelphia, Montreal, LaGuardia, and Hartford.

The real reason is totally unknown, only AA knows. There is obviously some logic behind why they are not flying it, but I don't see how it can be aircraft, market size, or yield issues. The best reason is probably a minimal market penetration in the Providence-area. It took them a long time to start DFW-PVD, a route, like MIA-PVD, that was always a "why did it take so long?". There will always be those markets that are not served "just because".



a.
User currently offlineDCAYOW From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 605 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 5479 times:

MIA Yields:

BNA (M80) $.1944
RIC (ERJ) $.1679
PHL (757/738) $.1566
CLE (M80) $.1524
PIT (M80) $.1432
LGA (757/M80) $.1351
BDL (738) $.1272
IND (M80) $.1202

PVD (--) $.1139

It is not coincidental that PVD-DFW started after AA secured major labor concessions thus lowering their seat mile costs. This made PVD-DFW viable.



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User currently offlineJeffrey1970 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 1336 posts, RR: 12
Reply 17, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 5392 times:

If they are going after a LCC it would be Southwest, since Southwest of course has flights out of BWI and also Norfolk, VA.


God bless through Jesus, Jeff
User currently offlineFlyCMH From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 2285 posts, RR: 10
Reply 18, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 5387 times:

Wow, very interesting information. You wouldn't happen to have the yields available for MIA-CMH/CVG, or where I could find a table with the aforementioned stats?

User currently offlineDCAYOW From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 605 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 5358 times:


This website has great information on yields, but also on international and domestic load factors to / from US.

www.transtats.bts.gov

MIA yields:

CMH $.1370
CVG $.1719

fortress hub CVG!



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User currently offlineFlyCMH From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 2285 posts, RR: 10
Reply 20, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 5333 times:

Thanks for the tip, DCAYOW! Very much appreciated.

User currently offlineDCAYOW From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 605 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 5325 times:


No problem FlyCMH...!



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User currently offlineJohn From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 1374 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 5332 times:

If PVD can handle a full Air Luxor A332 in the summer to PDL, then why would it be a problem for the MD-80? Although I think 738 equipment would be MORE suitable for a MIA run...What is the air mileage difference between PVD-DFW and PVD-MIA? How is that DFW run doing, are they filling it up?

User currently offlineDCAYOW From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 605 posts, RR: 3
Reply 23, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 5316 times:


The last time I checked they were blocking off seats on PVD-DFW (westbound). This means the flight isn't going out 100% full.

Also PVD-MIA routing may be longer as not all AA eqp is overwater. If they could do PVD-MIA overwater - it would be fine.

The M80 is a pavement hog. The Air Luxor A332 can do PVD-PDL because its operating in eastbound (tailwind) direction (therefore it is not full of fuel). The aircraft is operating at its heaviest departing PDL on the eastbound run.






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User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33194 posts, RR: 71
Reply 24, posted (10 years 12 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 5239 times:

Thanks for the info DCAYOW.


a.
25 Post contains images Boeing nut : AA To Start Daily Miami-Richmond, VA Service And yet they are letting STL crumble....... Way to go AA.
26 MAH4546 : And yet they are letting STL crumble....... Way to go AA. They have nothing to do with each other. American Airlines' goal is to obviously return to t
27 Mikeycpvd : Is there a reg that requires aircraft to be equipped with more gas for overwater flights versus overland flights of the same distance. I knew there ha
28 John : Mickeycpvd, do you ever watch that S80 take off to DFW? Does it use up pretty much the whole runway?
29 Flack4ric : AA service RIC-MIA has been financially attractive for some time. Aside from the predictable North-South vacationeer migrations, also attactive for bu
30 DCA-ROCguy : Thanks all for the fascinating info in this thread...poked my head in, and found out all sorts of interesting stuff. Just a few comments: --The State
31 John : "The State of Rhode Island needs to tell the Warwick NIMBYS to stuff it." Easier said, than done! Runway 5/23 at PVD is surrounded almost entirely on
32 Post contains images DCA-ROCguy : So which LCC is this a predatory move toward? Since there's no LCC in Richmond, this is an odd question. John...I didn't know PVD was hemmed in on the
33 PVD757 : having just read this thread, I must respond to a few points made: PVD-DFW is not being weight restricted and is running 75-80% full with little to no
34 DCA-ROCguy : Thanks for the info PVD757. That's what I meant, the 5 clear zone, sorry for the error. The 23 north end of course is developed right up to the airpor
35 PVD757 : DCA-ROC: I knew what you meant, it should be noted that the airport is indeed hemmed in, but there is adequate room to grow 5-23 to up to 9500 ft. 25-
36 DCAYOW : PVD757, I agree that yield mix from Caribbean connection traffic would raise yields, but AA probably has a bunch of other markets to put M80s that ex
37 PVD757 : DCAYOW: Thanks for the post, you are very correct. The inventory control issue does worry me, but only to a point. As we agree upon the obvious need f
38 DCAYOW : Right on PVD757! PVD needs south Fla and Houston market covered. Hopefully it will come about soon ! Its a great facility for the South New England r
39 Post contains links MAH4546 : PR out today: http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/031205/daf011_1.html Richmond Times Dispatch article: http://www.timesdispatch.com/servlet/Satellite?pagenam
40 PVD757 : DCAYOW: Thank you for your kind remarks about our airport. It means a lot to me since I work here and care very much about it's success and our passen
41 Flack4ric : MAH4546 - another good catch!
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